Kronii unintentionally starts a Vegito vs Gogeta war [Hololive]
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ต.ค. 2024
- Kronii unintentionally starts a Vegito vs Gogeta war in chat [Hololive]
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License: dova-s.jp/_con...
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“Don’t fight after stream.” Kroni, this war has been going on for years.
A war that's been going on for so long, some kids on youtube right now weren't even BORN when it started.
Wait didn't it end after the broly movie came out
@@fork-man Why would it? If the Gogeta there was stronger than the Goku Black saga Vegito it's because both Goku and Vegeta were way stronger when they fused in the Broly movie.
@@fork-man ikr, the broly movie only proved that vegito would mop the floor with gogeta
@@UryuCifer I think they just the fusion dance because the Potaras were not readily available. Otherwise they would have just did that and got the same results.
Gogeta is definetly not Cooler. That's Frieza's brother.
Cooler than Frieza? Then he must be Ice Cold
The Cooler jokes always caught me off guard 😂
The jokes are cool, but is it Cooler?
@zzskyninjazz1821 no that would be my father
@@WDCrazyTruth I think those commentors need to Chill.
@@Android-Twenty-One hes already dead tho. bardock killed him.
How to set off the entire Dragon ball community in anything: Ask "Who is stronger?"
As a Dragon Ball fan I can confirm this to be true
Who is stronger, Zamasu or Garlic Jr?
@@TheCabalOnMars yamcha
Yep glad I’ve diverged from the dragon ball community a while back, I was an anomaly since I could read and admit there are better anime and manga than it
@@sentryprime correct, it was a trick question. We all know Yamcha is the strongest Desert Bandit.
I think she needs to take responsibility for this by holding a Dragon Ball FighterZ stream. I dunno how well she'd do, but it'd be fun to see.
This very much please
It'll be best to play UI Goku, Teen Gohan and Vegito then
Easy to smash if you don't know much combo.
But those 3 also very good if you can combo well.
Watch her surprise us and play blugeta lab coat and vegito
Wait until she finds out there are 2 Gogetas in Dragon Ball FighterZ. I wonder if she will ask something like "Which Gogeta is stronger? SSJ4 Gogeta or Gogeta Blue?"
I'd adore that, we need more Hololive x Fighting Games
Kronii: "I didnt even ask this question, it was just an article that i found"
Also Kronii: "You know what? Lets have a poll, im curious now"
Chat: *"Kronii don't do it."*
Kronii: *_"I AM ABSOLUTELY DOING IT."_*
"I'm gonna open incognito in case it's not what I quite expect"
Clever girl, anticipating shipping and R34 right off the bat.
You never know when Google will decide that you must've wanted to see that character doing the Omni Man pose.
"Goku x vegeta body fusion" could led to some dangerous waters
I fully believe the guys behind Dragon Ball had powers that allowed them to see the future and decided to make shipping Goku and Vegeta 10x times harder by using all the good name combinations for fusions. That's why there's both Vegetto and Gogeta, plus Veku to refer to the fat version of Gogeta. The only available ship name would be Kakareta or something similar and they know damn well no one's going to bother to write something as dumb as that.
the internet is sickening
@@matiasgandolfo6122 KAKARETA 😭
Kronii: “Which fusion is stronger?”
Trunks: “YOU’RE GOING TO DESTROY THE WHOLE CHAT, KRONII!”
“Did I open a can of worms?” It’s Dragon Ball. Of course you did
“But can they beat Goku” best response
I'd argue both of them could beat Goku in Super Saiyan 3 at least.
SSB Goku can probably beat both unless they also turn SSB. But we all know UI Goku could destroy them lol
@@johnnysalery7383 pretty sure even UI goku can't keep up with gogeta and vegito in their blue forms
Ok
So Gogeta And Vegito Blue vs Full UI Goku
If we take the Goku from the last DBS MANGA chapter to date, I think Goku Wins
Gogeta Blue vs T.O.P UI Goku I think it's a Draw
And Vegeto unfortunately doesn't have a chance I think
even Frieza´s doctor can kill Gok in 1 shot
@@Bellial87 only if Goku powers down
That one comment that said "But can they beat Goku?" Killed me LMAO
Kroni: Oh is this a popular debate?
Her fans: ...Yeah?
Kroni: ...I'm curious now
Fans: Don't you do it
Kroni: Ima do it
Fans: DON'T YOU DARE
Kroni: *Wildfire*
I realized just now this is a TFS reference
You made a choice go fight against your fate!
There's something magical about chat having an open war in the background with this ambience music and Kronii's soothing voice.
I believe it's an actual artistic cinematography technique to have a calming ambience with the opposite thing as visuals.
I'll sum it up, Gogeta is the serious fusion guy, Vegito is the sassy fusion guy.
Gogeta wasn't all serious in DBS: Broly. However, if not for Cheelai making the wish on the Dragon Balls, he would have straight up killed Broly.
Let's also not forget GT Gogeta (even though I'd love to forget that version of him). He was basically acting like Gotenks. I get that he was trying to nullify the Negative Energy, but he played around too much.
I would personally sum the fusions up as:
Gogeta - the fusion that gets shit done (except for GT)
Vegito - the fusion that doesn't (seeing as he failed to stop both Buu and Zamasu)
not gunna lie, but i also think the reason gt gogeta acted that way was because of the monkey like personality of ssj4. it's kinda like an asian thing where monkeys are always portrayed as goofing around.
and it just clicked, like the monkey king.
@@pokeng But neither Goku nor Vegeta were goofing off as SSJ4 when not fused. Especially Goku, who was surprisingly serious in that form. He was also pretty surprised to Vegeta not only agreeing to the fusion, but also being its initiator, instead of Goku.
Counter print supreme Kai had stated that potara fusion is stronger then the dance
@@mrperfectjeff Supreme Kai is an idiot that thought there's nobody that could surpass Freeza. Not only that, he never knew about Potara fusion until Elder Kai mentioned it. Elder Kai also didn't know that Potara fusions made without godly beings were not permanent.
Probably the closest thing to a vtuber getting involved in versus debates.
"Who is stronger?" The words that awaken VS Debaters from the depths.
“Isnt vegito and gogeta the same thing?”
Me: *oh no*
Vegito has a specific purpose of playing around and making the badguy feel frustrated for a short time, then he just leaves again. If he stays until the end, he wouldn't be the real Vegito anymore.
He just VIBE CHECKS the antagonist for a while
Gogeta is the one called to get shit done.
plus they established at full power now with blue, vegito doesn’t even last as long as gogeta’s half hour
>this nonsense headcanon
Gogeta, for starters, wasn't canon (still isn't). Even humoring what kids mistake for it, the movies ain't that. Few are fool enough to support GT now. That only leaves...another movie. This time from Super. Guess what he does? He horses around. At least he is allowed to win, right? Vegetto on the other hand...in canon his goal was always to make his foe so desperate they get absorbed (with a barrier) to rescue friends/family (as rez won't work on the absorbed parties). Didn't realize it would split the fusion. Still succeeded in infiltration (and thanks to Geets the rescue worked **until Gokek dropped the ball**). Super makes a mockery of him by altering rules so he would split up before reaching the conclusion proper (with an immortal foe that Zeno ended up being needed for).
NOTE: Flashing your man-tits isn't getting shit done. Nor is confetti. You don't get to cherry pick, kids. It isn't all just backflip kicks into rainbow glitter. Something especially fruity about that version of the two (and his fans). Feel like the sort that would want long hair Trunks to lose the shirt after a good work-out. Deeply suspect.
Except Gogeta does the same thing in GT
If I had a nickel for everytime Canadians unintentionally started a war during a Hololive stream...
2:02 "I gotta make sure that I'm getting the spelling right or else I'm gonna get mauled."
You would have more for everytime they do it Intentionally lol
As a Canadian citizen I am sorry 😔
The real answer to all power level debates is that the writers are the strongest, because they decide how strong a character is at any given moment.
This is the correct answer, more or less.
Stan Lee agrees
th-cam.com/video/L4_zFYnnn2Y/w-d-xo.html
Yes, this is what Stan Lee said as definitive answer for "who would win againts who" in any scenario
yeah.. but isn't dragonball written by pne guy tho? not up to date, stopped at buu saga
@@johns.870 sorta. Toriyama wrote all of OG, Z, and an outline of Super, but Toyotaro has been handling the writing for a lot of the current Dragon Ball Super Manga.
I like Gogeta more because... he's just cool, like, Vegito is there to brag and feel superior, Gogeta is straight to the point, like.
"aight I have 30 minutes to destroy your ass, let's do this"
They have the same personality, because they're the same character.
Did you even watch any of the modern Dragon ball? Vegito was serious in his fight against Zamasu (who is immortal, that's why he lost) meanwhile Gogeta was playing around with Broly
@@firefly_0619 Dude Gogeta literally tried to straight up kill a guy who has the brain capacity of a toddler.
@@ra0028534 They are not, since Vegito is Vegetas side shining more through and Gogeta is Goku shining more through.
They are similar, but not quite the same.
@@ThatsKami16 That's never been a thing, the fanbase made that up because of the games.
Also i think you meant the other way around.
Regardless, GT had already shown that's not case.
Time to put an end to the whole thing. In the weekly jump issue released prior to DBS Broly Gogeta and Vegeto are described as "two equally-matched ultimate trump cards." According to the most up-to-date information on the two they're equal in power.
"That's just what they said to avoid pissing off fans!"
Well tbf them being equal trump cards doesn't inherently mean they're equal in strength. They would need retcon Gogeta or retcon Vegito again to change how the fusions work since the requirements for the fusions and their effects haven't changed besides Vegito being 1 hr now.
Makes sense to me. But we all know that people are going to continue to argue it and say one is stronger than the other.
@@rashad3932
This.
But the truth is that the people putting super together don't give a shit about DBZ. Just go ahead and assume the old kai was either braindead or lying about patora's because the show is telling us that was the case. Literally actually absolutely everything we know about fusions has been changed. People try to say it's only the timer that was 'reclarified', but just because it was left open in DBZ doesn't mean their terrible bs retcon makes sense. And the power of the fusions has definitely been changed too because Gogeta should be missing the deficit power difference between Goku and Vegeta (unless they're magically exactly equal in power already. Which has literally never ever ever been the case). Whereas Vegitto isn't missing that.
Imagine your devine fusion that's like supposed to be permanent (if used by gods I guess) to be matched by a silly dance that has a time limit, you'd think that the trade off of you must surrender your individuality would make it stronger
Even tho they did retcon it to something something god ki, something something mortals... Something something you don't have to worry about it, it's not permanent for the characters we don't want it to be
Can't wait for the Hololive-wide Sparking Zero tournament
I always liked Gogeta and during the Broly Movie it was insane finally seeing that cannonically and in the Super Saiyan Blue form nonetheless.
Kronii: *"I love to watch wildfires like this."*
Me: Kronii likes to see the world burn. :)
Gogeta is stronger than the last version of Vegito we saw, by virtue of the fact that Goku and Vegeta are both much stronger than they were when they last formed Vegito. Also, given the Potara fusion couldn't handle Vegito's power during the fight with Zamasu, that's as powerful as he can possibly be. Whereas Gogeta has no upper limit; he just has a time limit. If Vegito were to pop up now, he might not even LAST thirty minutes before the potara stopped being able to handle it. The power would be too great.
Yeah i hope they find a way to fix that about the Potara's. It was good when they both were considered equal in strength before they nerfed him
Considering that Gotenks fusion ended in like 10 min when using the ssj3 transformation Gogeta shouldn’t be able to last more than 1 min according to previous canon. But canon no longer matters because with past canon Gogeta shouldn’t exist, one of the rules to fuse using the dance is to have similar heights and Vegeta is short compres to Goku.
So maybe next time we se Vegeto he would be stronger that Gogeta, maybe with some stronger potaras or something like that
But Vegito was fighting against Zamasu with all his strength, but Gogeta didn't seem to used much power against Broly, yeah both were in their blue forms but you can see Vegito struggle more against Zamasu thanks to him being "Immortal".
Side note: I don't see Gogeta or Vegito as the same guy it feel more like they're Twins, not the same entity but really alike.
@@ssj3Samuel That doesn't really change the point being made, though.
The Gogeta that fought Broly would be stronger than the Vegito that fought Zamasu, simply be virtue of the fact that Goku and Vegeta were both a lot stronger than they were during the Goku Black arc. That will still be true irrespective of how hard Gogeta was trying against Broly.
And the power that Vegito put out fighting Zamsu was still too much for the potara to handle. And Gogeta will still not have that same problem; meaning that even if they were completely equal right now, Gogeta still has the potential to become a lot stronger while Vegito has effectively hit his limit (unless they produce some kind of super potara in the future).
Gogeta Blue is completely non-canon and Director's Notes say that Toriyama had basically zero input on the last act fight of the Super Broly movie and they just had fun winging it.
Vegito Blue actually exists. Gogeta Blue straight up doesn't.
"Oh No~" she said, slowly chuckling at the chaos she just unleashed...
I think the important question is, what would happen if Vegito gives Gogeta one of the potara earrings? Gogito
I think if Vegito combines with Gogeta, it will become Vegeta 😆
@@RenaiMaster08 lol
@@RenaiMaster08 but can he beat Goku
"Unintentionally" doesn't work when she went and made a friggin poll about it! Lol
1:25 Well with the widow's peak sure but nothing else. Unless Kronii meant *Vegeto* resembles Vegeta, which he does with the blue and the gloves.
I would’ve be in the war too. This topic is a crazy debate. Hella easy to trigger shit with this topic LOL
can they beat goku tho
Dragon Ball fans will find literally any reason to powerscale, even on a hololive clip. It's nutty
@@sage5871
This time it isn't even the DB fans fault. It was Kronii that started the powerscaling war in the firet place.
My economics teacher once asked "Who's stronger, Batman or Iron Man?" and I immediately responded with "You do _not_ want to open that can of worms."
Oh dear god… she had no idea what she got herself into…
Oh Kronii, fans have been fighting long before your Stream and will keep fighting long after. Tis a war of no end and really a case of better to not get involved over anything else lol
"i love seeing this wild fire", anarchy
"There is no right or wrong answer-" *_W R O N G_*
She couldn't have asked a worse question. Oh my lord.
Gogeta has that kick ass theme from the movie so he wins
*sees the option you didn't vote for win in the poll*
fan: I've said it once, and I'll say it again. Democracy simply does not work
the Creator of Dragon ball himself said both Fusion have the same power level
Which is a contradiction since its stated in the manga and anime Earrings are a stronger fusion
@@halogeorge1
toriyama has always been making shit up as he went on with the manga.
if you read dragonball from start to the latest chapter of super you find one redcon and rewrite after the next.
the guy also cant make up his mind on whats canon and what isnt.
like gt being canon at first befor declared non-canon only to end up as an alternate timeline.
taking anything in the mangas seriously only opens more plot holes than it solves at this point.
@@uteriel282 Taking anything fro the super manga is a terrible idea, its not even being wrote by toriyama at this point (just rough ideas, but a different writer)
Anything in the DBZ Manga is pretty much cannon, And the DBS Anime (its a direct continuation of DB KAI, which is the "True version" of dragon ball anime)
The DBS Manga as it stands is its own cannon and simply can't be used
You never straight up ask it.
Canonically, Potara fusion (Vegito) is supposed to be stronger than fusion dance (Gogeta). So if they fused into Vegito in the Super Broly movie, theoretically they would’ve been stronger.
As of dbs broly, the creator confirmed both fusions to be equal in strength
Exactly if only he had more screen time to Show Vegito's True Potential. I'm sure it's that way for one Goku is an idiot. Vegeta has more education than him he's a pretty smart guy and dont get enough credit.
This is based on what canon? The DBZ canon? the DBS canon? Or the Akira Toriyama said the opposite of this in an interview canon?
@@lucckyZ DBZ, yes. DBS canon states that they are the iqual in power. That is, a retcon and nerf for Vegito.
Gogeta vs Vegito is a case of 'Vegito's supposed to be stronger according to the rules, but Gogeta's the one who actually turns up and gets shit done without breaking a sweat.'
It comes down to preference, if you wanna go down with what the writers say or with what you see with your own eyes.
one of the comments scrolling: WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?!
Nice clip! I'm honestly surprised this happened, and is a thing now, but it's also kinda funny! Never thought I'd hear Kronii talking about, and starting a debate about DragonBall Z!
Unpopular(?) opinion: both Fusions are badass and are about the same level.
I'm pretty sure they were even confirmed to be equally as strong but yeah they both are cool.
Based take I love gogeta and vegtio
People still debating over this?
The answers has been in the manga for years
In the manga old kayoshin specifies that the warrior that comes from the potara fusion will be stronger than the one that comes from the metamoru fusion, not even making into account the time limit, that's another factor that doesn't come up
Both methods have their respective problems but also both are hella strong
Goku specifies that the result warrior in a fusion in his base state it's stronger than the maximum power of the individuals that make up the fusion, even confirmed in the daizenshu 7 so yeah both are stronger than the ssj blue of goku and vegeta in their base form but vegito it's stronger just cuz it's a potara fusion
Yes but things changed over the years because nothing is consistent with db
@@shaggyat1793 nothing changed except vegito getting ruined by trunks plot armor, he’s still stronger
quite makes sense, since Blue Goku and Vegeta vs Wrath Broly was an even match, but he transforms and he beats all 3 (including Frieza), so basically Gogeta just needs to go SSJ to beat SSJ Broly, but SSJB to stomp LSSJ, so yea he would basically 2 shot Jiren lmao.
This is what I remembered too, but I think they contradicted it in super. Vegito was forced to unfuse because they were too strong or something against Zamasu.
Old Kai was speaking out of jealousy/frustration. Daizenshuu doesn’t state there is any difference in power.
Dokkan art in the thumbnail GIGACHAD
dragon ball nerd here:
both fusions has their pro and cons
in term of power they are pretty much similar with very little if not any difference, but Potara fusion is a lot easier to make compared to the fusion dance, but at the same time the 1h time limit become useless if Vegito uses powerful forms like SSJB making it last only about 30/40 minutes like it did against Merged Zamasu due to power overuse and instability, while Gogeta is an extremely stable fusion due to the requirement of that dance like when he fought against Broly going all out and remaining fused even after the fight was over, BUT still we are talking about "Dragon Ball time" so we can't have a clear answer about timespans using only anime and movies.
Wasn't it 30 min going down to 5 min. When using ssb? Also Vegito is stronger because of lore but in theory they are the same person and gogeta is more useful having a longer time limit. It's like you want a gun that shoots 10 or 2 bullets, even if the 2 bullet gun shoots stronger bullets if both guns get the same result might aswell go for 10 bullets
@@nairav9156 the duration of Vegito Blue is kinda debated, but in the manga he defuses at 20 min before running out after using the Final Kamehameha. Vegito however is still better in a scenario where you need a quick powerboost since doing the fusion dance correctly without being interrupted would be highly unlikely
@@nairav9156 vegito WAS stronger about 30 years ago.
The retcon is very old now.
When the fusion partners are equal in power, there is no power gap between the different types of fusion.
Otherwise the Potara fusion is stronger and lasts longer.
Unless the fusion overuses it's power, like staying in SSJ3 or using a technique like the Final Kamehameha at full force, like Vegito did.
Gogeta on the other hand in DBS Broly didn't go all out, until the very end and even then he only used a normal Kamehameha, so he seems to have learned from the mistake from the Future Trunks arc.
@@nairav9156 I have a hard time believing which one is stronger or weaker because the writers could just contradict what they said before just like they did with the l hour time limit. So I usually put the writers as the strongest
@Sig Toriyama didn't oversee the creation of GT. He did a few designs but didn't really touch or have anything to do with the story. You don't even need to go to GT for shorten dance time, Gotenks suffered that in Z.
i like how she thought it was gonna be shipping art or something so she opened incognito lmao
I believe they are both exactly as powerful as each other, just in different ways.
I agree they should be equal in power
@@urielj2161 Right, equal in power, but they're both better at different situations.
@@tbazz95 This is simple:
DBZ canon: Vegito >> Gogeta
DBS canon: Gogeta = Vegito
@@mastersupreme2010 but I thought DBS canon *included* DBZ
@@tbazz95 Technically, yes, but Toriyama doesn't give a damn about rewriting both stories.
Ufff the pandora box of this old debate in DBZ... Poor Kronii xD
For anyone confused about the two beings here's a quick explanation:
The potara fusion (Vegito) is stronger than the Metamoran/dance fusion (gogeta). I forget the reason why but a big part of it is due to both the usage of the potara and how the potara fusion is an hour vs the dance only lasting half an hour. The potara are also the better option due to:
A. Convenience, basically no need to remember a dance/be in sync.
B. The fusees power levels do not need to be the same level (that's how goku and vegeta were able to combine to fight buuhan)
C. A height difference doesn't matter, meaning two people of varying heights can fuse (although it may hurt like hell to fuse with someone smaller)
However while the potara are better and much faster, the rarity of having the earrings is a huge issue, so the dance is a good second choice, and is personally my favorite.
A downside for fusions is that the more power the fused warrior releases, less time it will last. Thats why Blue Vegito didnt last the whole hour against Merged Zamasu
And the Old Kai mentioned something about Goku and Vegeta's rivalry making Vegito the strongest there is, so maybe Potara gives a rivalry boost
@@Cross_A yes, I completely forgot about those 2 points as well lol, thank you for adding them
Please delete, "Gogeta is cooler therefore he is stronger" people will haunt your house
@@stargazerequiem I didn't say that though, I said that the dance is a good second choice and it's my personal favorite of the two options, I never said not implied that cooler = stronger
@@HeroicZ31 Exactly why I said that, coz there are people who thinks cooler = stronger 😆
Without Toriyama-sensei to confirm now (RIP), this debate will go on for eternity.
Gogeta and Broly punched each other so hard they cracked open a hole in space time. Plus, FighterZ gave him that instakill super. Gotta go with my man, Gogeta on this one.
Goku and vegeta were stronger by then... Had they fused into vegito it would be even stronger
@@UryuCiferor they would've burned out in a few minutes flat
@@jaipadv8282gogeta's fight only lasts a few minutes as well, lol
That wasn't even spacetime. Probably a dimension like Goku Black's scythe of sorrow.
@jaipadv8282 Wait, you don't think Gogeta can be fused for 30 minutes do you😂?
Clearly it's the farmer with the shotgun
The use of potara increase the power potential of the fusion so technically, Vegito is the strongest.
No need to have any discussion about it.
I think it was stated that Vegito's multiplier is higher than Gogeta's multiplier on power. So yeah, you're not wrong.
But the creator later confirmed that they were now equal around the time dbs broly came out. Why does it seem like so many people don't know this?(I'm not trying to say this in a rude way. I'm legitimately asking)
@@xmant8842 When did he say that? I never knew about this
@@Hyro_Thod it was in a shounen jump that came out around the time the dbs movie came out. you can probably find it if you search "gogeta and vegito are equal"
@@xmant8842 A lot of people don't care about Dragon Ball Super and consider this serie as a fan fiction like Dragon Ball GT even thought it isn't.
Dragon Ball Z was already dragging the Dragon Ball story a bit too much.
I'm part of the group that do not take account Dragon Ball Super.
Also I didn't know there was a Broly OAV.
I need to watch this, thanks for the info.
If kronii says one is better than the other. Then one is better than the other. Kronii's words are final.
“Its a whole debate” we literally have the canon answer and its vegito. Gogeta fans just hard coping
Toriyama who said they're equal 💀
@@jojohappyjack6247 gonna need a source on that
@@jojohappyjack6247 The potara earnings have a higher multiplier than the fusion dance, so the answer is clearly vegito. The thing that makes them equal is gogeta gets shit done while vegito goofs off more. Tho since the question is “who’s stronger”, from a literal standpoint it’s vegito
@kris8569 I remember the elder kai being bias and stating that the potara is superior to the fusion, but never did they mention the multiplier
I mean, UVB split after a final kamehameha an savage strike, gogeta blue whipped out every move in his arsenal and still didn't split, so I can't believe the potara results in more power
@@Vavalry it was stated in the Jump Magazine in Japan when DBS Broly dropped
The Warden of Time commited her most heinous betrayal, she released her prisoners amongst the world
Vegito when he's turned into a small chocolate candy > Gogeta > Vegito
"Angel born in hell" For the winnn
In terms of pure strength/power, Vegito would technically _always_ be stronger because the stronger fusee has to lower their power when doing the fusion dance, but not when using Potaras.
But because of retcons, the Potara might seem weaker because allegedly when too much power is used, the fusion breaks. The thing is, the same was _also true_ for the fusion dance(even just SSJ3 cut Gotenks' fusion time down by a lot; you can argue that SSJ3's ki consumption was the cause of that, but SSJB - especially in the manga - has similar ki sustain issues), and we don't know how long the fight between Gogeta and Broly actually was.
As a result, the answer to who is the strongest Goku + Vegeta fusion is the same as the answer to how spinosaurus actually looked like: it changes every time new material on the subject matter appears.
It's weird talking about this topic on a Hololive clip out of everything, but here we are.
What do you mean Fusion's consistency is completely broken in Dragon Ball? Surely it can't be the case when Toriyama is the one who invented the concept, it's not like he periodically forgets stuff he created in the first place? Oh wait...
Also side note, but I don't think that Gotenks' shortened fusion time has to do anything with SSJ3 burning through ki but more like SSJ3 being galaxies ahead of what Goten and Trunks could achieve on their own, reminder they could only get as far as SSJ1 at that point in time. My speculation is that them breaking their natural limits by this much as Gotenks is what ended shortening his fusion time, not the form itself.
But then again, what sense do you make of fusion when even the writers can't?
@@markopusic8258 Nah you're right. Basically the fusion is as strong as the plot requires it to be. Next time Vegito shows up he's probably going to do crazy asspull shit that puts him above Gogeta Blue again. Watch them give Vegito ultra instinct or something. We know it's coming eventually.
actually, manga ssb no longer has ki sustain issues due to them achieving perfect blue by TOP arc
"I'm going to open a poll"
Famous last words
Isn't it like.... by default, the earrings make for a more powerful fusion power boost than with the fusion dance?
Yes, however the Potara appear to have an upper limit on the fusion’s power given how Vegetto(I use the Japanese spelling since it makes more sense to me) split within ten minutes against Zamasu. While it’s true that the dance can end early too it requires extenuating circumstances; Gotenks went a form that his fusees can’t do and Vegeta’s SSJ4 was a temporary artificial transformation, which drained GT! Gogeta before they hit 30 minutes(considering how long SSJ4 Goku could last the transformation isn’t much of a drain if done properly). Combine those facts with how much stronger they got from when Vegetto was last used compared to Gogeta’s post TOP existence, well it’s a no brainer who’ll come out on top.
@@coledewey3564 Depends on how you turn the debate, but in terms of strict power, if we take the same Goku and Vegeta for both fusions, Potara will by design always be stronger. If Vegetto and Gogeta were to fight though... I don't know who would win, because fusion is so inconsistent in Dragon Ball the writers can decide anythinf they want on the matter and I couldn't contest it.
out of all the wars happening in the world THIS is the one i was not ready for
It doesn't matter how it started... the only important thing is that GOGETA GANG WON MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
the only difference is in the time of the fusion 👍
I’m sad I wasn’t in chat that day imma cry about it lol
"I just didn't know they were different"
and now you'll pay for your sins
I feel like Gogeta is MUCH more serious. Due to the time limit he knows he has to get shit done or lose. With the current power levels i could see gogeta eking out a win.
@james jesse tbf Vegito couldn’t kill Buu since he wanted to save those who got absorbed and Zamasu was kinda immortal. Had that not been the case he would’ve won both with ease. I’d still pick Gogeta though
Imo they're equally strong but since Vegito's time limit is longer he's much cockier so he'd lose if they fight in character.
If they go all out, Vegito would outlast Gogeta
Vegetto can afford the cockiness cause his opponents were weaker than him, he just has bad luck with defusing before he gets the job done. Plus all his opponents have regenerative abilities which allows them to stay in the fight longer. Give him an equal opponent and he'll definitely take it seriously.
Suddenly remembers super saiyan 4 gogeta
@james jesse XD. True, but he was slapping Super Buu's shit without even transforming. He only went super Saiyan to add insult to injury.
Oh god. The anime 100 years war has finally reignited...
Gogeta has the limited duration but Vegito is the one that always times out and never finishes his fights
I always took it, thanks to Super retcons to be:
Gogeto using the dance is stronger but at a cost of much shorter time to use.
Vegito, however, lasts much longer but apparently now does have a time limit but comes at a cost of being bit weaker.
@@namegoeshere5220 I kinda disagree, it's been stated that they're both equally strong.
Vegito lasts an hour tho, while Gogeta lasts half an hour.
The reason Vegito defused so quickly was because SSB was a pretty garbage form at the time, it's basically the same reason ssj3 Gotenks and ssj4 Gogeta defused quickly.
That wouldn't make Vegito always better, since it's kind of inconvenient as they need to get the earrings, fusion dance is more reliable because of that
@@user-hj2fz1tb3z
the fusion dance uses a lot of energy to maintain which is why the average duration is 30 minutes.
but the more power is used the shorter the duration becomes which is why ssj4 gogeta defused after 5 minutes of ragdolling omega shenron.
potara fusion was supposed to be endless at first and it only ended in the dbz manga because buu absorbed vegito.
in super they slapped a time limit on potara fusions for non-kais to artificialy up the stakes in fights and declaring for no reason that potara fusion is stronger.
originaly potara fusion was supposed to be slightly weaker but easier to do because there were no limitations on the fusion targets and no time limit compared to the fusion dance which comes with several restrictions in return for more power.
in the end it doesnt realy matter which is better/stronger cause the writers are constantly making shit up and redcon stuff left and right as they go.
@@user-hj2fz1tb3z
I wouldn't say that dance is more reliable cause if you fail it you will be stuck either as a fat version or skinny version of your fusion for 30 minutes giving your opponent a free win unless they are retarded
@@uteriel282 Why should the Potara fusion be initially weaker though? In DBZ it's stated that the Fusion Dance requires both fusees to use the same power level, meaning that the stronger of the two won't use his max for the fusion, a drawback Potara fusion doesn't have. How could that result in the Fusion Dance being stronger on paper?
I think each Individual should have their own opinion on the matter and overall we should appreciate both fusions equally. Fighting over it helps no one and just wastes time.
Gogeta objectively better
Gogito is better.
Vegeto, of course. Would be funny a sparking zero stream now
For who's stronger DB Super definitely made me doubt everything. I think they are very both very close which makes sense since they are both fusions of Goku and Vegeta.
But for me Vegito will always be the cooler and favourite one. I like his appearance and moves way more and his name Vegetto has Gokus saiyan name Kakarott in it which gives it a nice touch.
Where did you get kakarot in vegito
@@CupOfWhiskey kakarot in jp is pronounced “kakarotto” which is the ito in vegito (also some translations call it vegetto instead)
I was thinking about this last night. There's a 200-comment-long thread in one Gogeta video that's just these two ppl arguing back and forth
"Don't fight after stream."
Chat 1:50 SHE WANTS US TO FIGHT
every fandom dragon ball ever
giorno giovana : GER GOES UNLIMITED DEATH
From my understanding it's that fusing with the potaras gives a fairly bigger flat increase to power but using the fusion dance ampliifies the individuals power more so for most people potaras would be stronger but the fusion dance can be the stronger fusion if the two fusing are powerful enough, so while both are still very strong I would say Gogeta should be stronger since it's Goku and Vegeta. Whereas if it were say Goten and Trunks they would probably be stronger if they used the potaras.
Edit: I remembered more and I believe its potara gives more power but has a limit to how strong the fusion can be while the dance gives less power but has no limit. Same conclusion but slightly different reasoning.
The debate used to be that the potarras fuse you at your full strength exponentially whereas the fusion dance needs you to be equal in power to harmonize. That is confirmed when Piccolo told Trunks to power down a bit to match Goten.
Then again, it's a different case for Goku and Vegeta in the DBS Broly movie.
If you follow the power scaling in DBZ, Gotenks in ssj3 was equal in power to goku ssj3, although much much much less experienced. And in the manga, Vegito was shown to be fighting around ssj2 level. So in theory, Gogeta should 100% be more powerful IF he can go SSJ3. So I agree that the power scales more with fusion dance, but it requires more skill to do; while vegeta couldn't go ssj3. So vegito made more sense at the time they fused.
@@eisas1306 ssj3 is kinda irrelevant at this point tho. Both Goku and Vegeta can go ssjb as can Vegito. There's no canon appearence of Gogeta but if Vegeta were willing to fuse with the dance there's no reason to think Gogeta couldn't go blue. How much further is entirely unknown as of now tho since Goku has UI and Vegeta has ssjbe
As dark as dark and deep into a vocal voice that is nearly crisp and wondering. vegato the forgotten vegetable cat in Spanish that can grasp the name.
The question is: who is stronger, not which fusion is the better choice; Vegito is stronger and that's purely because Potara fusion was introduced as a stronger form of fusion than the fusion dance. It doesn't matter if the retcon means Vegito could only fight for 5 minutes vs. Gogeta's 30 minutes, he's still stronger.
She really just reignited one of the oldest community wars…
"at first you have my curiosity, now you have my ereytion" (ye I wrote that on purpose)
Is that an abridged reference
Kronii Obliterate this two Fusions
I have a lot of respect for Vegito choosers. it takes a lot of courage to be openly wrong.
I see you with those dokkan battle assets.
*FUN FACT:* No fusion has ever canonically won a fight across the entire DB franchise. They all have a 0% win rate or 100% loss rate if you prefer to look at it that way.
Hmmm I guess that depends on your definition of winning but yeah true :D I personally would rate the Super Broly movie as a win but again... up for interpretation.
They technically beat broly, just didn’t kill him. So 1 win only lol
But Vegito intentionally got absorbed by Buu to save everyone else that was absorbed, if not he would’ve won easily. So technically a victory.
@@JBasilix Movies are never canon. So no one treats anyone winning or losing there with any weight.
@@janematthews9087 but the Super Broly movie is canon tho?
Kronwhis loves stirring the pot.
After all the data has been compiled, after all of this time, the result ends up being that Gogeta is more powerful while Vegito is supposed to last longer. That is pretty much it. They are pretty much equal trump cards. This also is reflected in their fighting styles. Gogeta represents an offensive swarmer with a hyper-aggressive style that never gives you room to breathe. Vegito spaces himself out and times his counters while controlling space effectively like an outboxer.
Well potara is nerfed to the point it cant handle vegito’s power apparently
The start of the video broke me.
Dragon Ball lore knowledge it's one of the basic things to know in life just after first aid.
I guess even perfection itself can't be perfect
Im sure their equal. since fusion dance needs to be of similar strength and since vegeta is always trying his best to beat goku they must always be at similar levels even if they use potara earrings. it all comes down to when in the timeline they fuse into vegito or gogeta.
In potara fusion, it doesn't really matter if the two have the same power level but because of how compatible Goku and Vegeta is, their fusion is stronger.
Kronii: lights up a tree in the forest
Also Kronii: sits down and enjoy the chaos while dinking a "insert a drink here"
Both have the same power level but Vegito has never win a fight, Gogeta defeated both Janemba and Super Broly so at least Gogeta gets the shait done Vegito is useless for now.
if Vegito didn't play around fighting Buu he could win.
Vegito did what he set out to do, he wasn't trying to kill Buu, he just wanted to make him frustrated enough to absorb him. Vegito did try hard against Zamas, but yeah, he was too strong for the potara and unfused quick. Both of their top forms we see though, the Gogeta Blue would far out class the Vegito Blue considering Goku and Vegeta are MUCH stronger during the Broly movie than they were during the Future arc.
@@Ibrahim_7982 If I remeber correctly the only advantage the potara has vs the dance fusion is that the potara fusion was eternal but this was retcon in Super and just last much more time depending on the power level of the people fused, thats why Kaioshin and Kibito unfuse later on.
Well, the difference in power between the methods of fusion is the reason Goku and Vegeta didn't even bother to try the fusion dance against Buu.
"Don't fight after stream"
Literally every Dragon Ball Z fan is holding a war like that What If scenario of the Saiyans rebelling against Frieza and taking on the entire Frieza Force.
Vegito is stronger potara earrings are canonically stronger then the fusion dance
the creator stated both fusions were equal around the time dbs broly came out
@@xmant8842 Yep... Another retcon...
I am just happy she pronounced them both correctly
There's a really simple way to end this "debate", ignore all of the weird rules that they've kept changing over and over, and go off of what they *should* be. Power Level limit? That's stupid and literally goes against the whole point of the question, ignore it. Time limit shenanigans? They both have time limits and they both get worse when more power is used, ignore it (but let's be honest, they only made that for Potara so that they can get their main characters back). The question isn't about a specific Vegito or Gogeta, it's about which technique is stronger (if it was about specific times they fused, the stronger one is whichever happened last, obviously). No limits, if Goku and Vegeta decided to fuse, which warrior would be stronger?
The answer is simply Vegito. It's the fusion technique of the gods, it's stronger. Even if you don't want to believe that, Fusion Dance requires the power level of the stronger character to be brought down to match the power level of the weaker one. If you want to ignore *that* then you throw the whole "balance" argument out the window, and it goes back to simply Potara being divine and therefore stronger. The "Vegito is cocky" argument is not what the question is about, if he needed to, he would end a fight better than Gogeta. Vegito is stronger.
I agree with this. Personally, even using fights is stupid to use in a debate because they're fighing different villains and are in different circumstances. In general, Potara just has that divine aspect to it that makes it more reliable than Metamoran
Vegito: Time Advantage.
Gogeta: Battle IQ advantage, because his time is limited, he needs to end it quickly.
vegito is stronger
earrings > fusion dance
But can he beat goku tho..
Wait...
They should be about the same power level. However vegito lasts until the earrings are broken or something so its either vegito last 30 mins without breaking them or gogeta wins.
@@brianli6562 The potara has a power limit, so the fusion can end at any time when the power goes beyond what the potara can support. So Vegito has an upper limit on how powerful he can be without the fusion breaking (and it can break in a lot less than 30 minutes). He probably can't get any stronger than he was when he fought Zamasu, since that level was too much for the Potara to handle.
Gogeta has no upper limit to his power; he just has a time limit.
@@seraphinaaizen6278 Ah I completely forgot they introduced that mechanic.
@@seraphinaaizen6278 1second of vegjto vs 1second of Gogeta
Vegito > Gogeta
Gogeta is the better fusion since in gt he had ssj4, the best looking transformation
Vegito in DBSH-🤫🧏♂️