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The Dangers of KJV-Onlyism | Dr. Mark Ward
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 มิ.ย. 2024
- Is the King James Bible the best translation? What is King James Onlyism? What principles should Christians consider when choosing a Bible translation?
Join us as Dr. Mark Ward, author, TH-camr (@markwardonwords), Editor at Crossway, and former KJV-Onlyist, explains why he believes this movement is fundamentally flawed and why Christians should steer clear of this divisive belief.
Learn more about Dr. Ward and his ministry at byfaithweunderstand.com.
#SoundWordsPodcast #SoundWords #KingJamesVersion #BibleTranslation #Bible
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Always enjoy hearing from Dr. Ward. Thank you for having him on your platform.
There's a guy here on YT that swears up and down you're only saved if you read the KJV. As if the saving power of Christ was tied to a specific English version of a book. 🙄
Who says that?
My main concern is, no matter what translation is used, how well do we apply the principles the Bible teaches? How Christlike are we growing towards? Do we display the fruit of the Spirit according to Paul's letter to the Galatians?
I have seen too many people, even though they mean well, turn into legalists. It's one thing to read the scriptures, yet another when we don't show love for others like Jesus. He is kind and compassionate.
I tell those that pushes kjv only. They aren't reading the kjv it's the 7th update to try to make it more current n easier to read.
I believe the majority that read the KJV knows this. I knew this in 1985 at 10 years old when I started reading the KJV. The last update was in 1769. The 1611 was unreadable for English-speaking people within 50 years. Here is the deal with the KJV. I like the TR translations. The TR was used for the first English translation that goes back 500 years. The transcripts used to compile the TR were being used for the majority of bibles in other languages that date back to 100 to 150 AD.
This hate and confusion being pushed against the KJV could be dangerous. Now, I am not a KJV onlyist. I often read the NKJ, NASB95, ESV, NLT. However, the KJV is my main study and carry bible. Whoever that makes mad, God bless you...
If you want to have a preference that is fine... But I have had people tell me I'm not "saved" because I don't worship the KJV .
Why didn't you mention the then wildly popular Geneva Bible that came out 50 years before the KJV? It seems so strange to skip it as if it didn't even happen.
Not only do I highly recommend Mark Ward's channel, but I also recommend Dr. James White's book, The King James Only Controversy. It's a much needed resource in the church today and if more KJV-Only people would just read it, I believe less people would be KJV-Only.
This book is an insufficient basis on which to inform oneself about this most important topic. Works by David W. Daniels, Dr. Jack A. Moorman, Dr. Phil Stringer, Dr. David Sorenson, and Edward F. Hills are recommended.
@@sdlorah6450 -- Says someone who is unable to adequately respond to the many sound points Dr White makes.
I read many of the authors he is recommending. They were required reading for my Bible degree. Now that I am older and have heard both sides of the argument I’d side more with James White. 🤷
@@sdlorah6450Have you listened to the debate between James White and Jack Moorman? The KJV only position was completely exposed for the deception that it is. Would not trust David W Daniels or anything from Chick tracts. Or any from the KJV only cult.
I don't trust anybody who thinks a search for truth is dangerous.
Do you have a complete Bible right now? If yes, what Bible?
@@murrydixon5221 Not sure if we have the complete Bible, some of Paul's letters were probably lost, but what we do have we can still find God in, and the good news of the Gospel that Christ died for our sins, was buried, then rose again from the dead.
Trust the science hehe
I love the KJV, but I am not KJV only. I use it as my primary. I am just as upset with KJV haters, as I am against KJV only. (FYI - I don’t think these guys are KJV haters)
I love the KJV, I truly do! I just finished Jeremiah 16 this morning in my daily Bible reading-and this year I'm going through the KJV.
I don't like KJV. People who use it tend to confuse exegesis with paraphrasing.
Doc, Are you saying there is no poor exegesis with people that don’t use the KJV? Is the problem the Bible or the expositor?
Who are the haters? Don't make things up! We don't hate the kjv just because we don't use it. I know my ESV is a netter bibe overall and I will continue to use it gladly . If some want to use the kjv , fine its the kjv extremists who cause the division and dissension and controversy. Just live and let live. OK.
Fine. So what's the point. ? Yiu kjv nuts are the problem. Most Christians in the world do not use the kjv.
The only disagreement i have is over the paraphrases that i dont think have any value l. Im not upset at anyone who uses new living translation but wont go to a church that promotes it. Mostly what mark ward does is great though!
Then don't use it if you don't like it. !
@@keithfuson7694 i don't but if a church has that as a standard Bible id have to find another one is the only point I was making. It's hard to follow along and I won't switch over.
I agree with Mark. Additionally I truly love this brilliant brother in Christ. I have many versions, but the reason I believe the KJV is superior is for the following reasons:
“The Father”= 218 mentions
“The word” = 469 mentions
“Holy Ghost” = 90 mentions
218=469=90=
777 !!
New Testament mentions
God + Jesus + Holy Spirt
1354 + 973 + 4
When we total them, this breaks down to 777 + 777 + 777 mentions
Father Son holy Ghost/ holy Spirit
7x37 7 x 33 7x13
Grand Total = 777 !!
New Testament mentions
God + Jesus + Holy Spirt
1354 + 973 + 4
When we total them, this breaks down to 777 + 777 + 777 mentions
Father Son holy Ghost/ holy Spirit
7x37 7 x 33 7x13
Grand Total = 777 !!
First chapter of the Bible has exactly 7 x 7 x 7 words. (these patterns of 7, we see only in the KJV Bible)
“Word” when capitalized is mentioned 7 times in entire KJV Bible.
The words “Holy Spirit” is mentioned 7 times.
“the Father” + “the Word + “Holy Ghost” has 777 mentions
Now Jesus said He is the First and the Last.
The very first verse of the Bible has 44 letters.
The very last verse of the Bible has 44 letters.
This draws my attention to Psalm 44:4.
“Psalm 44:4 Thou art my King, O God: command deliverances for Jacob.”
It is no accident that we see in this verse the name “King” and we see the name “Jacob”
Jacob=James in the Bible. One is Hebrew, the other Greek, but the same name.
It is no accident that if we count all the times we see “king” starting at the very beginning of the Bible, that when we get to the only verse that has this name in it, it gives us 1611 mentions, king + (s)
So to sum this up, there are exactly 1611 mentions of “KING” before Psalm 44:4
This Bible first appeared in 1611, the Authorized Bible, same as the King James Bible.
“KING” in Psalm 444 is the 12,383’rd word of Psalms.
So 12383 = 1769 x 7
1769 is the very year the King James Bible was standardized and finalized in its form that we are looking at today.
Will anyone who sees this doubt that God has inspired this Book, and not had His hand over its translators, and the manuscripts they were guided to use?
If we examine these patterns we can no longer honestly say, that God cannot preserve His word.
Additionally the first verse, and the last verse has the same amount of vowels, and same amount of consonants. This also points us to Jesus, the First and the Last. No other Bible version has this.
27 consonants and 17 vowels in each, the first verse, and the very last verse. I doubt there is another book in existence that has this.
I have hundreds of these divine patterns in my notes, if Mark would like more. Years ago I had studied in a course statistics and probability ,and any honest would will see the 1. the above are not man made patterns 2. That this occurs in this Bible is a miracle.
I'm looking for a modern Bible.
1. It should begin with the Geneva Bible. (Hopefully, upsetting kjv onlyists. )
2. It should contain all the original Geneva Bible margin comments in modern English.
3. It should carefully fix the old Testament using the Old Testament Septuagint + Dead Sea Scrolls, not the Masoretic Text.
4. It should carefully fix the new Testament using the Majority Text(Byzantine).
Editors should have a similar philosophy as the LSB/WEB Bible.
5. Decent leather. I don't want a paperback or hardcover.
6. Center column reference
7. Passage headings.
8. No tabs on the side to help find books of the Bible. I know where they are.
I think some of the Geneva Bible comments would upset some people.
My first Bible, a Pocket NT (NLT), was given to me by someone who witnessed to me. My second bible was given to me by a friend who was turning away from Jesus, but thought that I could use it. I still have it and loved the poetic feel of it, BUT, I discovered the difference between it and the NASB, and others which had used more reliable manuscripts. I mean KJ Only people now use "science" and what appears to be a form of " numerology " to "prove" their case. Btw, Flat Earthers are all KJO proponents as well.
I disagree I think the NKJV, compliments the KJV much better than the ESV!
How do you get Greek and Hebrew if you use anything else? Most disagreements, apostasy, bad doctrine, confusion is because of all the other translations and more or added all the time. How is that a good thing?
The new translations have nothing to do with what you mentioned. Most of the false teachings we see today predate the arrival of the modern versions.
Most false teachers I have heard are generally KJV only.
One of you has your headphones on backward.
Mark Ward, unless we clearly define our terms and stick to those definitions without wavering in discussions and argumentation and in order to be clear, logical and understood and so that we don't create any ambiguity or fall into equivocation, will you, for everyone's sake, please clearly define the terms, "the Bible" and "God's word". Thank you.
1. Good interview, thanks, and a refreshing change for Dr. Ward. He's usually agonizing over the latest KJV Only audaciousness, so you gave him a well-deserved breather.
2. Mark 4:28 (KJV): "For the earth bringeth forth fruit of herself; first the blade, then the ear, after that the full corn in the ear."
3. So if the King James Bible is good enough for corn huskers, then that's good enough for me.
I came out of KJV-Onlyism, and Mark has been a big help for me. Thanks Mark
People are bolder online to say things they will not to one's face. The ability to have one's jaws slapped tends to change how one enter reacts with others.
Hand in hand back to Rome
I so appreciate the labors of the King James Bible Research Council on the subject of the KJV and modern versions!
...not only are their labors invaluable, but the spirit and tone in which they convey information are laudable.
Textus Receptus, Gevena Bible 1560-99, King James bible, NKJV and MEV. NIV-Esv NLT etc. These critical Text have 8,000 differents and are short text. I wish people would compare these new testament differents, all these missing words and verses, Alow the Holy Spirit to show you which text or Bible version is errect. And look into the history of Westcott n Hort to corrupt bible scholars, who were into contacting dead Spirit, which is not christian.
Mark Ward has two videos on his channel addressing charges made against Westcott and Hort that I highly recommend you check out.
Never had trouble reading KJV . Had problems with modern versions in their exclusion of key scriptures. Spent years researching and discovered the source texts in all modern versions come from what's commonly called 'critical' text . It's claimed that these critical texts were corrupted in their source in 2nd century. The Fuller Byzantine texts were the basis of Textus Receptus which Erasmus translated. The Bottom line of KJV is not Translation but Source texts.
My friend, the New King James Version and the Modern English Version both use the same underlying Hebrew and Greek texts as the King James. And they translate those texts into fully intelligible contemporary English, which means they meet the principle of 1 Corinthians 14, edification requires intelligibility. I recommend the NKJV and MEV to you.
@@markwardonwords I've read modern versions for years and cannotrconcile the scripture omissions from minority critical texts as compared with Textus Receptus used by Waldensians, and other Non Catholic 'heretics' of pre reformation, used by rogue catholic Erasmus in his greek text and then the KJV translators. The incorporation of the critical greek texts ( which had their beginning in Alexandria by gnostic minded 'church fathers and later incorporated in Jerome's Latin Vulgate )
Bottom-line: I started to Read the KJV in my teens. shortly after my conversion , and GOD Gave me understanding the texts I read. I later read from NASB, and the then highly publicized NIV . Switched back to KJV in college ( IVCF ) and caught some flack from my 'reformed' and 'charismatic' brethren , ( when inquiring in Bible Study on missing verses Act 8:37, 1 John 5:7...I was told that these were mere 'scribal' errors and should cease from further inquiry... My Conscience said otherwise )
I don't judge someone's Salvation on KJV, but many in modern versions churches have fallen towards LOADSHIP Salvation ( JMac, Washer, Ray 'Torment' Comfort ) Or Losing Salvation doctrines like Joe Shimmel, Bevere, Brown...
My LOVE and Reliance on KJV is Born out of True HOLY SPIRIT Conviction that I received by merely placing my FAITH in CHRIST Alone in 1974 ( Rom 3:25, 4:5, Eph 1:13)
@@longstreet2740 My friend, I'm not telling you to stop reading the KJV! I'm telling you that if your concern is missing verses, then the NKJV and MEV contain those verses. They are based on the TR, and they will help you understand God's word in places where archaisms in the KJV (that weren't archaisms in 1611, of course) are obscuring the message.
@@markwardonwords "I'm not telling you to stop reading the KJV!" This is a common reaction that critics of my position of KJV Superiority, I would respond by saying...
'Read whatever you want, BUT when there are different readings and omissions between KJV and other versions, I Choose to BELIEVE the KJV'
Not saying I could mis read, or mis apply any verse of scripture, I find the TR a better, Safer, Option in Spiritual matters.
A wise discerning pastor ( From Liberty U ) once said "Life is too Short, Eternity Too Long for me To be in the Will of GOD the best of my ability... therefore, based on my conviction, I choose to stay with KJV as final authority"
After almost 50 years of Chrisitan life, through sorrows, trial, ridicule ( much by very secular minded family members ) and much study ( Not saying I'm expert ,but I can say I have much diligence to finding Truth , as I sense you are also, )
I've studied the works of David Cloud ( Way of Life ), Peter Ruckman, da Waite and others , who differ on some issues.
Botton line, When in doubt I choose KJV as Final Authority
@@longstreet2740 Then, brother, I encourage you to watch my Fifty False Friends in the KJV series here on TH-cam, so that you can read your KJV with full understanding. May the Lord bless your reading of His Word!
Is there anybody who says you're not saved unless you read the NIV? The Living Bible? I can't agree with the extreme form of KJV-Only-ism but I find it very telling and very suspicious that it is the AV of 1611 that comes under such withering attack. There's a lot of reasons why we love it, and prefer it. For a long time it was the main source of Textus Receptus Scripture translation. Most of the modern translations are dull and bland by comparison. There's no fire in their translation belly.
Brother, at what point did I attack the KJV in this (or any) video? I love the KJV and am reading through it yet again this year.
The KJV is an excellent translation-but if you're going to read it exclusively, you need to understand that it was translated into a form of English no one quite speaks or writes anymore. So there are going to be some places where you think you understand but, because of language change, you're going to miss the intent of the KJV translators. For help discerning when this is the case, I encourage you to check out my "Fifty False Friends in the KJV" series on TH-cam for help reading the KJV!
Please read Codeword Barbelon
Beware of the Society of Jesus and those who work for them
Yeppers go right ahead and use any Bible you want to learn the gospel. Shot using the book the Jehovah Witness and the book The mormon use.
To richardlafav. How did this troll get in here? You.
I READ MY KJV BIBLE EVERY DAY AND LOVE AND UNDERSTAND THE WAY IT IS WRITTEN THE KJV BIBLE IS THE VERY BEST BIBLE WRITTEN YOU CAN KEEP THE NIV
Why do they always yell?
You left your caps lock on
Yelling makes you right? Smh..
LOL 😂 , NAS , ESV.
You can use yiur inferior kjv! I don't need it.
There's nothing wrong with KJ only. The danger of other translations are the subtle adding or taking away of words which is changing the meaning. What's the point of all this? Man always has to have the last word. Though I'm OK with a few translations, I see no reason to change from KJ.
The point of all this is to understand God’s Word, and Dr. Ward gives us a good reason to change from the KJV - we don’t understand what we don’t understand. Over the centuries, the meanings of words change. A word might look like one you know, but it has a different meaning today than it did when the KJV was written. However, you won’t realize that, so you’ll misunderstand God’s Word.
Dr. Ward doesn’t go into detail about that here, so you should check out his TH-cam channel and learn more.
As for changes that change the meaning of the text, the book Dr. Ward mentions about KJV onlyism looks at a lot of examples that have been proposed, and they’re almost always less than advertised or a better translation.
The KJV is sloppy at best.
The bibles come from 2 different manuscripts the received text and the roman Catholics manuscripts
Ummmm. . . The Received Text was put together by a Catholic. 🤷
So because I read he KJV and believe the KJV is accurate, I am in a cult. Weird.
That's not really what Mark is addressing here. Mark would agree with you that it's a great translation and that there's nothing wrong with somebody using it as their primary translation. What he's going against here is the militant style of KJV-Onlyism; namely the type that argues the KJV is the ONLY accurate or good translation, or worse, that the KJV is the only pure translation and that all other translations are of the devil and that all Christians should avoid any translation that isn't the King James Version. This type of KJV-Onlyism can and has caused division and splits in churches over the years and this is what Mark is addressing here.
@@eclipsesonicSo if I believe the KJV is accurate I must also have another “truth” and say other versions are accurate, sort of like saying 1+1=3 and 2 at the same time.
@RevolutionDebates NO! If the KJV works for you, that's awesome. No one is trying to take it from you. However, it's beyond foolish for people to believe that the KJV is the only good English translation and not to realize that other translations are easier/better for some people to truly receive God's message due to their more modern language choices.
So the Pericope Adulterae, Last 12 verses of Mark, and the other 43 complete verses omitted in several versions, are they scripture or not?
This fellow needs to get David Daniels book, “What is missing in your Bible”.
THE KJV BIBLE IS THE MOST HATED BIBLE FROM THE RC JESUITS AND OTHER PEOPLE THE POPES NEVER WANTED US TO HAVE ANY WORD OF GOD JESUS
Stop yelling please. I am not saying stop posting. Just stop yelling.
The Jesuits, Rosicrucians and miscellaneous pedophile clergy.
Elizabeth, use your passion against the cults, not Christians. Go debate Seventh Day Adventists, they worship a false prophet and deny the atonement at the Cross. 🕊️
The text used for the KJV was assembled by Erasmus and dedicated to Pope Leo X.
You are a cult member. And you yell. If you have to yell to make a point, then you have none.
You promote every English Bible that replaces the authorized bible
Actually, he doesn't. For instance, Mark Ward has openly criticized the NRSV Updated Edition (2021), which is about as close as you can get to an official replacement for the Authorized Version (being the official update of the official update of the official update of the official American edition of the official British update of the KJV).
Daniel 9 verse 26 the mesiah is blasphemyed in your English Bible.
Does it not strike anyone as weird that Mark Ward's career was started on criticizing the KJV and that arguably is the only objective of his entire presence? Almost like he's on a job for Satan. Mark, how about you prove to us that you were a "KJV-Onlyist" in the past? I'd be interested in seeing some of your old papers and articles defending the KJV. I'd like to see the nature of your supposed former belief. I know you're reading these.
I attended Heritage Baptist Church of Woodbridge, VA, in high school. They were and are KJV-Only. You can see online. When I was a teenager in that church, I did not write articles or shoot TH-cam videos. It is possible that a fellow camp counselor from after my freshman year of college would remember me defending the KJV to him (he read the NIV). It's also likely that one of my old teachers at Heritage Christian School would remember encouraging me to remain KJV-Only as I went off to college. Beyond that I can think of no proofs.
I won't answer your other charges.
Thank God for an intelligent scholar like Ward who correctly points out the errors and weaknesses and inconsistencies of the outdated kjv.
So glad to see you on this channel, Dr. Ward! @@markwardonwords
Ward needs to close his “ministry.” There is only the Antioch Text, as faithfully received in our King James Bible. All else come from a non-ecclesiastical text. Period. “KJVO” is fictitious; Ward knows better.
I wouldn't say he needs to close. But definitely needs to move on to another topic. He has lost this battle!
@@mike245401 what’s ironically funny is, over a year ago he put a video out with the thumbnail on it, saying it was the last of his content related to the matter and that he was moving on. And here he is doubling down babbling and calling himself doctor. The guy made a complete fool of himself.
There are places where the KJV does not align with the Byzantine text-type (which you have labeled as the "Antioch Text" for the sake of promoting a historically inaccurate narrative about the manuscript tradition). In the more notable places where this divergence occurs, it instead agrees with the Vulgate. See Luke 17.36 (which the KJV's original translator notes flagged as dubious), Acts 8.37 (which Erasmus found in the marginal note of a Byzantine manuscript, not the main text), and 1 John 5.7 (which has hardly any Greek support over the centuries) for notable examples.
There are also a small number of places (mostly in Revelation) where the text behind the KJV doesn't match with any Greek manuscript whatsoever, whether that's because of accidental omissions (Rev. 1.8, where Erasmus accidentally left out "God" after "Lord"), deliberate emendations (Rev. 16.5, where "and holy" was altered by Beza into "and to be," against all existing manuscript evidence), or attempted reconstructions (Rev. 22.17-19, where the TR ironically both adds and subtracts words because Erasmus was having to back-translate into Greek from the Vulgate!).
Waw this is shocking guy is dangerous not the kjv
Only one Gospel: Gospel of Reconciliation.
Jesus Christ came into THEIR kingdom
to reconcile fallen angels unto Himself.
We are the fallen angels (ELOHIM) kept in DNA chains of darkness.
If you do not confess being a fallen angel in Lucifer's kingdom, then you are an unbeliever.
Unbeliever = those that claim to be made in the image of ELOHIM(gods).
REPENT FALLEN ANGELS.