@@Beerfish777 You know, Magnus has sometimes done the opposite since the Alphazero stuff. One of the things Alphazero showed is that sometimes you should go as much as three pawns down (as insane as that sounds) for activity and openness on your half of the board. Your own pawns can often hem your own pieces and suffocate your position. Since then, Magnus has seemed willing to be down a pawn or two in order to achieve great activity or position. He also has adopted AlphaZero's LOVE of the flanking pawns on the A and H file.
Sir, your discussion of the distinction between the English words 'poisoned' and 'poisonous' is remarkable and very interesting. I think, as suggested in other comments, 'poisonous' suggests it has always been like that. I.e. a poisonous mushroom; or the B2 pawn is always dangerous to take. 'Poisoned' suggests that there has been human intervention; I.e poisoned apple; or the B2 pawn is poisoned because of previous moves White has made. But still, absolute credit for your knowledge of English.
great elaboration. Maybe it's called "poison pawn" because the poison is contagious. It's meant to die off but not without harming the opponent who captures the pawn
In some contexts "poisoned" means the same thing as "poisonous". If you offer someone a drink into which poison has been put, the drink is said to be "poisoned". "Poisoned" in the sense of having ingested poison is generally reserved for living things.
I was about to start writing this same drink analogy to show why it makes sense for it to be called "poisoned pawn". It's like if someone coated it with poison... that someone being the white player that set it up to act as bait.
3:45 I feel like “poisoned” in this case is used as an adjective, not in the sense of passive voice. It describes the state of the pawn of having poison or covered in poison, which is essentially means “poisonous”. It does not necessarily mean that the pawn itself is being poisoned by someone else.
I always assumed it meant "pawn that is poisonous". It's one of those native speaker quirks, where even if someone is extremely fluent in a language like Agad, there's an idiom or two that he might read wrong. Think of it this way: a poisoned pawn is one that you swallow at your own peril.
Hi Agad, not sure how you call them in Croatian, but in German it's exactly the same construction as in English: It's called a "vergifteter Bauer" which is equal to "poisened pawn" whereas "poisenous pawn" would rather translate to "giftiger Bauer" which is never used by anyone. So it sounds to me like the poisened pawn theme it's a universal chess paradigm across languages, not just an English thing.
It's standard English to say that an inanimate object is "poisoned" if someone has put poison in it. For example, if someone poisons another's food, it becomes poisonous, yes, but it is common to say it is "poisoned" ("has been poisoned"). The metaphor is that your opponent has secretly poisoned the pawn, making it bad to take. It is a poisoned pawn.
Because I am Greek, I can easily separate poisonous and poisoned. Poisonous is δηλητηριώδες and poisoned is δηλητηριασμένο. For Greek speakers, the difference is very clear.
According to the Merriam Webster Dictionary, poison, poisoned is a transitive verb. It has two definitions a: : to injure or kill with poison This is how our host, the agadmator, understands it. But the second meaning is b: to treat, taint, or impregnate with or as if with poison Which what "poisoned" means in the chess context.
The pawn is only considered "poisoned" until it moves, it cannot carry its poison with it. If the pawn could carry its poison with it, then "poisonous" would make more sense. But because the pawn is only poisoned as long as it sits on b2, enticing you like an appetizing but secretly deadly meal, the canonical "poisoned" is apropos.
"Poisonous" infers that a thing is naturally & intrinsically harmful to health. "Poisoned" infers that it has been made so by outside forces. Here the pawn is poisoned - by the circumstances of the game. (At 4:11 it's Tringov not Fischer who moves etc.)
I agree with your reasoning. Poisoned pawns would just die from poison, and poisonous pawns will poison you if you eat / take them. However a pawn in a chess game is not a living thing, but a piece. Thus it can't die, but it still can contain poison. So it's okay to say poisonous and poisoned as well.
Your command of English is amazing. However, there is a subtle difference between 'poisonous' and 'poisoned'. 'Poisonous' refers to the actual nature of something such as a snake or a scorpion, for example. 'Poisoned' has two meanings. I am 'poisoned' if I eat something or am stung by something 'poisonous' or somebody gives me poison or I take it knowingly or by accident. But it also means something that has had poison added to it such as lacing a drink or food with poison. So, the pawn is 'poisoned' in that second sense. 'poisonous pawn' would suggest something more active. Here, it lays in wait with its secret load of poison waiting for the unsuspecting White to take it.
"Poisonous" means naturally poisonous, e.g. snake venom or the plant deadly nightshade. "Poisoned" means that poison has been applied to something not poisonous of itself, such as an arrow or the apple which Snow White ate. "Poisoned pawn" works for this English-speaker.
Pawn is poisonous means its like a snake The snake doesn’t die from his own poison But if you don’t remove the his gland where he stores the poison you can ingest it and die You have to remove that Which means you have to see far ahead in that line what happens of you captured it. Only thing is the master knows how to deal with this And a amateur might die(loose) Because amateur in chess always grabs a pawn whenever he sees and a grandmaster plant it there to be grabbed by opponent and slowly die from bad position…
Re: poisonous / poisoned: you do have a point, but the two emphasize different things. "Poisonous" only refers to the quality of the object that it kills people who ingest it or take it. "Poisoned" emphasizes more that the poison has been injected by someone, i.e. the player who offers the poisoned pawn. It emphasizes that this pawn is being offered as a seeming sacrifice but one is cautioned to take it because it's suggested that the player has poisoned the pawn - not that the pawn was in and of itself poisonous! Therein lies the difference.
Maybe it's whether the poison is exogenous to the thing. Like "poisoned" is a past tense verb meaning an action introduced poison. Hemlock doesn't get poisoned, it's poisonous by nature. So I guess it depends on how you think about the state of pawns :).
Hey! I'm glad to know that in Croatia you say "eat" when you take a piece or pawn, here in Argentina is the same. Greetings from the land of the current Football World Champions.
My thoughts exactly. I understand that there may be a refutation, but this threatens checkmate, takes back a piece, seems to be a "useful move" at least
There's an expression in most languages "poison apple" / "poisoned apple" popularised from Snow White, it has the same meaning. I hope that helps, and glad to hear your dog is still around.
Wherein the word “poisoned” define the object “pawn” then it’s an adjective in that context. “Contaminated” is a good example. More Bobby games, please.
Poisoned pawn. The nearest equivalent would be poisoned meat, or poisoned rat bait. As the pieces are themselves dead, either alive once as tree bark, or never alive, such as granite pieces, but not marble which is metamorphosed calcareous marine flora, we can say they are poisoned in a metaphorical sense with the tactical intention of the chess player. The pieces themselves would therefore not suffer from being poisoned, being dead already. Hope that helps.😁
Whenever i see an analysis fischer game i never skip it..i dont know but i always enjoy watching his games..there is always the feeling that fischer always play for the win.
The phrase poisoned is used in an odd fashion in that instance. In English it's used to indicate that the pawn, or any other object, has been imbued with poison and should be left alone. There is no poison in the pawn however in another metaphor the phrase indicates that there are dire events or circumstances that would occur if not left alone. Hence the use of the phrase.
Poisoned can mean that which it refers to as having had poison added to it. Poisoned meat, for example, is meat that has poison added to it. Therefore, it is correct in English to call it a poisoned pawn because tactical poison has been added to it.
In culling certain predators and pests, you poison the bait. Therefore, it is called poisoned, as in 'the bait has been poisoned' or 'this bait is poisoned.'
Things that are “poisoned” were originally not poisonous but have become poisonous through the action of some agent. Dart Frogs are “poisonous” but someone’s drink in a murder mystery is “poisoned” (because someone made it become poisonous).
And it was in this position at 3:06 that Agadmator got philosophical about the poisoned pawn, so we could all expand our vast knowledge, to share it at the bar and the library.
In English poison xxx means 'an xxx that carries poison'. Like poison ring, or here poison pawn. It has subtle difference from poisonous, that is a thing that is intrinsically deadly
Wow, I thought Bobby was White for a long time there. I think of "poisonous" as something that's endogenously toxic, "poisoned" has been adulterated. Thank you again for your wonderful channel.
Nice video! It took me some time to understand why 20. ... Nf6 was possible in the game. I guess if you play 21. exf6 you probably face Bxe6 that leads to many problems (bishop and rook hanging), and the same goes if they play 21.Bxf6. It's a bit tricky though :) and maybe their is an even better response to talking the knight that i dont see ... :D
Where poisonous is grammatically correct, the etymology of "poison" in this context seems to come from Snow White and the famed "Poison Apple" and as such, it is a "poison Pawn", eat at your peril. Its usage in Chess would then be as an English Idiom, and is perfectly legit.
You are right that technically it should be called a poisonous pawn, but momentum is a heck of a force with language, and poisoned pawn is the terminology that's been used forever.
But with Antonio's following, this could be the place for a change to begin. I agree with Agad here. I'm gonna start calling it the poisonous pawn. Chess pieces are supposed to represent forces on a battlefield, so he's right that it shouldn't be poisoned really - one wouldn't poison ones own troops :D
You are correct about “poisonous” - I would guess that the term “poison pawn” is a variant of “poison pill,” which does not suffer from the same logical problem!
Poisoned pawn is past tense. It means that the pawn was once poisoned, and it would be weird. We call it the 'poison pawn'. Poison pawn is present tense, so I think of it like a pawn full of poison. If you eat it you die. So it works for me at least. (Also thank you for all the great content. The good news is your English is way better than my Croatian!)
It's past tense, but it's a verb, not an adjective. If you say "the drink was poisoned", you mean that some time in the past, someone put poison in the drink. It was the act of poisoning that happened in the past, but the drink itself still has poison in it. A pawn is poisoned at the moment Tringov opted not to defend it. He was, in essence, putting poison in the pawn, hoping that Fischer would "drink" it on his move (which he did). It's grammatical as is.
It's a good point about "poisoned" vs. "poisonous". However, there is a sense of "poisoned" which is to say "having been laced with poison", as in a "poisoned dagger", etc. I guess the idea is that the player who offers up a "poisoned pawn" does so because they have prepared an unpleasant continuation.
I think it makes sense to say something is poisonous if it is intrinsically poisonous by its nature. But poisoned seems to imply something was made to be poisonous, where it was not prior. So poisoned pawn does work.
I never thought of the poisoned pawn like that hahaha, I think poisoned for non living objects has the same meaning as poisonous. It is funny since in other languages instead of pawn they use soldier, and it makes sense that you would think of a pawn as a living thing
I think of a poisoned pawn the same way I think of a poisoned elixir. That is, a poisoned pawn is a pawn that's been poisoned with something in the same way a poisoned elixir is poisoned with something. But seeing as how pawns are real living things, I understand the misunderstanding. inb4 🤓
Fischer was a materialistic player, especially in his peak years. He would grab a pawn or two and his opponent had to justify the sacrifice, which often times than not results in a win for Bobby.
It's a nuance of English, but "poisoned" is better than "poisonous" here. For example, a deathcap mushroom is poisonous, but if you added a deathcap mushroom to a soup, then the soup would be poisoned. The b2 pawn is not usually poisonous, but here White has (arguably) poisoned it with the position.
poisoned sounds as exact as it gets - it shows intent (most likely in GM play at least) and subject activity (somebody has done the poisoning) term poisonous is very much a random phenomena
I feel you on thewhole poisoned pawn thing not working if you imagine the pawn as a little guy who has been poisoned. And especially if you imagine the queen eats it, it would definitely also make sense as a poisonous pawn. But "poisoned pawn" has a nice air to it so I imagine it's like the little dude's armor has poison tips or something
Tringov: I got uppity at a chess game and forfeited the contest. Fischer: Same here! But I won the world championship anyway. Pick yer battles, Georgi!
Hey big fan here, something you should know is that when you switch to full screen on the phone it’s too zoomed in on the chessboard. I think if you slightly zoom out in the board it should fix everything
It is called testamentebonden in Danish. The last will pawn. Because, or so the story goes, a rich man once willed all his fortune to his son on the condition he never take a pawn on b2.
Fischer sat alone for hours in his hotel room in New York and played this tournament via teletype; it proved to be an arduous task for the American maverick
No, because black Bishop takes white bishop and is attacking the queen so queen has to take that bishop. Then pawn takes the other bishop, so queen takes paw with check but the black plays bishop to g7 in defense. Since white already sacrificed a piece, this position is pretty much lost. The fact that fischer probably saw all this from when his opponent sacrificed his knight is what makes him a legend.
I was most active in competitve chess from the late 60s to the late 80s. Based on the fact that Fischer achieved such dominance before engines, imagine what level he might have reached with engines. Elo 3000?
Fischer might have reached scary heights if he had computers to help him. However, be also might have become bored with the game and we would have been robbed of his brilliance. He said much later in life that he hated what chess had become and that's why he invented Fischer Random chess
I've heard people say poison apple or that something "is poison" when they mean that it is poisonous. Think "your words are poison" from the lord of the rings. Poison pawn. It's two nouns next to each other, not poisoned pawn. Also I find it amazing that Croatians eat pawns haha.
Spassky was 162nd world ranking in 1992 and rated 2550! Fischer beat Spassky 10 wins 15 draws 5 losses in 1992! So we get Fischer rating! Fischer score 58,33%! So we get Fischer rating 2617,78 in 1992! That would have been 59th ranking in the world!
![SAFEPLANET - ดาวเคราะห์ [ THE PLANET ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4X1XL3I_k3c/mqdefault.jpg)
Capablanca, Fischer and Korchnoi taught me a very important lesson as a chess player; pawn grabbing can win you games.
Yasser, Aman and Arjun too 😂
Magnus shows that in almost every game he wins. At the start of the end game he is always up a pawn or two.
Chess is about reducing the possibilities available to your opponent.
Yeah, Korchnoi is especially famous for taking pawns "of any quality".
@@Beerfish777 You know, Magnus has sometimes done the opposite since the Alphazero stuff. One of the things Alphazero showed is that sometimes you should go as much as three pawns down (as insane as that sounds) for activity and openness on your half of the board. Your own pawns can often hem your own pieces and suffocate your position. Since then, Magnus has seemed willing to be down a pawn or two in order to achieve great activity or position. He also has adopted AlphaZero's LOVE of the flanking pawns on the A and H file.
Sir, your discussion of the distinction between the English words 'poisoned' and 'poisonous' is remarkable and very interesting. I think, as suggested in other comments, 'poisonous' suggests it has always been like that. I.e. a poisonous mushroom; or the B2 pawn is always dangerous to take. 'Poisoned' suggests that there has been human intervention; I.e poisoned apple; or the B2 pawn is poisoned because of previous moves White has made. But still, absolute credit for your knowledge of English.
Yes it's poisoned , not poison. Poisoned meaning that it was intentionally given up with the knowledge that it was bad for the other person
great elaboration. Maybe it's called "poison pawn" because the poison is contagious. It's meant to die off but not without harming the opponent who captures the pawn
In some contexts "poisoned" means the same thing as "poisonous". If you offer someone a drink into which poison has been put, the drink is said to be "poisoned". "Poisoned" in the sense of having ingested poison is generally reserved for living things.
What a chess playing babe. Thanks
maybe he sees chess pieces as actual pieces in an army, where the pawn is a “living thing”
Also just plain "poison pawn" works too
I was about to start writing this same drink analogy to show why it makes sense for it to be called "poisoned pawn". It's like if someone coated it with poison... that someone being the white player that set it up to act as bait.
Vast knowledge and all that blah blah thank you
"I don't consider myself to be a genius at chess. I consider myself to be a genius who just happens to play chess." -- Bobby Fischer 🤣
Above 140 IQ is genius fiscers IQ is 180+ so he will definietly excel at every field he chosen
😆 so humble
Hes not wrong tho
@@VidaBlue317 He recognised his value as a being. There is nothing wrong with that
3:45 I feel like “poisoned” in this case is used as an adjective, not in the sense of passive voice. It describes the state of the pawn of having poison or covered in poison, which is essentially means “poisonous”.
It does not necessarily mean that the pawn itself is being poisoned by someone else.
Pretty much like "poisoned chalice".
@@thembadube9589 There have been cases of chalices dying from poison, I'm sure
Kinda like when you say man meaning mankind. And feminists get their panties in a bunch…
I always assumed it meant "pawn that is poisonous". It's one of those native speaker quirks, where even if someone is extremely fluent in a language like Agad, there's an idiom or two that he might read wrong.
Think of it this way: a poisoned pawn is one that you swallow at your own peril.
You can't be aerious😢
philosophical debate about a word, love it 😂😂😂 this made my day. Love this channel
Hi Agad, not sure how you call them in Croatian, but in German it's exactly the same construction as in English: It's called a "vergifteter Bauer" which is equal to "poisened pawn" whereas "poisenous pawn" would rather translate to "giftiger Bauer" which is never used by anyone. So it sounds to me like the poisened pawn theme it's a universal chess paradigm across languages, not just an English thing.
It's standard English to say that an inanimate object is "poisoned" if someone has put poison in it. For example, if someone poisons another's food, it becomes poisonous, yes, but it is common to say it is "poisoned" ("has been poisoned"). The metaphor is that your opponent has secretly poisoned the pawn, making it bad to take. It is a poisoned pawn.
Because I am Greek, I can easily separate poisonous and poisoned. Poisonous is δηλητηριώδες and poisoned is δηλητηριασμένο. For Greek speakers, the difference is very clear.
Agadmator: Hmm.... is it "poisoned" pawn or "poisonous" pawn?
Fischer: Either way, it tastes good to me.
According to the Merriam Webster Dictionary, poison, poisoned is a transitive verb. It has two definitions
a: : to injure or kill with poison
This is how our host, the agadmator, understands it. But the second meaning is
b: to treat, taint, or impregnate with or as if with poison
Which what "poisoned" means in the chess context.
The pawn is only considered "poisoned" until it moves, it cannot carry its poison with it. If the pawn could carry its poison with it, then "poisonous" would make more sense. But because the pawn is only poisoned as long as it sits on b2, enticing you like an appetizing but secretly deadly meal, the canonical "poisoned" is apropos.
It would be great to start a new series on Bobby Fischer's rise to top
3:05 Agad mannnnnnn such a deep thought 😂😂😂
"Poisonous" infers that a thing is naturally & intrinsically harmful to health. "Poisoned" infers that it has been made so by outside forces. Here the pawn is poisoned - by the circumstances of the game. (At 4:11 it's Tringov not Fischer who moves etc.)
I agree with your reasoning. Poisoned pawns would just die from poison, and poisonous pawns will poison you if you eat / take them. However a pawn in a chess game is not a living thing, but a piece. Thus it can't die, but it still can contain poison. So it's okay to say poisonous and poisoned as well.
but in chess terminology nobody ever sais poisonous.
Sir, you are a true gentleman.
Your command of English is amazing. However, there is a subtle difference between 'poisonous' and 'poisoned'. 'Poisonous' refers to the actual nature of something such as a snake or a scorpion, for example. 'Poisoned' has two meanings. I am 'poisoned' if I eat something or am stung by something 'poisonous' or somebody gives me poison or I take it knowingly or by accident. But it also means something that has had poison added to it such as lacing a drink or food with poison. So, the pawn is 'poisoned' in that second sense. 'poisonous pawn' would suggest something more active. Here, it lays in wait with its secret load of poison waiting for the unsuspecting White to take it.
Agadmator: "If the arbiter tells you something, just do it."
Arbiter: "You should resign."
Me: "........"
"Poisonous" means naturally poisonous, e.g. snake venom or the plant deadly nightshade. "Poisoned" means that poison has been applied to something not poisonous of itself, such as an arrow or the apple which Snow White ate. "Poisoned pawn" works for this English-speaker.
Poisonous also means not naturally poisonous according to the dictionary, but yeah, poisoned pawn works.
Pawn is poisonous means its like a snake
The snake doesn’t die from his own poison
But if you don’t remove the his gland where he stores the poison you can ingest it and die
You have to remove that
Which means you have to see far ahead in that line what happens of you captured it.
Only thing is the master knows how to deal with this
And a amateur might die(loose)
Because amateur in chess always grabs a pawn whenever he sees and a grandmaster plant it there to be grabbed by opponent and slowly die from bad position…
Fischer so talented his ability to create spectacular moves catching his opponents off guard
Fischer is king
Re: poisonous / poisoned: you do have a point, but the two emphasize different things. "Poisonous" only refers to the quality of the object that it kills people who ingest it or take it. "Poisoned" emphasizes more that the poison has been injected by someone, i.e. the player who offers the poisoned pawn. It emphasizes that this pawn is being offered as a seeming sacrifice but one is cautioned to take it because it's suggested that the player has poisoned the pawn - not that the pawn was in and of itself poisonous! Therein lies the difference.
Maybe it's whether the poison is exogenous to the thing.
Like "poisoned" is a past tense verb meaning an action introduced poison. Hemlock doesn't get poisoned, it's poisonous by nature.
So I guess it depends on how you think about the state of pawns :).
Incredible game along with fine commentary 😊
Hey! I'm glad to know that in Croatia you say "eat" when you take a piece or pawn, here in Argentina is the same. Greetings from the land of the current Football World Champions.
9:38
One variation I cant believe you didn't cover is taking the knight with either pawn or bishop.
In either of the cases you just grab White's light squared bishop and there is no attack.
My thoughts exactly. I understand that there may be a refutation, but this threatens checkmate, takes back a piece, seems to be a "useful move" at least
If I was in black's position I would've panicked. Fischer was indeed a human engine.
Fischer: the pawn in B2 is a poison pawn.
Agad: yes it is unless you push B4
There's an expression in most languages "poison apple" / "poisoned apple" popularised from Snow White, it has the same meaning.
I hope that helps, and glad to hear your dog is still around.
Fischer must be a magician. Tringov appeared to have more of a winning position, but Fischer comes in and makes it disappear.
Wherein the word “poisoned” define the object “pawn” then it’s an adjective in that context. “Contaminated” is a good example.
More Bobby games, please.
Poisoned pawn.
The nearest equivalent would be poisoned meat, or poisoned rat bait. As the pieces are themselves dead, either alive once as tree bark, or never alive, such as granite pieces, but not marble which is metamorphosed calcareous marine flora, we can say they are poisoned in a metaphorical sense with the tactical intention of the chess player. The pieces themselves would therefore not suffer from being poisoned, being dead already.
Hope that helps.😁
Whenever i see an analysis fischer game i never skip it..i dont know but i always enjoy watching his games..there is always the feeling that fischer always play for the win.
Did you skip this one?
Bobby is great
The phrase poisoned is used in an odd fashion in that instance.
In English it's used to indicate that the pawn, or any other object, has been imbued with poison and should be left alone.
There is no poison in the pawn however in another metaphor the phrase indicates that there are dire events or circumstances that would occur if not left alone.
Hence the use of the phrase.
Poisoned can mean that which it refers to as having had poison added to it. Poisoned meat, for example, is meat that has poison added to it. Therefore, it is correct in English to call it a poisoned pawn because tactical poison has been added to it.
The Real GOAT.
In culling certain predators and pests, you poison the bait. Therefore, it is called poisoned, as in 'the bait has been poisoned' or 'this bait is poisoned.'
Things that are “poisoned” were originally not poisonous but have become poisonous through the action of some agent. Dart Frogs are “poisonous” but someone’s drink in a murder mystery is “poisoned” (because someone made it become poisonous).
And it was in this position at 3:06 that Agadmator got philosophical about the poisoned pawn, so we could all expand our vast knowledge, to share it at the bar and the library.
In English poison xxx means 'an xxx that carries poison'. Like poison ring, or here poison pawn. It has subtle difference from poisonous, that is a thing that is intrinsically deadly
Wow, I thought Bobby was White for a long time there.
I think of "poisonous" as something that's endogenously toxic, "poisoned" has been adulterated.
Thank you again for your wonderful channel.
Best and most succinct answer to the poisoned/poisonous debate.
Some alternatives: toxic pawn; infected pawn; trojan pawn
Love the quote above the board
Nice video! It took me some time to understand why 20. ... Nf6 was possible in the game. I guess if you play 21. exf6 you probably face Bxe6 that leads to many problems (bishop and rook hanging), and the same goes if they play 21.Bxf6. It's a bit tricky though :) and maybe their is an even better response to talking the knight that i dont see ... :D
It's tricky because down the line Qxb7 attacking the rook is also possible because of Nf6 move :)
Where poisonous is grammatically correct, the etymology of "poison" in this context seems to come from Snow White and the famed "Poison Apple" and as such, it is a "poison Pawn", eat at your peril. Its usage in Chess would then be as an English Idiom, and is perfectly legit.
You are right that technically it should be called a poisonous pawn, but momentum is a heck of a force with language, and poisoned pawn is the terminology that's been used forever.
But with Antonio's following, this could be the place for a change to begin. I agree with Agad here. I'm gonna start calling it the poisonous pawn. Chess pieces are supposed to represent forces on a battlefield, so he's right that it shouldn't be poisoned really - one wouldn't poison ones own troops :D
@@FizzLeeague poisoned als means "primed with poison" in order to poison someone
@@thekurdishtapes8317 you're right, of course, but Agad is right to point out its ambiguity. I like linguistic precision (it's practically my kink 😂).
You are correct about “poisonous” - I would guess that the term “poison pawn” is a variant of “poison pill,” which does not suffer from the same logical problem!
Poisoned pawn is past tense. It means that the pawn was once poisoned, and it would be weird. We call it the 'poison pawn'. Poison pawn is present tense, so I think of it like a pawn full of poison. If you eat it you die. So it works for me at least. (Also thank you for all the great content. The good news is your English is way better than my Croatian!)
It's past tense, but it's a verb, not an adjective. If you say "the drink was poisoned", you mean that some time in the past, someone put poison in the drink. It was the act of poisoning that happened in the past, but the drink itself still has poison in it. A pawn is poisoned at the moment Tringov opted not to defend it. He was, in essence, putting poison in the pawn, hoping that Fischer would "drink" it on his move (which he did). It's grammatical as is.
It's a good point about "poisoned" vs. "poisonous". However, there is a sense of "poisoned" which is to say "having been laced with poison", as in a "poisoned dagger", etc. I guess the idea is that the player who offers up a "poisoned pawn" does so because they have prepared an unpleasant continuation.
I think you're right about poisonous as being more correct, but poisoned sounds more poetic.
Poisoned pawn refers to what was done to the pawn - it was made poisonous, as in "poisoned bait".
Poisonous pawn would be what the pawn itself is.
4:54 bishop and rook for bishop and rook..... and a pawn and poor position but
in English we can use a past participle of a verb as an adjective so in this context poisoned and poisonous mean the same thing
You are correct about the pawn language being poisonous rather than poisoned.
I think it makes sense to say something is poisonous if it is intrinsically poisonous by its nature. But poisoned seems to imply something was made to be poisonous, where it was not prior. So poisoned pawn does work.
I never thought of the poisoned pawn like that hahaha, I think poisoned for non living objects has the same meaning as poisonous. It is funny since in other languages instead of pawn they use soldier, and it makes sense that you would think of a pawn as a living thing
Love you showing and analyzing fischer games. Shame his mental issues cut short an amazing career.
I see Fischer i click :D
I think of a poisoned pawn the same way I think of a poisoned elixir. That is, a poisoned pawn is a pawn that's been poisoned with something in the same way a poisoned elixir is poisoned with something.
But seeing as how pawns are real living things, I understand the misunderstanding.
inb4 🤓
Brown vs Fischer is a great game! Fischer used the Alekhine defense!
I wish you had Bobby Fischer once a week at least
We can never get enough Bobby Fischer!
You are right about the poison semantics. I bet you could find out who made that reference originally
Fischer was a materialistic player, especially in his peak years. He would grab a pawn or two and his opponent had to justify the sacrifice, which often times than not results in a win for Bobby.
Gotta go back and watch the last half of the game again. For sure got lost thinking it was over for Fischer
It's a nuance of English, but "poisoned" is better than "poisonous" here. For example, a deathcap mushroom is poisonous, but if you added a deathcap mushroom to a soup, then the soup would be poisoned.
The b2 pawn is not usually poisonous, but here White has (arguably) poisoned it with the position.
poisoned sounds as exact as it gets - it shows intent (most likely in GM play at least) and subject activity (somebody has done the poisoning)
term poisonous is very much a random phenomena
I feel you on thewhole poisoned pawn thing not working if you imagine the pawn as a little guy who has been poisoned. And especially if you imagine the queen eats it, it would definitely also make sense as a poisonous pawn. But "poisoned pawn" has a nice air to it so I imagine it's like the little dude's armor has poison tips or something
You're right. It should be poisonous. You made me laugh out loud man. That was funny.
Hey agadmator, When will you start your Wilhelm Steinitz saga you were supposed to do??
Im getting free English lessons from Agad. My man is a legend❤
Tringov: I got uppity at a chess game and forfeited the contest.
Fischer: Same here! But I won the world championship anyway. Pick yer battles, Georgi!
Hey big fan here, something you should know is that when you switch to full screen on the phone it’s too zoomed in on the chessboard. I think if you slightly zoom out in the board it should fix everything
Nvm 😂
It is called testamentebonden in Danish. The last will pawn. Because, or so the story goes, a rich man once willed all his fortune to his son on the condition he never take a pawn on b2.
In German it’s called "Bauernraubvariante" which means "Pawn robbery variation"
Yes agree a poisonous pawn
Winning in 20 moves against a GM is crazy indeed :)
02:58 kehena kya chahte ho
We should call it the pestilent pawn or the pernicious pawn
The pawn is poisoned in the sense like food is poisoned. If you eat it, or in the case of chess, capture it, you die/lose.
People: Poisoned Pawn
Antonio: Poisonous Pawn
Meanwhile the Pawn:
We are Venom
If you bite it and you die, it was poisoned.
If it bites you and you die, it was poisonous (venomous?)
Fischer was not a force to be reckoned with lol, he was super strong!
Fischer be like, "Havana, ooh na na."
Fischer sat alone for hours in his hotel room in New York and played this tournament via teletype; it proved to be an arduous task for the American maverick
@9:38 can't you capture the black knight on f6 with the bishop and remove the defender of the checkmate square at g8?
No, because black Bishop takes white bishop and is attacking the queen so queen has to take that bishop. Then pawn takes the other bishop, so queen takes paw with check but the black plays bishop to g7 in defense. Since white already sacrificed a piece, this position is pretty much lost. The fact that fischer probably saw all this from when his opponent sacrificed his knight is what makes him a legend.
After 20 ... Nf6, what's wrong with taking the knight?
Antonio's humour is on another level😂❤
Always cracks me up. Every time
Is Antonio's prolonged discussion about the poison pawn because it precludes white's best move, b4?
You're absolutely correct about the "poison pawn" ; "poisonous pawn" is much more intelligent lol
I was most active in competitve chess from the late 60s to the late 80s. Based on the fact that Fischer achieved such dominance before engines, imagine what level he might have reached with engines. Elo 3000?
Fischer might have reached scary heights if he had computers to help him. However, be also might have become bored with the game and we would have been robbed of his brilliance. He said much later in life that he hated what chess had become and that's why he invented Fischer Random chess
@@hectorg5809 Good point, trying to predict Fischer's actions was always tricky !
9:37 what if I take the knight with the pawn ? Black doesn't seem to have any defense for this
Exactly Sir. It is not a poisonous move.
I was looking at the near final position. Why not pxN? after pxN BxB, QxB and Nd4 forking Q and R, doesn't the game still go on?
I've heard people say poison apple or that something "is poison" when they mean that it is poisonous. Think "your words are poison" from the lord of the rings. Poison pawn. It's two nouns next to each other, not poisoned pawn. Also I find it amazing that Croatians eat pawns haha.
Why did it have to be Nc6 followed by Qc5, rather than Qc5 followed by Nc6?
Such a boss pfp of fischer 😎😎
The Amazonian tree frog is quite toxic, but is it a poison frog?.
It's like the nauseous vs nauseated. Almost everybody uses the first when they mean the second.
Any plans to show a game from the Fischer-Spassky rematch in 1992? Some beautiful games were played in that match
Spassky was 162nd world ranking in 1992 and rated 2550! Fischer beat Spassky 10 wins 15 draws 5 losses in 1992! So we get Fischer rating! Fischer score 58,33%! So we get Fischer rating 2617,78 in 1992! That would have been 59th ranking in the world!