Making Sense of Nutrition | Dr Gil Carvalho | The Proof Podcast EP 207
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 มิ.ย. 2024
- In Episode 207 Dr Gil Carvalho explains how to approach nutrition information from an evidence-based viewpoint, breaking down the details of data analysis.
In recent years, we’ve seen a huge influx of information being presented as fact without any real scientific foundations. Being able to assess the validity of these claims is critical, and Dr Carvalho offers useful insight into how a layperson can approach them.
In today’s episode, we shift the focus away from what to think about the science of nutrition onto how to think about it. You’ll learn how to assess scientific claims with Dr Carvalho’s “Three P’s” framework. We apply this framework to a few examples, exploring cooking oils, red meat, eggs, and cholesterol. We also discuss the nuance of evidence hierarchies, and much more.
Specifically, we cover:
0:00 Intro
4:50 Gil’s Story
10:30 How we Think About Nutrition
14:50 What is Proof
28:40 Observational & Randomized Control Trials
44:07 Evaluating the Impact of Oil
1:22:14 Red Meat
1:54:33 Outro
You can learn more about Dr Gil Carvalho here: www.truehealthinitiative.org/...
and connect with him on Twitter: / nutritionmades3
and Facebook: / drgilcarvalho
For straightforward, science-based nutrition information, visit his TH-cam channel: Nutrition Made Simple / @nutritionmadesimple
You can also access his research publications: scholar.google.com/citations?... for more.
Thank you to The Proof friend, Eimele Essential 8, for sponsoring today’s episode. Eimele Essential 8 offers the right nutrients, in the right doses, to complement a plant-rich diet. To save 5% on your first order, head to theproof.com/friends/
Make sure to head to theproof.com/podcast/ for the full show notes.
Enjoy, friends.
Simon
*Supporting studies*
- A randomized crossover trial on the effect of plant-based compared with animal-based meat on trimethylamine-N-oxide and cardiovascular disease risk factors in generally healthy adults: Study With Appetizing Plantfood-Meat Eating Alternative Trial (SWAP-MEAT) [PMID: 32780794] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32780...
- Apolipoprotein B Particles and Cardiovascular Disease: A Narrative Review [PMID: 31642874] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31642...
- Assessment of Causal Direction Between Gut Microbiota-Dependent Metabolites and Cardiometabolic Health: A Bidirectional Mendelian Randomization Analysis [PMID: 31167879] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31167...
- Blood Pressure Response to Submaximal Exercise Test in Adults [PMID: 27703976] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27703...
- Consumption of Olive Oil and Risk of Total and Cause-Specific Mortality Among U.S. Adults [PMID: 35027106] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35027...
- Dietary Fats and Cardiovascular Disease: A Presidential Advisory From the American Heart Association [PMID: 28620111] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28620...
- Dietary lipids and blood cholesterol: quantitative meta-analysis of metabolic ward studies [PMID: 9006469] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9006469/
- Effects of Olive Oil on Markers of Inflammation and Endothelial Function-A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis [PMID: 26378571] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26378...
- Effects of red meat, white meat, and nonmeat protein sources on atherogenic lipoprotein measures in the context of low compared with high saturated fat intake: a randomized controlled trial [PMID: 31161217] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31161...
- Low-density lipoproteins cause atherosclerotic cardiovascular disease. 1. Evidence from genetic, epidemiologic, and clinical studies. A consensus statement from the European Atherosclerosis Society Consensus Panel [PMID: 28444290] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28444...
- Mediterranean diet, traditional risk factors, and the rate of cardiovascular complications after myocardial infarction: final report of the Lyon Diet Heart Study [PMID: 9989963] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9989963/
- Physical Activity and Risk of Cardiovascular Disease-A Meta-Analysis of Prospective Cohort Studies [PMID: 22470299] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22470...
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Awesome podcast! Gil has become my favourite youtuber on this topic. Such a humble and unbiased scientist.
I love Gil's content. He's great at explaining confusing subjects in an easy-to-understand way. His channel is aptly named :)
One of my favorite episodes. I think everyone who posts or reposts “nutritional” advice should listen to this along with anyone who has ever changed the way they eat due to a post, blog, or 15 second TikTok. We consume so much information at such a rapid pace that understanding how to interpret the evidence (or lack thereof) presented is critical especially when it comes to public health advice.
This dude is young and has many years to learn. Just because he got his PhD, doesn’t mean much. People are still learning despite getting their PHD.
simon, you and plant chomper should hook up. that would be an interesting mix of interests. actually that's how i first found out about gil. you guys are really upping the anti for vegan content.
What a great episode! Love the pop up with the studies on it
Great job Simon as usual. I’m a big fan of Dr. Gil and would love for you to continue this conversation with him in the future.
Simon, you do a masterful job of always asking the questions that need answers. For example, what about Sydney and Minnesota? What about oxidation of omega-6? And we get to hear the answers from experts in their fields. It’s incredibly useful. Also, Gil Cavalho’s content saved me from the misguided, and evidence-poor, hysteria of the online carnivore community. And your content has greatly enriched both my understanding and my critical thinking on nutrition science. I went from not wanting to hear what your guests were saying to appreciating the thoroughness and complexity of nutrition. Many thanks.
Wow, I just discovered your channel as it popped up as a suggestion (I am subscribed to Dr. Carvalho's channel). I can't wait to dig deeper into your content. Looks like you have a ton of interesting topics, saved this on my watch list :)
Very great episode. If scientific literacy can one day reach that of reading/writing then the world will be a far kinder and more reasonable place. This episode was an informative intro and how-to of looking at evidence hierarchies.
Scientific 'literacy', or rather, scientific 'knowledge' is meant to be kept from the consumer. A recent example of how the scientific community kept the truth and facts from the public was koveed. The people were sold a bill of goods. It was a money making scam for the pharmaceutical companies. Just as is most of the medical community regarding chronic illness or viruses. Anyway...
I’ve been looking forward to this one, thanks Simon! ✌️
Fantastic...Gil is awesome
First I would like to add my admiration for the service you are providing through The Proof. I had some trouble absorbing this one but was pleased it covered TMAO. I would simply like to add a perhaps random data point. I progressed to veganism through being a pescatarian. There is at least a concern that TMAO is linked to CVD and is considered a vascular inflammatory condition. As I went toward outright veganism my Dr monitored vascular plaque buildup annually. It continued until I eliminated fish from my diet. When I dropped the fish, predominantly wild caught salmon, my TMAO marker dropped from high to effectively zero. That year I showed my first reversal of plaque buildup. It was the only dietary change I had made. As I say. It's just a data point. Take it or leave it but it made a believer out of me. Thank you for the privilege of commenting.
Gil is a god. Thank you for bringing him to the proof :D
Great interview Simon! Gil is very insightful and really makes nutrition seem simple. His TH-cam channel and yours are wonderful... deep in research and great references. True guidance to sort out so much confusion.
Thank you both!
Thank you both for sharing. I think Zach Bush would be interesting as a future guest. ❤️🇨🇦
I go with what Dr Gil says. I know he wouldn’t want me to do that and he’d want me to look at the data instead, but ain’t nobody got time for that! He does it for me. I’m interested to learn more about TMAO, I know he’s changed his mind on it, but I’m not entirely sure that he should have, so I’ll keep my ear out for more on that.
The older I get, the more I realize that Bertrand Russell was often not talking about me in a good way. Great discussion!
This is so good .... as a physician ...... I appreciate the service you guys are providing!
Such an interesting conversation about evidence in the nutrition sphere. Very informative stuff. Thanks again Simon 👍
Thanks guys, love both your channels. So good to find dietary advice that stands up to such a high level of scrutiny.
Our pleasure!
I like his ability to summarise and explain, it's much clearer than some other guests on the show. I'm going to check his YT channel 👍
His channel is excellent!
A phrase i love and try to follow is (not sure who exactly said it): eat whole foods, mostly plants and not too much.
Michael Pollan said it
@@KirkVidrine thank you!
*all
Please bring Lisa Mosconi; she's a wealth of knowledge if you ask the right questions. Also, someone to talk about preserving joints and the spine.
Simon, excellent as usual. I’ve been WFPB for 18 months. I recently got into endurance sports and struggle to maintain weight (I also strength train). I’d love to add olive oil into my diet. Can you recommend a protocol for testing my risk for arthrosclerosis? Can I have the exact same meals one day, get a fasted ApoB test the next. The next day, add olive oil to the same meals and get tested. Would that be indicative of my personal risk?
I spend a big chunk of my day chewing on food so olive oil sounds like an amazing shortcut! I’m hoping like coco powder and tofu that it’s a rare example of ultra processed food that’s good for you. I don’t get why cause all the fiber polyphenols and stripped. In coco and tofu they remain
badass. can’t wait to listen on my run in a few hours
great convo guys. i’m familiar with Gil’s videos but this was my first time on your channel. looking forward to watching more. it’s a good break from the exhausting diet tribalism that plagues social media.
Hi Si and co, I have a question about supplementation on a WFPB diet. If I decide to buy a DHA EPA supplement like the one recommend or similar, is it not necessary to have include ALA foods like chia and flax or would it be advisable to add a algae based supplement along with these foods? Just to add genetic tests reveal I have poor conversion to long chain omega fats so need a little guidance on this topic. Thank you.
@@TheProofWithSimonHill Missed that one. Must be Mr Bulsiewicz pumping out so many podcast interviews, I've forgot there's other doctors and podcasts out there.
I won’t tell you to not eat glass, either; but I’m not responsible for anyone’s health but my own and that of my family. If everyone else wants to die early, I’m good with that.
Current state of understanding which may change with time:
Generally, consuming over 100 grams of red meat a day appears to have negative health effects. To put it in perspective, 100 grams is approximately the amount of red meat found in a single hamburger.
1:20:40 "just show data and let people make their own decision"
So true! Too many GP and dieticians present their diet as the result of science while there is not one exclusive science-based diet.
That's how my dad told me recently: "Look, they all have their own diet so to me it's just BS"
That's why I'm digging more and more to understand these contradictions, as close as possible to the studies without having to read them, as I cannot understand their jargon. For sure, all these contradictions are serving the scientific community badly and harming their credibility.
In 1:48, isn’t the case for Whole Foods vs Oils demonstrated with a trial?
Hey Simon, regarding the graph at 1:28:50 - the idea that there is a quick plateau in serum cholesterol with the incremental increase of dietary cholesterol is quite clear. However, could you please explain what is the baseline dietary cholesterol showing there? Thanks!
@@TheProofWithSimonHill ah, I didn't take notice of the most important factor of that, i.e., "dietary". I thought it was the baseline serum cholesterol, and I couldn't fathom how it is possible to have no serum cholesterol ^^. Thanks Simon, I really appreciate your response.
I'm so confused. He's at odds with Ornish and Lustig. I'm trying to sort out who is right and about what.
I'm on whole food-plant based 6 years now and so I am biased towards that. I started listening to Dr. Gil. He seems very unbiased. When it comes to the evidence, he believe that whole food-plant based and a properly consumed Mediterranean diet are the healthiest diets that can be consumed, based on his analysis of the data.
I'll stay wfpb but imho Mediterranean diet is much more realistic of a switch for the vast majority of people, who are mostly on the standard American diet.
I find Lustig demonizes all carbohydrates and that is not factual. An excess of sugar is clearly very bad for health, and refined and processed carbs are also very bad for health. A whole food-plant based diet contains most of the healthiest foods that there are.
Clear as mud thanks Gil
Dr. Gil has provided me with a check on the biased whole food-plant based video and doctors. I like to know the reality, but I have changed my lifestyle with wfpb to be the best I can be, so I stay on the diet anyways, and revere the supporting doctors: Mcdougall, Esselstyn, Barnard and many others.
Also, among the topics: fatigue (particularly mental) and evidence-based herbal medicine.
How about having two guests that can discuss these things. It’s very confusing having just one view of things
With respect to your dietary pattern regarding the overall whole effect on your health, is it true that the vegan diet is better than the Mediterranean one?
@@TheProofWithSimonHill Why not, since eating animal flesh produces inflammation?
@@jakobw135 Vegan diet can range from very unhealthy foods, which many vegans eat, to a whole food-plant based diet, which is extremely healthy.
Mediterranean diet could be as healthy as the whole food-plant based diet. That's what the unbiased information is showing at this time. I'm on the whole food-plant based diet and won't be switching.
@@RiDankulous The ONLY Vegan diet that makes sense is, of course, WHOLE and UNPROCESSED plants - and not the veggie JUNK widely available. :-)
They might be equal if analyses account for other variables besides dietary patterns. Even if it turns out that one is superior to another, Veganism has an edge in the animal ethic aspect.
The "evils" of seed oils seem to go back to the Weston A Price Foundation - Mary G. Enig and Sally Fallon leading the way.
Another great episode, but still missing the theme song from the Plant Proof.
Can you bring kevin bass on the podcast?
The fact that you can't do RCT's to provide empirical evidence does not make association into empirical science.
Correlation is not proof of causation.
Processed acorns are much more healthful than unprocessed acorns.
Heehee! Unless you're a squirrel 😊
The tribal beliefs and camps or sets of beliefs become part of people's pride.
This is similar to identity, but it's also a somewhat different perspective.
Ideas become idolized. Who wants their precious idols attacked or disrespected?
Oh dear, I think his covid vaccine analogy is pretty shaky ground haha
He undermined his credibility in one swell foop!
That preponderance is preposterous. I don't know what it means let alone even say it lol - If we want to know how we need to simplify the final P. Just me?
In science, research questions are formulated based on some problems in the literature. Either there is no evidence, mixed evidence, unclarity or the study aims to replicate previous findings.
Now to answer you question: "Preponderance" means what the bulk of evidence suggests, or in which direction it points to. It is essentially the "balance of evidence".
Mechanisms aren't evidence.
Mechanisms are explanations.
I think Shakespeare said that
@@TheProofWithSimonHill Yes, Mechanisms aren't complete, high level explanations. They tend to explain only small steps in the whole process. You can't use 1 mechanism and explain the whole process. The full explanation is a collection of mechanisms. And for sure some mechanisms may seem relevant on their own, but in the whole process they may not be important.
But I'd still be careful to say mechanisms are of low importance.
I'm an engineer. Try fixing a broken TV without any knowledge about the mechanisms of electronic components. You can't do it.
Try doing surgery without any anatomical knowledge. You can't do it.
Try explaining CVD without any knowledge about mechanisms. You can't do it.
The simple statement that high LDL-C or high ApoB causes CVD,.. already uses a mechanism. But is this mechanism talked about?..... Not really. It's simply assumed that there is a causal relationship. What is the mechanism that causes these particles to end up in the artery wall?
And one question that never gets answered: Why is a vasa vasorum required? Why is there no atherosclerosis without the presence of a vasa vasorum?
Can you do an interview with someone who has this kind of mechanistic knowledge?
@@tazot4064 sim. Romeu disse isso para Julieta.
Someone explain why all the long term vegans I've met are sick as they get older. They have low energy and have all types of chronic diseases.
I'd be interested to know how a non-vegan happens to meet many long-term vegans... vegans are only 1 to 3 % of the population. A vegan myself, i dont know more than 10 vegans, let alone "long-term vegans. "... and while most long-term studies show that people eating the most plants have better outcomes, all the vegans you meet are not healthy? Something is not making sense here... 🤔
I was going to ask the same of Keto/Carnivore eaters. All the Vegans I know are thriving and living longer with clear minds as they age.
The answer is in your question "Long term vegans" !
I started out vegetarian at 12 and have been vegan for 20 years (65 y/o now). In terms of energy and mental clarity and health, I’m doing just fine. This is confirmed by my lab work. I have no illnesses and need no meds except for the usual vegan supplements. But I believe different people may need different diets, though no one needs SAD. Ha