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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ต.ค. 2024
- What happens when you activate the red emergency alarm on a train? The passcom alarm as it is known in railway speak. in this video we look at what happens when a passenger activates the red passenger alarm on board a train in the uk, and what the drivers actions are in this event and the railway rules.
We also take a look at the Green Emergency Door Release Handel. or Egress as it is known in railway speak. What really happens when you pull the emergency door handle on a train?
Following the terrible incident at parsons green station, we look at how as railway enthusiasts we have a special duty of care to the public to remain vigilant and assist with railway security. We look at the British Transport Police See it say it sorted campaign - remember that number 61016
/ dadrail
/ dadrail
One thing to remember that you should almost never need to use the emergency door release. Except in the case of a fire or severe derailment, you are safer in the train carriage because of the possibility of trains on the other tracks, and high voltage either from the third rail or downed overhead wires.
Unless directed by crew. Happened to me. We stopped in an area the crew felt safe releasing us but they couldn’t open the doors from the outside. So people should know it’s there but it’s very rare that it’s needed.
❤
If the train is on fire, triggering the door release would be the worst decision.
Stations are equipped with far much more firefighting gear like extinguishers, hydrants, firefighting suit, smoke extraction system etc. than some random place on the tracks. Evacuation would also be easier and more efficient, as you won't need to walk for a long distance alongside tracks, sometimes having to avoid the deadly electrified 3rd rail.
Also if it's a subway train, situation would definitely get extremely tough as all the smokes and fumes coming from unextinguishable flames would be extremely likely to poison or suffocate everyone if the train stops inside a tunnel instead of a station.
Unless your on a runaway sleeper
Glad I found this channel. Coming from a fellow locomotive engineer (train driver) in the states!
Hi diesel ducy i have seen lots of your vids and subscribed
I think, if people are mistaking it for the flush button, then that's probably a sign it needs to _look_ more distinct. The glass thing is only gonna make more actual emergencies go unreported.
Agree with you completely
Definitely blame bad design rather than the people if we don't know immediately what buttons do on trains.
Toilets really do suck with their buttons, locks, flush buttons, and such...
Unrelated, I know, but something similar happened at a Walmart once. The valve handle in the garden center for the fire sprinkler system was the same color as the one for the water spigot, and as such someone set off the fire alarms (and likely got soaked, too) just because of two handles that looked the same. That whole situation could’ve been avoided if the spigot handle was made black or green or something instead of red.
On the ex-LM class 170s' there is a small sticker pointing out the red button is not the flush button. It does make you wonder how many incidents people have pressed it by mistake thinking it was a flush button before they put the sticker on it.
Even then, the button still gets pressed by people thinking its a flush button, especially on the crewe line that majority of these 170's work. For a modern-ish train (1999-2004) I'm surprised the emregency button in the toilets of the 170s (or at least the LM ones) do actually bring the train to a halt.
That said I accidentally pressed the emergency button in a disabled toilet on a 222. Well when I say accidentally pressed i meant the train jolted and I basically jolted as well and literally tapped it with my elbow. Having to do the walk of shame when I had to tell the guard what I did, though they reassured me it wasnt an issue as it happens all the time. Which makes me wonder if there should be some cover to prevent accidentally usage?
We have a similar saying here in the NY/NJ area, it’s “If you see something, say something.” But I like to shorten it to “See it? Say it!”
I had a little fantasy I was on London Underground, and I saw unattended luggage making a weird sound from inside. I investigated, and it was clearly ticking. I yelled for everyone to get away and that I thought it was a bomb, I pulled the alarm and told the driver there was a suitcase that sounded like it had a time bomb inside. We did an emergency stop at the next station, which was nearby, and the bomb squad got called in to haul it away. Turns out someone had pushed it in earlier without boarding and it was going to explode thirty minutes from when they retrieved it. It was disarmed and everyone was safe. I tend to have these fantasies of saving the day, even outside my Florida home. I HAVE been on a tube before. We call them subways in the United States. I've been to New York, and trust me, it's busy on their subways. But still a fun trip!
See it,
Say it,
Sorted.
See something, say something. We're uber-creative here in Yankeeland
I can do the British announcement from memory
"If you see something that doesn't look right then please speak to a member or British Police on 6 1 0 1 6 see it say it sorted...
Lol you can tell i spent too much time at British train stations
See it.
Say it.
Ignored it.
One of your old videos popped back into my feed yesterday. In it, you were chuffed to bits that you had acquired 400 subscribers. Look at you now!
Oh wow!
if a situation called for it, i would. not only for my safety but the safety of everyone aboard. if it saves lives who cares about a delay. im not fussed about a delay if it saves my life or the life of someone else.
I Agree with you completely.
Slightly unrelated but I was on a 165 and the driver stopped, beckoned me to come out of the train with him to witness him removing a signal cable that had been pulled onto the track by vandals.
Only came across your videos recently and I love them. Really great job. One thing I did notice though was your "decleration". The correct spelling is "declaration". But seriously when that is my only criticism, Your videos are great. Thank you.
Love your videos Graham
Regarding the telephones, I have seen quite recently drivers getting out to telephone the signalman when stopped at a red signal. Usually happens round here on local trains where the lines are non-electrified. Seems to me that the driver waits a set period of time, and if the signal hasn't cleared by then, he/she will use the telephone.
Found your channel by accident. Loved the video and subscribed. Thank you
About your wee dig regarding DOO, the West Wickham incident wouldn't necessarily have been prevented if a guard had been present. If he closed the doors from a carriage ahead of the girl who was trapped, he'd have been none the wiser. In fact the trainee driver 'should' have been able to see the girl hanging out the door on the monitor.
I have just put it in my phone See it Say it Sorted
Another fantastic video
I think the Yellow Sign means temporary speed restriction coming up the top speed is for passenger trains and the bottom one for freight trains but might be wrong as on my local I have not seen any
im an american watching this and traveling in the uk should i use that police number or just- wait do they use 911 or 999 in the uk?
Whilst I'm studying at uni, I have the pleasure of living fairly close to a main station. Also, being in Wales, or means that the 61016 message is said in both English and Welsh, so I am going to challenge you (if you'd like to) to try and pronounce the Welsh version of the warning. Here's the Welsh message:
"Os welch rhywbeth nad yw'n harodeudeg, siaradwch â staff, neu anfonwch neges destun i'r Heddlu Trafnidiaeth Prydeinig ar 61016. Bydden ni'n ei sortio. Wedi sylwi. Wedi sôn. Wedi setlo"
😉
With a surname like Evans i might just be able to do that :-)....... Challenge accepted ill have a go in my next VLOG
Thank you for sharing this! I am hoping to be a train driver in the future and I am preparing to hear these alarms and say these announcements all of the time.
#seeitsayitsorted
See it, say it, sorted.
Great video again Richard. I wouldn't hesitate to use the emergency alarm if I needed to use it. ☺
I actually always thought it was see it, say It, sort it.
It does sound like that, and at first thats what i thought. It was only when I saw it written down I noticed it was sorted. and not sort it. - Not one of the clearest advertising campaigns in my opinion.
It used to be, then they realised it would probably convince people to try and sort the problem themselves, so they changed it after about a week.
same
Sort is a weird word
Same
It would be useful if TOCs could publish a notice to say what situations require operating the pascom instead of leaving it to judgement. The main and only reason I can see is fire on board but there may be other reasons but I would only operate it in a fire.
It’s a hard one to call as they don’t want to discourage people from using it. But like you say what constitutes an emergency?
I would also use it if a passenger needed medical attention or police intervention was needed (e.g. a fight between passengers).
"If you see it... grass on it!"
"Remember the 3 S's See It Say It sorted
A great video very interesting. Hope to see you at another model show in the South East soon. the TSR Board show is top for Units and bottom for Loco Hauled/Light engine trains. This I believe marks the start of the TSR zone. In terms of activating the pass com, I would expect Thameslink to be replacing a fair number of those glass covers, especially around the disabled area as I have had to activate too many times when disabled assistance is not provided.
Good grief, boring ...
When I was on an East Midlands Trains service to Skeggness, someone accidentally thought it was a flush button, and the train was a Class 153 and the brakes applied immediately on Emergency Brake Setting
It happens a lot to be fair. 153s are fairly old now so yeah id imagine that they would be fitted with the older system that applies the brakes straight away.
Here in North America, the brake pipe is still connected directly to the emergency brake cords in coaches. When I worked passenger, a few pulled it as a prank. It usually happed after a sporting event, when the passengers had built up a good drunk.
I am a USA viewer so I can’t use that number but I can use local police numbers in my area for the trains, also nice video.
Hi it’s Gary one of the things that put me off using the emergency alarm which I did have an instance to do many years ago when an old lady fell over and also when there was a lot of trouble on the train from youths in that instance I didn’t push it because I was told if I did without good reason I could be fined and I think that’s what puts a lot of people off using the emergency alarms and especially now when they’ve got glass over them because it makes it almost look intimidating. So my question to you is what is deemed as a good enough reason to use the emergency alarm without being fined. I hope you can see my point of view on this as it is very confusing especially as there is notices up in a lot of trains about miss use of it.
3 years later. Saved the number :)
See
Say
Sort
;)
For us;
Passenger Emergency Intercom (PEI); That's the Rail Traffic Guard's job 😅
Passenger Emergency (PE) handle pulled with 'Door Open' tile illuminated?
1) Brake Controller into Emergency.
2) "Emergency Radio Call" to Control and all trains in the area.
3) Request a Track Block for all adjacent tracks.
Paul tyre man did something similar
I am from Serbia, so I didn't copy that number. We don't even have tube stations. We have trams and tram-busses although.
NYC subway, NYPD and other law enforcement agencies performed a pair of active shooter exercises on the subway system. Not sure how they pulled it off without causing alarm and no lessons were published on what they learned. I gather the various London Underground and London Police have similar exercises. Let's prey they never have to deal with a future active mass shooter or active mass stabbing. At least some police and transit systems are trying to address such a scenario.
Some idiots at a train station pulled the emergency door release to stop their late friend from missing the train. And why don’t you do a video of why you should not hold the doors
Thats not good, Delays the train whilst the driver or guard resets the door handle. Not sure I can make a whole video on why you shouldn't hold the doors open, but I'm going to be looking at the 30 seconds before departure rule, so can talk about it in that video.
I work at a station and something you hear a LOT is "You go ahead and hold the train, while I get the tickets.." Does me head in!
I have used the emergency alarm/brake chain around the late 90s. It worked.
I've only had to use the Pascom once. It was many years ago on a 158, when I found a man passed out in the vestibule. It would not be possible to find staff quickly on a 8 coach train, so I went into the toilet and pulled the alarm to stop the train
This is why we need a guard on the train
NO this is Patrick Teue
Do not let them D.O.O.
See it.
Say it.
Sorted.
In my country, the emergency passcom just tells the nearest station to bring help, meaning that some combat medics may get in your car. It helps a lot if someone feels sick. They actually encourage the use of it...
Is the new sign on higher priority (1-4) on the top and lower priority (5-9) on the bottom. But the sign itself means that there is a new temporary speed limit
Get the point about 700s. Personally as a passenger I prefer to have the alarm covered so I can’t accidentally activate it. Best implementation I’ve seen is on the tube where they have them covered by a flap that has to be actively lifted before pulling the handle
If it's a lever rather than a button, there's no need to cover it.
It's obvious, to most people (I assume), that anything that isn't just a button on a train, is something important and irregular... and also isn't located in a usual waist level place that would be normal, but is higher and obviously not intended for regular use...
4:48
There should be a cancel button next to the handle which people could press within 10 seconds before it went through just in case it is an accidental operation, like, as you said, someone in the toilet thinking it's the flush.
The Emergency Button should be mounted on the OPPOSITE wall to the toilet seat area, to avoid confusion. It is Bad design Error to mount emergency alarm too close to the flush button. People do make Design Blunders like this!!
@@kaichung2743 So that people sat on the toilet, or stumbling from it, can't reach it for help?
You don't want a cancel button, in case a nefarious person cancels your emergency call, when you're under duress.
#seeitsayitsorted
Thanks for these interesting videos, my comedy answer is that it is left over from '12 saying "Beware Olympics in two years" ? hope that Brightons somebody's day.
What about wheelchair users when station assitance doesn't show up? Can the pass com / handles be used?
I would say yes for sure.
See it, say it, sorted.
So I just text this number if I have an issue on Railway Premises?
I drove trains for Chiltern Railways between 1996 and 1999 after which I explored roles in the Operational Management structure as I found driving too boring.
Class 165 Network er Turbos and the Class 168/0 Clubman DMU's used on Chiltern at that time had a much noisier Pass Comm alarm that was excessively loud. Also, if the Egress handle was pulled, interlock was lost and Emergency braking step 4 was immediatly applied by the train AND more alarmingly, the doors where the egress was operated opened about an inch immediatly.
Saw it; said it; saved it.
4:17 is that what the "passenger stop override" button in the cab is for? (I'm not a train driver)
Yep
I wish we got a nice beep like that for the pass comm. We get a really loud buzz one until its over-ridden or reset (amplified twice as loud as standard buzzer). Certainly wakes me and the driver up lol. Driver can't speak due to the noise so the SC has to respond by going to the location looking at the hazard lights to see which carriage it is. Didn't know about the Emergency GSMR as soon as the egress is pulled though, so I've just learnt something too
Funnily enough here in France it's actually not ok to pull the alarm signal only to report a unattended bag or something else in quotes minor to the staff.
You're actually supposed to report the emergency to the nearest member of staff or if there is no one present to dial 3117 on your mobile phone or to send a text message to the 31177.
Some examples of situations where it is acceptable to pull the alarm are even mentioned by the SNCF company on their website, and of course it's if someone gets stuck between the doors and the train starts to move, or also if a window were to break, or if there is a fire.
It's basically when the motion of the train itself is a danger or the integrity of the train is compromised.
On the technical side though it's pretty much the same as you described on modern trains, a two-way intercom to talk to the driver and no immediate brake application.
There are also CCTV cameras all over the train and those located near the alarm handles will actually activate when it's pulled so the driver can immediately see the person's face.
For the emergency door release handles there are trains that don't even have them, you have to pull the alarm and then press a button and oddly enough it's actually the driver that will decide if the doors should be opened or not. (And pressing the fully exposed red button without pulling the alarm first does absolutely nothing for anyone wondering).
To me it kind of defeats the purpose of it being a emergency door release, I mean the driver could also open the doors like he normally does every time the trains stops at a station, see ?
Other modern trains come with door release handles that are separate from the alarm handles, however they still don't open the doors if the driver doesn't basically approve it.
I wonder what would happen if the driver were to be taken out in a severe crash for example.
How would the passengers be able to open the doors then ?
Now to the mistake between the alarm and flush button, there is a emergency phone or I should say intercom in the disabled toilet, however no actual red alarm handle.
But according to train drivers themselves on a forum, when someone presses the call button in the disabled toilet it sounds exactly the same in the cab as if it was a alarm handle that was pulled, therefore it can be quite distracting for them according to what I read, even though it's really only a intercom this time with no emergency brake application whatsoever unlike when it's the red handle that has been pulled.
Because of this inconvenience for the drivers they added "Emergency use only, misuse will be punished" stickers later on next to all the disabled toilets intercoms.
And also since many decades now the alarm handles all come with "Only pull in case of danger, misuse will be punished" signs next to them.
I dread to think what would happen if there was a fault that prevented them from opening the doors normally
(I have actually come across a video of it happening in the UK, the doors re-locked almost immediately, so it was pretty much impossible for anyone to get on or off)
They had to evacuate the train through the drivers cab, using the crew access door (the train did have mechanical emergency door release handles (the instructions say to partly pull the handle to release the air pressure, then pull it all the way down until the handle locks in place to unlock the right hand door, then slide the door open by hand), but im guessing that since the train would need to be taken back to the depot as soon as the passengers were off, they didn’t want the emergency releases being activated)
I have just finished watching your video from 2017 on emergency buttons/levers/phones.
You began and ended with a puzzle you set about the meaning of a sign on a signal post.
After listening to your "explanation" I still have no idea what you are talking about.
I saw a picture, and in the middle there was a horizontal diamond, and below that an oblong sign with traces of printed text almost painted over. Which were you talking about or is it about the combination?
Being a volunteer on a heritage railway (a Guard for that matter) I would suggest thinking twice and acting once. But if it was required I would.
See it. Say it. Sorted. I seldom use the trains but you never know if and when that number might come in useful!
It means the train can go both ways.
If I needed to pull alarm, I would, if I needed too, especially too save someone
Exactly! In an emergency, that's what it is there for. Whether it's behind a glass panel or not. "Break glass in emergency" means exactly what it says.
@@DeKat-84 wow i forgot about this comment, jeez it's been two years already. But yes, it's there to save someone or for an emergency
Just a guess if that's a TSR warning board (which is usually rectangle-shaped and the higher speed is usually at the bottom)
Warning: You are approaching a temporary speed restriction.
If it says 10/20 then the speed will be 20mph for passenger/ECS/parcels/postal trains and light locos, and 10mph for all other trains.
You are thinking along the right lines, And yes the speeds are the wrong way round, the higher speed should be at the bottom. It is a TSR warning board but the shape of the board is significant.
Dad Rail I know this is an old video, but looking through the comments you said people were close who said about faster units having the higher TSR. Is this sign (a TSR) close to a set of points going from a main to a fast (or vice-versa)?
Not quite it is a warning for a TSR, but the diamond shape indicates the speed is in KPH rather then MPH. In general The higher speed applies to passenger services and the lower to freight trains. Ive only ever seen these near Ashford International where services leave HS1 and join the mainline network to call at the station. HS1 is sing posted in KPH so therefore the train speedos are in KPH. SE Javelin trains automatically change from KPH to MPH after calling / leaving ashford but the eurostars do not hence the need for the speed in KPH
Love your videos Richard, but it bugs me every time I see your "Decleration". Please can you correct the spelling of that -
- should be "Declaration".
Thanks for pointing that out. I have changed my After Effects file so should be correctly spelt in the future !
I think the sign means warning of Temporary speed restriction (fright 10mi/h pasenger trains 20 mi/h)
Does the btp number apply for northern Ireland
Tell you what usually DOESN'T happen............. the bog has not been flushed ! 'Someone's flushed the passcom' !
See it,
Say it,
Sorted
Right....Firstly,
See it,
Say it,
Sorted.
Secondly,
On the NIR PASCONS, along with the driver cab alarm being sounded, there is a visual & audible annocement that plays over the trains PIS when a PASCON button is pressed, along the lines of "Call for aid device activated in Car 2, toilet bay" or if a at door "....Car 1, Door xx". Just thought you may find that interesting.... Also, the ones on NIR are not glass covered, infact, NIR recently removed window hammers on their trains.
Lastly, does the sign mean that there is a TSR in place with passenger trains allowed to go 20mph & other trains at 10mph?
To answer your last question, isnt it an advanced speed limit warning from 20mph to 10mph if diverging?
your thinking along the right lines but not correct I'm afraid
See it
Say it
Sorted...
Wait I say the announcement at a few stations
The yellow sign is a TSR (Temporary Speed Restriction) the top number is the speed for passenger trains and the bottom number is for freight trains
other way around (usually) its the same as a differential speed board. top one for frieght and heavy stock and the bottom for passenger service.
I don’t live in the UK but I know our emergency and non emergency lines for the services we use in the USA Seattle area. And I’ve called those numbers including to report a father and son playing on the railroad tracks, a mainline that sees trains going 60+ MPH. NOT HAPPY when I saw that but that’s something to be reported for sure.
I’ve also had to pull the emergency door release by direction of staff. Mechanical failure and they couldn’t open the doors for some reason. It’s good to know the emergency systems work in that case.
See it, Say it, Sorted
Advanced warning board for a differential temporary speed restriction
The sign means: a high speed train can go the speed at the top and slower trains go at the speed at the bottom
Good Answer, you are thinking right but not correct.
Another brilliant video Richard
I used to know it as "Rule 55, Detention of trains on running lines" All changed now. The yellow sign is an advanced warning of a TSR Duel speed, the top sign is for certain goods trains, the higher speed is for passenger trains. The warning would be placed at a safe braking distance to the start of the TSR, the driver would also get an AWS/TPWS warning, which needs to be acknowledged.
You are correct, in all but 1 detail. The diamond shape of the board indicates that the speed in shown in KPH not MPH.
@@DadRail Thanks for that correction. Much appreciated.
See It.Say it.Sorted
See it.
Say it.
Sorted
Would the door release still work if the electricity suppy failed and the train was stalled between two stations?
Yes it would, it's mechanical.
i don't travel by train often so i think i might be too scared to/ unsure about using it as they are often next to a sign saying "£ fine for improper use"
i would be too unsure because say for example, i were to genuinely believe it to be justified, what if the railway company disagreed and fined me?
Cool vlogs
Thank you :-)
On the class 180 it's above 3 miles an hour when the brakes will apply for an egress handle
Thanks thats good to know, can that be overridden for a period of time do you know?
@@DadRail break application's can be overridden by the driver unless departing from a station. However the class 180 is only operated by Hull Trains (when their not on fire) and grand Central
@@jameswhite8612 When their not on fire :-)
This reminds me of you'll be going nowhere meme
I uhh... don't live in the UK. But! See it, Say it, Sorted
then why you hear BRUV
See it, say it, sort it sir
Why does a train stop at the next stop if there is a emergency at the first stop or another stop
How long does a train take to stop under emergency braking conditions?
Train size, length, speed, mass, brakes, etc...
There are so many variables. Maybe watch some videos of emergency stops, or read some search results about emergency stopping...
That's the speed limit sign at the end:)
a temporary speed restriction warning board (TSR) I think the 10mph would be for freight and 20 for multiple units?
thats probably the closest answer yet, but not quite what i am looking for
See it, Say it, Sorted
how hard would being an express driver be
See it, say it, sorted!
20 MPH for Passenger and 10 for Freight or certain loco hauled stock.
8:40 I wouldn't say that they try but nevertheless I agree with you. It is the effect that it has!
Is the sign at the end of this video some kind of distance marker?
See it say it, sorted.
See it, say it etc, done😊
See it, say it, sort it
Ive already got 61016 in my contacts :-)
Good man !
Great Video By the way! I know one of your colleagues by the way, he says he knows you :-)
another driver?
Indeed :-)
See it say it sorted.
Cabride vids on WCML suggest this to be a temporary speed restriction?
See it, Say it, Sorted.
See it
Say it
Sorted
temperary speed restriction 20 mph for pasenger 10 mph for freight
See say it sorted
If you see something that doesn’t look right speak to staff or text British transport police on 61016 we’ll sort it...
SEE IT,
SAY IT,
SORTED
See it, say it, sod it.