A Chinese here. June Mu is obviously at native level to me. Some comments mentioning him growing up in China then makes sense. Julien's Chinese might be the BEST that one not grown up in China can reach by learning. Really interesting video.
@@furiousredeem1207 Prolly should have excluded all non-CSL speakers... this video idea seems a lil half-baked... are you guys sponsored by the Falun gong by any chance?
Honestly that guy Julien from XiaoMa’s video was one of, if not the most, impressive speaking/vocabulary/accent I’ve ever heard I believe when I first saw it many years ago. I wonder where you’d guys rank Steve Kaufman, accomplished I bet. I used to sometimes learn by listening to his Chinese speaking only videos because I just liked his accent haha. Great episode guys, love these! RIP Laoshu 老鼠😢
Lol his chinese is fluent for sure, I think he just has a bad habit for poor pronunciation, and some of it might also be that he is mumbling + improper pronunciation is his why he isn't godtier. The fact that he is mumbling shows that he has spoken a lot and is very confortable with it. Old habits die hard.
Exactly. He speaks good Chinese, but he hasn’t improved and if anything has gotten WORSE at speaking Chinese over time. His accent is horrible. But he understands very well and he is raising his kids to speak Mandarin as well. Imo, he needs to live in Beijing once again and do one or two months of intensive study.
Very interesting topic. Regarding June Mu's Chinese, I want to say that if I don't look at his face but only listen to his voice, I will definitely conclude that he is Chinese. His accent is exactly like that of young people from some northern provinces in China, even the tone and word choice during the conversation are very authentic.
小马 inspired me to learn chinese, he was one of the creators I watched in the very beginning of my journey. I used to dream of being able to walk up to chinese people and surprise them like he does. Now that I got to a certain level, I realised that his accent is very american and I don’t like the sound of it. Still, nothing but respect for 小马 for being one of the first inspiring figures in my chinese learning journey
XiaoMa only speaks about a handful of topics in any language: Food, how he learnt the language, a few basic "I like or don't like"(which is usually food anyway). He's still incredible at learning languages, just not as fluent as people seem to think
In most languages yes. Chinese is the only exception. I lived in China for 15 years. My wife is Chinese and a large portion of my friends are too. They all say that he has a clear American accent, but if he lost the accent you would not be able to tell him apart from a native Chinese speaker
@@test-547 His problem is not just the accent. When he mumbles, it's often because he said the first half of a sentence with English syntax and now can't find a good way to complete the sentence in proper Chinese grammar.
*Not all Chinese people speak Mandarin perfectly. A large proportion of Chinese peoples' Mandarin is coloured by their regional or provincial dialect or accent. Oriental Pearl: Getting good. - Can't tell very much from the short clips. - Needs work on pronunciation and tones. - At 11:55, the grandfather approaches Oriental Pearl and introduces her to his grandaughter. He says "小孫女" (little grandaughter or youngest grandaughter), which Oriental Pearl mishears as "小朋友" (little friend). The thing is, no Chinese grandfather would really ever call his grandaughter "小朋友" (little friend), and I'd think an accomplished speaker would be aware of something like that. Xiaoma: Accomplished. - Speaks rather fluently, but pronunciation, tones, and grammar need a bit of work. - Definitely not god-tier. Julian: Probably god-tier. - Zero complaints from what I can see in the clips. - However, god-tier should require a demonstration of a high-level of grammar, vocab, and expression, not just pronunciation. We don't see that here in these very short clips. But If I had to bet, I'd say his other qualities are just as good as his pronunciation. Laoshu: Needs work or Getting good. - Firstly, RIP. - In those clips, he demonstrated good potential, but needed work in terms of pronunciation and grammar, for example. Laoma; Most likely god-tier - Based on the ad-read--even though it's scripted--it's really good. LeleFarley: God-tier - The Taiwanese accent was him puttin on an accent. His default is the Beijing accent. - His pronunciation is pretty much perfect (like 99.5%). - I've seen him talk in livestreams and it's very evident that he can express himself at a very high level in Mandarin on various depp topics for hours on end. The only true way to know their level is to find out their HSK or TOCFL test results, and have a native Mandarin teacher interview them and judge their performance.
You guys should check out that young Finnish chap, Hepsima. He is not yet at god tier but he's surely at rizzmaster tier!! His rizzing is phenomenal !!
There’s a video of Xiaoma and I’m pretty sure it was with June Mu shopping. June Mu is a native Chinese speaker but Chinese people in New York were surprised by a black guy speaking Chinese like a native.
小马 is not that good. He love to show off his Chinese, but actually quite basic. Just like Oriental Pearl. June Mu's Chinese is on point. Just play his voice without seeing him, you would say he is Chinese.
I think Pearl's Chinese was even more basic than 小馬's, I'm surprised she ended up in acomplished even though she only said a couple basic sentences in the clip showed.
I lived in China for 15 years. I wouldn't say I was friends with Oriental Pearl. But we lived in the same city, had the same friend circle, went to the same bars and events. I've spent quite a bit of time around her. Her Chinese is really good. Her vocab is crazy
I've met Oriental Pearl at a night market in Taiwan, and we hung out the entire day spaking only Chinese. Her Chinese is actually crazy crazy good. She can definitely pull out all the crazy 成语 and she used very advanced vocab. Imo definitely more fluent than 小马
@@camerong9391 100% . The people commenting that her Chinese is bad probably don't even speak Chinese. She's lazy with her pronounciation and slips back into the English accent. But in formal situations she can fix her accent immediately. The thing I found most impressive was her vocab. It's way more advanced than the average foreigner who's learned Chinese
One thing I learned from this video as a Chinese: those people that I regarded as speaking about the same level of English as I do, probably speaks better English. Lol. The guy who learned Chinese at 19 years old and recited continental names, is phenomenal, he is at the same level as Dashan.
Does the fact ‘accomplished’ is formatted like that drive anyone else crazy? For the love of God you put this much effort in your videos to have it look like that 😂?!
If you have another tier list…try TH-camr: Andy’s (but it’s written in Mandarin). He is born and raised in Taiwan. German descent. Not to be confused with “Andy in Taiwan”
Oriental Pearl is the only one on this list with a masters degree from China. For overall language ability including reading and writing, she’s the best in the group.
I liked the reaction video. I’m into studying foreign languages as a hobby and it confirms my view that everyone judges your language level on your pronunciation more than anything else. Which is frustrating if you don’t like to study pronunciation per se 😂. I hate it. It’s so boring.
IMO god tier should be that they sound eloquent even for a native Chinese person. Like if a foreigner sounds like a well spoken native speaker. People achieve this level in other foreign languages!
Ben, you were teaching me Chinese with your TH-cam videos 13 years ago. I still remember you’d sit on your couch and explain a grammar point. Two videos that I still remember - how English speakers use need/want a lot and how to use it in Mandarin, and the 自相矛盾 video. So cool to see you’re still here! Also I have to say how incredible it was to see Jared go from being an American guy to a Chinese guy in an instant. When you learn a language well you really do get a new personality! All of my Chinese was learned in Canada and I only started in my mid 20’s, so I’m extremely envious of those like Jared who have been in China since they were young. But I also feel that those of us that learned to speak good Chinese completely outside of China are even more impressive 😜
for a native Chinese like me, their accent is not important at all. Chinese language is like .zip or .rar, a God Tier need to understand Chinese culture. if you want to talk to a decent educated Chinese in Chinese language, you need to understand some idoms and classic Chinese, like you talk in English quoting classic movie or bible, but 10x more.
18:20 "For most people grown up speaking english..." AMERICAN English. This is an American English problem. It's no surprise Ben didn't know where to stick his tongue to imitate xiaomanyc. This is even more obvious to people who are neither American nor native anglophone.
I'd love to see Xiaoma in your video. He's an incredible linguist who has studied about 50 languages and has so much fascinating insight to share. Plus, he's hilarious.
FulinFang supposed to be Accomplished, better than Julian. I dont agree with your guy's some ratings methodologies on those youtubers, probably bring a Chinese native speaker with you guys, there definitely a few misconceptions you guys have. So called 老外对中文的打分还是差点意思.
Bruh, as a language teacher I don't think it is appropriate to judge people's level based on a few video clips and their accents only... Language proficiency involves so many other skills, LIKE READING COMPREHENSION, can any of those people read a novel with ease?? Can they maintain a conversation about complex topics?? Not really, most of those people haven't got a C1 level yet. Still, I agree with where you placed them for the most part. But yea, I agree that XiaoMa's accent sucks.
A Chinese here. June Mu is obviously at native level to me. Some comments mentioning him growing up in China then makes sense.
Julien's Chinese might be the BEST that one not grown up in China can reach by learning.
Really interesting video.
June mu is a native speaker his mom is chinese and he grew up there.
does he still count then?
@@ClCl-n1h in my opinion no
@@furiousredeem1207 Prolly should have excluded all non-CSL speakers... this video idea seems a lil half-baked... are you guys sponsored by the Falun gong by any chance?
Honestly that guy Julien from XiaoMa’s video was one of, if not the most, impressive speaking/vocabulary/accent I’ve ever heard I believe when I first saw it many years ago.
I wonder where you’d guys rank Steve Kaufman, accomplished I bet. I used to sometimes learn by listening to his Chinese speaking only videos because I just liked his accent haha.
Great episode guys, love these!
RIP Laoshu 老鼠😢
Maturing and getting better at Mandarin allows you to respect 小马 as he has somehow managed to squeeze a career out of HSK4 Chinese
I would say he's fluent but definitely not as perfect as his fans say. Definitely needs work on his accent
@@rairaidj1 if he’s fluent then I am too (I am not fluent)
Lol his chinese is fluent for sure, I think he just has a bad habit for poor pronunciation, and some of it might also be that he is mumbling + improper pronunciation is his why he isn't godtier. The fact that he is mumbling shows that he has spoken a lot and is very confortable with it. Old habits die hard.
Exactly. He speaks good Chinese, but he hasn’t improved and if anything has gotten WORSE at speaking Chinese over time. His accent is horrible. But he understands very well and he is raising his kids to speak Mandarin as well. Imo, he needs to live in Beijing once again and do one or two months of intensive study.
@@A-ID-A-M Yeah I think he got to a good level, and then just kinda stopped trying so much, and maybe regressed a bit.
Very interesting topic.
Regarding June Mu's Chinese, I want to say that if I don't look at his face but only listen to his voice, I will definitely conclude that he is Chinese.
His accent is exactly like that of young people from some northern provinces in China, even the tone and word choice during the conversation are very authentic.
小马 inspired me to learn chinese, he was one of the creators I watched in the very beginning of my journey. I used to dream of being able to walk up to chinese people and surprise them like he does. Now that I got to a certain level, I realised that his accent is very american and I don’t like the sound of it. Still, nothing but respect for 小马 for being one of the first inspiring figures in my chinese learning journey
I always thought his accent was very obvious, but it’s interesting to hear that it’s not to everyone.
You should seperate those who grew up in China vs those who learned as an adult.
The first clip of LeLe was when he was imitating the Taiwanese content creators, so he was doing a "Taiwanese" accent
Rip Lao Shu
﷽
I really admire the combo of you two, please make some more descriptive content about Mandarin learning for beginners.
XiaoMa only speaks about a handful of topics in any language: Food, how he learnt the language, a few basic "I like or don't like"(which is usually food anyway). He's still incredible at learning languages, just not as fluent as people seem to think
In most languages yes. Chinese is the only exception. I lived in China for 15 years. My wife is Chinese and a large portion of my friends are too. They all say that he has a clear American accent, but if he lost the accent you would not be able to tell him apart from a native Chinese speaker
@@test-547 His problem is not just the accent. When he mumbles, it's often because he said the first half of a sentence with English syntax and now can't find a good way to complete the sentence in proper Chinese grammar.
What are you a hater? If he’s not fluent then only native speakers are fluent in a language.
@@paulwalther5237 There are a lot of non-native speakers more fluent than him, as seen in this video.
*Not all Chinese people speak Mandarin perfectly. A large proportion of Chinese peoples' Mandarin is coloured by their regional or provincial dialect or accent.
Oriental Pearl: Getting good.
- Can't tell very much from the short clips.
- Needs work on pronunciation and tones.
- At 11:55, the grandfather approaches Oriental Pearl and introduces her to his grandaughter. He says "小孫女" (little grandaughter or youngest grandaughter), which Oriental Pearl mishears as "小朋友" (little friend). The thing is, no Chinese grandfather would really ever call his grandaughter "小朋友" (little friend), and I'd think an accomplished speaker would be aware of something like that.
Xiaoma: Accomplished.
- Speaks rather fluently, but pronunciation, tones, and grammar need a bit of work.
- Definitely not god-tier.
Julian: Probably god-tier.
- Zero complaints from what I can see in the clips.
- However, god-tier should require a demonstration of a high-level of grammar, vocab, and expression, not just pronunciation. We don't see that here in these very short clips. But If I had to bet, I'd say his other qualities are just as good as his pronunciation.
Laoshu: Needs work or Getting good.
- Firstly, RIP.
- In those clips, he demonstrated good potential, but needed work in terms of pronunciation and grammar, for example.
Laoma; Most likely god-tier
- Based on the ad-read--even though it's scripted--it's really good.
LeleFarley: God-tier
- The Taiwanese accent was him puttin on an accent. His default is the Beijing accent.
- His pronunciation is pretty much perfect (like 99.5%).
- I've seen him talk in livestreams and it's very evident that he can express himself at a very high level in Mandarin on various depp topics for hours on end.
The only true way to know their level is to find out their HSK or TOCFL test results, and have a native Mandarin teacher interview them and judge their performance.
That Cantonese sound was really good. Felt like watching 80’s kungfu movie 😂
You guys should check out that young Finnish chap, Hepsima. He is not yet at god tier but he's surely at rizzmaster tier!! His rizzing is phenomenal !!
There’s a video of Xiaoma and I’m pretty sure it was with June Mu shopping. June Mu is a native Chinese speaker but Chinese people in New York were surprised by a black guy speaking Chinese like a native.
Would be cool if you did part 2 with Frankie Light, British Jack, Ryan Hale, Hepsima
You need to move June Mu to God tier!!! He’s basically native Chinese! 😂😂😂
He IS a native speaker.
大山 from Canada is definitely on God Tier
Not really a TH-camr though
@@learnchinesenowDashan is now a TH-camr as well. His channel is @Dashan
小马 is not that good. He love to show off his Chinese, but actually quite basic. Just like Oriental Pearl. June Mu's Chinese is on point. Just play his voice without seeing him, you would say he is Chinese.
I think Pearl's Chinese was even more basic than 小馬's, I'm surprised she ended up in acomplished even though she only said a couple basic sentences in the clip showed.
Plus she stopped speaking Chinese and even refused to improve, they should stop overhyping arrogant influencers in this BS list.
I lived in China for 15 years. I wouldn't say I was friends with Oriental Pearl. But we lived in the same city, had the same friend circle, went to the same bars and events. I've spent quite a bit of time around her. Her Chinese is really good. Her vocab is crazy
I've met Oriental Pearl at a night market in Taiwan, and we hung out the entire day spaking only Chinese. Her Chinese is actually crazy crazy good. She can definitely pull out all the crazy 成语 and she used very advanced vocab. Imo definitely more fluent than 小马
@@camerong9391 100% . The people commenting that her Chinese is bad probably don't even speak Chinese. She's lazy with her pronounciation and slips back into the English accent. But in formal situations she can fix her accent immediately. The thing I found most impressive was her vocab. It's way more advanced than the average foreigner who's learned Chinese
19:30 June sounds like a native speaker with slight northern accent.
One thing I learned from this video as a Chinese: those people that I regarded as speaking about the same level of English as I do, probably speaks better English. Lol. The guy who learned Chinese at 19 years old and recited continental names, is phenomenal, he is at the same level as Dashan.
yeah julian is fucking amazing
You should definitely reference the channels in description
People like Oriental Pearl have entire interviews in Chinese, not sure why the clips sourced are random 1-2 sentence street interactions lol
RIP laoshu ❤
Wow, you two folks are great ❤❤ Really 非常标准👍👍
Does the fact ‘accomplished’ is formatted like that drive anyone else crazy? For the love of God you put this much effort in your videos to have it look like that 😂?!
If you have another tier list…try TH-camr: Andy’s (but it’s written in Mandarin). He is born and raised in Taiwan. German descent. Not to be confused with “Andy in Taiwan”
Oriental Pearl is the only one on this list with a masters degree from China. For overall language ability including reading and writing, she’s the best in the group.
In the next round, I’d like to see （美国）曹操 和 （德国）老雷。
I liked the reaction video. I’m into studying foreign languages as a hobby and it confirms my view that everyone judges your language level on your pronunciation more than anything else. Which is frustrating if you don’t like to study pronunciation per se 😂. I hate it. It’s so boring.
IMO god tier should be that they sound eloquent even for a native Chinese person. Like if a foreigner sounds like a well spoken native speaker. People achieve this level in other foreign languages!
I'm a native speaker and university student in China, and trying to speak English fulently. we can help each other if you wanna study Chinese.😉
That lao shu guy referred to a lady as nu ren... It sounds a bit brash and disrespectful. Coming from Shanghai, we'd never call someone nu ren.
Right, thats why I said his word choices are not what I would choose
I have a feeling this video is going to explode in views, so i am commenting now. I also hope xiao ma sees this video
I vividly remember OrientalPearl describing the 9/11 attacks in Chinese in some video
Jump cuts in the video should reduce one’s score.
grading is perfect in my opinion, 朱利安，老马说得太好了。there's another youtuber called jared? iirc
if 大山 was a youtuber he'd be god tier, but i think 朱利安 is better
26:23 impressive. But that’s reading the script. Need more content
Ben, you were teaching me Chinese with your TH-cam videos 13 years ago. I still remember you’d sit on your couch and explain a grammar point.
Two videos that I still remember - how English speakers use need/want a lot and how to use it in Mandarin, and the 自相矛盾 video. So cool to see you’re still here!
Also I have to say how incredible it was to see Jared go from being an American guy to a Chinese guy in an instant. When you learn a language well you really do get a new personality!
All of my Chinese was learned in Canada and I only started in my mid 20’s, so I’m extremely envious of those like Jared who have been in China since they were young. But I also feel that those of us that learned to speak good Chinese completely outside of China are even more impressive 😜
Yeah Jared actually went to high school in China, so really an optimal time for absorbing knowledge. Thanks for watching all these years
Poor Oriental Pearl got graded on her conversation with a 6 year old 😂.
Kept our God-tier boy Lele for the end? Way to go.
兩位的中文太棒了，我到現在也說不好，我是香港人。
They did June Mu so wrong 😢
Hey he is probably god tier, we just need to see more, tell him to make more videos on other topics and we will upgrade him
RIP Moses Laoshu
People I follow jerryinchina, Rose & Anzai Country Life and Fel Thommy
Very good video
for a native Chinese like me, their accent is not important at all. Chinese language is like .zip or .rar, a God Tier need to understand Chinese culture.
if you want to talk to a decent educated Chinese in Chinese language, you need to understand some idoms and classic Chinese, like you talk in English quoting classic movie or bible, but 10x more.
12:39 she should be in getting good
吴雨翔 the German and Hey! Tobi (a German TH-camr) please….. Also Blondie in China 😃😃😃
加油朋友❤
20:23 he speaks better. God tier perhaps
What about Xiao Panda Preschool channel?
这种内容挺不错呀！还能发现了一些发音问题 🤓🤓☝🏻☝🏻 对了你的频道有没有一些视频解释一下怎么用我们的舌头我们的牙齿啊嘴唇什么什么的。 因为其实有一些细节没有办法意识到但是也不那么难改变比如说这个：18:27
Laoshu getting good? wtf he's getting nowhere if you havent heard
💀
Rip laoshu5000
拂菻坊差不多已经被中文互联网彻底ban了😅
另外就中文水平来说，我其实觉得他可以做到第二级，因为他可以看懂一些很拗口的中文，比如那个经典的意思系列“你什么意思 意思意思 你这就不够意思了 ”
为什么？
@@learnchinesenow 好像是在云南把一个粉丝睡了搞大肚子，后面被网民扒出来后不认账一直对线，再者就是他经常攻击同行（也就是同样在简中互联网吃流量的外国人），目前B站那边基本不更新视频评论区也关了，但还持续发动态。另外好像和你挑选的那个乐乐法拉利youtuber也有一定关系吧，我刚刚还去特意看了下他
了解，謝謝
小马is interesting. For someone this fluent, he should really work on his accent.
The disparity between fluency and pronunciation is huge.
18:20 "For most people grown up speaking english..." AMERICAN English. This is an American English problem. It's no surprise Ben didn't know where to stick his tongue to imitate xiaomanyc. This is even more obvious to people who are neither American nor native anglophone.
I'd love to see Xiaoma in your video. He's an incredible linguist who has studied about 50 languages and has so much fascinating insight to share. Plus, he's hilarious.
Rip laoshu
15:46 小馬worse than June Mu, but maybe better than others
14:15 no I think the previous guy’s accent is better. Maybe because he mumble of course. But her accent is too strong and not native
我听左边的主持人一开口就知道他的中文八成是在北京学的😂
💯😎👍
拂菻芳被低估了一点😊
W
神韵艺术团是不是跟法轮功有什么关系，我记得。
查到了，是由法轮功学员组建的。
神韵艺术团和新唐人都是法轮功学员组建的。
FulinFang supposed to be Accomplished, better than Julian. I dont agree with your guy's some ratings methodologies on those youtubers, probably bring a Chinese native speaker with you guys, there definitely a few misconceptions you guys have. So called 老外对中文的打分还是差点意思.
We rated FulinFang as “getting good”, certainly not higher than Julian
@@learnchinesenow Sorry, I'm not good at remember names, The "Julian" I refer to supposed to be the oriental pearl. Julian is doing fantastic.
Bruh, as a language teacher I don't think it is appropriate to judge people's level based on a few video clips and their accents only... Language proficiency involves so many other skills, LIKE READING COMPREHENSION, can any of those people read a novel with ease?? Can they maintain a conversation about complex topics?? Not really, most of those people haven't got a C1 level yet. Still, I agree with where you placed them for the most part.
But yea, I agree that XiaoMa's accent sucks.
Yeah its more just for the fun of it
if we could just judge on reading comprehension I'd be a polyglot instead of one language short of a monoglot
Ben, you need to work on your “pronounciation”.
You guys forgot www.youtube.com/@BlondieinChina she is amazing. Can speak as well as read in Chinese.
@Xiaomanyc 小马在纽约