Excellent description! Another small note of the difference between a cutter rig vrs a sloop rig is that “most” cutter rigs the mast is shorter. Cutter rigs having two front sails allows as much overall sail area like a sloop but because the mast is shorter, this helps a little with how much the boat will heal over making for a much more comfortable ride especially during long crossings
The huge kicker in some of these design choices comes down to racing rules , for most of us this was the IOR rule that encourages small mainsails as they were penalized by the rule and large over lapping genoas were not heavily penalized by the rule ( to keep it simple). As racing has unfortunately lost out to cruising ( nobody sells new racer/cruisers any more) we have gone back to more sensible size mainsails and much less overlapping Genoas ( or no genoas on some race boats). This is of course good for the cruiser as they no longer have to deal with those huge genoas and sail changes when the wind picked up. Overall I much prefer the smaller foresails and if the foretriangle is large enough boats can be designed with self-tacking jibs and easily reefed mainsail to simplify the shorthanded cruising lifestyle. Cheers Warren.
Very true! The self tacking staysail setup we have makes short tacking in a Harbor a breeze! Trying to monkey a huge lapped would be a nightmare. Being how racing trickles into cruising styles, I am excited for the day when cruisers have hydrofoils and ride above the waves. I know this sounds far fetched, but in the time of wooden full keels, it was insanity to propose that families would cruise on plastic fin keel boats with roller furling and electric charts!
Thank you, thank you, thank you! Finally a thorough & detailed description of what precisely defines a sloop vs. a cutter. I have found many (even official sailing organizations) who simply state the 2 foresails, which didn't make sense to me. I also appreciate your explanation of the mast positioning physics, particularly how it effects the ability to reduce headstay sag. Well done! I'm so glad I found your channel & am looking forward to watching more of your videos.
5:04 This is why we invented the Vang/Kicking strap. And the flexible rig. I've sailed sloops pretty much all my life but my dad has had a cutter for the last couple of years. Not a fan. Feels heavier and doesn't point. Pretty well balanced on the helm upwind though in a blow. I did broach in his last sloop in a storm. Helm completely ignored me and we fired up to windward and broached. Too much cloth up in the main but it happened so quickly. We'd already reefed the jenny. Luv and Peace.
I used to be a teacher, but more importantly I'm a nerd who loves to drill into a new topic, breaking it down and learning it. First I learned about sailing so I could better appreciate the Patrick O'Brian Jack Aubrey novels (Listening to them while building and paddling sea kayaks. Unless I'm a mile off the coast I don't feel I've paddled. The question I can't really answer yet is So what took you so long???) Now I want to sail. I have a plan over the next year or two learn how to sail, get good at it, get a boat and go sailing. I may start with a Catalina 22, but I will end up cruising the world - maybe not all of it. So I watch sailing videos and note things like, "but I didn't attach a preventer." So I look up preventer. (Google is great, I've learned new terms in the past that took me years to find a source of information.) So these videos are great. The physics I have down. My head was once awash in cables, sheets, chains, stays.... And then I learned what they do. It's a system, not 500 different things. So systems: maybe pause and go through the parts of systems. Your model. At some point maybe get some color string, also lower your exposure slightly and put a side, or a side back light, (If your bow was pointed north than these lights would be pointed from NWN) pointed at the model, now the background will no longer have any pure white in it, and the color strings will light up and stand out.
Great video! Absolutely, please keep putting out videos using the model and explaining how different rigs and rigging configuration affects performance and sailing in general. Thanks.
Ya the colloquial definition of cutter being a mast aft sloop with an inner forestay and staysail is not technically correct. But it is more sensible, as one can readily see the difference between the colloquial sloop vs the colloquial cutter. Picking out if the rig is aft or forward of station 4 is not readily apparent. (And the station locations, 0 to 10 are defined from the forward and aft perpendiculars which is not necessarily the same as 40 pct aft of the bow, so the distinction between cutter and sloop becomes less clear just from visual observation, especially in boats with large overhangs). As a naval architect, I prefer the colloquial definition instead of the historical definition as it is more descriptive of the rig, ie inner forestay with staysail vs one forestay or headstay. As far as sloop vs cutter upwind, the current highest breed of racing monohulls have the mast well aft (ie volvo 70s, TP52s, etc.) because this yields more rig configurations, and it is faster overall if you don't have to accommodate a rating rule. And they go upwing like crazy. So the generalizations of mast fwd is better for upwind aren't really true.
I was going to mention the VOR but decided not to in an attempt to keep it simple. They are “beyond cutter” with three headsails plus whatever they fly on the bowsprit. Those boats are machines with their rectangular main and staysail Genoas giving them all the performance available! I really do enjoy seeing where the boundaries of material science allow these ocean speed racers to go 😁
I'm so glad I found your channel . I'm planning on selling my van and tiny house to buy a large bilge keel yacht . It will probably be a project . I'm a carpenter with good glass skills so no fear of that side . Rigging not a clue I'm terrified of it . I think you will fill that knowledge gap nicely . Thanks great videos.
Really enjoyed your video as a non sailor it gives me a good idea how sails work I spent a few years in the fishing industry keep the videos coming. Garry =Ireland
Thanks for the video, great info. My S2 6.9 is a Sloop and I use the backstay adjustment often to change shape of the sails. It might be helpful to explain the difference between a fractional and masthead rig. I look forward to your future video on headsails.
Thanks guys, a real informative video in real simple to understand language. Excellent stuff, keep it coming. A few more ideas, differences in sail cut, sail trim, how to tension your standing rigging DIY style etc
Herbie, two related subjects i'd really like to know about: 1. the pros and cons of fractional vs mast head rigs? Inc. 9/10th and other fractions. 2. how do you determine the tension to set your back stay for various conditions?
Will do on the fractional rig setups! 2. Going upwind, you want to tighten your backstay to reduce headstay sag. Also, when the wind picks up, a tighter backstay will flatten the mainsail and depower it. Going downwind, you want to loosen the backstay to add headstay sag, allowing the luff of the headsail to billow out and generate a lot more power. This will also straighten the mast and give it more belly. The deeper chord will give it a lot more power in the light conditions. Basically: windy or going upwind: tighten the backstay. Light air or going downwind: loosen the backstay.
Over lapping sails next! I just bought a Ericson 41 Sloop. I haven't had time to go through all my sails yet; condition, size or what I have. New to sailing. Hoping to go cruising next year. I live in the PNW. Washington up to Alaska, Hawaii, San Francisco, winter in Mexico. That's the tentative plan.
Excellent description of the difference between the two. Could you do a video on the difference between a double ender versus standard stern relative to performance?
I was watching a video of a new sailboat, it was about 60' and was a cutter, and it had 3 head sails. I was curious what's thre performance or handling difference between a ketch and a cutter setup. It's certainly long enough for a mizzen! Thank you so much for getting back to me so fast and thank you in advance for a video on double enders! You're awesome!!
Just discovered you channel. I single-hand a new 37' gemini catamaran. New to me. So I am a sponge for knowledge. I like to learn.. I learned here. THANK you Being a little selfish - I'd love for you to explore catamarans. And if you're brave, B&R rigs
This was very informative. Would love to see more of these. It really helps in understanding the boat and you definitely take the clutter out of the physics of sailing. Awsome!
I put screws into the hull to act as chainplates for the shrouds but decided against putting on shrouds as it would clutter the rig up. I like keeping it to the very basics as it makes it easier to explain and to visualize.
@@RiggingDoctor One thing you did not explain is why modern USCG ships are called cutters. No sail or true mast anywhere. Is it because cutters were the shallow-water chasers, the bridge is forward or because they fancy themselves old-time sailors?
From what I understand about a cutter sailing to windward, you can have a much flatter cut to your inner fore sail. The flatter sail will give you a much better performance. And because the forestay is lower on the mast, it essentially becomes a factional rig. This will give better performance in strong wind.
That's what I thought as well. When the wind picks up, the main is reefed, the jib is furled and you are left with a nice flat yankee which should have reasonable windward performance.
I'm really enjoying your channel. I just sailed a lot as a kid only. Mostly FJ's. Could never get the hang of a dingy or those wicked fast Mistrals' though loved them. But your blog is terrific.
You only mentioned center of effort once. Good explanation on cutter vs sloop. Lots of variables that go into sailboat design and performance. Deciding what you need is what really counts if your building a new boat. What is available for sale is what you get in a used boat. You might want to mention why we went to triangular sails from the old square riggers.
Very good point! I was trying to keep these first videos very basic. I figured going into detail on little details would drive off someone who wants to start learning. The future videos that I will probably make this winter will go into the interplay of CE and CLR with sail balance
I'm by no means an accomplished sailor, but I always thought adjusting (tightening) the backstay can dump air out of the mainsail slowing forward progress. So, if you want to slow down fairly quickly or the sail are over powered you can tighten the backstay, instead of placing a temporary reef or luffing the main. Thanks...and I wondered where the 1-2 headsails explication came from.
We actually call it “the rodeo” because the dog tries to shake her off and she just holds on for the ride. I’ve only done it twice in their whole lives though. Maybe you guys will get to see #3 ;)
Thanks. My Pearson 36 has a hydro lick piston in line with the back stay that you can pump a handle to change the pressure on the back stay .2nd year on the boat and have no idea how to properly use it. Have a great day people:)
Basic rule of thumb, without getting too.much into the details: - Tension up the backstay to rake or curve the mast a bit aft as you sail upwind. - Slack the backstay to straighten the mast as you sail downwind
I have a boat with a Fractional Sloop Rigg on it... And it is really good upwind. It's a Alo 96 ms. If you are able to make a half as interesting video about the Fractional Sloop it would be great.
I am wondering how much this contributes to the difference in upwind performance of full keels vs fin keels. The full vs fin keel debate has quite a few different explanations of why a full keel doesn't sail as close into the wind and I'm now thinking that mast location might be a large factor. Most full keel boats happen to be older boats with cutter rigs and masts going through the center of the salon, which equals saggier forestays. I also learned from your "Ketch vs Yawl" video that a cutter gets dirtier air when close hauled so that might also explain why older boats don't sail upwind as well. I wonder how a full keel and fin keel would point upwind if they were both sloops with masts in identical locations. Maybe the size of the keel is not actually to blame.
These are good points! We have an Alberg 30 (full keel sloop from 1966) and it sails much faster than our Morgan. When we get back to the Chesapeake, we will be rebuilding the Alberg to go cruising so we will really get to see how the two boat styles stack up!
Great video with some really great information. I personally prefer a solent rig for cruising. Maybe you can go over the plusses and minuses of sloop, cutter, and solent rigging in a future video?
My sloop's mast is behind the 40% line (it's at 43). But at the same time the main has a high aspect ratio (3.7 to 3.8:1), which means its center of effort is not too far aft. I'm not sure we'll find a definition that is rigorous.
"Gentlemen never go to windward." As a cruising sailor, a traditional cutter-rig remains ideal for so many reasons. You can keep your big lapping genoas and rail riding. When it begins to blow, I shorten sail and go below.
Is this why some sail boats are powered by their main and others are powered by the head sail? I've sailed on a few sailboats didn't have any power till the main was drawing and others where it didn't do much if the main was up or down
Does this mean that for a Cutter that the rigging is looser than a sloop? When I bought my cutter the backstays were very loose, and still are. The shrouds are kind of loose too, I dont want to start tensioning everything without having the knowledge first. I read that 'hand tight' is what I should be going for with my rig but not sure if the forestay needs tensioning or just tighten the backstays until tighter, which will bend the mast aft...
Do you always have to use 2 headsails when sailing a cutter? It seems like it would be a pain to have an extra sail to deal with all the time. I"ve only sailed sloops in the past. But having a lower overall sail area and a lower mast would be good for going under bridges on the ICW. I'm having a hard time finding a cutter to try out before buying. I'm looking at the 40-46 foot range, looking at Island Packets, Hylas, Najad and Masons so far.
The only time I fly both headsails is on a beam or shallow broad reach. On a close reach, the sails interfere with each other and don’t perform as well. If winds are light, I keep the bigger sail, if winds are heavy, I keep the smaller sail; the same on a deep broad reach. The biggest advantage is when reefing, all you need to do is get rid of the bigger sail and instantly you have a smaller sail set closer to the mast. This is great for balancing the sails as well.
Nice, simple explanation, but not completely accurate on the genoa measurements. The headsail is measured on a line that goes on a 90 degree angle from the luff to the clew, not along the foot of the sail. Then you compare it to the "J" dimension (the horizontal measurement from the base of the mast to the fore stay). Also, you can use mast bend to help depower the main and the genoa by flattening them. You have to take into account that there are lower stays too, so tightening the back stay without adjusting any of the lowers will cause the top of the mast to bend in relation to the bottom. BTW, there is video of the America's Cup boats cranking down on their back stay so much that they break the boat.
The 40-50% you mentioned, does that relate to the deck or the waterline. Because of it's attachments you would think the former but the sail power reacts to the hull and the bow shape (overhang) so it might be the latter. Just wondering.
I have a newbie question: why have a boom on the mainsail? If the jib or the genoa can sail just by tying the clew, then why can't you just tie the clew of the mainsail down and not have to worry about getting wacked by a giant stick?
The boom is basically a permanent whisker pole for the mainsail. It’s really handy for trimming when going upwind. In a nasty storm, you switch to a trysail which is a boom-less small mainsail to take the boom out of the equation. Without the boom, the trysail is hard to trim well for upwind sailing and this really makes you appreciate the boom for the mainsail. The Thames Sailing Barge is an example of a sailboat with no boom. It can work, but it’s really helpful to have the boom for trimming and sail shape.
Most informative ~ and in layman's terms! I haven't been able to find any BASIC stuff on which to base further learning. eg HOW and where is the mast stepped/attached-to the hull of, say a 30-footer? (and, even more puzzling, how is a junk-style mast/rigging set up, given that such vessels are supposedly simpler/easier to handle?
What if you have a secondary backstay on a ketch that can be used up wind? Something to use on a long headwind hall. Maybe running a removable backstay to the backstay of the mizzen, or to the top of the mizzen mast.
I like the overlapping sail physics idea. Another question in this whole realm... Is this where a soylent comes in? What differentiates a cutter from a soylent (and a sloop)?
Thank you for the semplicity of your explanation it works very well ! Listen what do you think if I would add a forstay on my sloop ? I wanna increase the efficency by strong wind with a little sail on the forstay instead of the rolled genoa expecially up wind. Le t me know what do you think about it.
I'm looking at some British cutters and the backstay doesn't go all the way to the stern; they are mounted along the sheerline and the boom extend beyond the stern. I believe it's called a running backstay. How does that change the benefit of a cutter or sloop?
It makes it tricky to short tack as you have to set and douse the running backstays on each tack. They are better suited for long passages as opposed to buoy racing 😎
Thank you, I spent the day looking at your other videos and learned a lot! I'm sketching on a smaller gaff rig vessel, judging by the Cornish Crabber it seems possible to skip the running backstays for the smaller boats and only use lower shroud, cap shroud and forestay.
Once again I'm blown away (pun intended) with all your info. BTW...where does a catch come into the mix? Yes...I'd love you to talk about overlapping head sails on your next video. PEACE OUT! Ü
Sail shape is actually designed taking into account the sag that will occur. Sailmakers really depend heavily on the Rigging being tuned properly. Windward performance on a cruising boat is only important if you are cruising wrong! No matter the performance to windward, it is not comfortable. Racing needs that performance, Cruising is about relaxing as you sail downwind and enjoy your sundowner. We can go to windward but we choose not to because we would rather take a more peaceful downwind route to our next port.
![WHY Two Headsails? [Cutter vs Slutter vs Solent] | Sailing Wisdom](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/hQf_dmMduV4/mqdefault.jpg)
![Why Two MASTS? [Ketches vs Yawls] | Sailing Wisdom](/img/n.gif)
Excellent description! Another small note of the difference between a cutter rig vrs a sloop rig is that “most” cutter rigs the mast is shorter. Cutter rigs having two front sails allows as much overall sail area like a sloop but because the mast is shorter, this helps a little with how much the boat will heal over making for a much more comfortable ride especially during long crossings
For someone that know really nothing about sailing, u explained that really well & I understood, thank u!
Glad it all makes sense now :)
Nice tutorial ,on difference of Cutter & sloop, there is still many of advantage to the Cutter,in different wind conditions
It is my favorite rig for ocean cruising
Great explanation...I was intently focusing on you and your message...imagine my surprise at 1:50 when realized you had a bird on your shoulder!
Didn't realize till I read this 😂
Great video Herby, I learned a lot and I really appreciate your model sailboat, learning visually is the way to go.....thanks for the lesson!
Thanks Mark!
The huge kicker in some of these design choices comes down to racing rules , for most of us this was the IOR rule that encourages small mainsails as they were penalized by the rule and large over lapping genoas were not heavily penalized by the rule ( to keep it simple).
As racing has unfortunately lost out to cruising ( nobody sells new racer/cruisers any more) we have gone back to more sensible size mainsails and much less overlapping Genoas ( or no genoas on some race boats). This is of course good for the cruiser as they no longer have to deal with those huge genoas and sail changes when the wind picked up.
Overall I much prefer the smaller foresails and if the foretriangle is large enough boats can be designed with self-tacking jibs and easily reefed mainsail to simplify the shorthanded cruising lifestyle.
Cheers Warren.
Very true! The self tacking staysail setup we have makes short tacking in a Harbor a breeze! Trying to monkey a huge lapped would be a nightmare.
Being how racing trickles into cruising styles, I am excited for the day when cruisers have hydrofoils and ride above the waves. I know this sounds far fetched, but in the time of wooden full keels, it was insanity to propose that families would cruise on plastic fin keel boats with roller furling and electric charts!
Thanks… never knew this… & I recon not many other people know either… good onya 🇦🇺🤙🏽🇦🇺
Thank you
This was the best explanation that I've encountered. Very well-done. Thank you.
Thank you, thank you, thank you! Finally a thorough & detailed description of what precisely defines a sloop vs. a cutter. I have found many (even official sailing organizations) who simply state the 2 foresails, which didn't make sense to me. I also appreciate your explanation of the mast positioning physics, particularly how it effects the ability to reduce headstay sag. Well done! I'm so glad I found your channel & am looking forward to watching more of your videos.
Well done! very clear. I want to build a fast fast sloop.. and find a way to take it on long distance. Gonna do this!
Do a ketch rig next. Overlapping sail physics sound interesting
I second the request for ketch.
And then maybe a Solent rig after? :)
I would also like to hear your explanation of the pros and cons of a ketch rig.
Will do!
Yes . I want a ketch . For no reason at all other than they look way more pirate shipy .
5:04 This is why we invented the Vang/Kicking strap.
And the flexible rig.
I've sailed sloops pretty much all my life but my dad has had a cutter for the last couple of years. Not a fan.
Feels heavier and doesn't point.
Pretty well balanced on the helm upwind though in a blow.
I did broach in his last sloop in a storm.
Helm completely ignored me and we fired up to windward and broached.
Too much cloth up in the main but it happened so quickly.
We'd already reefed the jenny.
Luv and Peace.
"That is why you always need your shrouds..." Love it!
Herbie, the “Bob’s Burgers” Big Boy shirt I think explains a lot of why i enjoy following you guys!
All these videos on rig designs, pros n cons, and general considerations are great. Looking forward to the next topic!
👍
I used to be a teacher, but more importantly I'm a nerd who loves to drill into a new topic, breaking it down and learning it. First I learned about sailing so I could better appreciate the Patrick O'Brian Jack Aubrey novels (Listening to them while building and paddling sea kayaks. Unless I'm a mile off the coast I don't feel I've paddled. The question I can't really answer yet is So what took you so long???) Now I want to sail. I have a plan over the next year or two learn how to sail, get good at it, get a boat and go sailing. I may start with a Catalina 22, but I will end up cruising the world - maybe not all of it. So I watch sailing videos and note things like, "but I didn't attach a preventer." So I look up preventer. (Google is great, I've learned new terms in the past that took me years to find a source of information.) So these videos are great. The physics I have down.
My head was once awash in cables, sheets, chains, stays.... And then I learned what they do. It's a system, not 500 different things. So systems: maybe pause and go through the parts of systems.
Your model. At some point maybe get some color string, also lower your exposure slightly and put a side, or a side back light, (If your bow was pointed north than these lights would be pointed from NWN) pointed at the model, now the background will no longer have any pure white in it, and the color strings will light up and stand out.
Great video! Absolutely, please keep putting out videos using the model and explaining how different rigs and rigging configuration affects performance and sailing in general. Thanks.
👍 Thanks!
I am just starting to learn about sailing. It sounds fascinating to live on a sailboat and cruise.
Ya the colloquial definition of cutter being a mast aft sloop with an inner forestay and staysail is not technically correct. But it is more sensible, as one can readily see the difference between the colloquial sloop vs the colloquial cutter. Picking out if the rig is aft or forward of station 4 is not readily apparent. (And the station locations, 0 to 10 are defined from the forward and aft perpendiculars which is not necessarily the same as 40 pct aft of the bow, so the distinction between cutter and sloop becomes less clear just from visual observation, especially in boats with large overhangs).
As a naval architect, I prefer the colloquial definition instead of the historical definition as it is more descriptive of the rig, ie inner forestay with staysail vs one forestay or headstay.
As far as sloop vs cutter upwind, the current highest breed of racing monohulls have the mast well aft (ie volvo 70s, TP52s, etc.) because this yields more rig configurations, and it is faster overall if you don't have to accommodate a rating rule. And they go upwing like crazy. So the generalizations of mast fwd is better for upwind aren't really true.
I was going to mention the VOR but decided not to in an attempt to keep it simple. They are “beyond cutter” with three headsails plus whatever they fly on the bowsprit. Those boats are machines with their rectangular main and staysail Genoas giving them all the performance available! I really do enjoy seeing where the boundaries of material science allow these ocean speed racers to go 😁
This guy knows his stuff.
👍
I'm so glad I found your channel . I'm planning on selling my van and tiny house to buy a large bilge keel yacht . It will probably be a project . I'm a carpenter with good glass skills so no fear of that side . Rigging not a clue I'm terrified of it .
I think you will fill that knowledge gap nicely . Thanks great videos.
Really enjoyed your video as a non sailor it gives me a good idea how sails work I spent a few years in the fishing industry keep the videos coming. Garry =Ireland
Thanks for the video, great info. My S2 6.9 is a Sloop and I use the backstay adjustment often to change shape of the sails. It might be helpful to explain the difference between a fractional and masthead rig. I look forward to your future video on headsails.
Very good idea for a future video!
Thanks guys, a real informative video in real simple to understand language. Excellent stuff, keep it coming.
A few more ideas, differences in sail cut, sail trim, how to tension your standing rigging DIY style etc
Thanks for the topic ideas!
Thank you for sharing. This makes it visuel and easy to understand.
Thanks for the info, I never knew what the difference was !!!
Herbie, two related subjects i'd really like to know about:
1. the pros and cons of fractional vs mast head rigs? Inc. 9/10th and other fractions.
2. how do you determine the tension to set your back stay for various conditions?
Will do on the fractional rig setups!
2. Going upwind, you want to tighten your backstay to reduce headstay sag. Also, when the wind picks up, a tighter backstay will flatten the mainsail and depower it.
Going downwind, you want to loosen the backstay to add headstay sag, allowing the luff of the headsail to billow out and generate a lot more power. This will also straighten the mast and give it more belly. The deeper chord will give it a lot more power in the light conditions.
Basically: windy or going upwind: tighten the backstay.
Light air or going downwind: loosen the backstay.
Over lapping sails next! I just bought a Ericson 41 Sloop. I haven't had time to go through all my sails yet; condition, size or what I have. New to sailing. Hoping to go cruising next year. I live in the PNW. Washington up to Alaska, Hawaii, San Francisco, winter in Mexico. That's the tentative plan.
Sounds like some awesome cruising grounds!
You are a phenomenon and so skilled. Really thank you for educating me! I love it so much.
Thanks for the lesson. People should know the facts.
👍
Excellent description of the difference between the two. Could you do a video on the difference between a double ender versus standard stern relative to performance?
That’s a great topic! I’ll add it to the list 😉
I was watching a video of a new sailboat, it was about 60' and was a cutter, and it had 3 head sails. I was curious what's thre performance or handling difference between a ketch and a cutter setup. It's certainly long enough for a mizzen!
Thank you so much for getting back to me so fast and thank you in advance for a video on double enders! You're awesome!!
Here's the video I was referring to in previous comment...
Gorgeous boat.
th-cam.com/video/ObScSdrhoDw/w-d-xo.html
Great explaining, thanx!
That is one of the best explanations, for the us landlubbers on here.thanks great video, fair weather.:)
Just discovered you channel.
I single-hand a new 37' gemini catamaran. New to me. So I am a sponge for knowledge.
I like to learn.. I learned here. THANK you
Being a little selfish - I'd love for you to explore catamarans.
And if you're brave, B&R rigs
B & R rigs are a feat of engineering!
Rigging is very similar mono vs multi, the difference is cats don’t heel (unless you are flying a hull) 🤪
Your videos are incredibly informative. Thank you.
This was very informative. Would love to see more of these. It really helps in understanding the boat and you definitely take the clutter out of the physics of sailing.
Awsome!
I put screws into the hull to act as chainplates for the shrouds but decided against putting on shrouds as it would clutter the rig up. I like keeping it to the very basics as it makes it easier to explain and to visualize.
Rigging Doctor yup... kiss theory... works best.
MUY BUENA EXPLICACION DOCTOR !!!!! UN GRAN SALUDO DESDE ARGENTINA !!!!
Muchas gracias y saludos
I have a baby stay, I'd like to know more about that Herby. Great video, easy to understand.
Thanks for the topic idea :)
Would appreciate hearing your opinion and comparison of a Ketch vs. a Cutter vs. a Sloop rigs.
Good topic idea, thanks!
If you’re looking at Ketch, you may as well check out Schooners too.
very good, i like diagrams, animation and your model. i appreciate your knowledge shared.
Thanks! This model is a great way to visualize it while still keeping it simple
Thanks explained well I learned a lot
So glad!
Thank you Im learneding a lot from you thank you , Andy
Who knew Nick Swardson was so knowledgeable about sail rigging
Very good discussion. Thx!
Thanks :)
@@RiggingDoctor One thing you did not explain is why modern USCG ships are called cutters. No sail or true mast anywhere. Is it because cutters were the shallow-water chasers, the bridge is forward or because they fancy themselves old-time sailors?
From what I understand about a cutter sailing to windward, you can have a much flatter cut to your inner fore sail. The flatter sail will give you a much better performance. And because the forestay is lower on the mast, it essentially becomes a factional rig. This will give better performance in strong wind.
Yes, and this is what we have as our staysail :)
That's what I thought as well. When the wind picks up, the main is reefed, the jib is furled and you are left with a nice flat yankee which should have reasonable windward performance.
Very effective way to explain this.
Thank you!
I'm really enjoying your channel. I just sailed a lot as a kid only. Mostly FJ's. Could never get the hang of a dingy or those wicked fast Mistrals' though loved them. But your blog is terrific.
Thank you!
Everything moves slower on a keel boat, which makes them much easier to sail than a dinghy
You only mentioned center of effort once. Good explanation on cutter vs sloop. Lots of variables that go into sailboat design and performance. Deciding what you need is what really counts if your building a new boat. What is available for sale is what you get in a used boat. You might want to mention why we went to triangular sails from the old square riggers.
Very good point! I was trying to keep these first videos very basic. I figured going into detail on little details would drive off someone who wants to start learning.
The future videos that I will probably make this winter will go into the interplay of CE and CLR with sail balance
I'm by no means an accomplished sailor, but I always thought adjusting (tightening) the backstay can dump air out of the mainsail slowing forward progress. So, if you want to slow down fairly quickly or the sail are over powered you can tighten the backstay, instead of placing a temporary reef or luffing the main. Thanks...and I wondered where the 1-2 headsails explication came from.
The backstay adjustment you described is correct. Tightening the backstay flattens the mainsail and tightens the headstay.
I would like to see the bird with a little cowboy hat ridding the dog👍👍
We actually call it “the rodeo” because the dog tries to shake her off and she just holds on for the ride.
I’ve only done it twice in their whole lives though. Maybe you guys will get to see #3 ;)
Thanks. My Pearson 36 has a hydro lick piston in line with the back stay that you can pump a handle to change the pressure on the back stay .2nd year on the boat and have no idea how to properly use it. Have a great day people:)
Basic rule of thumb, without getting too.much into the details:
- Tension up the backstay to rake or curve the mast a bit aft as you sail upwind.
- Slack the backstay to straighten the mast as you sail downwind
@@feshfeshsailing Thank you:)
Brilliant video. Thank you.
Thank you. I learned something new today.
So a boomkin should reduce the back stay tension. BTW, I call a boat with a mast placement less than 40% a double head sail sloop.
I have a boat with a Fractional Sloop Rigg on it... And it is really good upwind. It's a Alo 96 ms. If you are able to make a half as interesting video about the Fractional Sloop it would be great.
It’s coming up soon!
Thanks for all the great info, love your videos .
👍
This is great. Thank you
wow that was great. Very interesting to me.
Of course, all of this goes out the port when talking about Gaff rigs and bowsprits.
Exactly!
I am wondering how much this contributes to the difference in upwind performance of full keels vs fin keels. The full vs fin keel debate has quite a few different explanations of why a full keel doesn't sail as close into the wind and I'm now thinking that mast location might be a large factor. Most full keel boats happen to be older boats with cutter rigs and masts going through the center of the salon, which equals saggier forestays. I also learned from your "Ketch vs Yawl" video that a cutter gets dirtier air when close hauled so that might also explain why older boats don't sail upwind as well. I wonder how a full keel and fin keel would point upwind if they were both sloops with masts in identical locations. Maybe the size of the keel is not actually to blame.
These are good points! We have an Alberg 30 (full keel sloop from 1966) and it sails much faster than our Morgan.
When we get back to the Chesapeake, we will be rebuilding the Alberg to go cruising so we will really get to see how the two boat styles stack up!
Great video with some really great information. I personally prefer a solent rig for cruising. Maybe you can go over the plusses and minuses of sloop, cutter, and solent rigging in a future video?
Got it right here for you!
WHY Two Headsails? [Cutter vs Slutter vs Solent] | Sailing Wisdom
th-cam.com/video/hQf_dmMduV4/w-d-xo.html
Great explanation,
Thanks
We love your Dyneema posts, we just changed to a Dyneema baby stay and love it already! Cheers!!
Wonderful!
using a tension gauge to tune rigging
My sloop's mast is behind the 40% line (it's at 43). But at the same time the main has a high aspect ratio (3.7 to 3.8:1), which means its center of effort is not too far aft. I'm not sure we'll find a definition that is rigorous.
"Gentlemen never go to windward." As a cruising sailor, a traditional cutter-rig remains ideal for so many reasons. You can keep your big lapping genoas and rail riding. When it begins to blow, I shorten sail and go below.
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I don’t know why but I love going to windward.
Thanks for the video. Very helpful but which is better for cruising and why? Thanks
I personally think a sloop is better for coastal cruising and a cutter for offshore bluewater passages.
Is this why some sail boats are powered by their main and others are powered by the head sail? I've sailed on a few sailboats didn't have any power till the main was drawing and others where it didn't do much if the main was up or down
I am interested in the series and balancing the sails.
Thanks for the feedback! I’ll be working on that shortly
I like you info. I am learning a lot keep them going.
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This is good next lesson would be how vantstag could help the backstag.
Another perfect kid toy video...thanks Cap.
We always arguing about the same thing good video
Very very interesting. Thank you a lot for those videos, they're super educational.
Does this mean that for a Cutter that the rigging is looser than a sloop? When I bought my cutter the backstays were very loose, and still are. The shrouds are kind of loose too, I dont want to start tensioning everything without having the knowledge first. I read that 'hand tight' is what I should be going for with my rig but not sure if the forestay needs tensioning or just tighten the backstays until tighter, which will bend the mast aft...
Very informative. Does a fractional rig change things?
It does! I’ll be doing a video on fractional rigs soon.
Do you always have to use 2 headsails when sailing a cutter? It seems like it would be a pain to have an extra sail to deal with all the time. I"ve only sailed sloops in the past. But having a lower overall sail area and a lower mast would be good for going under bridges on the ICW. I'm having a hard time finding a cutter to try out before buying. I'm looking at the 40-46 foot range, looking at Island Packets, Hylas, Najad and Masons so far.
The only time I fly both headsails is on a beam or shallow broad reach. On a close reach, the sails interfere with each other and don’t perform as well. If winds are light, I keep the bigger sail, if winds are heavy, I keep the smaller sail; the same on a deep broad reach.
The biggest advantage is when reefing, all you need to do is get rid of the bigger sail and instantly you have a smaller sail set closer to the mast. This is great for balancing the sails as well.
Thanks for the excellent information :)
Nice, simple explanation, but not completely accurate on the genoa measurements. The headsail is measured on a line that goes on a 90 degree angle from the luff to the clew, not along the foot of the sail. Then you compare it to the "J" dimension (the horizontal measurement from the base of the mast to the fore stay).
Also, you can use mast bend to help depower the main and the genoa by flattening them. You have to take into account that there are lower stays too, so tightening the back stay without adjusting any of the lowers will cause the top of the mast to bend in relation to the bottom. BTW, there is video of the America's Cup boats cranking down on their back stay so much that they break the boat.
The 40-50% you mentioned, does that relate to the deck or the waterline. Because of it's attachments you would think the former but the sail power reacts to the hull and the bow shape (overhang) so it might be the latter. Just wondering.
I have a newbie question: why have a boom on the mainsail? If the jib or the genoa can sail just by tying the clew, then why can't you just tie the clew of the mainsail down and not have to worry about getting wacked by a giant stick?
The boom is basically a permanent whisker pole for the mainsail. It’s really handy for trimming when going upwind. In a nasty storm, you switch to a trysail which is a boom-less small mainsail to take the boom out of the equation. Without the boom, the trysail is hard to trim well for upwind sailing and this really makes you appreciate the boom for the mainsail.
The Thames Sailing Barge is an example of a sailboat with no boom. It can work, but it’s really helpful to have the boom for trimming and sail shape.
Loved Loved this video! Thanks so much!
Thanks!
Most informative ~ and in layman's terms! I haven't been able to find any BASIC stuff on which to base further learning. eg HOW and where is the mast stepped/attached-to the hull of, say a 30-footer? (and, even more puzzling, how is a junk-style mast/rigging set up, given that such vessels are supposedly simpler/easier to handle?
Both good questions! We did a video on deck stepped vs keel stepped masts, but I’m not sure if we included that information
What if you have a secondary backstay on a ketch that can be used up wind? Something to use on a long headwind hall. Maybe running a removable backstay to the backstay of the mizzen, or to the top of the mizzen mast.
It would be very cumbersome with the mizzen boom and probably would not be that worthwhile
I like the overlapping sail physics idea. Another question in this whole realm... Is this where a soylent comes in? What differentiates a cutter from a soylent (and a sloop)?
Very good topic. I will soon be doing a video on solents and cutters, and I will also talk about slutters 😉
Fantastic video!! Thank you for this, much appreciated.
Thank you for the semplicity of your explanation it works very well ! Listen what do you think if I would add a forstay on my sloop ? I wanna increase the efficency by strong wind with a little sail on the forstay instead of the rolled genoa expecially up wind. Le t me know what do you think about it.
Thank you for the explanation. Now if you can only get everyone that sells a boat to use the correct term :-)
Apparently my Islander 30 Bahama is a cutter, lol
Great video, this was very informative.
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Did'nt see the bird intill 1:50 xD
Grate info! Thank you :D
Great Job Herb!
Thanks :)
The next topic sounds good.
I'm looking at some British cutters and the backstay doesn't go all the way to the stern; they are mounted along the sheerline and the boom extend beyond the stern. I believe it's called a running backstay. How does that change the benefit of a cutter or sloop?
It makes it tricky to short tack as you have to set and douse the running backstays on each tack. They are better suited for long passages as opposed to buoy racing 😎
Thank you, I spent the day looking at your other videos and learned a lot! I'm sketching on a smaller gaff rig vessel, judging by the Cornish Crabber it seems possible to skip the running backstays for the smaller boats and only use lower shroud, cap shroud and forestay.
Dude, thank you
Very informative, thank you
You are very welcome!
Good Job Herb I like this and am interested in the rigging also thx
Thanks 👍
Love the green cheek I have a sun conure and a sloop
…with bird shit all over it.
@@RustyKnorr and dock spider poo.
Once again I'm blown away (pun intended) with all your info. BTW...where does a catch come into the mix? Yes...I'd love you to talk about overlapping head sails on your next video. PEACE OUT! Ü
I’ll be doing ketches and yawls soon!
How important is "windward" performance in a cruising boat? How much could the sail shape be designed to compensate for stay sag?
Sail shape is actually designed taking into account the sag that will occur. Sailmakers really depend heavily on the Rigging being tuned properly.
Windward performance on a cruising boat is only important if you are cruising wrong! No matter the performance to windward, it is not comfortable. Racing needs that performance, Cruising is about relaxing as you sail downwind and enjoy your sundowner. We can go to windward but we choose not to because we would rather take a more peaceful downwind route to our next port.
Good explanation - You get a thumbs up! But what about Ketch's and Yawls?
That chainplates has a bunch of holes for all the mizzen masts! Thanks for the topic suggestion 👍
@@RiggingDoctor- www.alliedtitanium.com/products/marine/rigging-parts/chainplates/index.php