Plugins You Should Try INSTEAD of Neural DSP
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 พ.ค. 2023
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@NeuralDSP have I think the largest profile in the guitar plugin world, partly because they've been quite forward-thinking in terms of collaborating with artists and guitarists to push forward their stuff. There are a few less well known plugins that I think deserve more attention, notably:
NAM - free neural amp modeler
Scuffham S Gear
Mixwave Milkman Creamer
Line 6 Helix Native and the Metallurgy collection
Nembrini Audio
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That Milkman has exactly the right kind of clean tone attack; not compressed yet not piezo-like
Helix Native is incredibly value and is mind blowingly versatile. I've got an HX Stomp, so Native looked familiar, but seems about 10 times as powerful. It's like having the full Helix Floor at your fingertips, and then some. You can do just about anything you want, have many, many Blocks, signal chains, Set Lists, etc. You can create unimaginably complex Presets, and test them out, all in the an easy interface on your computer.
Kudos to Line 6 for making such a powerful Plugin available. I've read can even be run as a stand alone VST, but you have to do a little researcher on how to do that.
I've used Scuffham for years and I'm glad to see these guys get some recognition here! Really great sounding amps. The Milkman you covered was really inspiring! I've been playing with Positive Grid these last few years and while there are tons of fun options, there are really only a handful of useable tools. I'm looking forward to trying the Helix Native stuff. Thanks for the great vid, John!!
Im a big fan of Overlouds Rig Player. Took some time to get the hang of things but once I did I was glad I gave it a real shot. Its a great mix of real amp and cabism captures like a Kemper or Tone X but you also can mix those with the other pedals, supercab and other one off amps in the overall plug-in. Very underrated in my opinion.
Have to say that ending Jam is fantastic, wonderfully executed John, maybe a future series about breaking these down theory wise. 🤷♂️🤘
It's been around for a good amount of time, since we are now arived at GuitarRig6. It has been always my go to, even when I do own the NeuralDSP Plini. You can do Stereo-two-amp setups, which I use a lot atm. Since I've got the Softube Celestion Speaker Shaper added, I could get even more of the sound that I want out of that AmpSim. I tried the Benson PlugIn and yes, the Milkman got that beautiful clean, but the Benson was more what I sound like. I have enough for now I guess, otherwise the Benson would great
Definitely going to try the mix wave creamer, sounds amazing
The Benson plugins sound SO good. My church has a Benson backline and they are really great amps.
I really really really like the Milkman sim. Great video! Loved the last tune!
Phenomenal playing on the intro jam!
Big ToneX fan and user. Other great options are Mixwave Benson.
I've been using S Gear for years and I always go to back to it...have tried lts of stuff. S Gear just works. Amazing playing, as always John!
MixWave Benson and Milkman are both very nice. The clean-to-breakup amp tones, spring reverbs and more subtle overdrive and preamp options are the real stars there. Play feel is excellent. I do have most of the NeuralDSP plugins, Cory Wong and Tone King II are my favorites for my usual style and I love both of them. But with a couple of weeks playing the MixWaves options, I think they both may be even better than Wong & Tone King.
I dont play cleans on Neuraldsp anymore after using Benson for a while now, I even prefer it to Tonex amps. Neuraldsp sounds DI-ish to my ear and Tonex has that mud that I can’t explain but Mixwave captures that amp-ish sound specially playing clean solos.
ML SoundLabs Amped are nice too; I bought the Oracle plugin (Orange Rockerverb) for a nice price on sale.
I've tried most of them. One thing I noticed is the tech is getting better very fast now. Milkman Creamer is ridiculous accurate for cleans. And it feels right too. Didn't care much for their Benson version. A good IR can make an average sim into a great sim. Ownhammers are the best I've tried. Still like Neural DSP for high gain. Can't beat the Soldano. Lots of options now. Love Nembrini too.
Amped Roots! Best plugin for overdriven tones! I'm also using Rabea Massaad for the cleans. I've sold all the physical stuff except the wah-wah pedal.
I really like some of ML Sound Lab's stuff. They've also done a great job of updating/upgrading their plugins and they haven't charged for it. The ML800 is one of my favorites.
Blue Cat Axiom is another great one to check out, especially with its ability to change the sound of or rather emulate different pickups. By making single coils sound like humbuckers or vice versa
I used Destructor then Axiom. Since getting PolyChrome DSP McRocklin Suite I haven't used Axiom.
PolyChrome DSP McRocklin Suite is also pretty fun plugin. 4 amps, bunch of pedals, sounds good overall
Nembrini audio is stellar, fun fact, they are the ones making the modelling or at least are involved with it for many many of the plugins we consider to be the best on the market. They are very secretive on which plugins/company they were involved with but Igor Nembrini is a legend in the domain...rumors are that he was involved with NeuralDSP and still is, I don't know how true this is though.
Some affordable stuff that I really enjoy are: Audio Assault, Nalex and Analog Obsession.....with good IR's of course.
You’re absolutely right about the helix Native being underrated…. I’ve played more sessions with the helix native than any gear I own.it’s just a better workflow for me… Waves also have an amazing collection of Amps/Pedal too and they sound good
Polychrome DSP is what I've been using recently and I am very happy with it.
Amplitube 5 is a sleeper. I have the hx stomp, but there are some gems on amplitube 5.
100 percent. There is so much in Amp5, switching out different speakers in cabs Di-room-mixer it has it all. I bought a cheap midi pedal to switch saved presets and I almost never use my actual amp anymore. Amplitude 5 is it for me. I have a couple Neural and I always find Amp 5 to be more versatile.
I’ve been using the Mixwave Benson for a couple of months now and it is a blast. Really fun and well done amp and pedals.
That's definitely one on my list to try.
For me there are 3 plugins that I used the most .1)Sgear 3. 2)Neural Toneking MK2. 3)Amplitube 5. I like S-gear the most and after that I use the Tone King MK2 . Amplitube is nice but the other two sound better to me. I pair that with the Audiothings "Springs" reverb plugin. This models 13 spring reverb units/tanks of the past. This is a best spring reverb I've ever played. It nails that 60's surf sound in combination with the Toneking MK2 plugin. Instant 60's surf with a lot of natural drip.
I use Helix native and Bias FX 2 & Bias Amp with Helix Native some times.
So what are your opinions on Native Instruments Guitar Rig
I'm relatively new to plugins I only have DSP Cali Suite and DSP Tone king. Thank you for giving me other options to explore.
These are great. Cali is the most versatile good sounding amp. In general the amp ones are better than the artist ones.
I really like Overloud TH-U. It does the modeling thing but has their "rig player" which appears to be a capture player. I also use Helix Native to experiment with presets to use on my Helix LT.
Thanks John. My discovery (and purchase) of MixWave's Milkman Creamer and Benson Chimera is fairly recent. I own a Tone King Imperial mkII amp...and always enjoyed Neural DSP's Imperial plugin....until I tried the Milkman Creamer plugin. The Milkman Creamer plugin is "next level". I don't see myself ever using the Imperial plugin again. Scuffham, for my tastes, is awesome for other tones.
That's close to home. I also have an Imperial II, and the NeuralDSP TK plugin. For just quick & dirty, I would play through the computer, but still go to the amp for better play feel and tone. With the Milkman plugin though, I don't feel as much a need to flip the tube amp on. Might still just be in the afterglow of the new plugin, we'll see.
@john Nathan Cordy I was thinking of going with an hx stomp. How do you think it compares to helix native as well as the helix lt? I don’t gig, total closet musician, so wondered if the helix native is good enough? I use the gx 100 as well but wanted to venture into the helix world?
I have had several plugins and VST add ons. HELIX Native is truly like having a Helix locked inside your computer. It’s very good.
I really Like OVERLOUD’s THU as well.
Scuffham .... after neural this one has to be my fav. the plexi tone is really great. NAM friedmen capture are just amazing too.
I have most of the plugins you mentioned.
I love the MixWave - have them both.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Helix Native don't have Standalone version, right? - that's the only reason imt not using it more often
No, you have to use it in a DAW, Metalurgy can be standalone.
Helix Native IS brilliant and stands out, I must say.
Since recently being strongly influenced by a certain TH-camr to go Helix … 🙄..
I’ve spent more time in the bundled Helix Native than on the hardware unit itself.
I’d almost forgotten about it but my Bias FX2 updated this week and I really liked some of their clear tones with a Strat.
More investigation to follow
Didn’t Mr Nembrini also do a lot of the modelling for IKM/Amplitube ?
I like the Nembrini independent stuff, I grab them via their frequent offers.
I like the layout with Amplitube 5, sounds good as well to my ear, even before you add Tonex sounds to it.
Tonex I like but I don’t really need that hardware.
Native Instruments Guitar Rig 6 has some really nice tones too.
I got that in a bundle deal and was quite impressed with the sounds.
The interface doesn’t strike me as friendly as the others though.
Man... That outro tune is great.
What about Bias FX? It was the first modelling software I used and still use. I have a QC and HX Stomp but for recording I find the Bias stuff works really well.
I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on the positive grid bias+fx stuff, I’m in the market for upgrading some of my VSTs and I don’t really have any decent VSTs for guitar tones
I can see there's a demo version of Bias FX 2 - I'll try and check it out!
Maybe one day you'll discover PolyChrome DSP McRocklin Suite?
I purchased it as soon as it was released, and it became the only guitar plugin I use ever since.
worth a look. IMO
Curious if anyone else had same issue I did: Helix Native is a huge resource hog... sounds great, but if you are doing any sort of production (not just playing or using it for guitar), it bogs. Anyone else? Thanks for videos like this JNC.
I can’t seem to get the built in tuner to work for the mixwave plugins. Anyone else have this issue?
Try PolychromeDSP. McRocklin developed it. It's fantastic. Also, quick question. What do you use from a drum plug-in?
th-cam.com/video/EJiFrt99FnE/w-d-xo.html all the plugins and stuff I use are in this video - Native Instruments Studio Drummer for kit!
I have Neural Wong, Petrucci, Tone King, Henson, MKIIC+, and Bea. Doing it over, I'd skip the Henson and Tone King. Petrucci is great for liquid lead tones. MKIIC+ is a brilliant re-creation of an actual amp. Wong is a brilliant tight, funky clean tone generator. I love the amps in Bea, but don't really use the synthy stuff.
I purchased the Milkman Creamer after seeing your demo. It is the best Fender type plugin I've ever played. There are hundreds of presets that are branded as Fender tones - but none of them measure up. The Milkman Creamer does.
I have some Scuffam plugins lurking in some dark corner of my computer. I remember not really bonding with them. I'll have to give them another look.
I have the Valhalla Ecstasy and Tri-Axis. Those are remarkably close to the original. I've owned a couple of Ecstasys and I think that Valhalla does Ecstasy better than anyone.
Bang for the buck - Helix Native is a great introduction to plugins - but it is less refined as the ones mentioned above.
I always thought S-Gear was the best sounding but now Helix Native has the improved IRs it may just edge it, and yeah the new Gramatico, (Dumble) is really good. Great vids BTW.
I dont know if youll see this since its an older video of yours but ive heard you mwntion STL before and their subscription model.
I feel like i should correct you and let you know that a customer can buy and own outright any of their plugins. I bought Tonehub before there was a subscription and I own the Howard Benson and Andy James suites.
Honestly those last two i think would be worth looking at for you. Granted they are less raw and more curated artist tones.
Tonehub has more of a raw kemper like sound to me.
Amphub is good but its not my favorite. Some people really like it but i get option paralysis. It can also be purchased outright as opposed to subscription only.
Love your videos. I just found you over the summer and i keep coming back.
I'm going to try the MixWave stuff, hopefully they have a black friday sale. Big Neural DSP fan, but everything else I've tried I've found really disappointing. Looking forward to the creamer hopefully.
Kuassa,Mercuriall and Neural dsp are my favorites..they have great sound and they have everything separately and if you are sensible you can just grab the thing you want for a decent price.... which is why i dont like full suites, they are too bulky and have way too many things(that i ll probably never use)....still i think the overloud suite is very good sounding and i always thought is way better compared to things like bias....
All in all i truly believe my...purchasing plugins era is over....i prefer to collect great impulse responses these days than looking for the next best thing in the amp sim world...
It is possible to buy STL Tones plugins, fortunately they aren't just subscription based
Softube Amproom is another interesting option, have you tried it?
Helix native by far the most cpu friendly and the models relativelly accurate (based on some video). Still in ❤ with it.
Honestly I still like the universal audio Fuchs and Plexi ones, work for a laptop sound at least
Where is the DOGS??? I want to pet one thru my new monitor, the picture is unreal. Nice DEMO!!!
What about BIAS FX 2? Specially the new version that came out like a few hours ago?
Aye, a fair bit more 'Sparkle' to their new modelling. 👍
I'm impressed with it.
@@KozmykJ I haven't had the chance to get it yet (can't wait!) but based on what I heard the dif. was very noticeable. I also think that what you get for the price is pretty good, specially with the new features! (compare that to $99 USD for each Neural plugin, that sound great - but veeeery limited in anything extra) - my unimportant unsolicited opinion haha
Bias has more ready to go amp sound. But the effects somewhat innacurate compared to what helix does.
Add Blackdistorion plugin by plugin Alliance and you make Benson or Milkman good for rock tones.
That Schecter is just 👌👌
For a amazing price quality relationship you should try the AA Shibalba
Maybe the ML Soundlab stuff. I love the Plexi and 800. Mark V is decent too. Great prices. I don't think you mentioned it.
The cam is focusing your hands perfectly, lol. I guess this is manual focus set at the distance for recording the playing?
very 3 dimensional it was astounding. He needs to bring in one of the DOGS so we can see it looking so Good.
Do you still have scuffham presets available?
Is that Tele made by Baum? I can’t find it anywhere.
The tele is a Seth Baccus baritone Shoreline T!
Unpopular opinion....but the free Amped Roots Fluff plug-in is so nice if dialled in nicely.
Helix native is 💪 too.
That's not unpopular!! But yeh - I also love the Mikko 2.0 plugin for creating IRs!
I would also suggest ToneLib's GFX. They've currently extended their Spring half-off sale as well. Also, ReValver 4-recently acquired by the creators of Headrush pedals-is worth checking out as well, especially since they're advertising the release of ReValver 5 soon, and much of their stuff is super-affordable. I recently discussed it on my video here: th-cam.com/users/liveydaHwflcCpo
I agree with your statements about Helix Native, especially since Sweetwater frequently does deals where you can pick up Helix Native for free when you purchase a Helix/HX Stomp product. Definitely worth doing an updated vid on Helix Native, IMHO, BTW.
Hey I loved that intro, that ripped, man. Very bebop in places. Your jazz is showing.
helix Native must have correct input level set, it’s such a crucial part of the equation. -18db in.
Just a correction for your video. STL Tones doesn't HAVE to have a subscription though. I own my plugins from them outright.
That's good to know! Which ones do you dig?
I got denied access to the NAM facebook group. No idea why 😂
Make sure you scroll all the way through the request form. I missed a checkbox. Once I filled the whole form in I was accepted almost immediately.
Milkman awesome sounding, price is not awesome ! Amplitube 5 is a steal for the price on sale.
Polychrome DSP is the best on the market
Scuffham S-Gear 3 sounds so much better than literally everything else I've tried, it's just not even close. I've tried Tonex/Amplitube, Guitar Rig, Overloud...nothing comes close to Scuffham. My only problem with S-Gear 3 is that I seem to get even more noise in my signal than I do with some others. I'm trying to figure out my signal path because it's pretty darn noisy.
Mixwave>Neural DSP
overloud is best
Nural DSP plugins are overpriced… and I agree the subscription for plugins is dumb. An acceptable price for a good amp model is around $20.
Tube amps are for rich boomers. Neural DSP is for rich zoomers.
Free amp sims are for broke millennials.
NaLex (especially his Amplex multi-amp sim) and VTar (Vadim Taranov) deserve a mention as well.
Also, Lostin70s ToneDeluxe 2, Resonant DSP Swanky Amp, Arboreal STR-X and others.
Yeah I don't know it's going to be awfully hard to beat neural DSP especially when all their plugins include that transpose knob. That's worth the price of admission alone. Especially if you're doing all kinds of different tunings. Neural DSP is where it's at bro for me when I practice at home. I can leave my real rig at the rehearsal spot. And I didn't have to re-buy all my pedals to practice at home. Just buying a DigiTech drop pedal is more than buying any of the neural DSP plugins. Pick up a cheap midi foot pedal you're all good to go.
I'm looking and I don't see any transpose button on this plug-in I could be mistaken please let me know.
A whole chunk of their older plugins don't contain that transpose knob - I think only Petrucci, Rabea, Mesa and Morello plugins do.