RIBBON MICS for METAL GUITAR tones??
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 พ.ค. 2024
- Let's test 4 Ribbon Mics for Metal Rhythm Guitars!
Producer Kristian Kohle (Aborted, Electric Callboy, Powerwolf) compares four very different sounding ribbon mics with the industry standard, the SM57 through a badass sounding metal rig.
After visiting the @Ribbonmics headquarters in Pasadena Kristian went to Warren Huart's Spitfire Studios in LA to reamp some heavy guitars riffs! Come and join us!
Download the multitracks and watch the entire ribbon adventure for free:
➡️www.kohleaudiokult.com/course...
The links below might be affiliate links:
The microphones:
EU:➡️ thmn.to/thocf/ydeepkeb03
US:➡️tinyurl.com/2cxegba9
The Kreative Devices laptop
➡️ kreativedevices.com/allproduc...
The Guitar Amp:
➡️tinyurl.com/2yshd76w
The Bass Guitar Plugin:
➡️ bit.ly/3OUgyar
The Console:
➡️tinyurl.com/2yjo94a5
Wanna learn more about guitar tones, recording and mixing?
Check out Kristian's academy KOHLE AUDIO KULT:
➡️www.kohleaudiokult.com/
#ribbonmics #metalguitar #recordingguitar
00:00 Overview
01:58 The Reamping Signal Path
04:24 The Shoot-Out
05:27 Mic 1 (AEA N22)
07:22 Mic 2 (AEA R92)
10:04 Mic 3 (AEA R84)
11:52 Mic 4 (AEA KU5A)
14:15 Conclusion
15:44 The Mix
18:36 The Final Tone
23:40 Download the multitracks!
Which one is your favorite? Let me know!
I really enjoyed the KU5A
I really liked the KU5A, not on its own but blended with the 57.
Yeah man the 57+KU5A seems perfect!
R92!
R92 and the KU5A sounded best of the four to my ears
As a single mic, I liked the R92 most. The most impressive part was having Nolly on speed dial 😄
Great video as always! The fact that you were wearing the same shirt after you teleported back to Germany didn't go unnoticed
Looks like you noticed the really important parts of the video 🥳.
I was lucky to reach Nolly right away (with an 8 hour time shift) to be honest
I designed the R92 microphone working at AEA as an audio engineer 20 years ago. This is such a great comparison video, I want to try my personal prototype R92 on some metal guitars now.
Kreative Devices laptops are game changers for the masses.
some great tones there, well interchangeable. great vid.
The N22 with the 57 was my favorite.
The mix already sounds absolutely awesome. Great job recording!
Thanks! I’ll do the final mix soon
Very much enjoyed this and learned from it. Thank you.
You're very welcome!
I do believe the R84 manual states the proximity effect starts within 3 feet… so it’s designed to sound basically “flat” at 3 feet…. #FoodForThought”
Yes, That’s why they made those „thinner“ voiced models. I used the 84 as an interview mic latelyy Both speakers roughly a meter away from the mic. That was awesome.
They are all different and great, I can't choose.
Thanks Kris for your videos! You're my favourite engineer for metal/hardcore!
❤🤘
I have 2 laptops from Kreative Devices, I'm a fan for life.
Custom all the way!
Absolutely!
Signal Art makes the best Reamp boxes. Used to make a killer 251 clone too!
Great video! The more videos you do on ribbon mics, the more I really want to get one! They all sounded great in their own way.I really liked the sound of the KU5A on its own, but the mixed sound of the R92 and R84 was stellar.
Yeah, ribbons are inspiring.
I’m sure there will be more videos to suck you in even deeper, haha! 🤘❤️
@@KohleAudioKult Come to the dark side, we've got ribbon mics.
n22 is my fav, it sounds on point 👌
Hi Kristian, great video again. I'm big fan of ribbon microphones. I was lucky enough to get a Royer R121 when we were recording guitars. I mixed it with an Electro Voice Raven Blue mic and it sounded fantastic.
Thanks man!
Those are all nice mics. For some reason I don't use my 121s anymore. I never likek them on drums and I have found better ribbons (R92, M160) for guitars.
I have VERY limited experience with miking cabs, but I really liked the combination of a ribbon mic with an off-axis sm57. The ribbon takes away the sizzling and the harshness from the sm57 and add mass.
Regarding this video, I think they all work well mixed with the 57, not so much on their own. You made it work, but I’d just have added the 57 😂
Having a 57 around is always a good thing 😇
Really cool sounding mix at the end.
I wish at the beginning you had demoed the individual mics with the guitars from the recording session instead of some random Kohle riffing :)
This is a really beautiful ENGL! The Audient 4816 is cool too! Those Oversized Mesa cabs are great! I always used the 57+421, lately I've been trying the m160, never managed to make the 414 work, those mics are all very nice, I would definitely have a good use for all of them. I feel there is more IR's coming soon.
I appreciate the love for ribbon mics. I use a very cheap set of MXL r144s quite often.
The cheaper Chinese ribbons can sound nice. You just gotta be lucky to find a good one.
Glenn Fricker talked about this reamp box.
The Signal Art ReAmp and DI boxes are supposed to be some of the finest you can find (though they are impossible to buy new since they were only made in very limited numbers).
Btw, the R92 is probably the best mic I've ever heard for guitar cabs. It sounds so natural that you almost don't have to use EQ on the guitars recorded with it.
Yep, the 92 seems to be a real guitar cab sleeper.
I’m gonna include the Signal Arts into my reamping box shoot-out that I’ll be doing soon
i cant wait for that video. bben looking to upgrade my reamp box
My fave at the minute is a 160 on the center/cap edge blended with a 609 about an inch further out from the cap edge. -16ms on the 160 as its about 2 feet back compared to the 609 that is on the grill.
I like the R92 alone, but the KU5A was great blended with the 57. Both would be dope choices.
Wasn't surprised with your choice at the end at all, the r92 and r84 felt like the perfect pair after the first listen.
Ribbon mics are the best, I love them and always prefer them on guitars.
The R92 for me! It has kharacter and and adds what is needed for this black metal type of guitar sound: heaviness & krunch yet natural sounding. Thx for the video! A komparison between AEA and Royer one day would be interesting! LLTK!
Yeah, that could be interesting
What a beautiful snear😮
A bit disappointed you didn't put all the faders up! More is more!
Just download the files and you can crank it yourself 🤘🥳
@@KohleAudioKult 😁😁😁😁😁🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘
A little of the R84 for a little extra Beef, and more of the KU5A for what it did to the mids. That's my vote. Loved the drums ect back in Germany! 🤘🤘🤘
I'd love the KU5A on a bass cab when RAT is used.
This sounds amazing!! i guess i need some new toys ;)
We all do 😎😻
Excellent test Kristian
I'm a major ribbon lover 😍
Wes makes phenomenal mics, and he's a great guy.
The R92 to was the clear winner here. I'm not an SM57 fan; never have been. I love that you combined ribbon mics to get "the sound."
By all means, do more AEA tests.
Maybe in the future you can do more ribbon mic shootouts. The sE RNR1, the Shure KSM313, the Audio-Technica AT-4080 and AT4081, and the ubiquitous Beyerdynamic M 160 and M 130 are all beyond reproach. Perhaps you can test some Royers in the same way you tested the AEAs.
👏🏻Thank You 👏🏻
Thanks man!
I'm just diving into the AEA world right now. Quite a lot to discover there.
I also wanna hear those RNR1s. The Voodoos are great mics but very different from that classic ribbon tone.
I do have 121s as well but as I said in another comment, I hardly use them. Maybe just not the right voicing for my taste.
Believe it or not, I never used Royers. I did demo the Rode NTR once. Pretty dark. Cool looking though. Looks like something that can kill mosquitos. @@KohleAudioKult
Thanx for that video again, very intersting. I found the N22 great in complement of the 57, the r92 better in itself but as the 57 is very bright too I prefer the N22/sm57 combination. TheR84 to me will need EQ woirk on the low frequencies but may be great too in complement and I m not that much in the KU5A .
Can you please tell us what reamp box you use in your studio?
I'm using the classic Radial passive. But I will d a big reamping box shoot.out on this channel soon. I just need more time! Stay tuned.
@@KohleAudioKult Thanx for your answer. I'll be really interested in you making a reamp box comparison, be sure I'll stay tuned (as I am since a few years now)!
I heard good things about the Walrus Canvas Re-amp(which is quite cheap ) and I just watched some videos about the Signal Art one you're using which seems to be really quality work .
I thought the Radial passive was just a DI box which was not the same as reamp boxes, it seems I have to learn about the differences.
Thanx again.
Man I really love your videos since so many years, they're so really instructive!
I been experimenting since few months about reamping process, because I would like to make the new album of my band mostly at home, and so track DI's and after reamp them to my amp/Two Notes Captor and IR's.
What I found is that the signal from my guitar and the "reamp signal" is not the same, so my tracks not sound as good as I will have put my guitar directly into the amp.
1 - Generally to have the same signal, I need to boost signal of 3.7db before sending to my reamp box (JCR)
2 - The signal is not the same on the low frequencies (around 80hz) and the high frequencies, so the sound is also not the same as the guitar pluged into the amp.
I found this issues by doing some teste like plugin my guitar into the Hi-Z input of my interface (Motu Ultralite MK5) and I don't put any gain on it to not change the sound of the guitar, I record the guitar and I send the signal to the otuput to the reamp box and finally get back to the same input.
I don't found anyone on the youtube world trying all this test, maybe it would be cool if you can try this and maybe add your expertise/tricks and solutions to be the more accurate as possible to have a near to perfect signal to reamp :)
Cheers from France
I’m actually gonna do a big reamping shoot-out on the channel soon!
This sounds like something’s going wrong in your setup. Hard to tell what it is. Could be the DI or the reamp.
The fact that you have to adjust the level is normal though.
@@KohleAudioKult doin this « null test » by opposite the di signal and the reamped di signal by flipping the phase of one, is really relevant and I also make this test with 2 other boxes, a palmer dacapo and a standard di reversed. The jcr was the more accurate but it was not perfect. I also asked radial, they told me that this is a normal situation.
But finally for me, it’s a bit sad that is near impossible to get the exact same sound. But I will love to see your videos and your test.
@zerosadness But you did compensate for the additional latency caused by the DA/AD conversion before doing the null test, right?
If not, they’re never gonna null.
@@KohleAudioKult if you mean the latency of ms, yes for sure I always realign the reamped signal on my tests, normally I keeped my test so I can send you the files if you want hear them and understand the difference.
@zerosadness I don’t have the time to dive deeper into this. Sorry for that.
Last tip: Better do listening tests. Things should sound so close that you can’t tell the difference in tone. If you can, you’re doing something wrong somewhere.
16:40 What band is that? Sounds absolutely awesome. Would love to have your ears Kris. Keep the awesome work 🤘
That’s a solo project of the Long Distance Calling drummer. I’ll ask him to make a comment!
Thanks. The song will be out soon. I'll let you know here!
I'd love to know too! Man that song was awesome
Ribbons are my go to for all guitars since like 2006, way better than sm57 to my ears
Audient desk? How do you like it? Super compact and seems pretty amazing!
Yeah! Sounds badass and actually feels better than the small SSL.
I'm confused, I thought Warren sold off Spitfire Studios?
EDIT: Ok, the old Spitfire Studios had the big Neve. This looks like Warren's new studio with the new Audient console.
Yes, that’s the new Spitfire. A much better place if you ask me!
Can you make IRs with those mics?
With your favorite cabinets?
And pack them in a pack on your site?
That would be very great 👍🏻
I'll do that at some point for sure.
@@KohleAudioKult Thanks a lot! 🙌🏻👍🏻👌🏻✨
This song is making me want to go listen to Craft's "White Noise and Black Metal" album again. Also I want to go buy some ribbons
That's the spirit!
A mic like the R92 is exactly the kind of mic I'd use as my "base" mic---if all you had was one to use, it'd get you there. It has the meat plus the grind in the high-mids without all the extra in the top. You don't even need a 57 with that mic.
I fully agree. Well spoken! 🤘
I'd love to see a comparison between the KU5A and an M160. It seems like they'd take a similar role in recordings, but the AEA is about 2x more $. Would it sound 2x better as well?
Of course not. But that’s not how you compare mics. Is a U87 ten times better than a Rode?
It’s more about getting the sound you want.
Beyer and AEA both build great mics (hand-made in Germany / the US). I’d rather compare the M160 to the R92. They both kind of get the mids right for heavy guitar tones.
@@KohleAudioKult depends which Rode, maybe. 😅
You make a good point though.
I liked R92. Kristian, what can you tell about reamping box used in this session? Is it really good?
It did the job nicely!
Tbh I was happy to find any box to do the job over there.
I couldn’t do any comparisons. But there will be a big reamping box shoot-out on this channel soon 🎂
@@KohleAudioKult Cool!!! I've been waiting for a video like this. Hope you will tell about how to set signal levels properly. Starting from DI level in the DAW and so on to the amp. Thanx
🔥
Lotsa KD tools to be seen here
R92 is my favorite.
You’re making me want a R92 for my cabinets, but I don’t play heavy rock guitar. Just an overdrive tone.
So I am torn between the R92 and maybe the the KU5A.
For guitar cabs I’d go for a R92, no matter the gain. I’ve got shorter video coming up with the R92 probably next week. Stay tuned.
Sind die Mikros jetzt alle direkt vor dem Cab oder mit etwas Abstand?
Eine Frage dazu:
Wenn die Mikros direkt vor dem Lautsprecher sind, habe ich weniger Raum und wenn andere Instrumente spielen weniger/leiseres Übersprechen. Mein Eindruck beim rumprobieren zuhause war bisher aber das der Klang wie er im Raum ist besser aufgenommen wird, wenn die Mikros 30-50cm vom Lautsprecher entfernt stehen. Wo liegt da mein Denkfehler, da ich das bei dir und anderen Videos nie sehe. Mikros stehen immer direkt vor dem Lautsprecher.
Beste Grüße
Für diese High Gain Sounds ist es meistens an besten sehr nahe ran zu gehen.
In diesem Fall sind alle Mikros direkt dran.
Auch deshalb, damit es vergleichbarer ist.
Bei Bändchenmikrofonen kann es aber durchaus gut sein, ein paar Zentimeter zurückzugehen. Das reduziert den Bass.
The 57 by itself didn't sound bad, maybe a second 57 using Fredman technique would remove the fizz and that would probably be good enough.
The ribbon would be good to give some extra balls but I'm not even sure that would be needed in a mix.
One of my favorite combinations is a 57 with a Royer 121.
Edit
Great mix at the end, but its not a surprise, your mixes usually are.
Sure! A 57 always kinda woks.
I gotta say I'm quite impressed with the mids of the R92.
All those mics were great for blending but the 92 has something special on distorted guitars. Much better the my 121s that I never use. I'm gonna get one for sure.
F yes! good
That riff reminds me of the bands KHOLD and GEHENNA.
I think you’re heading into the right direction here 🤘
You're on the right way. Both bands have great records!
This fellow I know at a studio swears up and down by the Sennheiser MD441U supercardoid specifically for distorted guitars. Anyone else have experience with it?
I have the sE RNR1 , THE RUPERT NEVE RIBBON MIC ☺️☺️☺️
I still gotta check that one out. Beautiful looking mic. Have you tried it on a guitar cab?
@@KohleAudioKult that’s what I use it for, will be bringing it to Berlin for a live show with Big Jack’s Revenge on 31/03 & 30/04 if you have time come by….
Ribbons are awesome. For me the Beyer m160 has been a go to for many years. So much so that i can barely tolerate the sound of a 57 these days. 😂
The M160 is great. But check out the R92. It has a similar yet different way of getting the mids right for heavy guitars.
This has got me wondering if certain ribbon mic's will do a much better job of capturing the REAL tone and characteristics of different amplifiers that is usually lost when using something like a sm57. Opinions?
That might be true if you wanna capture the room tone
57 and R92 is tried and true.
So I’m not the first? 😩
What’s the band? Guitars sound a lot like Disbelief?
It’s a project by the Long Distance Calling drummer.
But we actually also just produced the upcoming Disbelief record here at the studio.
@@KohleAudioKult Always loved the first two albums and "Spreading the Rage" - very epic feel and great productions for the time. Looking much forward to the new record!
All meat, no potatoes. Now you just need tubes and tape for the silk.
just buy a guitar link cable or a usb to guitar cable to record guitar its better quality and its a more affordable home recording setup for recording guitar on your pc or mac
Is there more benefits to using the KK Softube amp rather than the Lemmy one for bass?
It’s a different tone. I would only use the KK as an additional high gain track like In do It here whereas the Lemmy could be the main track.
Haven’t you watched my video about the Lemmy amp plugin?
Moment
Ist de Hölle eingefroren?
Ich sehe da einen Engl Amp aufm Tisch!
Kristian, alles in Ordnung bei dir, oder bin ich im Paralleluniversum gelandet? 😅
Und... .warum ist der erste Kommentar nicht von Warren? Aber back to the topic: Kristian, hast Du mal den Inferno (Marty Friedmann signature) oder den dingsbums signature von... verdammt, warum kommt mir immer Bier dazwischen, wenn ich schlau klingen will.... der amp von dem Typen von den Dixie dreggs ausprobiert? Der mit den vielen Mitten?
Engl war für mich immer ZUUUUU tight, zu klinisch, zu wenig schmatzend. Vielleicht am ehesten der Smolski signature, aber ich würde immer eher einen Driftwood oder einen Dual rectifier vorziehen. Aber aus mir spricht auch das Bier.
Ich hab doch gar nix gegen Engl. Benutze meinen Savage andauernd.
Bin nur überhaupt kein Fan der ersten Fire- und Powerball Generation. Vielleicht hast du das in Erinnerung.
Der Artist 100 hier ist richtig gut. Den benutze ich schon zum zweiten Mal. Ansonsten bin ich auch ein großer Savage Fan. Aber manche Engl Amps können auch fizzy sein. Da gebe ich dir recht.
@@KohleAudioKult...Steve Morse war der Typ von den Dixie Dregs. Guter Mann. Ob es sein Amp kann oder nicht liegt wohl wie immer im Auge des Betrachters...
Die beiden Amps hab ich noch nicht probiert. Geile Gitarristen aber alle beide.
More mics - less difference)
Man I just can’t get behind these on guitars. All that grind and sizzle and aggression is what makes a 57 great in a mix, but you already know this. In a world full of dark, safe, soft, and generally bloated productions in modern metal already today, the last thing we need is a ribbon mic on guitars.
What people in modern metal do is getting aggressive guitar tones just to Soothe them to death again.
I’m looking for something else. Check out the final guitar tone in the end of the video. That’s what I’m gonna use for the song. And it sounds warm and fat!
Watch out; gramps has opinions and he wants to make sure other people know about them (for some reason).
@@KohleAudioKult uh oh, not those subjective terms again.
What's the name of the band that recorded the multitrack session? Sounds epic af!
It’s a project of the @longdistancecalling Drummer Janosch.
Thanks. Not sure about the name yet, but I'll let you know here!
That was a killer video, thank you. I always blend a 57 and Beyerdynamic M160 on guitar, love it.
The 160 is a great mic too!