Why flats are safer for me (and maybe you?)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- #keeppedaling #rideshimano #clipsvsflats
Flat (platform) pedals versus clipless (clip) pedals are a crazy hot button topic in mountain biking. Recently, I’ve switched over to riding exclusively flat pedals. A bunch of you have asked why, so we’ll get into it in this video!
FYI, I am sponsored by Shimano and Jenson USA.
I LOVE my Shimano GR9 flat pedal shoes. They use a simple drawstring system to pull tight, which feels like laces but doesn’t loosen up. The drawstring is covered by a leather flap that velcros into place. They are easy to put on, comfortable to wear as even every day shoes, and the Michelin rubber is plenty sticky for good pedals.
bit.ly/ShimanoG...
I also have a set of Freerider shoes from FiveTen, and have also used their Impact high top shoes. The soles of the FiveTen products are VERY soft and tacky. This can be great, but it can also be challenging. They can be so sticky that it’s hard to reposition your foot when it gets bumped out of place, which is something that still happens even with the mega gripy pedal/shoe combo.
bit.ly/FiveTenS...
For pedals, I often use my Shimano XT M8040 pedals, though they were recently discontinued by Shimano. The GR500 pedals are similar, and a much lower price point.
bit.ly/Shimano...
I also use a sec of Chromag Scarab pedals, and like them quite a lot. I bought them from Chromag, and really enjoy the wide platform and thin overall height. They are not as grippy as my Anvl Tilt pedals, but they bearings have been SOLID (better than Anvl) and their sizes makes them really comfortable. Currently these are my favorite pedals.
bit.ly/Chromag...
I often ride with some OneUp composite pedals. Rather than the concave shape I normally prefer, these are convex. The grip has impressed me, they aren’t heavy, and the bearings have lasted just fine. I like them, but I do prefer the concave shaped pedals more.
bit.ly/OneUpCom...
I am currently requesting some Shimano Saint pedals from Shimano USA, these look fantastic and I’m excited to try them!
bit.ly/Shimano...
Another really popular pedal is the Kona WahWah. With one of the largest sizes currently available, they are also very thin, so in theory, they should be grippy, comfortable, and very efficient. I plan to buy a pair to try later this spring.
bit.ly/KonaWahW...
I’ve had a set of Spank pedals for years, and really like them. The bearings have seized up, and the shape is a tad more open than others, so they aren’t the most comfortable, but the grip is good. Currently I have these on my Trials bikes, and wouldn’t hesitate to recommend them.
bit.ly/SpankOoz...
Years ago I rode some now discontinued E13 pedals, and they were VERY comfortable! Then I found a pair of RaceFace Atlas pedals, and WOW, they were even better. Very good sized platform, and the pins seemed a tad thinner than others, which gave them good ability to penetrate the shoe’s rubber. These lasted me for years, and I actually gave them to my mom, who still rides them to this day:
bit.ly/RaceFace...
JKW Koozies available now! shopjkw.com/co...
PODCAST: podcasts.apple...
Check out the new Ibis Ripmo AF here at Jenson USA: bit.ly/RipmoV2...
Join my email newsletter/riding tips/new content digest: eepurl.com/gbSvF9
Big thanks to these guys for making this all possible! Any purchases from these links will directly help support my channel as well:
Jenson USA: bit.ly/JensonU...
Industry Nine: bit.ly/Industr...
PNW Components: bit.ly/PNWComp...
Shimano: bit.ly/Shimano...
Kitsbow Cycling Apparel: bit.ly/KitsbowJKW
Kali Protectives: bit.ly/KaliJKW
Wilderness Trail Bikes (WTB): bit.ly/WTBlocaloam
Ibis Cycles: bit.ly/IbisJKW
Trust Performance: bit.ly/TrustMes...
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Check out my riding tutorials: / jeffkendallweed
www.jeffkendallweed.com
/ jeffkendallweed
/ jeffkendallweedmtb
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Can't afford kids with how expensive all my mtb stuff is....
🤣
LOL!!!
Had to settle for a premium hardtail lol. Got 4 kids but still manage to xc and downhill. Then there's snowboarding shit im always broke lol
Sounds like a win win
Lmao!! True!!
There is only ONE!! “Best/right” pedal, and that is....... The one you feel comfortable with 😉
This Jenson definitely agrees with the above Jensen!
Glad you mentioned that speed is not everything when it comes to riding. Going a bit slower and working on skill is in my opinion more fun.
I've been riding clipless since 1993 (mountain biking since '89), so I'm very comfortable with riding clipless, and can never really blame any crashes on them. For me, a good ride is where I can make the entire trail flow continuously at a nice pace, not a race pace, but fast. I've ridden flats and I just can't achieve the same level of quick acceleration as I can with clipless, and since my local trails have you climbing as much as you descend, the clipless win out for my riding style. I know a lot of people feel more comfortable jumping with flats, but that's not the case for me as I feel like I have plenty of float with my pedals to allow me to turn my feet and ankles enough when flicking the bike around. It really is a to each his own type of thing, but don't knock one until you've tried them both.
Steven Cole I agree Steven, well said
Everyone forgot to tell Sam Hill you can’t go as fast on flats
Haha fucking People who barely have control withouth clips
It's a ridiculous statement,
Yet every other top racers got the memo
@@Lukas-iq3cv i always see people in forums and comments that say 'i couldn't possibly go offroad with flats. clips are just so much better' and all i think is 'just go get some skills already!'
I was born in 60's & rode old flats all through my childhood. Later, learned to ride toe clips & straps in the 80's. I tried clipless in the 2000's for a summer. I crashed every time I rode. I gave those pedals & shoes to my nephew and switched to flats. Been happy on flats for years!
I switched to flats because it is just more fun for me and I feel like I've learned much better jumping technique.
With flats, I'm not scared to try really technical sections, skinnies, etc because I know I can bail, vs. having a split second delay with clips (or getting completely caught and just tipping over).
I'd say like you, I'm slightly slower overall with flats but happier. I definitely feel like I've gotten hurt less!
Max Krieger I am only 14 and I recently switched to clips, I ride my enduro bike like a down hill bike and a dirt jumper . I can get super technical on things and still send jumps At the bike park. I found that my jumping skills and ability to control the bike in the air improved, maybe give clips another try?
You just listed everything that I wrestle with when it comes to flats and clipless. I've stuck with clipless but don't want to feel as limited on techy and skinny trails due to the fear and likely reality of a tip over.
Yea, I feel similar!
When I ride with my buddies of which most are slower than me, if I lead in a trail, I always switch in race mode. At the end of each trail I am exhausted and can't remember any features after.
If I ride behind someone slower, I play alot more and enjoy the ride much more!
So slowing down is often really good, because you have more fun with less risk of hurting yourself.
Great video!!!
Thank you for the detailed description for both options.
Clipless for 12 years. I switched to flats 3 years ago and my riding has improved dramatically and I've had much more fun.
I actually started out with clipless pedals but switched to flat after realising that I got stuck in my skill developments. It took me at at least 6 months to get really comfortable and yes, I too don't ride as fast as in the past BUT flats have totally upgraded my skill levels!
Having ridden clips for over 15 years, I finally switched to flats 6 months ago after I broke my ankle. Front tire washed out and swept the bike from underneath me and twisting my foot. Loving the flats now. I feel I’m a better rider due to better body positioning, more commitment when cornering and just generally more confidence. Also I am bunny hopping properly and not cheating. The only thing I’m still struggling with is initial foot positioning, which is not yet intuitive and I have to look down to make sure my feet are in the right spot.
I’m teaching my daughter to ride mtb, she is learning in flat. I rode for 20 years with clipless. Two years ago I switched to flat to learn proper technique for basic tricks like manual and jumps. Like the quick bail out capability. Also like the pickup after a corner if I had to pull a leg out ready to dab. Like flats so far. Took me about a year to get back to speed I used too ride
I literally just put a set of old Shimano 636 pedals on my bike and they work awesome. Clips with big platforms are amazing
Both of my son's ride flats and they like them simply due to the fact they feel they can get off the bike quicker in a sketchy situation. I personally ride clipless and have done for 20 years, it just suits my riding style. So I will let my kids ride whatever they feel best on...flats or clipless it doesn't matter to me just as long as they keep riding!!
I use flats only. Took that Seattle to Vancouver trip in 2016 with my wife. Also an overnighter. Fun time in a great city.
Mike from Texas
With flats I’m getting bucked on rock gardens and techie up hills are the negatives. With clipless my gluts and hamstrings engage for a fuller leg muscle engagement, they also eliminate the chatter while turning in bumpy XC. I’ve learned to pop out of clipless and the only time I have a problem is when I’m tired riding uphill tech so on balance I ride clipless but do occasionally enjoy the freedom of flats.
Hi Jeff. Great video! I started on flats and rode them for a couple of years until I stick of slipping off and getting cut while doing tech climbs. I then switched to clip-less for two years and loved them. It was really nice having the bike attached to your feet. It gave me a lot of confidence riding chunk but I did hit the ground a lot more stalling on tech climbs. I then started riding trials and switched back to flats so I could play around more without dying. At first the switch back to flats made the tech climbs a bit harder but now I feel I can do the same things on flats. I guess I've gotten better at riding flats and I really don't slip off anymore (at least on the mountain bike). I don't have any plans to go back to clip-less. Cheers!
This can actually be a very complex question. As an athlete/coach/dad I’ve learned a few things through my experiences. First, you have to know where your child is developmentally and scaffold your approach to skill development to get them where you they need to be. I started my son out early on a balance bike, which gave him the freedom to move unrestricted. This gave him confidence and strengthened the way he rode from a neurological point of view. Next, at the age of 3, I transitioned him to flat pedals. Within 5 minutes, he was riding independently and safely. He is 4 now and rides at McDowell mountain at sections of the Competitive Loop & Pemberton Trail and at Usery Mountain. Next, will be carefully selected sections of Hawes. His feet rarely come off his flats b/c that’s how he is wired. When he is developmentally ready I will introduce clips to him and let him make the decision.
I got back into mountain biking 5 years ago from a long break. I jumped right into clipless pedals as that was what all my buddies were riding and encouraging. Looking back I wish that I started with flats. I believe it would have promoted better technique and eliminate some of the bad habits I've picked up ie. Poor bunny hops and lifting the bike in general. That said, I'm still having a ton of fun and can see some benefits of control with the clipless setup. Thanks for all that you do with your channel. It truly inspires me to ride better🙏
My take is that many riders are peer pressured into clips before they’re truly comfortable on a bike. So when they do try platforms again years later, they don’t have the skills for an equal comparison. They don’t want to go back to learning again so they stay with what they know, not necessarily the pedals they would prefer if skilled with both.
Wow - rare to find an opinion piece on flats vs clips that I'm 1000% in agreement with. TY for this - we are on the exact same page. I'm having way more fun on flat pedals when riding my trail bike than I ever did clipped in...but I've always been the one wanting interesting lines and ignoring Strava. Having said that, I don't think my shoulders have found either system more safe...lol
5 10s and Pedal Innovations have been a good combo for me! I did have my worst crash with this set up due to a pedal strike which resulted in a otb crash. I still ride PI flats and love them.
Great video as always, Jeff.....thanks!
I'm 73, came from a clipped-in road background, and started MTB'ing about 6 years ago (currently help coach a local NICA high school team). I initially went w/clips on the MTB; but after several "tumbles" still hooked to the bike, thought I'd try flats. I don't race per se, so speed is not an issue with me. Fun on the bike, quick access to riding it, and the ability to try challenging (for me) trails with no worry about getting away from the bike have me still on flats and loving them.
What I did find was: (1) I was much more capable on the flats with a more mid-foot foot position ... that allows me to lower my heels more easily and stay "planted" on the pedals; and (2) my overall riding/jumping technique became better using the flats because they don't allow you to lift the bike like being clipped in. That took some time though.
I always wear knee/shin protection, but have had very few trashed shins from the flats.
As with any new endeavor, there's a learning curve and patience-testing transition. But, for me, flats are great for my riding and trails.
PS: Currently use Five Ten Freeriders and OneUp composite pedals. Will be looking at the Shimano GR9's.
I have 3 daughters (15,12,and 9) all learned to ride on flats. I also coach a local NICA team. I always recommend our beginner and less skilled riders learn on flats. Easier to learn better technique on flats. That said I have been mainly running clips for 20+ years. My 15 year old switch to clip by her choice to help with XC racing but will be the first to say it has helped her most in the rough steep stuff! We both still put flats on when working on skills and when we go to clinics. Just so we learn the proper techniques first!
I switched to flats last year after riding clipped in for 25 years. I did it because I realized that riding clipped in was turning me into a wimp (even though I generally have no trouble clipping out when I really need to). Riding flats has allowed me to clear a few mental blocks. No regrets!
I haven't tried clipless yet. I'm told you can exert more pedaling force due to being able to yank your pedal up with one leg while you push down with the other. The other thing I've heard is that it's good for bunny hops because you can yank the bike up to you by the pedals.
Best flat vs clip vid on TH-cam.
I've only been riding mountain bikes for about 3 years. I learned on flats, really bad full plastic (even the pins) flats with vans. I moved to better pedals ($20 amazon plastic pedals but with real pins) and real mountain bike shoes (found a pair of Teva flats shoes on the discount rack for $20!) and that made a HUGE difference. So for my first year and a half I was learning good flat pedal technique and loved to take my foot our for corners. I went too hard on the foot out flat out and within a week I had gouged the back of my calf open (enough to get stitches) twice! I had heard all these great things about clipless and figured it would help me keep my feet on the pedals in the corners and thus keep me from gouging open my calf. I then fell in love with clipless, for all the reasons you said in your video (except I wasn't winning any races) and pretty much abandoned flats. This summer my good clipless shoes wore out (the rubber that the pins on my Mallet E's dug into was gone and gave the feeling of riding on ice, slippin in and out of the clips) and I didn't have the cash to get a new pair. I also wanted to work on my trails and jibbing skills as well as fix my poor foot technique that I had learned using clipless. So I went back to flats toward the end of this summer and rediscovered just having fun on the bike! With clipless I was always trying to go race pace and just smash, but with flats I couldn't sprint up short climbs and couldn't ride as fast through rough terrain and just learned to hit weird slow but fun lines. It also forced me to learn how to really brake and corner, I couldnt just compensate with a mad sprint out of a corner for my bad speed conservation skills. That being said I plan on going back to clipless this spring and get back to race pace for the next season.
After hearing your pedal journey I thought mine had some (minor) parallels and figured I'd share.
Love your videos and aways learn a lot. You have an absolute killer style on the bike as well! Thanks for putting out the content! Keep it up!
i went to flats, haven't had knee pain since.. also riding a big heavy full squish bike, eliminated the wrist pain. stoked!
Just got my boy onto his first pedal bike and he will definitely be on flats for the foreseeable future. I'm with you on the slightly less grippy pedal feel, I run the Specialized 2FO 2.0 flat pedals shoes and yes, my feet shift around, but it's easy to get them back in the right spot even while plowing through chunky, high speed, gnar. The only time I blow a pedal is when I'm already going down, fortunately slipping a foot has never caused a crash for me.
I started with flats, then pedals with integrated toe cage in the mid 1990s, and didn't switch to clipping in until 2007 due to peer pressure. I ended up feeling quite confident with clipless, and like you mentioned on your video, I think I've got to ride a bit faster through rough terrain. However, I felt like I was not being as playful with my bike, always thinking about being ready to unclip in needed. I finally switched to flats almost two years ago, and I'm having lots of fun again, trying more sketchy lines and practicing more wheelies on the trails than ever before. I'm not in need of speed, but love trying techy stuff. I'm staying with flats! Sorry for the long comment.
I think the answer I'd give is Mallet DH. Why not just have the best of both worlds? I'm considering clipless for my Chameleon for the power delivery for climbing and I've slipped pedals at the dumbest times with MASSIVE hits to my shins. Running my shin down a pedal like a cheese grater isn't fun. Should have worn my MTB shoes that day instead of hiking shoes that don't have flat bottoms.
Fellow Man biker and MX'r here Jeff. I ride flats, also grip bike with my ankles and legs as I do during MX. Wearing high top man bike shoes helps cushion ankles. Clipless is great for ling sustained climbs as it allows pulling up an better power is about all I think they'r better for IMO. Better technique developed using flats overall. Nice video.
I think those who grew up from BMX (which mostly have flats here in PH) will always prefer flat Padals as they move to MTB much later on. Nice Video. Ride safe!
My son wanted clipless pedals since he saw me with them so he got them at 8. But then started riding park and jumping so we both switched to flats to jump better. Now it's clips for trail and flats for DH park
Last year I changed back to flats, slowly figuring out on my own what you said in this video, heel position is super important. Thanks for the insight!
Ride whatever puts the biggest smile on your face. Not only pedals, but brakes, seat, handlebars, wheel size, gearing etc. Use whatever makes you eager to do another lap.
I currently use Crank Brothers Mallets...... The pins are adjusted such a way I can easily unclip off. My son Ride to, he is 13 years old and been riding since age 10. He ride flats, I encouraged him to start off with flats, and left the option for him to switch over to clipless, if he chooses to do so.
Those are great pedals for learning to ride clipless, that's how I learned.
I’ve been riding for about 2 years and have only ridden flats, I have both a hard tail and a full suspension. I found myself bouncing around in situations on the hard tail that the full suspension would absorb and realized I needed to put my heels down on the hard tail. I’m nowhere near as good a rider as you but it’s good to know the technique carries over to a full suspension as I progress
I like to be able too bail when i have to!! I have seen to many bad wipe outs due to being clipped in..!
I prefer clipless pedals on my e-mtb.
1. The pedals are always in the correct position under the feet - this reduces injuries, improves comfort and improves pedal efficiency.
2. It allows you to pull on the upstroke originating more power when needed.
3. You don’t scrape your chins.
4. The bike moves with you when you jump.
I have let my kids decide what they want to ride with, flats or clips. I initially started them out with flats while they were learning.. I have two boys that ride flats and one that rides clips.
I agree with your wanting to be able to adjust feet on pedal. I have Shimano shoes with the Michelin rubber too. I even took an Allen wrench and adjust spikes on pedals to be shorter because of the reason you mentioned.
I started riding clips as a teenager and after 20+ years I switched to flats a couple years back, mainly due to a knee injury. I find flats so much better in so many situations and they've made me a better rider. Like you, my speed isn't where it used to be, but I ride for fun now. Btw, my 3 kids all ride flats too. We all have some variation of the CB stamp pedals. I can also relate to your comment about the freeriders and not being able to re-position the feet easily...
I can't say anything about clipless, because I've always ridden flats. For anyone interested, I can relay my experiences with what I've found to be "best practices" for riding flats with the best chance to have your feet stay on the pedals. The shoe and pedal combination does matter in terms of how well the shoes grip the pedals, which absolutely affects how well your feet stay on them.
I prefer Five Tens for the grip, and I've gotten used to moving my feet around on them. I've tried multiple brands of pedals, and I've landed on a concave one that's pretty simple and doesn't cost a ton. It's the Spank Spoon, size M. That's after having Loaded Precision, HT, RaceFace, Canfield, Spank Oozy, and probably some I can't recall, and for me...the Spank Spoons are better than all of the ones mentioned.
I THINK THE RIGHT SIZE PEDAL IS A HUGE DEAL. I see riders with HUGE pedals, and I don't get that AT ALL. It defies physics to have a pedal that is so big that your shoe doesn't cover EVERY pin on the pedal, with a little fudge factor room on both sides. I see riders all the time with pedals that are TOO big, and all of the pins aren't even covered!
I'm also a believer in making sure you have pins that are nice and crisp and not worn down....replace them often. I REALLY believe the concave shape helps a lot too, because your foot sits "in" the pedal a bit, rather than just on top of the pins. The Spoons have no pins in the middle, creating a really nice concave shape.
Two of my worst crashes were from pedal strikes that happened seemingly out of nowhere, at high speed. On both of those, I was ejected over the bars instantly, with only enough time to react in mid air, and do my best to tuck and roll. In both of those crashes, I wonder if the bike would have followed me if I was clipped in, and if it did follow me...it would have made things MUCH worse.
What I’ve tried to learn from day 1 is how to pump with my heels dropped. I’m 5’6” and I’ve never felt that I had a height issue.
Man if I could ride 1/2 as good with either clip less or flats I would be stoked lol. Great video thanks for your expert input.
I’m 51 and grew up on flats riding bmx, but have tried clips a couple times. I like clips on mellow trails sometimes, but I mainly like steep freeride stuff now, so flats are what I have the most fun on.
I rode flats the 1st 2 years and then switched to spuds, had been riding spuds for 24 years and then switched to flats back again which I have been using the last 4 years again. No intention on switching to spuds anymore. Enjoy riding flats way more because of the freedom and versatility.
I switched to flats 3 years ago after 20+ on shimano clipless pedals. I thought a “real” rider rode big boy pedals! Went with Five Ten Freeriders and Chester pedals so I could work on jumps and more aggressive riding. LOVED the freedom and the 5-10s stick almost as well as my SPDs. I’ll never go back!
I enjoy the 'contact' that I get from flats. Because my feet CAN rattle off the pedals, I peel my eyes over every feature that I point the Minions at...
I'm not the best rider. Not by a mile, however, I derive a whole lot of pleasure from successfully reading the trail... and keeping my feet planted.
8:00 Thats why agressive hardtails are so fun! Of course a FS would handle the obstacle better, but with the HT you got more of a challenge to master! And thats what MTB is all about for me: mastering challenges!
I'm still hardtail, not many people can keep up downhill, even on FS bikes with 130mm travel plus, it's all about line choice and your legs are the suspension, I do find if I borrow a friend's FS bike I can go so bloody fast it's stupid, so there is that...
I ended up with flats after riding clipless for 20 plus years. I got a new bike about 5 years ago and the crank/pedal/shoe combo would not allow me to unclip. My shoe was hitting against the crank arm before I could unclip from the pedals. So I bought a pair of flats and some five tens thinking it would be temporary until I figured out the issue with unclipping on my current setup. I ended up feeling more comfortable on flats even though I had to re learn how to jump and not rely on "pulling" up. I still feel like I was a bit faster through steep chunky sections of trail because I feel like I could focus on just staying light on my bike vs. putting my heels down and weighting the bike down. As far as teaching my kids, I have taught them all to ride with flats. Of 4 kids my oldest is 15 and youngest is 4 so flats are the way to go right now. Unless any of them start racing or have a desire to try clipless they will most likely just keep riding flats.
Been riding flats for years and have no issues with my feet coming off on rough rocky descents. I think that really comes down to form and I am sure you are used to relying on being clipped in. Most of the guys I ride with run clips and where I think they have the advantage on me is technical climbing. When I my heart rate is at 180 and I am trying desperately to keep a spin going to clean techy climb is when I have a foot slip off a pedal.
Yes, if you keep your heels down, the feet are glued to the pedal, but while pedalling, of course, you cant keep them down!
When pedalling, you have to push your heels down too when you reach the power part of the stroke. This not only prevents your foot from slipping, but improves your pedalling technique and strenghtens your quads.
I clipped in for 20+ years for most of my riding. Rode flats on the DJ and DH bikes for 5-6 years. As XC trails and flow trails as well as bikes have evolved to offer more git'n rad i've moved to flats for all off-road riding. I find I ride with more bike control jumping and cornering much better with flats because i'm forced to ride with good form. As soon as I clip in I start to depend of the pedal to keep contact.
Going head over heels while glued to a set of F-ing shimano SPD’s, $80,000 in shoulder reconstructive surgery, and I never used or would use clip-in’s again.
Ken Munoz lucky I have the NHS in Britain. Completely free healthcare
Calum Caldwell
👍🏽
@@calumcaldwell1884 yea bc being laid up in a hospital dealing with pain meds and never moving the same way again is fine it's only the bill to worry about.
@@pyramidion5911 Oh yeah, it's never nice to have to go to hospital. It's somewhat reassuring though that in Britian and in Europe you won't end up with crippling debts to go with your crippled body.
@@calumcaldwell1884 The NHS is not free. I'm sure even you know that.
Flats drool & “clipless” rule!
That said I introduce many to cycling and do show them both options for them to choose... so far it’s about half & half with the more awkward/less confident ones leaning towards flats.
For me, it’s more work and less control using flats.
Just switched to clipless after riding flats my whole life, I just love the foot placement consistency, I'm using shimano saints with multi directional release clip, I ride them like a flat and have had zero issues getting out...oh and tought my kids on flats..
Jeff, very insightful video. I've also switched back and forth between spd/flats over the years, and the points you touched are EXACTLY the pros/cons i relate to (an added one would be the more consistent foot placement on spd's). It all sounds trivial but most of those points dont usually get mentioned in this debate, i guess because so few people actually try both types for long enough. It always sounds like "but, Sam Hill!", Or "clips are just more efficient"...
Used to love riding clipped in but a few years ago, I ended up with a tear in the cartilage of my knee. My Physiotherapist recommended flats and as it was that or not ride as much, I now find myself on flats full time. Rough climbs (especially on my hardtail) make me miss my SPDs but on the whole, am happy with flats (OneUp alloy & composite). My youngest daughter has decided she wants to start riding - she'll be starting on flats as I do think it's easier to bail! :)
Both. I use flats on my FS bike and have for years and years. Recently switched to clips on my gravel and hard tail. I like how much less locked in my knees are with clips. The float helps a done. I am much more confident with sketchy shit on flats though.
Perfect timing I just started researching going to clips!
I rode freestyle bmx for over 20 years. When I got into MTB I was on flats for 2-3 years but when my rides got longer I went to clips. I can confidently say that for myself I’m faster on flats, like 3-4 seconds on the same sections. I think it has to do with my body position when I drop my heels to lock in. When your heels are dropped you naturally have to move your hips back and it makes it easier to anticipate impacts and it allows the suspension to do its job more effectively. Might sound crazy, but it’s just my opinion.
Good stuff Jeff. I've only ever ridden flats and clips actually scare me. The thought of being stuck to my bike makes me feel nervous. But then again, that's most likely due to not putting the time into adapting to them.
I'm doing the same thing for different reasons. I've been riding clipped in forever. Started it as a roadie so it's second nature to me to clip in and out. I switched to flats to force myself to use proper technique for skills. I've been riding flats now for a year. You definitely have to focus on your foot/heel position with flats. I've also experienced the same issue with getting bucked on technical rock gardens or going down stairs of death (Sam).
I'm thinking of going back to clipless. I get that flats make your a better rider, but in the long run, I can't get better if I break something from being thrown off the bike. Some people riding flats don't have these issues or don't know any better because they've never ridden clipped in. More power to them. As for me, I'll still be on flats for a little while longer in order to work out some of my issues with flats. Once done, however, I'm definitely going back to clipless.
as for the question though, my girl gonna learn on flats.
Not for reasons of safety though.
I think the requisite skills should always be learnt on flats as once learnt on flats, never forgotten.
After years riding clipless, in the beginning of 2019 I switched to flats. I will never go back! I love flats! I ride the OneUp composites with Ride Concept shoes. You should try Ride Concepts, they are some of the best shoes I have ever worn! My 16 year old son rides with Chesters and Ride Concept shoes
I don't have kids, but I ride flats. I rode spd's since the 90's. With my RA, I can't move my ankles as well. So, I'm on flats now.
I did the complete opposite. Rode flats my first week mountain biking, then clipless for 8 years. Changed to flats last winter with proper shoes, and found no detriment in control or connection to the bike. Actually felt more connected to the pedals without the cleat float. Bonus confidence to try wheelies. I "feel" I ride faster because i am more comfortable and know I can throw a foot out without the anxiety of trying to clip back in. Can't really say whether I am faster, but definitely more comfortable at high speed. The only times i miss clipless are in the rockiest of east coast rock gardens during an enduro stage.
Everyone should be able to ride both. There's a time and a place for each. If you have to choose, choose the best for how/where you ride. Happy Trails shredder 🤘 🚲
Interesting thoughts for switching over. I could definately see trials features on flats being much more troublesome....as much as using your body to do a bunny hop is the 'right' thing, being able to just lift your back and save yourself the energy wasted in hauling the body around could be the key to a particular set of features
I run expedo dual pedals. Flat on one side with studs, clips on the other for efficient climbs . Little confusion at first but I'm starting to love them.
I work for a shop and unless the customer wants clips then I usually recommend good set of flat pedals. It’s more convenient and safer to get started with
It's funny because you made all of the points I was going to make. I was going to say, "Just drop your heels, man!" and "If you're not trying to shave off 0.02 seconds out of the start gate, than clips aren't that important" I did clips for 10 years, now flats for 6. There are aspects I like about both, but ultimately, I'm more comfortable and have more confidence on flats. 👍
Their are pros and cons for each type. I personally ride with PDX flat. For kids learning how to ride, flat is more convenient. Happy riding :)
I started riding in 1988 with flats & double straps! Thank goodness we've moved on since then! 91-2005 clipless. Then from 2006 to present flats! I prefer flats as it forces me to focus on what the bike is doing under me which in turn has made my riding style a lot smoother! Maybe not as fast as clips, but I'd rather focus on skill and being smooth and controlled vs outright speed! I'm teaching my daughter on flats which raises her confidence without the need to have to worry about getting stuck on her pedals. Flats help reduce anxiety in challenging riding situations for kids 🤘
Kids are learning (and racing) in flats, the question is when (what age and skill level) to switch to clips? At the move to Cat II or Cat I ? This was a great video. I thought the pedal thing might have been played out, but this is so well reasoned and fresh!
I still can't decide, I rode flats again for a month, and crashed twice clipping a pin on rocks, I'm just really used to the clearance advantage of the spd (the small one with no platform), and don't pay enough attention to the clearance needed for flats.. I still DH on flats though.
Love your channel!
I was flats only for about 2 years, but now ive switched and I feel safer on the steep tech stuff than i did before
clips all day :) m8020 and there dialed just like your setup.. so perfect.
I have a few climbs which I can clean clipped in, but cannot in flats. Clips give me another 10-15% more power on the steep/tech climbs, and on those it's the difference. I switched to flats this past year, and like them. I run Shimano GR9s, Five Ten Freerider Pros, with OneUp composite pedals.
I also like the mid-foot location of the pedal, I have noticed it recruits more hamstring/glute in pedaling, AND less leverage on the calf. I used to cramp my calfs on long rides when clipless, now it doesn't happen at all.
Went flats for a few years during my knee surgery time. My physio wouldn't let me ride clips and it massively improved my bike control skills.... For when I went back to clips. I can ride both but prefer clips for climbing and control. I have flats on my fat bike (we get winter here), DJ and urban bikes. Like you I'm getting older and slowing down now though so time will tell.
When I was 14 I had an aluminum trek y-frame with clipless pedals. I was doing a wheelie and looped out but for some reason, my left pedal didn’t release. The bike fell to the left twisting my leg. When I stood up, I looked down and my foot was pointing 45 degrees to the left despite my thigh and knee being straight.
I ultimately ended up with a spiral fracture in both the tibia and fibula and had a cast for a couple months.
Certainly understand it was a fluke thing...just won’t find me using them. Be safe out there!
One side benefit of riding clipless is realising that you don't need to dab in slow speed technical sections. Getting clipped in again in very technical sections can be tough so you just keep going, that's definitely improved my skills. Also not taking your foot off loose unsupported corners makes you realise how much more grip your bike has. The main reason I ride clipless is the feeling of the bike being connected to me.
Hello. My wife, two kids and I ride both. Thanks for the great content Jeff 🚵♂️😁
Flats for both my son and me. Spent most of my life riding horses, so the heels down is pretty automatic for me. I don't like the idea of being stuck. I prefer to feel free to bail on my terms when needed, another essential equestrian skill. We've only been riding a few years so, we don't want to cheat ourselves out of learning good form. It's been a process of finding the right flats for both of us. I do find people wanting to push clipless on me, just not ready or interested, yet.
I like these analytical videos from you 👍🏼Can you do a tutorial on how to ride with flats?
I've never tried clipless, but I think each pedal type can teach you a different riding style and can show you what you might be doing incorrect.
I was saying to myself "Who is this big Joey?" Then I saw the manual into the drop in the intro
Lol i ain’t gonna tell anyone I’m a “cool guy” but I do like to send it!
@@JeffKendallWeed everyone knows you are really proud of that! we all know why its in the intro to every video! (the first time i saw that i really could not believe someone would try that!)
I switch between pedals depending on the type of ride and time of year. Winter is pretty much always flats because of the slippery conditions. I have saved myself from crashes when the bike slipped out from under me and I just ran it out after bailing on the bike. I tend to ride slower in the winter anyways and don't need clipless for that reason. I ride clipless always on my gravel bike. I ride clipless on chunderous rides, XC rides, and most rides in the summer, but I will switch to flats when I am working on skills or doing any kind of jumps to be able to bail from the bike and not get into bad habits with the clipless pedals.
Already thought my son who is now 24 and started riding clipped in at 13. We both ride clips and i have broken bones but don't think it was because of the clips. Both elbows and two vertebrae. Speed was the cause of two of those. Dig ur videos and i know u have fought to come back the bike beckons!
Awesome video... couldnt agree more. That said, some people have a real hard time in tricky situations getting out of clipless pedals, i dont, but some do. Im a bit lost on my mtb on flats but luv the flats on the DJ. Another note, dropping heals is really required on clipless too, e.g. hard, deep, loamy corners, sandy, steepest sections try to grab as much rear brake as u can.
I’ve been on flats. Mainly from a cost perspective and I learned on flats. My favorite thing is when I’m taking a berm or turn too fast and it has sand just before it. I tend to skid .... but my foot is out so it gives me the support I need to kick back up and carry on. All the while kicking up a nice rooster tail for show. (They don’t know it always by accident)
After many year on clips (I used to use flats for my DH bike, but sold it 5 years ago) last season I went back to flats full time.Just to try something diff plus i found I was loosing my pedal feel. For me flats feet great, cornering is more solid since you can pivot your hips more... plus the wide platform with sticky shoes makes for a solid feeling ... def not a easy on tech climbs though. Also high speed spinning up stuff is more challenging. I used the Crankbrothers Stamp 7s ... the large size. Wicked pedal btw. This coming season I’m not sure yet ... might go back to clips we shall see ... pedaling efficiency feels better, but that’s hard to quantify. I wasn’t any slower on my stava times on flats. THe biggest reason I went to flats last year was because I was finding myself chickening out on some stuff while clipped in ... totally in my head ... found with flats I was willing to take more chances and try some of the techy stuff I would back off from on clips. The pedal feel from my DH bikes days came back fast though
Riding mostly Vancouver North Shore, I sometimes struggle with keeping my feet from getting bucked in chunky sections with my flats. My feet aren't getting blown off but I find I lose the sweet spot of the pedals and am often trying to move my foot back to where I want them which is difficult while riding for me in my 5.10's. I sometimes wish I had clippless setup but at the end of the day I do think I'm safer riding flats. Thanks for sharing your insights Jeff.
I rode clipless for 12+ years and always felt "one" with the bike. I decided to move to flats about 4 years ago to make sure I was using "proper" technique. For me, I am a more confident rider, not due to the ease of stepping off or dabbing, but because I now use pedal pressure differently than when I was clipped in. Again, for me, flats are the way to go, but I did lose that 10% of power used when pulling up hard on climbs, tech assents etc. Overall, and others have said it, use what feels right, but maybe give the other type of pedal a try to feel the difference. I agree with Jeff, I don't ride at race speed, not that I ever did, but have fun, push my limits where possible, session areas and continue to learn. Ride on everyone. Good video Jeff!!!
Recently tried going to flats, but I rode so crappy on them, I had to go back to clips. I have been riding clips since the early 90's, so I just wasn't comfortable. I never knew where my foot was, even after 3 months of trying. I was a shit-show going downhill on flats - so tentative. Uphill was fine - 5-10's and a nicely pinned pedal give soo much grip. Which brings up another thing that I found surprising - flats hurt my knees! When you are on the pedal, there is no rotational float at all, and I would have knee aches after a ride. I may not be one of the cool kids, but I think that the current trend of saying flats are better is not true. Flats are better if they are better for you.
Great music from Manu Chau!