THE WHITTAKERS: A West Virginia Inbred Family Tree Explained- Mortal Faces
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ธ.ค. 2022
- Back with another family tree! This time I managed to piece together The Whittakers family tree to see where they came from and who the rest of their family members were. The Whittakers came to light in Mark Laita's videos he posted on his channel Soft White Underbelly interviewing the family from rural West Virginia. What is striking is the state of their living conditions and the clear disabilities members of the family have. As their parents were first cousins and also second cousins, the poor physical and mental conditions helped to surface the rumors we see of the Appalachian mountains deep in rural United States. These rumors are of inbreeding and poverty, the two factors we saw in the Whittakers. Despite this, Mark's videos show that the Whittakers are just another family happy to be with each other and despite their challenges, care and support one another.
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That fella that could only bark to communicate but understood English was so damn heartbreaking. He might not be able to read or speak but his soul is pure gold.
That's the result of being "raised by wolves" as the saying goes.
He was clearly left outside, probably chained, with the dogs.
@@oliviamartini9700 Id not even thought about that possibilty you know :0
@@oliviamartini9700 that is not the case at all. Shame on you for spreading such ignorant falsehoods. Ray has been well cared for his whole life by Betty and the neighbors. He has been non-verbal since birth, as many people are. His “barking” is not him imitating a dog, it is just the form of vocalization that comes most naturally to him. He is 100% capable of interacting with other people (if they take the time to understand him) and can understand most basic social cues. Betty and many other people who have kept their names private have worked their asses off for decades now to make sure Ray gets the love and care he deserves. They would never leave him out with the dogs.
And he just loves Alpo dog food!!!😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
@@Katie-mw7pd I once saw him raise his leg to pee on a fire hydrant😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I figured there would be A LOT more overlaps given the profoundly unusual physical attributes these siblings display.
I did as well. Goes to show you it could have a lot to do with surroundings,malnutrition,and possibly chemicals more than inbreeding.
I know. It's really just first cousins marrying, then that offspring marrying another first cousin. They must have bad genes. The royal family had been doing that for at least a century.
True, but the fact that the two brother's in the tree were twins likely resulted in a much higher coefficient for genetic problems.
There would be, who would know who the real fathers are
Yeah I would have thought the same thing, but it really shows that birth defects like these displayed can happen in non-cosanguinous pairings as well.
The two granddads being twins makes the genetic overlap between their parents more similar to half siblings, not even to mention the second cousin thing.
This is far more drastic than regular first cousin relation.
The offspring from the twins married each others children making them double first cousins . The boys from one twin married a girl from the second twin and so on. They married their first cousins making the babies double. Got it?
@dawnemyers5056 My comment wasn't about what they actually are dumbass, it was about how much genetic overlap there is between their parents. Twins= Same genetics, as if it was one and the same person. So if their parents share 50%of their dna, it's genetically similar to offspring of half siblings.
So sit tf down and don't skip your special ed class next time
My mother was born in WV. Over a decade or so, I went back and did some genealogy research. I have quite a few Whittakers in my lineage. I tracked down a bunch of graves stones and even a Whittaker homestead in Giles County (in Va but on the border of WV).
After my daughter referenced the youtube videos, I mentioned to her that we may be related. She showed me this tree. After a quick consultation of my family tree, turns out my 5th great-grandfather is James Whittaker jr.
It's a small world.
Olá, sou do Brasil e também descendo de um Whitaker ....gostaria de saber mais sobre a família que veio para o Brasil....obrigada
Wow that's wild. Have you tested your DNA ancestry or 23and me?
Are you inbred, too?
Yes it is !
so you're inbred
It hurt my heart to hear that Lorraine was assaulted. She always has a smile on her face, bless her heart.
She told Mark that in 1 of his interviews
Yes, very sad to hear this about Lorraine. At least Timmy came out of such a dark time in her life. Timmy is a sweet boy.
Deep sadness here when I heard that too
She’s a brave survivor her an her Son 🙏🏼 ❤️
Yes and when she comes in my store she's so nice to me.
I am from West Virginia. I grew up extremely poor also. Thankfully not quite as poor as the Whittakers. But up a holler nontheless. I am so amazed by the comments I looked at. You all express kindness and sadness instead of laughing or criticising them. Thank you.😊❤
Viewers of The Soft White Underbelly are empathic people. The stories are often tragic but they allow us to understand the how's & why's, much like this family tree. If you haven't, I suggest giving the SWU a chance because it's a profound channel.
My dear, you are such a sweet person. Nobody has the right to look down on others. May God help that family and may He prepare a wonderful mansion for you in Heaven.
I've never understood why people would be mean to them. They can't help who they were born to. They did absolutely nothing wrong and are victims of circumstance.
Pity yes, but there are people in here celebrating this. Under no circumstance should we be celebrating or condoning incest
💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖
I've never been so confused in my life
2 sisters married 2 brothers then 1 off spring from each couple got together
So…. (= means the children they had)
James Whittaker jr married permelia Clybern= thomas whittaker
Meanwhile: James perkins married lucy Conway = elizabeth and mary perkins (sisters)
Thomas whittaker married elizabeth Perkins= henry and john whittaker (twins)
Mary Perkins married samuel riggs= ada riggs
Ada riggs married john whittaker= gracie whittaker
Meanwhile: Henry whittaker married sarah burton= John whittaker
Then: John married gracie whittaker= the family who we know
Hope this made a little more sense 🥺
Same
Same here even watched it twice still confused
Me either 😢😮
I can’t help but wonder how poor Lorene came to be sexually assaulted in her thirties. I have to assume she’s been home bound her entire life. This raises many questions for me.
She's not 'home bound' now.
Yeah I was wondering too if maybe someone in her extended family?
Right I noticed they knew what raped meant real well
@@WQ59BInv uh she didn’t drive herself anywhere, wtf are you talking about? that’s homebound
@@mk6022 i was thinking this too. her son look heavily bred
Can we take a moment to appreciate that someone named their baby Zobedia Obedience Biddie.
lmao
Me! I thought is this a blk woman but lookin at the tree that wld a hard NOPE!
@@roneseelliott-lee7321 why would you think it’s a BW? Weirdo. We don’t have names like that
@@roneseelliott-lee7321 racist
@Bandler Ching…some might find that your name or mine sounded funny..it depends on where you live.
I appreciate how respectful you are and how you provided eulogies for the late members of the Whittaker family.
Agree!
Right? No judgements just straight to the facts.
Agreed, they had a bad gene pool
To begin with it seems unfortunately. Crazy to think people self inflict this on their children. Once cars became a thing, not even the most rural communities have an excuse for this.
@@hollichristensen6419 that entire family shouldn’t even exist. It’s disgusting and wrong. These are the ones that give white people a bad name. What’s the one thing people always say? Inbred. And all you dipsh!ts are “omg such a sweet family”. Disgusting
@@marlonrodriguez9623 no excuse. This family shouldn’t even exist. How many more inbred spawn are they gonna bring into the world. One of them literally drools on himself and barks like a dog and people are like “omg so heart warming”. What is wrong with people???
As someone born in rural Arkansas, the number one question you have to ask your parents when you get to dating age is, "how do we know them"
Dude. Yikes.
In 2023.
No one’s told them it ain’t right and to leave to state to meet new peeps
It’s gotta stop.
Gotta quit looking at family reunions for hook ups. Lol. My maternal grandparents were double first cousins also, and from Ark originally. Jus' say'n.
Hahah you americans are freaky
@blessedbythebest1003 Most people don’t have the ability to pick up and leave whenever they want.
To be fair, this is the case in any rural area where people don’t move far from home.
We’ll all have some inbreeding in our ancestry, just generally people stuck to no closer than second cousins. There’s definite overlaps in my family tree in the UK once I get back to the 1800s.
I was so sad to hear about Lorraine being assaulted. How horrific, I knew there was a fear in her eyes, I've always wondered what was going on inside her. The love this family have for each other is incredible. Very interesting to learn about their family tree and genetics. Love conquers all ☮️
they didn't get into much details about the assault. could you please fill me in with who assaulted and what did they do?
@zhouxiadong3673 well they must have raped her because it resulted in pregnancy.
This family has too much love for eachother
I think that there is way more inbreeding in this family than is being told. I also don’t believe a lot of the relationships were consensual as you can tell from Lorrenes situation. This is just very sad and unfortunate.
I live in germany and was absultely shocked when the german professor told us in class that before he was teaching he was working for the state documenting incest. He said "it was surely bad before and after the war. No money is really taking its toll on families and their socio-economic environment which leads more often to inbreeding than anyone had thought at the time. It was never talked about and the people who knew, knew, but usually kept their mouths shut. In these days it's much better. But not nearly as good as you would think." I was completly stumped. It came never to my mind that I may have had an encounter with somebody like this. Statistically I should have, and it's just so creepy to think about.
depends on what you call inbreeding... if you mean between siblings or parents/children that may be. If you mean between first cousins, that's pretty normal in much of the world today.
yeah, a lot of times incest involves one party manipulating and taking advantage of another… it’s heartbreaking what happened in this family really.
Agree
Not really. You gotta remember there were twin boys in that line. Their DNA is a close as you can get without being cloned.
Worth mentioning that if the twins were identical (John & Henry), their children who married (John & Gracie) would be genetically half siblings rather than 1st cousins and that explains the severe defects some of the children have. I think this is likely
I was going to write something similar. Identical twins share so much DNA that that almost has to be what happened here.
@@venuss2000 yeah they share close to 100% of their dna
😢😮
Yes it’s exactly what I was thinking
I totally agree 💯
This family have more humanity than most families.
They clearly love and take care of each other. Can't say that for most families these days. God bless them 🙏💗
Because they have no other options in life. They live in the middle of nowhere, have no resources and are uneducated and have severe disabilities… they’re all stuck with each other. It’s by default not choice.
As a historian I can apreciate the amazing work you put in. Having to unscrable inbred family tree is super confusing sometimes. SUPER INTERESTING STUFF, thank you very much for taking the time ❤❤❤
I had unscramble the Lee family tree for an internship. Obviously I won’t explain it all here, but I’ll just leave you with this: Lighthorse Harry Lee was Phillip Fendall’s stepfather-in-law until Phillip’s wife died and he remarried, at which point Lighthorse became Phillip’s brother-in-law.
It’s not uncommon to marry first and second cousins in the early 20th century and even earlier times than that. Crazy to see how just 2 generations of 1st cousins then 2nd cousins marrying can really create tons of genetic issues for the third generation. Thank you for doing this fascinating research. I wish this family all the best!
I mean, I'm from a small village where cousins and second cousins got married for 400 years. My family-tree is MUCH more inbred than Whitaker's is and the most we have is scoliosis and ADHD/autism occasionally. I thought Whitakers were product of multi-generational incest.
It's going to create a mutation, same DNA isn't meant to be combined with the same .
You also aren't considering the chemicals and pollution in the water etc from the coal mining in the area past and present.
I think although unconfirmed- if the twins were identical it makes their offspring genetically siblings- not first cousins.
It's because they're BOTH 1st AND 2nd cousins (double cousins) and to twins.
You can tell so much about people by how they treat animals...their dogs look well cared for and loved, very comfortable with the family.
Bull shit, why would lie like that.
They didn't always looks like that. We lived near them and they starved their animals to the bone. My dad even took a horse from them because they were starving him.
@@corypowercat7277 oof reality is a bit h ain't it
@@corypowercat7277 That's horrible, but looking at the little one now they seem to have improved
@@corypowercat7277
You lived in Odd?
The fact someone put this together is amazing thank you let’s get this beautiful family the help they need
They're not beautiful though that's for sure. Sadly Hills Have Eyes like looking. But they do not deserve bullying, they need help.
@@jutjubowbeautiful souls perhaps
I agree this is a loving family and such a shame inbred hat to happen but there all remarkable people.
This image was posted in the first video. He just looked at it and talked.
Thanks for the very good and respectful breakdown of this! Absolutely fascinating family history. As others have said it was not uncommon for cousins to marry, but when the twin brothers' children got together, I think that's the real beginning of the troubles. There is too much genetic overlap with that union.
I hope that you gave the Whittaker family a framed copy of their family tree. It would be good for them to have. This was very interesting. Thanks
Their family pole? Lol
I don't think many of them can read, and I don't get the feeling the ones who can read want yet another reminder that they're inbred
@@andremoller782 I think a couple of them can understand it.
@@andremoller782 Mountain people that can't read their family name on a gravestone or piece of paper, are still able to feel pride about it. They are capable of emotions from receiving such a gift.
@@katrinajohnson3776. Thank you for having such a compassionate heart to have said so. It would seem people have no level of understanding and are very cruel.
I thought the tree would be even more tangled
Me too
Maybe it is and some children are not from actual nonfamily husbands ?! Previous generations…
It probably was! This is just from people accounts. Shameful things may have been hidden. DNA might not solve it either, too complicated.
I thought it was going to be a lot more gross, but Betty and siblings - trying to keep this straight - their parents were 1st cousins whose parents were twins whose parents were also 1st cousins.
That's wild, but a lot more innocent than I'd expected.
Still leaves the question of Timmy though. He looks so much like Larry, to me.
I can’t even wrap my head around how you did this, well done.
Here’s how i had to break it down to
Make my brain stop hurting.
My mom Elizabeth, married my dad, Thomas Whittaker, and had a few kids..(Me and all of my siblings… we are obviously whittakers, because our dad is)
My moms sister (my aunt, Mary) married a man.
My aunt, Mary , had two daughters (my cousins).
Two of my brothers married my two cousins. (My aunt Mary’s daughters).
**first set of incest**
(One of these brothers that married our cousins, was a twin.)
Remember, one of my twin brothers, married our cousin…… now, HIS twin, (my other brother) ended up getting married to a random woman.
Each of these couples had some kids.
One of the twins children (my niece), married one of the other twins children (my nephew).
So, one of my nephews from my twin brother, married and had kids with one of my nieces from my other twin brother. (Remember, one of my twin brothers is ALREADY married to our cousin)
**second set of incest, which is like double incest since they’re twins**
So, The kids that my niece & nephew (both twins children) ended up having, are THE Whittakers that we know & see on TH-cam.
God, my head hurts.
I hope this helps someone. I know i have a weird way of understanding things… maybe if you just put yourself into the equation like i did it’ll help. Lol 😩
I pastured some horses at some people's place once. I stopped by to check on them one day and sat to have coffee with them. Poor old lady (suffering from dementia) started trying to tell me how a fellow showed up that was her brother as well as her uncle. I didn't understand so her husband clarified, said her grandpa was an evil old bastard, who sexed up her mother, years before and knocked her up. They sent her away to have the baby, gave it up, then came home try and act like nothing happened, but truth finally came out. Sick!
My ex father in law raped his own daughters for years. We're assuming her oldest kid is her dad's son, but can't prove it. He looks a lot like his grandpa, & was born with cerebral palsy. 🤔
A lot more of these stories come to light when the boomers go into homes and reveal the secrets they didn't want to tell any family.
@silentsledge learned things in my family too. Shocking things
Good Lawd!
It took me so long to figure out how this would happen Too long. My brain wouldn’t comprehend it.
I understand why Lorraine is the least vocal out of them now, this family have suffered so much, I have so much respect for Betty spending her life caring for her siblings and nephew and being a voice for them when they struggle to communicate, it's fascinating and tragic how normal incest and abuse was in rural West Virginia families like the Whittakers
I am so glad I discovered your channel. I just saw the documentaries made about them. I am so glad that you and Mark treat those people with dignity and respect. They seem to be lovely and happy in their own world.
I'm glad you did this. These people have endeared themselves to my heart.
Their mom was pregnant for most of the years between 1937-1960. I wonder if some of the family's conditions is from malnutrition, environmental factors and access to prenatal care. I mean even "good" prenatal care in this time frame was nothing compared to prenatal care today. And being in a more rural area didn't not make access any easier. I wish them well, and love that the town they live in protects them and cares for them so well. We always say, it takes a village, and these people have their village
I would go with this theory… Poverty, malnutrition, maybe some genetic disorder that has not been detected (not necessarily linked to inbreeding). I’ve done a lot of work on my family tree and have found many many cases of inbreeding on my fathers side, on my grandfathers side, there were first cousins marrying in every generation for 4 or 5 generations and also found on my grandmothers side, her parents were first cousins, meaning my great grandparents were first cousins. One of my aunts (my father’s sister) married her first cousin and had 6 children. I don’t know of anyone with physical or cognitive challenges on my bloodline.
True. When I was a child we lived next door to a family with seven chidren. The first two were lovely lively pretty girls, but as their mother had a baby every year they became more sickly and showed signs of mental and physical disability. I think their dad was violent, and suspected the mother started drinking to cope, she had no teeth by the age of 30 and looked wizened. They were all always hungry, me too, we lived in poverty. The last couple of kids I saw were in pretty poor state tbh.
It's from wiping forward during pregnancy.
I think not, there are millions examples of families with many children and also being poor, especially in the past, and not single one of them is like that, it's just genetics.
@@Cedo86 poor maternal nutrition has been shown to produce sickly babies, higher rates of low IQ, stunted growth etc. The larger the poor family, the more it happens. In the UK the "working class" who were called ip for military service in WW1 were found to be small, weak and disease ridden. This was mainly attributed to poor nutrition among the urbanised post industrial revolution populations.
I am from Kentucky and this is one family of many in these circumstances. I lived near another family who were so inbred that many of them sat on the porch almost year round in wheelchairs. I remember one lady in that family was coming in to have a baby at the hospital at least once a year it seemed and one of her hands was so deformed it looked like a lobster claw. This lady could talk but she seemed to have the mentality of a 5 year old. So sad.
That's hot
I wish I was in an incest family
@@vkvk3525 wtf
The “lobster claw” is a deformity and is genetic. There was a circus family about 80-100 years ago that kept passing it down the generations
Well obviously the children lived to tell their tale.. there's mother's out here throwing their kids in dumpsters
This was fascinating thank you I've watched all of Marks videos about the Whittaker family and have been very touched by their devotion to each other.We should all aspire to be at their level ♥️
I love the Whitaker's and their family. They never cease to bring a smile to my face. Especially Ray and Timmy. ❤❤
No way! My mother is Joseph Whitaker Sr.'s 5x great-granddaughter through Joseph's son Nathaniel :0 I was so shocked to see a photo I recognized. Yes, it most certainly is not Joseph who is pictured. I think I found an old newspaper article claiming it was one of his sons (perhaps James, if I recall correctly?). Great video.
Thanks for this explanation! I was wondering about the photo If Joseph was born in 1755, he probably died before there was regular access to photography. Also the picture is pretty clearly 1840s-60s, when Joseph would have been much older than the man in the picture!
O wow!! What a shock 😅 I would have spent the rest of the day telling various family members
Mark has been very good to them and they trust him, their trip to Walmart was the sweetest video.
You have made a wonderful video! Thank you so much for honoring this family tree.
Wow. I have been waiting for this family tree. Fascinating - thank you.
West virginia has a lot of heavy metal runoff from the coal mines that get into the soil and groundwater. Outside of intermarriage, this causes a lot of FLK syndrome (funny looking kids), cancers, skin issues and developmental delays. It may be a contributing factor to the family’s issues
Yeah. Especially when most of them died extremely prematurely.
What the hell? That’s the biggest crock of bullshit. 😂😂😂 Everything you said is absolutely FALSE.
@@solangelalebron1348 FALSE!
I was thinking that, yeah. Obviously the incest is probably one of the causes of their health conditions but pollution, the fact that almost none of them went to school, probably also grew up without proper nutrition, lack of medical care, all would be contributing factors
@@TruthHurtsSoGetAHelmet lol
I think In remote areas of the country, it’s not unusual to find some great grandparents that were cousins. My great grandfather said he had to leave his small farm town in Florida in llate 1800’s. so he could find a wife that wasn’t related to him. That was the story told down generations. I however think he left his home area because he got in trouble!
You have hit upon some thing. In rural areas, there was no such thing as “dating” You only met people at picnics and church functions. Relatives married distant family or, neighbors. At some point in time there would be no one that you could marry that wasn’t related to you in some manner. I know, my family is from West Virginia. My mother and I went to a family cemetery, and she named all these people that were buried there and how they were related. She said when she was young, she could never date anyone because they were related to her!
@@IrishAnnie Note that some small ethnic groups like the Samaritans keep close tabs on family trees, to avoid this sort of thing.
@@scottcharney1091 I’ve heard in Iceland there are records to tell people how closely or distantly related they are to potential dates.
@@annjohnson6193 Note also that Iceland has a pretty sizable amount of "fresh blood" coming in via immigrants and their descendants. That's a good thing for many reasons, including/especially genetic health!
@@scottcharney1091, Chinese and other Asians keep records of family lines. It's my understanding, from my late grandfather, that a certain number of generations had to pass before you could marry a distant relative. I think it was something like 5 generations. That makes a lot of sense when you live in small villages where most people are related in some way. My ancestors came from a group of Five interrelated villages in the Pearl River delta area of China.
They are a lovely friendly family. They get along with each other better than most. How they have lived is amazing.
Thank you for explaining the family tree, it’s amazing how you pulled it all together.
They are a sweet family. So sad their earliest known relative became an orphan on the way to America. I wish nothing but the best for them. We see so many depictions in pop culture of “inbred” people being aggressive and frightening … but this family couldn’t be further from that.
The Whitaker Family are very sweet to me I've seen both the video's and yes I agree they all share some difficulties and many terrible health related issues but we all do.
My heart goes out to the Whitaker's. I'll say this - for as disabled as the Whitaker Family are mentally and physically they do love each other very much.
And the Whitaker Family manage to keep it together to run their home. It's unfortunate how disabled the Whitaker's are but I like that they are looked after and checked on.
Such a sweet plain folk
blessing's to the Whitaker Family🙏🏼🕯️
How do you know that? Have you lived with them? Some of the worst serial killers, rapists and abusers are "friendly" and easily befriend people. Unless you truly KNOW someone, you don't know them at all.
🤣🤣🤣🤣So which one is it who keeps the family all together??? Lmao!
@@calvin99991Always someone looking for the worst in any situation.
Don't excuse the horrible act just because they are nice people
it's an disgustingly cruel thing to do
Were the twin brothers mentioned identical twins? If they were that would biologically make their children more like siblings than cousins.
I couldn’t find info they were identical or fraternal unfortunately
Very interesting comment! I had to think about that aspect for a minute. Wow
FASCINATING!!!!!
Identical (i.e., monozygotic, or MZ) twins share 100 percent of their genes, whereas fraternal (i.e., dizygotic, or DZ) twins generally share only 50 percent of their genes.
Interesting, that could be a possible explanation.
Like to think about this
Your video and family tree was very interesting. The part I am so impressed about is the fact that you could highlight the names so we could follow it very easily. I really enjoyed the video and I think you did a fantastic job.👏👏👏
Cool vid, thanks for creating and sharing.👍
I think the Whittakers was one of the very first vids I saw on WhiteSoftUnderBelly and was naturally drawn right after watching a couple more of the Whittakers interviews. This family is magical, that's the best way I can put it, none of us have the power to pick which family we come from or at what time but this family sure made the best of what they were born into, grown into and left with.(God Bless Them!)🙏
I love the compassion you used when describing the Whitakers 😊
You handled this thoughtfully, and respectfully. Well done!
Agreed
I could watch that twice and still get confused.
Thank you for all your work. This video is well done and I learned a lot. I love to see the Whittakers family and how they work together to care for each other.
They all have each other looking out for one another and that's a lot more than a lot of people have... I wish I had something like that in my life
Amazingly done. They’re really a sweet family. Taking care of each other no matter what and accepting them how they are
so sweet how betty promised to always care for her family and never marry
*@Destiny Heath* ☘️ Yes, some of the very people that would sneer & laugh at them are themselves estranged or quarreling with their own family. The Whitaker's could teach us alot - I remember watching the first original documentary about them years ago and though they lived poor squalid conditions, they always had a smile for everyone and clearly loved & cared for each other, which is more than some other families who might sneer at them. Also I recall, the local people, sheriff & Doctor ALL looked out for the family too, refusing to let anyone with cameras or ill- intentions to just show up. It's rural country but close-knit, they look after each other up there,
Anyone know how this TH-camr managed to get this information? Just seems odd
Except the part where one of them r*ped Lorraine
Ahh the Whittakers!! Precious, precious family!! Hope they’re all handling this cold winter well. ❤
I couldn't follow ANY of this, which makes me wonder how you were able to even put it together!!! Genius work my man!!
I also expected the family tree to be more entangled given the amount of physical and mental deformities you see in the siblings. I guess we are to assume the twin brothers from the 1800s were identical and that resulted in genetic complications when their children married(they would have been half-siblings genetically speaking) and had these kids you see in the video. The situation with Lorraine might be darker than we'll ever know. I wouldn't be surprised if Timmy's dad is one of his uncles. Unfortunately when you're under the same roof all those years in close quarters, I can see sexual molestation happening. Timmy looks way too much like his uncles.
yeah I think the incest was going on way before the identical twins
..yes...or Timmy's dad could also be his grandfather...😬..it's possible...
Timmy looks identical to ken. If you noticed in the last encounter with them in summer 2022 when mark asked who was Timmy’s father there was a silence for a few seconds with than a quick reply that she was assaulted and raped. I wouldn’t be surprised if ken is Timmy’s father.
Sick familie
The twins thing is a good point, they weren't like regular first cousins, the twins genes were identical, so even a generation from there, their gene ratios were probably more identical, too.
But yes, like I already said in another comment, royalty and other groups throughout history have purposely married first cousins to keep things, in the family, but were still, ok.
The odds on this family go the other way around.
It is amazing how much most of us are related throughout history. Start with you and your parents. So you had four grandparents, and they each had two parents, so that's eight great-grandparents, and they had two parents each, so that's sixteen great-great-grandparents and so on, and so on, now average each generation at 30 years old and keep going... once you get to your 30th generation back you have over 1 billion great-grandparents (the year 1050), once you get to 40 generations back you have over 1 trillion grandparents (the year 750), which is 'impossible,' because when you got to 1 billion you were already way past the amount of people on the planet at that time.
"Number of Ancestors in a Given Generation"
The little description for everyone, it really added the humanity that is sometimes missing in modern life 💜
You did a very thorough and great job putting together their family tree! We can now understand how it all started. Very interesting!
This is so respectful everyone is so respectful to this family
My mom’s side of the family settled in an extremely rural area of the Ozarks, and when I did ancestry research, there’s was a lot of situations of sisters from one family marrying brothers of another family - notably lots of marriages between the Duggars and Moores. My grandma has a few “double cousins.” It’s less of an issue now as traveling and connecting with those outside the small community has gotten easier though, and thankfully we haven’t faced any debilitating inherited disorders.
There are some interesting recessive traits that lots of us share almost across the board though. Most have pale blue eyes, light blonde hair (even platinum blonde in my grandma’s and cousin’s case), lots of red moles, joint hypermobility, and thyroid cancer. Some like my grandma could almost be mistaken as albino. I got all but the hair and eye colors thanks to my dad’s side.
Duggars? Those Duggars?
@@scottcharney1091I second this question. Those Duggars? That explains a lot.
My mom has double first cousins and it's not incest, so why would there be any issues? 3 sisters from one family married 3 brothers from a different family. Not incest. The only interesting thing about it is on our DNA genealogy they automatically list double first cousins as siblings to my mom and first cousins to me instead of first cousin to her and second cousin to me. Again, it's not incest if two separate families marry each other lol
I don’t believe the inbreeding in families like you describe was due to inability to access different communities. The royal families of Europe and Asia have married their cousins forever. Other groups as well. I’m not arguing for inbreeding, I’m just skeptical that families who do this in America are all as “backwards” as we’re led to believe. Anyway, cheers.
@@aWomanFreed all of the royals are inbred ..meghan and kate, almost look like half sisters
A reason king George 3rd married Queen Charlotte, because she was black biracial to break up the birth defects
They all knew about the hapsburgs
Can't believe somebody did that to Lorraine. And then raised the boy as best as she could. The world can be a cruel place
She didn't raise him as she isn't mentally capable of doing so, I can guarantee you that she was raped by one of her family members which resulted in timmy.
I think it was a family member.....
What happened to her??
@@LisaMarie-xp4ym she was raped
@@LisaMarie-xp4ym She was assaulted probably by someone in the family or someone outside the family I'm not sure but I'm guessing on the former of it being a family member since well ya know...
I've been watching the documentaries on them for years. Mark always checks on them ❤
Well Done! You really straightened some question marks for me.
Poor Betty. She's done the best that she can.
But kept pumping them out.
@@malachi- What are you talking about. Betty did not have any children. She stayed single in order to look after her siblings.
@@avalondreaming1433 I agree, she said she never got married, she doesn't have kids of her own. She told her mother she'd never marry and take care of her siblings and nephew. So again I agree with you 100%.
@@malachi- Wrong, she told her mother she'd never marry to look after her siblings and nephew. She has no children of her own.
I feel like a lot of purebred dogs would have a family tree like this.
look up the royal family
A lot of purebreds aren't bred with their siblings anymore. They're bred with other pure breds. My dog is a purebred basset hound and her dad came from a different state.
@@genericwhitemale1114 Basset Hounds are actually one of the most inbred breeds alive today. Most basset hounds have joint issues because of the weak gene that arises from mating siblings or parents and kids. They are the fourth most inbred breed of dog 😂
@@genericwhitemale1114 Even so, it's very often not good for them, right?
I know with horses if you 'line bred' and 'double bred' people once thought it was making an even more powerful horse or 'smarter' horse. The things that make ya go hmmm. I would not bred my horses to their sire or dam or sibling.
I was expecting more drama if I'm honest, but this is a very carefully reseaeched, thoughtfully done video!
Thanks for this video!
The Whittakers are such a lovely family, I wish them a peaceful comfortable life and nice that kind people look out for them. Saw a documentary about them a while ago and it touched my heart how each one of them are so special and how much they care for each other. Wish more people were like those folks.
I'm glad more people aren't severly disabled because of their parents acts
This is a massive oversimplification, and completely overlooks the obvious suffering of these people. Ignorant people, I swear, next you’re going to say we should all marry our cousins and enjoy a “comfortable” life in squalor without heat in the winter. We’ll all promise our mothers to never marry so we can care for our severely disabled siblings who have been discarded by the system? Sounds peaceful 🙄
@@Kirsten_is_cursed10 tha fk is your problem? These folk are victims of their ancestors. They seem to try to live an honest life and care deeply for one another. They are having to deal with the hand they were dealt. You seem a little privileged. I hope Jesus touches your heart this Holiday season. Or maybe karma places you dirt poor and disabled for everyone to talk about and make fun of. I'm not an ass though. So ,I hope for the first option.
@@Kirsten_is_cursed10 Uhh what the fuck is this reply? Their situation is harsh, of course everyone knows that. I understand what you're saying but I'm sure OP meant that in spite of everything that has happened, they still take care of each other. It's called a silver lining.
Heck I figured they came from marriages of siblings. Now I'm wondering what happened... At any rate they're dear people and I'm so glad Mark captured snapshots of their lives.
Identical twins have the same DNA, so their kids would be half-siblings genetically speaking. There was also another close cousin marriage in the twins' family line; who knows, there may have been others.
There probably wasn't any non relatives around to marry.
With cousins, even first cousins, it's usually not a big deal UNLESS there are genetic disorders. I believe that's what happened here. It's still legal for first cousins to marry in many states because it's not really much different than a completely unrelated couple.
@@lavenderoh On a one off chance yeah it's not the worst thing. They probably wouldn't even be disabled. But if you look at Pakistan for instance they've been marrying cousins forever. It's lead to some very troubling statistics.
@@beckyshell4649 It overlaps even more. One of the twins' wives was also a first cousin, so he married a double first cousin. So you have a 25% coefficient of relationship for double first cousins before even getting into whether or not the twins were identical. If the twins were identical, there's another 25%, so I think you're looking at a 37.5% coefficient. That's the same as a 3/4 sibling (when the same parent has children with two siblings or another parent and their child).
I appreciated how gently and respectfully you spoke about the family
He spoke like a true fake tender pooch 😂
Thank you for giving us the family tree we love this family 💜
I loved watching those videos Mark made. They were sad, yes. But they also showed a lot of love and care and really taught viewers how amazing humans can be. How adaptable we are. It’s really impressive how the non-verbal Whittakers learned to communicate, and so inspirational how they take care of each other.
You find this lot inspirational? Typical disingenuous comment from someone trying to seem kind. SAing your sister at 13 is not admirable. Save your admiration for someone who's eyes point in the same direction.
I adore this family. I'm from south eastern Kentucky and know a few families specifically that are just like them. They are all some of the best people you could ever meet and some of the most interesting. A lot of the incxst isn't even consensual. People like the Whittaker's are almost always so nice and so interesting. I'm so happy that people fell so hard for them.
It usually isn't and cannot ever truly be anyway due to power differentials
such a sad story people end up this way because of the evils others did
@@kenetickups6146 it's so sad to know that a lot of these people are forced to do things or don't even know that they are being forced into situations.
@@CannibalChxrry Yep, very true and very heartbreaking
Your voice is seriously so calming
Mark you are an amazing man. The Whitaker family thinks of you as family. God Bless you 🤗
I just Love Ray the man that barks alot, He just touches my heart, Mark had money donated to him for the whittakers and he took that money and restored the old trailer they were living in, he has done so much for the whittakers Love Mark and his channel, he really cares about people, he helps the homeless, drug addicts and so many have lied and scammed him but he always caught them and was done with them, I would be the same way as well.
Ray is my favorite as well! He seems like such a sweetheart! I think about this family often & I pray someone will help take care of them if anything happens to Betty.
The only problem I have with that is Mark has the Gofundme in his name. Betty seems fully capable of handling that.
@@alaska-bornfloridaman Seems like they could raise enough money to just buy a new double wide or have habitat for humanity go out there. Some government grants. Someone must have the know how to help this family. Each one is receiving a disability check so they may be able to handle a small mortgage. A few years ago, I saw a video of a man who got a church to donate a trailer to a senior in West Virginia and they all worked together to get it set up for her and put furniture and everything in it. I would love to see something like that for this family.
I love the soft white underbelly videos about this family. Thanks for covering them
Your video is very respectfully done… I very much appreciate that. These people had no choice in what went on that led to them being on this earth & they should not be made fun of.
Wow ,,, excellent work. Thank you for sharing . 👍🏻
It would be interesting to find out if the birth defects predated the current group. Considering the interconnectedness of the family doesn't go back that far, I am wondering if there are also some environmental factors going on too.
Born and raised in the Steel Valley on the Ohio side. Birth defects abound due to contamination from old mines, steel mills, etc. They r just getting some of these places cleaned up after almost 100 years of contaminated water and soil.
It could be
We also don't know if the twins whose kids married were identical or not. If they were cousins with parents that were identical twins, genetically, that's pretty much the same as half siblings marrying.
I think there is more to it than genetics. There are other videos of Appalachian people that have nothing to do with the Whittakers, I noticed that some off them have the same eye issues some off the Whitakers have. Perhaps something in the soil or water. Now granted, genetics don't help...but, there is more than one thing going on, imo.
It's not only the coal mines and steel mills though. You should look up something called PFOA. DuPont have dumped hundreds of thousands of pounds of the stuff into the Ohio river since the 1950's. They knew full well the negative health effects it had on people, but they're still dumping it into the river to this day, even after being exposed. Truly evil company. Bet the execs were like "Who cares? They're a bunch of dumb hillbillies anyway". This chemical is probably having more of a catastrophic effect on the health of the people and wildlife in the region than coal ever did. I'm not condoning what Ted Kaczynski did, but I can't argue with what he wrote.
I think we can safely assume the inbreeding was going on well before the identical twins showed up
My maternal grandfather’s family (Traylor) has had descendents in central Virginia since the 1600s. No interfamilal marriages that I know of but I can say there is quite a bit of depressive, personality disorders, anxiety in the last several generations. Thanks for sharing info on the Whitakers. Very interesting how geneologies play out.
Mark you are truely a Angel for all you have done for this wonderful family ❤❤
8 years of College for me , I was blown away of your ability to decipher this ! In a Good way of course !
I would if Larry named his daughter after his sister, Betty. She's a gem. What a wonderful explanation of the family tree. The Whitakers and the whole subject of inbreeding is fascinating. I mean that in the most respectful way. Mark is one TH-camr who actually offers something of value to this platform. I'll definitely check out more of your videos. 🤍
Fascinating in a "how can people do something so evil kind of way"
@@kenetickups6146 What do you mean by "evil"?
@@VioletJoy cursing your children to a life of disorder is evil I would say
Great review of this very interesting family. It warms my heart that Mark has used his influence to get financial support for this very needy and deserving family. Thank you again
What amazing and detailed research . Wow … amazing work
Such love this family exhibits 🥰 Thanks for sharing this.
I've loved the Whitaker family since Mark introduced them to us on TH-cam. Such a sweet family. I hope their doing well. ❤
This family has happiness some of us will never know.
You been a kind man to this family mark huge respect to you fella x
Ray stole my heart ❤️ I adore his bright personality and strength
Presented factually and with respect to this lovely family. I am impressed by your kindness.
Great Video! Thank you for clarifying this. Another creator made a disparaging remark about the Whitakers "not minding" when they were "getting themselves into" the scenario that resulted in their genetic issues. I got in their comments trying to explain that this was NOT a case of multi-generational inbreeding, that their parents had been first cousins, but that the two siblings who had produced these first cousins were identical twins, & therefore the cousins shared roughly the same amount of DNA as siblings (half-siblings, really) do.
Ordinarily, first cousins only share 4% more DNA as random strangers. That's why it's perfectly legal for first cousins to marry in 19 States in the US, & legal with some restrictions in 6 more States. Of the 26 States which prohibit first cousin marriages, 17 allow cohabitation & sexual relations between first cousin's. So, sum total, 42 States in the US acknowledge that first cousins don't share enough DNA for there to be significant genetic issues with their offspring. It's when a family REPEATS the practice of first cousin marriage in subsequent generations that genetic problems arise.
Or in the case of the Whitakers, when the first cousins are the offspring of identical twin siblings.
John Emroy Whitaker & Gracie Irene Whitaker, because their respective fathers were identical twins, had the same genetic make-up of half-siblings with the same father but different mothers.
In any event, the Whitakers are beautiful people who in no way brought any genetic issues upon themselves. There isn't a history of repeated generational first cousin marriages. Their parents were just a special kind of first cousins (in more ways than one!)
The fact that some of the higher functioning siblings care for those who have special needs, that they (especially Betty) have sacrificed what could have been "normal" lives in order to take care of their siblings, is a devotion to family rarely seen in this day & age, & something to be applauded.
By the way, first cousin marriages is ILLEGAL in West Virginia, but cohabitation & sexual relations are allowed. First cousin marriage was not illegal anywhere in the US until the 1880s, & almost all of the current laws were in place by 1920, so I don't know if John & Gracie went to another State to get married, or if they were, perhaps NOT married (they already had the same last name, after all).
The National Conference of Commissioners on Uniform State Laws unanimously recommended in 1970 that all laws prohibiting first cousin marriage should be repealed, but no state has dropped its prohibition.
Globally, about 10% of all marriages are between first or second cousins. In the US, it's a mere 0.2% of marriages, whereas the number is closer to 50% in Pakistan.
Fun fact: Charles Darwin married his first cousin Emma Wedgewood (whose grandparents were third cousins).
I think MY family has more incidents of consanguineous marriage than the Whitakers do!
But no identical twins. Genetics are a funny thing.
Again, great video. Next time someone says something about the Whitakers having any kind of history of inbreeding, I'm going to send them right here to see the facts. And thank you for speaking kindly & respectfully of the Whitakers. They really are sweet people, & I agree, Timmy & Ray are as fascinating as they are entertaining. I love the way Timmy sort of "translates" what Ray is woofing about. I don't know if he actually "speaks Rayese" or if he's just making it up, but it's priceless.
I worry about Ray. His health has been waxing & waning this past year, & I can't IMAGINE how a doctor's appointment would go, so who knows what might be going on with him.
Thanks so much for this upload. I'm gonna go check our some of your other content now. It's good for the algorithm.✌🏼
They were basically first AND second cousins though and decided to have children, 15 in fact after they saw multiple have birth defects. It’s sad. I think it’s wrong no matter what to get with your cousin but this is multiple cousin marriages, not just one on top of the twin cousins. The parents were cousins (from twins) and the mothers parents were cousins (the fathers aunt and uncle were cousins). I love the Whitaker’s and I feel for them. It’s not there fault, it’s their parents. They had to have known after having so many children with problems.
Really clearly explained. Thanks
Totally agree the twins could have been identical, which is where most of the problems came from. Check the family tree again: 2 generations in a row of first cousins married.
Anyone know how this TH-camr managed to get this information? Just seems odd
With how they look this makes much more sense to me.
WOW! I sure could use you to do my family tree. I watched the video about this family. Fascinating!
Thank you that was helpful. I have watched the Whittaker's and wondered about their family tree
I've always wondered how they came to be. Thank you.
I absolutely love them.
They are severely deformed, I was shocked and mortified when I first saw their interview, but hearing their story and all of the abuse they endured broke my heart. So many families harbor so many secrets even when abuse and mistreatment is involved.
Not that deformed.
not mortified--horrified. Mortified is embarrassed.
What abuse did they go through?
So so true, thank you
Yup they ain't that deformed I've seen worse that weren't inbred who was deformed and couldn't walk
I appreciate that you gave mark credit ❤
Thank you for this video and research.
I'm a proud West Virginian, I was so hesitant to watch this video, but you were so respectful. Thank you.
This is fascinating. I love the Whittakers. I think Betty would appreciate this. She's so awesome to take care of them all and to devote her life to that.
Give it a break, it is a sheet hole.
Precious family no matter their circumstances. Ray has just touched my heart & I worry about his painful knees. When Ray feels good he seems to be so happy. God bless him & his family. I greatly appreciate the kindness & respect shown to the Whittakers.
Thanks for that. We have nothing in this life to give but love