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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ส.ค. 2024
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We get this question a lot from new welders and guy who want to weld, but haven't yet began their training: "Can I buy a TIG welder and use a flux cored wire without gas". The general idea sounds okay in theory, because in a noobies mind, "If I can use a wire feed process without gas and the flux shields the arc, it shouldn't matter whether it's fed through a feeder or by hand".
The one thing that the new welder isn't taking into account is the electrode itself. In traditional MIG and FCAW welding, the wire is the electrode (current carrying device). In TIG welding, the electrode is the Tungsten. And the Tungsten still needs the gas shielding to stabilize the arc and keep it from destroying itself. This will be a quick video, but we thought (since we've had this question on many occasions) we would do a quick demo and show the reaction. Enjoy!
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I just appreciate the fact that you tried. You can tell somebody that it won't work, but you usually have to prove that it won't work for people to believe you.
It's a solid rule to show the proof vs just saying so and others just simply believing.
I have never tig welded anything but this test makes the need for argon very easy to understand NOW.
Whoever requested that just ruined Mr Tig's tungsten.
Too bad you can’t regrind tungsten
Thank you for that demonstration without the Argon Gas! I now fully understand the oxidation phenomenon and how it destroyed both the Tungsten rod and test specimen without the Argon gas shielding your zoomed in video clearly shows, great video sir!
"Hi I'm Mr Tig" 🤣😂😭 dad you promised you wouldn't call yourself that anymore.
Thank you for these amazing experiments. This is how true learning and understanding happens. Science is not about why, it's about why not =)
Looks like what happened to the tungsten in my torch when I was testing to see if the lift start worked on my well used Miller. I don't have any shielding gas yet and it just vaporized the end of the tungsten and burned straight through the 1/8" plate in about a second. I don't think compressed air would have any effect on it, the presence of oxygen just makes the tungsten oxidize and melt very rapidly.
Argon also cools the tungsten down hence why helium was used as it can cool the tungsten because of its high heat conductivity and also it can shield the weld pool. Argon can do that too
Crazy. I was just wondering that exact thing.
well, at least I know what happens if I try that now, I'm just starting TIG and was thinking what would happen if I didn't use the gas.
Thanks!
I just loved this channel more than anything welse.
I use rods by Castolin Eutectic with sort of powder flux inside for welding cast iron castings but it neither shields the bead nor leave any slag on top but rather contains powdered metal ingrediends and spices.
We wouldn't have all the different types of welding if no one made any trials failures and eventually multiple ways of welding.
God loves a trier .
My TiG welder also equipped with arc welding capability, so this is not necessarily unless an emergency. One time I tried installing a brand new exhaust down pipe and found a hole in the weld joint area, I am forced to use TIG without an argon. I was able to weld but my tungsten tip burns off a bit and have to re-sharpen again.
The argon does more than shield the base metal and pool... it also prevents the same oxidation of the electrode... and it would likely be possible to TIG in a vacuum without gas but a true vacuum is very hard to achieve and outer space is a little more expensive than a bottle of Argon.
That's practical knowledge for you. Need to see it to comprehend it.
I was searching youtube to see if it was possible to do some kind of tig stuff on a stick welder, and this is the answer. Thanks for the info.
What you are asking is an entirely different question and the answer to that is yes. Search for scratch start TIG.
Clearly needs a heavy flux stick rod instead. I've seen it work with 4043 alum rod - would like to try on steel.
Without gas you burn up your tungsten so I don’t think you did see it work with 4043.
if you dont use gas I think you have to connect your torch to the Negative
I do think experiments like this are helpful. Please get try things.. you save me time.. I likely would have tried it just to know (already knowing it would likely fail but now I know it 100% failed).
Crazy man. You actually tried this!
Could a piece of graphite handle that better?
I was imagining what would happen but thanks to this video. Thank you
Should of used 1/16" or .072 wire instead of .035. Flux core is hollow so there's a lot less metal there per inch. Not to mention it would have more flux so it would've shielded better.
Nope. Without gas you’ve (you have not you of!) got a burned tungsten. No way around it.
thanks good info about tig without gas.
What an absolutely brilliant video.
I think the request was for the opposite reason... they don't have everything for TIG! Like the stinger and not really wanting to invest in the argon bottle, gas lines, regulatir,... a welder with mig/Tig "ARGON" capability.. (all they have is a FluxCore welder.) ... ... i think they wanted to know about using tig-Rod as added filler, using a Flux core welding machine! ... ... But WHY!?!?!? ... Possibly For less slag, pitts, spatter and or porosity!?!?
What if you used a 1/16”stick electrode? Use a little gas to get the electrode melted and see what happens
Would it work if you used less argon with flux cored wire?
I want to forge weld steel but I want to use my tig to weld the pieces together with no filler just to block the O2 can you do it without gas and you proved it wont work without gas
well done for giving it a go
I have been watching wall pros welding. They are all good anyd help full. I would like to to see some more interesting welding. For example to buildup a broken motorcycle cylinder find one in cast iron one in aluminum. These fins about 0.1875 inch thick and they are about 0.375 inch spaced apart. I like to see the to build up of an inside fin. Another simpler case are the plug welds especially the smaller ones. I enjoy the show and thanks for the help, I can use all I can get.
That Old Bob
I would imagine the tungsten would just turn into smoke, the way it does when you try to TIG in a little breeze. If you use the flux core with gas you have dual shield! // Wow, that was pretty wild looking!
We hate shielding gas companies and their rental tank policies. Never mind the cost. I've sold everything that needs gas myself. Stick and flux core or nothing.
Amen to that
Great video. I'm cheap and was checking in to see if TIG could be done w/o gas (quite expensive for the cylinder and gas). Seems like no. Guess the flux works on stick because there is not really any space between the work and the electrode.
These rods are made for open crack butt welds you absolutely need argon coming our your rig it just saves money on purging the stainless pipe with argon gas.
The flux works by creating a coating over the molten puddle therefore preventing oxygen from reacting with the metal. It does nothing for your tungsten because it doesn’t cover it.
Can you use CO2 in place of argon?
argon is hard to get here so can I use Co2 instead to weld mild steel
Thank you Mr. Tig you have shows us alot!!
Can you tig weld with mapp gas instead of the argon 🤔
3:16 no they are not Mr Tig, no they are not.
Why don't you ever weld a fitment out of position? Everything I see you do is on a bench. Simulate some real life working conditions and teach what a puddle looks like with gravity working against it. I'm sure there is a welding tree/vise company that can send you their product to promote. Weld out of position I want to learn how to do that!!!!!!!
fireflite34 yes I work in a half ass shop with what I have my table is not flat but I get shit done and done right these guys have all the nice shit. I would love to see them weld in a half-ass sharp situation
I would also like to see some up hill or down hill welding.or even over head
Hi sir from Philippines what is the best to used with gas or gas les what is the direfferent of welding thanks for the answer
Question can you tac weld without argon with tig?
@Weld.com What would happen if you did a dual shield setup? Ran Argon and the Flux core wire?
The flux core weld looks the same as when I forget to turn on my gas bottle. I do that every couple of months lol.
obviously starting the arc without having shielding gas is going to cause your tungsten to die and your base metal to be contaminated beyond salvation. no chance for the weld after that.
also think about the feed rate of the Flux core process. you're attempting to stretch that tiny dabs worth of flux to an extreme limit.
it somewhat defeats the purpose of the test, however if you'd like to see if it's possible, start your arc with argon until you have fed your wire. then instead of dabbing the rod, attempt an extremely rapid feed.once you've got the wire melting the argon may not be needed. you may just get enough shielding from the inner flux.
DOOOOOOO ITTTTTTTTT!
What is the best brand of tig machine
what if... Instead of using argone just use air to cool the tungsten rod.. So compressed air instead of argone and a fluxcore rod. Would that work?
You forgot to switch the polarity, and feed a lot more with a bigger wire
Flux core + gas in an outdoor high wind setting.
Not saying it would work any better but he's dabbing way too slowly with the flux core wire. It's like he isn't adapting his tig style to what is happening with the puddle. It that an Everlast welder he is using?
Awsome video I can't wait to see the flux cored tig filler rod
Sir, may I ask a question please: I want to add (weld) small custom connection clips to a bicycle chain - used to turn an observatory dome. If you can imagine turning a bicycle chain with the chain clips horizontally, so I may add a small motor to turn a dome. I am unable to find any commercial clips that attach/connect to a chain, which would allow me to attach the chain to 'something.' Therefore, I need to use some small hardware clips - and weld them to the chain. What TIG welder would you recommend and I do see TIG welders on Amazon, but I don't see canisters of argon. Perhaps, I should not be using TIG for this application, perhaps you would recommend another welder system. My preference is not to use a welding system that requires a gas - rather just a voltage-related (melting) system. Something like a soldering gun, but with much greater welding ability. Your advice/suggestion would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
Great demo
Thank you for clearing some points & I want ask if I can use CO2 gas with Tig welding , tank you again
How about TIG steel on AC?
Larger wire, or try using a welding stick as a filler wire type fashion.
So don't "borrow" the TIG from work, unless i "borrow" the gas bottle with it :)
i would expect the duel shield to work out well, mig duel shield does
Wayne Hartneck it does work nice usually its used to not need to purge on stainless pipes
Mr. TIG, what should be the setting if I TIG weld 3mm aluminum sheets? Thanks. I know it should be A/C but I dont know the other settings. Thanks
Compressed air will just feed more oxygen melting the tungsten 100 times faster. argon is used to create an oxygen free bubble at the tip. You blow on a fire to make it burn hotter
Hi sir,can tig machine use stick welding?without gas on tig welding?
That’s two questions. 1. Yes 2. No.
Would you recommend tig or mig for a beginner welding aluminum Or steel
oh ok but how about using stick electrodes as a filler rods? with argon ofcourse?
gonna try it tommorow in shop.
I use sometimes nickel elecrodes for tig but with stripped shield.
wonder how will it work with flux shield.
cool demo . how about using tig with gas and solder as filler. My guess is that it would melt before ever coming near the puddle.
i do believe he already did that on one of the symbol repair videos
Can you tig weld by using borax as a flux
Why??
Can you tig (braze) with argon on aluminum but use aluminum brazing rods (the ones that are designed to be used by a gas torch) instead of regular tig rods? I like the hardness of the aluminum brazing rods. Do you think the resulting join is better than regular tig rods in terms of durability?
ya- I like to know that too. I have my first tig welder coming in this week. I will try it. I have 4 pounds of AL3 rods (tin, aluminum and likely zinc). they are the Chinese ones from ebay and not as good as the ones I got from lowes. Propane would melt the ones from lowes but these dont really flow. So.. I will try to tig with them.
was wondering if you could do a review on the Hobart Auto Arc 100. i know its a cheeper welder was just looking for a professional opinion on it I like mine it's better than the Lincoln Weld Pak HD that I had
If you replace argon with air from an air compressor to cool the tungsten?
it's oxidation that kills the tungsten, no so much the cooling
Result: Congratulations, you've just created a crap plasma cutter.
the key of TIG welding is not not let oxygen that in the air to get between TIG torch tip and the metal or material that you are trying to weld . so you must need that argon gas to create this shield .
Can you try the Vulcan tig 200 or 165 from harbor freight.
thank you for this try. very usefull.
Short answer NO
Thanks for that, without gas. how about AIR or something extremely cold ---- I'd never used tig before nor much of any other
Thanks for that information
Can yo use carbon dioxide gas for mild steel ??
No. Contains oxygen.
What would be a good cheap take welder for a beginner at tic welding. Keep in mind I do use a wire fed electric welder and I'm pretty good with it
Everlast makes good quality welders that are affordable. I've got a few of their products myself.
There’s also quite a few paid shills for everlast on TH-cam, so I don’t buy their products.
Can i use a Air compressor for tig instead of the gas?
No. Argon is inert. That’s why it’s used. Compressed air is the same stuff you breathe, ie contains oxygen ie not inert.
How abour CRC AntiSpatter paste?
What about TIG without gas using a flux coated stick electrode?
Nope.
Could you try tig welding wihout gas in a vacuum?
If in a vacuum you don’t any gas. The purpose of the gas is to replace the oxygen. In a vacuum there is none.
remove the tungsten and stick in the flux core wire
They call me...MR TIG
My former employer had a welder come weld some stainless steel on a commercial dish washer. It was some type of tig. But he didn't use gas. The welder was a tiny Miller it was not flux core or stick. DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT THIS WAS? He had no gas and no flux. He said it was some new type of welding an the machine was around 3k$
I used to own a tiny Miller tig lift start welder that came with a extremely long power cable and the welder used disposable gas bottles that just fitted onto the strap so I could go anywhere and weld
Lower the amps
"Send us your ideas, we love that" 3 seconds later he absolutely IGNORES the reason for the video, and USES argon gas....
Wellp, im not subscribing....
Thank you. You are so good.
Can you use just normal air from your air compressor instead of using Argon
Just looking for a cheap alternative
No. Air contains oxygen which is what you’re trying to avoid by using the argon...
Pin and weld time with Amazon welder no gas 💪
Again my question is... Can u do TIG welding without its gas.... Without anything...
Did you not watch the video? Look at the fucking tungsten afterwards...
How can there be "18" dislikes?, If you don't like it, you are not interested, click your mouse and go watch "Greta Thunberg" or something similar?
Nice try Mr Tig, Thanks for sharing.
man that was horrible, i really thought you didn't need the gas that much
Apart from it working with argon gas, will it work for a water cooled tig torch?
Well that's a firm NO !
Someone should ask what happens when you shower with the welder?
NOTHING! Take my word.😎
With the welding _machine_ or the person doing the welding? :-O
thk you soo much, now I know what to do 👍❤️
Mr. TIG !!!
Rip tungsten
Yeeeeeeeeeek! !!!
I would have never in a million years tried that again
Yeeeeeeeeeek!!!!!
His sad face at the end from losing his tungsten is heartbreaking.
Thanks Mr Tig; I'll stay clear of this stuff, (unless I got some cymbals to weld), just kidding Mr Tig!
Mark Steven E