It appears I've caught the mispronunciation bug once again. Hope the video is still tolerable! Given how much time I put into researching for these videos, I'm not really sure how it happens. Too much reading, not enough listening.😅
Funny story btw. I live in Los Angeles, but only a few days before uploading this I ran into somebody from Carmel when out and about. What're the chances of that?! This is also when I realized I screwed up Carmel's pronunciation, but it was too late.
@@alexanderrotmensz you probably met someone from Carmel, California which is pronounced the way you were saying it, Carmel Indiana, is pronounced carMAL
An important part of Carmel's development is their tax program for parking. Surface parking can often take up half of the land a building sits on, so Carmel pays for a portion of the cost to put parking underground, under the building, etc, and the development is able to occupy twice the lot without surface parking. Once the parking solution is paid off, the city makes significantly more tax revenue from that single lot and the effect compounds over every similar development in the city. This kind of financial benefit is what will drive urbanism in the US once developers realize that this is more profitable than strip malls with huge parking lots.
I think that also depends heavily on the geology of where the city is as well, some cities are just above or sitting on bedrock so digging would be costly or damn near impossible, or here in Toronto, where most of the city is built on imported sand and landfill.
It feels like the entirety of Carmel may eventually redevelop to reflect these new styles. It feels to me like this city more than any other in the US has the chance of truly shifting how people design and build their towns in America.
That will take a long, long time. Most of Carmel is typical sprawl built in the last 30 years. The 'downtown' is very nice (the redeveloped library is spectacular), but most of the city could be anywhere in the US, except for the roundabouts.
This is beautiful but I do wish there was a streetcar line or even a network. I can imagine a line going along the Monon Trail having a lot of ridership
It's very unfortunate. From what I can tell, there is 0 transit in Carmel. the closest bus stops are in Indy on 86th Street, past the 465. Quite a track for anyone wanting to use transit, plus passing an interstate. In the mayor's defense, this is a very affluent area who initially stuck their nose up to any kind of good urbanism (since Americans have brainwashed into think that is for poor people) I imagine it will be an uphill battle with the community to even get a bus stop from the Indygo network in Downtown Carmel. There is a pretty good interview with him talking about how he got started in the town and they practically lynched him over the round about at first. There is a bike share program though!!
@@cosmickitty3009 there is some on-demand transit for the county (my mother uses it), but it's not well-staffed so it's inconvenient at best. I think at this point, the state has handicapped Indygo to the point where Carmel wouldn't trust taking on any financial burden of transit, even if people approved it. You're absolutely right that the affluence means very few people living here are actually in favor of transit.
I think it’s because for affluent people, transit = crime. They could try to make the buses clean and well-maintained and introduce incentives that could easily pull people out of their cars (such as school service or transportation to special events). If crime is an issue, raising fares could also solve this problem (although it could price out lower-income residents). There definitely are ways to make transit possible but they will need to get rid of the prevailing mentality that transit isn’t safe or “cool” for people with middle to higher incomes.
This is a great example of how to develop smaller towns and suburbs I also appreciate how it captures the feel of American Midwest towns It's strange how things that were common in the past now feel fresh and new.
I’m not so sure about that. I was optimistic too but then saw states tearing down homes and businesses for more highways and widening of highways still in 2024 and beyond plus some places aren’t allowing light rail or train expansions which is a huge hit to public transit because you can’t rely solely on buses or walking.
@@pattycarljackson Yeah I forgot about that, my state mainly the towns I've been in have demolished many historic houses for empty lots or parking lot's and theres a highway widening that's been going on for a while, which I believe is destroying many rural homes, the rail depots have all been torn down long ago it's unfortunate but I always look for hope with these things.
I think Carmel's example and success has inspired many communities in the Northern Indy suburbs as well!! Neighboring Zionsville, has very much maintained it's downtown. It's a smaller and poorer town so development is pretty limited but new builds in downtown definitely rhyme with Carmel, though only in keeping oldtown Midwest Americana charm. Their downtown park, named Elm Street Park, is just full of native plants along the small walking trail and a community garden. Additionally, they even have a pocket neighborhood that was recently built.
I cannot thank you enough for making this video, and showcasing Carmel’s outstanding urban planning. Indiana is often overlooked in the urbanist community, but it’s so great you shine a light on this suburb.
You should do a video on Carlton landing, in Oklahoma. It’s a dense walkable town founded in 2013 that is inspired by sea side Florida. It’s on a hilly terrain surrounded by a lake, with faint mountains in the few. It’s still not really close to being done, it still has a long way to go. But with what it has now it looks really nice, and it has such a charming style.
My question was, where did they get the money for all this amazing and stunning development? Turns out Carmel is the headquarters of the North American Interfraternity Conference. It's also the headquarters of a large number of corporations. Carmel is absolutely a model in how to develop, but they have resources other small-to-mid-size cities don't. Keep up the good work Alex! Love your content.
That is a very interesting thing and the significance cannot be overstated. Many fraternal societies are connected with classically designed university campuses in vibrant neighborhoods across the country. These folks are well connected and if this is what they are supporting in Carmel, I imagine many other towns will follow once they see how successfully it can be done. There are historical bases for this type of urban development going back thousands of years, and there's tons of money to be made by re-tooling America's abysmal suburban situation
You should try to interview the now retired Mayor Brainard. He knows his stuff. She can ask him very granular questions about public-private partnerships. I live in Indianapolis. I will say Carmel's growth has been impressive. Nothing looks cheap. In other words all of the buildings will look good and non-dated in 50 years.
As a European living in Switzerland, I'm amazed by all the above ground multi-level parking garages! I mean: Why? Put them under ground! One parking space per appartment is the rule over here, and using the size of the whole lot, you should get those in on just one level. I wouldn't want to live in an appartment that looks out on the street on one side and into a parking garage on the other... (I'm talking about the appartment complex that is supposed to "wrap" around the parking garage.)
In Australia garages are underground too. The first stage of construction of any big building, apartment or office, is usually excavating a 2 or 3 level basement garage. or more if its really big.
Sometimes there's odd variations, like a new mixed-use building near me has 2 underground public parking levels for nearby shops, then shops at ground level, then a parking garage level for the apartments, then 5 stories of apartments.
There’s a lot of pipes and other things below ground that prevent this, I feel like below ground parking lots would be a nightmare as well trying to implement in the US
Carmel is still a pretty small place, I imagine the budget for construction there doesn't really allow for major underground structures which would meet safety standards and requirements.
As the mobility is still basically all car, they need an obscene amount of parking. I am not even sure that can be easily fitted into underground parking without creating multilevel parking underground in an incredibly deep hole in the ground. Of course, key to a truly urban development is to reduce car dependency. But maybe that is a compromise one has to accept. Consider what the alternative to Carmel would be. If there is no urban core whatsoever to begin with, it isn't really possible to create the core of a functioning public transit network or generate pedestrian or cycling traffic. Once there is sufficient density and a somewhat pedestrian friendly core, that is getting considerably less ... impossible in such a context.
I think you’re missing one important point here: Carmel has money. A lot of money. Which is why so much of this is possible. I hope more cities can do this, but I’m less optimistic knowing the cost of these projects are beyond what the average town can handle. I hope I’m wrong.
This is gorgeous! So happy this is happening in our country! Washington State should take note... My hometown Spokane Valley would GREATLY benefit from this sort of planning. It has many unsightly stroads that have plagued the area for decades...
Indiana is making some SERIOUS moves with this development. The greater Seattle area needs to take some notes. Working as a civil engineer in the PNW, its heartbreaking to see one giant glass monolith pop up after another. This is so incredible that I want to travel to Carmel and learn who is designing this.
Thank you for making this video! This is very beautiful town! The local folks and town certainly defied the modernist architect demand for ugliness and lane excuses! Bravo!
13:15 I have an issue with this given how, from the perspective of shown, this building would replace several old farmhouses. I'm all for new buildings that replicate historical styles, but we should not prioritize them over *actually historical* buildings
Something interesting about Carmel is that the mayor who led the redevelopment was a Republican. Usually, urbanist ideas are focused on, well, big cities where Democrats usually dominate, which has led to the idea of urbanism being an inherently progressive one. Carmel demonstrates, though, that urbanism is not partisan and that density, walkability, and mixed uses can have broad support in smaller towns throughout the US if people have the political will to make it happen
For America this is amazing! I do wish they had done better with the architecture in making it more classical/traditional and done better with the car infrastructure as well as add a streetcar, etc.... but I guess beggars can't be choosers...so well done to Carmel! It is certainly better than the alternatives!
The architecture here is probably as good as you could possibly hope for in a suburban setting in America. I'm actually stunned it's as nice as it is, as what is typical in America is to get some nice renderings and then a value-engineered ugly thing.
@@fullonfogfor new suburban settings* many beautiful old american towns or villages that are now suburbs often have some amazing architecture, centers, streets, etc.
Carmel (like candy), not “Car Mel” is how pronounced. It’s overall a sprawling suburb of strip malls, McMansions and no where cars are not required as overall Indy area has zero mass transit options. Nice new buildings shown here of adding some density to otherwise non densely populated area.
I too am looking forward to your WEEKLONG visit to Carmel so that you can bring us photos and video of as much of it as you can. Nothing can take the place of boots on the ground because only in that way can one know the LIFE of the place. I'm counting on you Alex.
Another impressive list of a truly amazing suburb. I know Indiana is not very transit friendly but do you think it's possible to live car free or car lite in Carmel?
Probably not a good idea right now but if this type of development continues in other cities and suburbs around Indianapolis investing in public transit could definitely be justified. This is especially true since such areas tend to be more financially sustainable than traditional suburbs.
I live car lite, so its definitely possible. Requires living within the very center of the city though where all this development is happening and it helps being able to work from home. Check out @AmericanFietser for more examples of car-lite living in Carmel
State politics are going to continue to make this difficult. They’ve kneecapped the area’s abilities to build public transportation, including BANNING light rail. And living in downtown Carmel is expensive. I think you could get away with car free there, assuming your work is nearby. But again, very expensive.
Now that LA has burned down, I'd be interested in your thoughts on how they should rebuild. I was in Athens about 2 years ago and Athens reminded me of Southern California. Same type of climate, same type of terrain, looks like same type of vegetation. They are also subject to wildfires and earthquakes. The difference is they build all of their houses out of cement and brick. In the news we do hear about wildfires in Athens, but not about how it gets burned to the ground. If LA adopted the same type of buildings as Athens I'd estimated that 50 to 70% of the damage from this fire would have been mitigated. Those are my thoughts, I'd like to know yours.
I used to live in Carmel for 10 years from 2001 to 2011. I recently visited again and was struck by how much it’s changed in the last 10+ years. There are some strange choices in the city like all the eerie frozen-in-time statues or how every building feels the need to remind you that you are, in fact, in Carmel. There’s a big pillar next to the palladium that has arrows pointing to other buildings in the vicinity and the whole thing gives off the vibe that you’re in a video game or on a tv show/movie set. There were certainly elements that I really liked about the city, but it’s just got the strangest vibe when you look a bit closer
It is only really lacking good public transit. Yeah it is a decent city center, but you still have to drive to get there if you live more than a mile away.
i live in indianapolis yes a bigger truck is a pain in @SS get in some places and its the round about capital of the USA. Me even if i was rich i would not live in carmel or anywhere in hamilton county.
My suburban town is finally beginning to transform itself, decades after so many buildings were destroyed for parking lots. Unfortunately the build quality of the new structures is not nearly good enough. A lot of cheap construction, (not terrible, but cheap), and I'm afraid of how well these new buildings are going to last in the coming decades.
Please do a video on Fort Worth’s Panther Island project!!! We’re the largest rail user in the state & our city leadership is committed to building a dense-walkable city!
this is absurdly wonderful, i wish every city did this. have you considered a video on providence, RI? its been slowly healing its old wounds with a freeway relocation and new development around the capital center.
I suppose Carmel is as good as it gets for US cities to look closer to classical cities in Europe or Latam while still following the godawful zonification rules imposed by the car oligarchs. Not bad but those streets still feel too wide, needs more densely packed neighborhoods.
We don't have to look like Europe, density, walkability, and livability are not unique to Europe. It's cringy every time i hear someone comparing us to Europe.
Many of the roads are still far too wide I agree but there's at least a few silver linings. 1. Plenty of room for a streetcar/LRT in the future 2. Roundabouts
How do we get Brainard or one of his protege to redesign neighborhoods in California, or teach us the ways of Carmel Indiana? We really need this to fix the housing crisis 😩
So many videos I see here on TH-cam regarding walkable cities always go into the extreme and oftentimes politically tinged subject matter. This attitude comes from their frustration over the state of urban planning and these videos usually advocate for the limitation or banning of cars, heavily increased density, and an overall intense shift of the American culture towards something more European or Japanese. However America is not Japan or Holland and should not be treated as such. Carmel's center still features roads and cars, and I appreciate that. We have always had values of individualism baked into our culture and cars represent that freedom perfectly. We do not need to demolish our culture just to have the right to walk, we just need to create spaces with beauty that people will freely choose rather than the roads. This means that not only could I walk around this beautiful city all week and not get bored, but I could still take my car out for a Sunday drive without getting stuck in traffic for hours. That freedom of choice is really important to me. I appreciate the optimism of your video and I hope to see more cities doing this.
I have to disagree with your take on American car culture and that it's a perfect embodiment of individualism. The US achieved greatness before we ever had cars. The majority of our most beautiful towns and cities are along the east Coast, which were built before the time of cars. Much of American history and culture has been defined pre-auto. As far as individualism, I think a proper individualistic society needs options (more viable transportation options) to give individuals more options. And I find American car culture limiting on its citizens instead of granting more freedom. That being said, I'm not saying we ban cars, but rather we invest in other options instead.
Please look into dutch urban planning more. It's far easier to drive a car there cause there's much less traffic. It's still an option. In fact it's better than our only option - driving - is here. Cities shouldn't be designed 90% for the car like they are in the US. It's a design practice the boomers started using and the experiment has had awful results.
Carmel is a 100k population lifestyle center. While proving that we can still building things in different styles is good. It’s by far not the template the rest of the US should follow.
US cities look and feel terrible, with some of the worst urban planning decisions, architecture that is out of step with the times and incredibly outdated. You are lagging behind almost the entire developed world in this regard, and it will be very difficult to catch up.
Carmel resident here! (I'm new so I'm used to Indianapolis' way of doing things) Carmel is great and has a lot of good things going for it especially the corridors around the Monon trail and newer development being more walkable bikeable etc. However I don't think we'll get any sort of transit here. I've raised the idea in local groups and the feedback has been mostly positive but there's been a fair amount of classism and racism in the replies. Carmel also wouldn't take on any tax burden here when it comes to INDYGo when they floated the idea of an extension to Carmel years ago so its a multitiered issue. Another issue is that while we're redeveloping and adding on, there's a LOT of construction (streets and/or lanes closed) that would make it hard to create bus stops with a (semi) permanent structure. If we're going to have a bus system it needs to be better than Indy's for people here to be satisfied. Another issue is that we still have too much street parking. Streets like rangeline, main street and the monon road still have street parking when there's plenty of parking just half a block down or behind the buildings or in a parking garage. The space could be used for sidewalks, bike lanes or more greenspace or spots for emergency or public transit options etc etc. What I'm thinking it comes down to is that they want to redevelop most of the main strips before they start thinking about transit options. Which comes to my next point. Although a lot of spaces are great and are walkable, we still have issues where sidewalks do not connect or filter right out to the road. I"m hoping I can make a difference so that we can create sidewalks, upgrade the sidewalks to walking paths, and create a transit network that works well for everyone and not just the holiday "trolley" that operates 9 days out of the year with temporary bus stops and rented buses. Also fwiw, i'm not affluent in any way. I'm part of the (mostly) invisible lower class of Carmel that serves the higher class yet is expected not to live directly in Carmel. Despite all the new apartment buildings coming online in the years past and years to come I doubt that rent will go down in price.
It's funny that you mention the Monon. It's a beloved piece of infrastructure today but when it was first proposed there was a lot of vocal opposition that sounded a lot like some of the current opposition to transit in the city. I guess the promised crime and flood of poor people couldn't figure out how to cross 96th St!
Very interesting :) maybe you would like to check the community of Val Quirico in Mexico, is a new settlement inspired in the architecture from Toscany.
With all these plans, is public transit a big discussion as part of it? It looks like there's a lot of pretty cool denser design that's planned and much more beautiful, but is living car-free throughout the city viable or still not as feasible
Carmel is a car-dependent suburb completely isolated from the urban core of Indianapolis. There is not a single fix-route public transportation line. Less than 4% of the population commutes by alternative modes (not car). Carmel is a terrible example of transit oriented development that is accessible to people with a broad range of incomes. It is an isolated disneyworld style place that remains exclusive and cut off from the rest of the metropolitan area...only accessible by a private car.
Later on, if connecting to Indy or receiving public transportation lines, having good urban planning is better than not. Better to have walkable areas. This also makes promoting those types of connections easier than having a line going to a not dense area with no walkability.
So it's better to just be a suburb? You do realize towns don't have to depend on bigger cities? Their goal is to be independent and Carmel seems to be doing that, with a lot of mixed used buildings together, while maintaining a sense of place. I can see that to many chronic urbanites seeing towns become their own with architecture that reflects the place instead of glass and exposed concrete shoe boxes might be strange, but it's a step in the right direction, even if many buildings look too much PoMo. Your comment applies to place likes Oak Park, which would paint it as a bad place to live, but in reality, it's ranked as one of the best in the Midwest.
Transit has been an ongoing back and forth issue in Carmel for years now. The indy express to Carmel was discontinued in 2014, then there were plans to extend the Red Line to Carmel and Westfield but that was cancelled, and now there are plans for Carmel to develop it’s own Bus System but since the election of mayor Sur Finkham, there hasn’t been an update on the topic since 2023 and Finkham doesn’t seem to be expressing much interest in public transportation at this time
Lived there last year until I got in a fight with my roomate when he got blacked out, definitely a great area loved the downtown area lots of jobs and opportunities
It's actually CARmel like the flavor; not carMEL by the sea (Cali). CarMEL by the sea. CARmel by the interstate. If you like traffic circles, you'll love Carmel. It makes moving around the city pretty efficient. But beware of traffic diving into the circles. Yield is more of an optimistic notion than a rule in Carmel. And people don't use turn signals in traffic circles. It's still not a walking town, and it lacks public transportation.
"And should serve as a model for car-centric suburbs" Carmel has a lot of things going for it but the ultimate goal should be to eliminate car-centrism, not cater to it or try to perfect it. And I'd argue Carmel shouldn't be the standard model, either. A lot of their culture derives from being rich, largely white (and most people who aren't white are Asian, the "model minority") and very polished-looking, and being a community that's able to isolate themselves from actual urbanites. Like Indiana as a whole they're very resistant to public transit. We DO need more micro-communities but we need them to be transit-centered and connected. And we need these to be built for the people, not just reserved for those rich enough to pay for their own nice semi-urban bubble.
7:35 - What a waste of valuable urban space that pool/fountain is. Think how many CBD/Vape stores could be squeezed into that area for maximum tax revenue!
In other words, how can we make our city more like NYC or Washington DC? Edit: Haha, 2nd Street SW? Even the street names give away what they're trying to replicate... Carmel looks like something straight of a commercial/residential cluster in MD or VA, you almost expect to see a metro stop around the corner Sometimes I wonder if Americans actually enjoy dense urbanism and extensive public transit or whether dense urbanism is something that you put up with to live where the pinnacles of professional opportunities are. Seems that you often hear about people wanting to move out of Manhattan or the District after they've made enough money or after they have kids, which feels a bit discouraging... we have 2 cities that are the total paragons of urbanism competitive even with Europe and Asia, and yet people can't wait to move out to start families
Tens of millions of people live in the New York metro and most of it is about as dense as the builds in Carmel. People generally move out of cities because of either the COL or because of diversity and its consequences
@@tann_man Oh yeah, and clusters around metro stops in VA and MD are nearly identical to Carmel. Seems like Carmel actually resembles these more than it does NYC (e.g., Reston, Bethesda, Rockville, Pentagon/Crystal City, etc.) but COL there are often just as astronomical
Every city in America needs to add at least 1 Tram line from the suburbs to the their downtown. And along the way every 1 mile add a town similar to Carmel. And just build a ton of condos. That's how you solve both the housing crisis and traffic. Its literally that simple!
This is wonderful and all, but they have yuge advantages------ Essentially a greenfield, High incomes, and putting it as delicately as I can......favorable demographics.
its not. this is absolutely an exclusion to the rule. just because you see one video on one town thats decent doesnt mean theres a movement. there is none. the vast majority of new developments in america are still ugly unsafe and car obsessed. this is an outlier town and extremely rare, and its still car dependent. so dont get your hopes up at all. most american towns are not doing anything like this, and on top of that, most american towns *cant* even if they wanted to. theyre way too far gone to change for the better. not to mention corporations are running america and corporations dont understand what beauty even is.
@@darmar6895 yah just move somewhere else if you want to live somewhere beautiful and pleasant. we have a centuries worth of consistent car-based provably wrong way of developing cities here in north america. and most americans dont even realize what the problem is.
It appears I've caught the mispronunciation bug once again. Hope the video is still tolerable! Given how much time I put into researching for these videos, I'm not really sure how it happens. Too much reading, not enough listening.😅
Funny story btw. I live in Los Angeles, but only a few days before uploading this I ran into somebody from Carmel when out and about. What're the chances of that?! This is also when I realized I screwed up Carmel's pronunciation, but it was too late.
Like the corn not like the city in California
I was more confused about Moanin (Monon) 😂
@@alexanderrotmensz you probably met someone from Carmel, California which is pronounced the way you were saying it, Carmel Indiana, is pronounced carMAL
An important part of Carmel's development is their tax program for parking. Surface parking can often take up half of the land a building sits on, so Carmel pays for a portion of the cost to put parking underground, under the building, etc, and the development is able to occupy twice the lot without surface parking. Once the parking solution is paid off, the city makes significantly more tax revenue from that single lot and the effect compounds over every similar development in the city. This kind of financial benefit is what will drive urbanism in the US once developers realize that this is more profitable than strip malls with huge parking lots.
Agreed 100%
I think that also depends heavily on the geology of where the city is as well, some cities are just above or sitting on bedrock so digging would be costly or damn near impossible, or here in Toronto, where most of the city is built on imported sand and landfill.
they could just remove parking minimums but they wont
It feels like the entirety of Carmel may eventually redevelop to reflect these new styles. It feels to me like this city more than any other in the US has the chance of truly shifting how people design and build their towns in America.
That will take a long, long time. Most of Carmel is typical sprawl built in the last 30 years. The 'downtown' is very nice (the redeveloped library is spectacular), but most of the city could be anywhere in the US, except for the roundabouts.
This is beautiful but I do wish there was a streetcar line or even a network. I can imagine a line going along the Monon Trail having a lot of ridership
There used to be an interurban line that ran through Carmel
Me too! That's the last piece to the puzzle. Maybe one day...
It's very unfortunate. From what I can tell, there is 0 transit in Carmel. the closest bus stops are in Indy on 86th Street, past the 465. Quite a track for anyone wanting to use transit, plus passing an interstate.
In the mayor's defense, this is a very affluent area who initially stuck their nose up to any kind of good urbanism (since Americans have brainwashed into think that is for poor people) I imagine it will be an uphill battle with the community to even get a bus stop from the Indygo network in Downtown Carmel. There is a pretty good interview with him talking about how he got started in the town and they practically lynched him over the round about at first.
There is a bike share program though!!
@@cosmickitty3009 there is some on-demand transit for the county (my mother uses it), but it's not well-staffed so it's inconvenient at best. I think at this point, the state has handicapped Indygo to the point where Carmel wouldn't trust taking on any financial burden of transit, even if people approved it. You're absolutely right that the affluence means very few people living here are actually in favor of transit.
I think it’s because for affluent people, transit = crime. They could try to make the buses clean and well-maintained and introduce incentives that could easily pull people out of their cars (such as school service or transportation to special events). If crime is an issue, raising fares could also solve this problem (although it could price out lower-income residents). There definitely are ways to make transit possible but they will need to get rid of the prevailing mentality that transit isn’t safe or “cool” for people with middle to higher incomes.
This should certainly act as a role model to how American cities can redevelop
True, they can go multiple ways but all the roads lead to less cars
This is a great example of how to develop smaller towns and suburbs I also appreciate how it captures the feel of American Midwest towns It's strange how things that were common in the past now feel fresh and new.
honestly, it looks much more Old European than it does Old American.
I'm so happy to see America fixing it's mistakes. Soon we'll have cities to be proud of again.
Lol
"soon" is doing a LOT of lifting. But I like the sentiment
I’m not so sure about that. I was optimistic too but then saw states tearing down homes and businesses for more highways and widening of highways still in 2024 and beyond plus some places aren’t allowing light rail or train expansions which is a huge hit to public transit because you can’t rely solely on buses or walking.
@@pattycarljackson Yeah I forgot about that, my state mainly the towns I've been in have demolished many historic houses for empty lots or parking lot's and theres a highway widening that's been going on for a while, which I believe is destroying many rural homes, the rail depots have all been torn down long ago it's unfortunate but I always look for hope with these things.
I think Carmel's example and success has inspired many communities in the Northern Indy suburbs as well!! Neighboring Zionsville, has very much maintained it's downtown. It's a smaller and poorer town so development is pretty limited but new builds in downtown definitely rhyme with Carmel, though only in keeping oldtown Midwest Americana charm. Their downtown park, named Elm Street Park, is just full of native plants along the small walking trail and a community garden. Additionally, they even have a pocket neighborhood that was recently built.
I cannot thank you enough for making this video, and showcasing Carmel’s outstanding urban planning.
Indiana is often overlooked in the urbanist community, but it’s so great you shine a light on this suburb.
Road Guy Rob just did three videos on Carmel! Carmel really is setting an example other towns should follow.
You should do a video on Carlton landing, in Oklahoma.
It’s a dense walkable town founded in 2013 that is inspired by sea side Florida. It’s on a hilly terrain surrounded by a lake, with faint mountains in the few.
It’s still not really close to being done, it still has a long way to go.
But with what it has now it looks really nice, and it has such a charming style.
My question was, where did they get the money for all this amazing and stunning development? Turns out Carmel is the headquarters of the North American Interfraternity Conference. It's also the headquarters of a large number of corporations. Carmel is absolutely a model in how to develop, but they have resources other small-to-mid-size cities don't. Keep up the good work Alex! Love your content.
That is a very interesting thing and the significance cannot be overstated.
Many fraternal societies are connected with classically designed university campuses in vibrant neighborhoods across the country.
These folks are well connected and if this is what they are supporting in Carmel, I imagine many other towns will follow once they see how successfully it can be done.
There are historical bases for this type of urban development going back thousands of years, and there's tons of money to be made by re-tooling America's abysmal suburban situation
Very underrated channel
You should try to interview the now retired Mayor Brainard. He knows his stuff. She can ask him very granular questions about public-private partnerships. I live in Indianapolis. I will say Carmel's growth has been impressive. Nothing looks cheap. In other words all of the buildings will look good and non-dated in 50 years.
This is not “CarMEL” that is a seaside down in California. This is “Kar-mul” as in the treat.
Sorry, but the treat is kare-uh-mell😛
@@okaeT Got me
I live in indianapolis been in carmel a lot and it SUCKS!
Road Guy Rob did quite the series on Carmel, it was delightful.
yea it was great
I'm really looking forward to see the continued growth of this still young channel and general movement! Keep up the good work
As a European living in Switzerland, I'm amazed by all the above ground multi-level parking garages! I mean: Why? Put them under ground! One parking space per appartment is the rule over here, and using the size of the whole lot, you should get those in on just one level. I wouldn't want to live in an appartment that looks out on the street on one side and into a parking garage on the other... (I'm talking about the appartment complex that is supposed to "wrap" around the parking garage.)
In Australia garages are underground too. The first stage of construction of any big building, apartment or office, is usually excavating a 2 or 3 level basement garage. or more if its really big.
Sometimes there's odd variations, like a new mixed-use building near me has 2 underground public parking levels for nearby shops, then shops at ground level, then a parking garage level for the apartments, then 5 stories of apartments.
There’s a lot of pipes and other things below ground that prevent this, I feel like below ground parking lots would be a nightmare as well trying to implement in the US
Carmel is still a pretty small place, I imagine the budget for construction there doesn't really allow for major underground structures which would meet safety standards and requirements.
As the mobility is still basically all car, they need an obscene amount of parking. I am not even sure that can be easily fitted into underground parking without creating multilevel parking underground in an incredibly deep hole in the ground. Of course, key to a truly urban development is to reduce car dependency. But maybe that is a compromise one has to accept. Consider what the alternative to Carmel would be. If there is no urban core whatsoever to begin with, it isn't really possible to create the core of a functioning public transit network or generate pedestrian or cycling traffic. Once there is sufficient density and a somewhat pedestrian friendly core, that is getting considerably less ... impossible in such a context.
I think you’re missing one important point here: Carmel has money. A lot of money. Which is why so much of this is possible. I hope more cities can do this, but I’m less optimistic knowing the cost of these projects are beyond what the average town can handle. I hope I’m wrong.
This is gorgeous! So happy this is happening in our country! Washington State should take note... My hometown Spokane Valley would GREATLY benefit from this sort of planning. It has many unsightly stroads that have plagued the area for decades...
Indiana is making some SERIOUS moves with this development. The greater Seattle area needs to take some notes. Working as a civil engineer in the PNW, its heartbreaking to see one giant glass monolith pop up after another. This is so incredible that I want to travel to Carmel and learn who is designing this.
Thank you for making this video! This is very beautiful town!
The local folks and town certainly defied the modernist architect demand for ugliness and lane excuses! Bravo!
13:15 I have an issue with this given how, from the perspective of shown, this building would replace several old farmhouses. I'm all for new buildings that replicate historical styles, but we should not prioritize them over *actually historical* buildings
Something interesting about Carmel is that the mayor who led the redevelopment was a Republican. Usually, urbanist ideas are focused on, well, big cities where Democrats usually dominate, which has led to the idea of urbanism being an inherently progressive one. Carmel demonstrates, though, that urbanism is not partisan and that density, walkability, and mixed uses can have broad support in smaller towns throughout the US if people have the political will to make it happen
For America this is amazing! I do wish they had done better with the architecture in making it more classical/traditional and done better with the car infrastructure as well as add a streetcar, etc.... but I guess beggars can't be choosers...so well done to Carmel! It is certainly better than the alternatives!
The architecture here is probably as good as you could possibly hope for in a suburban setting in America. I'm actually stunned it's as nice as it is, as what is typical in America is to get some nice renderings and then a value-engineered ugly thing.
@@fullonfogfor new suburban settings* many beautiful old american towns or villages that are now suburbs often have some amazing architecture, centers, streets, etc.
roses are red, violets are blue,
trains, trams and buses come in all sorts of hue ;)
my playlist #2 is about transportaion
I have to correct myself. It is not pronounced Car-Mill. Rather it is pronounced like the short version of the candy--Carmel.
Carmel (like candy), not “Car Mel” is how pronounced. It’s overall a sprawling suburb of strip malls, McMansions and no where cars are not required as overall Indy area has zero mass transit options. Nice new buildings shown here of adding some density to otherwise non densely populated area.
I too am looking forward to your WEEKLONG visit to Carmel so that you can bring us photos and video of as much of it as you can. Nothing can take the place of boots on the ground because only in that way can one know the LIFE of the place.
I'm counting on you Alex.
Another impressive list of a truly amazing suburb. I know Indiana is not very transit friendly but do you think it's possible to live car free or car lite in Carmel?
Probably not a good idea right now but if this type of development continues in other cities and suburbs around Indianapolis investing in public transit could definitely be justified. This is especially true since such areas tend to be more financially sustainable than traditional suburbs.
I live car lite, so its definitely possible. Requires living within the very center of the city though where all this development is happening and it helps being able to work from home. Check out @AmericanFietser for more examples of car-lite living in Carmel
State politics are going to continue to make this difficult. They’ve kneecapped the area’s abilities to build public transportation, including BANNING light rail. And living in downtown Carmel is expensive. I think you could get away with car free there, assuming your work is nearby. But again, very expensive.
this place with trains would be amazing
It would be refreshing to see LA redevelop Pacific Palisades as a carbon copy of this.
Now that LA has burned down, I'd be interested in your thoughts on how they should rebuild.
I was in Athens about 2 years ago and Athens reminded me of Southern California. Same type of climate, same type of terrain, looks like same type of vegetation. They are also subject to wildfires and earthquakes. The difference is they build all of their houses out of cement and brick. In the news we do hear about wildfires in Athens, but not about how it gets burned to the ground. If LA adopted the same type of buildings as Athens I'd estimated that 50 to 70% of the damage from this fire would have been mitigated. Those are my thoughts, I'd like to know yours.
Watching a town in central indiana develop faster and far better than any state capital in the US is too funny
It's almost entirely White too. You love to see it.
I used to live in Carmel for 10 years from 2001 to 2011. I recently visited again and was struck by how much it’s changed in the last 10+ years. There are some strange choices in the city like all the eerie frozen-in-time statues or how every building feels the need to remind you that you are, in fact, in Carmel. There’s a big pillar next to the palladium that has arrows pointing to other buildings in the vicinity and the whole thing gives off the vibe that you’re in a video game or on a tv show/movie set. There were certainly elements that I really liked about the city, but it’s just got the strangest vibe when you look a bit closer
What do you mean by frozen in time statues? Statues usually don’t move lol
7:37 That fountain is amazing. Think of all the nice dates that can take place around that pleasant, walkable area.
Great video! Very informative. Thanks for sharing
I appreciate the architectural effort but a lot of it looks too new-ish or McMansionesque to my taste.
mot only doing classical architecture but also using the local (honestly kinda ughy) midwestern-specific brick design is fucking amazing
looks good, it seems a little too car centric, but overall better than 99% of the USA
It is only really lacking good public transit. Yeah it is a decent city center, but you still have to drive to get there if you live more than a mile away.
i live in indianapolis yes a bigger truck is a pain in @SS get in some places and its the round about capital of the USA.
Me even if i was rich i would not live in carmel or anywhere in hamilton county.
second! i love carmel's roundabouts
This city is surprisingly beautiful for a car centric suburb
My suburban town is finally beginning to transform itself, decades after so many buildings were destroyed for parking lots. Unfortunately the build quality of the new structures is not nearly good enough. A lot of cheap construction, (not terrible, but cheap), and I'm afraid of how well these new buildings are going to last in the coming decades.
Please do a video on Fort Worth’s Panther Island project!!! We’re the largest rail user in the state & our city leadership is committed to building a dense-walkable city!
Some parts of Carmel reminds me of the cities in my country (the Netherlands), they probably took some inspiration from us :)
Great video 🎉
How do we build more of this?
this is absurdly wonderful, i wish every city did this. have you considered a video on providence, RI? its been slowly healing its old wounds with a freeway relocation and new development around the capital center.
1:34 what is this art style called?
Watercolor rendering!
So glad they didnt turn everything into glass boxes. GREAT JOB CARMEL!
Great video
I suppose Carmel is as good as it gets for US cities to look closer to classical cities in Europe or Latam while still following the godawful zonification rules imposed by the car oligarchs. Not bad but those streets still feel too wide, needs more densely packed neighborhoods.
It’s hilarious because the city it’s named after, Carmel by the sea, is much better
We don't have to look like Europe, density, walkability, and livability are not unique to Europe. It's cringy every time i hear someone comparing us to Europe.
@@jamalbenhamou Lol I live in Britain's Capital of London, Carmel is more European at times than even London hilariously.
Many of the roads are still far too wide I agree but there's at least a few silver linings.
1. Plenty of room for a streetcar/LRT in the future
2. Roundabouts
Its a suburb
CARmel!
I love Indianapolis and CARmul (sic), but I couldn't listen to the pronunciation!
bautiful, thank you
Just seeing this makes me wanna visit there. Imagine if every US city was like this it would be quite incredible.
Brother, you didn't pronounce one word right lol. Monen, PoLLADium and CarMELL is crazy.
Do a video on "America's Fallen Cities" and make it either Pittsburgh or Cleveland, as those two cities have declined a lot.
How do we get Brainard or one of his protege to redesign neighborhoods in California, or teach us the ways of Carmel Indiana? We really need this to fix the housing crisis 😩
The perfect 345-minute city.
This is so cool!
This is what a metric ton of wealth can do you for town.
doesn’t matter what you say
never gonna turn away
doesnt matter what you do
never gonna fail you
Cities/towns in Connecticut need to follow Carmel’s blueprint.
So many videos I see here on TH-cam regarding walkable cities always go into the extreme and oftentimes politically tinged subject matter. This attitude comes from their frustration over the state of urban planning and these videos usually advocate for the limitation or banning of cars, heavily increased density, and an overall intense shift of the American culture towards something more European or Japanese.
However America is not Japan or Holland and should not be treated as such. Carmel's center still features roads and cars, and I appreciate that. We have always had values of individualism baked into our culture and cars represent that freedom perfectly. We do not need to demolish our culture just to have the right to walk, we just need to create spaces with beauty that people will freely choose rather than the roads.
This means that not only could I walk around this beautiful city all week and not get bored, but I could still take my car out for a Sunday drive without getting stuck in traffic for hours. That freedom of choice is really important to me.
I appreciate the optimism of your video and I hope to see more cities doing this.
Both Japan and the Netherlands have lots of cars and especially for the Netherlands driving is quite a bit more efficient for bigger cities.
I have to disagree with your take on American car culture and that it's a perfect embodiment of individualism. The US achieved greatness before we ever had cars. The majority of our most beautiful towns and cities are along the east Coast, which were built before the time of cars. Much of American history and culture has been defined pre-auto. As far as individualism, I think a proper individualistic society needs options (more viable transportation options) to give individuals more options. And I find American car culture limiting on its citizens instead of granting more freedom. That being said, I'm not saying we ban cars, but rather we invest in other options instead.
@@codythedoggo7671well said.
People act like Washington rolled up to the Battle of Bunker Hill in an Oldsmobile.
Please look into dutch urban planning more. It's far easier to drive a car there cause there's much less traffic. It's still an option. In fact it's better than our only option - driving - is here. Cities shouldn't be designed 90% for the car like they are in the US. It's a design practice the boomers started using and the experiment has had awful results.
I can’t v
Believe a city other than Charleston is building so beautiful.
I've been there and it is a place I wouldn't mind living personally.
Beautiful!
Carmel is a 100k population lifestyle center. While proving that we can still building things in different styles is good. It’s by far not the template the rest of the US should follow.
US cities look and feel terrible, with some of the worst urban planning decisions, architecture that is out of step with the times and incredibly outdated. You are lagging behind almost the entire developed world in this regard, and it will be very difficult to catch up.
Carmel resident here! (I'm new so I'm used to Indianapolis' way of doing things)
Carmel is great and has a lot of good things going for it especially the corridors around the Monon trail and newer development being more walkable bikeable etc. However I don't think we'll get any sort of transit here. I've raised the idea in local groups and the feedback has been mostly positive but there's been a fair amount of classism and racism in the replies. Carmel also wouldn't take on any tax burden here when it comes to INDYGo when they floated the idea of an extension to Carmel years ago so its a multitiered issue. Another issue is that while we're redeveloping and adding on, there's a LOT of construction (streets and/or lanes closed) that would make it hard to create bus stops with a (semi) permanent structure. If we're going to have a bus system it needs to be better than Indy's for people here to be satisfied. Another issue is that we still have too much street parking. Streets like rangeline, main street and the monon road still have street parking when there's plenty of parking just half a block down or behind the buildings or in a parking garage. The space could be used for sidewalks, bike lanes or more greenspace or spots for emergency or public transit options etc etc.
What I'm thinking it comes down to is that they want to redevelop most of the main strips before they start thinking about transit options. Which comes to my next point. Although a lot of spaces are great and are walkable, we still have issues where sidewalks do not connect or filter right out to the road. I"m hoping I can make a difference so that we can create sidewalks, upgrade the sidewalks to walking paths, and create a transit network that works well for everyone and not just the holiday "trolley" that operates 9 days out of the year with temporary bus stops and rented buses.
Also fwiw, i'm not affluent in any way. I'm part of the (mostly) invisible lower class of Carmel that serves the higher class yet is expected not to live directly in Carmel. Despite all the new apartment buildings coming online in the years past and years to come I doubt that rent will go down in price.
It's funny that you mention the Monon. It's a beloved piece of infrastructure today but when it was first proposed there was a lot of vocal opposition that sounded a lot like some of the current opposition to transit in the city. I guess the promised crime and flood of poor people couldn't figure out how to cross 96th St!
Comfy.
This is a miracle
If developers built like this other than soulless condos
Good job, Indiana
im from this area and trust me it sucks around here.
5:44 No - it is not a traffic “artery” Take another look at the map. Monon Blvd does not function as a through street
Very interesting :) maybe you would like to check the community of Val Quirico in Mexico, is a new settlement inspired in the architecture from Toscany.
As a Dutchie from Amsterdam, I wouldnt mind living here.
With all these plans, is public transit a big discussion as part of it? It looks like there's a lot of pretty cool denser design that's planned and much more beautiful, but is living car-free throughout the city viable or still not as feasible
This is the proof that you can have beautiful walkable cities without losing the car culture.
You should do a video on Hercules, Calif.
I love urbanity!
Carmel is a car-dependent suburb completely isolated from the urban core of Indianapolis. There is not a single fix-route public transportation line. Less than 4% of the population commutes by alternative modes (not car). Carmel is a terrible example of transit oriented development that is accessible to people with a broad range of incomes. It is an isolated disneyworld style place that remains exclusive and cut off from the rest of the metropolitan area...only accessible by a private car.
Later on, if connecting to Indy or receiving public transportation lines, having good urban planning is better than not. Better to have walkable areas. This also makes promoting those types of connections easier than having a line going to a not dense area with no walkability.
Yes, but it's good to bring attention and awareness to improvements like this.
So it's better to just be a suburb? You do realize towns don't have to depend on bigger cities? Their goal is to be independent and Carmel seems to be doing that, with a lot of mixed used buildings together, while maintaining a sense of place.
I can see that to many chronic urbanites seeing towns become their own with architecture that reflects the place instead of glass and exposed concrete shoe boxes might be strange, but it's a step in the right direction, even if many buildings look too much PoMo.
Your comment applies to place likes Oak Park, which would paint it as a bad place to live, but in reality, it's ranked as one of the best in the Midwest.
Bad take
Transit has been an ongoing back and forth issue in Carmel for years now. The indy express to Carmel was discontinued in 2014, then there were plans to extend the Red Line to Carmel and Westfield but that was cancelled, and now there are plans for Carmel to develop it’s own Bus System but since the election of mayor Sur Finkham, there hasn’t been an update on the topic since 2023 and Finkham doesn’t seem to be expressing much interest in public transportation at this time
It looks like a studio backlot. Maybe its just too new idk
As a local it’s pronounced as in the food ! 😊
amazing
Lived there last year until I got in a fight with my roomate when he got blacked out, definitely a great area loved the downtown area lots of jobs and opportunities
Also it’s pronounced car mol
It's actually CARmel like the flavor; not carMEL by the sea (Cali).
CarMEL by the sea. CARmel by the interstate.
If you like traffic circles, you'll love Carmel. It makes moving around the city pretty efficient. But beware of traffic diving into the circles. Yield is more of an optimistic notion than a rule in Carmel. And people don't use turn signals in traffic circles.
It's still not a walking town, and it lacks public transportation.
"And should serve as a model for car-centric suburbs"
Carmel has a lot of things going for it but the ultimate goal should be to eliminate car-centrism, not cater to it or try to perfect it. And I'd argue Carmel shouldn't be the standard model, either. A lot of their culture derives from being rich, largely white (and most people who aren't white are Asian, the "model minority") and very polished-looking, and being a community that's able to isolate themselves from actual urbanites. Like Indiana as a whole they're very resistant to public transit. We DO need more micro-communities but we need them to be transit-centered and connected. And we need these to be built for the people, not just reserved for those rich enough to pay for their own nice semi-urban bubble.
Oh no individual transportation, good architecture, white and east asian people, no great connection to ugly urban conglomerates, the horror!!
This is only one of several new urbanist developments in the US. Definately a good sign.
7:35 - What a waste of valuable urban space that pool/fountain is. Think how many CBD/Vape stores could be squeezed into that area for maximum tax revenue!
In other words, how can we make our city more like NYC or Washington DC? Edit: Haha, 2nd Street SW? Even the street names give away what they're trying to replicate... Carmel looks like something straight of a commercial/residential cluster in MD or VA, you almost expect to see a metro stop around the corner
Sometimes I wonder if Americans actually enjoy dense urbanism and extensive public transit or whether dense urbanism is something that you put up with to live where the pinnacles of professional opportunities are. Seems that you often hear about people wanting to move out of Manhattan or the District after they've made enough money or after they have kids, which feels a bit discouraging... we have 2 cities that are the total paragons of urbanism competitive even with Europe and Asia, and yet people can't wait to move out to start families
Tens of millions of people live in the New York metro and most of it is about as dense as the builds in Carmel.
People generally move out of cities because of either the COL or because of diversity and its consequences
@@tann_man Oh yeah, and clusters around metro stops in VA and MD are nearly identical to Carmel. Seems like Carmel actually resembles these more than it does NYC (e.g., Reston, Bethesda, Rockville, Pentagon/Crystal City, etc.) but COL there are often just as astronomical
Bro this seems like a good video but your killing me with CarMEL
Carmel - the new American dream.
Very nice.
Thought you were going to talk about Carmel, CA, a much nicer city in my opinion.
Every city in America needs to add at least 1 Tram line from the suburbs to the their downtown. And along the way every 1 mile add a town similar to Carmel. And just build a ton of condos. That's how you solve both the housing crisis and traffic. Its literally that simple!
With connecting buses to the neighborhoods that have at least 30 minute headways. Or else you’ll get an empty train most of the time.
Carmel is not in Indianapolis - it is over the county line.
This is wonderful and all, but they have yuge advantages------ Essentially a greenfield, High incomes, and putting it as delicately as I can......favorable demographics.
"Favorable demographics" are their biggest asset by far
People still needs cars bro
so glad we're finally shifting back to everything being skinny and pretty as a society
that’s an odd way to put it
its not. this is absolutely an exclusion to the rule. just because you see one video on one town thats decent doesnt mean theres a movement. there is none. the vast majority of new developments in america are still ugly unsafe and car obsessed. this is an outlier town and extremely rare, and its still car dependent. so dont get your hopes up at all. most american towns are not doing anything like this, and on top of that, most american towns *cant* even if they wanted to. theyre way too far gone to change for the better. not to mention corporations are running america and corporations dont understand what beauty even is.
@@exchangAscribe damn okay
@@darmar6895 yah just move somewhere else if you want to live somewhere beautiful and pleasant.
we have a centuries worth of consistent car-based provably wrong way of developing cities here in north america. and most americans dont even realize what the problem is.
camera quality improved