CHAOS In Record-Breaking Championship Of America Women's 4x800m At Penn Relays 2024
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 เม.ย. 2024
- A crazy end to the collegiate Championship of America women's 4x800m at the 2024 Penn Relays! Washington wins the race in a new collegiate record of 8:17.28 as Providence drops the baton in the closing meters of the race.
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After slowing the playback speed to .25 and rewatching the critical moments six times, I need to revise my earlier observation to report that the Washington runner actually did contact the baton and knocked it out of the Providence runner's hand but will have to leave it up to the judges as to how that stacks up against the Providence runner's swinging wide to block her. Would they be off-setting penalties? People will probably argue this one for years.
That's what I saw, too - contact with the baton.
@@richardbuchanan4720 Incidental contact!
That's because Providence ran into the other girl. Watch it again-you'll see she moved into lane two-it's he own fault.
@@leonardodalongisland exactly, she tried to block and received instant Karma. Anyway, it is the runners responsibility to hold onto the baton, contact happens
@@KrustyKlown I don't think she was trying to block-more like she just lost her bearings and "slid" into the next lane. But either way, it was her fault.
Every coach should definitely show the final 20 seconds to ALL their relay members (no matter what the distance) as a learning experience. #1. Washington on the corner tried to pass the Providence runner...both runners were equally strong at that point. Be patient, follow on the corner if you have no clear advantage to overtake the runner ahead of you.. By swinging out on the corner you force yourself to run harder, thus tiring you more. And if you do get to the shoulder of an equally strong runner, if you try to move in without a full stride on the inside runner and contact is made...you are the one DQ'd. Apparently, the corner judge ruled the contact to be insignificant thus creating no advantage/disadvantage...and no Washington DQ resulted. #2. Inside runner, carry the baton in your left hand...outside runner carry baton in right hand. #3. In a close race, when coming off a corner as the inside runner, do not drift "out" in an attempt to block your opponent. Even if no contact is created, this could be ruled as impeding your opponent's progress and cause you to be DQ'd. I do not think any judge ruled DQ for Providence impeding Washington's progress. #4. If Washington used a proper "sling-shot" pass when passing while coming off the corner technique, I think it would have been race over (Washington winning) #5. Because no proper sling-shot pass technique was used, the Washington runner lost all momentum and Providence actually beat Washington to the line. #6. Yes, there was Washington hand contact with the Providence baton (that's why Providence dropped the baton), but the ruling was that the contact was "accidental and NOT deliberately caused" by Washington. I saw no "overt action" by Washington to cause contact with the Providence baton. The Washington runner's arm swing action was unchanged throughout the final 50 meters. Therefore, that's just relay racing...PROTECT THE BATON AT ALL COSTS. You cannot win a race if you do not have the baton as you cross the finish line. So, if you drop the baton, go back and get it, and hope the judges rule in your team's favor concerning how did the baton get on the ground. In my final assessment...the final results were correct and should stand up under any protest.
Excellent analysis
This is why we have track nerds🎉🎉🎉. You sir get your flowers. Much appreciated analysis and good for the sport.
Maybe YOU should coach ! - yeah - makes me sad with little mistakes like dropping a baton - all the other girl's work gone - shit happens and it's like the easy dropped pass in the End Zone in Football or the missed easy layup in Basketball - "we don't trip over Mountains ... we trip over mole hills"
agreed. she drifted a lot....it was intentional.
@@mzbn5251 Can we pin @user-bm6ii3ny8l's analysis somehow? It's perfect. So many others here desperately need to review it.
Looks like the Washington runner knocked it out of the Providence runner's hand.
I agree, it looks like she was bumped
no, play it back in slow mo. no contact is visible
That’s exactly what happened
@@truth8508 Nope, there is definitely contact of the W runners hand on the P baton. Providence was robbed.
Yeah, Providence moved her arm back and Washington's hand came up just at the right time to hit it. Purely accidentally.
What an incredible race. I’m a Washington fan but wish the drop never happened. That’s heartbreaking for the Providence runners.
There was obvious contact noticeable at full speed that knocked out the baton. Even the commentators noticed the contact during the race.
Wow, that was exciting.
When you're in lane one, stay in lane one. It's the shortest distance. If you move to lane two down the stretch from lane one, you may be disqualified for obstruction.
the finish line is out in lane 2/3 on a relay, you dont know what youre looking at
Clearly they're talking about how the Providence girl swung super wide in the final straight @@paulsdogwalking
The Washington girl was making contact WHILE she was holding lane 1. Washington should be DQd!
That was lane 4. This is Penn.
@@paulsdogwalkingNo, it’s not. The finish line runs across every lane. The banner is not the official finish but even so the man holding the banner was behind the curb.
When you run the inside lane, you carry the baton on the inside so this can never happen.
Are you sure? It feels more natural to hold the baton in your dominant hand. But I don't know what the actual runners are instructed to do. Do they train holding the baton in either hand? On the other hand, you can be disqualified if you purposefully (it wasn't in this case) or accidentally (as it appears to be in this case) knock your opponent's baton out of their hand.
WHAT????????????? You hold baton in hand more comfortable for you. Even in sprint races, sometimes they switch hands after the exchange.
@@jeanicelewis510
It was just a question, and I was just imagining what I would do - grab it with my dominant hand and keep it there. I've never even run in a relay. I'm a long-distance trial runner. It does seem to me that you would try to keep the baton in the same hand throughout your run, because whenever you change hands there is the possibility of dropping the baton. I imagine it would also distract from your pacing.
Inside lane you absolutely switch the baton to your left hand specifically so this does not happen. The baton is more comfortable in my off hand than it is lying on the track.
EXACTLY! Just like in football-outside hand.
Poor kid - I feel so bad for her, incredible effort
Providence runner went wide right - naughty girl...and the baton in the wrong hand!
the washington girl clearly knocked the baton out of the providence girl's hand. the providence girl should have had her up, she had her hair a mini parachute behind her head
10:08 (7:55 of the race) from half way around the final turn. At .25 playback speed, the video quality is GREAT - wotta great race, regardless of controversy . . .
11:16“The replay on this could fill chapters in a book.” That wouldn't be a book I'd be interested in reading.
What a heartbreak. So much grit and grind and then that
IF the Washington runner had instead dropped her baton - this would have been a chaotic finish - since it was the Providence runner who caused the contact.
Thankfully, the runner who was the cause of the contact, is the runner who ended up dropping her baton. Easier for the judges and probably everyone just feels sorry for her.
Come on, folks, Providence VERY CLEARLY swung out into Lane Two and got instant karma. Case closed. Brava, Washington and a RECORD to boot!
Or Washington intentionally hit her hand?
I slowed playback to 1/4 speed and went frame by frame and there didn’t appear to be any contact but you could be right. I’m wondering if they’ll review the video before certifying the record.
Washington runner was banging into her on the final turn. You cant try to cut people off before you are in front of them, lol.
I have to agree really no other reason to push out - you'd actually want to stay inside - really sad to see a dropped baton though - so much effort from that first runner for Providence - maybe use glue next time
I find this who thing funny. I know NOTHING about running, I don't know the rules, I don't know who should have won, but @forrestsmith9235 is clearly a homer. Some days it's nice to be a troll.
When the Providence runner pushed out SHE set up the baton hit. I haven't heard the NCAA has adopted NASCAR rules for the last lap. Pushing to the outside AND carrying the baton right there where it can be knocked from your hand - That's ALL on the Providence runner. (Oh and I've got no like or dislike for either school or their athletes.
What a race !!!
The real problem with the race was the third leg runner for Providence. She was terrible and gave up a huge lead and gave the race to Washington. If you don't have a firm grip on the baton you gotta run with the baton in your left hand if there is a runner near you on the outside. With that slight unintentional contact the Providence runner should have never dropped the baton. The providence runer did drift into the Washington's runner lane, which could have been an infraction.
"The thrill of victory... and the agony...of defeat." :) :(
Gosh dang - I miss that beginning of the CBS ? ABC ? NBC ? Sports from the 70's
Well done girls , great dig at the end
Flailing arms caused this.
If they are both running with batons no harsh contact needs to be made to provide that the athlete with the baton wasn’t so close that she impeded on the other runners. She clearly was much too close and caused the baton to fall out of her hand. It’s not merely contact that causes these things to happen it’s how close each runners is trying to take over that inside lane. Clearly the runner was crowding the inside lane runner and caused the baton dropping.
Shame on that team for accepting victory.
If your baton falls out.... stop and pick it up and start running again. Why would you just keep running to the finish without the baton?
Full of adrenalin and going to lose anyway, so at least get to the line first.
This is right. In a relay, it’s the baton that matters. You drop it, pick it up and take it to the line. In an event in lanes, if it is out of the lane, then DQ, but here no lanes, so stop and get it.But also, you hold the baton and protect it from other runners. Lots of contact, but Providence runner did swing wide and should have stayed in lane 1 to the line.
Bingo, she knows she's dropped it. She went from 2nd to zero.
@@KTPurdy
It looks like the baton was accidentally knocked out of her hand by her opponent, but perhaps it doesn't matter whether she dropped it, or it was knocked out of her hand. As far as I can tell there has been no protest.
No doubt!!
Dawg Day afternoon! Conrats~
She could have run back and got the baton. She may have taken 3rd or 4th in the end. You can retrieve the baton as it is their own leg of the race. So long as you don't interfere with another runner there is no lane violation in this type of race.
Providence runner went from the inside lane to the next lane and cut in front of the Washington runner. No foul on the Washington anchor.
Washington anchor was in lane 1, crowding Providence, for much of the last lap
@@mettler54 Did you watch the video? Washington did bump a little on the last curve as she tried to pass, but after that what I said happened really did. And it is obvious. And how can you crowd the last lap when you are trailing the lead runner, who also was in lane one? Only a little crowding for about two seconds on the last curve.
WOW!!!! Did the Providence runner drop the baton, or did the Washington runner inadvertently knock it out of her hand? There was clear contact between the runners and the Providence runner did drift out, forcing Washington wider on the top of the stretch. I've never seen this happen before. Was there an official inquiry to determine what happened and who actually won?
Other girl hit baton out of hand. Also the W girl shoved her into the rail and should have sprained her ankle if she stepped on it.
Providence moved out to lane 2 and thus created the contact that caused the dropped baton. Washington not at fault, and their wind is totally legitimate.
I don't think the Washington runner wanted to knock the baton way, but she did.
In slow motion, it appears the baton hit the Washington runner's hand or wrist, however, even though each runner was interfering in the lanes at different times, it was the Providence runner moving further into the Washington's runner's lane that caused the contact with the baton. Washington should be the victors IMO.
I am from Germany. The behaviour of the runner in black, changing the line, was so unfair that she had to be disqualified in any case. The right team won, no doubt.
I missed that but you are absolutely right!!!
Looks like the Washington runner accidentally baton-swatted the Providence runner, but then Providence veered into Washington's lane to avoid being overtaken. Gotta hand it to the judges, they made the right call on sports(wo)manship! 😄
What a freaking beast.
Such unsportsmanlike behaviour from the last anchor changing lane and trying to block her opponent. Karma ,and she dropped her baton😂😂😂😂
@10:23 contact was made to the baton by the Washington runner which in turn knocked the baton from the Providence' runners hand.
Helluva race. Sad ending but exciting
Washington initiated contact from 125m out, trying to elbow around Providence.
It was a clear knock out of the hand by second place.
DQ.
"The replay on this is just going to fill up chapters of a book."
Yeah, so why didn't you show it?
[sheesh!]
WOW! If I was one of those Providence runners... shock, dismay, anger, confusion... how did this happen? I can't imagine what was going through their heads... just wow.
Put it in slow mo at 10:13… W crowds P in and P tries to gain lane fully again by pushing W away. I don’t run… what’s the rule on this stuff?
She held the baton in the wrong hand. Brilliant race well done.👏👏
She knocked it out of the Providence runner's hand, probably by accident, but fact remains she did knocked it out of her hand!
Another ZOLA BUDD / MARY DECKER
Providence forced her opponent wide and inadvertently made contact with her hand. Washington was just keeping her line. No foul when you slow it down.
both teams were making contact, the Washington team made first contact... but the providence girl was probably thinking.. im getting bumped im not going to go down on the rail. i need space.. ill push out a bit to avoid the rail on the straight away. and got the baton knocked out of her hand by the Washington runner.
played back in slow motion it looks like it was knocked out of her hand
Seems like the judges should be automatically review it to make sure it wasn't remotely possible for contact accidental or intentional but I digress.
Seems like the baton was knocked out of her hand probably not intentionally but she was moving to outside lane to block the other runner when it happened, so yeah Providence should be disqualified as they were.
@BWcapture She didn't block her the Official would have called it she forced her to go outside to make her work harder.
id like to see a closer view of that or a side view if possible cos that looked like the Washington runner knocked it out of her hand whether accidentally or intentionally u cant tell but they had already made contact b4 and yet the Washington runner stayed very close
The Providence runner drifted to her right, the finish would have been contested anyway, as it appeared she was trying to box the other runner out. I don't understand the comments about the baton being in the wrong hand. Right before she dropped the stick, it looked like she broke her wrist, which tells me she forgot she was holding a baton and that's what caused her to drop it. I know it must have been devastating, but the Providence girls will have a story they will tell, the rest of their lives.
Great race. What's a baton?
They should be disqualified for knocking the baton out of her hand
4x200 and 4x300m have more sense
Washington girls are awesome!
Yes, it's great that they won even though they finished second.
What a comeback from that far behind - that shows psychological confidence for sure
@@TotalFreedomTTT-pk9st Yes, if you have psychological confidence you can run the second fastest time. 🙂
@@aCycloneSteve You are in troll mode - but I thought the team that came back won ? that would be the fastest time right ? or did the Baton dropper finish first but dropped the baton ? confused in Freedomland
@@aCycloneSteve you do not finish a "relay" race if you do not carry the baton to the finish.....sorry TROLL
Lesson here HOLD THAT BATON FOR DEAR LIFE!!!!!!
Didn't look like a drop to me. Looked like Washington knocked it out of her hand.
When she dropped it, she shoulda stopped and went back to pick it up. With the lead they had, she still could've come in 3rd or 4th...but nope, she elected to give up causing her team to finish dead last.
Is it too difficult to switch baton hands so it’s away from the competitor?
dont know that Foerster knocked the baton out of Flockhart's hand but she may have impeded her on the curve before that. so potentially this could have been two DQs for separate reasons and Duke could have backed into the win from third place...
"dont know that Foerster knocked the baton out of Flockhart's hand"
Watch at 10:23 either at 0.25 speed or using the "," and "." keys to move backwards and forwards frame by frame. Foerter's fist makes (what looks like accidental) contact with the top of Flockhart's baton.
"potentially this could have been two DQs for separate reasons and Duke could have backed into the win from third place..."
Good point.
I feel like the Washington runner was running too close tucked in to the Providence runner flailing, and knocked that baton out of there.
I played it in slo motion and defiantly the Washington runner hit the baton of the Providence runner.
LOL! Didn't you see Providence move out of her lane into Washington's lane? How many lanes should Providence get? SMH. If a foul was committed it was by the Providence runner!
@@mantelltruth3053you keep posting the exact same comment and that comment is garbage! Washington made contact multiple times before the drift or baton drop. Get some glasses
@@mantelltruth3053
But just before that, the Washington runner ran into the lane of the Providence runner forcing her towards the boundary. It seemed to me the Providence runner was pushing her back - but she did end running in the Washington runner's lane. But what's the rule here.
@@mantelltruth3053 Oh geez, you’re right. I also slowed it down to see if Washington knocked the baton out of her hand. I wasn’t looking at the lanes. The Providence runner swung way out of the lane to bump into the Washington runner. They don’t have to stay in any particular lane for this race, but still, that erases my sympathy for Providence. If she would have just stayed in Lane 1 she would have won it.
Providence def drifted into the other lane, to block or not she was there.
The Washington runner on the last turn bumped the Providence runner even though she was as far to left on the inside as she could go, yes the Providence runner came out but she was ahead at that point.
Confused. At about 09:25 the announcer mentions "the Jamaican fans" but that's Franklin Field in Philly, right? I then googled "Penn Relays Jamaica" and there is one that seems to have the same schedule. What am I not understanding? Thanks..
I think the announcer is referring to the horns and noise makers, which I assume belong to the Jamaican fans who come to the relays to cheer for the Jamaican athletes.
@@jgrantsf Ohhh. That makes sense. Thanks a lot.
Dropped baton has to be heartbreak for Providence! 😢
Providence for Washington.
❤❤
Okay, I see now, when the baton dropped the Washington runner was in the second lane and the Prov runner swung that turn way too wide. Fair enough outcome after better understanding what happened.
Looks like Washington hit her baton
last 80m and both girls are exhausted. Shit happens..
Was expecting chaos. Was let down.
I feel the baton was knocked out of her hand.
The baton was punched out of her hand, probably accidentally, but that’s a sneaky way to win.
I had a Providence Washington Duke trifecta. FML.
I hear a lot of opinions. What do the rules say and why didn't the announcers mention it?
Where’s the chaos in the title of this vid? Looks entirely orderly to me including the Prov anchor not having any reaction if indeed the other runner bumped her. She was in the best position to know what happened.
serves her right for drifting
Washington knocked it out - Providence wins. Providence runner slowed down because of it also!
The washington passing high made contact and caused the drop .
so there was not talk of disqualification due to the dropped baton?
She clearly knocked it from her hand!!!
The judges make that decision. Incidental contact is not grounds for disqualification. At this level of competition that amount of contact would be judged as incidental.
2:13 =race starts=
I feel so bad for the Providence girl! Shit happens! For the rest of her life, she’ll tell this story!😢😢
WOW😮
It’s kinda bs because the Washington runner knocked the batton out of the other girls hand.
Sad, but contact happens in 800 so you must hold on. I'd have smiled back at the Penn anchor and said "we're still faster" lol
Maybe the Dutch Femke Bol can coach them.
Well that's one way to win, just knock it out of the hand....
Great, about displaying the date of the event…
Well THAT was chaotic. I wonder what the reaction would be if something actually chaotic happened.
I think chaotic is the entire meet, the crowds, the stadium, the lanes, everything about this meet is chaotic.
why not instantly pick it up and medal. i was there in front row at finish and never saw the baton fall. Just that Washington was on the board as winner, lol.
..no replay of the finish???
The runner in black brought it on herself, with the wide swing out, which looked intentional.
If Providence runner is going to force UW to outside lane, would've been wise to have baton in her left hand. Providence fault here.
Cheers for the Huskies girls!!!
The baton got knocked out of her hand ... should Washington not be disqualified?
Should Providence be DQ'd for drifting from the rail on the turn all the way out to the middle of the 2nd lane when the baton was dropped?
@@twostate7822 I don't think it is against the rules when one is leading to drift either way and it is up to the following runner to find a way past the leader without knocking the baton out of her hand. I think Providence should have won since she crossed the finish line first.
@@mauriceharting5877 Actually it is against the rules. The rules say that runners should maintain a straight path to the finish line. There's no specific penalty for drifting into another lane, but if you interfere with another runner while doing so, you can be DQ'd. In practice, many runners do drift and don't get DQ'd, but it's always a possibility.
sorry, I was looking at the wrong lap- clearly lane one runner came out of her lane
Clearly Providence's fault-she meandered into lane two (after Washington meandered into lane one) and got too close to the girl from Washington-who's arm hit the stick-not of her own fault.