I know this concert step by step and I have been listen to since long time, when I was young, it is a masterpiece of the Italian baroque instrumental music, Madam Petri is a very fine and polished player, one of the best have heard, my personal compliments
When she came to Seoul Korea, she played Christmas carols with our Junior Ensemble Team. Happy memories. Maybe in 2001 . Thank you so much and God bless you.
Anyone else find themselves panting just listening to her play? I only recently discovered Ms. Petri (through Sarah Jeffery). I have been playing at the recorder for most of my life and got a little more serious about it at church where I am part of a recorder ensemble. I have learned so much about this instrument in the past three years than I ever thought possible. This piece was amazing and I can't wait to hear more!!
Lo que más admiro de Michala Petri es la SOBRIEDAD de sus interpretaciones, libre de movimientos paroxísticos, dilatación de las mejillas, dedos muy levantados y otras payasadas tan comunes entre las nuevas generaciones de recorderistas. Es la auténtica Gran Maestra. Muchas gracias desde Colombia.
Comparto plenamente!!! Así aprendí yo a tocar y enseñar. Sin tantos movimientos paroxísticos, mejillas infladas y bamboleos como dice Ud. MAESTRA de MAESTRAS . Saludos desde Argentina!
I love the comfortable but sprightly tempo of the first movement, and the extraordinary beauty of the second. I owe my love for the recorder from seeing her 15 years ago in person with her husband’s outstanding guitar. She looks so relaxed on the third movement. By the way, she is capable of lightning speed-and delicate taste!
I am currently learning this piece. It is quite a challenge, and I am not playing it anywhere near this well, or even that fast on the first and last movements. It is so nice to hear such a marvelous performance so I know what to aim for. Thank you Michaela Petri.
Yesterday, I listened to another performance of this beautiful concerto, and suddenly, I felt that the first movement has a mood that is more classic than baroque, seeming that the composer might be ahead of his time, although contemporary of Walther, Černohorský, Bach, Handel and Domenico Scarlatti.
Smooth phrasing even when combining high with low registers, which is kind of hard to reach. And great musicianship without concessions to unnecessary exhibitionisms.
Nice fresh interpretation, a hint of innocense (which must be very hard to achieve when you've played this concerto for over 40 years). Not the incredible speed that some younger flautists achieve, but the difficult figures in the final movement are performed without a hitch. Beautiful clear and full sound, clean technique right into the small details. Impressive.
Linda apresentação! O som dessa flauta é a melhor, som limpo e agradável, minha única dúvida, ela tá tocando posição de fá maior, mas tá soando meio tom abaixo, ou seja, mi maior. Mas sem dúvida é uma apresentação magnífica!
gosh! i never thaught that mrs. petri is still playing. i am not shure if the played with the «academy of st martin in the fields» or «i musici» decades ago.
@@pinkoplat I had that 1982 recording on compact casette, which (if I remember correctly) also contained a concerto by Handel and Telemann, and possibly the well-known Vivaldi C major concerto for sopranino recorder. It's really enjoyable to hear how far Michala Petri has come, since then. On a technical, level I found her 1982 performance of the Sammartini concerto impressive, but on a musical level it was rather static. With Concerto Copenhagen and Lars Ulrik Mortensen she nailed it. :-)
Ms Petri is in a league by herself. I never fail to enjoy her recordings. The only thing I could wish is for someone to have miced her recorder more prominently. It sometimes gets lost inside the orchestra.
Still trying to master this wonderful piece after 8 years - lol!! I recently had the privilege of hearing the English player Piers Adams play this as an extra when attending the world premier of a piece written for Adams - the Crispin Ward recorder sonata at Chichester University - I was really close as the venue is small - he said that some DJ on Radio 4 said this was the finest piece ever written for the worst instrument ever invented - I think he was wrong but it is funny??
@@glenncornish6877 - Oh no, it is relevant to me - thanks for the info. I talked to him after the performance about his instruments - lol!! And he signed my programme. I hope a recording is made of the Crispin Ward sonata as it was really good imho.
Thank you very much from Russia!!! You are a great musician!!! Very useful for recorder students. You are my "teacher"! What is the model of this wonderful soprano?
Kifa Kifa - it looks very much like a Moeck Rottenburgh in Ebony/Grenadilla. I know she plays a Moeck Rottenburgh Alto on some performances of Bach, available on TH-cam, with her husband/ex-husabnd Lars Hannibal because he answered a comment to say so, so it's not unlikely. It has the sweet almost ethereal sound of a Moeck and the makers name stamp looks right - I have the Pallisander model and it is lovely - but I would love a Moeck Steenbergen (check out Anna Fusek playing Bach's Italian concerto on one - listed as Anna Fusek and Ensemble Kavka - it's the second piece they play in the concert - the slow movement is divine)
Kifa Kifa - pretty certain it is a Moeck Steenbergen in A 415 - baroque pitch - in Grenadilla - another amazing performance using this instrument is Anna ??? - group is Anna Capella - search for full concert Bach and Vivaldi - the second piece is Bach's Italian concerto transcribed for recorder by Anna and played on the Moeck Steenbergen. Thomann have them for a reasonable price - £645 - in UK money.
She had been playing Moeck Rottenburghs earlier in her career, with modern-pitch orchestras like the Academy of Saint Martin in the Fields, therefore it's a good guess that for this performance with a baroque-pitch ensemble, she would switch to the Moeck Steenbergen at A415. More recently I believe that she has also been playing Moeck Ehlerts, the ones with keys (quite unusual for an alto, but I guess that's the innovation). Have you seen those?
@@LeoCloma - there's an interview with Michala and Sarah Jeffries - on Sarah's YT channel - Team recorder - and Petri plays a Mollenhauer Modern with keys. I think the English player Jill Kemp plays the Moeck Ehlerts. Petri also plays an Eagle in some concerts (made by Adrianna Breuknik - sorry for bad spelling of her name) which also has keys but is wider bored. The keys enable a longer bore that allows for stronger low/fundamental notes (something about the tones produced when you overblow being in tune) she plays the Mollenhauer Modern for quite a few concerts these days - I've toyed with getting one but I love the sound of the true Baroque recorder - even with all of its limitations. For me the Moeck's sound the best, and Vivaldi
@@honeychurchgipsy6 I see, so the recorder with keys that Michala Petri plays is a Mollenhauer Modern, not a Moeck Ehlert. I have not come across the Eagle -- I'll have to look that up. I'm just an amateur player, but I too prefer to stick to a normal baroque alto without keys (I have a Moeck Rottenburgh and a baroque-style wooden Yamaha in modern pitch).
@@LeoCloma - I have two Moeck Rottenburghs - an alto in pear wood and a soprano in Pallisander. I would love a Steenbergen though. I actually think this is in A440 pitch on a second listen - the start of the second movement consists of two long e notes and they are definitely on pitch with my recorders (ie not sounding as an e flat)
I am trying desperatly to choose, tone wise, between a fairly pricey 1618 replica descant in maple, and a Moeck Rottenburg in Palisander... either btw will make me very happy. But how to judge it? I came here to see what the wonderful Ms Petri chooses, as this is one of my favourite concertos in the world... she is one my favourite recorderists, and I rather want someone else to make the decision for me... And it looks like she takes a Grenadilla... Mmmm now what...
@Gloria Moffit That‘s funny. I have the same problem but thinking about rosewood or olivewood. Also Moeck Rottenburgh or Küng Marsyas. It‘s so difficult to decide. I want something sweet but still for solistic purposes. Good luck with your decision.
@@paganina2330 The Rosewood was one I considered too. Lovely rich overtones to it. Slightly over my budget but could be doable...I have such fond memories of the Kobliczeks as my first teacher used to lend me his for festivals and I know they suit my hands perfectly. But I do like the hardwood Moecks. Did you know The Early Music Shop let's you trial up to 3 recorders for 2 weeks before buying? I think I might be doing that.
@@Ratwoman5000 Oh yes, I read about the Early Music Shop. I think, I‘d like to try the recorders beforehand as well but I‘m not sure whether they ship to Germany. At the moment I‘m looking for a shop in Germany where I can test them. Could be that in the end I decide for Grenadilla which was not on my plan. For me it is also important that I‘m allowed to travel with the instrument and I read that rosewood is on the list for banned wood. I seem cannot find more information about this topic…
@@paganina2330 Yes, Lucie Horsch has an antique ivory Sopranino that she can't travel with because of this.. I didn't know that Rosewood had similar issues.. regarding your location I have seen in reviews on EMS website that they've shipped to Kuwait! So Germany shouldn't be a problem. I hope you find a shop though, nothing beats trialing them in you hands first before commitment. Good Luck... Will update on my eventual choice.
@@Ratwoman5000 I‘m not sure whether rosewood is a problem or not. I just read that somebody bought a soprano recorder out of rosewood and complained that she didn‘t know she is not allowed to travel with it which was the purpose of the purchase. That was an online shop of the biggest music shop in Germany. She was really angry that she wasn‘t informed about this issue beforehand. Anyway, we try to inform ourselves best as possible and will find our instrument. Good luck with your search.
@@timothymiller1783 - yeah don't insult Michela like that - lol!! She would never give lessons to that murdering bastard - anyway hasn't he got better things to do than play music? like sorting out the crap in the world he apparently made??
ya check it out - I noticed that too. I get a numb arm and my fingers sometimes refuse to lift off the holes during fast passages - very annoying - perhaps she suffers with a similar issue and was sort of stretching - old age is creeping up on both of us but it could be peculiar to musicians - and it is worse on the Soprano I find.
She was still incredible. The spirit of the music shined and that is what matters. We are humans. I play professionally and I suffer from chronic pain due to a genetic bone disorder but my playing inspires others and I enjoy it, though there is at times great pain to play.
Kenneth Meador - unfortunately my mobility problems mean my playing is not reliable enough for me to perform to others but my friend and neighbour will often comment as she walks by on a summer's day, and I'm playing, that it sounds beautiful. I find that if I don't play for a few days I feel depressed - music definitely cheers me up even if I do sometimes hit a bum note !! I would love to see Michela play live - I missed her when she performed in London a few years ago. I love this performance of the Sammartini; I have been struggling with the third movement for some time now - it's hard!!!
@@jke518 - I think we are talking about the moment when she actually takes her entire right hand and arm away from the instrument and shakes it out during a moment when the recorder doesn't play - I know what you mean about the wrist motion - it does indeed enable players to lift their fingers away more efficiently and play faster - but I think we are speaking of something else - I am anyway.
Annie H - I think it's up to the orchestra to keep to the soloist's chosen tempo not the other way around - they do begin extremely slowly - there is actually no tempo suggestion for this part on the manuscript and most play it faster than this - also it's hard to see how Michela Petri could have played that first part any slower without losing all sense of the melody.
@@eelcj1 - who? Me, Dita H or Petri? Please be specific when hurling insults - it lessons their impact when no one knows who they are for - do better next time.
Madam Petri just keeps getting better. She is one of the world's great maestro virtuosi.
Indeed!
I know this concert step by step and I have been listen to since long time, when I was young, it is a masterpiece of the Italian baroque instrumental music, Madam Petri is a very fine and polished player, one of the best have heard, my personal compliments
When she came to Seoul Korea, she played Christmas carols with our Junior Ensemble Team. Happy memories. Maybe in 2001 . Thank you so much and God bless you.
Anyone else find themselves panting just listening to her play? I only recently discovered Ms. Petri (through Sarah Jeffery). I have been playing at the recorder for most of my life and got a little more serious about it at church where I am part of a recorder ensemble. I have learned so much about this instrument in the past three years than I ever thought possible. This piece was amazing and I can't wait to hear more!!
1st mvt 0:00
2nd mvt 3:48
3rd mvt 9:00
DIVINA!!!! Interpretazione Magistrale 👍👌👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏🌷🌹🌷🌹🌷🌹 Complimenti a tutti, Immensi Musicisti!!!! Cordiali saluti, Anna e Luigi
My all time heroine!
Beautiful! My favourite always was Frans Brüggen, with Harnoncourt, but Michaela Petri is ex aequo.
Lo que más admiro de Michala Petri es la SOBRIEDAD de sus interpretaciones, libre de movimientos paroxísticos, dilatación de las mejillas, dedos muy levantados y otras payasadas tan comunes entre las nuevas generaciones de recorderistas. Es la auténtica Gran Maestra. Muchas gracias desde Colombia.
Comparto plenamente!!! Así aprendí yo a tocar y enseñar. Sin tantos movimientos paroxísticos, mejillas infladas y bamboleos como dice Ud. MAESTRA de MAESTRAS . Saludos desde Argentina!
She sings! Always an inspiration.
Don’t know how this could be more enjoyable! A pleasure, beginning to end.
I love the comfortable but sprightly tempo of the first movement, and the extraordinary beauty of the second. I owe my love for the recorder from seeing her 15 years ago in person with her husband’s outstanding guitar. She looks so relaxed on the third movement. By the way, she is capable of lightning speed-and delicate taste!
My favourite piece by Giuseppe Sammartini. First time I see it being performed.
I am currently learning this piece. It is quite a challenge, and I am not playing it anywhere near this well, or even that fast on the first and last movements. It is so nice to hear such a marvelous performance so I know what to aim for. Thank you Michaela Petri.
Yesterday, I listened to another performance of this beautiful concerto, and suddenly, I felt that the first movement has a mood that is more classic than baroque, seeming that the composer might be ahead of his time, although contemporary of Walther, Černohorský, Bach, Handel and Domenico Scarlatti.
Absolute fantastic flute sound. Congratulations to the flautist and orchestra they are fabulous interpreting this Sammartini masterpiece. Bravo!!!
To my ears this is truly wonderful!
Impeccabile!
Very nice and beautiful. Thank you for this concerto. 👍🎶🌝
Il massimo, inarrivabile ! Ma che sacrifici !!!
Molto sacrifici....ma é fantastica!
Thanks for such a beautiful performance of my favorite baroque recorder concerto.
Beautiful!❤️❤️❤️
Tan fabulous
Thank you very much for the upload. What a beautiful performance.
This is incredible
MARAVILHOSO!!
Es extraordinaria!!!!
Magnifique. Merci
Absolute perfection!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Smooth phrasing even when combining high with low registers, which is kind of hard to reach. And great musicianship without concessions to unnecessary exhibitionisms.
Wow! You really described her as she is. So nice!
Nice fresh interpretation, a hint of innocense (which must be very hard to achieve when you've played this concerto for over 40 years). Not the incredible speed that some younger flautists achieve, but the difficult figures in the final movement are performed without a hitch. Beautiful clear and full sound, clean technique right into the small details. Impressive.
Always. Technically perfect
lovely, brava! bravi!
Bellissimo
Este concierto es una pasada de interpretacion de Michala Petri.Enhorabuena!!!!! Tomeu Estaras(Els Valldemossa) 6-11-2018.
Que belleza. ¡?!
Linda apresentação! O som dessa flauta é a melhor, som limpo e agradável, minha única dúvida, ela tá tocando posição de fá maior, mas tá soando meio tom abaixo, ou seja, mi maior. Mas sem dúvida é uma apresentação magnífica!
Capolavoro!! Sembra bach!
Wow. That's it.
Il barocco italiano. Faro dell'umanità!!!
gosh! i never thaught that mrs. petri is still playing. i am not shure if the played with the «academy of st martin in the fields» or «i musici» decades ago.
it was in 1982 by the Academy of St Martin in the Fields :)
She's only 59...or is that old or something?
Haha! and she started performing very early
@@pinkoplat I had that 1982 recording on compact casette, which (if I remember correctly) also contained a concerto by Handel and Telemann, and possibly the well-known Vivaldi C major concerto for sopranino recorder. It's really enjoyable to hear how far Michala Petri has come, since then. On a technical, level I found her 1982 performance of the Sammartini concerto impressive, but on a musical level it was rather static. With Concerto Copenhagen and Lars Ulrik Mortensen she nailed it. :-)
👍❗👍 СПАСИБО ❗
Привет из Киева.
Ms Petri is in a league by herself. I never fail to enjoy her recordings. The only thing I could wish is for someone to have miced her recorder more prominently. It sometimes gets lost inside the orchestra.
Still trying to master this wonderful piece after 8 years - lol!! I recently had the privilege of hearing the English player Piers Adams play this as an extra when attending the world premier of a piece written for Adams - the Crispin Ward recorder sonata at Chichester University - I was really close as the venue is small - he said that some DJ on Radio 4 said this was the finest piece ever written for the worst instrument ever invented - I think he was wrong but it is funny??
I was at school with Piers Adams! Not very relevent, but I don't see his name very often.
@@glenncornish6877 - Oh no, it is relevant to me - thanks for the info. I talked to him after the performance about his instruments - lol!! And he signed my programme. I hope a recording is made of the Crispin Ward sonata as it was really good imho.
Thank you very much from Russia!!! You are a great musician!!! Very useful for recorder students. You are my "teacher"! What is the model of this wonderful soprano?
Kifa Kifa - it looks very much like a Moeck Rottenburgh in Ebony/Grenadilla. I know she plays a Moeck Rottenburgh Alto on some performances of Bach, available on TH-cam, with her husband/ex-husabnd Lars Hannibal because he answered a comment to say so, so it's not unlikely. It has the sweet almost ethereal sound of a Moeck and the makers name stamp looks right - I have the Pallisander model and it is lovely - but I would love a Moeck Steenbergen (check out Anna Fusek playing Bach's Italian concerto on one - listed as Anna Fusek and Ensemble Kavka - it's the second piece they play in the concert - the slow movement is divine)
Kifa Kifa - pretty certain it is a Moeck Steenbergen in A 415 - baroque pitch - in Grenadilla - another amazing performance using this instrument is Anna ??? - group is Anna Capella - search for full concert Bach and Vivaldi - the second piece is Bach's Italian concerto transcribed for recorder by Anna and played on the Moeck Steenbergen. Thomann have them for a reasonable price - £645 - in UK money.
❤️🌹🌷🌹♥️
TH-cam editors, playing commercials in the middle of the concert!!!! Really.?.
That's placed there by an algorithm. I enjoy the concert without ads on the Opera browser.
Big italian composer!
Bravo. Sehr gute Aufnahme und die Flötistin ist zwar nicht perfekt aber sie ist voll dabei und überträgt die Meloodien sehr gut
Looks like a Moeck Steenbergen in A415 - anyone know ?
She had been playing Moeck Rottenburghs earlier in her career, with modern-pitch orchestras like the Academy of Saint Martin in the Fields, therefore it's a good guess that for this performance with a baroque-pitch ensemble, she would switch to the Moeck Steenbergen at A415. More recently I believe that she has also been playing Moeck Ehlerts, the ones with keys (quite unusual for an alto, but I guess that's the innovation). Have you seen those?
@@LeoCloma - there's an interview with Michala and Sarah Jeffries - on Sarah's YT channel - Team recorder - and Petri plays a Mollenhauer Modern with keys. I think the English player Jill Kemp plays the Moeck Ehlerts.
Petri also plays an Eagle in some concerts (made by Adrianna Breuknik - sorry for bad spelling of her name) which also has keys but is wider bored. The keys enable a longer bore that allows for stronger low/fundamental notes (something about the tones produced when you overblow being in tune)
she plays the Mollenhauer Modern for quite a few concerts these days - I've toyed with getting one but I love the sound of the true Baroque recorder - even with all of its limitations. For me the Moeck's sound the best, and Vivaldi
@@honeychurchgipsy6 I see, so the recorder with keys that Michala Petri plays is a Mollenhauer Modern, not a Moeck Ehlert. I have not come across the Eagle -- I'll have to look that up.
I'm just an amateur player, but I too prefer to stick to a normal baroque alto without keys (I have a Moeck Rottenburgh and a baroque-style wooden Yamaha in modern pitch).
@@LeoCloma - I have two Moeck Rottenburghs - an alto in pear wood and a soprano in Pallisander. I would love a Steenbergen though. I actually think this is in A440 pitch on a second listen - the start of the second movement consists of two long e notes and they are definitely on pitch with my recorders (ie not sounding as an e flat)
I am trying desperatly to choose, tone wise, between a fairly pricey 1618 replica descant in maple, and a Moeck Rottenburg in Palisander... either btw will make me very happy. But how to judge it? I came here to see what the wonderful Ms Petri chooses, as this is one of my favourite concertos in the world... she is one my favourite recorderists, and I rather want someone else to make the decision for me... And it looks like she takes a Grenadilla... Mmmm now what...
@Gloria Moffit That‘s funny. I have the same problem but thinking about rosewood or olivewood. Also Moeck Rottenburgh or Küng Marsyas. It‘s so difficult to decide. I want something sweet but still for solistic purposes. Good luck with your decision.
@@paganina2330 The Rosewood was one I considered too. Lovely rich overtones to it. Slightly over my budget but could be doable...I have such fond memories of the Kobliczeks as my first teacher used to lend me his for festivals and I know they suit my hands perfectly. But I do like the hardwood Moecks. Did you know The Early Music Shop let's you trial up to 3 recorders for 2 weeks before buying? I think I might be doing that.
@@Ratwoman5000 Oh yes, I read about the Early Music Shop. I think, I‘d like to try the recorders beforehand as well but I‘m not sure whether they ship to Germany. At the moment I‘m looking for a shop in Germany where I can test them. Could be that in the end I decide for Grenadilla which was not on my plan. For me it is also important that I‘m allowed to travel with the instrument and I read that rosewood is on the list for banned wood. I seem cannot find more information about this topic…
@@paganina2330 Yes, Lucie Horsch has an antique ivory Sopranino that she can't travel with because of this.. I didn't know that Rosewood had similar issues.. regarding your location I have seen in reviews on EMS website that they've shipped to Kuwait! So Germany shouldn't be a problem. I hope you find a shop though, nothing beats trialing them in you hands first before commitment. Good Luck... Will update on my eventual choice.
@@Ratwoman5000 I‘m not sure whether rosewood is a problem or not. I just read that somebody bought a soprano recorder out of rosewood and complained that she didn‘t know she is not allowed to travel with it which was the purpose of the purchase. That was an online shop of the biggest music shop in Germany. She was really angry that she wasn‘t informed about this issue beforehand.
Anyway, we try to inform ourselves best as possible and will find our instrument. Good luck with your search.
Guiseppe Sammartini (1695-1750)
9:03
0:55
If God could play recorder...he'd be taking lessons from Michala Petri.
Blasphemy!
@@timothymiller1783 - yeah don't insult Michela like that - lol!! She would never give lessons to that murdering bastard - anyway hasn't he got better things to do than play music? like sorting out the crap in the world he apparently made??
00:52 what was she doing with her left hand? Miss a note
ya check it out - I noticed that too. I get a numb arm and my fingers sometimes refuse to lift off the holes during fast passages - very annoying - perhaps she suffers with a similar issue and was sort of stretching - old age is creeping up on both of us but it could be peculiar to musicians - and it is worse on the Soprano I find.
She was still incredible. The spirit of the music shined and that is what matters. We are humans. I play professionally and I suffer from chronic pain due to a genetic bone disorder but my playing inspires others and I enjoy it, though there is at times great pain to play.
Kenneth Meador - unfortunately my mobility problems mean my playing is not reliable enough for me to perform to others but my friend and neighbour will often comment as she walks by on a summer's day, and I'm playing, that it sounds beautiful. I find that if I don't play for a few days I feel depressed - music definitely cheers me up even if I do sometimes hit a bum note !! I would love to see Michela play live - I missed her when she performed in London a few years ago. I love this performance of the Sammartini; I have been struggling with the third movement for some time now - it's hard!!!
@@jke518 - I think we are talking about the moment when she actually takes her entire right hand and arm away from the instrument and shakes it out during a moment when the recorder doesn't play - I know what you mean about the wrist motion - it does indeed enable players to lift their fingers away more efficiently and play faster - but I think we are speaking of something else - I am anyway.
She doesn’t play notes, she makes music as if it were just happening.
0:50 WTF?
Water on the key hole.
I dont know recorder sound so classy ....haha
This is when you maxed out the default beginner weapon in game and got the platinum trophy on PSN, you know what I mean
The volatile phone steadily file because humor normally crawl a a interesting swing. jumbled, kind fir
Beautifully played solo,rather spoilt by an over exuberant conductor
Mechanically playing the recorder.
you mean getting all the notes correct and in the right order - lol!!
Not quite in tempo with the orchestra on the first part of the second movement. Otherwise, exquisite.
Annie H - I think it's up to the orchestra to keep to the soloist's chosen tempo not the other way around - they do begin extremely slowly - there is actually no tempo suggestion for this part on the manuscript and most play it faster than this - also it's hard to see how Michela Petri could have played that first part any slower without losing all sense of the melody.
sounds like you cant play crap.
@@eelcj1 - who? Me, Dita H or Petri? Please be specific when hurling insults - it lessons their impact when no one knows who they are for - do better next time.
Unnecessarily, and publicly, nitpicking a detail of a performance is incredibly rude and insulting.