I always felt like winding and setting time was just part of the experience of putting on a different watch. Gives you a chance to fiddle with all the stuff you spent so much money on lol.
I love your down-to-earth approach to these important life-questions. Now I know I don't need winders. I would like to own some, just to look at them, but then, as you say, they'd have to be good quality thus expensive, and frankly: I'd rather buy another watch.
My dad had Jovial automatic watch and the last time he used it 2002. He passed away in 2016. Just last month I asked my mom about his watch which has been stored in the drawer since 2002, and surprisingly when she gave it to me I shaked and it works like a champ. I am using it now and it is so accurate
Thank you for this. I have only 3 automatic watches and, frankly, wear my quartz beaters most of the time. I have no problem resetting the autos when I pull them out. Your clear and trusted analysis saved me a lot of money and a lot of guilt.
I have the SWI ww-10001-55. Also known as 'The Swiss Legend'. I use every day for half a day. Had it 4 years. Makes no noise at all, have to lay ear on the case to hear it. Never gave any issues, works as new. It cost me $30 new, on sale. Has two 3 way switches for direction and number of times it will wind and then rest and then start winding again. I use on Seiko SKX which has no hand wind feature.
I only just found this video so I'm late to the comments. That said, I finally got a winder after accumulating so many watches that my rotations can last six or more months between the times I wear one watch, and that doesn't count the autos that I wear for certain occasions, like the couple dress autos I have which get trotted out maybe once a year? I have an 8-watch winder. About every month, I pull all eight off and put them back in the safe, and I pull 8 other ones out of the safe and put them on the winder. I asked my watchmaker about the topic before I bought one and he told me that if I'm not going to wear a watch more than four weeks out of the year, I should put it on a winder occasionally just so that the lubricants don't get a chance to stiffen or settle non-uniformly as they get dirty and denature. He told me that the wear will be more even and they'll keep better time for longer and they'll probably need less frequent servicing & replacement parts as a result. (I have a few with very rare and expensive movements, so this is a concern.) I figured that when I bring watches in for servicing I'm spending a couple thousand dollars at least, so the cost of a winder isn't that big by comparison, and if I can lengthen my service window by a couple years, it will pay for itself. I figure that if I only had a half-dozen watches and I wore them each for a week every couple months, I wouldn't need one. I'm way way way past that stage, though.
I have a quad, dual and 2 single watch winders. And for all those who think it's like a car idling 24/7, you couldn't be more wrong. All my winders run for a short period, then rest, then start up again in the opposite direction. So, it no different than driving your car to work, parking it for 8 hours, then driving home. But more importantly, having almost 30 watches, and wearing a different piece each day, I won't be able to tell which pieces are running fast or slow, because I never wear the same watch for more than one day. That being said, using my winders allows me to see which pieces are running off and which are running spot on. I'd never be able to tell otherwise. So for that reason, I use watch winders for all my automatic pieces. And my most accurate piece is my Oris TT1 Titanium, which has always been on a winder since day 1.
I used a cheap winder for three years and it works fine still. I don't use it anymore because most of my automatics have hand winding and I often don't set the day/date. I cannot easily read the day/date anymore anyway. I also heard the theory that winders wear out the watch sooner, more use means more frequent servicing. And do you know the price to service an Omega at an authorized service center? Last I checked was a couple of years ago it was $1200 plus parts. I only paid $60 for my 1969 Seamaster automatic brand new. I paid $200 for factory service in 1989. Now I can by two Tissot watches for the price of getting my Omega serviced.
I agree completely with Mark. Over the years I have purchased four watch winders: one is an eight place, bi-directional, while the others are four position. They were all expensive but not brand-name units. At one time or another they have all had some sort of mechanical failure, and two have had electronic failures. When i needed repair parts, and was actually able to locate and contact the manufacturer or vendor, i was given an assortment of flimsy excuses why parts would never materialize. I did manage to repair two failed circuit boards by cobbling parts from another. Are these watch winders worthwhile? ABSOLUTELY NOT !!! Would I buy them again? NOPE! Were my automatic watches any better or worse for all the hassles and expenses of these boxes. NO! In fact, I suggest you save the money you would spend on one or more winders, and apply it towards the purchase of an additional watch for your collection.
Circuit boards? No reason why a winder would have circuit boards, unless you want to program it so it turns at specific times etc, in which case you might as well just use a timer for a mains outlet, connected to a usb charger or 12v adapter which power the device. A mechanical timer is also an option if the winder needs to be battery driven. Winders are a ripoff, you really don`t get what you pay for..
@@afrog2666 you are so wrong. mine was 20 bucks, winds 2 watches, independent motors, digital controls for number of rotations and direction. very quiet, no issues in years. if it breaks i buy another one. you think that is too much, not worth the price?
@@louiscyfer6944 can I ask where you got it? I'm not spending a lot, have 3 seikos and a Steinhart and a Tisell that has a finiky crown, don't like playing with it and would rather have it on a winder. Thanks.
As to the issue of convenience versus functionality, please consider the problem of overuse of crown and stem when resetting automatics. In my collection, the biggest repair issues involve crown, stem problems. So, I find the winders eliminate the constant resetting and over use of crown and stem when one allows autos lay dormant between wearing.
I own a winder. I got it after snapping the winding stem of my dress watch. Thankfully it happened just after buying it and Ernest Johns just swapped it for a different new watch when I took it back to get it repaired. I really appreciated that, great service. I'm never going to risk winding it again.
Very good presentation, thank you. Have a winder (Chinese origin) with four watches in it. Plus six spaces for storage. Have read many opinions about winders. The question is do watch oils coagulate over time, leading to a break down in their lubrication effectiveness. I read some watch people say they do not. So why service it unless something acts wrongly? In the end your right it is a matter of convenience. Since winders run at intervals during the days there should not be any harm.
I bought one of those noisy Chinese winders that holds six watches. I hung it on the wall and each of the six arms rotates while the whole thing rotates on a central rotor, so each watch is going more than just around. The motor was noisy and eventually died, so I took the winder to a guy who repairs appliances and he put a very nice quiet motor in it. Now, I just run it during the day to allow the springs to run down at night.
We all have our rituals. And as long as it makes us happy who cares? I have half a dozen autos and the same quartz. And part of my personal ritual once a week i sit down and reset them all down to the atomic clock, give then a wipe etc. And return them to the display case/winder. It is nuts and doesn't need to be down. But i like seeing them all tick the same time etc. Weird but it makes me happy :)
When you have a large collection of 10 or more,a question of needing a winder does come to mind, just saying it depends on how busy your schedule is...
Great advice. I was thinking of getting a winder, but you saved me money. Now I'll use that for a watch box to store my watches, which I think is a better use of the money.
nonsense. i have a great winder for 20 bucks. 2 watches. i have a case for 5 more. the winder handles my 49 to 52mm watches, no issues. the watchbox cost about rhe same. matching wood.
Used to use winder but no longer do. Some broke down over time, some were too noisy. Got tired of them. Some were more expensive than others but all developed mechanical issues eventually. Couldn't justify investing in a disposable item any longer. Nice video BTW. Thanks. Really like your "Watch and Learn's."
I have a double and a single winder. I used them constantly for several years and eventually quit using them. I now see them only as a way to cause excess wear they would not have if allowed to run down and stop between wearings. They are wonderful winder that are silent even after a couple of years of continuous use.
Was considering getting a winder, but it feels more personal to manually adjust the date and time as needed. Came here for advice and got it, thanks Marc!
I agree with you Marc. Aside from the points that you made I would add that a big part of the fun and pleasure of owning a mechanical watch is having to wind and set it on occasion. I have 6 fairly nice pieces and rotate them when I feel the urge to wear something different. I have a buddy who stressed about maintaining his Omega to the point he sold it to me at a bargain. I just wear them and if something breaks I have a good source to get it fixed. Good info on the video.
I have a quad winder and keep daily wear watches in it but I am grateful for your perspective. I have many automatic watches in a wooden display case and I always wondered if it was a necessity to keep them running and now it seems it's really not.
Excellent video, Mark. Appreciate the mix of technical, economic and almost philosophical aspects to your discussion. I have a modest collection, but it does include 7 automatics, a mix of new and vintage. I looked into winders initially, I think I was enamored with the *idea* of them more than I was ever convinced of their utility. I ultimately decided that unless I purchase an automatic moon phase, a winder just doesn't make sense for me personally. Whether I own 7 autos or 70, chances are when I pick up any one off my dresser it's going to need to be reset. I've decided that's a level of user engagement I'm comfortable with. In fact, it's almost a pleasing ritual because it reminds me that this is a completely mechanical piece of wearable technology, one that can only store a finite amount of potential energy to power it. That's part of the charm of mechanical timepieces. If I didn't appreciate that on some level, I'd stick with quartz.
Thanks for your honest opinion on watch winders Marc. I was thinking about buying one for my three automatic watches but this has changed my mind. I like the idea behind them but as I change watches on a regular basis anyway it would be wasted money in my case getting one and wear and tear was another consideration also. Thanks again I really enjoy watching your watch and learn videos.
In my opinion. I wouldn't get a watch winder. Nothing against them but in my case, I feel a special satisfaction everytime y have to wing my watches and set up the time. Have 2 self winding and 1 with hand winding and hack. (1 Seiko 5, 1 Seiko SKX and a Seiko prospex) Good video Mark. 👍👍
As a watchmaker l agree with you fully. Keeping your watch running constantly comes from the old days of mineral oils and drying out. Modern synthetic oils do not. Running constantly creates wear but its very small and we regularly change parts during a service. Its normally the labour that costs. Similar to an oil change on your car, you would also change the filter
I use wonders because: 1. Good winder does not put more stress on a watch than wrist wear anyway. So if every of my watches would be my only one it’d have more wear from wearing than from winder. 2. It is curious to me to see the performance of the watches and how it goes along with time. It is surprising how sometimes Watch suddenly starts to be late (or runs way too fast) and then suddenly goes back to normal. I already figured out what watches from ones I have are super accurate in any circumstances. And I also proved one of the ‘myths’: some movements do adjust themselves from running. May be some little parts do rub each other into places, may be lubricates spread better - but not one of my watches changed performance in first months of running and then start to perform ‘on a plato’: pretty much without changes. 3. As I’m into dive watches - it saves me from some unnecessary screwing and unscrewing of the crowns. Seals in crowns would suffer faster degradation from frequent operation than a movement that would work anyway if any given watch would be my only one. And service period for movements is way bigger than service periods for sealings in the watch. 4. Winder gives a faster idea if something is wrong with the watch. At least two pieces where ‘caught’ malfunctioning on a winder and sent for repairs (in both cases while warranty was still in place). Otherwise I may have noticed that something was wrong way too late. 5. A funny argument, but still: almost everybody advices complicated calendars to ‘live’ on a winder for the sake of hardships of setting the calendar. But, if these more complicated, more delicate, more capricious movements are OK to be on a winder - why would a rugged sports and/or dive watch need a more gentle approach? Use it! Let it run! Let it work and be ready to be on your wrist at any time and then service it because you will need to do that anyway!:)
For me there is no real argument for a watch winder but one! I like to watch my timepieces ⌚ spin around in the winder. I just enjoy that. I have a good one, absolutely soundless. It's on my desk and watching it working is relaxing. 😊
Had a cheap double winder (Chinese) lasted 5 years then stopped working. Bought a second hand Wolf one which is very quiet but you cannot adjust it. Kept it for my wife's new auto watch but she does not use it. So now I rotate the collection in it, IF I remember! Agree with you completely on service, only ever had a 1 watch serviced but I wore it every day for 10 years, there was nothing wrong with it just thought I had better. Got it back and if they had just put it in drawer for a few weeks I would never of known. Might I add I'm sure they didn't as they were a very respectable family jewellers.
A J MacDonald Jr whenever I pick up one of my watches I haven’t worn enough, I enjoy setting the date and time. Essentially I take it as an opportunity to bond and re-connect with the watch and enjoy the tactile experience.
Thanks for some very useful information. I’ve done some research on winders, and come to a similar conclusion, but it’s really nice to have it confirmed by an expert!😃 I just reset my automatics when I wear them, as you do. As to your imaginary test, if you were patient enough, you work through all those minute details but when you were done, you’d only have results for one particular kind if watch! It wouldn’t apply to other kinds of movements, even if they were the same brand. Not very useful.
Well done Mark, you just saved me the cost of a Wolf winder. The cost of the winder will pay for my next service...love the c9llaberations with The Urban Gentry BTW.
Marc, love the video. Love how you go off on the test and procedures. Myself, I’ve had expensive winders and cheap winders. I’ve had both break. The expensive one was repaired under warranty once, but the company would not do it again after it broke a second time. I have a couple of cheapies that I keep in the closet. The funny part is now I don’t use them anymore except as watch boxes. I’m like you in that I set it when I want to wear it. I have a calendar watch that takes more time to set. But I enjoy the hands on experience of setting it. Take care!-Mark
Thanks for the very honest opinion, it would have been easy for you to sing the praises of watch winders and then try and sell them to us, so it’s good to see you didn’t do that :)
I agree with you, Marc. I also have a couple of winders which I do not use. Why? No idea. Of course for the happy owners of "high complication watches" such as perpetual calendars and minute repeaters, it might be needed. Not spending weeks long to have it reset. For common watches, no absolute need of them. In my country, Switzerland, we have a joke about winders; "if you work for the Government, you need a winder, for sure, because you do not move enough during your daily activity!"..........
Marc, I love these "Watch And Learns". You've taught me so much and I appreciate the time and effort you put into them. This might be a bit off-topic, but the question of if it would be beneficial to use a winder to keep a watch running constantly made me wonder... would it even be cost-effective to have my $240 Seiko SRPD51 serviced? Might it be better to, in 10 years when the watch seemed to want attention, just find a new (or maybe by then new-old-stock) 4R36 movement if the case and such is still in good shape and if not grant it honored retirement and buy a whole new watch?
I like my winders, mainly because they keep my watches in one place and safe from knocks, drops, dogs, etc. I like that they keep watches moving a bit, though they always need to be re-set because they still lose time. My winders are set to the recommended winding regimens for each movement.
I have two automatics, both are older model Orient divers, non-winding and non-hacking. I have them in a $45 double winder that has been running for years. I like to keep them wound so that I can wear them without having to dink around with them before putting them on. I just pull a watch out of the winder, put it on, wear it and put it back when I'm done with that watch. They're not perpetual calendar watches so I have to re-set the dates on months with less than 31 days. Which I do fairly religiously. I set the time while I have the watches out of the winder but neither drifts more than a couple minutes a month when they're "living" in the winder. That's the only messing around I have to do to wear those watches, thanks to the cheap winder. The problem I've had with my cheap winder is that the drive belts break eventually. They're just thin little rubber bands. I solved that by replacing the drive belts with the kind of thing that holds hair tied up, a sort of a cloth covered heavy rubber band kind of thing. I found that those fit the motor/driver pulley system very well and don't wear out. When I replaced the belts with those hair ties I sprayed some hair spray on the new belt (hair tie) to make it a little tacky, sort of like the old days of using a belt dressing on a car engine's belts. It works good, the winder has been running for years that way and all in all I'm happy with the situation. So I'd have to say that you don't necessarily need a high end winder nor is it only useful on high end watches. It's purely a matter of personal preference but if you want your watch to be ready to go whenever you feel like wearing it this is a very convenient thing to do. It also makes a nice display for those automatic watches. Most of the time I wear my Citizen BL5551 titanium chronograph Eco-Drive, which Amazon lists for $450 (but I didn't pay anywhere near that for it) so that's the "highest end" watch I own. That watch I have a light-charger for, which I do find to be extremely convenient. Like a watch winder for an automatic, the light-charger is a means of keeping the Eco-Drive fully "fueled". As I wear a watch 24/7/365 I put the Eco-Drive on that over night once every couple months while I wear another watch as it charges up. The light-charger is just a bank of bright LED lights that sit in the bottom of a sort of bowl or cradle and the Eco-Drive lays face down right on top of the LEDs separated by a pane of glass and about 5mm from the actual emitters. This keeps the Eco-Drive well charged with about the same light intensity as sunlight (at that extremely close proximity to the emitters) and being as that watch is my most accurate keeping it fully powered does nothing but good for its accuracy. Everything else I own is a quartz battery powered watch so I keep batteries on hand, have a case opening tool for the screw-on cases and a case knife for the pop-off backs and change my own batteries. I have a couple of aviators and a Seiko quartz chronograph in gold for dress occasions. I hardly ever "dress up" so while the Seiko chrono looks nice it hardly ever gets worn and is like new even though it's about 15 years old. This system keeps my watches all charged up and ready to wear whenever I feel like a particular watch for a particular occasion. For my purposes a watch that isn't running and ready to go is as useless as an unloaded gun or a fishing reel with no line ... I like to keep my stuff in immediately operational condition.
I have two Mozsly devices to manage the power reserve of 5 quality automatic watches. I tend to rotate the watches according to when they were last worn and by their power reserve. I switch on the winders for around 8-10 hrs a day only when I think necessary (not always the same watch naturally) and they keep all pieces ticking along very nicely. Super quiet, not silly money and very reliable, they can run off the mains, be linked together, or run on two AA batteries if you don't want the hassle of cables and I've found the latter easily last for over two months when operating them on the standard bi-directional 650TPD setting. They cannot overwind a decent watch - if that was the case and you wear an auto watch daily, it would break in no time. If you are going away for a long time and are not taking all your collection (who does lol), just let the watches wind down, stop and rest. it will do them no harm at all.
There are some cheaper ones that aren't bad. I have one that my wife bought me about 10 years ago now. The case is carbon fiber, it has 4 dual sections for watches so 8 total, and I think she paid about 400-500 for it. It will wind in 6 different ways depending on how you set it up. Has lights inside and a key lock on the front. I was incredibly surprised with the quality of it. 10 years later it still works great. And if you're in the room you can hear it, but I can't hear it in my bedroom which is right beside it with both doors open. I would say (and I stress this to my wife) a big thing is really look through the reviews on a product before buying. I've been incredibly happy with mine. But honestly I've got a bunch of other watches just sitting in a box that I pull out and wind too. I think for me I keep a few in rotation in the winder that I wear during the month and then swap em around. Its more about being able to just look at them than actually keeping them wound.
I think setting and winding and setting the date is part of the fun Of interacting with your watch collection. Plus I heard a wind or can over wind your automatics. I don’t know how true that is that’s just what I heard
Marc: I think you make a *great* point in regard to the number of watches in one's possession: IMO, having a dozen or more makes the idea of having a winder (or, in that case, several winders) something bordering on ludicrous. In my case, I have five watches total (six if I count the vintage Seiko LordMatic with the "Achilles heel" Quickset problem that's out of rotation) - four Seiko autos, and a quartz Casio Edifice chrono. Two of the Seikos, a vintage 6139 chronology and a dressy Seiko 5 7S36, are of course non-manual-wind, while the other two, a Seiko 5 Spacewalk and Alpinist (sourced from you...thanks again) *are* manual-wind. I have one two-watch winder, from Versa, which is gong on four years old, and while I had trepidations about going with a "budget" winder, this one's worked out well so far, having gone from near-dead-quiet to just a tad noisier, but hardly anything that would draw attention to it, let alone rouse me from sleep (there's more stuff outside the house that can do that). The bigger deal for me with the wider is simply convenience: if I want to grab one of the non-manual-wind watches on a whim and in a hurry, I *can* - and those are the watches you'd find in that winder some 75% of the time, because (1) the Alpinist and Spacewalk can be handwound in a jiffy, and since the number of watches is small, and the rotation is pretty robust, those watches only rarely run completely down, especially the Alpinist with its 50-hour PR. "Need" is a silly question here - no one needs a winder any more than one "needs" more than one watch (or any watch for that matter, if you talk to some people regarding their smartphone). But for someone with a handful of favorite watches that they wear on a regular basis, it's a nice thing to have.
A bigger question for me is concerning service intervals. If you have so many watches (automatic) that you can't possibly wear them enough and they sit dormant most of the time...Ok Ok here's the question... Is the 5year (give or take) service still valid? In other words If you have a watch that's rarely worn (or never worn) do you still need to have it serviced in that 5 year period?
Great topic but here's my point.Aside from fuel would you keep a car engine running all the time if you only drove it once a week? Surely a mechanical movement will last much longer if only wound as worn.Even a 3 hz piece is working very hard each day?Just a thought.Cheers,Len.
What about leaving, say a Rolex, "dormant" for several years? I stopped wearing mine a few years ago and had it in a watch winder which crapped out. Until I bought another one it remained stationery for a couple of years. That cannot possibly be good for it. It's 22 years old now, has never been serviced and, as far as I can tell, still keeps pretty good time.
I have a few automatic but truth be known I am cheap when it comes to buying a winder. I am in the same mindset as you as far as shaking them up and resetting them before wearing them Here is my question How often should I wind up my manual/automatics if they are setting in the display case? I heard once a month is good enough. Thanks
Great video, on a very hot topic. I agree that winders are generally not necessary. For instance I own a Bulova Super Seville, that I purchased new in 1991. I've never owned a winder and this watch actually sat dormant for almost 10 years. When I brought it out and began wearing it again, a few years ago, it started straight away, without the slightest issue. It has been looked at by my watchmaker who says the movement looks brand new, and it runs just fine to this day. Perhaps, a testament to the amazing ETA 2834-2, more than anything, but I think this proves that winders are optional. Still they are cool accessories. Have you heard the argument that running a watch in a winder actually will require it to be serviced more frequently, than laying it down for an extended period? I wonder if that is true?
Thank you for the video. I have a 2 directional watch winder with 4 slots and after watching this video decided to not use it anymore. My question would be. Is it safe to keep the watches in the winder, vertically, without winding them? It’s a matter of comfort and being able to see them at all times.
Interesting thanks. Like you say youd have to test it for so long and ive heard 7s26 can last for 10 years and im sure thats not on the basis you wear it every day. All my auto's start up from dead no problem, in fact setting and winding my autos is half the fun of them for me!
I have a winder and frequently use it with day/date watches. Too lazy to set reset them myself. Also any new watches I have I will usually put them in a winder when not using then for at least the first year. Reason being that if it is going to fail my experience has been that it will fail within the first year of ownership. Except for my Rolex Sub. It failed the second year I owned it! Afterwards a year, I tend to leave them in a box when not in use.
I like the watch winder because they look cool, and the watches inside they too. :) I want a Wolf winder for two pieces only for aesthetic reasons but, as you say, I realy don't need it, and for the price I prefer to buy more watches. But, again but, if in the future I get to have enought disposeble money I going to buy it, only because looks so cooooooool!
I have ten watches and I use my winders and love them also I my change watches twice a day but I agree setting the watch is part of the experience but even with my winders I have a couple watches that aren’t on a winder that I switch out so I still get all the “fun” lol
Winders as not necessary, similar to hand-cranks for starting motors on modern cars. However, I do hope you have a pressure gauge for your dive watches! They need to be maintained with the correct internal pressure as recommended by the crystal manufacturer, lest you risk a catastrophic crystal break with under-pressure!
I have an older (1974) Seiko automatic which will keep great time when it's active, but I made the mistake of letting it sit for 6 months, then when I started it up again the timekeeping was all over the place. Mostly it was super fast, but it was very erratic. I suspect the spring having been relaxed for a long time made it run faster. After keeping it running for about 6 weeks, it finally settled down and now it keeps very accurate time again. So I need a winder if I want to wear my other watches. This watch just cannot be allowed to sit.
Thanks for video, very good information! So far I have only Citizen and Seiko light powered watches and think that all watches should be light powered. Still there are a lot of attractive automatic watches out there so I consider to get my first automatic soon. And I think the models with a window on the backside showing the mechanism is cool! Here I wonder: even if I don't use and carry an automatic watch every day, is it enough to wave it around in the air a few minutes to keep it charged? I think it whould be enough. Yes, that may be enough bothersome for one watch but a problem if you have several automatics. Otherwise: if you use to take a daily walk you can put a watch on each arm and the natural arm waving during a few km walk should be enough to keep the watches charged.
I think I've seen a few of your videos. Personally I own a little over 40 watches. I had some major life changes. Extreme personal loss, so I replaced some hobbies I can't do anymore with one I can. I love learning about watches and now that I have a fair collection I'm thinking of buying a winder. Reason. Well a large portion of the collection is my favorite. Seiko 7002-7000s and they can't be stopped like the N35a movement. So starting them can be a pain in the tail. I have a few others that are hard to start and keep running a Tissot seastar a orient Crystal and some others.
I own a $50 CHIYODA single ( bought on Amazon ), it is quiet and I have had it for a few years now. It probably gets used a couple nights each month. I only use it for non-hand-winding movements ( looking at you Seiko 7S26 movement ), and only if I plan ahead enough to put it on the winder the night before I plan on wearing it. I could see using it, if I had not worn a watch in a while, but only because I figure they should all get a day of operation every month ( I would do the same if I had several cars ). I bought my triple calendar moonphase as a quartz purely to avoid needing to reset it.
Great video. Never is there going to be agreement on this. Even when a winder is not used. Opinion varies from winding a watch once to twice a week, to once a year. Modern synthetic oils are good for 5 to 7 years and servicing is the key to longevity in a mechanical movement, though over time the costs of servicing could exceed the value of the watch, certainly with reasonably priced watches. I think the answer is just to enjoy your watches.
Do Rolex watches need to be serviced if not used for 5-10 years, (safe queen) before temporary use? Great video. Thanks I bought a winder, then I put the watch in my safe, never used. The dealer said I needed the watch winder. Then I thought if I'm not using the watch why wear it out. Then another watch dealer said you need to use the winder to keep it lube, or so the lube doesn't dry out????? What's you advice. I've never wore it yet, I bought it in 2005, it sits in my safe. Every once in awhile I thought I would wear it to dinner, but was afraid of hurting it??? Again what's your take?
I just think of them as extra cool display cases. I do not have any yet, but love the look of Jody's at JOMW. Utility? Meh, not really, but it's not nothing. But seriously, what is the practical marginal gain from any watch in my collection over my $90 Casio G-shock? Zero. It is all just for fun anyway.
Thanks Mark. Agree with your assessment. However, just to clarify, you could do the scientific evaluation with watches that had some inherently variability from one to the next. Just need more replications of more variable watches to have the same statistical power as fewer replications of more consistent watches. Both types, if they are randomly allocated to the treatment, will reveal the truth about the winder (i.e they are statistically unbiased). Thanks for your videos! Loving my 009 on strapcode jubilee.
I want a winder for one particular watch in my collection, it’s a 1968 Seiko Sportsmatic 7625-8263 with date but it’s not quick set, painfully annoying to set the date if I haven’t worn it in a few weeks, I really love the watch and would like to wear it more often, sure, I could just do the seiko shuffle, set the time and just wear it but my ocd won’t allow me to without having the date set correctly haha, I’m at the point where if it’s stopped on say 15th and it’s the 28th I’ll just wait until 15th of the coming month then I’ll set it and wear it for a couple of days.
I have a 2 watch winder (it is a cheap one but never had any issues with that). About a week ago I took the 2 watches off it and put the winder in the cupboard. To me the bigger issues were that in reality I could only keep 2 wound and really I needed about 8. Also it meant 2 of my watches were not in the same place as the rest of my watches which was a pain. I would rather have them all in the same box (or 2 in my case). Also even if you keep the watch wound you often have to set the date anyway as not all months have 31 days so they get out of step! :-)
Well OK however, I didn’t use a Brietling for 2 weeks and it ‘jammed’ £300 invoice from Brietling to repair (some 14 years ago) when I was much younger I needed capital and pawned an Omega a year later, jammed did cost me as broker was forced to pay. Today, many winders in use and never a jammed watch. I am hooked/convinced but I wish people would understand they do not keep the watch on time, it just keeps moving in a similar way to your arm does, you will need to set them. Hate disagreeing with you as have much respect. Kindest Bob
Hey Nice video. Thanks!! If you could cover one more topic for those guys like me who have quite few quartz watches, To pull the crown or not to pull the crown to save the battery life ? does it cause battery leak and all that comes with it. Thanks.
Yeah analogue quartz defo pull out when not worn, I have quite a few watches so saving changing batterys is worth it, never had a problem with leaks etc.
I had ordered one. I however realized that money was probably better suited towards another watch. They seem to be sold at the price of gold. A jeweler tried to sell me one that looked like a cheap Chinese built pos for 300.
I liked the studies that had not been done,but have you ever heard the addiage a rolling stone gathers no moss.Thats my feelings! I had ROLEX DAY JUST .When l got it cleaned Last year the owner told me that with the cleaning it was worth 7200.I bought for 2000 slightly used,the watch lasted nearly 20 years.l got it cleaned & it was stolen from my house 1year later!! You cant wear a watch like that all the time l feel,so l used to keep it on the wineder when not in use....l liked yr not tested feeling,but if l get anouther it will go on a winder & in a gun safe......
I have 2 winders (4 winding w/6 static placements & 6 winding w/10 static placements). I don't usually have them running except when I have guests arriving. I've found it very interesting how family and friends were drawn to the winders because the watches caught their attention as they were spinning. That started sparked quite a bit of interest in the different types of watches and became the topic of discussion over and over since then. All of my kids are now interested in watches and have started their own collections just because they were drawn to my watches as they were winding away on my living room shelf. (I don't keep them in the bedroom......I like them out where I can admire them myself. Why hide such great timepieces away where they are rarely seen?) So, are watch winders useful???? I guess it's all in how you look at it :)
Heh, Heh...my watch addiction is contagious. Now my son and one of my son-in-laws has requested their own winders for Christmas. Of course this means they will have quite a few empty slots to fill in the winders....which means more watch purchases......Damn this addiction.....Hah!!!
Hey Mark, I have a couple watch winders and in my experience, they work well with my Rolex(s) and not so well with my low-end Seiko(s). I think that has to do with the angle the watches are in and how Seiko(s) are regulated vs. Rolex(s). Great video and keep up the content.
Eddy, I recently purchased my first ever Seiko automatic. SARB035 with 6R15 movement and it will NOT keep running on a winder but does keep running while I'm actually wearing it. My other two automatic watches never stop on their winders (those two have Swiss Automatic Movements). So I too am wondering if the heaviness of the rotor or some other item about the 6R15 doesn't work on winders. I've never heard any definitive information about this.
I have a winder for a Longines Ultrachron, but it replaced another winder and with this one, I've noticed that if I pick it up after a week, the time is pretty much right but curiously the date is behind several days. No idea how this could be. When I wear the watch, the date changes reliably and the time is accurate. Weird. I was kind of beginning to doubt that I should use the winder anyway so I may just do what you do.
Good vid, I agree that it would be pretty hard to analyze, like you say the samples would need to be high end to be viable to measure as mass produced will vary too much, I don't use them myself but possibly would with a perpetual complication.
My winder is noisy, so I have it plugged into a timer plug. It switches off between 10.45pm and 8.30am. After all , the watch would just be sat on the bedside table at night anyway, no?
I always felt like winding and setting time was just part of the experience of putting on a different watch. Gives you a chance to fiddle with all the stuff you spent so much money on lol.
A friend at work gave me a winder as a gift. I put my quartz watches in it LOL
Ha!
That's a power move
I have seen someone, just for a gag, store his G-shock in one
LOL Then the quartz watches should be turbo charged, right?
Yeah, good storage out of dust... as long as it's off right ?! 🤨😅
Bought a $10 rotating display base, super glued my watch pillow to it, sat it on its side and it keeps my Seiko 5 SNK807 constantly keeping time.
Lol!
i paid 17 dollars for a double winder with independent motors, super quiet and with separate digital controls. no issues whatsoever.
are you sure you are not overwinding it or at least putting additional wear on the rotor bearing ?
I love your down-to-earth approach to these important life-questions. Now I know I don't need winders. I would like to own some, just to look at them, but then, as you say, they'd have to be good quality thus expensive, and frankly: I'd rather buy another watch.
Thank you.
This is such an underrated channel. Thank you for all the very informative content Marc.
My dad had Jovial automatic watch and the last time he used it 2002. He passed away in 2016. Just last month I asked my mom about his watch which has been stored in the drawer since 2002, and surprisingly when she gave it to me I shaked and it works like a champ. I am using it now and it is so accurate
Thank you for this. I have only 3 automatic watches and, frankly, wear my quartz beaters most of the time. I have no problem resetting the autos when I pull them out. Your clear and trusted analysis saved me a lot of money and a lot of guilt.
Guilt...?
I have the SWI ww-10001-55. Also known as 'The Swiss Legend'. I use every day for half a day. Had it 4 years. Makes no noise at all, have to lay ear on the case to hear it. Never gave any issues, works as new. It cost me $30 new, on sale. Has two 3 way switches for direction and number of times it will wind and then rest and then start winding again. I use on Seiko SKX which has no hand wind feature.
I only just found this video so I'm late to the comments. That said, I finally got a winder after accumulating so many watches that my rotations can last six or more months between the times I wear one watch, and that doesn't count the autos that I wear for certain occasions, like the couple dress autos I have which get trotted out maybe once a year? I have an 8-watch winder. About every month, I pull all eight off and put them back in the safe, and I pull 8 other ones out of the safe and put them on the winder. I asked my watchmaker about the topic before I bought one and he told me that if I'm not going to wear a watch more than four weeks out of the year, I should put it on a winder occasionally just so that the lubricants don't get a chance to stiffen or settle non-uniformly as they get dirty and denature. He told me that the wear will be more even and they'll keep better time for longer and they'll probably need less frequent servicing & replacement parts as a result. (I have a few with very rare and expensive movements, so this is a concern.) I figured that when I bring watches in for servicing I'm spending a couple thousand dollars at least, so the cost of a winder isn't that big by comparison, and if I can lengthen my service window by a couple years, it will pay for itself. I figure that if I only had a half-dozen watches and I wore them each for a week every couple months, I wouldn't need one. I'm way way way past that stage, though.
I have a quad, dual and 2 single watch winders. And for all those who think it's like a car idling 24/7, you couldn't be more wrong. All my winders run for a short period, then rest, then start up again in the opposite direction. So, it no different than driving your car to work, parking it for 8 hours, then driving home.
But more importantly, having almost 30 watches, and wearing a different piece each day, I won't be able to tell which pieces are running fast or slow, because I never wear the same watch for more than one day. That being said, using my winders allows me to see which pieces are running off and which are running spot on. I'd never be able to tell otherwise. So for that reason, I use watch winders for all my automatic pieces. And my most accurate piece is my Oris TT1 Titanium, which has always been on a winder since day 1.
Why do you need thirty watches? Do you have thirty cars, or thirty houses or thirty wives?
@@gilessteve because i can...
I used a cheap winder for three years and it works fine still. I don't use it anymore because most of my automatics have hand winding and I often don't set the day/date. I cannot easily read the day/date anymore anyway. I also heard the theory that winders wear out the watch sooner, more use means more frequent servicing. And do you know the price to service an Omega at an authorized service center? Last I checked was a couple of years ago it was $1200 plus parts. I only paid $60 for my 1969 Seamaster automatic brand new. I paid $200 for factory service in 1989. Now I can by two Tissot watches for the price of getting my Omega serviced.
I agree completely with Mark. Over the years I have purchased four watch winders: one is an eight place, bi-directional, while the others are four position. They were all expensive but not brand-name units. At one time or another they have all had some sort of mechanical failure, and two have had electronic failures. When i needed repair parts, and was actually able to locate and contact the manufacturer or vendor, i was given an assortment of flimsy excuses why parts would never materialize. I did manage to repair two failed circuit boards by cobbling parts from another. Are these watch winders worthwhile? ABSOLUTELY NOT !!! Would I buy them again? NOPE! Were my automatic watches any better or worse for all the hassles and expenses of these boxes. NO! In fact, I suggest you save the money you would spend on one or more winders, and apply it towards the purchase of an additional watch for your collection.
Or put that money towards a servicing.
Great advice!
Circuit boards?
No reason why a winder would have circuit boards, unless you want to program it so it turns at specific times etc, in which case you might as well just use a timer for a mains outlet, connected to a usb charger or 12v adapter which power the device.
A mechanical timer is also an option if the winder needs to be battery driven.
Winders are a ripoff, you really don`t get what you pay for..
@@afrog2666 you are so wrong. mine was 20 bucks, winds 2 watches, independent motors, digital controls for number of rotations and direction. very quiet, no issues in years. if it breaks i buy another one. you think that is too much, not worth the price?
@@louiscyfer6944 can I ask where you got it? I'm not spending a lot, have 3 seikos and a Steinhart and a Tisell that has a finiky crown, don't like playing with it and would rather have it on a winder. Thanks.
As to the issue of convenience versus functionality, please consider the problem of overuse of crown and stem when resetting automatics. In my collection, the biggest repair issues involve crown, stem problems. So, I find the winders eliminate the constant resetting and over use of crown and stem when one allows autos lay dormant between wearing.
I own a winder. I got it after snapping the winding stem of my dress watch. Thankfully it happened just after buying it and Ernest Johns just swapped it for a different new watch when I took it back to get it repaired. I really appreciated that, great service. I'm never going to risk winding it again.
Sounds great.
Very good presentation, thank you. Have a winder (Chinese origin) with four watches in it. Plus six spaces for storage. Have read many opinions about winders. The question is do watch oils coagulate over time, leading to a break down in their lubrication effectiveness. I read some watch people say they do not. So why service it unless something acts wrongly? In the end your right it is a matter of convenience. Since winders run at intervals during the days there should not be any harm.
I bought one of those noisy Chinese winders that holds six watches. I hung it on the wall and each of the six arms rotates while the whole thing rotates on a central rotor, so each watch is going more than just around. The motor was noisy and eventually died, so I took the winder to a guy who repairs appliances and he put a very nice quiet motor in it. Now, I just run it during the day to allow the springs to run down at night.
Your opinion really helps. Im with you, just set the time & date and good to go. Don't need to burden my mind with this watch winder. Thanks.
I use mine as a rotation aid, putting the one I plan to wear the next day on my winder the night before,
To me part of the joy I get from watches is setting them and winding them that's part of the love I have for my watches
Right, it's a bonding time.
Just as you, I set the time and wind the watch when needed. Literally takes seconds and has become a sort of a morning ritual :)
Exactly.
@@islandwatch I like that too. but will the threads on the stem be a problem if you I reset it too often? I'm worried about the crown.
We all have our rituals. And as long as it makes us happy who cares? I have half a dozen autos and the same quartz. And part of my personal ritual once a week i sit down and reset them all down to the atomic clock, give then a wipe etc. And return them to the display case/winder. It is nuts and doesn't need to be down. But i like seeing them all tick the same time etc. Weird but it makes me happy :)
When you have a large collection of 10 or more,a question of needing a winder does come to mind, just saying it depends on how busy your schedule is...
Great advice. I was thinking of getting a winder, but you saved me money. Now I'll use that for a watch box to store my watches, which I think is a better use of the money.
nonsense. i have a great winder for 20 bucks. 2 watches. i have a case for 5 more. the winder handles my 49 to 52mm watches, no
issues. the watchbox cost about rhe same. matching wood.
Used to use winder but no longer do. Some broke down over time, some were too noisy. Got tired of them. Some were more expensive than others but all developed mechanical issues eventually. Couldn't justify investing in a disposable item any longer. Nice video BTW. Thanks. Really like your "Watch and Learn's."
Appreciate it.
I have a double and a single winder. I used them constantly for several years and eventually quit using them. I now see them only as a way to cause excess wear they would not have if allowed to run down and stop between wearings. They are wonderful winder that are silent even after a couple of years of continuous use.
Great winders are nice. But not necessary.
Was considering getting a winder, but it feels more personal to manually adjust the date and time as needed. Came here for advice and got it, thanks Marc!
I agree with you Marc. Aside from the points that you made I would add that a big part of the fun and pleasure of owning a mechanical watch is having to wind and set it on occasion. I have 6 fairly nice pieces and rotate them when I feel the urge to wear something different. I have a buddy who stressed about maintaining his Omega to the point he sold it to me at a bargain. I just wear them and if something breaks I have a good source to get it fixed. Good info on the video.
Thanks!
Thanks Mark. Love your watch and learns and really appreciate your honest opinions.
agree 👍
Yep. Appreciate the honesty.
Same here 👍
Thank you!
Thanks awesome! I was thinking along the same way! I wear my SKX009J all the time even to bed anyway
!😊
Very informative, thanks Marc. After seeing this video. I turned off my winder. I also heard it may overwind a watch and cause premature wear.
I have a quad winder and keep daily wear watches in it but I am grateful for your perspective. I have many automatic watches in a wooden display case and I always wondered if it was a necessity to keep them running and now it seems it's really not.
Thanks!
Excellent video, Mark. Appreciate the mix of technical, economic and almost philosophical aspects to your discussion. I have a modest collection, but it does include 7 automatics, a mix of new and vintage. I looked into winders initially, I think I was enamored with the *idea* of them more than I was ever convinced of their utility. I ultimately decided that unless I purchase an automatic moon phase, a winder just doesn't make sense for me personally. Whether I own 7 autos or 70, chances are when I pick up any one off my dresser it's going to need to be reset. I've decided that's a level of user engagement I'm comfortable with. In fact, it's almost a pleasing ritual because it reminds me that this is a completely mechanical piece of wearable technology, one that can only store a finite amount of potential energy to power it. That's part of the charm of mechanical timepieces. If I didn't appreciate that on some level, I'd stick with quartz.
Thanks for checking it out.
Thanks for your honest opinion on watch winders Marc. I was thinking about buying one for my three automatic watches but this has changed my mind. I like the idea behind them but as I change watches on a regular basis anyway it would be wasted money in my case getting one and wear and tear was another consideration also. Thanks again I really enjoy watching your watch and learn videos.
In my opinion. I wouldn't get a watch winder. Nothing against them but in my case, I feel a special satisfaction everytime y have to wing my watches and set up the time. Have 2 self winding and 1 with hand winding and hack. (1 Seiko 5, 1 Seiko SKX and a Seiko prospex) Good video Mark. 👍👍
As a watchmaker l agree with you fully. Keeping your watch running constantly comes from the old days of mineral oils and drying out. Modern synthetic oils do not.
Running constantly creates wear but its very small and we regularly change parts during a service. Its normally the labour that costs. Similar to an oil change on your car, you would also change the filter
my mechanical watches are more just keepsakes ....they dont need to be wound and running .
Looking at things from an engineers point of view. Once again Marc you’ve amazed, confused and educated us.
Then I've done my job!
I use wonders because:
1. Good winder does not put more stress on a watch than wrist wear anyway. So if every of my watches would be my only one it’d have more wear from wearing than from winder.
2. It is curious to me to see the performance of the watches and how it goes along with time. It is surprising how sometimes Watch suddenly starts to be late (or runs way too fast) and then suddenly goes back to normal. I already figured out what watches from ones I have are super accurate in any circumstances. And I also proved one of the ‘myths’: some movements do adjust themselves from running. May be some little parts do rub each other into places, may be lubricates spread better - but not one of my watches changed performance in first months of running and then start to perform ‘on a plato’: pretty much without changes.
3. As I’m into dive watches - it saves me from some unnecessary screwing and unscrewing of the crowns. Seals in crowns would suffer faster degradation from frequent operation than a movement that would work anyway if any given watch would be my only one. And service period for movements is way bigger than service periods for sealings in the watch.
4. Winder gives a faster idea if something is wrong with the watch. At least two pieces where ‘caught’ malfunctioning on a winder and sent for repairs (in both cases while warranty was still in place). Otherwise I may have noticed that something was wrong way too late.
5. A funny argument, but still: almost everybody advices complicated calendars to ‘live’ on a winder for the sake of hardships of setting the calendar. But, if these more complicated, more delicate, more capricious movements are OK to be on a winder - why would a rugged sports and/or dive watch need a more gentle approach? Use it! Let it run! Let it work and be ready to be on your wrist at any time and then service it because you will need to do that anyway!:)
Thanks for commenting! Nice to hear your reasoning.
For me there is no real argument for a watch winder but one!
I like to watch my timepieces ⌚ spin around in the winder. I just enjoy that. I have a good one, absolutely soundless. It's on my desk and watching it working is relaxing. 😊
Like a washing machine :)
Had a cheap double winder (Chinese) lasted 5 years then stopped working. Bought a second hand Wolf one which is very quiet but you cannot adjust it. Kept it for my wife's new auto watch but she does not use it. So now I rotate the collection in it, IF I remember!
Agree with you completely on service, only ever had a 1 watch serviced but I wore it every day for 10 years, there was nothing wrong with it just thought I had better. Got it back and if they had just put it in drawer for a few weeks I would never of known. Might I add I'm sure they didn't as they were a very respectable family jewellers.
Thanks for sharing.
I'm like you, I reset the time and date when I change watches.
A J MacDonald Jr whenever I pick up one of my watches I haven’t worn enough, I enjoy setting the date and time. Essentially I take it as an opportunity to bond and re-connect with the watch and enjoy the tactile experience.
Sometimes, I only set the time and don't bother to set the day/date. Why bother setting up the day/date when I know what day or date is?
Yes, it's a nice experience.
Craig Rodgers I have exactly the same opinion! 👍🏻
Cannot more agree with you
The best winder explanation I've seen,great job😎👍
Thanks for some very useful information. I’ve done some research on winders, and come to a similar conclusion, but it’s really nice to have it confirmed by an expert!😃
I just reset my automatics when I wear them, as you do.
As to your imaginary test, if you were patient enough, you work through all those minute details but when you were done, you’d only have results for one particular kind if watch! It wouldn’t apply to other kinds of movements, even if they were the same brand. Not very useful.
Thanks for watching.
Well done Mark, you just saved me the cost of a Wolf winder. The cost of the winder will pay for my next service...love the c9llaberations with The Urban Gentry BTW.
Watch winders are a cool way to display a collection of watch collection. That’s the reason to buy one.
Visual interest I guess.
Marc, love the video. Love how you go off on the test and procedures. Myself, I’ve had expensive winders and cheap winders. I’ve had both break. The expensive one was repaired under warranty once, but the company would not do it again after it broke a second time. I have a couple of cheapies that I keep in the closet. The funny part is now I don’t use them anymore except as watch boxes. I’m like you in that I set it when I want to wear it. I have a calendar watch that takes more time to set. But I enjoy the hands on experience of setting it. Take care!-Mark
Thanks for watching! Test Procedures! Used to write many of them. :)
Thanks for the very honest opinion, it would have been easy for you to sing the praises of watch winders and then try and sell them to us, so it’s good to see you didn’t do that :)
I agree with you, Marc. I also have a couple of winders which I do not use. Why? No idea. Of course for the happy owners of "high complication watches" such as perpetual calendars and minute repeaters, it might be needed. Not spending weeks long to have it reset. For common watches, no absolute need of them. In my country, Switzerland, we have a joke about winders; "if you work for the Government, you need a winder, for sure, because you do not move enough during your daily activity!"..........
LOL!
Marc, I love these "Watch And Learns". You've taught me so much and I appreciate the time and effort you put into them.
This might be a bit off-topic, but the question of if it would be beneficial to use a winder to keep a watch running constantly made me wonder... would it even be cost-effective to have my $240 Seiko SRPD51 serviced? Might it be better to, in 10 years when the watch seemed to want attention, just find a new (or maybe by then new-old-stock) 4R36 movement if the case and such is still in good shape and if not grant it honored retirement and buy a whole new watch?
Your willingness to share your knowledge make be what to buy watches from you.
I like my winders, mainly because they keep my watches in one place and safe from knocks, drops, dogs, etc. I like that they keep watches moving a bit, though they always need to be re-set because they still lose time. My winders are set to the recommended winding regimens for each movement.
I have two automatics, both are older model Orient divers, non-winding and non-hacking. I have them in a $45 double winder that has been running for years. I like to keep them wound so that I can wear them without having to dink around with them before putting them on. I just pull a watch out of the winder, put it on, wear it and put it back when I'm done with that watch. They're not perpetual calendar watches so I have to re-set the dates on months with less than 31 days. Which I do fairly religiously. I set the time while I have the watches out of the winder but neither drifts more than a couple minutes a month when they're "living" in the winder. That's the only messing around I have to do to wear those watches, thanks to the cheap winder.
The problem I've had with my cheap winder is that the drive belts break eventually. They're just thin little rubber bands. I solved that by replacing the drive belts with the kind of thing that holds hair tied up, a sort of a cloth covered heavy rubber band kind of thing. I found that those fit the motor/driver pulley system very well and don't wear out. When I replaced the belts with those hair ties I sprayed some hair spray on the new belt (hair tie) to make it a little tacky, sort of like the old days of using a belt dressing on a car engine's belts. It works good, the winder has been running for years that way and all in all I'm happy with the situation.
So I'd have to say that you don't necessarily need a high end winder nor is it only useful on high end watches. It's purely a matter of personal preference but if you want your watch to be ready to go whenever you feel like wearing it this is a very convenient thing to do. It also makes a nice display for those automatic watches.
Most of the time I wear my Citizen BL5551 titanium chronograph Eco-Drive, which Amazon lists for $450 (but I didn't pay anywhere near that for it) so that's the "highest end" watch I own. That watch I have a light-charger for, which I do find to be extremely convenient. Like a watch winder for an automatic, the light-charger is a means of keeping the Eco-Drive fully "fueled". As I wear a watch 24/7/365 I put the Eco-Drive on that over night once every couple months while I wear another watch as it charges up. The light-charger is just a bank of bright LED lights that sit in the bottom of a sort of bowl or cradle and the Eco-Drive lays face down right on top of the LEDs separated by a pane of glass and about 5mm from the actual emitters. This keeps the Eco-Drive well charged with about the same light intensity as sunlight (at that extremely close proximity to the emitters) and being as that watch is my most accurate keeping it fully powered does nothing but good for its accuracy.
Everything else I own is a quartz battery powered watch so I keep batteries on hand, have a case opening tool for the screw-on cases and a case knife for the pop-off backs and change my own batteries. I have a couple of aviators and a Seiko quartz chronograph in gold for dress occasions. I hardly ever "dress up" so while the Seiko chrono looks nice it hardly ever gets worn and is like new even though it's about 15 years old.
This system keeps my watches all charged up and ready to wear whenever I feel like a particular watch for a particular occasion. For my purposes a watch that isn't running and ready to go is as useless as an unloaded gun or a fishing reel with no line ... I like to keep my stuff in immediately operational condition.
I have two Mozsly devices to manage the power reserve of 5 quality automatic watches. I tend to rotate the watches according to when they were last worn and by their power reserve. I switch on the winders for around 8-10 hrs a day only when I think necessary (not always the same watch naturally) and they keep all pieces ticking along very nicely. Super quiet, not silly money and very reliable, they can run off the mains, be linked together, or run on two AA batteries if you don't want the hassle of cables and I've found the latter easily last for over two months when operating them on the standard bi-directional 650TPD setting. They cannot overwind a decent watch - if that was the case and you wear an auto watch daily, it would break in no time. If you are going away for a long time and are not taking all your collection (who does lol), just let the watches wind down, stop and rest. it will do them no harm at all.
There are some cheaper ones that aren't bad. I have one that my wife bought me about 10 years ago now. The case is carbon fiber, it has 4 dual sections for watches so 8 total, and I think she paid about 400-500 for it. It will wind in 6 different ways depending on how you set it up. Has lights inside and a key lock on the front. I was incredibly surprised with the quality of it. 10 years later it still works great. And if you're in the room you can hear it, but I can't hear it in my bedroom which is right beside it with both doors open. I would say (and I stress this to my wife) a big thing is really look through the reviews on a product before buying. I've been incredibly happy with mine. But honestly I've got a bunch of other watches just sitting in a box that I pull out and wind too. I think for me I keep a few in rotation in the winder that I wear during the month and then swap em around. Its more about being able to just look at them than actually keeping them wound.
I think setting and winding and setting the date is part of the fun Of interacting with your watch collection. Plus I heard a wind or can over wind your automatics. I don’t know how true that is that’s just what I heard
I have a winder which I bought from ebay for $65 and its been running for about a year and a half non stop, still going strong.
Sounds great. Maybe you're lucky.
Thx! Been thinking about these lately. You cleared things up for me.
Great!
Marc: I think you make a *great* point in regard to the number of watches in one's possession: IMO, having a dozen or more makes the idea of having a winder (or, in that case, several winders) something bordering on ludicrous. In my case, I have five watches total (six if I count the vintage Seiko LordMatic with the "Achilles heel" Quickset problem that's out of rotation) - four Seiko autos, and a quartz Casio Edifice chrono. Two of the Seikos, a vintage 6139 chronology and a dressy Seiko 5 7S36, are of course non-manual-wind, while the other two, a Seiko 5 Spacewalk and Alpinist (sourced from you...thanks again) *are* manual-wind. I have one two-watch winder, from Versa, which is gong on four years old, and while I had trepidations about going with a "budget" winder, this one's worked out well so far, having gone from near-dead-quiet to just a tad noisier, but hardly anything that would draw attention to it, let alone rouse me from sleep (there's more stuff outside the house that can do that). The bigger deal for me with the wider is simply convenience: if I want to grab one of the non-manual-wind watches on a whim and in a hurry, I *can* - and those are the watches you'd find in that winder some 75% of the time, because (1) the Alpinist and Spacewalk can be handwound in a jiffy, and since the number of watches is small, and the rotation is pretty robust, those watches only rarely run completely down, especially the Alpinist with its 50-hour PR. "Need" is a silly question here - no one needs a winder any more than one "needs" more than one watch (or any watch for that matter, if you talk to some people regarding their smartphone). But for someone with a handful of favorite watches that they wear on a regular basis, it's a nice thing to have.
I'm thinking of launching a kickstarter for a manual-wound automatic watch winder!
LOL, great idea!
A bigger question for me is concerning service intervals. If you have so many watches (automatic) that you can't possibly wear them enough and they sit dormant most of the time...Ok Ok here's the question... Is the 5year (give or take) service still valid? In other words If you have a watch that's rarely worn (or never worn) do you still need to have it serviced in that 5 year period?
Great topic but here's my point.Aside from fuel would you keep a car engine running all the time if you only drove it once a week? Surely a mechanical movement will last much longer if only wound as worn.Even a 3 hz piece is working very hard each day?Just a thought.Cheers,Len.
Very good point and perspective.
What about leaving, say a Rolex, "dormant" for several years? I stopped wearing mine a few years ago and had it in a watch winder which crapped out. Until I bought another one it remained stationery for a couple of years. That cannot possibly be good for it. It's 22 years old now, has never been serviced and, as far as I can tell, still keeps pretty good time.
I use a winder to display my Breitling. Other than that I could've done without.
I have a few automatic but truth be known I am cheap when it comes to buying a winder. I am in the same mindset as you as far as shaking them up and resetting them before wearing them
Here is my question
How often should I wind up my manual/automatics if they are setting in the display case?
I heard once a month is good enough.
Thanks
Great video, on a very hot topic. I agree that winders are generally not necessary. For instance I own a Bulova Super Seville, that I purchased new in 1991.
I've never owned a winder and this watch actually sat dormant for almost 10 years.
When I brought it out and began wearing it again, a few years ago, it started straight away, without the slightest issue. It has been looked at by my watchmaker who says the movement looks brand new, and it runs just fine to this day. Perhaps, a testament to the amazing ETA 2834-2, more than anything, but I think this proves that winders are optional. Still they are cool accessories.
Have you heard the argument that running a watch in a winder actually will require it to be serviced more frequently, than laying it down for an extended period? I wonder if that is true?
I've heard arguments both ways, but there's no proof either.
Thank you for the video. I have a 2 directional watch winder with 4 slots and after watching this video decided to not use it anymore. My question would be. Is it safe to keep the watches in the winder, vertically, without winding them? It’s a matter of comfort and being able to see them at all times.
Interesting thanks. Like you say youd have to test it for so long and ive heard 7s26 can last for 10 years and im sure thats not on the basis you wear it every day. All my auto's start up from dead no problem, in fact setting and winding my autos is half the fun of them for me!
It's all part of the experience.
I have a winder and frequently use it with day/date watches. Too lazy to set reset them myself. Also any new watches I have I will usually put them in a winder when not using then for at least the first year. Reason being that if it is going to fail my experience has been that it will fail within the first year of ownership. Except for my Rolex Sub. It failed the second year I owned it! Afterwards a year, I tend to leave them in a box when not in use.
Good points!
I like the watch winder because they look cool, and the watches inside they too. :)
I want a Wolf winder for two pieces only for aesthetic reasons but, as you say, I realy don't need it, and for the price I prefer to buy more watches.
But, again but, if in the future I get to have enought disposeble money I going to buy it, only because looks so cooooooool!
That's a reason then.
I enjoy getting the watch going and setting it. It’s part of the fun of having a mechanical watch
I have ten watches and I use my winders and love them also I my change watches twice a day but I agree setting the watch is part of the experience but even with my winders I have a couple watches that aren’t on a winder that I switch out so I still get all the “fun” lol
Winders as not necessary, similar to hand-cranks for starting motors on modern cars. However, I do hope you have a pressure gauge for your dive watches! They need to be maintained with the correct internal pressure as recommended by the crystal manufacturer, lest you risk a catastrophic crystal break with under-pressure!
I'd use a winner for a perpetual calendar watch, and maybe a vintage watch that doesn't have quickset date. Other then that, it's not a big deal.
Correct!
I have an older (1974) Seiko automatic which will keep great time when it's active, but I made the mistake of letting it sit for 6 months, then when I started it up again the timekeeping was all over the place. Mostly it was super fast, but it was very erratic. I suspect the spring having been relaxed for a long time made it run faster. After keeping it running for about 6 weeks, it finally settled down and now it keeps very accurate time again. So I need a winder if I want to wear my other watches. This watch just cannot be allowed to sit.
Thanks for video, very good information!
So far I have only Citizen and Seiko light powered watches and think that all watches should be light powered. Still there are a lot of attractive automatic watches out there so I consider to get my first automatic soon. And I think the models with a window on the backside showing the mechanism is cool!
Here I wonder: even if I don't use and carry an automatic watch every day, is it enough to wave it around in the air a few minutes to keep it charged? I think it whould be enough. Yes, that may be enough bothersome for one watch but a problem if you have several automatics.
Otherwise: if you use to take a daily walk you can put a watch on each arm and the natural arm waving during a few km walk should be enough to keep the watches charged.
I think I've seen a few of your videos. Personally I own a little over 40 watches. I had some major life changes. Extreme personal loss, so I replaced some hobbies I can't do anymore with one I can. I love learning about watches and now that I have a fair collection I'm thinking of buying a winder. Reason. Well a large portion of the collection is my favorite. Seiko 7002-7000s and they can't be stopped like the N35a movement. So starting them can be a pain in the tail. I have a few others that are hard to start and keep running a Tissot seastar a orient Crystal and some others.
I own a $50 CHIYODA single ( bought on Amazon ), it is quiet and I have had it for a few years now. It probably gets used a couple nights each month. I only use it for non-hand-winding movements ( looking at you Seiko 7S26 movement ), and only if I plan ahead enough to put it on the winder the night before I plan on wearing it. I could see using it, if I had not worn a watch in a while, but only because I figure they should all get a day of operation every month ( I would do the same if I had several cars ). I bought my triple calendar moonphase as a quartz purely to avoid needing to reset it.
Thanks for sharing.
Thanks so much for this one Mark. Good topic.
Welcome
Great video. Never is there going to be agreement on this. Even when a winder is not used. Opinion varies from winding a watch once to twice a week, to once a year. Modern synthetic oils are good for 5 to 7 years and servicing is the key to longevity in a mechanical movement, though over time the costs of servicing could exceed the value of the watch, certainly with reasonably priced watches. I think the answer is just to enjoy your watches.
Enjoy and do not worry about it!
Agree whole heatedly...what the real purpose... does back to having having an engine warmer... what's the real purpose
Lol, yeah!
Do Rolex watches need to be serviced if not used for 5-10 years, (safe queen) before temporary use? Great video. Thanks I bought a winder, then I put the watch in my safe, never used. The dealer said I needed the watch winder. Then I thought if I'm not using the watch why wear it out. Then another watch dealer said you need to use the winder to keep it lube, or so the lube doesn't dry out????? What's you advice. I've never wore it yet, I bought it in 2005, it sits in my safe. Every once in awhile I thought I would wear it to dinner, but was afraid of hurting it??? Again what's your take?
I use a winder but not for any longer than 2 weeks at a time. Seems like running a winder for many months or years at a time might cause more wear.
On the watch yes.
Thank you. If I don't wear my watch and I have it stored in the cabinet all year round. Is it better to have it in a winder? Or leave it stored still?
You convinced me in the first minute or so that I really don't need a minder. Now I can spend that money on more watches ;)
Ok Marc, I expect you to get on this test immediately. I will check back in 3 years. 🙃
Lol!
Best and most informative watch channel.
I just think of them as extra cool display cases. I do not have any yet, but love the look of Jody's at JOMW. Utility? Meh, not really, but it's not nothing.
But seriously, what is the practical marginal gain from any watch in my collection over my $90 Casio G-shock? Zero. It is all just for fun anyway.
Right.
Thanks Mark. Agree with your assessment. However, just to clarify, you could do the scientific evaluation with watches that had some inherently variability from one to the next. Just need more replications of more variable watches to have the same statistical power as fewer replications of more consistent watches. Both types, if they are randomly allocated to the treatment, will reveal the truth about the winder (i.e they are statistically unbiased). Thanks for your videos! Loving my 009 on strapcode jubilee.
Thanks!
I want a winder for one particular watch in my collection, it’s a 1968 Seiko Sportsmatic 7625-8263 with date but it’s not quick set, painfully annoying to set the date if I haven’t worn it in a few weeks, I really love the watch and would like to wear it more often, sure, I could just do the seiko shuffle, set the time and just wear it but my ocd won’t allow me to without having the date set correctly haha, I’m at the point where if it’s stopped on say 15th and it’s the 28th I’ll just wait until 15th of the coming month then I’ll set it and wear it for a couple of days.
LOL, I've done the same!
I have a 2 watch winder (it is a cheap one but never had any issues with that). About a week ago I took the 2 watches off it and put the winder in the cupboard. To me the bigger issues were that in reality I could only keep 2 wound and really I needed about 8. Also it meant 2 of my watches were not in the same place as the rest of my watches which was a pain. I would rather have them all in the same box (or 2 in my case). Also even if you keep the watch wound you often have to set the date anyway as not all months have 31 days so they get out of step! :-)
Number of winders you need is (Number of watches) - 1
Well OK however, I didn’t use a Brietling for 2 weeks and it ‘jammed’ £300 invoice from Brietling to repair (some 14 years ago) when I was much younger I needed capital and pawned an Omega a year later, jammed did cost me as broker was forced to pay.
Today, many winders in use and never a jammed watch. I am hooked/convinced but I wish people would understand they do not keep the watch on time, it just keeps moving in a similar way to your arm does, you will need to set them.
Hate disagreeing with you as have much respect.
Kindest
Bob
Hey Nice video. Thanks!!
If you could cover one more topic for those guys like me who have quite few quartz watches, To pull the crown or not to pull the crown to save the battery life ? does it cause battery leak and all that comes with it.
Thanks.
Actually that's a really good question. Maybe Marc will get around to that one later.
Pull it!
Yeah analogue quartz defo pull out when not worn, I have quite a few watches so saving changing batterys is worth it, never had a problem with leaks etc.
Or you could just buy solar powered quartz and not worry as long as you give it some light every now and then 👍
@@islandwatch this really saves battery life?
“Or maybe you will”...hahaha. Nice line Marc😁
:)
Very interesting discussion for watch lovers. You answered some questions I've had nagging me for a while.
I had ordered one. I however realized that money was probably better suited towards another watch. They seem to be sold at the price of gold. A jeweler tried to sell me one that looked like a cheap Chinese built pos for 300.
Yes, they are pricey.
I liked the studies that had not been done,but have you ever heard the addiage a rolling stone gathers no moss.Thats my feelings! I had ROLEX DAY JUST .When l got it cleaned Last year the owner told me that with the cleaning it was worth 7200.I bought for 2000 slightly used,the watch lasted nearly 20 years.l got it cleaned & it was stolen from my house 1year later!! You cant wear a watch like that all the time l feel,so l used to keep it on the wineder when not in use....l liked yr not tested feeling,but if l get anouther it will go on a winder & in a gun safe......
I have 2 winders (4 winding w/6 static placements & 6 winding w/10 static placements). I don't usually have them running except when I have guests arriving. I've found it very interesting how family and friends were drawn to the winders because the watches caught their attention as they were spinning. That started sparked quite a bit of interest in the different types of watches and became the topic of discussion over and over since then. All of my kids are now interested in watches and have started their own collections just because they were drawn to my watches as they were winding away on my living room shelf. (I don't keep them in the bedroom......I like them out where I can admire them myself. Why hide such great timepieces away where they are rarely seen?) So, are watch winders useful???? I guess it's all in how you look at it :)
Interesting point; so a winder as a conversation starter!
Heh, Heh...my watch addiction is contagious. Now my son and one of my son-in-laws has requested their own winders for Christmas. Of course this means they will have quite a few empty slots to fill in the winders....which means more watch purchases......Damn this addiction.....Hah!!!
Hey Mark, I have a couple watch winders and in my experience, they work well with my Rolex(s) and not so well with my low-end Seiko(s). I think that has to do with the angle the watches are in and how Seiko(s) are regulated vs. Rolex(s). Great video and keep up the content.
Thanks for sharing.
Eddy, I recently purchased my first ever Seiko automatic. SARB035 with 6R15 movement and it will NOT keep running on a winder but does keep running while I'm actually wearing it. My other two automatic watches never stop on their winders (those two have Swiss Automatic Movements).
So I too am wondering if the heaviness of the rotor or some other item about the 6R15 doesn't work on winders. I've never heard any definitive information about this.
Excellent tutorial, thank you.
I have a winder for a Longines Ultrachron, but it replaced another winder and with this one, I've noticed that if I pick it up after a week, the time is pretty much right but curiously the date is behind several days. No idea how this could be. When I wear the watch, the date changes reliably and the time is accurate. Weird. I was kind of beginning to doubt that I should use the winder anyway so I may just do what you do.
Good vid, I agree that it would be pretty hard to analyze, like you say the samples would need to be high end to be viable to measure as mass produced will vary too much, I don't use them myself but possibly would with a perpetual complication.
That's the only way I see it being useful.
Can you leave the watches continuously spinning in a winder? would that damage the watch?… thanks
My winder is noisy, so I have it plugged into a timer plug. It switches off between 10.45pm and 8.30am. After all , the watch would just be sat on the bedside table at night anyway, no?
Right there... Mechanism of convenience.. That's how I see unless I had so much money to throw on perpetual calendar