@@sageofthickcalvesItachi don't need Izanagi to beat Obito, Totsuga blade can do the job if he uses Amaterasu as decoy because Obito cannot keep his intangibility against continuous attacks like Konan did...people always forget Itachi possess the best Susano after Kakashi, the combo Yata and Totsuga is a win combo for a genius like him... Obito possesses a defensive ability with one kamui, his win condition is when he touches the opponent...Yes Kamui is the best ability of the verse but Obito just possesses the defensive part, Obito with Rinnegan is a better matchup for a win condition in his side.
I’ll say this much about Obito, he was super entertaining to watch in all his fights. I’ll never forget how he ripped off his arms and threw it at someone
U did. a terrible Job ,I am kidding man ,but you were just glazing obito talking about teleporting into the Susano he would be met with an explosion to totsuka.its like saying itachi points at obito and its gg . Not once but they met when itachis teammate died and he didnt,obito glazed itachi the whole time are dos weaker than their original no,itachi was just revived at some point people judge him based on feats when he was sick they forget to know that orochimaru attempted to off guard him and got stomped in 3tomoe while konan is almost taking out obito.and itachi is not even moving to one shot deidara... 😂before itch got sick he scales above his edo its that simple and are we supposed to ignore that he has shisuis mangyeko ? that could probably kill obito? the. narutodom is fucked
My interpretation of Obito’s comment on Itachi killing him if Itachi knew all his secrets has been like “Wow, that is just like Itachi, embedding Amaterasu in case he dies and I come after Sasuke. With meticulous planning like his and how tenacious he is, he would have found a way to kill me if he knew the full extent of my abilities.” Which is kinda to say, Obito had to be extremely cautious around Itachi because he knew Itachi wanted to kill him and was smart enough to capitalize on any openings he found, but not that Itachi was actually strong enough to for sure beat him in a fight. I think Obito takes this at least 8 times out of 10 since Itachi’s only win cons are “land Tsukuyomi and we assume Obito can’t break out” or “force Obito to materialize somehow and catch him with the Totsuka Blade”. Obito just has a deeper bag and more ways to win, and beyond that Itachi does NOT know all his secrets therefore the really threatening “Gonna kill me” version of Itachi doesn’t exist. Like Konan. She’s WAY below Obito, but since she knew his secrets she was able to craft a plan that forced Obito to burn through and reveal another secret technique. Itachi could do the same thing except way better because he has more to work with.
U can said the same about Obito only win con is sucking people up. Itachi has koto, izanami, Tsukuyomi & explosion clones to bodyslam obito if Obito sucks on him which prevents Obito wins.
@@jackylim3948 Obito DOES have other win cons. Even with just sucking people up, that’s still really solid given Itachi doesn’t know the weakness of him being unable to Kamui while attacking, but Obito has other abilities too. He COULD theoretically also take a Genjutsu based W, Obito has Kotoamatsukami like Genjutsu strong and subtle enough to work on Yagura, whereas Itachi’s only Genjutsu resistance feats are against Kurenai and basic Sharingan Sasuke. Kotoamatsukami also worked on Itachi but like, you could argue he let it work on him and I’d agree. Obito could also just outlast Itachi. Itachi has some really impressive stamina but it’s not as good as Obito’s and he gets more blind after each Mangekyo ability he uses. Obito also has like, weapons. It’s not like he can’t simply lift his arm and summon weapons from Kamui whenever he wants. That said, you’re right, his bag in Orange Mask is less deep than I was thinking. Itachi has more stuff but I don’t think any of it works.
@@illialidur8244the problem with Obito is that realistically in character he’s not going to use other techniques outside of kamui and MAYBE fire style if he’s feeling himself. I will say though that perhaps you can make the argument that Obito will use jutsu as a means of catching Itachi off guard to use kamui as a coup de grâce which will still be difficult considering how slippery he is. If you ask me because of how cautious Obito will be compared to others he’s fought, and in character how Itachi prefers to slow things down, it’ll be a battle of who slips up first.
I understand the izanagi vs Kamui debate but if you look at it through a media comprehension lens you realize that scene is foreshadowing Obito’s win over Konan later. So we aren’t blindsided (pun not intended) by Obito pulling a deus ex machina out of nowhere. It isn’t out of nowhere it’s set up by Obito when he comes back clothes intact and tells sasuke, “glad Itachi didn’t know every card up my sleeve.” This is Kishimoto telling both sasuke and us as the audience that Obito has more than just Kamui going for him. The fact they both work is a happy accident. But as a writer Kishimoto makes sure to set up his win over Konan all the way back in the cave with sasuke.
My problem with this is this same logic applies with the Danzo fight which covers the exact same basis, with Obito knowing all about the Jutsu & having a Hashirama arm. The series as a whole is super vague in show / in databook about Obito so it’s pretty hard to make a case objectively.
12:05 I'll be honest, I don't think the image used was in reference to Izanagi; it's more so about his identity because the section title says "仮面の奥に隠された素顔とはいった、…!?" Which translates to "What is the true face hidden behind the mask...!?" and this is the only instance where his face is more revealed. "An entity without a physical form, transcending time and space!! Its true identity, abilities, and everything about it remain shrouded in mystery, an enigmatic existence..." The passage provides a broad description of the Masked Man's overall mysterious nature; it's not describing a specific jutsu being used.
This is my opinion as well it more so just continued the point the DB is pretty ambiguous, and we should look at the scene / how the jutsu function for a more solid answer.
The narrative is true. Obito knew if he controlled the 9 tails then he could have implemented his plan years sooner. They had more problems than expected because Itachi prevented Obito from taking the strongest tailed beast. Everything would have been easier if Obito had the nine tails. He straight couldn’t because he knew Itachi would have killed him if he attacked the village. Tsukiyomi and the totsuka blade is too dangerous to fight for literally anyone in the series. Sure you might win, but if he catches you it’s over. This was proven with even someone as strong as unlimited chakra nagato.
Shoutout to TG and Kam 👏. This is how you do a VS battle, so many interpretations. Best video on the channel fo sure. I think Itachi's bag is deeper, but banger video.
Thank you for covering the amaterasu izanagi/kamui thing, I feel like you explained the interpretations the best I've heard of them. People really just don't seem to understand how izanagi works and that you can't just magically izanagi away damage you took prior to activating it. Obito still slams btw. He's just... the strongest.
After all, it's the same stuff he repeats like he's last vid. Bruh did not bring out izanami & koto knowing any of this jutsu can tap him. Instead of making caps like thinking Itachi is spamming susanoo and amateratsu when he doesn't need to. So they can give it to Obito without a single logic explained
Obito hasn't shown to phase through things that are attached to him at a cellular level like Torune's bugs. Fire damages cells. And this scene parallels to the Izanagi reveal with Danzo -- Obito didn't know about Danzo's Izanagi coupled with Senju cells. Same with Itachi. So it mirrors and reveals Obito's secret neatly. Izanagi is simply a cleaner explanation narratively, featswise, and thematically. Which makes sense as Itachi is one of the most thematically heavy handed characters.
@@marwyn8152 fire doesnt automatically go inside of ur body directly into ur cells the moment u touch it… so comparing it to torunes bugs is already wrong. izanagi only reverses damage AFTER being activated. This is why obitos arm was missing before using Izanagi against konan and remained missing after using it against konan, this is why in sasuke vs danzo, danzo had izanagi deactivated because he thought he was going to kill sasuke, but sasukes susanoo upgrades and cuts danzo, danzo then reactivates Izanagi, gets killed, comes back and the cut from when izanagi was deactivated is still there. The databooks also make it blatantly clear it’s kamui they said the ability that got rid of amateraus transcends through SPACE, and the picture examples right beside it are of KAMUI. On top of this obito said the reason the trap didn’t work is because he kept secrets from itachi, itachi KNEW about izanagi. So no actually narratively, featswise and thematically kamui is the CLEAR answer
@@dc5855 1)Amaterasu isn't regular fire so that comparison is moot. 2) Izanagi wasn't revealed when the 3rd databook was released. 3) Obito already activated Izanagi before the flames hit. 4) Stealth volume describes Izanagi as "An entity without a physical form, transcending time and space!! Its true identity, abilities, and everything about it remain shrouded in mystery, an enigmatic existence..." Obito's databook shares the keywords of transcending into space and mystery, in addition to the secret of how Madara survived (Izanagi). 5) You didn't even have an answer to the thematic parallels 6) There is zero evidence of it being Kamui. Izanagi is simply a cleaner explanation narratively, featswise, and thematically. Which makes sense as Itachi is one of the most thematically heavy handed characters.
@marwyn8152 An eye that uses the Izanagi must be exposed and unobstructed. Tobi couldn't have activated Izanagi before the Amaterasu hit him because his left Sharingan was still obstructed by his mask, his mask only came completely off after being hit and the image used in the stealth volume (P030) it wasn't in reference to Izanagi; it's about his identity because the section title says "仮面の奥に隠された素顔とはいった、…!?" Which translates to "What is the true face hidden behind the mask...!?" and this is the only instance where his face is more revealed. "An entity without a physical form, transcending time and space!! Its true identity, abilities, and everything about it remain shrouded in mystery, an enigmatic existence..." This passage provides a broad description of the Masked Man's overall mysterious nature; it's not describing a specific jutsu being used. Furthermore, it being Izanagi only leads to one assumption after the other and even contradicts the 3rd databooks description.
To everyone saying Obito slams, Obito would not have made the statements he did about Itachi if he thought he could slam Itachi. Why would he even honor an agreement with Itachi if he could just dispose of him with no risk to himself?
Because he didn't need to fight itachi at all? Why waste a good tool when you can use it until it expires? And even then Obito does a lot of things in pro of the plot, considering how strong he is he could instead of forming akatsuki attack all the jinchuriki since naruto was a kid. Start with kid gaara and go up from then, the only problematic one may be Bee then take naruto. If he was so set on doing things rationally it would go by that but he plays on villain rules that requieres suspension of disbelief so he wait to go to konoha after a looong time.
In regards to the Obito concessions. I think what Obito meant is if Itachi knew who he was he may have gone to Kakashi to use him to help end Obito. Or He would have known about all his abilities and dealt with him because he could prepare a scenario (as a ninja) to win. Itachi is a Kage from childhood in terms of how he thinks (pinnacle of shinobi). So he would have acted like a Kage and caught Obito lacking
Well-researched video once again TG! Kamran’s super smart too, can’t wait for that Obito vs Pain vid. Just curious, where do you find all these extra guides and fan books besides the databooks, fully translated?
Too much free time, for the Road to Ninja Guide we did find it however, I went ahead and bought the physical version since the scans aren’t the best quality which is not good for translating
in the Amaterasu scene tobi clearly states he planted that jutsu to protect sasuke form obito,not to mainly to kill and this is consistent with the narrative of itachi being protector, people keep talking about sick itachi but there is no scenario where anyone pushes him, except during the Kirin scene . egos are clearly weaker... edo itachi is definitely weaker than prime tac hi shortly before his sickness
2:40 Feel it is worth noting he would also lose Itachi as an asset if he made an enemy of him, which means he would need to find a replacement since the Akatsuki operates with a set number of shinobi. He also loses the potential to replace Itachi with Sasuke if Itachi openly leaves the group, so even beyond caution, it is just in his best interest to wait Itachi out since he knows of his illness. Would likewise say someone being an opponent does not mean they are equal. There can be a one-sided match betwixt opponents. 12:10 I think it is referring to Obito in general, not just Izanagi. Izanagi had already been explained when Sasuke faced it by that point, but Kamui had not. So it would be strange to suddenly state that Izanagi is so unknown. So really, I think that still supports the Kamui interpretation since it essentially rules out Izanagi as being his mysterious power. 14:35 Actually he seemingly did so when he used it against Konan, since his arm had already been blown off. Either day or he can use one-handed hand seals? 15:00 He was considering potentially using it for genjutsu instead. He did not get to decide before he was stabbed. 23:50 Konan was able to set up a trap that, if not for Izanagi, could have killed Obito with her knowledge of Kamui. I imagine Itachi, in a similar position, could do even better. Does not mean either "scale" to him, though. 33:50 Feel that Obito having superior genjutsu prowess probably means it would just not affect him on that level. Might even reflect it.
I agree with most things here, for the Danzo example that’s precisely the point I was making the Genjutsu does not require his bandages to be off so the Izanagi has to be the reason he’s taking them off which is followed by him debating between the two.
Finally some good old fashioned media literacy. On another note, Itachi’s chakra reserve is one of the bigger drawback vs Obito but his greatest drawback is he dosent have a counter to Kamui. Even if it’s Edo Itachi
@ he doesn’t have a good reason to. He doesn’t want Sasuké, he has to collect the other tailed beasts before they can go after Naruto, and he doesn’t have any beef with kakashi. Obito never attacked Itachi because his plans never conflicted with Itachi’s goals. Itachi wanted to prevent further destruction of the leaf and to keep sasuke safe. If anything Itachi should’ve had bigger beef with pain.
I mean this topic will always be a thing regardless of this video but honestly, it's still a good video. I did learn something new and it says much if put in the right position; the fight between Itachi and Obito could go either way. I am puzzled by something: Obito clearly can use Wood Release and I get it; he avoids not using it to make others assume he's not Madara. And he does avoid it during his fight against Konan (that he did surprise attack her when she thought she killed him) but I am curious if he started using Wood Release, would not change anything? I guess not much due to Amaterasu or the Susanoo but it would be interesting.
The clone explosions maybe won’t one shot obito but if were to pull the clone into the dimension and it exploded he would be extremely wary of trying to pull him into kamui again. And no knock to obito but his only real win con is Kamui
Obito is faster, stronger has more powerful arsenal of general Jutsu and his Sharingan is also more powerful. Kamui is overpowered but his normal genjutsu prowess is also on par, if not greater than Itachis. Any Hax Itachi has like his Susanoo, Yatta Mirror or Totsuka Blade are completely useless against Obitos Kamui in all aspects.
A big part of the Izanagi misinterpretations is the filler scene during Izanami. When that random Uchiha used Izanagi to bring back like a dozen homies from the dead. If it worked like that, a group of Uchiha would’ve been God lmao
This fight would be a hell of a lot closer if itachi was an edo tensei. Obito is literally 50% of more hashirama cells. So he’s essentially a human white zetsu and has never shown to be out of chakra until like the war arc when he’s spamming stuff
HOnestly no amount of preptime is gonna save Itachi here. Like Itachi had to have been on crack when he said he could kill Obito, or not aware how haxed Obito is. Like, his best suckerpunch, the sealed Amaterasu failed. And yes, I do believe he genuinely sealed Amaterasu because it was the most effective. As you guys said, it was meant to take Obito's eye out. never figured that myself despite it being obvious. It was set to trigger on eye contact with Obito's sharingan, Amaterasu burns the eye's focal point, eye contact effectively means, the other person's pupil (the light receptor of the eye, not student^^) is your eye's focal point. So yeah, obvious but never fiured it out. So Itachi definitely had planned to take his MS out. You thought about Tsukyomi: Never ever gonna work. Sasuke, whose sharingan is a joke compared to Obito's, just shattered Tsukyomi. And yes, I think Sasuke did it himself. Itachi straight up told Kakashi "yeah, you're good enough with the sharingan to resist my MS, but you lack the keikeigenkai" and then a week later when Sasuke rolled up on him, he absoluitely wrecked Sasuke with Tsukyomi to drive the point home: "Sasuke is too weak, you need the skill and the keikeigenkai". When Sasuke then in Shippuuden rolled up, he was better with the sharingan than Kakashi for sure so he ws within the parameters Itachi specified in part 1. And yes, I do believe Itachi deliberately planted information there. And obito? First up, Obito has the MS, his genjutsu skill and genjutsu resistance are buffed by that, second he has hashirama cells that buff his base sharingan. Third, he was trained by fucking Madara. Well Itachi didn't know all that, but he knew about the MS and he assumed Obito to be Madara. So he assumed a ridiculous degree of skill with his sharingan and the EMS. If Sasuke breaks out, Madara isn't even gonna get tagged by Tsukyomi, simple as that. So yeah, I wonder how Itachi ever intended to land a shot at Obito^^
Thats NOT at ALL what Itachi said to Kakashi and Sasuke but go off... Sasuke was implied to break out of a Tsukiyomi where Itachi was holding back. Not to mention unlike Obito Sasuke has had the experience of being INSIDE Tsukiyomi TWICE. We don't have enough showings from Obito in terms of Genjutsu resistance that implies that he can resist or immediately break out of a spirit breaking Genjutsu like FP Tsukiyomi(assuming he actually gets caught). I obviously believe Obito wins more often than not. But the idea Itachi has 0 wincons, especially with Preptime involved?? That idea is ludicrous..
@@king5k96 There is literally neither an indication nor evidence for it. I know, he let sasuke win. But want to know when he did that? I can pinpoint it for you in the fight. It was not the Tsukyomi. it was the first Amaterasu in the fireball struggle. Like what did that thing even do besides wasting 25% of Itachi's chakra? Heck I'll even take the second Amaterasu that Itachi cancelled (although I do believe Sasuke would have slipped it with Orochimaru-style substitution) But I won't take the Tsukyomi there: we have very clear statements by Itachi regarding the Tsukyomi. And no, that Itachi was a spy does not make those automatically lies. Itachi was dropping hints like crazy against Kakashi. He gave the Akatsuki's full gameplan away. And he was veeery explicit about Tsukyomi: "Yes, somebody with your level of skill with the Sharingan can resist the Mangekyou to a degree, however you do not have the body of an Uchiha. Only someone who has both the skill with the sharingan and the keikeigenkai can withstand my Tsukyomi." That is pretty fucking explicit. especially as he just a week after shows, you REALLY need power and skil with the Sharingan when he uses Tsukyomi on Sasuke. He literally gave Kakashi and Sasuke the play to surviving Tsukyomi. So, no he did not let Sasuke break out in the fight. Tsukyomi was a TEST to see if Sasuke was even remotely where Itachi needed him. He had a clear plan for Sasuke, one that required sasuke to be at least a competent shinobi (meaning near kage level). He wanted sasuke to awaken the MS and mop up the Akatsuki with his MS/EMS. He even implanted Shisui's eye to Naruto and programmed it to go off when naruto is exposed to Itachi's eyes, to hit Sasuke with Kotoamitsukami. So, Itachi definitely planned on sasuke getting EMS (I mean that was why he told Sasuke about it). Akatsuki had at least 2 heavy hitters that were beyond his paygrade. Sure, Itachi planned to get Obito with the Amaterasu trap. But no way he'd rely on that. Plus even if it had killed or crippled Obito: that still leaves pain. That means, Sasuke had to be powerful enough to give Itachi a fight, or the whole plan would fail. What good is Itachi's plan if he keels over and Sasuke after obtaining the EMS is still weaker than Itachi? If you remember we can make a solid argument that STILL happened. EMS Sasuke is at least weaker than edo Itachi but would probably beat alive Itachi purely by stamina. Imagine Sasuke was even weaker. Itachi would keel over and it would make zero difference and only increase Obito's odds of winning. Tsukyomi is a good test to see if Sasuke meets literally Itachi's MINIMUM requirements. Tsukyomi simply is not that crazy. Sure what it does is insane and its specific mechanism is even capable of eliminating Jinchuuriki, but it is nowhere near indefensible. An Uchiha that is competent with his sharingan can survive it. And I believe we can agree that this is a bar that Sasuke clears? Sure it's a guaranteed oneshot against every non-Uchiha, but it is worthless against an Uchiha who warrants the use of the MS. Sasuke definitely was weaker than Itachi, I'll give you that, but he genuinely broke out of Tsukyomi.
@nirjhar4803 we unfortunately saw his best win con. The Amaterasu trap. Maybe Izanami but I doubt that would work against Obito. Or rather I doubt Obito would let the man set it up. (Although call me crazy shouldn't throw one shuriken with the right, one with the left and again one with the right be enough to instill the loop if Obito phases?) But Obito just is too hax and not stupid either. Sorry I don't think Obito would lose to Itachi's MS. Itachi was in my opinion absolutely clear about Tsukyomi. Ofc you are right that Sasuke had 3 rodeos with it, although I would argue only the second time he could have learned to fight it with his sharingan. And sure we have very little defensive feats but I honestly do not think, Tsukyomi would land on Obito. Assuming it has any chance of landing, Obito has the MS. And we know Kakashi after obtaining literally the same MS (well regaining) goaded fake Itachi into using Tsukyomi. Sure the fake couldn't use it, but Kakashi kind of had to be confident to do something so monumentally stupid, right?
At the end of the day, Itachi screwed the entire plan of the Akatsuki when he and Kisame went to the leaf. That two/three year gap and Naruto gaining Sage mode and eventually KCM screwed the Akatsuki significantly. Obito knew this and still did nothing to Itachi who violated the pact first. Simply put, Itachi from Obito's perspective was far too dangerous to handled directly even if he felt like he could. Also, we have to remember that Obito is under the guise of a persona and needs to flex his posture and intention. Also, Itachi also has a numerous amount of tricks up his sleeves too, it's not known if he knew of Itachi's mystical weapons either. Obito is extremely tricky and formidable but it's definitely nothing Itachi wouldn't be able to handle.
As always, awesome video TG! I'm so grateful for the justice you did my boy Obito. 21:55 I would like to say I think Obito was doing the same thing Pain was after he killed Jiraiya. Pain notes how if Jiraiya knew his secrets prior to to their fight, then he would have lost. This is something Pain said, although most of us believe Pain is outright stronger. This leads me to believe that with Intel, it's very possible to kill someone who is levels above you in strength. Obito echoes similar sentiments regarding himself and Itachi. And he says so after noting that the trap failed. If Itachi knew enough about Kamui, he would have set up a better trap, thus killing Obito. It's a bit like when Konan set her trap for Obito. She actually killed him, but died by his hands before the day ended. She would have planned better if she knew about Izanagi. Maybe things would have gone very differently. So basically, no one knows the mechanics of Kamui or the extent of his arsenal, so no one can make an effective plan to kill him. That's all that mental note was in my opinion.
@ThunderGodTG thank you bro. I must say, you're probably the TH-camr who scales Obito with the most amount of impartiality. You and Kamran of course. I don't want to trash anyone, but the many disingenuous arguments in favor of Itachi in this match-up are annoying. I'll watch anything you post, keep up the awesome work
Hey man I really appreciate that! 🫡 thank you for the continued support! I stg I think dudes just pick an agenda instead of making genuine arguments for a lot of these characters
I think Sasuke broke out of Tsukuyomi because of his latent potential as an Indra reincarnate. It would explain how he did this even without a Mangekyo when that’s not supposed to be possible.
@ITACHITHEGOAT-gg4ky if he gets caught in the kotoamatatsukami Obito's izanagi will activate and he'll get a do-over. Itachi and Obito get one shot to do these jutsus so its a stalemate.
He obviously used Kamui. Izanagi takes longer as it requires hand seals whereas Tobi can activate Kamui faster than Raikage could blitz him. Even if Izanagi was just as fast or faster, he doesn't need to sacrafice an eye with Kamui. Which even with spare Sharingan, I doubt he would waste.
The real question is, can Tsukiyomi be cast through another dimension???? We have to assume that it can to land, cause we know Obito 100% of the fight is gonna be materialized. Obito has the option to choose what body parts he wants to materialize. If he decides to materialize his whole head which includes his eyes, can Tsukiyomi still be casted???? My answer to that is no, I don’t wanna spread any head canon and Tsukiyomi isn’t stated to do such things. Also another good question is, if Obito gets caught off guard with Totsuka blade and sealed away, can he just Kamui out of it???? We know Orchimaru was summoned out through Sasuke having spare chakra of his. But can’t Obito just Kamui to his dimension and then come back to earth. My answer to that is probably, if Obito can Kamui out of heaven and can come back to earth, he can probably Kamui out of Itachi’s seal
I don’t think Itachi vs sasuke is a good battle gauge. Itachi could’ve killed Sasuke, easily. He literally drew out the battle so he could deal with Orochimaru & then pass away. He was fighting very uncharacteristically.
It's time someone says it: Óbito SUCKS! Obito only became a real villain after borrowing power from Nagato (the real face of Akatsuki), before that man is out there losing limbs and eyes to side characters, seriously man doesn't take a clean W pre white mask. There's a reason he "stays in the shadows" and sneak attacks people, he ain't nuking a village head on pain style or waltz into a war and finess an army Madara style. When it comes to being the better man, Obito, is just not him. But hey, he is a fine schemer, managed to accomplish his goal anyways and find external power to supplement his own. And before anyone brings Jubito, give Tenten the 10 tails and she soloes the verse
Yo TG How much do you guys take itachi’s intelligence when it comes to these battles? Correct me if I’m wrong but, I believe his iq is only second in the verse behind Minato. I do consider this battle to be a nail biter with its hi eventually finding a way. (Like Minato). A lot of this is sooo theory based as we really don’t have a good gauge on Itachi’s strength. One moment he’s leading a battle against Peak Hebi Sasuke, and the next he’s leading the charge against powerhouses (especially with great amount of hax abilities) in Nagato and Kabuto. For itachi to state that he would kill Obito so confidently leads me to believe that he could given how he had that same attitude towards Kabuto.
Itachi could def find out kamuis weakness like minato did he just simply doesn’t have a counter to it. This is also something obito acknowledged when the Amaterasu trap failed. But itachi saying he would kill obito doesn’t hold any weight because when he does actually try to kill obito he doesn’t try him head on he instead attempts to off guard him from beyond the grave and still fails. So I get ur kabuto comparison but we are literally shown he didn’t have a way to kill obito.
>Intelligence second behind Minato Had 8 years to come up with alternatives yet still relied on chakra heavy & blinding jutsu that kill him which he automatically had when he unintentionally awakened Mangekyo at 13. Sasuke, Tobirama, Shikamaru, Shikaku, Kakashi & Sakura are smarter (Sakura - most notably, quickly came up with an antidote to Sasori's poison, deduced his puppets' movements from his finger movements akin to Shikamaru against Tayuya, & figured Kamui in her one encounter even ahead of Kakashi who also has Kamui & was said to be smarter than Shikamaru - chapter 395 pages 9-10).
Why are you guys arguing for 10 minutes if Obito can react to Amaterasu or not? Uhh duh, he was easily reacting to Minato at 14 who needed to outsmart him with FTG lvl 2. And then later on easily reacts to the Raikage, who easily dodged Amaterasu. Now as for interpretation, that’s actually a good one. I do believe if Obito gets caught in Tsukiyomi, he’s done. Cause Tsukiyomi is stated to be able to kill people. And I think that’s what Obito was afraid of when he said he would’ve been dead, cause if he got caught with Tsukiyomi off guard, it would’ve been over. But the thing about this is, Obito already has knowledge on Tsukiyomi. So he won’t be caught off guard in a actual fight, he can just avoid his eyes. Plus it’ll be hard for Itachi to even glance at his eye since Obito doesn’t show it much under his mask. I really don’t like the fact that people always forget that Obito has wood release. Obito can literally spam wood release and force Itachi to use Susanno to lose his stamina faster and make him go blind faster. Then when Itachi starts feeling the drawbacks, Obito can take advantage of it and finish him with a wooden stick.
Caught the livestream last week and then got busy, I asked about this at that time, and I can't wait to see what your thoughts about the matchup are. Side-note question, do you do any (friendly) debating?
I used to do a lot of Debating and still do it often with people whose opinion I would substitute with my own. I also do it a lot with my stream although I’ve been considering just having people on stream to do that - my only reservation is I can’t control what they say and I don’t want my channel cooked lmao
I kinda disagree with the point about obito having to weave signs for izanagi, as when he's activating izanagi vs konan he has one hand ripping off his mask to unveil the sharingan and his other arm is blown off so im not sure when he would've weaved the signs there Also in the case of sasuke using amaterasu on obito obito was holding his mask in his hand in front of his face, so his other eye may have already been exposed Otherwise great video, and I think the exploding clones as a win con make a lot more sense in conjunction with izanami (the way itachi used the crow clone to setup izanami vs kabuto) rather than them actually having the AP to kill obito
I believe the gap in stamina between the two in favor of Obito is much...much smaller than the gap in IQ in favor of Itachi. He said it himself, every technique has a weakness and if anyone could find it and exploit it then it's itachi. Reducing this fight to a battle of HAX abilities compared to one another is too simple, especially when Itachi is involved. I can easily see the fight going as follows : Itachi fighting obito just enough to figure him out, escaping then coming back and crush him. There's a reason why Obito didn't touch a hair on sasuke. His senju body plus Kamui give him a serious edge in battle but he knows itachi has a terrifying combination of ability, talent and IQ. You do not want this man after you, with or without Kamui.
Only thing I’ll say is, I think when people talking about Naruto vs battles they tend to only focus on the big Justus without actually factoring in fightings styles or tactics. Even in this Obito vs Itachi video, we say the neither one is objectively above the other. Yes Itachi’s Amaterasu & Tsukuyomi and Obitos Kamui & Izanagi are big Jutsus but how exactly will each fighter go about the fight? Creating openings and using intelligence in battle to pull a dub over the other😊
Haved watched yet: already know its boutta be izanagi, totsuka blade and genjutsu vs obito as obito just closes his eyes to counter. Funni suggestion btw: DB BoG FFA between all the non-god tier opponents (No Goku, Beerus, Vegeta is fine but no SSJ Beserk) I think alot of the characters could be argued to be somewhat relative at this point? (Humans just magically get buffed in DBS, Vegeta got super sayin 2, Majin buu, Androids are also pretty cracked, Ultimate Gohan isnt shown to inherently be completely cooked yet, Gotenks, etc) Just thought it could be fun idea.
And people bringing up war arc … if Itachi was in the war arc with kakashi guy Naruto etc he would 100% be reacting to kcm 2 and peak EMS sasuke undoubtedly.
Would you rather : (A) have itachis kit and fight Obito. (B) have obitos kit, and fight itachi. In both senarios your speed, strength, and durability will be that of a regular person. So you can use kamui/amaterasu, but a 6ft fall might kill you.
@@AlexMartin-ec3dc yellow mask, orange mask, white mask beats itachi, not even gonna mention ten tails version, yellow mask has the full nine tails with kamui, chains, is on par with minato on speed as you see in the fight that he caught him off guard multiple times and exchanged multiple moves and attacks in the fight and reacted to minato except the last blow, minato states during the pain arc that he read through every move I took btw and that's the yellow mask version he's talking about, not even the version that has way more experience 16 years later and he's not dumb and has one of the best genjutsu in the show, he manipulated a perfect Jinchuricki, also reacted to kakashi, guy, Bee as the 8 tails, and kcm 2 Naruto which is probably faster than the 4th raikage best speed feat since Naruto already outsped him as kcm 1, they only landed a blow on him cause kakashi has HIS other eye, I mean itachi can't do much against a full nine tails pressuring him while having to worry about obito and his arsenal with kamui and his iq and biq, he can phase through his susano'o and the NINE TAILS would be shooting off Bijuu bombs while obito would be trying to catch him off guard the whole fight with kamui, he has no choice but to pull out his susano'o off rip which has less mobility and easy to spot. obito just wins
Itachi fans cannot stand the fact that Obito slams him😂😂 and let’s remember Kamui alone let Obito fight and react to KCM2 Naruto…WA Guy and Kakashi together
That’s because Obito has the best defense in the show. Did Obito even damage one of them? Where is his AP? Also Obito himself respects and fears Itachi. “ If Itachi knew everything about me I would be dead”. These are Obitos own words.
@@NarutosRasengan5 Cringe. Calling people you don’t know “ Kid” over anime. Also you dodged my question. Obito can only dodge, he can’t do any damage to Itachi. As soon as he tries to warp him, Itachi would simp use an exploding shadow clone.
@@arsenewenger4847I mean u have to understand that they saved each other last second, if any of them were a second off or a man less they would’ve lost. When obito said itachi would kill him he said so right after surviving the Amaterasu trap so he’s said good thing he kept a few secrets from itachi otherwise he would be dead “RIGHT NOW” as in the TRAP would’ve been made succesful not that itachi would beat him in a head on fight. If u watched this entire anime and think the guy who’s been going as Madara since 14 is scared of itachi then u just need to rewatch it lmao. Obito has been facing stronger opponents than itachi since he was 14, has faced Naruto, kakashi and guy without using the rinnegan, and went against Madara but he’s supposed to be scared of itachi the known spy on his own team? 🤔 matter of fact when kabuto pulled out edo ITACHI, nagato, kakuzu, deidara, and sasori obito doesn’t give af until Madara is brought out, that’s literally proof he didn’t fear itachi but for whatever reason u didn’t see this.
@ I don’t care about your question buddy…Obito slams Itachi cope harder😂 bro wanna debate so bad because his feelings are hurt over what if battle between fictional characters…get a grip
Whoever wins is entirely cirrcumstance I give orange mask Obito a 6/10 odds of winning due to higher stamina and hax. Itachi is brilliant he could win under the right conditions or intel. White mask Obito is more like an 8/10 in his favor due to the increase in power and win cons. So Orange mask High to Extreme diff, white mask mid diff.
To add on to your point is that when tskuyomi lands on obito it's difficult to say that obito would break out of it instantly since when your in it even for a short amount of time it can still mess a person up badly look at 8 and 12 year old sasuke for example, although I'm curious how long can obito survive in it before he dies and if he survives that then itachi is screwed.
konan almost sent that motherfucker with prep time to the afterlife then what if the. able. shinobi,greter than the god Of shinobi has prep. time not even daemon can save him
It took 10 years and she had to do it before the fight so don’t say konan obito stomps konana and midd diff itaichi Obito win due to itaichi stamina with the MS while obito can use his kamui like it nothing and he can phase through everything itiachi throws at him and obito can suck him one he activate the sussano teleporting inside it or he can use his wood as well and the rods and if he really preparing for a fight he can have those large shuriken and kunia in his dimension and izanagi like what I am saying is it will take up too much of his chakara just trying to figure out kamui
Obito is a monster. They had to make a plot to take one of his eyes, just to make it fair for everyone. Mind you those same two eyes are largely responsible for developing two of the most powerful ninja in the manga. Itachi is cooked, hes got nothing
It had to have been izanagi because of it was ameterasu and he phased then wouldn’t the entire building they were in erupt in flames like how the stone land around the area sasuke and itachi fought erupted in flames
You can literally argue Obito wins, even if you think like Tsukyomi or the totska blade one shot, which is fair, then 1. We know people can fight in Naruto without making eye contact 2. Literally all Obito has to do it keep jumping in and out of the Kamui demension and running the clock on Itatchi's stamina
@@ITACHITHEGOAT-gg4ky It was stated in the manga that Obito was using Itachi and Nagato for their ocular jutsu and to capture tailed beast. If Itachi knew Obito was the mastermind, wanted to recruit Sasuke, and destroy the hidden leaf then why not kill him if he’s stronger.
@@godemperorofmankind3.091 Only about sasuke* he joined the akatsuki and portrayed himself as this villain who slaughtered his family to sasuke to anger him into doing better than him, to protect the leaf. He obviously didn't know everything about obito if you actually watched the video in the panel where it says roughly "If Itachi knew my secrets I'd probably be dead" wanting to control sasuke and destroy the leaf was one of those secrets.
This is a good and fresh point that I haven’t seen someone use yet. It’s always the same childish non sense but would I would say to your point is that itachi would know it could go either way if they fought and he needed sasuke to be the one to kill him so he decided to put his trust in sasuke and ultimately Naruto as well.
Obito couldn't phase the Aburame jutsu and had to thorn his own arm, Amaterasu should be no different. There's a noticeable biased torwards Obito in this video
Ah yes cause an attack that literally attacks you at a cellular level that Obito exposed himself to is the same as fire that takes long af you & your cells especially when it has to go through layers of clothing first, but let’s selectively ignore the other example of him using Kamui when aburame bugs are on him, My character not winning = Bias now a days huh
@ThunderGodTG Doesn't matter how long it takes, both attacks latch on, it is also why A had to sever his arm. If anything, purposefully leaving out this far more comparable example is disingenuous. And I'm being objective when I say there is a bias, the entire video is about pointing at ways for Obito to circumvent Itachi's bag while avoiding to adress the ways Itachi could circumvent Obito's until the very end of the video.
Yes the speed entirely matters since Kamui still needs to activate, A’s arm was still fine but, would have burned over time you could never prove Amatarasu burns as fast (it doesn’t 40 examples were provided that show it being VERY slow to burn) compared to the Aburame Bugs which attack on a smaller level & much faster. It’s so clearly not applicable compared to what we noted, the Aburame Bugs attached to him on a cellular level aren’t even Ninjutsu which he’s noted to be able to phase through, they’re physical beings that straight up merged with Obito. Again my character not winning = bias when we kept the vid very open with interpretations for Itachi to win, the reality is MOST of his bag really doesn’t work on Obito, we can agree to disagree but, calling a vid Bias and not addressing the arguments presented doesn’t actually mean it’s bias bud
Arguments about Itachi’s illness or stamina are overplayed when you consider Itachi purposefully didn’t take his medicine before his fight with Sasuke. Who’s to say medicated Itachi would keel over and cough up blood vs obito?
Sasuke out her coughing up blood using the Susano’o that shit coming out one way or another illness only really presents itself when Itachi uses his Mangekyou likely due to the high chakra cost / drain on his stamina.
In my opinion, and I say this as an Itachi fan and defender in general, Obito IS the stronger combatant, however, the stronger fighter is not always the winner, Naruto fights, and anime fights in general, can definitely be viewed more like a Pokemon battle, where type advantages and specific weaknesses and strengths in that particular matchup are going to better define the end result, a Water type of equivalent level will almost always defeat a Fire type, unless we're putting a Level 5 Squirtle up against a Level 100 Charizard, which would be like saying Academy Rock Lee vs. Momoshiki because Momoshiki's weakness is Taijutsu, which is a true statement, but Lee in that instance would just be so out-leveled that it wouldn't matter, so while Obito in my analogy is on paper a stronger fighter, it's not by much, both have similar scaling vs. KCM1 Naruto and EMS Sasuke levels of power so you can say they are roughly relative in that same tier or like half-tiers apart. The thing about Itachi is that, in my opinion, he has the better battle IQ, he is much less likely to be caught off-guard and he's basically #1 or #2 in jutsu analysis, him and Kakashi have shown the ability to break down enemy jutsus the quickest, with Sasuke probably surpassing them by the end of the series and into Boruto anyways, but in my opinion Itachi is the ultimate foil to Obito, he is probably going to be the second or third-quickest to solve Kamui, similar to how Kakashi and Minato were able to, also Sakura lowkey solved Kamui even when Obito was goofing off as Tobi so it's an extremely simple jutsu to solve at its core, exploiting it is the hard part, and Itachi has the tools to do so, he's BY FAR the quickest at weaving signs, so fast Kakashi literally could never perceive him weaving a single sign, he'd likely feign a loss with an exploding shadow clone, and when Obito attempts to suck it up thinking its the real Itachi as his win-con, it explodes in his face and either kills or severely injures Obito. I think Tsukuyomi is a 50/50 on working and depends on what condition you take Itachi in, but also Obito just having one Mangekyo could either fully counter Itachi or not be enough, you could interpret that because he only has one eye, he wouldn't have as good of a resistance vs. two. This is a fight where, contrary to the common opinion of Itachi defenders, where Itachi should just spam MS and Susano'o abilities to a win, this is actually the complete opposite of how he'd fight, he very rarely uses his full power, he mainly fights using diversionary methods to force opponents to utilize their kits so he can study them and solve them, using low chakra-cost jutsus such as FIre Style, basic taijutsu, shurikenjutsu, subtle basic Sharingan Genjutsus and so on, Itachi is not a stupid fighter like Sasuke, he made an MS last for almost a decade, Sasuke lost his in like a week or two across the span of like three fights, Itachi is never under any circumstances starting a fight with Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi, and his Susano'o, he pulls out his win con of choice once he has devised which one will end the fight, until then he will fight in chakra conservation mode while he studies Kamui, and probably reach the conclusion to use Tsukuyomi to see if that will work, and if it doesn't, he will use the remainder of his chakra to try to fake Obito out with an Exploding Shadow Clone, which should work on Obito as shadow clones have even tricked the likes of Kaguya and Isshiki, who both have far better visual acuity than Obito and if anyone should be able to discern clones from originals, it should be Otsutsukis, the only way Obito would be able to tell is if Itachi outright made it in front of him without masking it which would be insanely stupid not to mention out-of-character, not to mention Itachi is literally like the character with the fastest sign-weaving feats I can think of. I think Itachi takes it 6/10 times ultra high diff, but I do think there are outcomes that either result in Itachi's illness catching up with him if we use Shippuden alive Itachi, where Obito simply wins by attrition and plays it very carefully, but I also think Itachi is simply smart enough and has a diverse enough kit, superior battle IQ and fighting style, that he'd pull through more often than not even if only by a little.
*>Assumes Itachi would deduce Kamui mid-battle even though he never figured out he wasn't Madara in years* Amusing. *>Still thinks Itachi had an illness* No proof whatsoever. His only supposed symptom was coughing blood which Sasuke also did from overusing Susano (chapter 479 pages 1 & 11). *>Talks like Itach's competent like his superior brother, while ironically downplaying him* You went too far Itachi fan. I'm not letting you go unchecked. *>"Sasuke probably surpassing them by the end of the series and into Boruto anyways"* Surpassed in between part one & two. *>Itachi is not a stupid fighter like Sasuke, he made an MS last for almost a decade, Sasuke lost his in like a week or two across the span of like three fights* Itachi never laid a finger on the Akatsuki nor Danzo whereas Sasuke fought a Perfect Jinchuriki, Kage because Tobi & Zetsu ruined his plan to remain hidden, Danzo whom Itachi knew wanted Sasuke dead yet left alone, then Kakashi. All while knowing blindness wasn't a game ender since he could obtain EMS. If Itachi was as good as you imagine he is, he would come up with alternative means than self-destructive hax dojutsu. He had 8 years. 21 year old Itachi said he needed Susano - an inherent Sharingan ability that he *automatically* had when he *unintentionally* awakened Mangekyo at 13, which consumes a lot of chakra in addition to blinding & killing him, to counter Kirin. The ultimate lightning jutsu his more talented & intelligent brother *created* & *mastered* by 16, within 3 years. Sasuke turned down the chance to obtain Mangekyo by killing his inferior rival at the Valley then trained to overcome Itachi's. Broke out of Tsukuyomi by amping Sharingan with the Curse Mark (Itachi had exclamation points in his speech bubble showing he was surprised - chapter 389 pages 9-10). Then escaped Amaterasu with snake substitution after baiting Itachi to use it outside to set up Kirin. Which obliterated Susano despite having the "invincible" Yata Mirror. Manipulating the weather instead of chakra allowed him to set it up without Itachi knowing & made Kirin on a level beyond any jutsu in it's field since it uses natural lightning (chapter 391 page 4). Whereas Itachi's grand scheme against Tobi was implanting Amaterasu to activate to Tobi's Sharingan. His other maneuver with Sasuke was brainwashing him with the super Genjutsu Koto-Amatsukami. Hax, hax & hax. Two failed & one barely worked. Contrast that with Sasuke who, amongst other things, achieved a decisive victory over Danzo - a Sharingan user, with what Tobi called a weak Genjutsu, in a plan he just came up with. Escaped Deidara's ultimate explosion without the need of a hax like Flying Thunder God, by using a common ability - summoning jutsu, in a clever way instead of relying on self-harming moves despite having Orochimaru absorbed for fast recovery. Even with the several year age advantage Itachi falls significantly below Sasuke.
@ Itachi never fought Madara or tried to fight Madara, in a fight Itachi would quickly solve his abilities and probably even realize it’s not actually Madara. Also you just exposed yourself as a fake Naruto fan because Itachi’s illness is well-documented, Obito even tells Sasuke he was taking medication to prolong his life, and in one of the canon light novels Sasuke goes to the land where Itachi was sourcing the medication from, so I don’t know if you thought were doing something here, but the only thing you’re doing is exposing yourself as a fake Naruto fan, so let’s keep going, this will be very amusing. Seems you’re just a delusional Sasuke fan. If Sasuke had surpassed Itachi in between part 1 and part 2 he wouldn’t have been relative to Itachi when they fought Kabuto even AFTER obtaining the EMS lmao, Sasuke was always weaker than Itachi, I took a literal God given power from Hagoromo in the form of a Six Paths enhanced Rinnegan for Sasuke to finally eclipse his more prodigious older brother. You’re such a foolish child. I can tell you’re a kid because you talk like a kid, Itachi is a character that it takes a little bit of age and wisdom to appreciate, rewatch Naruto again once you’re in your 20s and you’ll understand, foolish child.
Its as simple as this: the threat: "I will kill you" doesn't have to happen in a fair fight. In the end Kamui is overpowered. Itatchi cannot counter it. But Itatchi can still think he can kill Obito when his guard is down. He doesn't have to engage him head on.
I also think Obito takes this but YIKES, you're overcomplicating Izanagi and Amaterasu just to make Kamui more powerful when it's already the MOST BUSTED ms ability. Izanagi is explained to rewrite reality but the way it's used all throughout the manga is basically: 'cast right before you die from the damage, and reverse it like it didn't happen' You don't cast it before the fight. You cast it before a fatal blow. So you can get hit and still cast it just right before you die, and reverse the whole thing. There's no prep time needed for it other than weave the handseals before the damage kills you and make sure the eye is exposed. It doesn't regenerate anything prior to that. So the assumption is Obito gets by Amaterasu, casts Izanagi off screen (he was in the dark) before the fire fully engulfs him, then reverses everything. We see the exact interaction in the Danzo fight. He gets hit by Amaterasu, then we don't see him for a bit, then he respawn unscathed, no burn marks on his clothes. Izanagi is the most consistent explanation as to how Obito survived.
@@ThunderGodTG aw my bad if that sounded aggressive but yeah I rewrote it because you explained exactly how Izanagi works which is awesome then came to the conclusion at 20:11 that Izanagi works only with the assumption that he had to have casted it prior to Amaterasu hitting/before talking to Sasuke. My take is he casted it AFTER getting hit by Amaterasu but before it actually kills him. Which works based on how you already explained how Izanagi works, and has less assumptions to make than with Kamui wherein we have to assume Amaterasu burns Obito eyes but slower for Obito shoulder (which is still (which is technically still the target, Obito eyes is connected to his body /shoulder).
Beating obito required jutsu that aren't physical. And itachi has pockets of jutsu like koto, izanami, tuskyomi, genjutsu, explosion clones. Itachi cooks obito
Obito should have info on Koto and Tsukuyomi. Izanami counters Izanagi, but why would Obito need to use Izanagi in the first place? Also, I don't think Itachi can perform the requirements for Izanami on Tobi. Obito has better genjutsu feats. And the explosive clone probably isn't doing that much.
Obito only win con is sucking people up. And explosion clones can literally one tap him on that. That's it. Izanami did work on Obito who doesn't accept the reality and their fate.
@jackylim3948 1. Itachi couldn’t use Shisui’s eye back when he was alive because it was still recuperating, meaning no Kotoamatsukami. 2. Itachi has no reason to use Izanami, as he doesn’t know Obito (as Tobi) is experiencing an identity crisis, so Izanami is off the table. 3. Obito meets the requirements needed to break through Tsukuyomi so that gets broken out of. 4. The Sharingan would allow Obito to easily dispel any genjutsu used against him, making genjutsu entirely useless in this matchup. 5. Itachi doesn't know that Obito becomes tangible when attacking or teleporting, so he couldn’t plan to prepare an explosive clone in advance.
My opinion: obito wins,in a 8 to 9 hard difficulty against itachi and vice versa. I think kamui negates a good part of itachi's kit while the oposite is not quite the same. My win con fir itachi is either tsukuiomi one shot ( the one where he used on his girlfriend that made her live a lifetime and died of old age) or get a lucky totsuka hit if we asume his soul does not became intangible with him, both would require a very prolonged battle and chest level plays. In short, both have insta kill moves and cannot affort to make any signifant mistakes or GGs
One thing with the Totsuka blade that I think is weird about Obito fazing through it is that Obito usually teleports the part of his body being tagged but it’s not physically being tagged at all so would he even teleport that part of his body to the Kamui dimension
Also I think it’s fair to think that unlike most people Obito with an MS wouldn’t be one shot by Tsukuyomi but would be heavily affected by it for the rest of the fight essentially crippling him just not to the degree of like Kakashi in part 1 but afterwards I think Itachi would win that specific scenario if that’s how you interpret Tsukuyomi
I got obito using izanagi on Amaterasu. he says danzo uses an incomplete version, and we don't see obito weave signs for it like danzo does, so I think he doesn't need to activate it before hand to turn something into illusion. the proof itself being the instance in question. "itachi didn't know everything about me". itachi didn't know he had hashirama cells to use it. I also got obito breaking tsukuyomi. itachi probably wasn't using a full power one on sasuke, but I feel sasuke could have broke a stronger one than that too, cause he still had chakra to use after it. obito has the MS, plus hashirama cells so I feel he'll be able to fight it off. I think itachi's subtle genjutsu is his best asset. like we seen kakashi and obito have the little genjutsu battle in the kamui world. I think itachi could really fuck with obito, using his high battle IQ
@@Normal_guy9 well I don't have a strong opinion on whether it's before or after. I just think it isn't the same as danzos incomplete version. could have been activated just as it was shot before it landed, or after idk.
Itachi has a counter to everything Obito does: If he becomes Tangible (Amaterasu) If he tries to warp away Itachi (exploding shadow clone) Izanagi (Itachi has the Izanami) Any AP (Yata mirror) Genjutsu (Tsukoyomi, Kotoamatsukami crow) Obitos only win con is catching Itachi fast enough to warp him away. Whereas Itachi has 5-6 different win cons.
@@arsenewenger4847 Obito can negate the Amaterasu. Exploding paper bombs, IF they catch Obito, would only inflict minor damage. Genjutsu wouldn't work on Obito, bro was literally taught everything by Madara. I have no answer tobhe the yata mirror.
@arsenewenger4847 - Amaterasu only worked on Tobi (Obito) because his guard was down, something unlikely to happen in a 1v1 setting, especially against Itachi. Additionally, he doesn’t need to materialize to attack, as he can still launch projectiles or use long-distance ninjutsu while staying intangible. - Obito knows everything about Itachi and would likely anticipate the use of an explosive clone but even if he didn't, he could still suck the explosion away, just like he did with Konan's. - Izanami takes time to set up, and on top of that, Obito is aware of it. He would simply avoid repeating the same sensation, preventing Itachi from creating and completing the loop. - Yata Mirror can only be held up for so long. - Obito is a member of the Uchiha clan and wields the Mangekyo Sharingan. He meets the criteria needed to break through Itachi's Tsukuyomi, there's more leaning towards he can break it than him not being able to, and Itachi can't use Koto'amatsukami.
I wonder about the Toutska blade because unlike Kaguya who blatantly disappears from the dimension while Obito phases he still is able to be seen in the dimension while is body parts are in the other dimension maybe Itachi would haave to throw his Yata Mirror at Obito first before sealing him but I don't see it as impossible. One example I can see since it's the most obvious Astral Body we get outside of filler in which Itachi probably grabs all those ghosts as well is Dan Kato's Ghost Jutsu he could probably seal him if the blade catches Dan. This upload will never win. I still always rep Itachi.
Check out Surfshark!
surfshark.com/thundergod
I be weaving the ads with Surfshark, just like Itachi be weaving Obito's hands in the ones.
😂😂😂 this made me laugh in the gym
Fire video, appreciated the private dm call as to why Sick Itachi perception blitzes and one hits Obito via spinning back fist tho🔥🔥
@@Virhtue ⚰🤣
@@Virhtue BRO LEAKING THIS IS CRAZY
Easily the best breakdown of the Izanagi vs Kamui argument
sageofthickglaze
I agree!
Are Ya'll going to team up for Kakashi vs Obito Form by form?
@@zelz3011 maybe
@@sageofthickcalvesItachi don't need Izanagi to beat Obito, Totsuga blade can do the job if he uses Amaterasu as decoy because Obito cannot keep his intangibility against continuous attacks like Konan did...people always forget Itachi possess the best Susano after Kakashi, the combo Yata and Totsuga is a win combo for a genius like him... Obito possesses a defensive ability with one kamui, his win condition is when he touches the opponent...Yes Kamui is the best ability of the verse but Obito just possesses the defensive part, Obito with Rinnegan is a better matchup for a win condition in his side.
I’ll say this much about Obito, he was super entertaining to watch in all his fights. I’ll never forget how he ripped off his arms and threw it at someone
When was this I forgot😭
Thanks for having me on the channel!
seeing you on a vid, especially with TG, means something delicious was definitely cooked 🔥
@@KamranCreates you gotta start uploading again
kamran virhtue TG lookin like the big 3 in miami with lebron dwade and bosh no bs (supreme glaze).
U did. a terrible Job ,I am kidding man ,but you were just glazing obito talking about teleporting into the Susano he would be met with an explosion to totsuka.its like saying itachi points at obito and its gg . Not once but they met when itachis teammate died and he didnt,obito glazed itachi the whole time are dos weaker than their original no,itachi was just revived at some point people judge him based on feats when he was sick they forget to know that orochimaru attempted to off guard him and got stomped in 3tomoe while konan is almost taking out obito.and itachi is not even moving to one shot deidara... 😂before itch got sick he scales above his edo its that simple and are we supposed to ignore that he has shisuis mangyeko ? that could probably kill obito? the. narutodom is fucked
You need to upload more
My interpretation of Obito’s comment on Itachi killing him if Itachi knew all his secrets has been like “Wow, that is just like Itachi, embedding Amaterasu in case he dies and I come after Sasuke. With meticulous planning like his and how tenacious he is, he would have found a way to kill me if he knew the full extent of my abilities.”
Which is kinda to say, Obito had to be extremely cautious around Itachi because he knew Itachi wanted to kill him and was smart enough to capitalize on any openings he found, but not that Itachi was actually strong enough to for sure beat him in a fight. I think Obito takes this at least 8 times out of 10 since Itachi’s only win cons are “land Tsukuyomi and we assume Obito can’t break out” or “force Obito to materialize somehow and catch him with the Totsuka Blade”. Obito just has a deeper bag and more ways to win, and beyond that Itachi does NOT know all his secrets therefore the really threatening “Gonna kill me” version of Itachi doesn’t exist.
Like Konan. She’s WAY below Obito, but since she knew his secrets she was able to craft a plan that forced Obito to burn through and reveal another secret technique. Itachi could do the same thing except way better because he has more to work with.
Yeah I always took that statement from Obito as him referring to Itachi with Prep. Not in a random 1v1
U can said the same about Obito only win con is sucking people up.
Itachi has koto, izanami, Tsukuyomi & explosion clones to bodyslam obito if Obito sucks on him which prevents Obito wins.
@@jackylim3948 Obito DOES have other win cons. Even with just sucking people up, that’s still really solid given Itachi doesn’t know the weakness of him being unable to Kamui while attacking, but Obito has other abilities too.
He COULD theoretically also take a Genjutsu based W, Obito has Kotoamatsukami like Genjutsu strong and subtle enough to work on Yagura, whereas Itachi’s only Genjutsu resistance feats are against Kurenai and basic Sharingan Sasuke. Kotoamatsukami also worked on Itachi but like, you could argue he let it work on him and I’d agree.
Obito could also just outlast Itachi. Itachi has some really impressive stamina but it’s not as good as Obito’s and he gets more blind after each Mangekyo ability he uses.
Obito also has like, weapons. It’s not like he can’t simply lift his arm and summon weapons from Kamui whenever he wants.
That said, you’re right, his bag in Orange Mask is less deep than I was thinking. Itachi has more stuff but I don’t think any of it works.
@@jackylim3948 dude, obito has wood style. That alone counter everything in itachi’s arsenal
@@illialidur8244the problem with Obito is that realistically in character he’s not going to use other techniques outside of kamui and MAYBE fire style if he’s feeling himself. I will say though that perhaps you can make the argument that Obito will use jutsu as a means of catching Itachi off guard to use kamui as a coup de grâce which will still be difficult considering how slippery he is. If you ask me because of how cautious Obito will be compared to others he’s fought, and in character how Itachi prefers to slow things down, it’ll be a battle of who slips up first.
I understand the izanagi vs Kamui debate but if you look at it through a media comprehension lens you realize that scene is foreshadowing Obito’s win over Konan later. So we aren’t blindsided (pun not intended) by Obito pulling a deus ex machina out of nowhere.
It isn’t out of nowhere it’s set up by Obito when he comes back clothes intact and tells sasuke, “glad Itachi didn’t know every card up my sleeve.” This is Kishimoto telling both sasuke and us as the audience that Obito has more than just Kamui going for him.
The fact they both work is a happy accident. But as a writer Kishimoto makes sure to set up his win over Konan all the way back in the cave with sasuke.
My problem with this is this same logic applies with the Danzo fight which covers the exact same basis, with Obito knowing all about the Jutsu & having a Hashirama arm. The series as a whole is super vague in show / in databook about Obito so it’s pretty hard to make a case objectively.
@ personally i think Kishimoto wrote it that way so he could leave the door open to go whichever way he chose when he got there later in the story.
Yeah I’m of the same opinion for sure.
THANK YOU
12:05 I'll be honest, I don't think the image used was in reference to Izanagi; it's more so about his identity because the section title says "仮面の奥に隠された素顔とはいった、…!?" Which translates to "What is the true face hidden behind the mask...!?" and this is the only instance where his face is more revealed.
"An entity without a physical form, transcending time and space!! Its true identity, abilities, and everything about it remain shrouded in mystery, an enigmatic existence..."
The passage provides a broad description of the Masked Man's overall mysterious nature; it's not describing a specific jutsu being used.
This is my opinion as well it more so just continued the point the DB is pretty ambiguous, and we should look at the scene / how the jutsu function for a more solid answer.
The narrative is true. Obito knew if he controlled the 9 tails then he could have implemented his plan years sooner. They had more problems than expected because Itachi prevented Obito from taking the strongest tailed beast. Everything would have been easier if Obito had the nine tails. He straight couldn’t because he knew Itachi would have killed him if he attacked the village. Tsukiyomi and the totsuka blade is too dangerous to fight for literally anyone in the series. Sure you might win, but if he catches you it’s over. This was proven with even someone as strong as unlimited chakra nagato.
Shoutout to TG and Kam 👏. This is how you do a VS battle, so many interpretations. Best video on the channel fo sure. I think Itachi's bag is deeper, but banger video.
the amateratsu nerf is so depressing
It’s never been good tbh
Sage, virhtue and Tg uploaded today. Made my day.
Thank you for covering the amaterasu izanagi/kamui thing, I feel like you explained the interpretations the best I've heard of them. People really just don't seem to understand how izanagi works and that you can't just magically izanagi away damage you took prior to activating it.
Obito still slams btw. He's just... the strongest.
it was simply not kamui ,it was izanagi he went in the dark and performed the hand seals
After all, it's the same stuff he repeats like he's last vid. Bruh did not bring out izanami & koto knowing any of this jutsu can tap him. Instead of making caps like thinking Itachi is spamming susanoo and amateratsu when he doesn't need to. So they can give it to Obito without a single logic explained
Itachi slams
Obito is indeed the strongest.
Nagato >>> both
that's why you're the best narutotuber. you give different interpretations and show a complete picture, not just absolute statements.
Obito hasn't shown to phase through things that are attached to him at a cellular level like Torune's bugs. Fire damages cells.
And this scene parallels to the Izanagi reveal with Danzo -- Obito didn't know about Danzo's Izanagi coupled with Senju cells. Same with Itachi. So it mirrors and reveals Obito's secret neatly. Izanagi is simply a cleaner explanation narratively, featswise, and thematically. Which makes sense as Itachi is one of the most thematically heavy handed characters.
@@marwyn8152 fire doesnt automatically go inside of ur body directly into ur cells the moment u touch it… so comparing it to torunes bugs is already wrong.
izanagi only reverses damage AFTER being activated. This is why obitos arm was missing before using Izanagi against konan and remained missing after using it against konan, this is why in sasuke vs danzo, danzo had izanagi deactivated because he thought he was going to kill sasuke, but sasukes susanoo upgrades and cuts danzo, danzo then reactivates Izanagi, gets killed, comes back and the cut from when izanagi was deactivated is still there.
The databooks also make it blatantly clear it’s kamui they said the ability that got rid of amateraus transcends through SPACE, and the picture examples right beside it are of KAMUI. On top of this obito said the reason the trap didn’t work is because he kept secrets from itachi, itachi KNEW about izanagi. So no actually narratively, featswise and thematically kamui is the CLEAR answer
@@dc5855good explanation, it's clearly Kamui
Get ratio’d nerd
@@dc5855
1)Amaterasu isn't regular fire so that comparison is moot.
2) Izanagi wasn't revealed when the 3rd databook was released.
3) Obito already activated Izanagi before the flames hit.
4) Stealth volume describes Izanagi as "An entity without a physical form, transcending time and space!! Its true identity, abilities, and everything about it remain shrouded in mystery, an enigmatic existence..."
Obito's databook shares the keywords of transcending into space and mystery, in addition to the secret of how Madara survived (Izanagi).
5) You didn't even have an answer to the thematic parallels
6) There is zero evidence of it being Kamui.
Izanagi is simply a cleaner explanation narratively, featswise, and thematically. Which makes sense as Itachi is one of the most thematically heavy handed characters.
@marwyn8152 An eye that uses the Izanagi must be exposed and unobstructed. Tobi couldn't have activated Izanagi before the Amaterasu hit him because his left Sharingan was still obstructed by his mask, his mask only came completely off after being hit and the image used in the stealth volume (P030) it wasn't in reference to Izanagi; it's about his identity because the section title says "仮面の奥に隠された素顔とはいった、…!?" Which translates to "What is the true face hidden behind the mask...!?" and this is the only instance where his face is more revealed.
"An entity without a physical form, transcending time and space!! Its true identity, abilities, and everything about it remain shrouded in mystery, an enigmatic existence..."
This passage provides a broad description of the Masked Man's overall mysterious nature; it's not describing a specific jutsu being used. Furthermore, it being Izanagi only leads to one assumption after the other and even contradicts the 3rd databooks description.
We putting a end to the itachu glaze with this one i brough my notebook
I enjoyed this video out of all of the Itachi versus Obito videos I’ve seen up until now.
imagine obito suspected a trap from itachi and the entire initial encounter was a genjutsu to bait it out
To everyone saying Obito slams, Obito would not have made the statements he did about Itachi if he thought he could slam Itachi. Why would he even honor an agreement with Itachi if he could just dispose of him with no risk to himself?
You can’t even pay attention to the people who use slam, clap, wash in a matchup like this. They’re either kids, unintelligent or both.
he does slam but he was wary of his smarts
Because he didn't need to fight itachi at all? Why waste a good tool when you can use it until it expires?
And even then Obito does a lot of things in pro of the plot, considering how strong he is he could instead of forming akatsuki attack all the jinchuriki since naruto was a kid. Start with kid gaara and go up from then, the only problematic one may be Bee then take naruto. If he was so set on doing things rationally it would go by that but he plays on villain rules that requieres suspension of disbelief so he wait to go to konoha after a looong time.
In regards to the Obito concessions. I think what Obito meant is if Itachi knew who he was he may have gone to Kakashi to use him to help end Obito.
Or
He would have known about all his abilities and dealt with him because he could prepare a scenario (as a ninja) to win. Itachi is a Kage from childhood in terms of how he thinks (pinnacle of shinobi). So he would have acted like a Kage and caught Obito lacking
Well-researched video once again TG! Kamran’s super smart too, can’t wait for that Obito vs Pain vid. Just curious, where do you find all these extra guides and fan books besides the databooks, fully translated?
Too much free time, for the Road to Ninja Guide we did find it however, I went ahead and bought the physical version since the scans aren’t the best quality which is not good for translating
Damn, that sponsor spot was really quiet. Usually it's the other way around, so i appreciate that
Tried to not make it as loud and figured dudes will skip it anyway
18:12 i always just thought obito sucked the amaterasu into a random part of the kamui dimension
Amazing vid🙌
in the Amaterasu scene tobi clearly states he planted that jutsu to protect sasuke form obito,not to mainly to kill and this is consistent with the narrative of itachi being protector, people keep talking about sick itachi but there is no scenario where anyone pushes him, except during the Kirin scene . egos are clearly weaker... edo itachi is definitely weaker than prime tac hi shortly before his sickness
itachi didn't do anything to protect sasuke
What people don't realize is that its always obito who is glazing on Itachi, itachi never once in his life talked about obito being a threat to him
Respect ≠ Glaze
@Normal_guy9 yeah 👍 you can say it that way too I didn't mean it litterally
I've been looking forward to this.
2:40 Feel it is worth noting he would also lose Itachi as an asset if he made an enemy of him, which means he would need to find a replacement since the Akatsuki operates with a set number of shinobi. He also loses the potential to replace Itachi with Sasuke if Itachi openly leaves the group, so even beyond caution, it is just in his best interest to wait Itachi out since he knows of his illness. Would likewise say someone being an opponent does not mean they are equal. There can be a one-sided match betwixt opponents.
12:10 I think it is referring to Obito in general, not just Izanagi. Izanagi had already been explained when Sasuke faced it by that point, but Kamui had not. So it would be strange to suddenly state that Izanagi is so unknown. So really, I think that still supports the Kamui interpretation since it essentially rules out Izanagi as being his mysterious power.
14:35 Actually he seemingly did so when he used it against Konan, since his arm had already been blown off. Either day or he can use one-handed hand seals?
15:00 He was considering potentially using it for genjutsu instead. He did not get to decide before he was stabbed.
23:50 Konan was able to set up a trap that, if not for Izanagi, could have killed Obito with her knowledge of Kamui. I imagine Itachi, in a similar position, could do even better. Does not mean either "scale" to him, though.
33:50 Feel that Obito having superior genjutsu prowess probably means it would just not affect him on that level. Might even reflect it.
I agree with most things here, for the Danzo example that’s precisely the point I was making the Genjutsu does not require his bandages to be off so the Izanagi has to be the reason he’s taking them off which is followed by him debating between the two.
blessed today with a goondergod video
Finally some good old fashioned media literacy.
On another note, Itachi’s chakra reserve is one of the bigger drawback vs Obito but his greatest drawback is he dosent have a counter to Kamui. Even if it’s Edo Itachi
Just throwing it out there he didn’t outlast Sasuke cause he has better stamina, Sasuke purposely used the rest of his chakra to set up Kirin.
Itachi was enough of a problem that Obito didn’t wanna try him. Which is a crazy feat given he thought he was good enough to take on Minato at 14.
Why would Obito fight Itachi if he followed orders.
@ he doesn’t have a good reason to. He doesn’t want Sasuké, he has to collect the other tailed beasts before they can go after Naruto, and he doesn’t have any beef with kakashi. Obito never attacked Itachi because his plans never conflicted with Itachi’s goals. Itachi wanted to prevent further destruction of the leaf and to keep sasuke safe. If anything Itachi should’ve had bigger beef with pain.
I mean this topic will always be a thing regardless of this video but honestly, it's still a good video.
I did learn something new and it says much if put in the right position; the fight between Itachi and Obito could go either way. I am puzzled by something: Obito clearly can use Wood Release and I get it; he avoids not using it to make others assume he's not Madara. And he does avoid it during his fight against Konan (that he did surprise attack her when she thought she killed him) but I am curious if he started using Wood Release, would not change anything? I guess not much due to Amaterasu or the Susanoo but it would be interesting.
The clone explosions maybe won’t one shot obito but if were to pull the clone into the dimension and it exploded he would be extremely wary of trying to pull him into kamui again. And no knock to obito but his only real win con is Kamui
Obito is faster, stronger has more powerful arsenal of general Jutsu and his Sharingan is also more powerful. Kamui is overpowered but his normal genjutsu prowess is also on par, if not greater than Itachis.
Any Hax Itachi has like his Susanoo, Yatta Mirror or Totsuka Blade are completely useless against Obitos Kamui in all aspects.
A big part of the Izanagi misinterpretations is the filler scene during Izanami. When that random Uchiha used Izanagi to bring back like a dozen homies from the dead. If it worked like that, a group of Uchiha would’ve been God lmao
I diden't watch it but Obito solos 🗣🔥
Prep time vs hax😂😂😂😂 that’s the perfect tile for this mu🤜🤛😂
Thor!! you bastard where is that tag team ranking video you made!?😡
Banger video though yessir 🔥💯💪🏽
Gone reduced to atoms
This fight would be a hell of a lot closer if itachi was an edo tensei. Obito is literally 50% of more hashirama cells. So he’s essentially a human white zetsu and has never shown to be out of chakra until like the war arc when he’s spamming stuff
Props for doing the ad-read with a worse mic
HOnestly no amount of preptime is gonna save Itachi here. Like Itachi had to have been on crack when he said he could kill Obito, or not aware how haxed Obito is. Like, his best suckerpunch, the sealed Amaterasu failed. And yes, I do believe he genuinely sealed Amaterasu because it was the most effective. As you guys said, it was meant to take Obito's eye out. never figured that myself despite it being obvious. It was set to trigger on eye contact with Obito's sharingan, Amaterasu burns the eye's focal point, eye contact effectively means, the other person's pupil (the light receptor of the eye, not student^^) is your eye's focal point. So yeah, obvious but never fiured it out. So Itachi definitely had planned to take his MS out.
You thought about Tsukyomi: Never ever gonna work. Sasuke, whose sharingan is a joke compared to Obito's, just shattered Tsukyomi. And yes, I think Sasuke did it himself. Itachi straight up told Kakashi "yeah, you're good enough with the sharingan to resist my MS, but you lack the keikeigenkai" and then a week later when Sasuke rolled up on him, he absoluitely wrecked Sasuke with Tsukyomi to drive the point home: "Sasuke is too weak, you need the skill and the keikeigenkai". When Sasuke then in Shippuuden rolled up, he was better with the sharingan than Kakashi for sure so he ws within the parameters Itachi specified in part 1. And yes, I do believe Itachi deliberately planted information there. And obito? First up, Obito has the MS, his genjutsu skill and genjutsu resistance are buffed by that, second he has hashirama cells that buff his base sharingan. Third, he was trained by fucking Madara. Well Itachi didn't know all that, but he knew about the MS and he assumed Obito to be Madara. So he assumed a ridiculous degree of skill with his sharingan and the EMS. If Sasuke breaks out, Madara isn't even gonna get tagged by Tsukyomi, simple as that.
So yeah, I wonder how Itachi ever intended to land a shot at Obito^^
Itachi let Sasuke Break tsukuyomi tho
Thats NOT at ALL what Itachi said to Kakashi and Sasuke but go off... Sasuke was implied to break out of a Tsukiyomi where Itachi was holding back. Not to mention unlike Obito Sasuke has had the experience of being INSIDE Tsukiyomi TWICE.
We don't have enough showings from Obito in terms of Genjutsu resistance that implies that he can resist or immediately break out of a spirit breaking Genjutsu like FP Tsukiyomi(assuming he actually gets caught).
I obviously believe Obito wins more often than not. But the idea Itachi has 0 wincons, especially with Preptime involved?? That idea is ludicrous..
@@king5k96 There is literally neither an indication nor evidence for it. I know, he let sasuke win. But want to know when he did that? I can pinpoint it for you in the fight. It was not the Tsukyomi. it was the first Amaterasu in the fireball struggle. Like what did that thing even do besides wasting 25% of Itachi's chakra? Heck I'll even take the second Amaterasu that Itachi cancelled (although I do believe Sasuke would have slipped it with Orochimaru-style substitution)
But I won't take the Tsukyomi there: we have very clear statements by Itachi regarding the Tsukyomi. And no, that Itachi was a spy does not make those automatically lies.
Itachi was dropping hints like crazy against Kakashi. He gave the Akatsuki's full gameplan away. And he was veeery explicit about Tsukyomi: "Yes, somebody with your level of skill with the Sharingan can resist the Mangekyou to a degree, however you do not have the body of an Uchiha. Only someone who has both the skill with the sharingan and the keikeigenkai can withstand my Tsukyomi." That is pretty fucking explicit.
especially as he just a week after shows, you REALLY need power and skil with the Sharingan when he uses Tsukyomi on Sasuke. He literally gave Kakashi and Sasuke the play to surviving Tsukyomi. So, no he did not let Sasuke break out in the fight. Tsukyomi was a TEST to see if Sasuke was even remotely where Itachi needed him.
He had a clear plan for Sasuke, one that required sasuke to be at least a competent shinobi (meaning near kage level). He wanted sasuke to awaken the MS and mop up the Akatsuki with his MS/EMS. He even implanted Shisui's eye to Naruto and programmed it to go off when naruto is exposed to Itachi's eyes, to hit Sasuke with Kotoamitsukami.
So, Itachi definitely planned on sasuke getting EMS (I mean that was why he told Sasuke about it).
Akatsuki had at least 2 heavy hitters that were beyond his paygrade. Sure, Itachi planned to get Obito with the Amaterasu trap. But no way he'd rely on that. Plus even if it had killed or crippled Obito: that still leaves pain.
That means, Sasuke had to be powerful enough to give Itachi a fight, or the whole plan would fail. What good is Itachi's plan if he keels over and Sasuke after obtaining the EMS is still weaker than Itachi? If you remember we can make a solid argument that STILL happened. EMS Sasuke is at least weaker than edo Itachi but would probably beat alive Itachi purely by stamina. Imagine Sasuke was even weaker. Itachi would keel over and it would make zero difference and only increase Obito's odds of winning.
Tsukyomi is a good test to see if Sasuke meets literally Itachi's MINIMUM requirements.
Tsukyomi simply is not that crazy. Sure what it does is insane and its specific mechanism is even capable of eliminating Jinchuuriki, but it is nowhere near indefensible. An Uchiha that is competent with his sharingan can survive it. And I believe we can agree that this is a bar that Sasuke clears?
Sure it's a guaranteed oneshot against every non-Uchiha, but it is worthless against an Uchiha who warrants the use of the MS.
Sasuke definitely was weaker than Itachi, I'll give you that, but he genuinely broke out of Tsukyomi.
@nirjhar4803 we unfortunately saw his best win con. The Amaterasu trap. Maybe Izanami but I doubt that would work against Obito. Or rather I doubt Obito would let the man set it up. (Although call me crazy shouldn't throw one shuriken with the right, one with the left and again one with the right be enough to instill the loop if Obito phases?)
But Obito just is too hax and not stupid either. Sorry I don't think Obito would lose to Itachi's MS. Itachi was in my opinion absolutely clear about Tsukyomi. Ofc you are right that Sasuke had 3 rodeos with it, although I would argue only the second time he could have learned to fight it with his sharingan. And sure we have very little defensive feats but I honestly do not think, Tsukyomi would land on Obito. Assuming it has any chance of landing, Obito has the MS. And we know Kakashi after obtaining literally the same MS (well regaining) goaded fake Itachi into using Tsukyomi. Sure the fake couldn't use it, but Kakashi kind of had to be confident to do something so monumentally stupid, right?
Lol no. Itachi is FAR smarter than Obito and unironically outhax's that one trick pony. Itachi mid-high diff him
Both(their eyes) only last 5 minutes. That's why izumi and rin giggle
At the end of the day, Itachi screwed the entire plan of the Akatsuki when he and Kisame went to the leaf. That two/three year gap and Naruto gaining Sage mode and eventually KCM screwed the Akatsuki significantly. Obito knew this and still did nothing to Itachi who violated the pact first. Simply put, Itachi from Obito's perspective was far too dangerous to handled directly even if he felt like he could. Also, we have to remember that Obito is under the guise of a persona and needs to flex his posture and intention. Also, Itachi also has a numerous amount of tricks up his sleeves too, it's not known if he knew of Itachi's mystical weapons either. Obito is extremely tricky and formidable but it's definitely nothing Itachi wouldn't be able to handle.
W vid Mr Barkgod
Aye, do I hear the Bakugan Subterra Arena ost in the background?
Bro knows ball 🤝🏻
You better drop that mythical itachi panel soon
As always, awesome video TG!
I'm so grateful for the justice you did my boy Obito.
21:55
I would like to say I think Obito was doing the same thing Pain was after he killed Jiraiya.
Pain notes how if Jiraiya knew his secrets prior to to their fight, then he would have lost.
This is something Pain said, although most of us believe Pain is outright stronger.
This leads me to believe that with Intel, it's very possible to kill someone who is levels above you in strength.
Obito echoes similar sentiments regarding himself and Itachi. And he says so after noting that the trap failed.
If Itachi knew enough about Kamui, he would have set up a better trap, thus killing Obito.
It's a bit like when Konan set her trap for Obito. She actually killed him, but died by his hands before the day ended. She would have planned better if she knew about Izanagi. Maybe things would have gone very differently.
So basically, no one knows the mechanics of Kamui or the extent of his arsenal, so no one can make an effective plan to kill him. That's all that mental note was in my opinion.
I love this idea I actually can’t lie, I someone how never connected the two examples like that, W comment fr ✊🏻🔥
@ThunderGodTG thank you bro.
I must say, you're probably the TH-camr who scales Obito with the most amount of impartiality. You and Kamran of course. I don't want to trash anyone, but the many disingenuous arguments in favor of Itachi in this match-up are annoying.
I'll watch anything you post, keep up the awesome work
Hey man I really appreciate that! 🫡 thank you for the continued support! I stg I think dudes just pick an agenda instead of making genuine arguments for a lot of these characters
I think Sasuke broke out of Tsukuyomi because of his latent potential as an Indra reincarnate. It would explain how he did this even without a Mangekyo when that’s not supposed to be possible.
All being an incarnate meant is Indra's chakra latched onto him like a ghost.
You got Itachi using mangekio genjutsu on mid tiers vs Obito using base sharigan genjutsu on perfect jinchuriki. I'm just saiyan
are talking about the guy that still has shisuis mangyeko ,with prep Time itachi becomes Madara and hashirama
@ITACHITHEGOAT-gg4ky if he gets caught in the kotoamatatsukami Obito's izanagi will activate and he'll get a do-over. Itachi and Obito get one shot to do these jutsus so its a stalemate.
@@king-xl3667or koto will force him to walk into the totsuka blade and he’ll be sealed forever .
@@king-xl3667 Obito has great offensive genjutsu but as TG said he has zero defensive genjutsu feats. If Tsukoyomi hits him, he is done.
@@Juubian Kamui's through that like a chad. Plus he would have long broken out of the koto by then.
He obviously used Kamui. Izanagi takes longer as it requires hand seals whereas Tobi can activate Kamui faster than Raikage could blitz him. Even if Izanagi was just as fast or faster, he doesn't need to sacrafice an eye with Kamui. Which even with spare Sharingan, I doubt he would waste.
The real question is, can Tsukiyomi be cast through another dimension???? We have to assume that it can to land, cause we know Obito 100% of the fight is gonna be materialized. Obito has the option to choose what body parts he wants to materialize. If he decides to materialize his whole head which includes his eyes, can Tsukiyomi still be casted???? My answer to that is no, I don’t wanna spread any head canon and Tsukiyomi isn’t stated to do such things.
Also another good question is, if Obito gets caught off guard with Totsuka blade and sealed away, can he just Kamui out of it???? We know Orchimaru was summoned out through Sasuke having spare chakra of his. But can’t Obito just Kamui to his dimension and then come back to earth. My answer to that is probably, if Obito can Kamui out of heaven and can come back to earth, he can probably Kamui out of Itachi’s seal
I don’t think Itachi vs sasuke is a good battle gauge. Itachi could’ve killed Sasuke, easily. He literally drew out the battle so he could deal with Orochimaru & then pass away. He was fighting very uncharacteristically.
It's time someone says it: Óbito SUCKS!
Obito only became a real villain after borrowing power from Nagato (the real face of Akatsuki), before that man is out there losing limbs and eyes to side characters, seriously man doesn't take a clean W pre white mask.
There's a reason he "stays in the shadows" and sneak attacks people, he ain't nuking a village head on pain style or waltz into a war and finess an army Madara style.
When it comes to being the better man, Obito, is just not him.
But hey, he is a fine schemer, managed to accomplish his goal anyways and find external power to supplement his own.
And before anyone brings Jubito, give Tenten the 10 tails and she soloes the verse
Burning hot take
imagine if Sasuke's eye used Koto on Obito instead
The Oppenheimer music killed me once I recognized it
Yo TG How much do you guys take itachi’s intelligence when it comes to these battles? Correct me if I’m wrong but, I believe his iq is only second in the verse behind Minato. I do consider this battle to be a nail biter with its hi eventually finding a way. (Like Minato).
A lot of this is sooo theory based as we really don’t have a good gauge on Itachi’s strength. One moment he’s leading a battle against Peak Hebi Sasuke, and the next he’s leading the charge against powerhouses (especially with great amount of hax abilities) in Nagato and Kabuto. For itachi to state that he would kill Obito so confidently leads me to believe that he could given how he had that same attitude towards Kabuto.
Itachi could def find out kamuis weakness like minato did he just simply doesn’t have a counter to it. This is also something obito acknowledged when the Amaterasu trap failed.
But itachi saying he would kill obito doesn’t hold any weight because when he does actually try to kill obito he doesn’t try him head on he instead attempts to off guard him from beyond the grave and still fails. So I get ur kabuto comparison but we are literally shown he didn’t have a way to kill obito.
>Intelligence second behind Minato
Had 8 years to come up with alternatives yet still relied on chakra heavy & blinding jutsu that kill him which he automatically had when he unintentionally awakened Mangekyo at 13. Sasuke, Tobirama, Shikamaru, Shikaku, Kakashi & Sakura are smarter (Sakura - most notably, quickly came up with an antidote to Sasori's poison, deduced his puppets' movements from his finger movements akin to Shikamaru against Tayuya, & figured Kamui in her one encounter even ahead of Kakashi who also has Kamui & was said to be smarter than Shikamaru - chapter 395 pages 9-10).
I would argue itschi would push him with his susanoo like how madara pushed the sand by just summoning it
If I don't get these vids in 2026 then yall failed
Why are you guys arguing for 10 minutes if Obito can react to Amaterasu or not? Uhh duh, he was easily reacting to Minato at 14 who needed to outsmart him with FTG lvl 2. And then later on easily reacts to the Raikage, who easily dodged Amaterasu.
Now as for interpretation, that’s actually a good one. I do believe if Obito gets caught in Tsukiyomi, he’s done. Cause Tsukiyomi is stated to be able to kill people. And I think that’s what Obito was afraid of when he said he would’ve been dead, cause if he got caught with Tsukiyomi off guard, it would’ve been over.
But the thing about this is, Obito already has knowledge on Tsukiyomi. So he won’t be caught off guard in a actual fight, he can just avoid his eyes. Plus it’ll be hard for Itachi to even glance at his eye since Obito doesn’t show it much under his mask.
I really don’t like the fact that people always forget that Obito has wood release. Obito can literally spam wood release and force Itachi to use Susanno to lose his stamina faster and make him go blind faster. Then when Itachi starts feeling the drawbacks, Obito can take advantage of it and finish him with a wooden stick.
Caught the livestream last week and then got busy, I asked about this at that time, and I can't wait to see what your thoughts about the matchup are.
Side-note question, do you do any (friendly) debating?
I used to do a lot of Debating and still do it often with people whose opinion I would substitute with my own. I also do it a lot with my stream although I’ve been considering just having people on stream to do that - my only reservation is I can’t control what they say and I don’t want my channel cooked lmao
I kinda disagree with the point about obito having to weave signs for izanagi, as when he's activating izanagi vs konan he has one hand ripping off his mask to unveil the sharingan and his other arm is blown off so im not sure when he would've weaved the signs there
Also in the case of sasuke using amaterasu on obito obito was holding his mask in his hand in front of his face, so his other eye may have already been exposed
Otherwise great video, and I think the exploding clones as a win con make a lot more sense in conjunction with izanami (the way itachi used the crow clone to setup izanami vs kabuto) rather than them actually having the AP to kill obito
I believe the gap in stamina between the two in favor of Obito is much...much smaller than the gap in IQ in favor of Itachi. He said it himself, every technique has a weakness and if anyone could find it and exploit it then it's itachi. Reducing this fight to a battle of HAX abilities compared to one another is too simple, especially when Itachi is involved. I can easily see the fight going as follows : Itachi fighting obito just enough to figure him out, escaping then coming back and crush him. There's a reason why Obito didn't touch a hair on sasuke. His senju body plus Kamui give him a serious edge in battle but he knows itachi has a terrifying combination of ability, talent and IQ. You do not want this man after you, with or without Kamui.
Only thing I’ll say is, I think when people talking about Naruto vs battles they tend to only focus on the big Justus without actually factoring in fightings styles or tactics.
Even in this Obito vs Itachi video, we say the neither one is objectively above the other. Yes Itachi’s Amaterasu & Tsukuyomi and Obitos Kamui & Izanagi are big Jutsus but how exactly will each fighter go about the fight? Creating openings and using intelligence in battle to pull a dub over the other😊
Itachi simply for the agenda fr
Link in desc broken btw
Bro just saved my life just fixed it thanks king ✊🏻
Haved watched yet: already know its boutta be izanagi, totsuka blade and genjutsu vs obito as obito just closes his eyes to counter.
Funni suggestion btw: DB BoG FFA between all the non-god tier opponents (No Goku, Beerus, Vegeta is fine but no SSJ Beserk) I think alot of the characters could be argued to be somewhat relative at this point? (Humans just magically get buffed in DBS, Vegeta got super sayin 2, Majin buu, Androids are also pretty cracked, Ultimate Gohan isnt shown to inherently be completely cooked yet, Gotenks, etc) Just thought it could be fun idea.
And people bringing up war arc … if Itachi was in the war arc with kakashi guy Naruto etc he would 100% be reacting to kcm 2 and peak EMS sasuke undoubtedly.
Would you rather : (A) have itachis kit and fight Obito. (B) have obitos kit, and fight itachi. In both senarios your speed, strength, and durability will be that of a regular person. So you can use kamui/amaterasu, but a 6ft fall might kill you.
I would take Obitos kit. Kamui would be more useful than susanoo when you're expecting to get speed blitzed.
Obito dog walks 🔥
why do you hate itachi so much because the zest says he in invincible?
Like he did Konan? Okay buddy intelligent people understand neither is slamming the other.
Itachi slams both pain and obito
@@AlexMartin-ec3dc yellow mask, orange mask, white mask beats itachi, not even gonna mention ten tails version, yellow mask has the full nine tails with kamui, chains, is on par with minato on speed as you see in the fight that he caught him off guard multiple times and exchanged multiple moves and attacks in the fight and reacted to minato except the last blow, minato states during the pain arc that he read through every move I took btw and that's the yellow mask version he's talking about, not even the version that has way more experience 16 years later and he's not dumb and has one of the best genjutsu in the show, he manipulated a perfect Jinchuricki, also reacted to kakashi, guy, Bee as the 8 tails, and kcm 2 Naruto which is probably faster than the 4th raikage best speed feat since Naruto already outsped him as kcm 1, they only landed a blow on him cause kakashi has HIS other eye, I mean itachi can't do much against a full nine tails pressuring him while having to worry about obito and his arsenal with kamui and his iq and biq, he can phase through his susano'o and the NINE TAILS would be shooting off Bijuu bombs while obito would be trying to catch him off guard the whole fight with kamui, he has no choice but to pull out his susano'o off rip which has less mobility and easy to spot. obito just wins
@@ITACHITHEGOAT-gg4ky Invisible in that fight🤡 if you think he is invincible then you're delusional🥸
Itachi fans cannot stand the fact that Obito slams him😂😂 and let’s remember Kamui alone let Obito fight and react to KCM2 Naruto…WA Guy and Kakashi together
That’s because Obito has the best defense in the show. Did Obito even damage one of them?
Where is his AP?
Also Obito himself respects and fears Itachi. “ If Itachi knew everything about me I would be dead”. These are Obitos own words.
@ doesn’t matter kid cry harder Itachi is not reacting to Guy…Kakashi and kcm2 Naruto😂
@@NarutosRasengan5 Cringe. Calling people you don’t know “ Kid” over anime.
Also you dodged my question. Obito can only dodge, he can’t do any damage to Itachi. As soon as he tries to warp him, Itachi would simp use an exploding shadow clone.
@@arsenewenger4847I mean u have to understand that they saved each other last second, if any of them were a second off or a man less they would’ve lost.
When obito said itachi would kill him he said so right after surviving the Amaterasu trap so he’s said good thing he kept a few secrets from itachi otherwise he would be dead “RIGHT NOW” as in the TRAP would’ve been made succesful not that itachi would beat him in a head on fight. If u watched this entire anime and think the guy who’s been going as Madara since 14 is scared of itachi then u just need to rewatch it lmao.
Obito has been facing stronger opponents than itachi since he was 14, has faced Naruto, kakashi and guy without using the rinnegan, and went against Madara but he’s supposed to be scared of itachi the known spy on his own team? 🤔 matter of fact when kabuto pulled out edo ITACHI, nagato, kakuzu, deidara, and sasori obito doesn’t give af until Madara is brought out, that’s literally proof he didn’t fear itachi but for whatever reason u didn’t see this.
@ I don’t care about your question buddy…Obito slams Itachi cope harder😂 bro wanna debate so bad because his feelings are hurt over what if battle between fictional characters…get a grip
after the flames are on karin, her cloths are burned off were the black flames were
They were burned off after a period of time yes she was on fire for a minute
Whoever wins is entirely cirrcumstance I give orange mask Obito a 6/10 odds of winning due to higher stamina and hax. Itachi is brilliant he could win under the right conditions or intel. White mask Obito is more like an 8/10 in his favor due to the increase in power and win cons. So Orange mask High to Extreme diff, white mask mid diff.
To add on to your point is that when tskuyomi lands on obito it's difficult to say that obito would break out of it instantly since when your in it even for a short amount of time it can still mess a person up badly look at 8 and 12 year old sasuke for example, although I'm curious how long can obito survive in it before he dies and if he survives that then itachi is screwed.
Obito is not afraid its just alot of work
Obito >> Itachi
konan almost sent that motherfucker with prep time to the afterlife then what if the. able. shinobi,greter than the god Of shinobi has prep. time not even daemon can save him
It took 10 years and she had to do it before the fight so don’t say konan obito stomps konana and midd diff itaichi Obito win due to itaichi stamina with the MS while obito can use his kamui like it nothing and he can phase through everything itiachi throws at him and obito can suck him one he activate the sussano teleporting inside it or he can use his wood as well and the rods and if he really preparing for a fight he can have those large shuriken and kunia in his dimension and izanagi like what I am saying is it will take up too much of his chakara just trying to figure out kamui
VIDEO IDEA COULD a early db era chioutzu defeat orochimaru PERMANENTLY if he knew hakai some how? Whaddya think? :) 😂
Obito is a monster. They had to make a plot to take one of his eyes, just to make it fair for everyone. Mind you those same two eyes are largely responsible for developing two of the most powerful ninja in the manga. Itachi is cooked, hes got nothing
In itachi flashback on izanagi, didn’t that one uchiha actived izunagi after his comrades were kill.
It had to have been izanagi because of it was ameterasu and he phased then wouldn’t the entire building they were in erupt in flames like how the stone land around the area sasuke and itachi fought erupted in flames
The stone did not really erupt in flames Itachi just missed Sasuke and it spread out
You can literally argue Obito wins, even if you think like Tsukyomi or the totska blade one shot, which is fair, then
1. We know people can fight in Naruto without making eye contact
2. Literally all Obito has to do it keep jumping in and out of the Kamui demension and running the clock on Itatchi's stamina
Itachi waited until after his death to do anything to Obito and still failed.
the opposite is also true
@@ITACHITHEGOAT-gg4ky It was stated in the manga that Obito was using Itachi and Nagato for their ocular jutsu and to capture tailed beast. If Itachi knew Obito was the mastermind, wanted to recruit Sasuke, and destroy the hidden leaf then why not kill him if he’s stronger.
@@God_MellowYT because itachi only ever cared about himself
@@godemperorofmankind3.091 Only about sasuke* he joined the akatsuki and portrayed himself as this villain who slaughtered his family to sasuke to anger him into doing better than him, to protect the leaf. He obviously didn't know everything about obito if you actually watched the video in the panel where it says roughly "If Itachi knew my secrets I'd probably be dead" wanting to control sasuke and destroy the leaf was one of those secrets.
This is a good and fresh point that I haven’t seen someone use yet. It’s always the same childish non sense but would I would say to your point is that itachi would know it could go either way if they fought and he needed sasuke to be the one to kill him so he decided to put his trust in sasuke and ultimately Naruto as well.
Obito couldn't phase the Aburame jutsu and had to thorn his own arm, Amaterasu should be no different.
There's a noticeable biased torwards Obito in this video
Ah yes cause an attack that literally attacks you at a cellular level that Obito exposed himself to is the same as fire that takes long af you & your cells especially when it has to go through layers of clothing first, but let’s selectively ignore the other example of him using Kamui when aburame bugs are on him, My character not winning = Bias now a days huh
@ThunderGodTG Doesn't matter how long it takes, both attacks latch on, it is also why A had to sever his arm.
If anything, purposefully leaving out this far more comparable example is disingenuous.
And I'm being objective when I say there is a bias, the entire video is about pointing at ways for Obito to circumvent Itachi's bag while avoiding to adress the ways Itachi could circumvent Obito's until the very end of the video.
Yes the speed entirely matters since Kamui still needs to activate, A’s arm was still fine but, would have burned over time you could never prove Amatarasu burns as fast (it doesn’t 40 examples were provided that show it being VERY slow to burn) compared to the Aburame Bugs which attack on a smaller level & much faster. It’s so clearly not applicable compared to what we noted, the Aburame Bugs attached to him on a cellular level aren’t even Ninjutsu which he’s noted to be able to phase through, they’re physical beings that straight up merged with Obito.
Again my character not winning = bias when we kept the vid very open with interpretations for Itachi to win, the reality is MOST of his bag really doesn’t work on Obito, we can agree to disagree but, calling a vid Bias and not addressing the arguments presented doesn’t actually mean it’s bias bud
Arguments about Itachi’s illness or stamina are overplayed when you consider Itachi purposefully didn’t take his medicine before his fight with Sasuke. Who’s to say medicated Itachi would keel over and cough up blood vs obito?
Sasuke out her coughing up blood using the Susano’o that shit coming out one way or another illness only really presents itself when Itachi uses his Mangekyou likely due to the high chakra cost / drain on his stamina.
Itachi stomps 🙌
In my opinion, and I say this as an Itachi fan and defender in general, Obito IS the stronger combatant, however, the stronger fighter is not always the winner, Naruto fights, and anime fights in general, can definitely be viewed more like a Pokemon battle, where type advantages and specific weaknesses and strengths in that particular matchup are going to better define the end result, a Water type of equivalent level will almost always defeat a Fire type, unless we're putting a Level 5 Squirtle up against a Level 100 Charizard, which would be like saying Academy Rock Lee vs. Momoshiki because Momoshiki's weakness is Taijutsu, which is a true statement, but Lee in that instance would just be so out-leveled that it wouldn't matter, so while Obito in my analogy is on paper a stronger fighter, it's not by much, both have similar scaling vs. KCM1 Naruto and EMS Sasuke levels of power so you can say they are roughly relative in that same tier or like half-tiers apart.
The thing about Itachi is that, in my opinion, he has the better battle IQ, he is much less likely to be caught off-guard and he's basically #1 or #2 in jutsu analysis, him and Kakashi have shown the ability to break down enemy jutsus the quickest, with Sasuke probably surpassing them by the end of the series and into Boruto anyways, but in my opinion Itachi is the ultimate foil to Obito, he is probably going to be the second or third-quickest to solve Kamui, similar to how Kakashi and Minato were able to, also Sakura lowkey solved Kamui even when Obito was goofing off as Tobi so it's an extremely simple jutsu to solve at its core, exploiting it is the hard part, and Itachi has the tools to do so, he's BY FAR the quickest at weaving signs, so fast Kakashi literally could never perceive him weaving a single sign, he'd likely feign a loss with an exploding shadow clone, and when Obito attempts to suck it up thinking its the real Itachi as his win-con, it explodes in his face and either kills or severely injures Obito. I think Tsukuyomi is a 50/50 on working and depends on what condition you take Itachi in, but also Obito just having one Mangekyo could either fully counter Itachi or not be enough, you could interpret that because he only has one eye, he wouldn't have as good of a resistance vs. two.
This is a fight where, contrary to the common opinion of Itachi defenders, where Itachi should just spam MS and Susano'o abilities to a win, this is actually the complete opposite of how he'd fight, he very rarely uses his full power, he mainly fights using diversionary methods to force opponents to utilize their kits so he can study them and solve them, using low chakra-cost jutsus such as FIre Style, basic taijutsu, shurikenjutsu, subtle basic Sharingan Genjutsus and so on, Itachi is not a stupid fighter like Sasuke, he made an MS last for almost a decade, Sasuke lost his in like a week or two across the span of like three fights, Itachi is never under any circumstances starting a fight with Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi, and his Susano'o, he pulls out his win con of choice once he has devised which one will end the fight, until then he will fight in chakra conservation mode while he studies Kamui, and probably reach the conclusion to use Tsukuyomi to see if that will work, and if it doesn't, he will use the remainder of his chakra to try to fake Obito out with an Exploding Shadow Clone, which should work on Obito as shadow clones have even tricked the likes of Kaguya and Isshiki, who both have far better visual acuity than Obito and if anyone should be able to discern clones from originals, it should be Otsutsukis, the only way Obito would be able to tell is if Itachi outright made it in front of him without masking it which would be insanely stupid not to mention out-of-character, not to mention Itachi is literally like the character with the fastest sign-weaving feats I can think of. I think Itachi takes it 6/10 times ultra high diff, but I do think there are outcomes that either result in Itachi's illness catching up with him if we use Shippuden alive Itachi, where Obito simply wins by attrition and plays it very carefully, but I also think Itachi is simply smart enough and has a diverse enough kit, superior battle IQ and fighting style, that he'd pull through more often than not even if only by a little.
*>Assumes Itachi would deduce Kamui mid-battle even though he never figured out he wasn't Madara in years*
Amusing.
*>Still thinks Itachi had an illness*
No proof whatsoever. His only supposed symptom was coughing blood which Sasuke also did from overusing Susano (chapter 479 pages 1 & 11).
*>Talks like Itach's competent like his superior brother, while ironically downplaying him*
You went too far Itachi fan. I'm not letting you go unchecked.
*>"Sasuke probably surpassing them by the end of the series and into Boruto anyways"*
Surpassed in between part one & two.
*>Itachi is not a stupid fighter like Sasuke, he made an MS last for almost a decade, Sasuke lost his in like a week or two across the span of like three fights*
Itachi never laid a finger on the Akatsuki nor Danzo whereas Sasuke fought a Perfect Jinchuriki, Kage because Tobi & Zetsu ruined his plan to remain hidden, Danzo whom Itachi knew wanted Sasuke dead yet left alone, then Kakashi. All while knowing blindness wasn't a game ender since he could obtain EMS.
If Itachi was as good as you imagine he is, he would come up with alternative means than self-destructive hax dojutsu. He had 8 years. 21 year old Itachi said he needed Susano - an inherent Sharingan ability that he *automatically* had when he *unintentionally* awakened Mangekyo at 13, which consumes a lot of chakra in addition to blinding & killing him, to counter Kirin. The ultimate lightning jutsu his more talented & intelligent brother *created* & *mastered* by 16, within 3 years.
Sasuke turned down the chance to obtain Mangekyo by killing his inferior rival at the Valley then trained to overcome Itachi's. Broke out of Tsukuyomi by amping Sharingan with the Curse Mark (Itachi had exclamation points in his speech bubble showing he was surprised - chapter 389 pages 9-10). Then escaped Amaterasu with snake substitution after baiting Itachi to use it outside to set up Kirin. Which obliterated Susano despite having the "invincible" Yata Mirror. Manipulating the weather instead of chakra allowed him to set it up without Itachi knowing & made Kirin on a level beyond any jutsu in it's field since it uses natural lightning (chapter 391 page 4).
Whereas Itachi's grand scheme against Tobi was implanting Amaterasu to activate to Tobi's Sharingan. His other maneuver with Sasuke was brainwashing him with the super Genjutsu Koto-Amatsukami. Hax, hax & hax. Two failed & one barely worked.
Contrast that with Sasuke who, amongst other things, achieved a decisive victory over Danzo - a Sharingan user, with what Tobi called a weak Genjutsu, in a plan he just came up with. Escaped Deidara's ultimate explosion without the need of a hax like Flying Thunder God, by using a common ability - summoning jutsu, in a clever way instead of relying on self-harming moves despite having Orochimaru absorbed for fast recovery.
Even with the several year age advantage Itachi falls significantly below Sasuke.
@ Itachi never fought Madara or tried to fight Madara, in a fight Itachi would quickly solve his abilities and probably even realize it’s not actually Madara.
Also you just exposed yourself as a fake Naruto fan because Itachi’s illness is well-documented, Obito even tells Sasuke he was taking medication to prolong his life, and in one of the canon light novels Sasuke goes to the land where Itachi was sourcing the medication from, so I don’t know if you thought were doing something here, but the only thing you’re doing is exposing yourself as a fake Naruto fan, so let’s keep going, this will be very amusing.
Seems you’re just a delusional Sasuke fan. If Sasuke had surpassed Itachi in between part 1 and part 2 he wouldn’t have been relative to Itachi when they fought Kabuto even AFTER obtaining the EMS lmao, Sasuke was always weaker than Itachi, I took a literal God given power from Hagoromo in the form of a Six Paths enhanced Rinnegan for Sasuke to finally eclipse his more prodigious older brother. You’re such a foolish child. I can tell you’re a kid because you talk like a kid, Itachi is a character that it takes a little bit of age and wisdom to appreciate, rewatch Naruto again once you’re in your 20s and you’ll understand, foolish child.
Its as simple as this: the threat: "I will kill you" doesn't have to happen in a fair fight. In the end Kamui is overpowered. Itatchi cannot counter it. But Itatchi can still think he can kill Obito when his guard is down. He doesn't have to engage him head on.
I think pain is a harder fight for itachi than obito.. itachi is his kryptonite
I also think Obito takes this but YIKES, you're overcomplicating Izanagi and Amaterasu just to make Kamui more powerful when it's already the MOST BUSTED ms ability.
Izanagi is explained to rewrite reality but the way it's used all throughout the manga is basically: 'cast right before you die from the damage, and reverse it like it didn't happen'
You don't cast it before the fight. You cast it before a fatal blow. So you can get hit and still cast it just right before you die, and reverse the whole thing.
There's no prep time needed for it other than weave the handseals before the damage kills you and make sure the eye is exposed.
It doesn't regenerate anything prior to that.
So the assumption is Obito gets by Amaterasu, casts Izanagi off screen (he was in the dark) before the fire fully engulfs him, then reverses everything.
We see the exact interaction in the Danzo fight. He gets hit by Amaterasu, then we don't see him for a bit, then he respawn unscathed, no burn marks on his clothes.
Izanagi is the most consistent explanation as to how Obito survived.
Bro literally rewrote what was said in the video and passed it off lmao
@@ThunderGodTG💀🤣
@@ThunderGodTG aw my bad if that sounded aggressive but yeah I rewrote it because you explained exactly how Izanagi works which is awesome then came to the conclusion at 20:11 that Izanagi works only with the assumption that he had to have casted it prior to Amaterasu hitting/before talking to Sasuke. My take is he casted it AFTER getting hit by Amaterasu but before it actually kills him. Which works based on how you already explained how Izanagi works, and has less assumptions to make than with Kamui wherein we have to assume Amaterasu burns Obito eyes but slower for Obito shoulder (which is still (which is technically still the target, Obito eyes is connected to his body /shoulder).
Beating obito required jutsu that aren't physical. And itachi has pockets of jutsu like koto, izanami, tuskyomi, genjutsu, explosion clones. Itachi cooks obito
Obito should have info on Koto and Tsukuyomi. Izanami counters Izanagi, but why would Obito need to use Izanagi in the first place? Also, I don't think Itachi can perform the requirements for Izanami on Tobi. Obito has better genjutsu feats. And the explosive clone probably isn't doing that much.
Obito only win con is sucking people up. And explosion clones can literally one tap him on that. That's it. Izanami did work on Obito who doesn't accept the reality and their fate.
Koto and Tsukuyomi can whop him without breaking sweat. All he has to do is showing rin or brainwashing him
@jackylim3948 Izanami probably would work, if Itachi could set it up. And what makes you think an explosive clone can just one shot obito.
@jackylim3948 1. Itachi couldn’t use Shisui’s eye back when he was alive because it was still recuperating, meaning no Kotoamatsukami.
2. Itachi has no reason to use Izanami, as he doesn’t know Obito (as Tobi) is experiencing an identity crisis, so Izanami is off the table.
3. Obito meets the requirements needed to break through Tsukuyomi so that gets broken out of.
4. The Sharingan would allow Obito to easily dispel any genjutsu used against him, making genjutsu entirely useless in this matchup.
5. Itachi doesn't know that Obito becomes tangible when attacking or teleporting, so he couldn’t plan to prepare an explosive clone in advance.
I still can’t believe Izanami/Izanagi are a thing
Dumbest abilities in the show.
My opinion: obito wins,in a 8 to 9 hard difficulty against itachi and vice versa. I think kamui negates a good part of itachi's kit while the oposite is not quite the same. My win con fir itachi is either tsukuiomi one shot ( the one where he used on his girlfriend that made her live a lifetime and died of old age) or get a lucky totsuka hit if we asume his soul does not became intangible with him, both would require a very prolonged battle and chest level plays. In short, both have insta kill moves and cannot affort to make any signifant mistakes or GGs
Akatsuki (all versions) vs madara (all versions)
The moment amatersu gg was debunked, the itachi STANS (not fans, itachi fans > itachi stans) began sweating, i could feel it in the universe
One thing with the Totsuka blade that I think is weird about Obito fazing through it is that Obito usually teleports the part of his body being tagged but it’s not physically being tagged at all so would he even teleport that part of his body to the Kamui dimension
Also I think it’s fair to think that unlike most people Obito with an MS wouldn’t be one shot by Tsukuyomi but would be heavily affected by it for the rest of the fight essentially crippling him just not to the degree of like Kakashi in part 1 but afterwards I think Itachi would win that specific scenario if that’s how you interpret Tsukuyomi
Since obito can physically see it coming towards him he should be able to phase through it regardless of whether it’s a spiritual weapon or not
I got obito using izanagi on Amaterasu. he says danzo uses an incomplete version, and we don't see obito weave signs for it like danzo does, so I think he doesn't need to activate it before hand to turn something into illusion. the proof itself being the instance in question. "itachi didn't know everything about me". itachi didn't know he had hashirama cells to use it.
I also got obito breaking tsukuyomi. itachi probably wasn't using a full power one on sasuke, but I feel sasuke could have broke a stronger one than that too, cause he still had chakra to use after it. obito has the MS, plus hashirama cells so I feel he'll be able to fight it off.
I think itachi's subtle genjutsu is his best asset. like we seen kakashi and obito have the little genjutsu battle in the kamui world. I think itachi could really fuck with obito, using his high battle IQ
Do you believe Tobi [Obito] used a jutsu before or after being hit by Itachi's Amaterasu?
@@Normal_guy9 well I don't have a strong opinion on whether it's before or after. I just think it isn't the same as danzos incomplete version. could have been activated just as it was shot before it landed, or after idk.
@@spit-fire Would you agree that an eye using the Izanagi must be exposed and unobstructed?
@@Normal_guy9 there might be something there. obito's mask did fall off while he was on fire
@@spit-fire Would you agree that the Izanagi returns you to the state you were in prior to its activation?
Itachi has a counter to everything Obito does:
If he becomes Tangible (Amaterasu)
If he tries to warp away Itachi (exploding shadow clone)
Izanagi (Itachi has the Izanami)
Any AP (Yata mirror)
Genjutsu (Tsukoyomi, Kotoamatsukami crow)
Obitos only win con is catching Itachi fast enough to warp him away. Whereas Itachi has 5-6 different win cons.
None of that will work against him.
@@Normal_guy9 There’s no reason they wouldn’t.
@@arsenewenger4847
Obito can negate the Amaterasu.
Exploding paper bombs, IF they catch Obito, would only inflict minor damage.
Genjutsu wouldn't work on Obito, bro was literally taught everything by Madara.
I have no answer tobhe the yata mirror.
@@ADM.II. Genjutsu that powerful would most likely work as Obito has shown no genjutsu resistance feats.
@arsenewenger4847 - Amaterasu only worked on Tobi (Obito) because his guard was down, something unlikely to happen in a 1v1 setting, especially against Itachi. Additionally, he doesn’t need to materialize to attack, as he can still launch projectiles or use long-distance ninjutsu while staying intangible.
- Obito knows everything about Itachi and would likely anticipate the use of an explosive clone but even if he didn't, he could still suck the explosion away, just like he did with Konan's.
- Izanami takes time to set up, and on top of that, Obito is aware of it. He would simply avoid repeating the same sensation, preventing Itachi from creating and completing the loop.
- Yata Mirror can only be held up for so long.
- Obito is a member of the Uchiha clan and wields the Mangekyo Sharingan. He meets the criteria needed to break through Itachi's Tsukuyomi, there's more leaning towards he can break it than him not being able to, and Itachi can't use Koto'amatsukami.
If obito used kamui to get out of Amaterasu then he shirt and shoulder would have been burnt when he walked back to the light. End of discussion.
we just skipped the part where we elaborated on Amaterasu takes 10 business days to burn or just the examples provided
We already know it was obito because if itachi could kill him he would have done it
I wonder about the Toutska blade because unlike Kaguya who blatantly disappears from the dimension while Obito phases he still is able to be seen in the dimension while is body parts are in the other dimension maybe Itachi would haave to throw his Yata Mirror at Obito first before sealing him but I don't see it as impossible.
One example I can see since it's the most obvious Astral Body we get outside of filler in which Itachi probably grabs all those ghosts as well is Dan Kato's Ghost Jutsu he could probably seal him if the blade catches Dan.
This upload will never win.
I still always rep Itachi.
❤