The Mistake Screenwriters Make With Structure - Shannan E. Johnson
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ต.ค. 2024
- In this Film Courage video interview, Writer/Instructor and Script Consultant Shannan E. Johnson (The Professional Pen) on The Mistake Screenwriters Make With Structure.
MORE VIDEOS WITH SHANNAN E. JOHNSON
bit.ly/32pCWAF
CONNECT WITH SHANNAN E. JOHNSON
www.awriterfor...
/ theprofessionalpen
/ shannanejohnson
/ theprofessionalpen
/ shannanejohnson
BECOME A FILM COURAGE MEMBER
/ @filmcourage
CONNECT WITH FILM COURAGE
www.FilmCourage...
#!/...
/ filmcourage
/ filmcourage
/ filmcourage
BUSINESS INQUIRIES
bit.ly/22M0Va2
SUBSCRIBE TO THE FILM COURAGE TH-cam CHANNEL
bit.ly/18DPN37
LISTEN TO THE FILM COURAGE PODCAST
/ filmcourage-com
PROMOTE YOUR MOVIE, WEBSERIES, OR PRODUCT ON FILM COURAGE
bit.ly/1nnJkgm
SUPPORT FILM COURAGE
/ filmcourage
Stuff we use:
CAMERA - This is the camera we have used to film 90+% of our interviews (over 200 interviews and counting) It continues to be our workhorse - amzn.to/2u66V1J
LENS - Most people ask us what camera we use, no one ever asks about the lens which filmmakers always tell us is more important. This lens was a big investment for us and one we wish we could have made sooner. Started using this lens at the end of 2013 - amzn.to/2tbtmOq
AUDIO
Rode VideoMic Pro - The Rode mic helps us capture our backup audio. It also helps us sync up our audio in post amzn.to/2t1n2hx
Audio Recorder - If we had to do it all over again, this is probably the first item we would have bought - amzn.to/2tbFlM9
LIGHTS - Although we like to use as much natural light as we can, we often enhance the lighting with this small portable light. We have two of them and they have saved us a number of times - amzn.to/2u5UnHv
COMPUTER - Our favorite computer, we each have one and have used various models since 2010 - amzn.to/2t1M67Z
EDITING - We upgraded our editing suite this year and we’re glad we did! This has improved our workflow and the quality of our work. Having new software also helps when we have a problem, it’s easy to search and find a solution - goo.gl/56LnpM
*These are affiliate links, by using them you can help support this channel.
#writing #screenwriting #screenplay
She's the most interesting person you've had in this entire series. Unpretentious, direct.
💯💯💯💯
Yep, 1st minute in and I agree.
She certainly is.🌼🌼🌼
She’s the teacher who everyone can love for the right and hate for the wrong reasons. If you understand why she critiques your work and is very blunt with you because she wants you to succeed, then you have to forfeit any personal hostility and ego of your work and accept others feedback.
I watched one of her videos, then binged a dozen more. Then I followed her on IG. She’s excellent.
I've hired her. She's not good. She's AMAZING!
Galaxy Hunter what amazing about what you hired her to help you with vs other consultants
Shannan is amazing at getting to each point and explaining it in detail... Great advice!
We agree, thanks for watching!
Wonderful advice. Activity isn’t action. Events are not story. One of the final things I feel a lot of writers come to is the importance of everything in the story serving in some way, at the very least, the encompassing theme. If you’re going to have action, make it assist the story.
Very well said, my friend!
I highly disagree if you've seen pulp fiction events and scenes was all the movie was about
She is so articulate! I LOVED hearing her speak, and it made a lot of things clear for me.
Fantastic, glad you found valuable insight here.
Film Courage Thank you! I also LOVE LOVE LOVE you channel!!! It is really THE BEST source of information on scriptwriting, all across the internet! Without any exaggeration. So, thank you very much for existing, and I hope, you will continue so, for many years to come. 🤩
We hope so too. Thank you for your kind words of support. There are so many great resources available today, we are doing the best we can. Again, thank you spending time here with us.
My feeling is she's delivered these pitch perfect comments a thousand times before but writer's don't listen.
CribNotes 😂
Everything that comes out of her mouth is just pure gold. Thank you for interviewing her, she's amazing.
Posting another new video tonight. Stay tuned!
The most interesting part is the fact that she knows her craft. She is an expert in her field, and this is where we all need to be. Thank you for the teaching lesson.
Her writing insight is gold. Thank you, Film Courage.
"The cat sat on a mat" - is not a story. "The cat sat on the Dog's mat" - that's a beginning.
Nice!
"He died hungry." That's a beginning too.
I really love Shannan’s true respect for the craft and the way she communicates the what’s what and the how and why’s of things in such a REAL way. (Also I just made that what’s what and how etc stuff up here lol wtf)
Thanks as always, Film Courage!
She's the best, her interviews are always the best
She is filled with so much wisdom and she's very engaging.
This interview was awesome. Shannan was very insightful and honest about knowing and understanding the craft. Her insight regarding structure and the difference between types of programming was most helpful.
She is awesome. She explains things so well and with so much energy and life. Love it!
Thanks Gene! Great to see you and others connecting to Shannan's teachings.
This was actually helpful, even if I only write for fun I’ve never been prouder when I felt I nailed the inciting incident in the first few pages and people got excited and craved more. Structure is a real thing!
Also, I love this woman’s way to talk about this, very articulate and down to earth.
Shannan is awesome! I’ve been following her on IG for awhile. She always has such incredible advice and is really there for us writers. Can’t wait to see more of this interview.
Thanks Kim! Here is everything we have published so far on this channel - bit.ly/32pCWAF
@@filmcourage I've watched them all! Thank you for posting! This was not only informative, but has given me a push to work on my projects.
Great stuff Darlene! Looks like we can't keep up with you. Haha. Will probably have a new video up with Shannan in 2 weeks. Keep creating!
@@filmcourage This channel is amazing and I can't wait to see the next interview. Thank you🤗
I love the way she says "no" in the beginning! 😂
Shannon is by far THE BEST interviewee you guys got on this channel! Not saying the others are bad! But Shannon explains things so so well!
Shannan: All writers need help with structure.
Me: I wonder how she'll prove this without sounding arrogant.
Shannan: There are rewriters who have jobs.
Me: (ashamed) ok. please teach me.
@@timetheory84 the end product has a lot to do with other factors though like last minute rewrites, director/actor preferences, etc
Shannen is so articulate and interesting to watch. Thank you for uploading this. She's helped me realise that much of my story is activity not action. Please post more of this and pass compliments back to Shannen.
Thanks Matdy, great to see you finding value in our interview with Shannan! Here is everything we have published with her so far - bit.ly/32pCWAF
@@filmcourage many thanks. I've seen them all! but I'll look forward to more.
Liked her describing the different structures.
What was the most helpful part of this video for you?
Interesting how, in her opinion, structure does not always necessarily stop someone (an insider) from not seeing promise in in a script.
When she said that activity isn't action. I'm doing an undercover story and for the life of me I've been finding it hard to create action because it's an information job and so you need to be passive.
TLDR: it just helped me think about how i can make my story more action oriented for my protagonist
She simplified structure and just told writers how it is when it comes down to structure and THAT is what I've been looking for this whole time.
The third act...
Great to see that Jacoby. We just put together a longer video on structure that you may find helpful. Save this for a car trip or when you are doing household chores or something like that - th-cam.com/video/_D7fxkvsUUw/w-d-xo.html
"read scripts that are close to the script that you are writing so you can see what kind of structure and what kind of format they use"
So basically read what you want to write, consume what you want to produce.
Top notch advice, all of it. Currently watching all of the interviews from this writer!
Thanks a lot!
Same Loll
''... you gotta respect the craft.'' Indeed! Thank you!
I've gotten good information from so many of the interviews you do but this woman's advice has been the most insightful and to the point. I'm going to watch all of her interviews and see what else I can find from her (books, articles, podcasts, etc.). Thanks for this.
Shannan is great!
I like this kind of interview where the interviewer gracefully remains in the background, and allows the expert/interviewee all her time/say....It allows the interviewee's style, knowledge and personality to shine through. Great questions, great insights, ...kudos both
passion really goes a long way :)
This touched a nerve... and in a good way! It helped me to see, more clearly, in my own dark corners of the mind that shroud I was holding over clumsy structure, deflecting attention toward the "bright idea." I've done this on screenplays, novels, scientific papers (meandering abstracts),...
I love her clarity and the ability to distill the core wisdom that helps me analyze how closely my writing fulfills the baseline requirements. Only by knowing these "rules" to a level of deep understanding can we ever hope to break the rules and simultaneously create innovative and compelling art. Creating without such mastery invariably results in something clumsy or even cringe worthy.
Love this lady! I'm glad you keep posting excerpts from the interview with her. Would love to have her as a consultant... It was really helpful when she explained that writing in five acts is basically writing three, but stretching them out. Also the final part about using the resources around the internet to learn and become better. This channel is one for me!
Cheers Miranda, we're humbled to be a valuable resource for you. Keep creating!
So many truth bombs in this that resonated with things I've learned about my own writing (prose, not screen), my mistakes, and what works in the professional market. Fantastic.
Brilliant! Straight and to the point! Best one yet! Thank You Shannan! Thank you Film Courage!
Daaannnnnmmm, this is one of the most greatest person to listen to, please keep making more video with her ,she explaining everything the way it supposed to be, please ask her how to get the money to film the script as well,
Shannan E. Johnson is DOPE!!! To the point, detailed, with great insight.
excelente..no hablo ingles asi que tengo que poner el traductor....y el traductor me escribe exactamente la idea que esta transmitiendo......pero lo he hecho con otros y el traductor no me registra las ideas correctamente, esto significa que los otros no son acertivos para expresar sus ideas. SHANNAN E. JHONSON SI ES ACERTIVA Y SABE EXPRESAR EN FORMA CONCISA Y CLARA. CONTINUARE APRENDIENDO DE ELLA. THANKS
Shannon, thank you for sharing your expertise. You are the GOAT!
One thing I respect about Shannan she always gives you the raw truth. Sometimes it’s harsh but I feel it builds backbone
Dang, she straight up the point no bullshit. I love it.✨
She is really, really good. A natural teacher and explainer.
Wow- this is gold!
I have been watching her videos on your channel. Love her. No bs.
Thank You, Film Courage for doing this video. After watching this video, I learned that a movie can become good and engaging to watch only if it is made with a well-structured script.
Glad this one was helpful Shailendra! Doing our best to put out helpful bits of wisdom as often as we can. Cheers!
Thank you for posting this interview. She's so knowledgeable and this information is so helpful.
Glad it was helpful!
Organized. I love organization. Although there are many approaches to building something, methodical process is the most efficient way to go. Thank you for making these videos and sharing with us.
Best interview I've watched on here!
One of the best screenwriting consultants I've heard to date! Shannon E. Janson is amazing, a breath of fresh air, and as a new writer, I'm inspired to take on learning screenwriting this new year! I wish anyone seeing this the best of hopes in your craft, too. What you plan to do in your writing career?
This really helped! I realized I've been writing to much stuff with no conflict or goal.
THIS IS GOLD.
I love her. She’s awesome!
This information is so amazing! She is a great teacher, so very helpful, exactly what i need to hear, thank you!
More people like this, please...
The most helpful parts for me were getting your most interesting info in the first 15 pages and figuring out which channel your story is best for
This video was dope. (That's a good thing. Meaning I liked it alot.) It's very encouraging to hear no writer, or at least very few, is without fault.
Glad I subscribed.
There's only so much bingeing and pb&j making I can do these days.
I have yet to watch a single video on your channel that I didn't like. Keep it up, I'm loving it.
It's bound to happen sooner or later, but we are certainly glad to hear it. Cheers Jean!
Thank you. God bless,
Very helpful to hear how screenwriters "should" write for structure in stories.
I love this woman
Helpful coz it makes man know; "I aint outta ma mind"✌🏽
Best person in your interviews for sure. Always giving away amazing information.
Sounds like you are getting a lot of value out of our videos with Shannan, thanks for watching!
Maybe this is why so much coming out of Hollywood feels so formulaic. Measuring everything against story beat sheets surely leaves many great stories untold.
Thanks for your comment. What are your Top 5 movies?
But don't genre beats come from generations of storytellers refining them?
Arrival, Sicario, A Quiet Place, Spider-Man: Into the Spider-verse, and Marriage Story all have beats don't they?
I disagree. It sounds like she's talking more about whether the story hooks you or not. Your story can take in any matter of shape or form but it needs to capture your attention or draw you in. Sounds similar to what makes a good book.
🤔Read scripts that are close to what you are writing and structure is setting actions to fulfill a particular goal (3 Acts can be condensed). Another great information! 🔥🔥🔥for 🎥
Thank you for this video, Like she said I have an idea, characters, and a world/setting but I have trouble with the structure so I’ll work on it thanks for the help!
Cheers! We just released this video a couple of weeks ago. You may find it helpful - th-cam.com/video/_D7fxkvsUUw/w-d-xo.html
Film Courage thank you
This is a good one. ❤️
Cheers!
Insightful, Thank you
Glad it was helpful!
Wonderful comments by her. I need to get my hands on some scripts to learn structure
Best interview partner ever!
That was great. Thanks
She is awesome.
Structure, structure, and more structure. Got it.
Excellent!
I love her
Very very good advice
This woman is an amazing communicator. She should be a teacher for children lol
Bravo !
Awesome video. Awesome prof.
Wow, she's fantastic
Super great. Love the idea of inciting incident as thesis-not exactly the same, in that you're not making a statement, you're raising a question, but same effect: "Ah! THAT's what this is about."
Not sure about her analysis of 3-act, though. Act 1 is setup? It includes setup, but thinking of it as "the setup act" is a good way to be hopelessly boring. Act 2 is "actually getting to the goal"? Okay, that's pretty close, as long as you're relentlessly escalating. Act 3 is "we got the goal, now what"? No way. The story's over basically as soon as we get the goal, save for a little bit of denouement. The bulk of Act 3 is usually buildup to the climax, which is decidedly NOT post-goal material.
Thanks so much for this 🙏
These ‘writers’ and other ‘writers’ I’ve taken courses with all talk about ‘knowing whether a scripts good or not cause it hits beats in one page/two pages/three pages’. These same ‘writers’ would, if they were forced to stick by their word, not read past page three of the godfather and pulp fiction, both scripts where no beats occur in the first three pages. I’d bet that writing well gets you ten times further than writing spreadsheets.
Good point. There are people that encourage to write different, create unique stories but they still want you to write like everyone else when it comes to structure, but those unique stories don't have the same structures as the conventional stories. It might take a few more pages to introduce a certain character etc. sometimes it's discouraging smh lol
There are exceptions to the rule when you’re talking ppl like Coppola and Tarantino. They can get away with stuff like that. Like Aaron Sorkin’s long dialogue scenes. Unknown writers will get tossed.
There are reasons why most of these "experts" have never written a fantastic feature.
@@j.goebbels2134 criticizing is much easier than creating things that will be criticized
Godfather is an adaptation of a novel directed by a famous director and pulp fiction is made by Tarantino after he got famous from reservoir dogs (a movie who's inciting incident happens within it's third scene). These are films made by established filmakers. Of course producers are going to make an exception.
She's right. Learn the rules, apply the rules and love what you do...
Thank you. Much appreciated.
Thanks for watching Jo Ann!
Even the inanimate “lamp” was intentional to drive the action and vibe of this story. 👍🏼
Great video!
"Activity is not action."
JJ Abrams: "Okay, first of all, I don't see why you need to personally attack me."
Definitely seeking her out for consultation
Watched the movie Tag tonight. There’s a lot of activity in that movie. Central to the premise of the film, sure, but the structure was kinda limp and it came through especially when I realized I was only 30 minute into what felt like an hour.
This is the kind of teacher/coach that students think is just mean and don't realize until way later just how much value she added.
Excellent.
lovely person
She's good, thanks.
great !
Is there an age limit for submitting your work to Sundance? Just a quick question before I finish the video :)
www.sundance.org/submissions-faq
Is this advice for a 30-minute episode? cause if I get to the inciting incident within the first 3 or 10 pages my movie is over in 60 minutes or less.
I am restructuring my scripts into TV Series.
It appears the millennial generation is interested in series more than feature films.
Would it be because of impatience, time constrictions or that to tell a good story it takes more than two hours?
It's just economics. That's where the money is now. Feature film is dying. All the money and good writing is in TV now.
Very informative
Thanks for watching!
She seems like an all star mentor.
I agree that '3-act structure' is the underlying structure of every story. It's been that way since Aristotle, and since mythology before that.
It's fine to use formulas and recipes that stress 1,2,3,4,5, or 6 acts, if that helps you or gets you to fit a story into a required formula, but of course 'formula' is the mortal enemy of creativity, so while it's fine to use that for training wheels to get a story moving forward in its initial creation, at some point its important to leave all of that behind in the name of actual creativity. The only basic structure a story needs is beginning, middle, and end.
Readers and viewers care nothing at all about act structure or scene structure, at least consciously. They don't consciously say 'Oh-now we're in Act II' or 'Oh-that scene ended and I guess another is beginning'. Knowing all that is important for the author, of course, but all the audience wants is the story. They might unconsciously perceive these changes, but the difference between beginning, middle, and end is naturally known to every audience member, both consciously and unconsciously, and they know what they want is what they expect.
And what they expect is a beginning, a middle, and an end. They expect an inciting incident early in Act I, they expect progressive complications and a possible crisis question in Act II, and they expect a climax either late in Act II or early in Act III, and they expect the bulk of the resolution to be in Act III. Without even realizing this is what they expect. An author, in story, is obligated to give them what they expect.
What happens in the beginning of a story is different from what happens in the middle and from what happens in the end. What you write in Act I is going to be different from what you write in Act II and that is going to be different from what you write in Act III, regardless how you might consciously section that up.
Of course there are a lot of intricate fine details for how to make all that work, but essentially, what the goal for the creator is, and what the audience is looking for, is a story, which if structured properly, will always have a beginning, a middle, and an end.
100% true - action should always be PROACTIVE. You can have a main character doing lots of activities, (being active) - but not *proactive*. BIG difference.
I've had a LENGTHY argument with one filmmaker who believed she reinvented the wheel by not following "rules" and conventions/structures. I requested to view her 10min short film, and afterwards pointed out beat for beat how she made a one act film. She naturally cursed me and most likely banned me on FB. hahahah. Shame. ANYONE that says there are no rules, have not MASTERED the basics yet.
Great comment Joseph, thank you for posting. We are fascinated to see people argue over structure.
I don't know, I think passionate amateurs can create some truly special things. Most people kinda know what they like, and will do their best to achieve this Standart. The result will probably be rough around the edges, but, because of their arrogance for the rules, also kind off special. I think saying you have to master the basics is kind off an excuse to not actually finishing things, at least it's something that often holds amateurs, including me, back from just doing what they think might be cool.
@@Cyliandre441 I disagree wholeheartedly. If you don't master the basics, then you will get stuck constantly. And more specifically you get things done quicker. I have a couple of friends who received zero education training in screenwriting that takes 10 years to write a script. I mean............... and the one guy is on draft 12. That's another big red flag of someone not taking the time to master the basics and hone your skill. You shouldn't go past draft 2 if not draft 3. If you do a draft 4, the producers have already hired another writer.
@@josephvanwyk2088 Yes, if you work professionally it's a little bit of a different story. The basics exist because they work fairly reliably, I think, and that reliability might help with speed.
But in my opinion there is a certain kind of freedom not knowing what exactly you are doing brings. This doesn't work in a professional environment because, as you said, it takes ages and is prone to mistakes.
But sometimes I wish risks like these would be taken, because even when a "professional" movie is really good it does not surprise in a way a janky campy passion Projekt can.
I don't really know what my point is, maybe that we should see the naive approach as equally valid as the professional one. I hope I did not ramble to much.
Sorry I unfortunately ignored some aspects of your response. But I would've probably completely muddled my point if I had incorporated these.
@@Cyliandre441 I totally disagree. I work in animation as a storyboard artist, a character designer, an animator, and a writer. You absolutely must master the basics/fundamentals to break the rules. My goto comparison is Picasso. When most people think of Picasso they think of his cubism paintings, with weird looking images with distorted eyes and not following any proper anatomy. He broke all the rules. But he did that because that was the only place for him to go, to grow as an artist, to evolve his talents, it was the next logical progression of his work. He had already mastered life drawing, he had mastered painting, he had mastered composition, tone, color, hue, likeness, and all the fundamentals of visual art. There was nowhere to go from there. So the only place to take his art was in a completely different direction, cubism. But he only got to that point because he had mastered the fundamentals.
I see a lot of visual artists/painters who go straight to breaking the rules, without learning the fundamentals. To be totally honest, it's bullshit. They act as if they broke the rules on purpose. 'Oh, that eye lacks form? That's just my style. That was on purpose because (fill in the bullshit excuse here)'. When in fact, it is not on purpose, it is not their style, they just don't have the skill to paint properly. They haven't mastered the fundamentals. Instead of making up excuses, the best thing to do is be honest, and learn from your mistakes. 'Oh, that eye lacks form? How so? What is the proper form of an eye? How do I go about painting that?' Then you can improve in your craft. But if you are steadfast in making excuses, you will never learn the craft.
She speaks as an author who actually writes good books. Skips the unnecessary stuff, pacing is perfect, everything is in order and has purpose and sense. Which of course makes perfect sense! :D
Brilliant. She is worth her weight in diamond :)
This was helpful because it reaffirms my belief that the 3 act structure is the way to go.
Thanks for this.