Awesome. IMO this represents the best species of educational TH-cam video: something completely quotidian, viewed through a completely unexpected perspective that elevates it to another level of interest. I would never have viewed paint as a form of technology, but it totally is!
Really enjoy your videos dude. You choose unique topics and research them on master level. The footage you use is the best part- I dont know where you find all the clips. Then you deliver the fruits of your research in the way a true master of that topic would - easy to follow with a great structure that keeps focus. Truely well done, so few gets this right. Lastly- I've started to notice big channels on youtube copies topics off one another, many of them, not you sir- your topics are fresh!
And let's not forget that he is just SO good at pacing! Fast enough to keep you interested, but never so fast it feels rushed. And the chosen small pauses always comes at the "ah, ok!" moments.
@@gtbkts What I think is most important Is that the videos provide something of value like a unique perspective or greater depth. It's natural for people to make videos about big events or trendy topics. It only becomes a problem when they have nothing worthwhile to say (like tech previews before the actual review) or straight hearsay like that chess scandal.
i have worked on cars for some 50 years and now have a collection of old "mopar" muscle cars. after graduating from high school in 1972, i built and ran an auto body shop for three years and then went on to college and law school. i was the main "paint guy" at my body shop. in the 60's and 70's, GM used Acrylic Lacquer and Ford and Chrysler used Acrylic Enamel paint. both these paints were "single step" paints meaning that you just shook the paint vigorously, thinned it (usually 2-1) with a Lacquer or Enamel thinner, and then sprayed the paint on the vehicle. most colors required at least two coats - except black. the "metallic" paints (paint with small metal flecks) had to be applied in a certain way or you would get what was called "tiger stripes" meaning that you could see broad "mismatched" areas where the metal fleck "laydown" was mismatched from one area to another. the thinners for these paints came in three temperatures ranges, fast drying, medium drying, and slow drying. you used fast for cold shop temps and slow for hot shop temps. Lacquer was the easiest to use as if you made any mistakes like a dry spot, a "run in the paint", or the pesky fly that hit a panel, you could wait an hour and the paint was dry and hard enough to sand down and completely refinish. Acrylic Enamel was a different story. that paint was a little thicker in viscosity (as it had more clear acrylic in it) and you usually had to wait 24 or even 48 hours to sand and refinish Enamel. it was also easy to "blend in" small repairs or "partial panel painting" with these paints. there was little difference in appearance between these two paints, however, a skilled bodyman or painter could tell the difference between Lacquer and Enamel vehicle paint. i closed my body shop in 1974 to go to college. when i retired from my law practice in 2016, i started my car collection. i have found that the "water based paints" are AWFUL and CANNOT be used by a private person in their house garage. you MUST have a professional, commercial "paint booth" to spray the water based paints as they need constant air flow and "heat" to cure properly. the "base coat, clear coat" paints can be sprayed by a "do it yourself" private car restorer. i restored and painted one of my 1968 Plymouth Barracuda's using Acrylic Lacquer that I was able to get "custom mixed" and painted that car in the garage of my house. it came out very nice and looks just like the paint that would have been on the car when it was new in 1968. one thing about painting "old cars" - if you are a "purist" and want your car to "look like it did when it was new", you have to find a shop that can spray the old single step Lacquer or Enamel. ALL the new paints, water, base-coat/clear-coat, "Emron" type paint using an additive or "hardening agent" - all those paints have a MUCH higher gloss than paints had 55 years ago. only a few "luxury" cars "back then" had REALLY glossy paint jobs - like the Cadillac's and Lincoln Continental's. there were no Chevy's or Fords or Plymouths or Dodges or Pontiacs or Buicks or Oldsmobile's that looked like the cars do today. like so many things in this world now, EVERYTHING is much more complicated - AND EXPENSIVE!! when i contacted PPG (a major car paint company) to get a gallon of Acrylic Enamel to paint my 68 Barracuda with original paint (yes, PPG still manufactures some old OEM paint products), they said, "Yes, we have that paint, it is $1000 a gallon." i ended up painting the Barracuda with "Lacquer" at $327.00 a gallon. it is not unusual for a simple, modern repaint of a car costing $10,000 today. when i ran my body shop in 1973, we charged on average, $150.00 for a complete repaint. there was a guy named "Earl Schieb" who had a series of "franchised" body shops around the country who advertised "A new paint job for $29.99!"
@@never2late454 Dupont used to make a basic auto enamel paint called "Dulex." you could paint a concrete block with it and see your face in the shine. it was so thick it was almost like today's "powder coat" paint.
@@jimharvard Dulux was a great finish, but if I'm remembering correctly it took forever to cure. But a properly laid down acrylic enamel will last a lifetime if taken care of. I have a 1970 Mustang with the original paint that still shows a reflection.
@@never2late454 i used both acrylic lacquer and enamel in my body shop in 1973. you could get fast, medium and slow thinner for both paints. acrylic enamel could be shot pretty easily using the "fast" thinner, however, if the shop was very hot and you had to use the "slow" thinner with enamel, it would run if you didn't put the first couple of coats on very thin. you had to let enamel "tach up" for about 10 minutes before you could spray more to cover primer patches or to add color. i never had a paint booth in my shop and had to rely upon the different thinners and my own skill to get nice paint jobs done. i'm guessing that using the new paints in a modern paint booth is a lot easier than in the old days when you just "sprayed water on the floor" to keep down dust, mixed the paint in a Develbis or Binks "suction" (cup on the bottom) paint gun and get to spraying.
@@jimharvard Mack Truck used to sell this two part Kirker through their parts department back in the 80's. "Mack Standard Red" was my go to paint for pretty much everything, trucks, trailers, forklifts, even my girlfriend's car lol. 30 bucks a gallon including the activator for red, Other colors were cheaper. It worked pretty good and it held up well. Now I look at automotive paint prices and about have a stroke. I used to be able to paint a truck tractor for about 200 bucks in materials, and maybe 250 for a ten wheel dump. Boy I miss the old days
At 11:30. As far as I'm aware wet-on-wet doesn't usually refer to clear over base. It refers to spraying base over a smoothly applied primer or sealer that is not sanded or fully cured. It can save time but obviously the underlying surface needs to be well prepared and perfectly flat in advance. Technically the application of the clear over the base coat is the same technique but that terminology isn't used because that's the only way to do it.
At Volvo trucks here in Dublin Virginia the process is Dupont brand base coat sprayed by robots. Then 1 or 2 minutes later the clear is sprayed. It is considered wet on wet. Then it gets baked by ovens for two hours.
@@LBCAndrewComplete curing of eurethane, where the cross linking of molecules has taken place, takes about 30 days. Baking speeds initial dry time, but cross linking is still occurring after initial drying. Drying is through the evaporation process, where curing (cross linking process) is a chemical reaction.
As a COF.....Certified Old Farte.....I remember when GM used lacquer, Ford used enamel, and all red pigments faded faster than light at sunset. Late 80's I had a roommate that was a master painter and then went on to be a salesman for an auto paint company. We had many a conversation about paints, myself having done some basic painting. With the base coat urethane topcoat system, we've hit auto paint Nirvana.
Been painting cars for 8 years.. what a cool video! I have sprayed both modern water based and solvent based paints. In my experience water paints provide a better user experience, but solvent paints generally provide a more durable product that can be more reliable and less finicky in the long run. With a good painter using the correct products, it can outshine waterborne as well. I spray a hybrid of the Axalta Cromax system.. Standox base coat which is ok, but with their 7900s series clear coat, it is absolutely phenomenal. The clear really makes the product.
I don’t think you have the timelines of the paint development quite right..l was a automotive spray painter from the early seventies and we went from duco (nitrocellulose) to dulon (acrylic lacquer ) during that decade..two pack appeared in the form of Acran in the eighties which was highly toxic and killed many painters because the dangers of isocyonates were not realised as it had up to 5% cyanide in it .. decent two packs came here in the mid nineties and the requirements were a specific type of spray booth and full masks with outside independent properly filtered air supply.The development of of the two packs may have been earlier but were not in use ,at least not in Australia and New Zealand until the timeline l mentioned..
In the US, Dupont's Imron was the first widely used "2k" isocyanate bearing paint, and was on the market in the '70s. I strongly suspect the manufacturers were aware of the toxicity of the isocyanates, but they labeled the products with the exact same warnings as were on their acrylic lacquers. There was at one point a class action lawsuit brought against Dupont over this, but I don't know the outcome of the suit.
We had 2pack in the UK in the early 80s, although "celly" was the norm. The first 2pack laquer I used was from Metalflake and gave a superb finish, but was very expensive to use.
In the early eighties when working as a spray painter for a shop fitting and signage company (New Zealand ) ' I used Acran on something ' It was a new product ' I wore a respirator ' but I think I must have got some hardener on my skin ' one of my feet swelled up to about 3 times normal size ' and the skin on that leg went funny with a lumpy texture ' it all went back to normal in a few day's . I normally sprayed Duco at that time .
Great video… I have a suggestion for a part 2 companion video. You could cover the color pigment process… the search for rare materials, why some colors take years to perfect and why said colors are expensive up-charges. It’s an aspect of the industry that flys under the radar.
Detroit Agate, Motor City Agate, or Fordite, is a type of “stone” made from automotive paint that accumulated on factory equipment over the years. It has many layers/bands of wildly-varied color. People sometimes shape it into jewelry.
acrylic laquer and polyurethane will always be the best coating that I worked with acrylic laquer for custom painting and polyurethane for bependablety Great video I did a lot of painting in the early '70's and '80's lot's of artwork with acrylic laquer...and even with Imron polyurethane's I seen some cars and vans painted 10+ years ago and they looked like they were done yesterday that paint could take a lot of stones bouncing off them and still look like new . .
I was hoping to hear more about Imron paint - when it's applied correctly it's bullet proof. Had a 1976 Datsun 280z with Imron paint. This was in 1989 and it still had the original paint job in Upstate NY. I did end up painting it again with the original Imron color and that probably is still good - miss that car - but man that was some expensive paint
Bependablety? Is that dependability? I assure you, no trolling here. Just wanted to confirm your chosen words. I feel like the context pulls me towards dependability, but I am no pro painter. There could just as easily be a term I am not familiar with. That said, i always prefer acrylic laquers due to the intense pretty. I am usually rattle canning something in a uncontrolled garage though, so my idea of pretty is defnitely "paint it black, hit the track" over "watch the orange peel, make sure it flashes off properly...."
Regardless of your views on the environmental impact of modern industries, you have to give props to the engineers and scientists for solving so many problems with so many constraints.
I had a thought about how remarkable automotive paint was just a day or so ago on a drive, what a happy coincidence this is! Excellent video as always.
Good grief that was a bloody tour de force explainer. I'm exhausted just contemplating all the work and research that surely went into this 🥵 Utmost respect and appreciation 🙏 🏆
@@SolarWebsite personal experience on a 2014 Civic. Horrible paint. Only lasted 2 years before hood and roof were mostly gone. Honda repainted for free under recall but though I requested the whole car be done because the sides were going too the declined stating that painted was faded enough yet to qualify. So a year later went back for sides when they were gone but nope, my VIN had already been repainted and they won't paint the same VIN twice so fuck me. But of course that's 8-9 year old car. Maybe their paints better now? Ive seen plenty of other Hondas with totally faded paint too but can't speak to them personally
All auto paint will fail if not protected with a wax or sealant. It gets worse every model year, the manufacturers find a way to thin the clear coat to save money (the paint job is the most expensive part of a car). Fortunately, modern spray sealants have replaced traditional wax, they last longer and are as easy to apply as spraying a light mist on the surface and wiping it off. The newer your car, the more important you protect the paint.
Would have been cool to hear more about what car brands used which paints thru the years. But I’m sure that would have been hard to do comprehensive research on. But now I have the tools to figure it out myself. Nice vid
So many educational/informational channels seem heavily geared towards kids so I really appreciate you assume the viewer here is able to understand things without pedantic explanations
As a home hobbyist, I painted a few cars with acrylic enamel and a suction gun. I've never tried a basecoat/clearcoat system. I'm too old to paint a car today or I really mean to learn how to use the new stuff. In the past, I always wanted to. I'd like to restore another old car like oh say something small, a Ford Falcon maybe
I know I say what others already said, but damn man, your content is so rich in information and details as well as very easy to digest [English isn't my native language and I have zero problems following the script]! I am so thankful that you put out these videos, each one is a little gem that shines brightly throughout the platform. The topics that you choose aren't even what I would look for, but I am being sucked into the topic, whatever it may be, and I find it VERY interesting after you explain it. Thank you!
Clear coats are all well and good, but after a few years they peel off and the surface has to be repainted whilst the older coatings could be rubbed down and rejuvenated. So much for all the fancy technology.
0:45 _"They're also highly abrasion and impact resistant."_ I don't mean to be difficult, but uhh.....no. If there's one thing automotive paint has *_not_* become over the decades it's abrasion resistant---at least not _'usefully'_ abrasion resistant. I've often wondered how, with all the 'advances' in car paint over the years, *you still have to treat it so delicately in order not to get 'swirls' or other micro scratches* (which, to those who know cars, are totally obvious and not at all subtle). You can't even avoid these scratches by 'doing everything right'---like using lots of water; using only the softest washing cloths; chamoising carefully...etcetera. No matter what, you'll STILL get abrasions all over the paint, and they'll only be fixed by occasionally polishing with mild abrasives, only to start getting scratched all over again with your very next wash.
My father owned a paint and body shop going back to around 1960. Back then they typically used "acrylic enamel" which took a long time to dry and had to be put on at the correct thickness so it would self level to some extent. It took a long time to harden and could not be sanded and machine polished. They also used "lacquer" which dried fast but left a rough finish with no shine, so it was always sanded and polished after application. In the 1970s they were using the systems that had clearcoat but the clearcoat would not age well, it would yellow and crack. The changes to paint systems in the 1980s lead to paints that did not weather well. In my opinion paint systems used in recent years, maybe still being used, do not have the durability of the systems used over 50 years ago.
Auto Paints don't last in environments like the American Southwest on their own. I'll dare say, they are massively inferior to older manual intensive processes. The new process needs refinement to fight oxidation of large hoods and roofs. Toyota paint systems are notoriously quick failure systems out here. Usually less than 5 years in worst conditions.
Toyota paint, especially their blacks are notorious for oxidation due to not using a clear coat system. I literally just spent close to 10 hours turning my fathers 1999 4Runner's black paint that was chalky gray back to a brilliant deep gloss black finish. Two of his neighbors thought he had got it repainted it was such a huge difference. As for the southwest, i'm in southern california and my 2010 Audi has been parked on the street since i bought it new and i have zero issues with clearcoat or paint oxidation or failure. And i have been horrible at paint maintenance at least for five of those years. Perhaps its because Audi uses Glasurit paint made by BASF.
And the poor guy at the collision shop with just a $1000 spray gun that has to match the finish that trillion dollar automated robots produce gets no respect
4:15 I know its a small point to make but its not "melting" the top layer dissolving into the solvent, which then evaporates, allowing a homogenous mixture of layers to occur without a boundary. Melting would imply a change in heat or pressure which isnt happening here
Marvellous video! 👍👍 US EPA also regulates automotive repair coatings fir hydrocarbon emissions. As you note, any painting/coating application is only as good as the surface prep. Recently saw a video that said automotive coatings found uses in other industries. Fender Musical Instrument Corp® used DuPont® products on the wood bodies of its famous Stratocaster® and other models for many years. Many colors are known by their GM color codes. The challenge for restoration of vintage guitars and automobiles is finding a color match today. Today guitars use polyurethane or other more recent coatings or are coated overseas if one must have nitrocellulose lacquer with all its aging issues.
I can't say how much I appreciate your videos. The research you put into and reassuring tone is mesmerising. Please release videos a bit more frequent, just my suggestion though
Yep did this 45 yrs, And when clear coat was first introduced, it was only a year later that Porsche first used it, then it began pealing off, much like the low quality clears that are being used now in low cost body shops.. the high quality clears that lasts much longer are the most expensive, while many shops use low cost clear to reduce expenses and to profit..
I always wonder why you have so little subscriptions and views. Your channel is absolutely amazing, this video is another great example of that. Keep up the good work, cheers!
I appreciate these new paints because I remember the early 1970s. Cars would begin to rust out after 3 years, destroying any notion of long term ownership.
While the quatily of the color itself and possibility of mixing millions of tones has advanced and rust protection is far better, I wouldnt agree that the paints are better now. I have seen paint being damaged just after 3-4 yrs on new VW to the point that it has to be repainted while my old VW from 1989 still has the original paint and no stone chips on the hood or fenders. It is also twice the thickness of the new paint and can be polished a lot easier. Cost saving has gone mental on the paintjobs and it is not just on "cheap" cars, BMW suffers from the same issue. If I could chose, old acryl paint that MB used during 80s and 90s is by far the best paint for the car imho
I recall when the new paint factory owner ended up taking night school classes in the early 1980s of paint manufacturing and theory . It was all going good till somebody found out he owned zolatone, national paint and paramount paint and lacquer companies..
Excellent information! Re 'over 40,000 color and texture variations' ... no doubt that is true, but I have become very aware that the majority of cars these days are black, white or silver. Sometimes, there are strings of white cars seen on the road. Use of color in cars has dramatically decreased. I can speculate as to the reasons for that, but it is a great shame in any case. Long gone are the days when you could buy cars in a wide range of lurid colors, with two tone vinyl roof combos etc!
The main reason is there just isn't much demand. That's why most of the colors are pretty neutral because most people like those colors and they can sell them easier. I mean you even see it a lot with even with companies like Porsche and Lamborghini that have some really cool and unique colors yet no one ever options them on their vehicles. Instead they choose grey, white or black.
This is major -- so major that it got a major entry in Alfred Sloan's classic, "My Years With General Motors." He changed the paint on all their stuff cutting the dead inventory, cars sitting there waiting for the paint to dry, by -- I forget, it's years ago -- two weeks.
10/2024: Good Day. Excellent. I have watched a few videos on painting of new cars. So far, until yours, they are all the same. Great video but no explanation of the process. This video is very interesting, detailed and educational. I have subscribed. Thank You & Best Regards.
You can still paint a car with a roller, single stage and it will last longer then the factory finish. Probably cause it’s thick! I’ve done it. Wish I would have done it sooner.
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Awesome. IMO this represents the best species of educational TH-cam video: something completely quotidian, viewed through a completely unexpected perspective that elevates it to another level of interest. I would never have viewed paint as a form of technology, but it totally is!
My man just dropped the word quotidian on us like it was nothing.
quo·tid·i·an
kwōˈtidēən
adjective
ordinary or everyday, especially when mundane.
Quotidian is the least quotidian of English words.
It’s the main way to say “daily” in French, I didn’t realize the word existed in English
Really enjoy your videos dude. You choose unique topics and research them on master level. The footage you use is the best part- I dont know where you find all the clips. Then you deliver the fruits of your research in the way a true master of that topic would - easy to follow with a great structure that keeps focus. Truely well done, so few gets this right. Lastly- I've started to notice big channels on youtube copies topics off one another, many of them, not you sir- your topics are fresh!
And let's not forget that he is just SO good at pacing! Fast enough to keep you interested, but never so fast it feels rushed. And the chosen small pauses always comes at the "ah, ok!" moments.
I don't think they're copying each other, people just have similar interests.
@@nahometesfay1112 Agreed. But some channels do follow after trends and hypes for views.
@@gtbkts What I think is most important Is that the videos provide something of value like a unique perspective or greater depth. It's natural for people to make videos about big events or trendy topics. It only becomes a problem when they have nothing worthwhile to say (like tech previews before the actual review) or straight hearsay like that chess scandal.
i have worked on cars for some 50 years and now have a collection of old "mopar" muscle cars. after graduating from high school in 1972, i built and ran an auto body shop for three years and then went on to college and law school. i was the main "paint guy" at my body shop. in the 60's and 70's, GM used Acrylic Lacquer and Ford and Chrysler used Acrylic Enamel paint. both these paints were "single step" paints meaning that you just shook the paint vigorously, thinned it (usually 2-1) with a Lacquer or Enamel thinner, and then sprayed the paint on the vehicle. most colors required at least two coats - except black. the "metallic" paints (paint with small metal flecks) had to be applied in a certain way or you would get what was called "tiger stripes" meaning that you could see broad "mismatched" areas where the metal fleck "laydown" was mismatched from one area to another. the thinners for these paints came in three temperatures ranges, fast drying, medium drying, and slow drying. you used fast for cold shop temps and slow for hot shop temps. Lacquer was the easiest to use as if you made any mistakes like a dry spot, a "run in the paint", or the pesky fly that hit a panel, you could wait an hour and the paint was dry and hard enough to sand down and completely refinish. Acrylic Enamel was a different story. that paint was a little thicker in viscosity (as it had more clear acrylic in it) and you usually had to wait 24 or even 48 hours to sand and refinish Enamel. it was also easy to "blend in" small repairs or "partial panel painting" with these paints. there was little difference in appearance between these two paints, however, a skilled bodyman or painter could tell the difference between Lacquer and Enamel vehicle paint. i closed my body shop in 1974 to go to college. when i retired from my law practice in 2016, i started my car collection. i have found that the "water based paints" are AWFUL and CANNOT be used by a private person in their house garage. you MUST have a professional, commercial "paint booth" to spray the water based paints as they need constant air flow and "heat" to cure properly. the "base coat, clear coat" paints can be sprayed by a "do it yourself" private car restorer. i restored and painted one of my 1968 Plymouth Barracuda's using Acrylic Lacquer that I was able to get "custom mixed" and painted that car in the garage of my house. it came out very nice and looks just like the paint that would have been on the car when it was new in 1968. one thing about painting "old cars" - if you are a "purist" and want your car to "look like it did when it was new", you have to find a shop that can spray the old single step Lacquer or Enamel. ALL the new paints, water, base-coat/clear-coat, "Emron" type paint using an additive or "hardening agent" - all those paints have a MUCH higher gloss than paints had 55 years ago. only a few "luxury" cars "back then" had REALLY glossy paint jobs - like the Cadillac's and Lincoln Continental's. there were no Chevy's or Fords or Plymouths or Dodges or Pontiacs or Buicks or Oldsmobile's that looked like the cars do today. like so many things in this world now, EVERYTHING is much more complicated - AND EXPENSIVE!! when i contacted PPG (a major car paint company) to get a gallon of Acrylic Enamel to paint my 68 Barracuda with original paint (yes, PPG still manufactures some old OEM paint products), they said, "Yes, we have that paint, it is $1000 a gallon." i ended up painting the Barracuda with "Lacquer" at $327.00 a gallon. it is not unusual for a simple, modern repaint of a car costing $10,000 today. when i ran my body shop in 1973, we charged on average, $150.00 for a complete repaint. there was a guy named "Earl Schieb" who had a series of "franchised" body shops around the country who advertised "A new paint job for $29.99!"
You still can't beat a single stage acrylic enamel for durability, and longevity.
@@never2late454 Dupont used to make a basic auto enamel paint called "Dulex." you could paint a concrete block with it and see your face in the shine. it was so thick it was almost like today's "powder coat" paint.
@@jimharvard Dulux was a great finish, but if I'm remembering correctly it took forever to cure. But a properly laid down acrylic enamel will last a lifetime if taken care of. I have a 1970 Mustang with the original paint that still shows a reflection.
@@never2late454 i used both acrylic lacquer and enamel in my body shop in 1973. you could get fast, medium and slow thinner for both paints. acrylic enamel could be shot pretty easily using the "fast" thinner, however, if the shop was very hot and you had to use the "slow" thinner with enamel, it would run if you didn't put the first couple of coats on very thin. you had to let enamel "tach up" for about 10 minutes before you could spray more to cover primer patches or to add color. i never had a paint booth in my shop and had to rely upon the different thinners and my own skill to get nice paint jobs done. i'm guessing that using the new paints in a modern paint booth is a lot easier than in the old days when you just "sprayed water on the floor" to keep down dust, mixed the paint in a Develbis or Binks "suction" (cup on the bottom) paint gun and get to spraying.
@@jimharvard Mack Truck used to sell this two part Kirker through their parts department back in the 80's. "Mack Standard Red" was my go to paint for pretty much everything, trucks, trailers, forklifts, even my girlfriend's car lol. 30 bucks a gallon including the activator for red, Other colors were cheaper. It worked pretty good and it held up well. Now I look at automotive paint prices and about have a stroke. I used to be able to paint a truck tractor for about 200 bucks in materials, and maybe 250 for a ten wheel dump. Boy I miss the old days
As an automobile historian, I really appreciated this video: well researched and tackling an often overlooked topic. Well done 👍
At 11:30. As far as I'm aware wet-on-wet doesn't usually refer to clear over base. It refers to spraying base over a smoothly applied primer or sealer that is not sanded or fully cured. It can save time but obviously the underlying surface needs to be well prepared and perfectly flat in advance. Technically the application of the clear over the base coat is the same technique but that terminology isn't used because that's the only way to do it.
It can refer to either. Typically there is not a full bake between base coat and clear coat.
@@mightychicken93 It doesn't need to be baked to fully cure. Modern automotive paint cures in under 2 hours due to the catalyst.
At Volvo trucks here in Dublin Virginia the process is Dupont brand base coat sprayed by robots. Then 1 or 2 minutes later the clear is sprayed. It is considered wet on wet. Then it gets baked by ovens for two hours.
@@LBCAndrewComplete curing of eurethane, where the cross linking of molecules has taken place, takes about 30 days. Baking speeds initial dry time, but cross linking is still occurring after initial drying. Drying is through the evaporation process, where curing (cross linking process) is a chemical reaction.
Ah here's another expert 😅
As a COF.....Certified Old Farte.....I remember when GM used lacquer, Ford used enamel, and all red pigments faded faster than light at sunset.
Late 80's I had a roommate that was a master painter and then went on to be a salesman for an auto paint company. We had many a conversation about paints, myself having done some basic painting.
With the base coat urethane topcoat system, we've hit auto paint Nirvana.
Been painting cars for 8 years.. what a cool video! I have sprayed both modern water based and solvent based paints. In my experience water paints provide a better user experience, but solvent paints generally provide a more durable product that can be more reliable and less finicky in the long run. With a good painter using the correct products, it can outshine waterborne as well. I spray a hybrid of the Axalta Cromax system.. Standox base coat which is ok, but with their 7900s series clear coat, it is absolutely phenomenal. The clear really makes the product.
I don’t think you have the timelines of the paint development quite right..l was a automotive spray painter from the early seventies and we went from duco (nitrocellulose) to dulon (acrylic lacquer ) during that decade..two pack appeared in the form of Acran in the eighties which was highly toxic and killed many painters because the dangers of isocyonates were not realised as it had up to 5% cyanide in it .. decent two packs came here in the mid nineties and the requirements were a specific type of spray booth and full masks with outside independent properly filtered air supply.The development of of the two packs may have been earlier but were not in use ,at least not in Australia and New Zealand until the timeline l mentioned..
In the US, Dupont's Imron was the first widely used "2k" isocyanate bearing paint, and was on the market in the '70s. I strongly suspect the manufacturers were aware of the toxicity of the isocyanates, but they labeled the products with the exact same warnings as were on their acrylic lacquers. There was at one point a class action lawsuit brought against Dupont over this, but I don't know the outcome of the suit.
Remember, Australia is a decade behind the rest of the world
Let the lad be. Let’s stop criticizing each other and applaud his efforts for trying
We had 2pack in the UK in the early 80s, although "celly" was the norm.
The first 2pack laquer I used was from Metalflake and gave a superb finish, but was very expensive to use.
In the early eighties when working as a spray painter for a shop fitting and signage company (New Zealand ) ' I used Acran on something ' It was a new product ' I wore a respirator ' but I think I must have got some hardener on my skin ' one of my feet swelled up to about 3 times normal size ' and the skin on that leg went funny with a lumpy texture ' it all went back to normal in a few day's . I normally sprayed Duco at that time .
Great video… I have a suggestion for a part 2 companion video.
You could cover the color pigment process… the search for rare materials, why some colors take years to perfect and why said colors are expensive up-charges.
It’s an aspect of the industry that flys under the radar.
Never thought I'd be interested in something like this, yet here I am. Watching the history of automotive paint
Detroit Agate, Motor City Agate, or Fordite, is a type of “stone” made from automotive paint that accumulated on factory equipment over the years. It has many layers/bands of wildly-varied color. People sometimes shape it into jewelry.
Simply put, This is the best video on Automotive coatings, that exists on TH-cam.
Kudos on a stellar production !!!!
Very interesting. So much engineering goes into things that seem so simple.
acrylic laquer and polyurethane will always be the best coating that I worked with acrylic laquer for custom painting and polyurethane for bependablety
Great video I did a lot of painting in the early '70's and '80's lot's of artwork with acrylic laquer...and even with Imron polyurethane's I seen some cars and vans painted 10+ years ago and they looked like they were done yesterday that paint could take a lot of stones bouncing off them and still look like new . .
I was hoping to hear more about Imron paint - when it's applied correctly it's bullet proof. Had a 1976 Datsun 280z with Imron paint. This was in 1989 and it still had the original paint job in Upstate NY. I did end up painting it again with the original Imron color and that probably is still good - miss that car - but man that was some expensive paint
Bependablety?
Is that dependability?
I assure you, no trolling here.
Just wanted to confirm your chosen words.
I feel like the context pulls me towards dependability, but I am no pro painter. There could just as easily be a term I am not familiar with.
That said, i always prefer acrylic laquers due to the intense pretty. I am usually rattle canning something in a uncontrolled garage though, so my idea of pretty is defnitely "paint it black, hit the track" over "watch the orange peel, make sure it flashes off properly...."
Regardless of your views on the environmental impact of modern industries, you have to give props to the engineers and scientists for solving so many problems with so many constraints.
What a great video! As a coating and corrosion engineer the history was fascinating.
I had a thought about how remarkable automotive paint was just a day or so ago on a drive, what a happy coincidence this is! Excellent video as always.
🤫 Not coincidence...Google even reads your internal thoughts..... 🤣🤔...you never know...
This is the best presentation of automotive coating concepts that I have seen. Good work.
Good grief that was a bloody tour de force explainer. I'm exhausted just contemplating all the work and research that surely went into this 🥵 Utmost respect and appreciation 🙏 🏆
Somebody show this to Mazda and Alfa.
Especially the "rust-preventing-layer" bit.
Honda too. They're horrible with paint longevity
@@michaelwallace9291 Really? Even today? I drive Toyota, so rust is something I've only heard people talking about 😉
Yeah he left out the part where they engineered obsolescence into it.
Guessing it was that part about the changes due to EPA
@@SolarWebsite personal experience on a 2014 Civic. Horrible paint. Only lasted 2 years before hood and roof were mostly gone. Honda repainted for free under recall but though I requested the whole car be done because the sides were going too the declined stating that painted was faded enough yet to qualify. So a year later went back for sides when they were gone but nope, my VIN had already been repainted and they won't paint the same VIN twice so fuck me.
But of course that's 8-9 year old car. Maybe their paints better now? Ive seen plenty of other Hondas with totally faded paint too but can't speak to them personally
All auto paint will fail if not protected with a wax or sealant. It gets worse every model year, the manufacturers find a way to thin the clear coat to save money (the paint job is the most expensive part of a car). Fortunately, modern spray sealants have replaced traditional wax, they last longer and are as easy to apply as spraying a light mist on the surface and wiping it off. The newer your car, the more important you protect the paint.
Would have been cool to hear more about what car brands used which paints thru the years. But I’m sure that would have been hard to do comprehensive research on. But now I have the tools to figure it out myself. Nice vid
It always makes my day a little better when I get a notification that you have a new video out. You cover the most interesting subjects.
Orange peel finish is still available on brand new BMW cars in the UK.
So many educational/informational channels seem heavily geared towards kids so I really appreciate you assume the viewer here is able to understand things without pedantic explanations
The best video I've seen in recent years about automotive refinishing. Thank you.
Answers about a hundred questions I have had about the paint process of the Individual BMW M4 I just ordered. Thanks for posting!!!
Thank you for the time and energy you invested in the research of this topic. Good job!
As a home hobbyist, I painted a few cars with acrylic enamel and a suction gun. I've never tried a basecoat/clearcoat system. I'm too old to paint a car today or I really mean to learn how to use the new stuff. In the past, I always wanted to. I'd like to restore another old car like oh say something small, a Ford Falcon maybe
I know I say what others already said, but damn man, your content is so rich in information and details as well as very easy to digest [English isn't my native language and I have zero problems following the script]! I am so thankful that you put out these videos, each one is a little gem that shines brightly throughout the platform. The topics that you choose aren't even what I would look for, but I am being sucked into the topic, whatever it may be, and I find it VERY interesting after you explain it. Thank you!
As a master collision repair technician I love this video
I thoroughly enjoyed literally watching paint dry.
For those of you owning electric guitars, look at its painting. It seems casual but its technology piggybacked a lot on the automotive paint industry.
Yep, this is also why modern guitars dont really degrade like the classic electrics from the 60s
My car and my Ibanez actually have the same dark blue color, something between oxford and Prussian blue
Clear coats are all well and good, but after a few years they peel off and the surface has to be repainted whilst the older coatings could be rubbed down and rejuvenated. So much for all the fancy technology.
This was a great trip down the paint memory lane!
Bro, your videos are always SPOT on. So crisp and clean and clearly laid out. The details are beautifully stated and easily understood. Thanks homie
I remember an autobody shop friend of mine, complaining about the dangers of working with isocyanates, especially breathing them in.
That's because isocyanate, is lead.
Isocyanates are also used in making polyurethane foams.
@@seanwalsh999 It's not: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isocyanate
@@matthewsellers82 I stand corrected, I guess they took the lead out of paint and put in isocyanate, still nasty stuff. Thank you for the correction.
@@seanwalsh999 it's cyanide mate.
0:45 _"They're also highly abrasion and impact resistant."_
I don't mean to be difficult, but uhh.....no. If there's one thing automotive paint has *_not_* become over the decades it's abrasion resistant---at least not _'usefully'_ abrasion resistant.
I've often wondered how, with all the 'advances' in car paint over the years, *you still have to treat it so delicately in order not to get 'swirls' or other micro scratches* (which, to those who know cars, are totally obvious and not at all subtle). You can't even avoid these scratches by 'doing everything right'---like using lots of water; using only the softest washing cloths; chamoising carefully...etcetera.
No matter what, you'll STILL get abrasions all over the paint, and they'll only be fixed by occasionally polishing with mild abrasives, only to start getting scratched all over again with your very next wash.
My father owned a paint and body shop going back to around 1960. Back then they typically used "acrylic enamel" which took a long time to dry and had to be put on at the correct thickness so it would self level to some extent. It took a long time to harden and could not be sanded and machine polished. They also used "lacquer" which dried fast but left a rough finish with no shine, so it was always sanded and polished after application. In the 1970s they were using the systems that had clearcoat but the clearcoat would not age well, it would yellow and crack. The changes to paint systems in the 1980s lead to paints that did not weather well. In my opinion paint systems used in recent years, maybe still being used, do not have the durability of the systems used over 50 years ago.
As a car guy who works in a body shop, this video was very informative
Wonderfully explained, every bit of it has entered high tech and result of continued scientific and technical efforts. Very informative. Thanks.
I'm watching paint dry.. You got me @New Mind.
Good video
8 minutes in and I'm fascinated. Nice work! Super informative, good concise flow, and educational beyond the current system. Excellent!
Great video. And THANK YOU for using a real human to narrate!
Such an underrated video but with superb content, this video should gain more viewers
That was good. Excellent narration at a level we can understand.
I'm loving the content! Especially the videos regarding automotive. Keep them coming, I subscribed!
Very informative, thanks for sharing 👍
Can't beat PPG/Ditzler Delstar catalyzed acrylic enamel. Lay it down, no color sanding or buffing needed. Incredible gloss.
0:29 the primary use is a protective coating because steel would rust without it.
All the detailers cringing at the excessive orange peel toward the end of the vid and at 11:31 😂
Toyota should have reviewed your video specifically rust treatment. Great video.
Auto Paints don't last in environments like the American Southwest on their own. I'll dare say, they are massively inferior to older manual intensive processes. The new process needs refinement to fight oxidation of large hoods and roofs. Toyota paint systems are notoriously quick failure systems out here. Usually less than 5 years in worst conditions.
Toyota paint, especially their blacks are notorious for oxidation due to not using a clear coat system. I literally just spent close to 10 hours turning my fathers 1999 4Runner's black paint that was chalky gray back to a brilliant deep gloss black finish. Two of his neighbors thought he had got it repainted it was such a huge difference.
As for the southwest, i'm in southern california and my 2010 Audi has been parked on the street since i bought it new and i have zero issues with clearcoat or paint oxidation or failure. And i have been horrible at paint maintenance at least for five of those years. Perhaps its because Audi uses Glasurit paint made by BASF.
Great video man. Very detailed and even when technically speaking, everyone can understand it.
And the poor guy at the collision shop with just a $1000 spray gun that has to match the finish that trillion dollar automated robots produce gets no respect
So this video is about the history of watching paint dry?
Good video nonetheless!
9:22 “In the 1960’s Ford Motor Company …….” Picture is a 1970’s British Leyland MGB GT shell.
He's talking about nitrocellulose and shows a clip of and HVLP gun soooo.....basically is reading something showing clipart.
Such a great video! So information packed but so clear.
4:15 I know its a small point to make but its not "melting" the top layer dissolving into the solvent, which then evaporates, allowing a homogenous mixture of layers to occur without a boundary. Melting would imply a change in heat or pressure which isnt happening here
good film, nicely illustrated
Marvellous video! 👍👍
US EPA also regulates automotive repair coatings fir hydrocarbon emissions. As you note, any painting/coating application is only as good as the surface prep.
Recently saw a video that said automotive coatings found uses in other industries. Fender Musical Instrument Corp® used DuPont® products on the wood bodies of its famous Stratocaster® and other models for many years. Many colors are known by their GM color codes. The challenge for restoration of vintage guitars and automobiles is finding a color match today.
Today guitars use polyurethane or other more recent coatings or are coated overseas if one must have nitrocellulose lacquer with all its aging issues.
I'll hire you next time I need my car painted.
I'm about to buy my new car so I clicked fast. Thanks for covering this. I'll see how my car's paint holds up over time. 😁
Good luck
Just make sure it's not in a shade of gray!
@@TheLaXandro Yeah I'm looking at either white, blue, or red.
@@TheLaXandro why ? What happens to grey ?
Lots to take in on a short video. Very informative
Watching Paint dry is more interesting as expected😂
I can't say how much I appreciate your videos. The research you put into and reassuring tone is mesmerising.
Please release videos a bit more frequent, just my suggestion though
Old paint chemist's joke: What's the difference between paint and a coating? About a hundred bucks a gallon.
Yep did this 45 yrs, And when clear coat was first introduced, it was only a year later that Porsche first used it, then it began pealing off, much like the low quality clears that are being used now in low cost body shops.. the high quality clears that lasts much longer are the most expensive, while many shops use low cost clear to reduce expenses and to profit..
Always look forward to your videos! Great content
Your videos are fantastic. I see your channel growing so much.
im ready for some top quality content. ooh yeah! i hope lexus structural blue gets a mention
Excellent video, thank you for sharing.
At last a source that is not a mess. Liked this video. I missed mentioning the termoplastic and the termosetting paints though.
No jest. One of the most interesting vids I've ever seen. 👍💯
Good video.... very informative.....keep up the good work
Thanks,i've been looking for this kind of info for awhile!
What a fantastic choice of topic for a video!
It's so good that I'm going to use your coupon code if I ever sign up for Brilliant.
The stock footage used is hilarious!
I always wonder why you have so little subscriptions and views. Your channel is absolutely amazing, this video is another great example of that. Keep up the good work, cheers!
In my personal experience baked enamel is the best, if I find something with original enamel paint on it I will do whatever I can to preserve it.
Me, too.
I appreciate these new paints because I remember the early 1970s. Cars would begin to rust out after 3 years, destroying any notion of long term ownership.
While the quatily of the color itself and possibility of mixing millions of tones has advanced and rust protection is far better, I wouldnt agree that the paints are better now. I have seen paint being damaged just after 3-4 yrs on new VW to the point that it has to be repainted while my old VW from 1989 still has the original paint and no stone chips on the hood or fenders. It is also twice the thickness of the new paint and can be polished a lot easier. Cost saving has gone mental on the paintjobs and it is not just on "cheap" cars, BMW suffers from the same issue.
If I could chose, old acryl paint that MB used during 80s and 90s is by far the best paint for the car imho
It's not just cost saving it's environmental pressures as well usage is highly regulated.
Nice job! Thanks for the share.
I've painted a number of cars with acrylic enamel and a suction gun. I've never tried a basecoat-clearcoat system.
I recall when the new paint factory owner ended up taking night school classes in the early 1980s of paint manufacturing and theory . It was all going good till somebody found out he owned zolatone, national paint and paramount paint and lacquer companies..
I do Fiberglass and Gelcoat repair on boats, I’d love a video on Gelcoat products.
Gelcoat is all around you!
Henry Ford said, "You can have your Ford any color you'd like, as long as it's black"
Thank you!
Excellent information!
Re 'over 40,000 color and texture variations' ... no doubt that is true, but I have become very aware that the majority of cars these days are black, white or silver. Sometimes, there are strings of white cars seen on the road. Use of color in cars has dramatically decreased. I can speculate as to the reasons for that, but it is a great shame in any case. Long gone are the days when you could buy cars in a wide range of lurid colors, with two tone vinyl roof combos etc!
The main reason is there just isn't much demand. That's why most of the colors are pretty neutral because most people like those colors and they can sell them easier. I mean you even see it a lot with even with companies like Porsche and Lamborghini that have some really cool and unique colors yet no one ever options them on their vehicles. Instead they choose grey, white or black.
It's also why unique and special colors cost more because they usually don't keep a large supply on hand because of the lack of demand
This is major -- so major that it got a major entry in Alfred Sloan's classic, "My Years With General Motors." He changed the paint on all their stuff cutting the dead inventory, cars sitting there waiting for the paint to dry, by -- I forget, it's years ago -- two weeks.
10/2024: Good Day. Excellent. I have watched a few videos on painting of new cars. So far, until yours, they are all the same. Great video but no explanation of the process. This video is very interesting, detailed and educational. I have subscribed. Thank You & Best Regards.
You can still paint a car with a roller, single stage and it will last longer then the factory finish. Probably cause it’s thick! I’ve done it. Wish I would have done it sooner.
Thank you
Can you research onto tank tracks and how it influenced construction vehicles
Im amazed they still use paint on new cars. I expect something much more durable and hi-tech by now.
Fascinating. How do they get plastic parts like bumpers to match coated metal so well?
Same paint.
By painting them with the same paint. They don't need to be applied to only metal to get the same finish
i thought it was just another paint, what an amazing story to tell
Thanks again!
Excellent, outstanding video👏👏👏
Thank you so much🙏🤜🤛🙌
I like the paint color on the DMC DeLorean. Best automotive paint.