Interesting video mate, its great that you have pointed out this issue with front axle weights as not many people are aware. Certainly concerning to see that you have Ford are recommending a Bar that would put you over front Axle limits (not even considering the lights, winch, recovery points, bash plates etc. that many will add) and also that the 4WD shop has no idea that they are technically making vehicles unroadworthy.
I don’t get the obsession with bull bars. I’ve been travelling Australia for 40 years and never had an incident where a bull bar helped. In the early days my 4x4s were purchased used and all came with a bull bar already fitted, but once I could afford to buy new cars I’ve had no bar. I currently have a 2020 Land Cruiser Sahara, a reasonably expensive vehicle and it doesn’t have a bull bar. To me, most look bad to hideous and certainly do nothing to enhance the look of the vehicle. My friends ask “but what if I hit something”, that’s what insurance is for. “Oh, but a bull bar might make the difference between being able to keep going or being stranded.” Really? That’s a pretty slim scenario. Come to think of it, I don’t think any of my friends have had an incident where a bull bar has made a difference. If I lived out in the bush and traveled a lot at night then I would consider one, but I live in the city and when I’m travelling I avoid driving at high risk of animal strike times. Living in the city I’m more likely to hit a pedestrian and god forbid I hit a person with a Land Cruiser, let alone a Land Cruiser with a bull bar. Modern vehicles are continually getting better at avoiding hitting pedestrians and large animals, (I don’t think they will ever detect a Wombat though) and bull bars can interfere with these devices. That’s my rant, safe travels to everyone, bull bar or not.
We are also in the process of purchasing a new tow vehicle when getting a quote at our local Ford dealer for a Wildtrak we were told that when fitting an ARB bullbar (summit Sahara bar) they would have to remove a large metal bar at the front before adding the bull bar and so the nett additional weight would only be around 20kg. Has this ever been mentioned to you either by Ford or ARB, it may be a question to ask. We would certainly like this confirmed as well. Your video was very educational, thank you.
Thanks for watching and your comment! On the ARB site they say that the approximate weight of the Summit II bar, chassis mounts and fitting kit is 79kg. Approximately 17kg is removed from the vehicle for fitment of the bar - so net is 62kg on paper. Clearly the bar can be used if you have a GVM upgrade such as the second stage Lovells which adds 150kg. It also costs $6k. Both Ford and ARB could be clearer on that point.
Great information. I just got a 2024 Ford Ranger platinum v6 with ARB summit bullbar with recovery points, ARB under protection panels, ARB 140lt tank, and clear vision tow mirrors. I wondering if my GVM is something to look into.
I noticed he was measuring the tow ball height while the van was sitting on the scales did he reduce the measurement taking in the height of the scales that the wheels were sitting on?
If you get a suspension lift upgrade, they upgrade the front axle weight. Pretty sure it was 150kg. I had mine done and got a certificate with it. Not that I know everything about it. It is the arb summit II on a 2024.5 Wildtrak
Yes, Wildtrak 24.5 and Summit II (was the plan). That is correct the Lovells 7t GCM upgrade has that increase and costs about $6k - it would be fair for Ford and ARB to be clear on that point.
I would ask the question… do I really need a bar. We have the Everest and I have no intention on fitting one…. 99% of our driving is during the day and in our travels parked by about 3pm After having bars fitted to previous cars I feel I’ll save the money for other things
An excellent question! we have thought about this and have already decided that for our travels in Tasmania a bull bar is not necessary. However, later we intend to travel in Western Australia and South Australia and we are looking at more remote travel. A family member who recently did the Oodnadatta Track and the Strzelecki Track noted emus on the road and had some near misses.
@ I’ve done the oonadatta track recently also and i live in WA… done the Gibb River road … well many places in WA & the eastern states…. So after all this travelling… it’s a no from me… we are soon to retire to do further travelling.. here & abroad.
Yes all 3 tanks full, 240 litres. We also had more water to simulate food and clothes. The van was not really our worry as weighed before. It as really how things changed by subbing a Pajero for a Ranger.
@@TravellingLP i was interested because I have an Outback 19.6.2 and when I got it I had to ditch the front generator/tool box as it was overweight on the ball. In have a Ford Everest but am not happy with the way the van tows. Your experience with the weight at the back and over the drawbar is very interesting as I have added a lightweight box on the back bumper but it holds a baby Weber that is failry heavy.
@@rossdavey428 We looked at a 19.61-2 that had a large toolbox on the front, but the ball was already close to 350kg without any of our stuff, so we passed that one. At the time we were towing with a Pajero NX that would have been way overweight. Really recommend going to a competent weigher for advice.
@@TravellingLP I did, after I took the heavy toolbox off and weights were good (but I dont recall him measuring the difference between front and back van wheels). I then put the rear plastic toolbox on and have not had a chance to re weigh the van. I think the baby Q Weber might be too much weight on the back.
Understand that, but this is the problem when all things are not considered properly. Axle weight should be taken from the hub, wheel and tyres should be legally rated to take the axle load. Doing it this current way is revenue raising when defect notices start being handed out.
@@Undies79 You are absolutely technically correct. BUT whether this was ever a consideration I am not aware of but in the road transport sector where it would have been argued if anywhere it is taken as the load measured under the tyres. The European trucks have always struggled with front axle weights and the weight of the tyres/wheels would have been a welcome adjustment for them, but it is NOT taken into account. So the reality is that it is measured under the tyres, whether technically correct or not.
@@ianloy1854 Technicalities will save you in a court of law, if they ever tried to blame it on an accident happening. Engineers of the accessories and Manufacturers of the vehicles should be pushing back on this. Atleast 70-80kg of weight that should not be counted on the axle load.
It does indeed! especially since Ford recommend the ARB Summit II bar. It means you also need the $6k GVM upgrade which increases the front axle capacity sufficiently. I think it is a bit misleading by the manufacturer.
Interesting video mate, its great that you have pointed out this issue with front axle weights as not many people are aware. Certainly concerning to see that you have Ford are recommending a Bar that would put you over front Axle limits (not even considering the lights, winch, recovery points, bash plates etc. that many will add) and also that the 4WD shop has no idea that they are technically making vehicles unroadworthy.
Thanks for watching. Yes concerning indeed. We'll need to consider the GVM upgrade if we want a steel bullbar.
Great video. Thanks for your time team
Thanks Michael - you're the expert here and your advice was absolutely invaluable. Now we just have to figure out what to do :-)
I don’t get the obsession with bull bars. I’ve been travelling Australia for 40 years and never had an incident where a bull bar helped. In the early days my 4x4s were purchased used and all came with a bull bar already fitted, but once I could afford to buy new cars I’ve had no bar. I currently have a 2020 Land Cruiser Sahara, a reasonably expensive vehicle and it doesn’t have a bull bar.
To me, most look bad to hideous and certainly do nothing to enhance the look of the vehicle. My friends ask “but what if I hit something”, that’s what insurance is for. “Oh, but a bull bar might make the difference between being able to keep going or being stranded.” Really? That’s a pretty slim scenario. Come to think of it, I don’t think any of my friends have had an incident where a bull bar has made a difference. If I lived out in the bush and traveled a lot at night then I would consider one, but I live in the city and when I’m travelling I avoid driving at high risk of animal strike times. Living in the city I’m more likely to hit a pedestrian and god forbid I hit a person with a Land Cruiser, let alone a Land Cruiser with a bull bar. Modern vehicles are continually getting better at avoiding hitting pedestrians and large animals, (I don’t think they will ever detect a Wombat though) and bull bars can interfere with these devices. That’s my rant, safe travels to everyone, bull bar or not.
Outstanding Weighter there, man knows his shit!
We are also in the process of purchasing a new tow vehicle when getting a quote at our local Ford dealer for a Wildtrak we were told that when fitting an ARB bullbar (summit Sahara bar) they would have to remove a large metal bar at the front before adding the bull bar and so the nett additional weight would only be around 20kg. Has this ever been mentioned to you either by Ford or ARB, it may be a question to ask. We would certainly like this confirmed as well. Your video was very educational, thank you.
Thanks for watching and your comment! On the ARB site they say that the approximate weight of the Summit II bar, chassis mounts and fitting kit is 79kg. Approximately 17kg is removed from the vehicle for fitment of the bar - so net is 62kg on paper. Clearly the bar can be used if you have a GVM upgrade such as the second stage Lovells which adds 150kg. It also costs $6k. Both Ford and ARB could be clearer on that point.
Great information thank you
Great information. I just got a 2024 Ford Ranger platinum v6 with ARB summit bullbar with recovery points, ARB under protection panels, ARB 140lt tank, and clear vision tow mirrors. I wondering if my GVM is something to look into.
Great you enjoyed it. A professional weighing session is very informative and educational - would recommend it.
I noticed he was measuring the tow ball height while the van was sitting on the scales did he reduce the measurement taking in the height of the scales that the wheels were sitting on?
I also pointed that out and Michael indicated he was compensating for that.
If you get a suspension lift upgrade, they upgrade the front axle weight. Pretty sure it was 150kg. I had mine done and got a certificate with it. Not that I know everything about it. It is the arb summit II on a 2024.5 Wildtrak
Yes, Wildtrak 24.5 and Summit II (was the plan). That is correct the Lovells 7t GCM upgrade has that increase and costs about $6k - it would be fair for Ford and ARB to be clear on that point.
I would ask the question… do I really need a bar.
We have the Everest and I have no intention on fitting one…. 99% of our driving is during the day and in our travels parked by about 3pm
After having bars fitted to previous cars I feel I’ll save the money for other things
An excellent question! we have thought about this and have already decided that for our travels in Tasmania a bull bar is not necessary. However, later we intend to travel in Western Australia and South Australia and we are looking at more remote travel. A family member who recently did the Oodnadatta Track and the Strzelecki Track noted emus on the road and had some near misses.
@ I’ve done the oonadatta track recently also and i live in WA… done the Gibb River road … well many places in WA & the eastern states…. So after all this travelling… it’s a no from me… we are soon to retire to do further travelling.. here & abroad.
Did you have water in the van tanks?
Yes all 3 tanks full, 240 litres. We also had more water to simulate food and clothes. The van was not really our worry as weighed before. It as really how things changed by subbing a Pajero for a Ranger.
@@TravellingLP i was interested because I have an Outback 19.6.2 and when I got it I had to ditch the front generator/tool box as it was overweight on the ball. In have a Ford Everest but am not happy with the way the van tows. Your experience with the weight at the back and over the drawbar is very interesting as I have added a lightweight box on the back bumper but it holds a baby Weber that is failry heavy.
@@rossdavey428 We looked at a 19.61-2 that had a large toolbox on the front, but the ball was already close to 350kg without any of our stuff, so we passed that one. At the time we were towing with a Pajero NX that would have been way overweight. Really recommend going to a competent weigher for advice.
@@TravellingLP I did, after I took the heavy toolbox off and weights were good (but I dont recall him measuring the difference between front and back van wheels). I then put the rear plastic toolbox on and have not had a chance to re weigh the van. I think the baby Q Weber might be too much weight on the back.
Really the weight of tyre and wheels should come off the axle weight. That weight is not on the axle, wheels and tyres are holding the weight.
We followed the expert and the way the vehicle is weighed by the authorities, which includes anything on the axle.
Understand that, but this is the problem when all things are not considered properly. Axle weight should be taken from the hub, wheel and tyres should be legally rated to take the axle load. Doing it this current way is revenue raising when defect notices start being handed out.
@@Undies79 You are absolutely technically correct. BUT whether this was ever a consideration I am not aware of but in the road transport sector where it would have been argued if anywhere it is taken as the load measured under the tyres. The European trucks have always struggled with front axle weights and the weight of the tyres/wheels would have been a welcome adjustment for them, but it is NOT taken into account. So the reality is that it is measured under the tyres, whether technically correct or not.
@@ianloy1854 Technicalities will save you in a court of law, if they ever tried to blame it on an accident happening. Engineers of the accessories and Manufacturers of the vehicles should be pushing back on this. Atleast 70-80kg of weight that should not be counted on the axle load.
Oh Lord, 50 years after europe the australians thinks about towing weights .....
Yes, it's very different and Europe has lighter caravans.
So a standard ute can not have a BB . Seems silly
It does indeed! especially since Ford recommend the ARB Summit II bar. It means you also need the $6k GVM upgrade which increases the front axle capacity sufficiently. I think it is a bit misleading by the manufacturer.