Woah! It's like someone took all the videos I've watched about Joseph Smith not practicing polygamy and rolled them together into one anthology. This must have taken quite some time and I can't applaud it more. Thank you.
Thank you for that - that's exactly how this started! The first one I ever saw was Rob Fotheringham's "Brigham or Joseph" video. I wanted to take the "zingers" and compile them, and it snowballed from there!
Oh wow, thanks for the shout out at 1:15:32. Your breakdown of Jacob 2 was excellent and you have made a very compelling case throughout your presentation. You've also brought to the table many observations that I haven't heard of yet like the gospel doctrine manual changing the word "For" to "But" which is very significant. I have also seen language explaining this verse that places the word otherwise at the end such as, "I will command my people otherwise" which also changes the meaning. The biggest problems with this subject are that the amount of information is so vast, the sources vary substantially and regularly contradict one another, and there are so many other important facts are left out. Also, we don't seem to realize that Joseph Smith, who translated the Book of Mormon and knew of that vast amount of content that could have been as much as 1 Nephi to the end of Alma, likely knew a great deal more about this topic from Lehi's record and perhaps others that were lost and would have known clearly better than anyone else that it was an abomination. Another thing to look into is the specific use of the term "wickedness and abominations." It seems that this term is used with Jacob's people and their practice of taking many wives and concubines along with King Noah, and the people of Jerusalem at the time Lehi left and we know they were practicing this as well along with those in ALL the lands of God's people. We see the phrase occurring many more times throughout the Book of Mormon and I've wondered if this unique phrase is perhaps especially tied in some way to the people taking many wives and concubines. Anyway, I'm a little over halfway through but just wanted to share my appreciation for contributing to this topic, you have provided many great resources and presented the information very well.
Thank you, Steve! Michelle pointed out the "For" >> "[But]" thing, and it blew my mind. Also, when I read through the Jacob scriptures during the video, I was going to leave out all the instances of "saith the Lord of Hosts," for brevity, but I believe it was you (correct me if I'm wrong!) who pointed out that that term has significance, so I left it in. Thanks for you contributions!
@@karenhyatt647 yeah that’s right. Impressive work, one if the best, if not the best breakdown of all the major points I’ve seen. There’s just so much information and I like how you provided a transcript and detailed references, well done!
This is absolutely phenomenal! I am so glad I watched your meticulous presentation. I will be recommending it to my family and friends. Thank you for all your inspiration, hard-work, and dedication to truth and righteousness❤
It’s so interesting to me how Joseph always speaks of a loving God and uplifts with his words whereas Brigham always uses fear of destruction. That really stood out.
This is the video I’ve wished existed. Concise, irrefutable, accurate, without a lot of personal opinion or commentary. The logic and evidence speaks volumes.
You missed that the Book of Mormon shows that the Lamanite women abducted by the priests of Noah also defended their husbands when the Lamanites discovered them. It is called stockholm syndrome. It is no surprise polygamist wives were defending their husbands in the practice.
Karen, I already knew this would be great, but I'm absolutely stunned at the clear and logical and persuasive way you organized this video. The LDS polygamy history, with all of its moving parts, motivations, false "laundry list" persuasion techniques ("there are tons of women that we can list who we were married to Joseph, so it must be true!"), etc., etc., etc. make this an extremely daunting task. And yet you blow holes in all of it with ease, and give compelling reasons why we can ACTUALLY BELIEVE Joseph. I'm so impressed. I will be sharing this with friends and family. ❤❤❤
@@AbrahamJohn-j7t Persuasive - to lead people from believing in false traditions. Or are you arguing that our leaders are infallible? Historians work to prop up a false narrative and this is accepted by our leaders. Our leaders need to see the false narrative their historians are giving them, because our leaders are *not* infallible.
@@AbrahamJohn-j7t Trust is built on integrity, not deception. Our leaders do not practice or promote polygamy, so I"m not sure what the problem is. It is always better to account for past mistakes and move forward with real trust. Just add polygamy to Brigham Young's list of other Church-denounced doctrines and we can all move on.
@@AbrahamJohn-j7tyeah Joseph Smith was our founding leader. Why don’t you trust his own words??? Everyone throws him under the bus for less reputable leaders for some insane reason.
God bless you. I developed a hypothesis many years ago that Brigham Young had started polygamy and pinned it on Joseph Smith. I thought I was alone out of over 15 million members. Finally thousands and even tens of thousands are coming to learn truth regarding this. Jesus Christ taught "The truth shall set you free." Your work, with that of so many others, like Pamela and Richard Price, Michelle Stone, Jerry Hoop, and so many others, all contributes to bless those who seek truth. Untruths hurt so many, but the truth will set us all free. So many have suffered and have been persecuted for speaking the truth. The humble followers of Christ will recognize truth, and love all those who need the love of those who honestly seek truth and love their fellow men. This is wonderful overview of what has taken me years to learn. May the truth bring people together in love and understanding.
@@anniecrowther8423 Annie, I apologize - your comment got buried, and I'm sorry I'm only now getting back to you. There are so many parallels between Brigham and King Noah that I now see them in a very similar light. Both were polygamists, of course. King Noah put down the priests that had been in place before him and replaced them with new ones who were prideful and would support him in his abominations. Brigham was awful to many who were loyal to Joseph, including Sidney Rigdon, William Marks, Emma Smith, Lucy Mack, and Joseph's sons. King Noah heavily taxed his people and lazily glutted himself off their labors. Brigham openly said that every time he picked up a hoe, someone would come along and do the work for him - they just wouldn't let him work! He also told his people that he couldn't pay his personal debts until the people paid their tithing, threatening to put them "to the screw" if they didn't. Yikes. King Noah "did cause his people to commit sin." I could never imagine how a leader could "cause" his people to sin. But Brigham repeatedly told his people that polygamy was necessary to their eternal glory and exaltation and shamed those who didn't participate. Check. As far as "keys" and "succession," I look at the example of Alma the elder, who was one of Noah's wicked priests. Not only were the previous priests replaced by Noah (breaking any "chain of authority" as I see it), but I can't imagine it would be necessary for someone as wicked as King Noah to lay hands on Alma in order to confer godly power or authority on him. I just don't believe that God approves of - let alone requires - anything like that from a wicked man in order to impart power. I believe God chose and empowered Alma because of his faith, repentance, and obedience - not because he was in some sort of line of succession. So for me, as far as modern leaders, I listen to them and strive to discern truth from error with the help of the Spirit. As Jesus said in reference to true prophets, "ye shall know them by their fruits." There's a very long answer after a very long wait - apologies!
@@anniecrowther8423 I’ve thought about this question many times. To be as short and to the point as possible, all of the evidence shows that Brigham was a very bad man and took opportunity in literally hijacking the restored church away from Joseph and Hyrum. The deaths of Joseph, Hyrum and Samuel can all be attributed to the secret combinations of Brigham Young. It’s a fact that Brigham Young was about to be dealt with severely by Joseph once he was released from the Carthage jail. Joseph had become aware that there were many dirty members of the quorum of the 12 apostles and he had been made aware of some things they were teaching while in Carthage jail. Joseph told Emma that upon his release, he would square things with the newspaper regarding misinformation that had been printed, then he planned to deal directly with Brigham Young regarding his false teachings of polygamy and spiritual wifery secretly being taught among certain members. When you understand that Joseph and Hyrum were literally murdered by Willard Richards, the nephew of Brigham Young, and John Taylor, the successor of Brigham‘s church after his death, you should be able to see very clearly that these were not godly men, and that they could never have been called by God to be prophetic leaders of his church. The day Joseph and Hyrum were murdered the restored church fell into complete apostasy. Brigham Young started his own church out of the ashes, while trying to disguise it as the same church, Joseph restored. The church that Nephi, Isaiah, Moroni and other prophets, warn us about in these latter-day‘s, the church that would rob the poor, the church that would have leaders with hard hearts, stiff necks, and would be puffed up, the church that would teach false, vain and foolish doctrines, the one that would commit whoredom‘s and priestcrafts, the one that would have large and spacious buildings adorned with the finest materials, is literally the LDS church today. The church is approaching nearly $300 billion in assets yet gives very little to feed the poor or clothe the naked. Instead, it bails out its own insurance company, built a lavish shopping mall and invests in hotels and commercial real estate throughout the world. Even with hundreds of billions of dollars the advice is still given over the pulpit today that “if you are faced with a decision to buy food or to pay tithing, you should always pay your tithing”. It should be obvious to all that the LDS church corporation today is completely off track and apostate, and is absolutely not the same church that Joseph restored to the earth.
Wow, outstanding work! This is an exceptionally well-crafted and concise summation of the polygamy debate, presented in a clear and accessible manner. Your efforts will undoubtedly enlighten many. It’s time for the truth to shine through the fog of misinformation. Well done!
This was probably the most comprehensive, well researched, and just fabulous video I've sen on the subject. I can tell this must've taken a very, very long time to research, compile, and edit this video. Thank you for sharing this! I just want to shout from the rooftops that Joseph Smith was NOT a polygamist!!
Thank you for collecting these records and information! I’ve watched hundreds of videos on this subject and I still really enjoyed this and learned new things
Bravo, Karen! Thank you for your work! I will add this to my resources to give to people who are open to learning an alternative history that is more consistent with an unchanging, loving Heavenly Father and Mother.
Thank you, Karen, for an amazing presentation. It was packed with insight after insight. A great labor of love. As I read the list of contributors at the end, my heart was full of love for each of those great people and the work being done. ❤
Karen, Bravo! Superb. I am sending it to my family and friends. Thank you for all your hard and excellent work. Us "deniers" are gaining momentum. Every nudge toward the church changing its narrative is important. Great stuff!
Superb work, Karen. Probably the most concise coverage of the evidence I've seen to date and included some scriptural insights I hadn't thought of or encountered before. This must have taken untold hours to script and produce. So well done! This video represents the next step in the evolution of the pro-monogamy movement. I think the next step will be something that would be very hard to do on TH-cam. There are so many pieces to this puzzle that it's hard to keep track of what has been covered and what hasn't. A visual representation of every element of the story - scriptures, affidavits, letters, etc. overlaid with a Hemlock Knots-style color coding to reflect latency, proximity, and verbatim verbal\written, like they did with their Quotes page.
Wow Karen! What a great presentation! With the enormous volume of info out there, such a concise presentation seemed to be impossible...but you did it. So amazing, Thank you!
I appreciate that so much, Dale! If you had seen the hundreds of topics written on bits of paper scattered all over the floor as the first step to this thing, you'd never have imagined it would ever come together. It was daunting. I proceeded completely on faith, lol. Thanks for appreciating it!!
Excellent video!! It is like you took many of the historical documents I have been researching for the last 3 1/2 years and put them into one well organized video!! Thank you!! ❤ I pray that this will help more people come to the truth!
Karen this is fantastic! 🎉 And clearly the result of countless hours of hard work. I especially appreciate the individual breakdown of the alleged wives and evidence of marriage to Joseph Smith. Truly a wonderful contribution to this discussion, thank you for making this!
Thank you so much, Gwendolyn!! I soooo wanted to include the Cochranite connection in this but just couldn't, since it leaned just a bit too far into speculation. I was absolutely ELATED when I saw you had gone into it in depth in your video. Some friends who appreciated my video then had questions about how this could have worked its way into the church. Perfect question!! I was so happy to be able to refer them to YOUR video and your excellent and very plausible hypothesis. WOOHOO!!! Thank you!
@@karenhyatt647 When I learned about the Cochranites and Agusta Cobb I couldn't believe I had never learned about them before. I didn't know that there was even another discussion of polygamy before "Joseph's revelation". That solidify it to me, Joseph truly fought polygamy.
I appreciate that so much. Your 'Joseph or Brigham' video was the first thing I ever saw on the subject. I looked up the sources you showed, verified them, and had a paradigm shift - which made scads more sense than what I had been told for so long. Amazing that hardly any of us even know about the original D&C, let alone any of the other important information surrounding this topic. Thank you so, so much for your work and your courage. I'm sure it has come with a price. Thank you, Rob!!!
Rob, I just want to say I am sorry for any price you may have paid for speaking the truth. And even though I already knew for years, from my own research, that Joseph didn't practice polygamy I was very grateful to you for your courage in spreading the truth and bringing others to that knowledge. It was the right thing to do and I know God will bless you for it. Thank you for your contribution to bringing truth to light.
Thank you so much for your work. I hope they come apologizing to you someday. I think it is roulette with leaders. Because of yours and other experience I thought I would be possibly excommunicated when talking to my leaders about my thoughts on Brigham's polygamy. What are you up to? I did see an interview with Hemlock a while back. Thank you again for your videos!
Wow. This video was soooo well done. The presentation couldn’t be better! Full of Grace and Truth. And such beautiful news!! This feels like such an integral part to the continuing restoration we’ve been awaiting!! Thank you for your efforts!!!
So great, thank you! Agnes Coolbrith was Joseph's Brother Don Carlo's wife. Don Carlos died 1842 and Agnes moved to California with their girls. They didn't claim the Mormon religion in California. Her daughter Ina Coolbirth, born Josephine Donna Smith, became a famous poet. Ina wrote to her cousin Joseph F Smith letters telling him that The Book of Mormon taught against polygamy.
That's so cool! There are so many faith-promoting stories from sources that I always figured were not valuable enough to read. I feel very foolish now. I need a rewind button.....!
@@Fefo419 I can't find them. I have gone looking for them again and haven't found them. Michelle Stone just shared letters between Joseph F and Joseph III. The name of the video is 150: What Joseph's Family Really Thought -- About POLYGAMY
Brian Hales is a very dishonest individual. He knows damn well what the truth is...but chooses to continue to paint a FALSE narrative to deceive people both in and out of the church. He has caused so many people to abandon the gospel because of his lies. He will be held accountable!!!!
This is a vast simplification. The only way you can claim things so authoritatively is when you completely ignore evidence. I believe Joseph was involved, however I also know the whole issue is murky. Bran Hales is not dishonest, but a historian that goes 1000 times deeper than you ever will.
@@Telavianyou mean retired anesthesiologist , not historian. His credibility is lost when he completely omits loads of evidence that doesn’t align with his narrative and all of Joseph’s & Hyrum’s mountain of teachings against it.
I just found Michelle Stone through the Cwic media podcast and was so intrigued. Mary Rollins Lightner is my ancestor. I have read her journal entries and was always so confused by the account of the angel and the sword. I wish that would have been included in this video. Where did this story come from? I grew up believing it. I really enjoyed this documentary and it clearly shows that there are way too many question marks to portray the certainty that the church does on Joseph Smith polygamy! Listening to Jennifer Finlayson Fife has also been a huge inspiration to me. She explains how polygamy can not and does not allow true intimacy in marriage, eternal spiritual growth or progression. Paraphrasing her words… If God is who we think, a loving God completely dedicated to our eternal progression… polygamy can’t be apart of it.
I REEEALLY wanted to include the angel with the drawn sword, but the documentation on where it came from was just all over the place. I thought Mary was the first to claim it, but then I saw that some newspaper article by someone hostile to the church actually claimed it much earlier on. But yes, that's one of my top 5 regrets of things I just couldn't find a way to fit in! You've probably already read lots of autobiographical sketches from Mary, but I do have a link to the extracts of her autobiography as published in the Utah Genealogical and Historical Magazine on my website. So on the off-chance that you haven't read them, they're pretty entertaining! (Nothing about the angel in there, though, unfortunately!) JosephToldTheTruth (dot) org.
Brigham was obsessed with Adam hence the Adam God theory and I'm sure used the term "angel with a drawn sword" often since that phrase was used when casting out Adam and eve from the garden. Many "revelations" back then included that phrase for what seems like dramatic effect. I haven't read where Joseph used it but I've read where others have. I don't believe any of the revelations using those words because they don't make sense and completely contradict what was going on. In other words the dudes used it to look powerful 😅
@soniasmiles100 Thank you for this post. I think people who justify polygamy and insist on ignoring the women who were/are destroyed by this practice have lost touch with their understanding of what authentic intimacy is it supposed to look like. Because if they neither experience nor recognize it, then of course something like "authorized polygamy" must contain some sort of magic balm that allows a woman to give herself fully to a man who is dividing his intimacy among multiple partners. I believe in Heavenly Mother, and I also believe that she has always been treated and regarded by her spouse with complete fidelity.
@@rocketzero2103Yes! I think living out our belief detailed in the gospel doctrine essay concerning Heavenly Mother would change everything. On another note.. we know that Brian Hales helped wright a lot of the gospel essays on plural marriage… anyone know who help wright the Heavenly Mother one?
Soooooo cringey, lol!!!! I didn't point it out in the video, but his statement strongly implies that his wives are NOT on board with his "lifestyle" - so sad!
As is the statement that they want first pick of beautiful women converts. These men were openly despicable and it's disturbing that people will throw Joseph under the bus in an attempt to defend and protect such men.
Wow. Just WOW! I'm so grateful how you pointed out Abraham and Jacob. I never made the connection of Abraham and Jacob being similar to Alma, Alma the younger, and the Sons of Mosiah. I'm so grateful you pointed this out. God truly doesn't remember our sins if we repent. My goodness. Thank you!
Could this be why The Lord hasn't fulfilled His promise to bring forth the additional ancient scriptures? We are refusing to accept all The Book of Mormon's teachings and those of its champion, Joseph.
Oliver also admitted that he had no first hand knowledge of anything between Fanny and Joseph and that Joseph disclosed no such thing to him. Oliver who was at odds with Joseph at the time was clearly spreading or repeating rumor.
Oliver was probably smitten with her Fanny🥵 sorry-- but sure seems a lot of deflecting of sins from those enemies around Joseph and Emma - like we are seeing big time in our world!!
Thank you for calling Brian Hales what he is - an amateur historian. And isn’t it interesting that he has gotten so much attention and praise from the church? Yet there are countless other amateur historians getting X’d purely because they look at the documents and see that they don’t align with the narrative of the church.
I know he acknowledges that he's technically an amateur historian, so I felt fine using that. I think his books went a long way in helping everyone at least see that Joseph was not libido-driven in his behavior, but I would love it if he did another volume that clarified that he wasn't a polygamist in the first place! It would be an AMAZING book, and it would be three times as well received as the others combined, I'm confident!!
As I contemplate Brian Hale's role in all the side trails with sloppy polygamy documentation/history I can't believe his ego is that large. Could it be that money was exchanged to keep the established narrative going? One day all truth will be made known.
@@karenhyatt647this is the most juvenile accounting of polygamy denial I've ever come across. Joseph Smith was a polygamist 😂😂😂. There's countless videos debunking ever single claim you've made😅😅😅😅😅
Karen, thank you for this! I’m so grateful that this truth is spreading! What an exciting time to be alive, to see their names cleared and for our brothers and sisters to understand God’s true nature!❤
The truth of what is spreading? Polygamy being false? We don't even do polygamy today, so I truly don't see why people spend so much time and effort on the concept. We can see the leaders are wrong in vastly simpler ways than focusing on a divisive topic like polygamy.
@@Telavianpeople leave in droves for the church’s own narrative that Joseph was deceptive in hiding his secret polygamy from his wife. Let’s clear his name of such blasphemy so people can know the true Joseph.
@@Kay-mr1qo They don't leave for that reason. That is completely made up. Faithful people believe he did it because God wanted him to. Why are you making stuff up?
@@Telavian I personally know loads of people who have left due to thinking JS was a pedo or liar. Do you live under a rock? It’s absolutely happening around the globe. They can’t reconcile who they thought he was and who the church claims him to be while trying to call it “carefully worded denials.” Our church history aligns with what anti’s claim about Joseph. God does not command abominable whoredoms for anyone. Raising up seed is to raise a covenant people, not a polygamous people!
@@Telavian one of the main reasons people leave is because they can’t reconcile Joseph’s character if he was deceptively practicing polygamy and openly fighting against it. Faithful people also believe Joseph was telling the truth and faithful to his one wife. More and more are seeing the evidence and want the church to repent from this false tradition/evil practice so that the church can have God’s full blessings.
It is sad that people don't believe Joseph's innocence simply because they don't believe that so many people would later lie. Yet they ignore the fact that those people either lied in Nauvoo when they signed their names to documents that polygamy wasn't being preached or practiced or they lied in Utah when they blamed polygamy on Joseph. Either way they are liars, either way there was a conspiracy to hide the truth.
To steal man their argument, I learned that they lied because polygamy was against the law. Which sounds a little like the Blues Brothers, Belushi and Akroid being on a "Mission From God".
Also, another problem with the current narrative: it seems none of these purported wives needed the "Holy Spirit of Promise" to perform their marriages and seal them to Joseph, which is ironic, since the current "Holy Spirit of Promise" being Joseph at that time, was at every one of these sealings. It seems to be a new dude performing every sealing. I'd like to know the level of priesthood these men had when they performed these polygamous marriages, (not that I think that matters, but I believe it adds to the chaos of these accounts.) This was excellent Karen, thank you! We applauded quite a few times from our couch. Your work is so well done.
Love the mental image of the couch applause, lol - thank you! I get a kick out of Brigham's account of his sister Fanny (who never said a word about being married to Joseph). Sounds like Brigham is claiming he just "sealed" her to Joseph on the spot, apparently against her will, lol. Seriously bizarre, that one.
I’ve wondered this same thing too. If Joseph was the only man authorized to preform sealings, how did Newel K Whitney perform one. Along with several other men. There’s no explanation given for what made that possible.
I think Ben must be mortified to realize his comments about change coming can be taken to support the “amateur” historians! I loved it! Great Job Karen!
It was so odd, because he literally brought up the totally amateur historian Lester Bush in a positive way and praised his contribution, which was fabulous. And I just have no idea what changes he was alluding to if he wasn't hinting at polygamy. I can't think of anything else the church members would need to buckle up for. 🤔
This is beyond excellent! The tone and “feeling” are perfect and should not feel threatening to orthodox LDS because you kept it factual and historical, instead of an attack against our current church and leaders, which I appreciate. This is an exposition that I can feel comfortable sharing with all my LDS friends. Thank you for all your hard work.
I appreciate that so much, Wild! The vast majority of my friends have agreed with me that it's really good news. I hope yours will, too! I always acknowledge that it opens up a can of worms regarding Brigham, but most people agree that that can was already halfway open anyway, lol.
I love that quote, too!. Clark said even more along those lines, but he eventually decided that he had to choose between reason and faith. He seemed afraid that he'd have to throw out everything if he chose to reason things out. I don't think he could fathom that some parts could be right and some wrong. Dang!!
I would love to see Brian Hales or any church historian try and argue the evidence you have presented. And by argue, I mean use evidence more than just “life was different back then”, “people forgot dates after so many years”, ”it was acceptable to lie for the Lord in public.” Use evidence that stands up in court and doesn’t just sweep the obvious under the rug. Just some of the things Brigham Young said about women and polygamy in public makes me want to vomit. If I only had his words to go off of and nothing else, I would still see polygamy as an abomination. With all the evidence and contradictions now available, it’s clear it was not of God.
There were so many times while putting this together that I threw up my hands and wailed, "This should be a FOUR-MINUTE VIDEO!! Look at what these guys said....OUT LOUD!!!" 😂 One time, I just had to leave the house and take a walk. My neighbor was on her porch and asked what I was up to. I poured out my lamentations. She and her husband looked into it, and now they understand, too. Stuff like that is what kept me working.....
@@karenhyatt647 I love this so so much. Thank you for the work you are doing. It is healing lives, and taken in a spirit of humility, strengthening testimonies of the scriptures and true gospel doctrine.
@@bonniewayne3223 This sister had him on her podcast hoping to talk about his interpretation of the evidence, but instead he brought a PowerPoint presentation about how people who don't believe the traditional narrative are usually excommunicated. It was pretty disappointing. :( th-cam.com/video/mpLBtTg4AzE/w-d-xo.html
This was a great video summary! Even as an ExMormon atheist, I greatly appreciate the discussions happening within these groups. As someone who values discovering and believing as many true things as I can, the deep exploration and verification of the historical records, the evidence, and reviewing all the data is incredibly encouraging and worthwhile.
Marcus, even if you are calling yourself an atheist, your desire to engage and seek truth tells me that you are open to receiving what the Lord has for you. I do not judge anyone's path or walk with God. What is sad, is that the polygamy narrative and so called doctrine is not founded in truth, thus it demotes faith in God. It changes how people view God and men and women. I have hope that one day, yet another faith demoting rumor will be jettisoned. Funny how many of those originated with Brigham Young.
@@BridgeBuilder-x4c I’m totally open to the idea of god revealing himself to me. And for context, polygamy was an issue for me while I was a believing member, for sure. It’s hard for it not to be. I remember my dad telling me about the brief history of it when I was 12-13 years old and the overwhelming feelings of betrayal, confusion, and rejection were very strong. However, there were other items/issues/claims that caused the idea of the restoration’s truthfulness unconvincing. However, I’m open to being wrong.
@@marcuschristensen1883 There is no gospel question so sacred that we should not feel safe asking about. Even the existence of God should not be a question we fear asking. Ask anything you want. I will see if I can help. You won't get a reflexive, dogmatic answer from me. I know there are problems in the Church's history, and that a lot of fig leaves have been applied rather than seeking the grace of Jesus Christ and owning up to it. But, I also know what was done wrong or right in the past is not of our current leaders making. The problem is, they are stuck wondering how to fix it. Polygamy for example is a goliath But the whole Israelite army feared. But all it took was one David with faith in the Living God and one smooth stone guided by the Lord to take out Goliath.
Just finished and this is incredible, the perfect video to share with anyone who is newer to this discussion and wants to better understand the opposing sides point of view. As a potential future video, it would be amazing to see a breakdown of every contemporary source of evidence for the Smiths polygamy. The new book Secret Covenants provides a detailed chart of these claims.
@@karieberry1070 Thank you, I’m in Australia and have a very serious health issue, so I’m struggling I’m hoping the leaders will look at this, we csn pray they, will prayer is so powerful.
Well done! Very thorough for presenting an overview of so much information. Regarding the women who claimed to be Joseph Smith’s wives by providing affidavits and more, I also keep in mind that these women had gone through the temple ceremony of the time, and were under covenant to obey their husbands, most of whom were also church leaders. If their husbands/priesthood leaders were asking them to provide the needed proof to connect Joseph to polygamy, even if they had to make some things up to do so, I wonder what choice they would feel they had?
I think he’s referring to the film about the succession crisis? There’s a digital billboard on I-15 and one of the ads is for a new Mormon movie about the succession crisis, in favor of Brigham Young.
Really love having a concise way to share evidence that Joseph Smith is innocent of the allegations of polygamy. Having spent over a year looking at evidence and hearing the debates and reading every scripture on the topic--it's nice to have a "go to" place for people to see a large sampling of misrepresentations. Thank you all for all your effort. I don't know what the Church will do with this, but it feels like cloud 9 to not be burdened with it!
I don't know why any LDS scholar, person, member etc., would find this not to be 100% true. The men back then - namely Brigham Young, Heber C. Kimball, Orson Pratt and the others in high positions remind me a bit of Chad Daybell - just fat, old, bald men who think they are somehow special and can have as many wives or have sex with multiple women because they have special powers and keys. This documentary is such an eye opener, and so well presented! I'm so happy Joseph and Emma are getting a voice, this should be shared with everyone and everywhere!! Our gospel was never founded on polygamy, its a dirty stain brought about by nasty old men, and I hope they will be accountable for all the pain and suffering they caused so many women!
I'm sure they will be, and I'm pretty sorry for them. Gwendolyn Wyne pointed out that Brigham lost his mother at a young age and lost his first wife early on as well. I wonder if he suffered from feelings of abandonment. Who knows. But it stirred up some compassion in me, and I was thankful. I really like your comment about giving Joseph & Emma a voice. It's sad that they've been squelched for so long - thank heavens we're now able to look at what they actually said. Thank you for the kind words! 💜
-Many don't know that Willard Richards is Brigham's cousin. -That Brigham claimed having a vision regarding polygamy while on his mission in England before Joseph ever allegedly presented polygamy to him. Yet later Brigham would claim he desired death when Joseph presented polygamy to him. -William Clayton, Willard Richards, Heber Kimball were all with Brigham in England when he had that vision. (thick as thieves) -William Clayton's Manchester Journal page 145. April 25th 1840. William Clayton defends Jacob and David having many wives. Completely contrary to Jacob in the Book of Mormon They hatched their plan for polygamy in England with no oversight or influence from Joseph. They brought women from England to America, some leaving their husbands and arriving destitute and susceptible to the lies of these men, as a means of survival. Joseph put a stop to it (why would he do that if he was involved) Joseph instituted the RS in part to protect these women from men who would use their desperate situation to seduce them (again why would he do it if he was involved?) As soon as Joseph died Brigham shut down the RS and as stated in this video took many plural wives while still in Nauvoo even though Nauvoo was so dangerous the Mormons had to flee. How does this make any sense? Joseph was jailed and killed as a result of the Expositor revealing his alleged polygamy. Polygamy was allegedly kept secret to avoid persecution. Yet after polygamy being exposed and Joseph's killed Brigham and Heber felt safe enough to take multiple wives. Mind-blowing, unless your research has revealed the truth then it all makes sense.
Ok, so Hyrum was there on July 12th when 132 was supposedly received, and yet Brigham claims he wasn't an insider and didn't know about this "principle".... riiiight .... it's obvious who's lying, those that believed in "lying for the Lord", not those who never changed their position on the matter.
This video is going to be the catalyst for many people choosing to “repent and come unto me and be baptized in my name and know of the true points of my doctrine, that they may be numbered among my people” LDS 3 Nephi 21:6
You really think so? Understanding polygamy was wrong is going to be a catalyst to bring people to God? I don't see it. 99.99% of the world already knows polygamy is wrong.
I’d like to hope that would be true, but as long as the institutional church continues with the narrative that 132 is inspired revelation given by God to Joseph Smith, I don’t see how many will trust, believe or be baptized. 😢
Very well done. And it makes sense! So much of traditional beliefs and excuses for polygamy never felt right, especially for women. This strengthens my testimony in Joseph Smith. It’s too bad that this false teaching wasn’t addressed and condemned by leaders decades ago. It’s amazing that we’re in the year 2024 and still not hearing our leaders explain that it was wrong then and forever will be, even if that means bad mouthing those past leaders that promoted it. It’s okay, and would be a relief, to hear our current prophet just say they were wrong and caused decades of harm to the church that continues today. I REALLY hope this gets addressed to the church worldwide.
Agree 100% Audrey! I really hope we can put this behind us, and the sooner the better. It really is still causing harm as an unnecessary stumbling block to sincere seekers of truth.
Wow, awesome Karen, you did a wonderful job presenting the truth that the saints that came West who entered polygamy were filled with lies, lies and more lies. These "lies" are the "foundation" of Brigham Church, Its not the Lords Church, its Brigham's Church and the Lord has this to say about it: Behold, I am Alpha and Omega, even Jesus Christ. 61 Wherefore, let all men beware how they take my name in their lips- 62 For behold, verily I say, that many there be who are under this condemnation, who use the name of the Lord, and use it in vain, having not authority. 63 Wherefore, let the church repent of their sins, and I, the Lord, will own them; otherwise they shall be cut off. 64 Remember that that which cometh from above is sacred, and must be spoken with care, and by constraint of the Spirit; and in this there is no condemnation, and ye receive the Spirit through prayer; wherefore, without this there remaineth condemnation. (Doctrine and Covenants | Section 63:60 - 64) Revelation given August 1831 And your minds in times past have been darkened because of unbelief, and because you have treated lightly the things you have received- 55 Which vanity and unbelief have brought the whole church under condemnation. 56 And this condemnation resteth upon the children of Zion, even all. 57 And they shall remain under this condemnation until they repent and remember the new covenant, even the Book of Mormon and the former commandments which I have given them, not only to say, but to do according to that which I have written- (Doctrine and Covenants | Section 84:54 - 57) Revelation given Sept 22 1832 For the kingdom of the devil must shake, and they which belong to it must needs be stirred up unto repentance, or the devil will grasp them with his everlasting chains, and they be stirred up to anger, and perish; 20 For behold, at that day shall he rage in the hearts of the children of men, and stir them up to anger against that which is good. 21 And others will he pacify, and lull them away into carnal security, that they will say: All is well in Zion; yea, Zion prospereth, all is well-and thus the devil cheateth their souls, and leadeth them away carefully down to hell. 22 And behold, others he flattereth away, and telleth them there is no hell; (Book of Mormon | 2 Nephi 28:19 - 22) Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion! 25 Wo be unto him that crieth: All is well! (Book of Mormon | 2 Nephi 28:24 - 25) What song did the Saints sing on the way WEST to SLC Utah? "Come Come Ye Saints" "All is well," All is well." This is fulfillment of prophecy from our own Book of Mormon! I hope the Church repents, if not collectively at least individually! I am still a member and have repented of propagating the lie that the prophet Joseph Smith was a teacher and practiced polygamy and that D&C 132 is false doctrine and is not in harmony with D&C 42 "embracing the law of the church," that man should only have one wife and cleave unto her and none else!
I have watched this several times. Thank you so much for compiling and presenting this so clearly. It has given me a lot of validation for my suspicions for years.
Thank you for that, Adrienne - that's the comment I get over and over as I share this in my ward and stake. Most say that polygamy had never sat right with them, and the truth makes so much more sense and squares better with what we know about Joseph. Thanks for watching & sharing! 💜
Karen , I appreciate your thorough and honest research in sharing the historical facts that shed great light on this divisive subject that has brought so much pain and suffering to many. I pray that the leadership of the church and the church historical department will have the integrity to address the accurate history and exonerate Joseph Emma and Hyrum.
Me too, Renee! I know it will take a lot of courage for them to reexamine this, but it will be so worth it. I turned it into a professionally printed booklet for them, since I figured they'd prefer that format. I knew there was little chance of meeting with the leaders themselves, so I intended to hand deliver it to their secretaries. And, in fact, I realized it was probably better that way, so I've been super excited. Imagine my surprise to learn that I can't even set up an appointment with the SECRETARIES without my stake president requesting it first!!! What in the world?? I'll talk to him in the next day or two, and we'll go from there. So this will not be as easy as I thought. But God will provide a way. Prayers please!
@@karenhyatt647 Wow! What a process!! Please keep us all updated.. I am very interested to hear what they say. I will definitely be praying 🙏 for you and all those involved . I failed to mention in my first message that the work you put in with the affidavits was incredible Karen! How in the world can the historical department use them as proof is beyond comprehension!! God bless!
This was beautifully done ❤ thank you for giving voice to the women! I do however wish we could get rid of the bad explanation for Jacob 2:30. It really is quite simple. 29&30 are the peak of the chiasm so there are two thought forms in each verse that mirror one another. #1) If God will call people to be HIS people then he will give them commandments. #2) if said people choose to disobey God’s commands, then God will curse them. We don’t need to break the chiasm to make sense of verse 30 nor do we need to reach back 7 verses to define what “these things” means because the definition comes from the verse before.
Great comment, I believe it’s more simple than we often make it. You really just need to read verses 29 and 30 together and it’s clear that 30 is just reaffirming what 29 just said, and then 31-35 explain the why.
THESE THINGS refers to 3 sins. If people want to say that the Lord sometimes authorizes polygamy, he is also authorizing the other too. Ridiculous to cherry pick out that verse.
@@BridgeBuilder-x4c and I agree that for people to think it’s an allowance to do the opposite of what else was preached throughout the rest of the chapter is nonsense.
Heavenly Father has allowed the grossest injustice to stand for two millennia - that of the slander and execution of His Son. Should we be surprised that in the restoration of all things, He has allowed another gross injustice to stand uncorrected for 2 centuries? Time is up for both injustices, of which one is but a type and shadow of the other.
VERY TRUE. If you believe there is a polygamy loophole, you have to accept the Lord is authorizing all the other names sins as well. This is high school English. Now we seem to have woke English--twist it to suit the narrative.
Karen, thank you so much for your incredible work here. I found myself overcome with gratitude and simultaneous sorrow as I listened to you spotlight the women who lived in the system. Thank you for sharing their stories. The truth of this subject is so important, even today. The pain and fear of polygamy is still silently living in the hearts of many faithful women.
Thank you so much for the kind words. It's a horrific thing to have on the horizon, yet so many of us have laid it on the altar, so to speak. I feel like this is our ram in the thicket, and it's such good news. But yes...those poor women who lived this way. I hope they're cheering us on.
Yes!! This is what we need! I’m so glad you included all your sources and showed the documents 📃 on the screen! Anyone who honestly studies these sources will be able to wipe the mud of the windshield and see an honest and monogamous Jospeh Smith.
I think you have beautifully presented content that others have tried and failed to present in a clear and concise digestible manner. We as members have some very hard choices ahead if this material is true.
I love this presentation!! Thank you so much! It makes so much sense! Joseph is the Prophet of the Restoration and I believe him and Emma, Hyrum, Sam and William. God bless!
@@supereverything3636 Thanks so much, Super! If you run into anyone with questions about Joseph and polygamy, be sure to share it with them! 💜 (Oh and if you share the website - JosephToldTheTruth[dot]org - I think they can watch it there without all the lame ads.)
Great job on two big mistakes by Clayton, his August 1843 journal entry about the Partridge sisters and his contradictory accounts regarding who took section 132 to Emma. I’ve been trying to point these out and they are generally dismissed by the pro polygamy crowd. Very telling though when you consider the overall narrative.
@@whatsup3270 So Joseph can stay in the office with Clayton and take the revelation to Emma with Hyrum at the same time? It’s important because it’s one of many contradictions regarding the provenance of 132. Clayton’s contemporary entry is the one that says they both went, he wrote the entry that day so he certainly shouldn’t have got that detail wrong. So why does the church tell this other story based on his later story?
@@Commenter2121 it is not based on William Clayton and never was. Think about this with some logic. The bad claim is Joseph needed to dictate the revelation to William so William could given a written copy to Joseph so Joseph would know the revelation( that is looney) cont
I'm grateful to hear about the wives and the stories surrounding their "affidavits." Patty Sessions is one of my ancestors and it is interesting to find out her journal contained a leaflet with the info about Joseph, not that it was written in there originally. One other piece of evidence about Joseph and Emma's feelings on monogamy is the old hymnbook compiled by Emma. In that book there is a "section" on Marriage that contains only one song. It is so beautiful about Adam and Eve and explains the whole plan about husband and wife cleaving to each other. It has been included in the RLDS hymnbook for sometime I believe. th-cam.com/video/Xir3kxPmGng/w-d-xo.htmlsi=uGOarZupgvfWR2Y9
Very cool - I didn't know about that hymn. I'm anxious to look at that - thanks! You've probably already read it, but here's a link to the book of Patty's diary entries: digitalcommons.usu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1092&context=usupress_pubs (The inserted pages are shown on p. 277.)
Very nice compilation of information. I wonder if the LDS administration will audit this information officially and correct the historical record or sweep it under the rug.
Thank you. I'm praying they'll take a look at the information for themselves. I'm preparing a written version in case they're not into watching a video made by some rando, which I can understand, lol. Here's hoping....🙏
Ha! A godly person would evaluate information based on the content rather than some appeal to "authority". Look at the descriptions of Jesus Christ given in Mosiah 14:2-3 such as despised and esteemed not, nor beauty that we should desire him, etc. I certainly don't think your some rando, and neither should they.
Woah! It's like someone took all the videos I've watched about Joseph Smith not practicing polygamy and rolled them together into one anthology. This must have taken quite some time and I can't applaud it more. Thank you.
Thank you for that - that's exactly how this started! The first one I ever saw was Rob Fotheringham's "Brigham or Joseph" video. I wanted to take the "zingers" and compile them, and it snowballed from there!
Honest and concise compilation. Incredible work!
I agree with you. She has done a marvelous job.
Oh wow, thanks for the shout out at 1:15:32. Your breakdown of Jacob 2 was excellent and you have made a very compelling case throughout your presentation. You've also brought to the table many observations that I haven't heard of yet like the gospel doctrine manual changing the word "For" to "But" which is very significant. I have also seen language explaining this verse that places the word otherwise at the end such as, "I will command my people otherwise" which also changes the meaning. The biggest problems with this subject are that the amount of information is so vast, the sources vary substantially and regularly contradict one another, and there are so many other important facts are left out.
Also, we don't seem to realize that Joseph Smith, who translated the Book of Mormon and knew of that vast amount of content that could have been as much as 1 Nephi to the end of Alma, likely knew a great deal more about this topic from Lehi's record and perhaps others that were lost and would have known clearly better than anyone else that it was an abomination.
Another thing to look into is the specific use of the term "wickedness and abominations." It seems that this term is used with Jacob's people and their practice of taking many wives and concubines along with King Noah, and the people of Jerusalem at the time Lehi left and we know they were practicing this as well along with those in ALL the lands of God's people. We see the phrase occurring many more times throughout the Book of Mormon and I've wondered if this unique phrase is perhaps especially tied in some way to the people taking many wives and concubines.
Anyway, I'm a little over halfway through but just wanted to share my appreciation for contributing to this topic, you have provided many great resources and presented the information very well.
Thank you, Steve! Michelle pointed out the "For" >> "[But]" thing, and it blew my mind.
Also, when I read through the Jacob scriptures during the video, I was going to leave out all the instances of "saith the Lord of Hosts," for brevity, but I believe it was you (correct me if I'm wrong!) who pointed out that that term has significance, so I left it in. Thanks for you contributions!
@@karenhyatt647 yeah that’s right. Impressive work, one if the best, if not the best breakdown of all the major points I’ve seen. There’s just so much information and I like how you provided a transcript and detailed references, well done!
@@karenhyatt647it is as huge !! Another example of how we “wrest the scriptures “ to our own destruction.
@@karieberry1070 Somehow your comment slipped by me till now. I love it - you're so right. It's a PERFECT example of wresting the scriptures!
This is the perfect video that has everything.
Thank you!
Aww, thank you so much. I'm so glad you enjoyed it!
This is absolutely phenomenal! I am so glad I watched your meticulous presentation. I will be recommending it to my family and friends. Thank you for all your inspiration, hard-work, and dedication to truth and righteousness❤
@@brigettehlers124 Thank you so much! And thank you for sharing it - you've made my day! 💜
It’s so interesting to me how Joseph always speaks of a loving God and uplifts with his words whereas Brigham always uses fear of destruction. That really stood out.
Sounds like we have a false prophet somewhere.
You haven't seriously read Joseph Smith Jr.'s writings... pick up a TPJS and read it cover to cover and then come back
This is the video I’ve wished existed. Concise, irrefutable, accurate, without a lot of personal opinion or commentary. The logic and evidence speaks volumes.
This. Plus, it goes down the list of each purported wife.
This doc is outstanding.
@@rocketzero2103 amen! Each wife one by one was very impressive to me. It made the entire topic seem less intimidating.
I appreciate that so, so much, Leslie - thank you!
"hoped for?" hoped for for what? to lead people away from trusting God's chosen prophets and apostles?
@@AbrahamJohn-j7t if they don’t each have their owna revelation from God calling them such - they are not Gods prophets
You missed that the Book of Mormon shows that the Lamanite women abducted by the priests of Noah also defended their husbands when the Lamanites discovered them. It is called stockholm syndrome.
It is no surprise polygamist wives were defending their husbands in the practice.
Excellent point.
That's an amazing insight! Thank you!
Almost makes one wonder why Mormon, who saw Brigham's day, decided to include that little detail in his book...
Nice catch. Many got married in their teens, brain-washed early, and that's all they ever knew.
Monogamous wives go through this same fear, Stockholm syndrome awareness. The source of fear is Satan and is a lack of faith.
Karen, I already knew this would be great, but I'm absolutely stunned at the clear and logical and persuasive way you organized this video.
The LDS polygamy history, with all of its moving parts, motivations, false "laundry list" persuasion techniques ("there are tons of women that we can list who we were married to Joseph, so it must be true!"), etc., etc., etc. make this an extremely daunting task. And yet you blow holes in all of it with ease, and give compelling reasons why we can ACTUALLY BELIEVE Joseph.
I'm so impressed. I will be sharing this with friends and family. ❤❤❤
Wow, such kind words - thank you so much! 🙏
persuasive? To lead people to not trust our leaders?
@@AbrahamJohn-j7t Persuasive - to lead people from believing in false traditions. Or are you arguing that our leaders are infallible? Historians work to prop up a false narrative and this is accepted by our leaders. Our leaders need to see the false narrative their historians are giving them, because our leaders are *not* infallible.
@@AbrahamJohn-j7t Trust is built on integrity, not deception. Our leaders do not practice or promote polygamy, so I"m not sure what the problem is. It is always better to account for past mistakes and move forward with real trust. Just add polygamy to Brigham Young's list of other Church-denounced doctrines and we can all move on.
@@AbrahamJohn-j7tyeah Joseph Smith was our founding leader. Why don’t you trust his own words??? Everyone throws him under the bus for less reputable leaders for some insane reason.
God bless you. I developed a hypothesis many years ago that Brigham Young had started polygamy and pinned it on Joseph Smith. I thought I was alone out of over 15 million members. Finally thousands and even tens of thousands are coming to learn truth regarding this. Jesus Christ taught "The truth shall set you free." Your work, with that of so many others, like Pamela and Richard Price, Michelle Stone, Jerry Hoop, and so many others, all contributes to bless those who seek truth. Untruths hurt so many, but the truth will set us all free. So many have suffered and have been persecuted for speaking the truth. The humble followers of Christ will recognize truth, and love all those who need the love of those who honestly seek truth and love their fellow men. This is wonderful overview of what has taken me years to learn. May the truth bring people together in love and understanding.
Love, love, love this!! Thank you SO much! 💜💜💜💜💜
@@karenhyatt647 Thank you. Please share this video with others and encourge them to share this video.......
So how do you make sense of Brigham Young, genuinely asking?
@@anniecrowther8423 Annie, I apologize - your comment got buried, and I'm sorry I'm only now getting back to you.
There are so many parallels between Brigham and King Noah that I now see them in a very similar light. Both were polygamists, of course. King Noah put down the priests that had been in place before him and replaced them with new ones who were prideful and would support him in his abominations. Brigham was awful to many who were loyal to Joseph, including Sidney Rigdon, William Marks, Emma Smith, Lucy Mack, and Joseph's sons. King Noah heavily taxed his people and lazily glutted himself off their labors. Brigham openly said that every time he picked up a hoe, someone would come along and do the work for him - they just wouldn't let him work! He also told his people that he couldn't pay his personal debts until the people paid their tithing, threatening to put them "to the screw" if they didn't. Yikes. King Noah "did cause his people to commit sin." I could never imagine how a leader could "cause" his people to sin. But Brigham repeatedly told his people that polygamy was necessary to their eternal glory and exaltation and shamed those who didn't participate. Check.
As far as "keys" and "succession," I look at the example of Alma the elder, who was one of Noah's wicked priests. Not only were the previous priests replaced by Noah (breaking any "chain of authority" as I see it), but I can't imagine it would be necessary for someone as wicked as King Noah to lay hands on Alma in order to confer godly power or authority on him. I just don't believe that God approves of - let alone requires - anything like that from a wicked man in order to impart power. I believe God chose and empowered Alma because of his faith, repentance, and obedience - not because he was in some sort of line of succession.
So for me, as far as modern leaders, I listen to them and strive to discern truth from error with the help of the Spirit. As Jesus said in reference to true prophets, "ye shall know them by their fruits."
There's a very long answer after a very long wait - apologies!
@@anniecrowther8423 I’ve thought about this question many times.
To be as short and to the point as possible, all of the evidence shows that Brigham was a very bad man and took opportunity in literally hijacking the restored church away from Joseph and Hyrum. The deaths of Joseph, Hyrum and Samuel can all be attributed to the secret combinations of Brigham Young. It’s a fact that Brigham Young was about to be dealt with severely by Joseph once he was released from the Carthage jail. Joseph had become aware that there were many dirty members of the quorum of the 12 apostles and he had been made aware of some things they were teaching while in Carthage jail. Joseph told Emma that upon his release, he would square things with the newspaper regarding misinformation that had been printed, then he planned to deal directly with Brigham Young regarding his false teachings of polygamy and spiritual wifery secretly being taught among certain members.
When you understand that Joseph and Hyrum were literally murdered by Willard Richards, the nephew of Brigham Young, and John Taylor, the successor of Brigham‘s church after his death, you should be able to see very clearly that these were not godly men, and that they could never have been called by God to be prophetic leaders of his church.
The day Joseph and Hyrum were murdered the restored church fell into complete apostasy.
Brigham Young started his own church out of the ashes, while trying to disguise it as the same church, Joseph restored.
The church that Nephi, Isaiah, Moroni and other prophets, warn us about in these latter-day‘s, the church that would rob the poor, the church that would have leaders with hard hearts, stiff necks, and would be puffed up, the church that would teach false, vain and foolish doctrines, the one that would commit whoredom‘s and priestcrafts, the one that would have large and spacious buildings adorned with the finest materials, is literally the LDS church today. The church is approaching nearly $300 billion in assets yet gives very little to feed the poor or clothe the naked. Instead, it bails out its own insurance company, built a lavish shopping mall and invests in hotels and commercial real estate throughout the world.
Even with hundreds of billions of dollars the advice is still given over the pulpit today that “if you are faced with a decision to buy food or to pay tithing, you should always pay your tithing”.
It should be obvious to all that the LDS church corporation today is completely off track and apostate, and is absolutely not the same church that Joseph restored to the earth.
Wow, outstanding work! This is an exceptionally well-crafted and concise summation of the polygamy debate, presented in a clear and accessible manner. Your efforts will undoubtedly enlighten many. It’s time for the truth to shine through the fog of misinformation. Well done!
This was probably the most comprehensive, well researched, and just fabulous video I've sen on the subject. I can tell this must've taken a very, very long time to research, compile, and edit this video. Thank you for sharing this! I just want to shout from the rooftops that Joseph Smith was NOT a polygamist!!
Thank you!! We watch the videos you and your sister have done and so appreciate your work. Bravo!
I do that everywhere I go!! 😆🥳 it’s so important to healing of hearts of women - and marriages !!
Thank you for collecting these records and information! I’ve watched hundreds of videos on this subject and I still really enjoyed this and learned new things
Bravo, Karen! Thank you for your work! I will add this to my resources to give to people who are open to learning an alternative history that is more consistent with an unchanging, loving Heavenly Father and Mother.
Thank you, Karen, for an amazing presentation. It was packed with insight after insight. A great labor of love. As I read the list of contributors at the end, my heart was full of love for each of those great people and the work being done. ❤
Thank you, Brian. They are truly pioneers!
Excellent video Karen. Very precise and easy to follow. Love you and Michelle,.
So glad you found it easy to follow - thanks!
Karen, Bravo! Superb. I am sending it to my family and friends. Thank you for all your hard and excellent work. Us "deniers" are gaining momentum. Every nudge toward the church changing its narrative is important. Great stuff!
I sent this to my bishops wife …. Should be fun!! She and I were lamenting about this issue weeks ago…
Superb work, Karen. Probably the most concise coverage of the evidence I've seen to date and included some scriptural insights I hadn't thought of or encountered before. This must have taken untold hours to script and produce. So well done!
This video represents the next step in the evolution of the pro-monogamy movement.
I think the next step will be something that would be very hard to do on TH-cam. There are so many pieces to this puzzle that it's hard to keep track of what has been covered and what hasn't. A visual representation of every element of the story - scriptures, affidavits, letters, etc. overlaid with a Hemlock Knots-style color coding to reflect latency, proximity, and verbatim verbal\written, like they did with their Quotes page.
Wow Karen! What a great presentation! With the enormous volume of info out there, such a concise presentation seemed to be impossible...but you did it. So amazing, Thank you!
I appreciate that so much, Dale! If you had seen the hundreds of topics written on bits of paper scattered all over the floor as the first step to this thing, you'd never have imagined it would ever come together. It was daunting. I proceeded completely on faith, lol. Thanks for appreciating it!!
Thankyou for adding yet another work and testimony to the truth about Joseph, Hyrum and Emma. Brilliant!!!!
Excellent video!! It is like you took many of the historical documents I have been researching for the last 3 1/2 years and put them into one well organized video!! Thank you!! ❤ I pray that this will help more people come to the truth!
That's exactly what I did - and close to the same timeline, too!
I hope you will write a book!! We need more of this truth about Joseph & Emma THERE!! Including cleaning up Wikipedia --
Karen this is fantastic! 🎉 And clearly the result of countless hours of hard work. I especially appreciate the individual breakdown of the alleged wives and evidence of marriage to Joseph Smith. Truly a wonderful contribution to this discussion, thank you for making this!
Thank you so much, Gwendolyn!! I soooo wanted to include the Cochranite connection in this but just couldn't, since it leaned just a bit too far into speculation. I was absolutely ELATED when I saw you had gone into it in depth in your video.
Some friends who appreciated my video then had questions about how this could have worked its way into the church. Perfect question!! I was so happy to be able to refer them to YOUR video and your excellent and very plausible hypothesis.
WOOHOO!!! Thank you!
@@karenhyatt647 When I learned about the Cochranites and Agusta Cobb I couldn't believe I had never learned about them before. I didn't know that there was even another discussion of polygamy before "Joseph's revelation". That solidify it to me, Joseph truly fought polygamy.
Very well done! This is a tremendously important presentation.
Rob, yours was the one that turned my world upside down and I'm so grateful. ❤❤❤
I appreciate that so much. Your 'Joseph or Brigham' video was the first thing I ever saw on the subject. I looked up the sources you showed, verified them, and had a paradigm shift - which made scads more sense than what I had been told for so long. Amazing that hardly any of us even know about the original D&C, let alone any of the other important information surrounding this topic.
Thank you so, so much for your work and your courage. I'm sure it has come with a price. Thank you, Rob!!!
Where you at? lol
Rob, I just want to say I am sorry for any price you may have paid for speaking the truth. And even though I already knew for years, from my own research, that Joseph didn't practice polygamy I was very grateful to you for your courage in spreading the truth and bringing others to that knowledge. It was the right thing to do and I know God will bless you for it. Thank you for your contribution to bringing truth to light.
Thank you so much for your work. I hope they come apologizing to you someday. I think it is roulette with leaders. Because of yours and other experience I thought I would be possibly excommunicated when talking to my leaders about my thoughts on Brigham's polygamy. What are you up to? I did see an interview with Hemlock a while back. Thank you again for your videos!
Wow. This video was soooo well done. The presentation couldn’t be better! Full of Grace and Truth. And such beautiful news!! This feels like such an integral part to the continuing restoration we’ve been awaiting!! Thank you for your efforts!!!
Such kind words! Thank you so much, Heather - I'm so glad you liked it!!
Only about 45 minutes in but this is absolutely brilliant Karen, very well done! Looking forward to finishing up.
Beautifully done! Thank you for all the time and effort and sacrifice you must have put into this informative production. So inspiring!
That's very kind - thank you!
So great, thank you! Agnes Coolbrith was Joseph's Brother Don Carlo's wife. Don Carlos died 1842 and Agnes moved to California with their girls. They didn't claim the Mormon religion in California. Her daughter Ina Coolbirth, born Josephine Donna Smith, became a famous poet. Ina wrote to her cousin Joseph F Smith letters telling him that The Book of Mormon taught against polygamy.
That's so cool! There are so many faith-promoting stories from sources that I always figured were not valuable enough to read. I feel very foolish now. I need a rewind button.....!
@@karenhyatt647 Karen Thank you for your video! No need for rewind just going forward!
I guess our early pioneer brothers and sisters were fighting it in that day too!!!
Could you share those letters from Ina to Joseph F ?
@@Fefo419 I can't find them. I have gone looking for them again and haven't found them. Michelle Stone just shared letters between Joseph F and Joseph III. The name of the video is 150: What Joseph's Family Really Thought -- About POLYGAMY
Fantastic video! Thank you for all your hard work putting this together!
This was wonderfully done! Thank you for your dedication and hard work . This feels like something I can share with friends.
Brian Hales is a very dishonest individual. He knows damn well what the truth is...but chooses to continue to paint a FALSE narrative to deceive people both in and out of the church. He has caused so many people to abandon the gospel because of his lies. He will be held accountable!!!!
Yes he will be standing in the same repentance line as Brigham, Heber, John Taylor and the rest.
This is a vast simplification. The only way you can claim things so authoritatively is when you completely ignore evidence.
I believe Joseph was involved, however I also know the whole issue is murky. Bran Hales is not dishonest, but a historian that goes 1000 times deeper than you ever will.
@@Telavianyou mean retired anesthesiologist , not historian. His credibility is lost when he completely omits loads of evidence that doesn’t align with his narrative and all of Joseph’s & Hyrum’s mountain of teachings against it.
@@Telavian Delusional much?
@@Kay-mr1qo You seem to put too much weight on Joseph's words. Implying the because he taught against it then couldn't have done it.
I just found Michelle Stone through the Cwic media podcast and was so intrigued. Mary Rollins Lightner is my ancestor. I have read her journal entries and was always so confused by the account of the angel and the sword. I wish that would have been included in this video. Where did this story come from? I grew up believing it.
I really enjoyed this documentary and it clearly shows that there are way too many question marks to portray the certainty that the church does on Joseph Smith polygamy!
Listening to Jennifer Finlayson Fife has also been a huge inspiration to me. She explains how polygamy can not and does not allow true intimacy in marriage, eternal spiritual growth or progression. Paraphrasing her words… If God is who we think, a loving God completely dedicated to our eternal progression… polygamy can’t be apart of it.
I REEEALLY wanted to include the angel with the drawn sword, but the documentation on where it came from was just all over the place. I thought Mary was the first to claim it, but then I saw that some newspaper article by someone hostile to the church actually claimed it much earlier on. But yes, that's one of my top 5 regrets of things I just couldn't find a way to fit in!
You've probably already read lots of autobiographical sketches from Mary, but I do have a link to the extracts of her autobiography as published in the Utah Genealogical and Historical Magazine on my website. So on the off-chance that you haven't read them, they're pretty entertaining! (Nothing about the angel in there, though, unfortunately!)
JosephToldTheTruth (dot) org.
Brigham was obsessed with Adam hence the Adam God theory and I'm sure used the term "angel with a drawn sword" often since that phrase was used when casting out Adam and eve from the garden.
Many "revelations" back then included that phrase for what seems like dramatic effect. I haven't read where Joseph used it but I've read where others have. I don't believe any of the revelations using those words because they don't make sense and completely contradict what was going on. In other words the dudes used it to look powerful 😅
@soniasmiles100 Thank you for this post. I think people who justify polygamy and insist on ignoring the women who were/are destroyed by this practice have lost touch with their understanding of what authentic intimacy is it supposed to look like. Because if they neither experience nor recognize it, then of course something like "authorized polygamy" must contain some sort of magic balm that allows a woman to give herself fully to a man who is dividing his intimacy among multiple partners.
I believe in Heavenly Mother, and I also believe that she has always been treated and regarded by her spouse with complete fidelity.
@@karenhyatt647 are there any videos or historians that you can point me to that goes into the documentation or history of the Angel story?
@@rocketzero2103Yes! I think living out our belief detailed in the gospel doctrine essay concerning Heavenly Mother would change everything.
On another note.. we know that Brian Hales helped wright a lot of the gospel essays on plural marriage… anyone know who help wright the Heavenly Mother one?
The quote by Heber C Kimball about having thousands wives in the spirit world is so cringey.
Soooooo cringey, lol!!!! I didn't point it out in the video, but his statement strongly implies that his wives are NOT on board with his "lifestyle" - so sad!
As is the statement that they want first pick of beautiful women converts. These men were openly despicable and it's disturbing that people will throw Joseph under the bus in an attempt to defend and protect such men.
Wow. Just WOW! I'm so grateful how you pointed out Abraham and Jacob. I never made the connection of Abraham and Jacob being similar to Alma, Alma the younger, and the Sons of Mosiah. I'm so grateful you pointed this out. God truly doesn't remember our sins if we repent. My goodness. Thank you!
I really appreciate this - you've made my day!!
Could this be why The Lord hasn't fulfilled His promise to bring forth the additional ancient scriptures? We are refusing to accept all The Book of Mormon's teachings and those of its champion, Joseph.
That would make perfect sense. 😢
Well done! Thank you for this clear easy to follow over view of this subject. I think it is going to change minds!
This is an amazing distillation of years of research and mountains of evidence. You nailed it. Thank you!
Oliver also admitted that he had no first hand knowledge of anything between Fanny and Joseph and that Joseph disclosed no such thing to him. Oliver who was at odds with Joseph at the time was clearly spreading or repeating rumor.
Oliver was probably smitten with her Fanny🥵 sorry-- but sure seems a lot of deflecting of sins from those enemies around Joseph and Emma - like we are seeing big time in our world!!
Thank you for calling Brian Hales what he is - an amateur historian. And isn’t it interesting that he has gotten so much attention and praise from the church? Yet there are countless other amateur historians getting X’d purely because they look at the documents and see that they don’t align with the narrative of the church.
I know he acknowledges that he's technically an amateur historian, so I felt fine using that. I think his books went a long way in helping everyone at least see that Joseph was not libido-driven in his behavior, but I would love it if he did another volume that clarified that he wasn't a polygamist in the first place! It would be an AMAZING book, and it would be three times as well received as the others combined, I'm confident!!
As I contemplate Brian Hale's role in all the side trails with sloppy polygamy documentation/history I can't believe his ego is that large. Could it be that money was exchanged to keep the established narrative going? One day all truth will be made known.
@@MaryW359I’m sure he has made good money from his trilogy
@karenhyatt647 you give Brian a lot more charity than I can muster. The more I learn the more I believe he is willfully lying.
@@karenhyatt647this is the most juvenile accounting of polygamy denial I've ever come across. Joseph Smith was a polygamist 😂😂😂. There's countless videos debunking ever single claim you've made😅😅😅😅😅
Karen, thank you for this! I’m so grateful that this truth is spreading! What an exciting time to be alive, to see their names cleared and for our brothers and sisters to understand God’s true nature!❤
The truth of what is spreading? Polygamy being false? We don't even do polygamy today, so I truly don't see why people spend so much time and effort on the concept.
We can see the leaders are wrong in vastly simpler ways than focusing on a divisive topic like polygamy.
@@Telavianpeople leave in droves for the church’s own narrative that Joseph was deceptive in hiding his secret polygamy from his wife. Let’s clear his name of such blasphemy so people can know the true Joseph.
@@Kay-mr1qo They don't leave for that reason. That is completely made up.
Faithful people believe he did it because God wanted him to. Why are you making stuff up?
@@Telavian I personally know loads of people who have left due to thinking JS was a pedo or liar. Do you live under a rock? It’s absolutely happening around the globe. They can’t reconcile who they thought he was and who the church claims him to be while trying to call it “carefully worded denials.” Our church history aligns with what anti’s claim about Joseph. God does not command abominable whoredoms for anyone. Raising up seed is to raise a covenant people, not a polygamous people!
@@Telavian one of the main reasons people leave is because they can’t reconcile Joseph’s character if he was deceptively practicing polygamy and openly fighting against it.
Faithful people also believe Joseph was telling the truth and faithful to his one wife. More and more are seeing the evidence and want the church to repent from this false tradition/evil practice so that the church can have God’s full blessings.
It is sad that people don't believe Joseph's innocence simply because they don't believe that so many people would later lie. Yet they ignore the fact that those people either lied in Nauvoo when they signed their names to documents that polygamy wasn't being preached or practiced or they lied in Utah when they blamed polygamy on Joseph. Either way they are liars, either way there was a conspiracy to hide the truth.
Bingo.
To steal man their argument, I learned that they lied because polygamy was against the law. Which sounds a little like the Blues Brothers, Belushi and Akroid being on a "Mission From God".
Also, another problem with the current narrative: it seems none of these purported wives needed the "Holy Spirit of Promise" to perform their marriages and seal them to Joseph, which is ironic, since the current "Holy Spirit of Promise" being Joseph at that time, was at every one of these sealings.
It seems to be a new dude performing every sealing. I'd like to know the level of priesthood these men had when they performed these polygamous marriages, (not that I think that matters, but I believe it adds to the chaos of these accounts.)
This was excellent Karen, thank you! We applauded quite a few times from our couch. Your work is so well done.
Love the mental image of the couch applause, lol - thank you! I get a kick out of Brigham's account of his sister Fanny (who never said a word about being married to Joseph). Sounds like Brigham is claiming he just "sealed" her to Joseph on the spot, apparently against her will, lol. Seriously bizarre, that one.
@@karenhyatt647 really, it's a crazy story.
I’ve wondered this same thing too. If Joseph was the only man authorized to preform sealings, how did Newel K Whitney perform one. Along with several other men. There’s no explanation given for what made that possible.
@@brandiw752Amen to the power and “priesthood “ of that man!! Authority =must be give Permission
I think Ben must be mortified to realize his comments about change coming can be taken to support the “amateur” historians! I loved it! Great Job Karen!
It was so odd, because he literally brought up the totally amateur historian Lester Bush in a positive way and praised his contribution, which was fabulous. And I just have no idea what changes he was alluding to if he wasn't hinting at polygamy. I can't think of anything else the church members would need to buckle up for. 🤔
This is beyond excellent! The tone and “feeling” are perfect and should not feel threatening to orthodox LDS because you kept it factual and historical, instead of an attack against our current church and leaders, which I appreciate. This is an exposition that I can feel comfortable sharing with all my LDS friends. Thank you for all your hard work.
I appreciate that so much, Wild! The vast majority of my friends have agreed with me that it's really good news. I hope yours will, too!
I always acknowledge that it opens up a can of worms regarding Brigham, but most people agree that that can was already halfway open anyway, lol.
CONCISE, Well Organized, Comprehensive, & To The Point. Just the facts, ma'am. THANK YOU KAREN!
I appreciate that so much - thank you!
Praying for you and your efforts! I love the introductory quote about truth. It gave me Chills! (The good kind)
I love that quote, too!. Clark said even more along those lines, but he eventually decided that he had to choose between reason and faith. He seemed afraid that he'd have to throw out everything if he chose to reason things out. I don't think he could fathom that some parts could be right and some wrong. Dang!!
Anyone else try to like the video more than once?
Thank you Karen for the work you did for this! You did a great Job.
I would love to see Brian Hales or any church historian try and argue the evidence you have presented. And by argue, I mean use evidence more than just “life was different back then”, “people forgot dates after so many years”, ”it was acceptable to lie for the Lord in public.” Use evidence that stands up in court and doesn’t just sweep the obvious under the rug. Just some of the things Brigham Young said about women and polygamy in public makes me want to vomit. If I only had his words to go off of and nothing else, I would still see polygamy as an abomination. With all the evidence and contradictions now available, it’s clear it was not of God.
There were so many times while putting this together that I threw up my hands and wailed, "This should be a FOUR-MINUTE VIDEO!! Look at what these guys said....OUT LOUD!!!" 😂 One time, I just had to leave the house and take a walk. My neighbor was on her porch and asked what I was up to. I poured out my lamentations. She and her husband looked into it, and now they understand, too. Stuff like that is what kept me working.....
@@karenhyatt647 I love this so so much. Thank you for the work you are doing. It is healing lives, and taken in a spirit of humility, strengthening testimonies of the scriptures and true gospel doctrine.
Maybe you guys could do a video together? Has he done any videos talking with people who recognize this evidence?
@@monicafoster5839 Thank you, Monica!
@@bonniewayne3223 This sister had him on her podcast hoping to talk about his interpretation of the evidence, but instead he brought a PowerPoint presentation about how people who don't believe the traditional narrative are usually excommunicated. It was pretty disappointing. :(
th-cam.com/video/mpLBtTg4AzE/w-d-xo.html
So exciting to see so many coming to the truth. God bless all those working to bring the truth to light. Loved the quote at the beginning.
This is so good, Karen!! You're amazing! ❤
Thank you! And, oh my word, I couldn't have done the website without Adrian's help - thank you, thank you!!
This was a great video summary!
Even as an ExMormon atheist, I greatly appreciate the discussions happening within these groups. As someone who values discovering and believing as many true things as I can, the deep exploration and verification of the historical records, the evidence, and reviewing all the data is incredibly encouraging and worthwhile.
Wow, Marcus, what a generous thing to say. I wish I could triple-like your comment - it really means a lot. Thank you.
Marcus, even if you are calling yourself an atheist, your desire to engage and seek truth tells me that you are open to receiving what the Lord has for you. I do not judge anyone's path or walk with God.
What is sad, is that the polygamy narrative and so called doctrine is not founded in truth, thus it demotes faith in God. It changes how people view God and men and women.
I have hope that one day, yet another faith demoting rumor will be jettisoned. Funny how many of those originated with Brigham Young.
@@BridgeBuilder-x4c I’m totally open to the idea of god revealing himself to me.
And for context, polygamy was an issue for me while I was a believing member, for sure. It’s hard for it not to be. I remember my dad telling me about the brief history of it when I was 12-13 years old and the overwhelming feelings of betrayal, confusion, and rejection were very strong.
However, there were other items/issues/claims that caused the idea of the restoration’s truthfulness unconvincing. However, I’m open to being wrong.
@@marcuschristensen1883I like your honesty. May God bless your journey .
@@marcuschristensen1883 There is no gospel question so sacred that we should not feel safe asking about. Even the existence of God should not be a question we fear asking. Ask anything you want. I will see if I can help.
You won't get a reflexive, dogmatic answer from me.
I know there are problems in the Church's history, and that a lot of fig leaves have been applied rather than seeking the grace of Jesus Christ and owning up to it.
But, I also know what was done wrong or right in the past is not of our current leaders making.
The problem is, they are stuck wondering how to fix it.
Polygamy for example is a goliath
But the whole Israelite army feared.
But all it took was one David with faith in the Living God and one smooth stone guided by the Lord to take out Goliath.
Just finished and this is incredible, the perfect video to share with anyone who is newer to this discussion and wants to better understand the opposing sides point of view. As a potential future video, it would be amazing to see a breakdown of every contemporary source of evidence for the Smiths polygamy. The new book Secret Covenants provides a detailed chart of these claims.
I hope our leaders watch this. Thank you
I find polygamy so degrading to women.
I think I will find a way to get this to our stake president - he loves Joseph! And is very Christ centered.
@@karieberry1070
Thank you, I’m in Australia and have a very serious health issue, so I’m struggling
I’m hoping the leaders will look at this, we csn pray they, will prayer is so powerful.
Well done! Very thorough for presenting an overview of so much information.
Regarding the women who claimed to be Joseph Smith’s wives by providing affidavits and more, I also keep in mind that these women had gone through the temple ceremony of the time, and were under covenant to obey their husbands, most of whom were also church leaders. If their husbands/priesthood leaders were asking them to provide the needed proof to connect Joseph to polygamy, even if they had to make some things up to do so, I wonder what choice they would feel they had?
This was absolutely fantastic! Perfectly timed counter view of the new Brigham propaganda film recently released.
Film?
What film?? Did I miss something? Who released it?
Wut. I need to see that....! What's it called?
I think he’s referring to the film about the succession crisis? There’s a digital billboard on I-15 and one of the ads is for a new Mormon movie about the succession crisis, in favor of Brigham Young.
@ThomasFackrell Who made it? The historians 🤣. I'll have to look into it
1:01:15 compare D&C 132:61 and Jacob 1:15. It is wicked practice to even desire many wives and concubines.
Thanks for pointing out that scripture! Powerful trifecta with verse 22 of Section 42.
Excellent presentation of source material and facts. Joseph, Emma, and Hyrum told the truth and fought polygamy. Thank you for this credible resource.
Really love having a concise way to share evidence that Joseph Smith is innocent of the allegations of polygamy. Having spent over a year looking at evidence and hearing the debates and reading every scripture on the topic--it's nice to have a "go to" place for people to see a large sampling of misrepresentations.
Thank you all for all your effort.
I don't know what the Church will do with this, but it feels like cloud 9 to not be burdened with it!
Right with ya - it feels like a burden has been lifted. Thank you! 💜
It’s tragic what so many of these women went through because of this abominable doctrine.
My poor grandmothers!!! So much trauma!! And their daughters !! And us !! We all need therapists - or Jesus 🥰😅🙏
So plainly and clearly set out. Thank you, Karen.
Very thorough and well put together!
I don't know why any LDS scholar, person, member etc., would find this not to be 100% true. The men back then - namely Brigham Young, Heber C. Kimball, Orson Pratt and the others in high positions remind me a bit of Chad Daybell - just fat, old, bald men who think they are somehow special and can have as many wives or have sex with multiple women because they have special powers and keys. This documentary is such an eye opener, and so well presented! I'm so happy Joseph and Emma are getting a voice, this should be shared with everyone and everywhere!! Our gospel was never founded on polygamy, its a dirty stain brought about by nasty old men, and I hope they will be accountable for all the pain and suffering they caused so many women!
I'm sure they will be, and I'm pretty sorry for them. Gwendolyn Wyne pointed out that Brigham lost his mother at a young age and lost his first wife early on as well. I wonder if he suffered from feelings of abandonment. Who knows. But it stirred up some compassion in me, and I was thankful. I really like your comment about giving Joseph & Emma a voice. It's sad that they've been squelched for so long - thank heavens we're now able to look at what they actually said. Thank you for the kind words! 💜
Yup, and karen will gladly help you leave the lds church
Thank you, thank you, thank you. Well done. God bless us all as this information rolls out.
-Many don't know that Willard Richards is Brigham's cousin.
-That Brigham claimed having a vision regarding polygamy while on his mission in England before Joseph ever allegedly presented polygamy to him. Yet later Brigham would claim he desired death when Joseph presented polygamy to him.
-William Clayton, Willard Richards, Heber Kimball were all with Brigham in England when he had that vision. (thick as thieves)
-William Clayton's Manchester Journal page 145. April 25th 1840. William Clayton defends Jacob and David having many wives. Completely contrary to Jacob in the Book of Mormon
They hatched their plan for polygamy in England with no oversight or influence from Joseph. They brought women from England to America, some leaving their husbands and arriving destitute and susceptible to the lies of these men, as a means of survival. Joseph put a stop to it (why would he do that if he was involved) Joseph instituted the RS in part to protect these women from men who would use their desperate situation to seduce them (again why would he do it if he was involved?) As soon as Joseph died Brigham shut down the RS and as stated in this video took many plural wives while still in Nauvoo even though Nauvoo was so dangerous the Mormons had to flee. How does this make any sense? Joseph was jailed and killed as a result of the Expositor revealing his alleged polygamy. Polygamy was allegedly kept secret to avoid persecution. Yet after polygamy being exposed and Joseph's killed Brigham and Heber felt safe enough to take multiple wives. Mind-blowing, unless your research has revealed the truth then it all makes sense.
Ok, so Hyrum was there on July 12th when 132 was supposedly received, and yet Brigham claims he wasn't an insider and didn't know about this "principle".... riiiight .... it's obvious who's lying, those that believed in "lying for the Lord", not those who never changed their position on the matter.
Right?? Soooo implausible!
@@Kristy_not_Kristine great point! They can’t have it both ways. Their narrative is crumbling
Powerful and concise truths! Thanks for sharing!
Thank YOU for watching!
Amazing job with such complex historical narratives!!
Thank you!!
This video is going to be the catalyst for many people choosing to “repent and come unto me and be baptized in my name and know of the true points of my doctrine, that they may be numbered among my people” LDS 3 Nephi 21:6
You really think so? Understanding polygamy was wrong is going to be a catalyst to bring people to God? I don't see it. 99.99% of the world already knows polygamy is wrong.
I’d like to hope that would be true, but as long as the institutional church continues with the narrative that 132 is inspired revelation given by God to Joseph Smith, I don’t see how many will trust, believe or be baptized. 😢
Very well done. And it makes sense! So much of traditional beliefs and excuses for polygamy never felt right, especially for women. This strengthens my testimony in Joseph Smith. It’s too bad that this false teaching wasn’t addressed and condemned by leaders decades ago. It’s amazing that we’re in the year 2024 and still not hearing our leaders explain that it was wrong then and forever will be, even if that means bad mouthing those past leaders that promoted it. It’s okay, and would be a relief, to hear our current prophet just say they were wrong and caused decades of harm to the church that continues today. I REALLY hope this gets addressed to the church worldwide.
Agree 100% Audrey! I really hope we can put this behind us, and the sooner the better. It really is still causing harm as an unnecessary stumbling block to sincere seekers of truth.
I'm staying in the church waiting for the leaders to repent and correct the D&C by eliminating section 132.
SO FANTASTIC - Thank you for all the time and expertise and inspiration you put into this important documentary!
Aww, thank YOU!
Wow, awesome Karen, you did a wonderful job presenting the truth that the saints that came West who entered polygamy were filled with lies, lies and more lies. These "lies" are the "foundation" of Brigham Church, Its not the Lords Church, its Brigham's Church and the Lord has this to say about it:
Behold, I am Alpha and Omega, even Jesus Christ.
61 Wherefore, let all men beware how they take my name in their lips-
62 For behold, verily I say, that many there be who are under this condemnation, who use the name of the Lord, and use it in vain, having not authority.
63 Wherefore, let the church repent of their sins, and I, the Lord, will own them; otherwise they shall be cut off.
64 Remember that that which cometh from above is sacred, and must be spoken with care, and by constraint of the Spirit; and in this there is no condemnation, and ye receive the Spirit through prayer; wherefore, without this there remaineth condemnation.
(Doctrine and Covenants | Section 63:60 - 64) Revelation given August 1831
And your minds in times past have been darkened because of unbelief, and because you have treated lightly the things you have received-
55 Which vanity and unbelief have brought the whole church under condemnation.
56 And this condemnation resteth upon the children of Zion, even all.
57 And they shall remain under this condemnation until they repent and remember the new covenant, even the Book of Mormon and the former commandments which I have given them, not only to say, but to do according to that which I have written-
(Doctrine and Covenants | Section 84:54 - 57) Revelation given Sept 22 1832
For the kingdom of the devil must shake, and they which belong to it must needs be stirred up unto repentance, or the devil will grasp them with his everlasting chains, and they be stirred up to anger, and perish;
20 For behold, at that day shall he rage in the hearts of the children of men, and stir them up to anger against that which is good.
21 And others will he pacify, and lull them away into carnal security, that they will say: All is well in Zion; yea, Zion prospereth, all is well-and thus the devil cheateth their souls, and leadeth them away carefully down to hell.
22 And behold, others he flattereth away, and telleth them there is no hell;
(Book of Mormon | 2 Nephi 28:19 - 22)
Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!
25 Wo be unto him that crieth: All is well!
(Book of Mormon | 2 Nephi 28:24 - 25)
What song did the Saints sing on the way WEST to SLC Utah? "Come Come Ye Saints" "All is well," All is well." This is fulfillment of prophecy from our own Book of Mormon! I hope the Church repents, if not collectively at least individually! I am still a member and have repented of propagating the lie that the prophet Joseph Smith was a teacher and practiced polygamy and that D&C 132 is false doctrine and is not in harmony with D&C 42 "embracing the law of the church," that man should only have one wife and cleave unto her and none else!
The hearts of the children shall turn to the promises made to the fathers! Great job.
Great thought!
I have watched this several times. Thank you so much for compiling and presenting this so clearly. It has given me a lot of validation for my suspicions for years.
Thank you for that, Adrienne - that's the comment I get over and over as I share this in my ward and stake. Most say that polygamy had never sat right with them, and the truth makes so much more sense and squares better with what we know about Joseph. Thanks for watching & sharing! 💜
Such an amazing presentation here. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. Lovely compilation of so many sources.
Aww, thank you so much - I really appreciate that!
Karen , I appreciate your thorough and honest research in sharing the historical facts that shed great light on this divisive subject that has brought so much pain and suffering to many. I pray that the leadership of the church and the church historical department will have the integrity to address the accurate history and exonerate Joseph Emma and Hyrum.
Me too, Renee! I know it will take a lot of courage for them to reexamine this, but it will be so worth it. I turned it into a professionally printed booklet for them, since I figured they'd prefer that format. I knew there was little chance of meeting with the leaders themselves, so I intended to hand deliver it to their secretaries. And, in fact, I realized it was probably better that way, so I've been super excited. Imagine my surprise to learn that I can't even set up an appointment with the SECRETARIES without my stake president requesting it first!!! What in the world?? I'll talk to him in the next day or two, and we'll go from there. So this will not be as easy as I thought. But God will provide a way. Prayers please!
@@karenhyatt647 Wow! What a process!! Please keep us all updated.. I am very interested to hear what they say. I will definitely be praying 🙏 for you and all those involved . I failed to mention in my first message that the work you put in with the affidavits was incredible Karen! How in the world can the historical department use them as proof is beyond comprehension!! God bless!
@@Renee-47Thank you for the prayers! And yes, seriously!! What a shock to see the flimsy evidence that this has been based on for over 150 years! 😱
Amazing!!!!! What a monumental and important work you’ve done!!
This was beautifully done ❤ thank you for giving voice to the women!
I do however wish we could get rid of the bad explanation for Jacob 2:30.
It really is quite simple. 29&30 are the peak of the chiasm so there are two thought forms in each verse that mirror one another.
#1) If God will call people to be HIS people then he will give them commandments.
#2) if said people choose to disobey God’s commands, then God will curse them.
We don’t need to break the chiasm to make sense of verse 30 nor do we need to reach back 7 verses to define what “these things” means because the definition comes from the verse before.
Great comment, I believe it’s more simple than we often make it. You really just need to read verses 29 and 30 together and it’s clear that 30 is just reaffirming what 29 just said, and then 31-35 explain the why.
@@Commenter2121 yes! Exactly!
25-29 are the what of the chiasm and 30-34 are the why. Thank you 🙏🏼
THESE THINGS refers to 3 sins. If people want to say that the Lord sometimes authorizes polygamy, he is also authorizing the other too. Ridiculous to cherry pick out that verse.
@@BridgeBuilder-x4c I don’t see that fitting in with the rules of English. Thank you for sharing your opinion.
@@BridgeBuilder-x4c and I agree that for people to think it’s an allowance to do the opposite of what else was preached throughout the rest of the chapter is nonsense.
This is fabulous. Thank you!
Thanks so much!
Wow. Amazing work and compilation. Thank you.
Heavenly Father has allowed the grossest injustice to stand for two millennia - that of the slander and execution of His Son. Should we be surprised that in the restoration of all things, He has allowed another gross injustice to stand uncorrected for 2 centuries?
Time is up for both injustices, of which one is but a type and shadow of the other.
" time is up" that phrase hit me hard, ... in a good way :-)
You missed that the term "these things" or "this thing" was repeated 5 other times in Jacob 2. All refering to abominations of some kind.
VERY TRUE. If you believe there is a polygamy loophole, you have to accept the Lord is authorizing all the other names sins as well.
This is high school English.
Now we seem to have woke English--twist it to suit the narrative.
Nice work! Thank you 🙏
I really appreciate that!
Karen, thank you so much for your incredible work here. I found myself overcome with gratitude and simultaneous sorrow as I listened to you spotlight the women who lived in the system. Thank you for sharing their stories.
The truth of this subject is so important, even today. The pain and fear of polygamy is still silently living in the hearts of many faithful women.
Thank you so much for the kind words. It's a horrific thing to have on the horizon, yet so many of us have laid it on the altar, so to speak. I feel like this is our ram in the thicket, and it's such good news. But yes...those poor women who lived this way. I hope they're cheering us on.
Thank you for this wonderful resource and all of the links to sources. Truly a work of faith and love to all who seek truth. ❤
Thanks so much! And thank you for appreciating the links - that was a bit of work! 😅💜
Holy crap this was so good!
Oh my gosh! Thank you. I felt that for a long time, the history was not totally accurate 😪
Right?? I hear that constantly when I share this with friends!
Great job on this documentary Karen! All your research is much appreciated to reveal the truth. ♥️👍👏
Brilliant! Well researched and well put together.
I appreciate that!
Fabulous work! Bless you for your efforts and research.
Joseph is an honest man, thank you.
Yes!! This is what we need! I’m so glad you included all your sources and showed the documents 📃 on the screen!
Anyone who honestly studies these sources will be able to wipe the mud of the windshield and see an honest and monogamous Jospeh Smith.
I think you have beautifully presented content that others have tried and failed to present in a clear and concise digestible manner.
We as members have some very hard choices ahead if this material is true.
I've seen so many great videos & wanted to grab the most compelling parts from several of them. Thanks!
I love this presentation!! Thank you so much! It makes so much sense! Joseph is the Prophet of the Restoration and I believe him and Emma, Hyrum, Sam and William. God bless!
@@supereverything3636 Thanks so much, Super! If you run into anyone with questions about Joseph and polygamy, be sure to share it with them! 💜 (Oh and if you share the website - JosephToldTheTruth[dot]org - I think they can watch it there without all the lame ads.)
Great job on two big mistakes by Clayton, his August 1843 journal entry about the Partridge sisters and his contradictory accounts regarding who took section 132 to Emma. I’ve been trying to point these out and they are generally dismissed by the pro polygamy crowd. Very telling though when you consider the overall narrative.
They are not exclusive events, it is reasonably like there were more than one conversation
@@whatsup3270 You aware of his contradictions on who took 132 to Emma the day it was written?
@@Commenter2121 it’s not a mutually exclusive set of events
@@whatsup3270 So Joseph can stay in the office with Clayton and take the revelation to Emma with Hyrum at the same time? It’s important because it’s one of many contradictions regarding the provenance of 132. Clayton’s contemporary entry is the one that says they both went, he wrote the entry that day so he certainly shouldn’t have got that detail wrong. So why does the church tell this other story based on his later story?
@@Commenter2121 it is not based on William Clayton and never was. Think about this with some logic. The bad claim is Joseph needed to dictate the revelation to William so William could given a written copy to Joseph so Joseph would know the revelation( that is looney) cont
Thank You for all of your hard work! Excellent video.
Awesome job and a well presented piece.. love your documentary!!!
Thanks!!
Absolutely fantastic. Thank you to everyone who is working to do away with this wicked false tradition.
Thank you so much for showing us all of this, sister! Brian Hales is dishonest!
I'm grateful to hear about the wives and the stories surrounding their "affidavits." Patty Sessions is one of my ancestors and it is interesting to find out her journal contained a leaflet with the info about Joseph, not that it was written in there originally.
One other piece of evidence about Joseph and Emma's feelings on monogamy is the old hymnbook compiled by Emma. In that book there is a "section" on Marriage that contains only one song. It is so beautiful about Adam and Eve and explains the whole plan about husband and wife cleaving to each other. It has been included in the RLDS hymnbook for sometime I believe.
th-cam.com/video/Xir3kxPmGng/w-d-xo.htmlsi=uGOarZupgvfWR2Y9
Very cool - I didn't know about that hymn. I'm anxious to look at that - thanks!
You've probably already read it, but here's a link to the book of Patty's diary entries:
digitalcommons.usu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1092&context=usupress_pubs
(The inserted pages are shown on p. 277.)
Very nice compilation of information. I wonder if the LDS administration will audit this information officially and correct the historical record or sweep it under the rug.
Thank you. I'm praying they'll take a look at the information for themselves. I'm preparing a written version in case they're not into watching a video made by some rando, which I can understand, lol. Here's hoping....🙏
Ha! A godly person would evaluate information based on the content rather than some appeal to "authority". Look at the descriptions of Jesus Christ given in Mosiah 14:2-3 such as despised and esteemed not, nor beauty that we should desire him, etc. I certainly don't think your some rando, and neither should they.
@@tinkeringengr Here's hoping!!!
12 minutes in and I can tell this is going to be fantastic!
It truly is so good!
@@amandadangerfieldpiano Aww...thank you so much. 💜