It may not be the longest or most complex interchange, but the few times I have transferred between Euston Square and Euston it always seems to be raining.
The early London underground layout was a model of passenger inconvenience and has provided an almost constant stream of employment for engineers, planners and commentators for the last hundred years as improvements were made piecemeal. That's why it continues to be so fascinating. Thanks for this illuminating study - you are the grist to our collective mill.
I feel like New York subway was the same and they never bothered to try and unify stuff. The amount of similar names stations or unidirectional entry / exits there is infuriating
@@sams3015 I heard one of the metrostations in New York Manhattan where so big and crowded they simply put a wall in middle of it and split the station into 2.
Damn, are you saying that individualism and a society based wholly in the accumulation of wealth is less efficient and desirable than a collectivist society based wholly on advancing the needs of all?
A couple of years back two mates and I headed to London for a day train spotting. We arrived at King's Cross and were going across to Euston first stop to see the sleepers coaches and class 92s. They said "We will get the tube". I replied "No thanks, nothing against the tube, but I will walk and still beat you." Which I went and did, standing at the top of the escalators at Euston station waiting for them, and to really rub it in, I then showed the photos I took in St. Pancras on the platforms.
I love striding purposefully out of Euston to Euston Square on my way to Liverpool Street, feeling like the superior member of the London Underground cognoscenti I am.
What I like about Jago’s videos is that they’re basically short podcasts. As lovely as the visuals are, they’re not often that important to the narrative. Maybe Jago should also publish these as short podcasts too.
Euston Square station wasn't always called so, from its opening on the Metropolitan Railway in 1863 until 1907, it was called Gower Street. It was renamed to make passengers aware of its close proximity to Euston station. Even closer to Euston Square than Euston is Warren Street station on the Northern and Piccadilly Lines but again with no direct interchange facilities. Kind regards, David, Crouch End, N8
On our recent visit to London, we took a day trip up to Bletchley Park via Euston station. Our "home" tube station was Barbican, so of course we took the Circle/HammCity/Metropolitan line train to Euston Square. It wasn't a terrible walk around the block to Euston, and based on the crowded sidewalk it isn't an unpopular interchange. It did give us an opportunity to go around the block the *other* way to get an obligatory photo of Speedy's Sandwich Shop.
Thanks for answering a question that someone who had Euston for 25+ years commuting from Rugby without knowing! I think the whole station should be called Euston after the work is complete.
I think the point about the psychological point of Euston and Euston Square being distinct is the key point. The change in station from the Piccadilly and Victoria lines at Green Park might be longer than Euston Square to Euston but psychologically it is further. BTW I treat an interchange at Bank as separate stations as it is usually quicker and easier to go to pavement level and re-enter.
The change of lines at Green Park station is such a long walk! The walk between wood Lane station and white city station to change lines is a quicker walk than changing at Green Park.
@@mbrady2329 that’s useful to know 😉. My tip? If you want the mainline station when alighting from the Victoria Line at King’s Cross, do not follow the official signage. It’s a tortuously long route. Instead, be in the last carriage of a Northbound VL train (or first carriage of a Southbound one) and go up the escalators to the original tube ticket hall, pass through the barriers & turn right, then right again at the staircase that brings you to the front of the station. Quicker in particular if you’re headed for a mainline train and know from the National Rail Enquiries app which platform it is departing from. Only use the signed route to the Northern ticket hall if your train is leaving from Platforms 9 or 10
@@mbrady2329 that’s useful to know 😉. My tip? If you want the mainline station when alighting from the Victoria Line at King’s Cross, do not follow the official signage. It’s a tortuously long route. Instead, be in the last carriage of a Northbound VL train (or first carriage of a Southbound one) and go up the escalators to the original tube ticket hall, pass through the barriers & turn right, then right again at the staircase that brings you to the front of the station. Quicker in particular if you’re headed for a mainline train and know from the National Rail Enquiries app which platform it is departing from. Only use the signed route to the Northern ticket hall if your train is leaving from Platforms 9 or 10
I've had to change at Euston for Euston Square for years now. If you've been staying overnight somewhere and have heavy baggage, you're hungry and it's a cold winter night outside, and you have to navigate the frequently chaotic traffic and poor crossing systems outside, it's... definitely a faff! By comparison, I'd rather do the Bank-Monument interchange (although to be fair, I don't have to do that often, I might change my tune if I did). I'll still use it to get to Liverpool Street ahead of any other option, though. I may find the experience cumbersome, but I'm not that desperate to avoid it.
When I lived in Clayhall, it was more easier to go to Gants Hill station than Barkingside, even though the latter was nearby. It’s because Barkingside station was situated in an obscure place where public transport and shops are not located and you have to walk quite considerably to find one, whereas Gants Hill as you know is easy to get public transport and there are shops close by.
Interesting as always. A lot of, shall we say, the 'quirks' of New York City's Subway system are because the 'system' was never designed as such. There were three independent companies, I think, plus the then-privately owned commuter rail companies.
Euston Station is connected to Euston Square by a bus route, you don't have to walk, if you don't want to walk, expect to cross a road at the lights. Once I was on a Metropolitan line train that was failing due to power issues. So I helped several people who wanted to get to Liverpool Street Station, to follow me and my younger brother and get a bus to Tottenham Court Road Station from Euston Square, on to the Central Line to Liverpool Street Station. We all got there over fifteen minutes, before our delayed train, crucial when catching a mainline train.
In my last trip to London, I was coming in from Paris, flying home from Luton and midway through my London stay, I had a day planned with a Northern English friend to meet half way at Birmingham. So wanted to be in the King’s Cross area . Anyway in that entire week of staying in London, I never realised I was using Euston proper UG station and Euston Square Station. It wasn’t until the very last day I notified they were totally different stations 😖
I travel to Liverpool (Lime Street - not Street) every week from Wimbledon. I always get the train to Euston Square and then walk to Euston. Much more relaxing than changing at Victoria.
Indeed, but the point is valid. If I'm in a place where I really need to mute my phone, then these videos with subtitles are a great watch. Conversely, if I can only listen (like when walking), they work equally well as audio-only podcasts.
As an infrequent visitor, I've always been aware that it is easy to get between Euston Square and the mainline station but most of my onward journeys need the deep tubes. I've probably used Euston Square 3 times in the last 40 years. It would be a good idea to rename it to Euston once the corridor opens.
interesting how because of the names they're thought of as very close, while Warren Street and Euston square are still only about 200m apart on street level for a quieter interchange
If we were France they'd have joined them all up in the 1970s when building a Crossrail type line from Euston to Victoria and we'd have a Euston Warren Gower Battle of Waterloo type name for it (based on how the Metro does things!)
A wonderful explanation. I haven’t even thought of Euston Square since the early 1970’s when as a student teacher I used to take the tube from there to far off Dagenham to go to Abb’s Cross school in the mornings.
By 2040, all of London's stations will be connected by underground moving walkways. These walkways will be organised into "lines" to help people navigate. The lines will converge on localised transport hubs, all called Eustons, and ultimately trains will be built to allow easy connection between the Eustons.
Another fun Tube trick is coming in to London at Waterloo East, walking against the crowd to Southwark for a Jubilee Line train that manages to then leave London Bridge before people have been able to cover the distance from above ground.
Just a thought about Euston and Euston Square station names when the interconnection occurs (he he). Keep both names and use alternately named roundels and signs “Euston for Euston Square” and “Euston Square for Euston”.
Connecting between Euston Sq and Euston (mainline) was one of the first things I ever did in London. Totally bewildered, jet lagged, heavy suitcase in tow, I had to wait (read: loiter) around Euston for a few hours before my train to Manchester.
yes there is not a lot to do in Euston . Personally I would get off at Russell Square , walk back toward Holborn for the book shops and eateries, then back up the other side of the road , past the Russell Square itself past the BMA building and hope to cross the Euston Road at street level in one peice should I be running early, there is precious little north of Euston to do (that is not illegal or imoral)
Oh, Jago. Your videos are never a waste of time. I do change from Euston to Euston Square fairly regularly, and used to do so extremely frequently, because it's convenient to get home. It's quite a pleasant stroll if it isn't raining. Incidentally, you briefly mentioned the original owners of Euston Station in the video. One thing I would be interested in seeing you do is a series of videos on the history of London's major main line rail stations. For example, why do trains to West Sussex, Hampshire and Dorset depart from Waterloo, yet those to East Sussex and Kent leave from Victoria, which is west of Waterloo? (I imagine ownership by different companies is involved.) Why do so many, if not all, trains that leave Charing Cross stop at London Bridge? Etc., etc.
I used to go to the uch hospital, from Finsbury park, change at kings cross to get to Euston sq. Like an idiot I could've just continued on the Vic line to Warren street which was literally a few minutes walk from the hospital. Only realised years afterwards.
Not a direct answer to the question, but sometimes I prefer to leave a train terminus and use a different entrance to the tube to the in-station entrance, for example, at London Bridge. There's the opportunity for a short walk in the fresh air and sunlight to the entrance in Borough High Street, which is usually much less crowded than the ticket hall and gate lines beneath London Bridge station .
I didn't know they were building a tunnel to Euston Square! They could then extend that tunnel to link in the nearby Warren Street, thereby giving you the option to bypass Euston at busy times and creating an octopus-like interchange on the map. I live in hope!
Very interesting video. As someone who worked on and off (mostly on) in that area the new link would have been most welcome. Also, some kind of escalator/ travelator/passage link from Warren Street to Euston Square would be a boon both for interchange and reducing the number of pedestrians negotiating the Tottenham Court Rd and Euston Rd junction. As for the new name just call it Euston.
I only quite recently noticed the dotted lines on Tube maps which denote easily walkable gaps between separate stations! Perhaps a video on those which are but shouldn't be or those which should be but aren't would be entertaining or informative!
A more convenient idea (for which read expensive) would be to build a new Met station directly adjacent to Euston mainline station and close Euston Square née Gower Street. No, I'm not expecting it to happen either.
It sort of is adjacent; at least the platforms are. The problem is that the entrance is as far away from the mainline station as it’s possible for it to be. On Gower Street, in fact…
I often use Euston Square tube station instead of Euston tube station as it's only 5 minutes from the mainline station and much easier if traveling to Paddington or Liverpool Street. Also it's interesting to note that Euston Square was renamed from Gower Street in 1909. Did the Metropolitan realise that they were losing traffic to the LNWR's city terminus at Broad Street and rename it in an attempt to regain some of the traffic?
I seem to remember changing from the Bank branch of the Northern to the Charing Cross branch always seemed such a trek, I stopped bothering and often walked (overground) from St Pancras to Euston, or all the way from St P's down to Charing Cross instead. The Euston changeover is interesting watching the sign length diminish the closer to the Ch X platform you go.
I mistook the North side entrance to Euston Square for a Public Toilet before the illuminated sign was put there, all you used to see as you walked towards Euston BR was a Staircase with Black Railings.
I've always used Euston Square as an interchange from Euston mainline, In fact until a few years ago I would often use it instead of Euston tube completely as I felt the inconvenience of a short walk largely outweighed the overcrowded ticket hall at Euston where busy queues flooded ticket machines as oppose to the rather quiet nature of Euston Square (yes, I even did this for journeys that may have been slightly easier on the Vic or Northern, although not if it put me more than 15 minutes out of my way). I think if (or when) the stations are eventually connected, Renaming Euston Square to plain 'Euston' and just signposting it as a way to the Sub Surface lines is a far more logical idea, as it would actively encourage people less familiar with the network to use it, if you see a signpost for a station with a different name (no matter how easy it is to get to), it may make people feel less confident to use it.
Euston and Euston Square, a bit like Bank and Monument? Incidentally, the latest pocket map shows a dotted (walk) link between the two so it's not a secret! I'm sure there are more... Jago will know
I just posted a similar comment without reading this - there's also a dotted line between Northwick Park and Kenton... a walk I do several times a week!
I always do the walk from Euston Square. A tunnel to Euston would be handy. I think TfL do draw attention to the closeness of Euston Square. The map has the dotted lines on it and the carriage announcements announce the possibility.
about time as you might have seen from the Camden Plan I sent you a while back the Crossrail 2 is already planned to link Euston with St Pancras as is the way with the Elizabeth line between Liverpool St & Moorgate
I used to change from Euston Square to Euston every morning as part of my commute from Ruislip to Milton Keynes (a temporary posting that was meant to be 6 months long but lasted 18 months). I hated the change so much that on the way home I went from Milton Keynes to Watford Junction, then to Harrow & Waldstone, bus to Harrow-on-the-Hill and then Metropolitan line to Ruislip! All that for 18 months. And this was before the built the lifts to the street on the south side. Instead we came up into an MI5 building on the corner of Gower Street. Because of this I prefer the name "Gower Street", but if the two stations are joined (and I believe the plan is for a new ticket office at the East end of the platform and so closer to Euston) then "Euston" makes more sense than "Euston & Euston Square".
Keep up the good work Jago. I'm surprised you failed to mention the old gag about "Euston - we have a problem". Perhaps you think it's been done to death - but that doesn't usually stop you 🙂
I like tunnels in much the same way that I like trains and bridges. There doesn't have to be a reason! I will take a longer walk to use one, especially one I haven't used recently. I used to live in Montreal, and enjoyed the challenge of avoiding going outdoors all day.
My answer to all your questions at the end is ‘buggered if I know’ Mister H but I do know that the Hidden London tour of Euston starts at the entrance to Euston Square station. There’s lots of abandoned tunnels and passageways down there which is rather cool.
1:58 in my experience, that concept still hasn't reached bus services outside of London in 2022. I was asking staff at the Glasgow subway how the ticketing works, and apparently nothing is integrated into anything, there's the subway and there are different bus companies who all do their own thing.
Great video (as always) Jago! Alas, I think you've overlooked a major point. Euston Square was originally named/sited as GOWER STREET so never really a Euston 'link' station. By the way, there are still a very few original Gower Street features at platform level if you know where to look! Thanks again 🙂
Having just read a biography of Charlotte Brontë, she writes in one of her letters of travelling by train to London and arriving at "Euston Square Station."
A fantastic video as I was staying at the Euston Hilton a few weeks ago. This gave me a chance to get to know Euston station more intimately than as a child when it was used merely to and from Rugby to the tube and family. I used Euston Square and found it easy considering it was a sunny day.
Thanks, Jago, for another interesting video about the Tube. On trips to London when I was younger I did wonder why Euston ans Euston Square were separate. Regarding your remark about the introduction of travelators to connect some stations which are close together. I'm sure the advantage to both TfL and the travelling public will quickly become apparent.
Whenever I change from Victoria to Circle et al lines, it always seems easier to change at Kings Cross (I'm usually coming from north to south) rather than Euston. Also, I'm never sure if I'm charged more if I leave one station and enter another instead of just changing at a same station - probably not but pricing on the Undergrounds remains an enigma wrapped in a riddle to me. A travelator from Euston to Kings Cross sounds hellish as people often get on these contraptions then promptly forget they have legs.
Same with escalators. Why do people just stand still even when going down. Its like they've got all day. I haven't. I always walk up/down. It wouldn't be as bad if escalators/travelators didn't move so slow. I actually enjoy running on travelators because i can go twice as fast.
We stayed at St Pancras Premier Inn recently to catch the Eurostar next morning, and used Euston Square rather than King's X St. P. Shorter walk. Also used the be the station for the wonderful Bree Loise pub, another victim of HS2 building works. But I have to take issue on one minor point - Bishop's Road is surely the Hammersmith and City/Circle platforms at Paddington. So we South Walians use it a lot, especially since the Circle started being a spiral . . .
Brilliant stuff, Jago and more excellently-presented info in the only way you know how. Thanks for this. Having been a student at UCL, I have a fondness for Euston Square. I'm sure the on-board tube maps made the most of the proximity of Euston Square to Euston, so I think an actual subsurface link between the two would be a very good idea, especially if it helps alleviate the overcrowding your video highlighted. Also, with links for Crossrail already employed between Liverpool Street and Moorgate, and between Barbican and Farringdon, why not have a similar link between Euston and Euston Square for when HS2 becomes a reality? 👍🏾👏🏾
I don't think your videos will become obsolete: perhaps a charming reminder of a distant past, like advertisements for livery stables in 19th c. magazines.
05 / 10 /2023 "As part of the now scaled-back proposals, a planned pedestrian tunnel linking Euston station with the nearby Euston Square tube station has also been scrapped." HS2 Welcome to Sunaklad
As a lovestruck teenager I would travel from Essex (Brentwood specifically) to Wigan (Oral Post if memory serves) and one Friday night my travelling was interrupted by a tractor falling on the line causing all manner of delays. Ergo, I ended up spending my first night sleeping at a train station, first of many, obviously the 16 year old me didn't have any clue how to get home; and I had already been confused about how to get from tube to train.
If the history of all sorts of railways tells us anything, its that competition is not always as beneficial as some would have us believe.Co-operation would have served everyone better here. In fact, one might argue that railway companies and Underground in particular, had to have co-operation forced upon them before they started to work in the interests of passengers. The dilemma is always about whether you are running a service or running a business. The former being for the benefit and interests of users(passengers/customers) and the latter for the benefit and interests of shareholders. For Euston I see joining up all the stations being useful for passengers. Keeping them away from the cars and the weather and making them interchange more easily.
Uhhh... Starting from the end, these stations were built before cars ‘clogged the streets’ so that’s a moot point. Whether its evil corporations, or enlightened state central planners, they would not have realistically been able to build stations suitable for consumer patterns over a century later. Could these stations be improved? Absolutely. But it really is unfair to bemoan the original station builders and the practices they employed for not future proofing their projects centuries after their deaths. But on the competition point, the Underground was already bringing things such as unified fare structures and common signage before the formation of London Transport, years before actually. Transport nerds seeing two stations a couple hundred metres away, and then bemoaning this as being due to ‘competition’ is a tired cliche. We have to ask ourselves why London Transport (or its successors) haven’t rebuilt the Euston stations to be one in their >70 year existence when they have moved railway lines, stations and services all over the shop elsewhere, above or below ground. Could it be that central planners are not as monolithically enlightened as we have been led to believe? That the ‘public’ in ‘public transport’ does not (necessarily) mean ‘state run’? The real problem is the type of people who run our institutions, along with the incentive structure built into those institutions (although corpos and the state are more similar in both regards than a lot may think). Its the people running things, not whether they wear a suit for a corpo, or a state. That matters most.
@@SuperGamerMiner actually, street traffic was worse then than street traffic is today. Mostly carriages, trams and omnibuses rather than cars, but more people, more congestion, and very similar movement patterns and challenges
@@SuperGamerMiner Although the thesis of this video is that is *was* due to competition that the stations are separate and I think Jago's point is a valid one, tired or otherwise.
Obviously, it's to make me carry two large suitcases up a flight of stairs, then drag them a good hundred meters to the station to catch my breath after missing my train.
Thanks for this and I have a few points. Firstly I *do* walk to Euston Square from Euston mainline if my destination warrants it. Also it's nice to avoid the crowded Underground ticket hall at Euston! When the changes associated with HS2 are finally realised I think I'd still prefer the name, Euston Square, to be retained... partly for historical reasons and in any case you still have Bank/Monument, so there's precedent. I'd like to point out an interesting comparison from Madrid if I may? I was there for the first time a few weeks ago. When they redeveloped Atocha station a few years ago, the mainline platforms were moved further south and the original trainshed became a tripocal garden (it's lovely!) As part of this the Metro gained an extra stop, Atocha RENFE, to serve the station more directly. What's interesting (and this must be a very recent development because it doesn't seem to be reflected in online Merro maps) there have been more renamings. The original Atocha Metro is now Estacion del Arte (there are a number of galleries and museums nearby) and Atocha RENFE is now simply Atocha... much more sensible because it's more convenient for the mainline platforms.
It was confusing for tourists who got off at Atocha thinking it was the railway station. Paseo del Arte shows how Madrid has achieved UNESCO world heritage status for the paseo connecting its art galleries. Also the new name Atocha instead of Atocha Renfe for the metro station serving the railway station better reflects the fact that there are French and Italian competitors to Renfe now operating from Atocha station.
@@garethking1639 Yes, of course! I hadn't thought about that aspect of it... indeed it removes any confusion with regards to train operators serving Atocha.
Bizarrely Euston Square means a lot to me. My son was born very unexpectedly and prematurely at UCL while my wife was visiting friends in London. After a nerve wracking day involving a frantic flight to London from Edinburgh I made it in time, and ended up in Euston Square dazed, confused and a father for the first time, trying to find my way back to our friends house. So it may be unassuming and confusing but it will always mean a lot to me!
I remember when I started making regular journeys up to London in the early 70's being somewhat perplexed by this disconnect. I did make the journey between the 2 by foot a couple of times & as others have already commented, the weather was never great! 😱
The other little annoyance that this situation threw up was the lack of a step-free interchange between Euston Square and Euston. When I used this route, I often needed to help people trying to change between the mainline stations, who had trouble getting their luggage up the steps at Euston Square.
In a past life I worked for TfL in the planning/InfraCo part of the business. My portfolio included the proposed footway between Euston Square and the main line station. It was moribund due to sheer number of other services needing to be moved in order to avoid building in stairways to get over gas pipes, under data links and electric cables - not to mention moving sewers and basements. The costs were found to be enormous and nowhere near meeting the criteria for a business case. I'd like to see the gannt chart of how this will be done and how much it will cost.
....Not to mention rumours of 'secret' passageways between the number of Government buildings in the area. Even suggested that when 222 Euston Road was built at the West corner of Euston, and occupied by BR HQ (after moving from 222 Marylebone Road), there was said to be a connection to the tunnels from the basement of the new building. One assumes that if that were true it would have had to have been blocked up when Inmarsat took over the building.
I always thought why was there no connection between Euston and Euston Square, and now is the time to make this possible. A corridor between the two stations make sense as getting between the two stations will make travelling a lot easier for everyone. Looking forward to it.
I only ever pass through the Euston stations, either on the Northern line or the H&C, Circle and Metropolitan lines. The rebuild of Euston station and its new connections sound like a hell of a lot of walking.
But to get to Euston Square, you have to leave Euston - which means looking at the outside of Euston station. And who would want to do that? Will miss crashing my luggage along the crappy pavement between Euston and Kings Cross though.
Victoria as a heliport sounds lit. If I visited the UK and Victoria had a heliport, I'd opt to enter the city in the most glorious way. Yes I love trains, but helicopters are neat machines too y'know
The basic problem with Euston Square is that, like all the first-generation underground lines, the Metropolitan was built cut-and-cover under the main road - Marylebone Road. So it lay significantly south of Euston mainline station which is on the north side of the road. This is less pronounced at Kings Cross St Pancras where the underground walkways have been expanded, although the old Kings Cross Thameslink station was rather remote. Likewise Marylebone itself is not on the Met/Circle/H&C, with Baker Street and Edgware Road the nearest stops, but is on the Bakerloo which being a deep tube could deviate from the surface road system.
Nice episode. I change between Euston and Euston Square all the time as I need to get to Tower Hill. The only thing is, I'm wondering if Bank would be closer as I have to get to Fenchurch Street.
Very interesting videos, thank you oh wise one, I had always wondered why Euston Square and Euston are not connected. I walk between the two, but its very inconvenient and inevitably always seems to be raining hard when I need to do so. A direct connection tunnel would be good. Calling it all Euston (and not burying 'Euston Square') would make sense.
I. used Euston Square frequently when I lived at Southfields on the District Line. One easy(ish) change at Edgware Road. However, recommending this route to a friend visiting from the Northwest led to her taking a long detour via Edgware: she had misunderstood my directions and headed to the Northern Line at Euston rather than the Circle/H&C at Euston Square.
The Bank northern line rebuild early this year meant I used Euston Sq to the Barbican rather than N Line from Euston to Moorgate or Bank, and yes, it is straightforward. And actually much quicker journey (Kings Cross>Angel>Old St takes an age on the Northern Line). The hike down Euston Rd isn't too bad. A direct tunnel to walk down would be terrific. But this, the travellator to St Pancras/KingsX - really? Given slashing of current government spendiing I reckon Crossrail was the last big project for a long while, HS2 likely to be mothballed, and Euston Stn rebuild - instead a facelift to cover up the mess created so far.
Jago The North Metropolitan Railway (later Metropolitan Railway) Bill originally proposed the siting of Euston Square Station with Entrances in Euston Square itself at the other end of the platforms but this was vetoed hence the station name was retained but located Gower Street. The Act of Parliament that was passed (of which I have a copy) did include a provision for a physical link between the Metropolitan Railway and the LNWR at Euston with lifts raising/lowering individual wagons.
At 5:52 "...and this video will be obsolete. That was a waste of time, wasn't it?" There's one bloke in St Paul, MN (whose name is quite similar to mine), who greatly appreciates your keen & ironic sense of humor!
well at least the poor sod traveling from Brussels to the north of England via high speed train, won't have to haul their luggage from St. Pan to Huston. *Sorry: Euston*. Oh, and a subway ACROSS Euston Road? As expected great video, Mr. Hazzard.
The moving walkway between Kings Cross and Euston would be brilliant although a 5 minute walk down Euston road (twice) during my recent outing - was not too much of a hardship as I had no intention of taking the tube for 1 stop.
There is - not exactly a short cut, but - an alternative route which avoids the traffic and congestion along Euston Road. It involves leaving Euston by the side entrance, crossing Eversholt Street and then cutting through the side streets and a housing estate, emerging behind the British Library opposite the Thameslink/Eurostar entrance to St Pancras. But it's slightly complicated and needs better signposting.
Now, now Jago. Your videos are never a waste of time. As for Euston connectivity, wonder why no 1 thought to have an access through the car park to Euston Sq...? Chicago & Boston have such access between transit & airports in the US. A Montdeal hospital kept the "temporary" one established to an adjacent Metro stn after the permanent tunnel opened a year or so ago...
I am fairly familiar with the tube map, but I have very little idea how far apart the stations are in real terms, so it rarely occurs to me to walk from one station to the next. You'd assume from the name that Euston and Euston Square are close together, but there are all kinds of weird naming decisions on the tube that I don't really trust those kind of assumptions either. I agree with the psychological issue though. It feels much further away if you have to leave the station than if there's a corridor/tunnel. And this can lead to scheduling problems, for example if you take the U6 or the U3 to Vienna Westbahnhof, you need around 5 mins to get from the U-Bahn to the main station platforms because it's the other side of the street. There is an underground way to avoid crossing the main road but it's longer and busier so doesn't save much time ultimately - it just feels like it does.
I had to get a train to Scotland from kings cross on the day of Power cuts all over london back in September. I'd normally take the Piccadilly line to get there, but the outage took that out. so I went via Hammersmith/city/circle instead. only to then learn those trains didn't stop at Kings cross due to the outage. that proposed travellator (provided it wouldn't have hypothetically been taken out by the outage) would have been very handy as I had to walk from Euston square all the way to kings cross. Thankfully, I did make the train!
My Dad’s friend used to work at London Euston when HS2 started and I do think that there will be a pedestrian link connecting from Euston main line station to Euston Square underground station that will be built underground and beneath the office blocks. As Euston Square and Euston stations that are 300metres apart and are on Euston Road. And is also easy walk from King’s Cross and St. Pancras International stations if you want to avoid the tube and be healthy and walk from one station to the other. I also remember when me and my dad nearly bumped into now Labour leader Kier Starmer who was visiting a Sainsbury’s Local convenient store at London Euston station. But he was too busy talking with his people and completely ignored me and my dad.
I generally go Wood Lane to Euston Square rather than White City to Euston despite the short walk and less frequent service. The plus side is that I don't have to change, the trains are more pleasant and I have mobile service for most of the journey.
I had no idea about the travelator from Euston to King's Cross. Isaac Asimov imagined a new style of underground system consisting of parallel travelators each going faster than the one next to it, until you got to the main part with seats, running at at least 60mph. This could just be the beginning...
I suspect wayleave was a big factor here. From King's Cross nearly all the way to Paddington the Metropolitan Railway was built under the straight(ish) line formed by the Euston and Marylebone Roads. To take in Euston main line station directly it would have had to make an awkward and very expensive dogleg in its route. On top of that it was originally planned with the convenience of the GWR primarily in mind, and they were probably only too pleased to make access to the LNWR terminus at Euston as inconvenient as possible.
I go to UCL so I've been to both Euston Square and Euston more times than I can count. Very excited for them to be joined up and a travelator to King's Cross will be excellent as well!
![[TH] Esports World Cup : Knockout Stage Day 3](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/t3FcD5TD8qI/mqdefault.jpg)
It may not be the longest or most complex interchange, but the few times I have transferred between Euston Square and Euston it always seems to be raining.
You are right, just whenever I think about Euston station I think about rain
Its only down the road but it feels like forever!
Yes, all my memories of that interchange seem to involve rain or freezing cold, for some reason!
Huh, I love that station because it means the start of our weekend in London and it’s always sunny
I think the issue you've encountered is that both stations are in England.
The early London underground layout was a model of passenger inconvenience and has provided an almost constant stream of employment for engineers, planners and commentators for the last hundred years as improvements were made piecemeal. That's why it continues to be so fascinating. Thanks for this illuminating study - you are the grist to our collective mill.
I feel like New York subway was the same and they never bothered to try and unify stuff. The amount of similar names stations or unidirectional entry / exits there is infuriating
@@sams3015 I heard one of the metrostations in New York Manhattan where so big and crowded they simply put a wall in middle of it and split the station into 2.
Damn, are you saying that individualism and a society based wholly in the accumulation of wealth is less efficient and desirable than a collectivist society based wholly on advancing the needs of all?
I'd like the old name .. Gower Street!
@@caramelldansen2204 Nah. Not really. And, by the way, what are the "needs of all"? And, who decides what those needs are?
A couple of years back two mates and I headed to London for a day train spotting. We arrived at King's Cross and were going across to Euston first stop to see the sleepers coaches and class 92s.
They said "We will get the tube".
I replied "No thanks, nothing against the tube, but I will walk and still beat you." Which I went and did, standing at the top of the escalators at Euston station waiting for them, and to really rub it in, I then showed the photos I took in St. Pancras on the platforms.
I love striding purposefully out of Euston to Euston Square on my way to Liverpool Street, feeling like the superior member of the London Underground cognoscenti I am.
Mommy?
Northern line to Moorgate and change there?
-- . / - --- ---
@@quintuscrinis8032 no, Circle Line to Liverpool St. 🚇
@@GeekyMedia from Euston Square yeah, but it isn't impossible from Euston nor a particular difficult journey.
Your videos are never a waste of time or obsolete Mr Jago
Yet?
@@stephenlee5929 ever!
Amen
Yes, yes they are, _and that is why I love them._
I second that
4:58 you say that but the air quality on Euston Road is awful and theres something about not wanting to walk next to six lanes of traffic instead.
What I like about Jago’s videos is that they’re basically short podcasts. As lovely as the visuals are, they’re not often that important to the narrative. Maybe Jago should also publish these as short podcasts too.
Euston Square.
I don't know how it is for everyone else, but to me, it's the one tube station that most feels like a Public Convenience.
Euston Square station wasn't always called so, from its opening on the Metropolitan Railway in 1863 until 1907, it was called Gower Street. It was renamed to make passengers aware of its close proximity to Euston station. Even closer to Euston Square than Euston is Warren Street station on the Northern and Piccadilly Lines but again with no direct interchange facilities. Kind regards, David, Crouch End, N8
Quite right! Although Warren Street is northern and Victoria not Piccadilly
On our recent visit to London, we took a day trip up to Bletchley Park via Euston station. Our "home" tube station was Barbican, so of course we took the Circle/HammCity/Metropolitan line train to Euston Square. It wasn't a terrible walk around the block to Euston, and based on the crowded sidewalk it isn't an unpopular interchange. It did give us an opportunity to go around the block the *other* way to get an obligatory photo of Speedy's Sandwich Shop.
Barbican is quite a pleasant area overall. I lived there for 17 years.
Thanks for answering a question that someone who had Euston for 25+ years commuting from Rugby without knowing! I think the whole station should be called Euston after the work is complete.
I think the point about the psychological point of
Euston and Euston Square being distinct
is the key point.
The change in station from the Piccadilly and Victoria lines
at Green Park might be longer than Euston Square to Euston
but psychologically it is further.
BTW I treat an interchange at Bank as separate stations
as it is usually quicker and easier to go to pavement level
and re-enter.
The change of lines at Green Park station is such a long walk! The walk between wood Lane station and white city station to change lines is a quicker walk than changing at Green Park.
It's also quicker at Green Park to change lines via the escalators!
@@mbrady2329 that’s useful to know 😉. My tip? If you want the mainline station when alighting from the Victoria Line at King’s Cross, do not follow the official signage. It’s a tortuously long route. Instead, be in the last carriage of a Northbound VL train (or first carriage of a Southbound one) and go up the escalators to the original tube ticket hall, pass through the barriers & turn right, then right again at the staircase that brings you to the front of the station. Quicker in particular if you’re headed for a mainline train and know from the National Rail Enquiries app which platform it is departing from.
Only use the signed route to the Northern ticket hall if your train is leaving from Platforms 9 or 10
@@mbrady2329 that’s useful to know 😉. My tip? If you want the mainline station when alighting from the Victoria Line at King’s Cross, do not follow the official signage. It’s a tortuously long route. Instead, be in the last carriage of a Northbound VL train (or first carriage of a Southbound one) and go up the escalators to the original tube ticket hall, pass through the barriers & turn right, then right again at the staircase that brings you to the front of the station. Quicker in particular if you’re headed for a mainline train and know from the National Rail Enquiries app which platform it is departing from.
Only use the signed route to the Northern ticket hall if your train is leaving from Platforms 9 or 10
Heck, the chnage to the jubilee line at Westminster might even be longer
I don't live in London and have only traveled on the tube a couple of times in my life but your videos are never a waste of time.
I've had to change at Euston for Euston Square for years now. If you've been staying overnight somewhere and have heavy baggage, you're hungry and it's a cold winter night outside, and you have to navigate the frequently chaotic traffic and poor crossing systems outside, it's... definitely a faff! By comparison, I'd rather do the Bank-Monument interchange (although to be fair, I don't have to do that often, I might change my tune if I did).
I'll still use it to get to Liverpool Street ahead of any other option, though. I may find the experience cumbersome, but I'm not that desperate to avoid it.
When I lived in Clayhall, it was more easier to go to Gants Hill station than Barkingside, even though the latter was nearby. It’s because Barkingside station was situated in an obscure place where public transport and shops are not located and you have to walk quite considerably to find one, whereas Gants Hill as you know is easy to get public transport and there are shops close by.
Interesting as always. A lot of, shall we say, the 'quirks' of New York City's Subway system are because the 'system' was never designed as such. There were three independent companies, I think, plus the then-privately owned commuter rail companies.
Euston Station is connected to Euston Square by a bus route, you don't have to walk, if you don't want to walk, expect to cross a road at the lights.
Once I was on a Metropolitan line train that was failing due to power issues. So I helped several people who wanted to get to Liverpool Street Station, to follow me and my younger brother and get a bus to Tottenham Court Road Station from Euston Square, on to the Central Line to Liverpool Street Station. We all got there over fifteen minutes, before our delayed train, crucial when catching a mainline train.
In my last trip to London, I was coming in from Paris, flying home from Luton and midway through my London stay, I had a day planned with a Northern English friend to meet half way at Birmingham. So wanted to be in the King’s Cross area . Anyway in that entire week of staying in London, I never realised I was using Euston proper UG station and Euston Square Station. It wasn’t until the very last day I notified they were totally different stations 😖
I travel to Liverpool (Lime Street - not Street) every week from Wimbledon. I always get the train to Euston Square and then walk to Euston. Much more relaxing than changing at Victoria.
We used to do that journey. Though it's slightly quicker to go to Vauxhall and change to the Victoria line direct to Euston proper.
Your output is never a waste of time! They are always interesting and informative
Hear hear!
Indeed, but the point is valid. If I'm in a place where I really need to mute my phone, then these videos with subtitles are a great watch.
Conversely, if I can only listen (like when walking), they work equally well as audio-only podcasts.
As an infrequent visitor, I've always been aware that it is easy to get between Euston Square and the mainline station but most of my onward journeys need the deep tubes. I've probably used Euston Square 3 times in the last 40 years. It would be a good idea to rename it to Euston once the corridor opens.
interesting how because of the names they're thought of as very close, while Warren Street and Euston square are still only about 200m apart on street level for a quieter interchange
If we were France they'd have joined them all up in the 1970s when building a Crossrail type line from Euston to Victoria and we'd have a Euston Warren Gower Battle of Waterloo type name for it (based on how the Metro does things!)
Also lift access on the side of euston square to warren street and on warren street- way easier for baggage
A wonderful explanation. I haven’t even thought of Euston Square since the early 1970’s when as a student teacher I used to take the tube from there to far off Dagenham to go to Abb’s Cross school in the mornings.
I change from Euston to Euston Square regularly and just the other day I thought it would be a good topic for a Jago video!
By 2040, all of London's stations will be connected by underground moving walkways. These walkways will be organised into "lines" to help people navigate. The lines will converge on localised transport hubs, all called Eustons, and ultimately trains will be built to allow easy connection between the Eustons.
Another fun Tube trick is coming in to London at Waterloo East, walking against the crowd to Southwark for a Jubilee Line train that manages to then leave London Bridge before people have been able to cover the distance from above ground.
Just a thought about Euston and Euston Square station names when the interconnection occurs (he he).
Keep both names and use alternately named roundels and signs “Euston for Euston Square” and “Euston Square for Euston”.
Your videos are NEVER a waste of time! :)
Connecting between Euston Sq and Euston (mainline) was one of the first things I ever did in London. Totally bewildered, jet lagged, heavy suitcase in tow, I had to wait (read: loiter) around Euston for a few hours before my train to Manchester.
yes there is not a lot to do in Euston . Personally I would get off at Russell Square , walk back toward Holborn for the book shops and eateries, then back up the other side of the road , past the Russell Square itself past the BMA building and hope to cross the Euston Road at street level in one peice should I be running early, there is precious little north of Euston to do (that is not illegal or imoral)
@@highpath4776 If I only I knew that at the time! London (and traveling) was new to be then (2012).
Oh, Jago. Your videos are never a waste of time. I do change from Euston to Euston Square fairly regularly, and used to do so extremely frequently, because it's convenient to get home. It's quite a pleasant stroll if it isn't raining. Incidentally, you briefly mentioned the original owners of Euston Station in the video. One thing I would be interested in seeing you do is a series of videos on the history of London's major main line rail stations. For example, why do trains to West Sussex, Hampshire and Dorset depart from Waterloo, yet those to East Sussex and Kent leave from Victoria, which is west of Waterloo? (I imagine ownership by different companies is involved.) Why do so many, if not all, trains that leave Charing Cross stop at London Bridge? Etc., etc.
I used to go to the uch hospital, from Finsbury park, change at kings cross to get to Euston sq. Like an idiot I could've just continued on the Vic line to Warren street which was literally a few minutes walk from the hospital. Only realised years afterwards.
Not a direct answer to the question, but sometimes I prefer to leave a train terminus and use a different entrance to the tube to the in-station entrance, for example, at London Bridge. There's the opportunity for a short walk in the fresh air and sunlight to the entrance in Borough High Street, which is usually much less crowded than the ticket hall and gate lines beneath London Bridge station .
I didn't know they were building a tunnel to Euston Square! They could then extend that tunnel to link in the nearby Warren Street, thereby giving you the option to bypass Euston at busy times and creating an octopus-like interchange on the map. I live in hope!
I was just thinking the same thing.
Very interesting video.
As someone who worked on and off (mostly on) in that area the new link would have been most welcome. Also, some kind of escalator/ travelator/passage link from Warren Street to Euston Square would be a boon both for interchange and reducing the number of pedestrians negotiating the Tottenham Court Rd and Euston Rd junction.
As for the new name just call it Euston.
I only quite recently noticed the dotted lines on Tube maps which denote easily walkable gaps between separate stations! Perhaps a video on those which are but shouldn't be or those which should be but aren't would be entertaining or informative!
Sir, I applaud your films, award yourself many points!
A more convenient idea (for which read expensive) would be to build a new Met station directly adjacent to Euston mainline station and close Euston Square née Gower Street. No, I'm not expecting it to happen either.
It sort of is adjacent; at least the platforms are. The problem is that the entrance is as far away from the mainline station as it’s possible for it to be. On Gower Street, in fact…
The Euston Square name has to stay. If only to preserve the lovely coloured roundels on the platforms
I often use Euston Square tube station instead of Euston tube station as it's only 5 minutes from the mainline station and much easier if traveling to Paddington or Liverpool Street.
Also it's interesting to note that Euston Square was renamed from Gower Street in 1909. Did the Metropolitan realise that they were losing traffic to the LNWR's city terminus at Broad Street and rename it in an attempt to regain some of the traffic?
the number of travellers Euston to Broad Street would be nil, the passengers would be from Dalston etc to EITHER Euston,or Broad Street
@@highpath4776 I’m thinking about the passengers from further north, Watford, Tring, Bletchley and beyond.
@@stevesaul7975 I suppose through tickets to the City were avalible. See Jago Vids on Broad Street and Disused Stations website
I seem to remember changing from the Bank branch of the Northern to the Charing Cross branch always seemed such a trek, I stopped bothering and often walked (overground) from St Pancras to Euston, or all the way from St P's down to Charing Cross instead. The Euston changeover is interesting watching the sign length diminish the closer to the Ch X platform you go.
I mistook the North side entrance to Euston Square for a Public Toilet before the illuminated sign was put there, all you used to see as you walked towards Euston BR was a Staircase with Black Railings.
3:08 Jago, It's finally hit me - you're the guy that narrated the Stanley Parable. I now won't be able to unhear this in future videos.
I've always used Euston Square as an interchange from Euston mainline, In fact until a few years ago I would often use it instead of Euston tube completely as I felt the inconvenience of a short walk largely outweighed the overcrowded ticket hall at Euston where busy queues flooded ticket machines as oppose to the rather quiet nature of Euston Square (yes, I even did this for journeys that may have been slightly easier on the Vic or Northern, although not if it put me more than 15 minutes out of my way).
I think if (or when) the stations are eventually connected, Renaming Euston Square to plain 'Euston' and just signposting it as a way to the Sub Surface lines is a far more logical idea, as it would actively encourage people less familiar with the network to use it, if you see a signpost for a station with a different name (no matter how easy it is to get to), it may make people feel less confident to use it.
If anything should become a worthy competitor to the Bank-Monument Complex...
Yeah, Euston Square isn’t for Euston Square, it’s for, “oh, I have to get a 2 minute walk for these lines, well ok
Used to go from Euston to Euston Square quite often to get to some destinations. Better than some interchanges particularly with luggage
Euston and Euston Square, a bit like Bank and Monument? Incidentally, the latest pocket map shows a dotted (walk) link between the two so it's not a secret! I'm sure there are more... Jago will know
I just posted a similar comment without reading this - there's also a dotted line between Northwick Park and Kenton... a walk I do several times a week!
Also Cannon and Street and Mansion house are also the same distance to bank as well and yet they don’t have an interchange.
I always do the walk from Euston Square. A tunnel to Euston would be handy. I think TfL do draw attention to the closeness of Euston Square. The map has the dotted lines on it and the carriage announcements announce the possibility.
about time as you might have seen from the Camden Plan I sent you a while back the Crossrail 2 is already planned to link Euston with St Pancras as is the way with the Elizabeth line between Liverpool St & Moorgate
I used to change from Euston Square to Euston every morning as part of my commute from Ruislip to Milton Keynes (a temporary posting that was meant to be 6 months long but lasted 18 months). I hated the change so much that on the way home I went from Milton Keynes to Watford Junction, then to Harrow & Waldstone, bus to Harrow-on-the-Hill and then Metropolitan line to Ruislip! All that for 18 months. And this was before the built the lifts to the street on the south side. Instead we came up into an MI5 building on the corner of Gower Street. Because of this I prefer the name "Gower Street", but if the two stations are joined (and I believe the plan is for a new ticket office at the East end of the platform and so closer to Euston) then "Euston" makes more sense than "Euston & Euston Square".
Keep up the good work Jago. I'm surprised you failed to mention the old gag about "Euston - we have a problem". Perhaps you think it's been done to death - but that doesn't usually stop you 🙂
I like tunnels in much the same way that I like trains and bridges. There doesn't have to be a reason! I will take a longer walk to use one, especially one I haven't used recently. I used to live in Montreal, and enjoyed the challenge of avoiding going outdoors all day.
My answer to all your questions at the end is ‘buggered if I know’ Mister H but I do know that the Hidden London tour of Euston starts at the entrance to Euston Square station. There’s lots of abandoned tunnels and passageways down there which is rather cool.
1:58 in my experience, that concept still hasn't reached bus services outside of London in 2022. I was asking staff at the Glasgow subway how the ticketing works, and apparently nothing is integrated into anything, there's the subway and there are different bus companies who all do their own thing.
Great video (as always) Jago! Alas, I think you've overlooked a major point. Euston Square was originally named/sited as GOWER STREET so never really a Euston 'link' station. By the way, there are still a very few original Gower Street features at platform level if you know where to look! Thanks again 🙂
Having just read a biography of Charlotte Brontë, she writes in one of her letters of travelling by train to London and arriving at "Euston Square Station."
A fantastic video as I was staying at the Euston Hilton a few weeks ago. This gave me a chance to get to know Euston station more intimately than as a child when it was used merely to and from Rugby to the tube and family. I used Euston Square and found it easy considering it was a sunny day.
Thanks, Jago, for another interesting video about the Tube. On trips to London when I was younger I did wonder why Euston ans Euston Square were separate. Regarding your remark about the introduction of travelators to connect some stations which are close together.
I'm sure the advantage to both TfL and the travelling public will quickly become apparent.
Thanks Mr H.
A question that I asked myself on a recent journey from Norwich to Lancaster.
Whenever I change from Victoria to Circle et al lines, it always seems easier to change at Kings Cross (I'm usually coming from north to south) rather than Euston. Also, I'm never sure if I'm charged more if I leave one station and enter another instead of just changing at a same station - probably not but pricing on the Undergrounds remains an enigma wrapped in a riddle to me. A travelator from Euston to Kings Cross sounds hellish as people often get on these contraptions then promptly forget they have legs.
Same with escalators. Why do people just stand still even when going down. Its like they've got all day. I haven't. I always walk up/down. It wouldn't be as bad if escalators/travelators didn't move so slow. I actually enjoy running on travelators because i can go twice as fast.
We stayed at St Pancras Premier Inn recently to catch the Eurostar next morning, and used Euston Square rather than King's X St. P. Shorter walk. Also used the be the station for the wonderful Bree Loise pub, another victim of HS2 building works. But I have to take issue on one minor point - Bishop's Road is surely the Hammersmith and City/Circle platforms at Paddington. So we South Walians use it a lot, especially since the Circle started being a spiral . . .
Brilliant stuff, Jago and more excellently-presented info in the only way you know how. Thanks for this. Having been a student at UCL, I have a fondness for Euston Square. I'm sure the on-board tube maps made the most of the proximity of Euston Square to Euston, so I think an actual subsurface link between the two would be a very good idea, especially if it helps alleviate the overcrowding your video highlighted.
Also, with links for Crossrail already employed between Liverpool Street and Moorgate, and between Barbican and Farringdon, why not have a similar link between Euston and Euston Square for when HS2 becomes a reality? 👍🏾👏🏾
I don't think your videos will become obsolete: perhaps a charming reminder of a distant past, like advertisements for livery stables in 19th c. magazines.
05 / 10 /2023 "As part of the now scaled-back proposals, a planned pedestrian tunnel linking Euston station with the nearby Euston Square tube station has also been scrapped." HS2 Welcome to Sunaklad
As a lovestruck teenager I would travel from Essex (Brentwood specifically) to Wigan (Oral Post if memory serves) and one Friday night my travelling was interrupted by a tractor falling on the line causing all manner of delays. Ergo, I ended up spending my first night sleeping at a train station, first of many, obviously the 16 year old me didn't have any clue how to get home; and I had already been confused about how to get from tube to train.
If the history of all sorts of railways tells us anything, its that competition is not always as beneficial as some would have us believe.Co-operation would have served everyone better here. In fact, one might argue that railway companies and Underground in particular, had to have co-operation forced upon them before they started to work in the interests of passengers. The dilemma is always about whether you are running a service or running a business. The former being for the benefit and interests of users(passengers/customers) and the latter for the benefit and interests of shareholders.
For Euston I see joining up all the stations being useful for passengers. Keeping them away from the cars and the weather and making them interchange more easily.
Uhhh...
Starting from the end, these stations were built before cars ‘clogged the streets’ so that’s a moot point. Whether its evil corporations, or enlightened state central planners, they would not have realistically been able to build stations suitable for consumer patterns over a century later. Could these stations be improved? Absolutely. But it really is unfair to bemoan the original station builders and the practices they employed for not future proofing their projects centuries after their deaths.
But on the competition point, the Underground was already bringing things such as unified fare structures and common signage before the formation of London Transport, years before actually. Transport nerds seeing two stations a couple hundred metres away, and then bemoaning this as being due to ‘competition’ is a tired cliche. We have to ask ourselves why London Transport (or its successors) haven’t rebuilt the Euston stations to be one in their >70 year existence when they have moved railway lines, stations and services all over the shop elsewhere, above or below ground.
Could it be that central planners are not as monolithically enlightened as we have been led to believe? That the ‘public’ in ‘public transport’ does not (necessarily) mean ‘state run’?
The real problem is the type of people who run our institutions, along with the incentive structure built into those institutions (although corpos and the state are more similar in both regards than a lot may think).
Its the people running things, not whether they wear a suit for a corpo, or a state. That matters most.
@@SuperGamerMiner actually, street traffic was worse then than street traffic is today. Mostly carriages, trams and omnibuses rather than cars, but more people, more congestion, and very similar movement patterns and challenges
@@SuperGamerMiner Although the thesis of this video is that is *was* due to competition that the stations are separate and I think Jago's point is a valid one, tired or otherwise.
Obviously, it's to make me carry two large suitcases up a flight of stairs, then drag them a good hundred meters to the station to catch my breath after missing my train.
Thanks for this and I have a few points.
Firstly I *do* walk to Euston Square from Euston mainline if my destination warrants it. Also it's nice to avoid the crowded Underground ticket hall at Euston! When the changes associated with HS2 are finally realised I think I'd still prefer the name, Euston Square, to be retained... partly for historical reasons and in any case you still have Bank/Monument, so there's precedent.
I'd like to point out an interesting comparison from Madrid if I may? I was there for the first time a few weeks ago. When they redeveloped Atocha station a few years ago, the mainline platforms were moved further south and the original trainshed became a tripocal garden (it's lovely!) As part of this the Metro gained an extra stop, Atocha RENFE, to serve the station more directly. What's interesting (and this must be a very recent development because it doesn't seem to be reflected in online Merro maps) there have been more renamings. The original Atocha Metro is now Estacion del Arte (there are a number of galleries and museums nearby) and Atocha RENFE is now simply Atocha... much more sensible because it's more convenient for the mainline platforms.
It was confusing for tourists who got off at Atocha thinking it was the railway station. Paseo del Arte shows how Madrid has achieved UNESCO world heritage status for the paseo connecting its art galleries. Also the new name Atocha instead of Atocha Renfe for the metro station serving the railway station better reflects the fact that there are French and Italian competitors to Renfe now operating from Atocha station.
@@garethking1639 Yes, of course! I hadn't thought about that aspect of it... indeed it removes any confusion with regards to train operators serving Atocha.
Bizarrely Euston Square means a lot to me. My son was born very unexpectedly and prematurely at UCL while my wife was visiting friends in London. After a nerve wracking day involving a frantic flight to London from Edinburgh I made it in time, and ended up in Euston Square dazed, confused and a father for the first time, trying to find my way back to our friends house. So it may be unassuming and confusing but it will always mean a lot to me!
I used to walk between Euston Square tube and the main line station.
I remember when I started making regular journeys up to London in the early 70's being somewhat perplexed by this disconnect. I did make the journey between the 2 by foot a couple of times & as others have already commented, the weather was never great! 😱
The other little annoyance that this situation threw up was the lack of a step-free interchange between Euston Square and Euston. When I used this route, I often needed to help people trying to change between the mainline stations, who had trouble getting their luggage up the steps at Euston Square.
Well, there's the lift on the other side of the road now. But then you have the added hassle of crossing back over the road :(
In a past life I worked for TfL in the planning/InfraCo part of the business. My portfolio included the proposed footway between Euston Square and the main line station. It was moribund due to sheer number of other services needing to be moved in order to avoid building in stairways to get over gas pipes, under data links and electric cables - not to mention moving sewers and basements. The costs were found to be enormous and nowhere near meeting the criteria for a business case. I'd like to see the gannt chart of how this will be done and how much it will cost.
I suspect the first big circle is labeled “ Demolish Euston Station & Surrounding Suburb “
....Not to mention rumours of 'secret' passageways between the number of Government buildings in the area. Even suggested that when 222 Euston Road was built at the West corner of Euston, and occupied by BR HQ (after moving from 222 Marylebone Road), there was said to be a connection to the tunnels from the basement of the new building. One assumes that if that were true it would have had to have been blocked up when Inmarsat took over the building.
Looks like HS2 money no object seems to have solved that, your work was not in vain
I always thought why was there no connection between Euston and Euston Square, and now is the time to make this possible. A corridor between the two stations make sense as getting between the two stations will make travelling a lot easier for everyone. Looking forward to it.
I only ever pass through the Euston stations, either on the Northern line or the H&C, Circle and Metropolitan lines. The rebuild of Euston station and its new connections sound like a hell of a lot of walking.
But to get to Euston Square, you have to leave Euston - which means looking at the outside of Euston station. And who would want to do that?
Will miss crashing my luggage along the crappy pavement between Euston and Kings Cross though.
Your videos will never be obsolete. I like to photo of Euston Arch, perhaps you could have scripted in a pun "is Euston looked like this" 😅
Victoria as a heliport sounds lit. If I visited the UK and Victoria had a heliport, I'd opt to enter the city in the most glorious way. Yes I love trains, but helicopters are neat machines too y'know
The basic problem with Euston Square is that, like all the first-generation underground lines, the Metropolitan was built cut-and-cover under the main road - Marylebone Road. So it lay significantly south of Euston mainline station which is on the north side of the road. This is less pronounced at Kings Cross St Pancras where the underground walkways have been expanded, although the old Kings Cross Thameslink station was rather remote. Likewise Marylebone itself is not on the Met/Circle/H&C, with Baker Street and Edgware Road the nearest stops, but is on the Bakerloo which being a deep tube could deviate from the surface road system.
Nice episode. I change between Euston and Euston Square all the time as I need to get to Tower Hill. The only thing is, I'm wondering if Bank would be closer as I have to get to Fenchurch Street.
Very interesting videos, thank you oh wise one, I had always wondered why Euston Square and Euston are not connected. I walk between the two, but its very inconvenient and inevitably always seems to be raining hard when I need to do so. A direct connection tunnel would be good. Calling it all Euston (and not burying 'Euston Square') would make sense.
I. used Euston Square frequently when I lived at Southfields on the District Line. One easy(ish) change at Edgware Road. However, recommending this route to a friend visiting from the Northwest led to her taking a long detour via Edgware: she had misunderstood my directions and headed to the Northern Line at Euston rather than the Circle/H&C at Euston Square.
Very interesting, I had always wondered why they were kept separate, usually when walking from one to the other during a heavy shower :/
The Bank northern line rebuild early this year meant I used Euston Sq to the Barbican rather than N Line from Euston to Moorgate or Bank, and yes, it is straightforward. And actually much quicker journey (Kings Cross>Angel>Old St takes an age on the Northern Line). The hike down Euston Rd isn't too bad. A direct tunnel to walk down would be terrific.
But this, the travellator to St Pancras/KingsX - really? Given slashing of current government spendiing I reckon Crossrail was the last big project for a long while, HS2 likely to be mothballed, and Euston Stn rebuild - instead a facelift to cover up the mess created so far.
Yes. I've dragged my suitcase from the Square station to the Mainline station. And vise versa!
Jago The North Metropolitan Railway (later Metropolitan Railway) Bill originally proposed the siting of Euston Square Station with Entrances in Euston Square itself at the other end of the platforms but this was vetoed hence the station name was retained but located Gower Street. The Act of Parliament that was passed (of which I have a copy) did include a provision for a physical link between the Metropolitan Railway and the LNWR at Euston with lifts raising/lowering individual wagons.
At 5:52 "...and this video will be obsolete. That was a waste of time, wasn't it?"
There's one bloke in St Paul, MN (whose name is quite similar to mine), who greatly appreciates your keen & ironic sense of humor!
well at least the poor sod traveling from Brussels to the north of England via high speed train, won't have to haul their luggage from St. Pan to Huston. *Sorry: Euston*. Oh, and a subway ACROSS Euston Road?
As expected great video, Mr. Hazzard.
Euston, you have a problem.
I make the Euston NR to Euston Sq interchange every time I go in to the office.
There’s a great falafel stall on the pavement between the two 😁
The moving walkway between Kings Cross and Euston would be brilliant although a 5 minute walk down Euston road (twice) during my recent outing - was not too much of a hardship as I had no intention of taking the tube for 1 stop.
There is - not exactly a short cut, but - an alternative route which avoids the traffic and congestion along Euston Road. It involves leaving Euston by the side entrance, crossing Eversholt Street and then cutting through the side streets and a housing estate, emerging behind the British Library opposite the Thameslink/Eurostar entrance to St Pancras. But it's slightly complicated and needs better signposting.
Now, now Jago. Your videos are never a waste of time. As for Euston connectivity, wonder why no 1 thought to have an access through the car park to Euston Sq...? Chicago & Boston have such access between transit & airports in the US. A Montdeal hospital kept the "temporary" one established to an adjacent Metro stn after the permanent tunnel opened a year or so ago...
I am fairly familiar with the tube map, but I have very little idea how far apart the stations are in real terms, so it rarely occurs to me to walk from one station to the next. You'd assume from the name that Euston and Euston Square are close together, but there are all kinds of weird naming decisions on the tube that I don't really trust those kind of assumptions either.
I agree with the psychological issue though. It feels much further away if you have to leave the station than if there's a corridor/tunnel. And this can lead to scheduling problems, for example if you take the U6 or the U3 to Vienna Westbahnhof, you need around 5 mins to get from the U-Bahn to the main station platforms because it's the other side of the street. There is an underground way to avoid crossing the main road but it's longer and busier so doesn't save much time ultimately - it just feels like it does.
your videos will never be obsolete
I had to get a train to Scotland from kings cross on the day of Power cuts all over london back in September. I'd normally take the Piccadilly line to get there, but the outage took that out. so I went via Hammersmith/city/circle instead. only to then learn those trains didn't stop at Kings cross due to the outage. that proposed travellator (provided it wouldn't have hypothetically been taken out by the outage) would have been very handy as I had to walk from Euston square all the way to kings cross. Thankfully, I did make the train!
My Dad’s friend used to work at London Euston when HS2 started and I do think that there will be a pedestrian link connecting from Euston main line station to Euston Square underground station that will be built underground and beneath the office blocks.
As Euston Square and Euston stations that are 300metres apart and are on Euston Road. And is also easy walk from King’s Cross and St. Pancras International stations if you want to avoid the tube and be healthy and walk from one station to the other.
I also remember when me and my dad nearly bumped into now Labour leader Kier Starmer who was visiting a Sainsbury’s Local convenient store at London Euston station. But he was too busy talking with his people and completely ignored me and my dad.
I generally go Wood Lane to Euston Square rather than White City to Euston despite the short walk and less frequent service. The plus side is that I don't have to change, the trains are more pleasant and I have mobile service for most of the journey.
ooh those charing cross underpass sections are so incredibly welcoming !! surely one of the jewels in the crown of the underground network.
I had no idea about the travelator from Euston to King's Cross. Isaac Asimov imagined a new style of underground system consisting of parallel travelators each going faster than the one next to it, until you got to the main part with seats, running at at least 60mph. This could just be the beginning...
The Roads must Roll.....Robert Heinlein
Didn't really notice this - thanks for sharing!!! 🤔🚂🚂🚂
I suspect wayleave was a big factor here. From King's Cross nearly all the way to Paddington the Metropolitan Railway was built under the straight(ish) line formed by the Euston and Marylebone Roads. To take in Euston main line station directly it would have had to make an awkward and very expensive dogleg in its route. On top of that it was originally planned with the convenience of the GWR primarily in mind, and they were probably only too pleased to make access to the LNWR terminus at Euston as inconvenient as possible.
I go to UCL so I've been to both Euston Square and Euston more times than I can count. Very excited for them to be joined up and a travelator to King's Cross will be excellent as well!
Great video Jago