Why Modern Men Look Elsewhere for Spiritual Wisdom
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 มิ.ย. 2024
- Friends, an interesting article was published at The Gospel Coalition titled “Savior or Stoics? Why Modern Men Look for Spiritual Wisdom Outside the Church” (bit.ly/3o47dEp)
The author observed how a growing number of young men are filling a moral and spiritual void in their lives by turning to modern self-help books based on ancient Stoic thinkers. Authors such as Jordan Peterson, Ryan Holiday, and Navy SEAL Jocko Willink have won large followings of men by translating the principles of Marcus Aurelius, Seneca, and Epictetus into modern advice.
Why is Stoicism so appealing to many young men today? And what lessons might Christians learn from this development? That is what Brandon Vogt and I discuss on today’s episode of “The Word on Fire Show.”
A listener asks for recommendations before receiving the Sacrament of Reconciliation for the first time.
00:00 | Intro
01:00 | New Word on Fire studio in Rochester
02:32 | Groundbreaking for new diocesan pastoral center
03:47 | Why do we have such difficulty engaging young men?
07:39 | Why Jordan Peterson effectively reaches young men
10:31 | The good life is based on moral principles
16:36 | Called out of nihilism and hedonism to take responsibility
20:26 | We have lost our masculine mentors
22:23 | How can the Church better disciple men?
25:07 | The danger of Stoic Pelagianism
30:09 | Listener question
33:59 | Bishop's new book
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“Savior or Stoics?” (The Gospel Coalition) - bit.ly/3o47dEp
Word on Fire Eucharist resources - wordonfire.org/eucharist
“This is My Body” ($2 per copy) - bit.ly/42YiJ2S
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I started with Joe Rogan and Jordan Peterson. And found my way to pints with Aquinas and bishop Barron.
This seems to be a common path. Stoicism and courage is better than hedonism. But, the revelation of God is better still.
Natural progression there. Need bishop Barron on Rogan
@@Custodes21 God shows his beauty when we have pleasure in this life. Hedonism is subjective. Pleasure valued to its proper place . A gorgeous day, diamonds on the snow , wonder, love, compassion ect…, but yes we are a hedonistic people maybe gone awry?
Anne Turner Hedonism is pleasure above all else. It is pleasure outside of it's proper place. Enjoying the beautiful Creation which God has made is not hedonistic unless you begin to place that pleasure in the place of God.
@@marchand5223 Joe loves to talk about Christianity and other religions as a cult, and so do most of his listeners, so having a "cult leader" wouldn't be so good for his image
When I was a young Marine stationed in Okinawa Japan I had the pleasure of serving with a great Catholic Marine, Col. John Ripley who was one the great Marines of our time and a great American hero in the Vietnam war. He taught me that the three great pillars of a man’s life are Intellectual - a life long pursuit of educating oneself; Physical - the constant challenge of pushing oneself to greater physical readiness; Faith - the development of a personal relationship with the Lord. A man cannot truly consider himself a “great man” without a balance between these three things. RIP Colonel Ripley, Semper Fidelis!
Christianity-is-sophistry, it is all ‘MADE UP’ of fake & fictional stories copied over and over for over 2000 years
Xtian New Testament copied from Jewish Old testament
Politicians & Rulers use Churches are a proxy to enslave public by branding them as ‘Sinners’.
Jewish character.zesus never existed, appropriated by early fictional writers as son-of-god.
Easter was Pagan festival appropriated by Church.
Bibles based on fiction writers plagiarizing over and over for over 2000 years for brainwash the gullible public and they keep changing .
Christmas is not even mentioned in bibles..Santa is a fictional character
25th dec is not a real DOB of zesus, it has been selected by the Church.
Quit xtianity, save humanity.
Great commentary
Col Ripley was one of the greatest Marines in its entire history.
Thanks, combines Traditional with Christian Virtues
Col, John Ripley was a Great Marine, Human Being and Man of Faith! You were Blessed to have met him and beautifully recalled what he gave you!
After leading mostly young men in the Marines for 30 years I can say that the harder you pushed them the happier they were. They complained/"bitched", but they were happy. They had a sense of purpose. Men, especially young men, have to be challenged to have meaning. Young men are so miserable now. They live at home longer, they smoke weed, and play video games that simulate adventures they are afraid to take on in real life. I thank God for my father, priests, coaches, professors, and military instructors who pushed me harder than I would have on my own initiative. As a boy, and a man, nothing rang more hollow then getting unearned praise. Nothing was better than being challenged to be better and getting the coaching and mentorship to do it.
Theirs only a few good men around,
Let’s pray for more role models for our future generation.
Lm
Hahaha - as a former young Marine, I agree with the complaining and happiness comment.
Thanks for that I sight. Please keep posting this response. We need to wake up a complacent, feminised church that has no fear of the Lord and little respect for holiness.
I hear the Bishops message but, after a number of years of being away from the Church, I decided to attend Sunday Mass and to be honest I probably enjoyed more then I ever have in the past. In this crazy world and all it's insanity , I found the Mass aside from the singing of the responses to be traditional as I remember. so gratifying and peaceful. 🙏
Love it. Try a good TLM with translations available. That converted me back into the Church.
Bravo!! It’s the real thing… God’s just too amazing.
God is very real.....
We lived in his Holy Soul...
Spent a long time trying to find something that would fill the void in my heart. First it was extreme music, next it was drugs and psychedelic spirituality, then finally found Christ. Or Should I say he found me? Anyways, I see many young men, my age and younger who I can tell are yearning for adventure, genuine virtue, and deep meaning. Unfortunately our culture has very few good outlets for this, and it is sad to say that the church has been dropping the ball. Praying for revival and an awakening of young men coming to Christ!
Thanks for another great video Bishop! You've given me lots to think about and I really do feel lit on fire by your words. Viva Cristo Rey!
When Bishop mentioned "men prefer being challenged" I thought, why not create or promote monastic orders? A monastic order where someone can go to learn the proper way of life, faith etc without needing to be ordained into priesthood. Just going to church alone doesn't seem to do the trick for a lot of people so a place where "purposeless" men can go to study or live an ascetic life for a bit might be useful.
I like that idea.
sounds great, sign me up
Exodus 90 would be a great place to start
I believe Jordan Peterson showcases the strengths and weaknesses of human beings. He is unashamed of revealing his vulnerabilities at times and is honest about his shortcomings. What I admire about him is his unwavering appreciation for the power of the Bible. Despite his own family's struggles, they are willing to share their expertise to assist others in their personal challenges.
On the other hand, Bishop Barron makes the Catholic journey easier. By "easier," I mean that he appeals to all human emotions and intellect in a positive manner. He presents beauty, truth, and honesty. He fearlessly provides direct answers to the profound questions that humans have regarding faith.
Bishop Barron gets it right. The "Biblical Framework" has a beauty and simplicity. Its simplicity that irks non-believers because every narrative reveals a protagonist and an antagonist. Sometimes they are actual people, sometimes inner conflicts, sometimes spirits, sometimes groups....
It is my first time here and I am impressed by the quality of this conversation, in particular, Bishop's warning not to fall into the self-help trap but recognise that we cannot save ourselves. Yes, we must be tough but have the humility to recognise our human limits.
I think the same reason men are being drawn to the Classics, to Greek and Roman philosophy, is the same reason young men are drawn to the Traditional Latin Mass. The ancient is so foreign to the modern world that it's captivating. It's new. The ancient is being discovered, I can't even say 'rediscovered' because many of these young men are encountering it for the first time.
Father Barron, thank you for your priesthood, your wisdom, your charisma that you share with all of us. I thank God for putting you in my path, God bless you Father Barron 😊
I’m learning a lot about the Catholic faith through this forum as a means of understanding other religions.
Amen amen to your comment!
Jesus was my personal North Star for manhood, he walked the desert, denied the temptations of the devil, threw out the money lenders and went against the elders and the authority, he saw and broke bread with the meek and the downtrodden, he forgave and he gave his life for those he loved. How could you be more of a man than to speak against authority, deny evil, raise up the weak and lay down your life for your friends - it is a truly holy grace
Awesome, I truly appreciate Bishop Barron’s nuanced position between virtue and pelagianism, and especially his invoking of Saint Paul’s dilemma. That’s very helpful.
Bishop Barron's position between Virtue and Pelagianism is much too late to save lives. During his Tenure over 50 some odd million lives have been destroyed from Abortion and all of the Bishops have done absolutely Nothing, yes Nothing! Today, Evil is destroying the U.S. The Pope, Bishops, Cardinals and a huge majority of Priests are hiding out so not to be involved with the Sheep who, are suffering and leaving the fold and Rightly So! Bishop Barron is either a Coward or a False and Empty Teacher. Christ would not tolerate, what we see every day in the news yet many ask, why is Church Membership Declining and God Suffering?
Bishop Barron is very close to the mark. One thing that was missed, and it may be just in the Parishes that I have attended, is that the Priests always exalt women and talk down to men. For example, over the past few years I've attended several funerals. At every one of those for women, the Priest would talk about how good and virtuous... And every man's funeral it was almost like it was off a queue card, how he wasn't perfect and how we must rely on the grace of God for Heaven. And the same for mother's day and father's day, the homily laid out how all women were as virtuous as Mary and father's day if mentioned, would be a subscript. If feel most men, if they want to be talked down to, could stay home and have a conversation with their wife. This turns a lot of men off. I know you can remember when "man up" was the theme of all the men's conferences. I know others share a similar point of view because it sparked a lot of affirming comments on another channel when this topic came up and from both genders. God Bless you BOTH and all the work you do.
Thank you Bishop Barron and Brandon. I always love to listen to both of your'll on the Word on Fire show. GOD bless you both. ➕️❤
Amen to your comment!
Bravo Bishop. You hit the nail on the head....now go all the way!!! I am a cradle Catholic novus ordo by birth Father. I am now attend the Latin Mass my children veil, my son's wear suits in mass...we kneel and only receive the Lord on the tongue. We pray the rosary in Latin together and acknowledge when we pass a church while driving. Go all the way Bishop. We love you and pray for you.
This is one of the most beautiful episodes I have listened to. Thank you, your Excellency!
I wish our culture, in general, was more religious. I wish we could have more honorable, kind, faithful men.
My favorite celebration of the Triduum happened when I participated with the Monks at St Bernard Abbey 4 years ago!
Brandon is so good in these talks. Many people would be tempted to interject and interrupt more. Brandon keeps it just right. Excellent job!
Looking forward to listening to this.
This video is GOLD!
Thank you!
Your Excellency, as a man who wants to be a man, I've found so much comfort, brotherhood, and love in the solemnity and beauty of the Tridentine Mass. It has a spine, and I've seen enough of your content to know that you understand what that means when we are faced with - dare I say it - irreverent Masses.
I have to credit the Society of Saint Pius X here. I came out of the wilderness to the Episcopal Church. I wanted something deeper, but what I found amongst the modern Catholic churches were guitar hymnals, a rebuke of proper dress, and an aversion to taking a stand against the evils of the world. Your Excellency, please help us address this. Many of these people feel that their future is uncertain. And young people are FLOCKING to the TLM. The SSPX are doing their part to keep the faith alive. They rebuke evil, love unabashedly, and catechize, catechize, catechize. They could use your help.
God bless you.
Remember SSPX is a schism and without the Catholic Sacraments. Come home to the fullness of God's Grace present in the one true church of Christ, the Roman Catholic Church.
I appreciate the sentiment of the SSPX in combating modernism, restoring Tradition, and inspiring people for deeper reverence and love of God. However, you can’t be pushing people to the border of Sedevacantism in your doctrinal views. Even the entire idea that Marcel Lefebvre was preserving the one true faith (as if it were not visible already) and consecrating bishops without the approval of the Holy Father is problematic. And how most within the society view the 2nd Vatican Council and the Novus Ordo is erroneous. It’s unfortunate that the Novus Ordo got completely derailed by modernists but that doesn’t make every Novus Ordo invalid or “extremely dangerous” as some say.
@@RobRod305 No Sedevacantism here. What gave you that idea? We pray for the Pope every day. One of my priests in catechism told us how Francis has done more than any other Pope in his efforts to consecrate Russia. This is the sort of misinformation we need to combat! At least meet me on this point. Your others, I'd be happy to delve into - but at least understand that we don't push anyone towards Sedevacantism.
A subject near and dear to my heart. I’ve seen the effeminacy of our young men skyrocket the last few decades. As defined by Thomas, the inability to suffer for a greater good. Our Churches are losing young men and it has little to offer them besides these lame youth ministries that do not engage them. We have a crisis on our hands and the Church needs to step up to the challenge. Young boys don’t want to be alter servers because it’s just another space that young girls have moved into. Feminism is destructive in innumerable ways. Is there anyplace that young men can just be mentored and have a space to themselves anymore? All of our institutions are catering to the females. Our boys are in dire straights.
😊
Unfortunately imo the space that young boys have to themselves is now computer games where satanists are waiting for them with open arms.
@@janetsakaly7337😢😢
Women are very helpful , nuns, lay, volunteers, they complement each other
@@marialuisa4227 they absolutely are. I think the point was that the feminization of men and of the church has pushed men away, or made those that embraced it impotent - they have lost that which made men great. Women are great, men are great and bring unique value to the family, to church, and to society. When we insist one act like the other we generally diminish that value.
Amen Bishop! It makes me feel so hopeful to hear you put your finger on the issue! Now go tell your brother bishops and let’s see the graces that challenging the faithful will bring.
Fr Barron, I saw this video suggestion after watching a short video of a Hindu monk talking about concentration. I'm a Catholic and I thank God for people like you.
This movement reminds me of the rich young man in Matthew 19. He too was high minded and interested in righteous living. He kept all the commandments that Jesus rattled off. Yet there was something very fundamental that was lacking in his spirituality. All the stoicism is for naught, if there is not that connection, relationship, bond -- whatever you want to call it -- with Jesus through the Holy Spirit. If the institutional church can do the matchmaking for people, then the dates and the relation and spiritual romance will follow.
Thank you Bishop Barron ❤
This is coming from first hand experience, Mr. Bishop Robert Barron. There are few males between the ages 20 - 30 that are bachelors in the churches I attend. I live in Palm Springs California. I fall withing this demographic. This makes me feel out of place, when I go to church, since I don't see a strong community of other men to surround myself with and build relationships. The only other places I see other men of my age is in sports and when going out at night.
Very good point. I am a bachelor in my 30s and I am definitely an outlier in my parish. The majority of parishioners are definitely young families or retired folks. I think this trend will only get harder for single people as more young men are remaining "sexless" in their 20s as dating apps, technology, and financial pressures are making it increasingly harder for young men in particular and people in general to meet and start families
You are in a small demographic so you need to look to diocesan or larger groups. Wilderness Outreach is a group that I participated in that takes groups on men of all ages to camp and do physical work and pray. Mostly these activities are 7-9 days in the west. We have worked with Natl Forest Service to clear trails or build them. Men are college grads to early 60’s and some seminarians and a priest on most. It’s a band of brothers in faith.
Go to an FSSP parish, mine is quite literally full of young couples and kids, and the rest are single people from ages 18-45. That's where they all went.
I know you've been around for some time now, but welcome to Minnesota! We're glad to have you.
Last Sunday my sister and her husband received two copies of Bishop Barron's book "This is my body" at their parish church as they went to Mass: one for them and another to give to a friend. They were very happy with the gift. Congratulations to the priest and his team. It can surely be replicated elsewhere.
Thanks much for this video.
I’ve been seeing this in my day to day life. I see guys my age yearning for god and Jesus but dismiss it as “stupid” .
Yes, I've seen first hand people drown in vice and bad habits, while constantly pushing aside the Life raft that they repeatedly bumped into.
I have found that people complain that the church has created a lot of ritual that is just made up. This is usually because they know nothing about the Catholic religion. VII attempted to eliminate a lot of the ritual but at the same time Jesus because a real nice guy who just accepts everything. The church went from way right to way left and it needs to be in the middle. God is God and demands worship and that you obey His laws and that is it and He will punish you for wrong doing and then they say that the church is always threatening people to control them but the fact is that He will punish you.
I would say that is an issue of poor theological formation, not a failure of having a “tough” Church
Great insights, thanks!
give the young men of the world the challenge of changing the world of homelessness and drug addiction which seems to be the modern warfare, let the church and the leaders be a good example enlist them to serve in helping their brothers, sisters lift them out of their poverty helping them personally to change and lead them spiritually.
Spot on. Thank you.
Thank you for your work to explain the Catholic Faith. Whenever I have an opportunity, I share your channel.
Excellent conversation
Thank you Bishop Barron, this is a great eye opener for me as a single mom of a young man. I can tell he definitely likes challenges and see why he gets so demanding at times. Also understanding why my brother enjoy so much a priest that isn’t afraid to tell it like it is, he enjoys him so much I thought the priest was a bit harsh but now I can see he’s so much needed with young men particularly, father Willy Peña. Not just him but we the Hispanic are pretty blessed in that sense because mostly the Hispanic priests don’t play! 😅 like father Jorge Loring and Manuel Carreira all beautiful minds of our church. I love each one of them including Bishop Barron, and feel so blessed to be Catholic.
To be a committed Christian in a godless culture demands nothing if not manliness. It is to face ridicule, contempt, rejection and loneliness. You want to be a man? The path to which Christ calls you will break you and then remake you into one.
I look and find spiritual wisdom in many different places including Catholic but also Protestant, Orthodox, Jewish, Islam, Tao, Confucius, Buddha, Vedas, and so on. Since I was raised Catholic, I know more about its rituals but prefer to be a secular Catholic instead of a practicing Catholic. It is too bad that secular Catholics cannot receive the Eucharist and divorce and abortion are always problematic along with original sin. I have come to appreciate the Pentateuch and feel that Catholics can learn much more from the Pentateuch than they now do.
My spiritual salvation does not depend on conforming to a series of rituals but rather on living a good and moral life. That is the spiritual wisdom that I look for...
Thank you😍
Bishop Barron: you are excellent at conveying the message. I read the Daily Stoic daily and have for years because it requires me to think and the life experiences of Marcus Aurelius, Seneca and Epictetus are still true today. Same for the Greek Philosophers like Aristotle. I listen to you as well because you also make me think. Keep up the good work. I’m neither young nor Catholic btw.
Thank you Bishop Barron for so widely sharing the gift God has given you!
I recently heard Dennis Prayer coin a phrase cut flower ethics. That is a cut flower, as beautiful as it is, apart from its roots, will quickly die. Or John 15:5 “I am the Vine…”.
Congratulations. All the best. I am going to Google Map it to feel a bit closer. Thank you for your help and teachings from Buenos Aires.
I'd add that men like to be intellectually challenged, and almost all the homilies and sermons I've heard have been "feel-good" platitudes I've heard a hundred times. Years ago, then-Father Barron had a phrase -- "beige Christianity" -- to denote the boring, placid, dumbed-down, intellectually vapid version of spirituality offered up by churches. That is (in my estimate) responsible for many men -- especially the smartest -- leaving the church. I remember walking away from my Catholic church after hearing a sermon on how Jesus was "like a cookie God offered to us." And no, it wasn't a children's mass. I thought to myself, "This is actually retarding my spirituality; it isn't helping it." That was after a long string of similarly bland, feel-good, dumbed-down messages. You can easily find more intellectually challenging spiritual/religious content on TH-cam than you can in church. Forget about the kneeling and standing stuff -- the church needs to become more *intellectually* challenging and interesting.
Every homily I hear issues a challenge to me, to get closer to Christ, to become more holy, to grow in my Catholic faith. The Mass itself challenges me to offer myself wholly to God alongside His Son.
@@beverlyplonski-mcgavock3512 That's a different sort of "challenge" than the one I'm talking about.
Great podcast. I like this Bishop a lot 🙏
I love this guy. He makes want to read more.
Muchas gracias,es bueno para todos
Beautiful analysis of human nature and education with the most important addition-faith, hope, and love. Being an educator for forty years, I’ve always imagined what the foundation of a good education should be. Here it is! Start here!Foster the building of “character” and work at becoming the human being God meant you to be. Today’s public school education (and to some extent Catholic education) has lost its mission. And the concept of education in the university today, is a far cry from St. John Henry Newman’s “Idea of a University “ and “Definition of a Gentleman.” The classical “liberal education” has been aborted by relativism and Godlessness. Thank you Bishop Barron. Praise God for the grace He has given you.
Please pray for the Catholics who should return to the church! Like my two brothers, my niece, my husband, my sons, my friends. God save them all and draw them back!
"The good enough is often the enemy of the best, when the best is available."
Unknown
God bless you 🙏
Thanks, this was insightful. :)
I love your advice to get out the 10 commandments and go through these to examine yourself. as well as the 7deadly sins. Great discussion!
Brandon we'll versed for asking and answering some major questions, and bring to life some questions that verifiy where it all comes from, we just don't know. By chance or by submission, thanks Brandon, thanks Barron.
I listen to live classics of Mother Angelica and the then Bishop Fulton J. Sheen. And along the way, I encountered Bishop Barron. These are very helpful toward my spiritual growth. ❤
I agree, I’ve been so much more motivated by young priests around my age (23-30) who make us focus on the liturgy, who make us take the little details of the mass seriously, who encourage us to seek out discomfort.
Sometimes the older priests are more liberal than the young ones😅
Because they are smarter and better educated than the young ones.
@@FrancesRobinson-yn2ks Really? Being smarter and better educated equates to being liberal? Then I'm glad I'm just a dumb fool for Christ.
@@FrancesRobinson-yn2ksArrogance is never a good look on anyone, reassess yourself.
@@jimbocrispy6908 Thank you. I stand corrected. Even though you have displayed the same 'arrogance'. LOL
@@Denis.Collins I love Eucharistic processions. Christ is not just for sundays and for the people who already found him. By Christ coming out to the streets people are able to see him and can be moved to return to the Church Christ founded. Did Christ hid or did he have a public ministry? Plus you don’t hold on to youth but to truth. The younger priest are looking to the church fathers the councils, doctors of the church, saints and it’s history.
I enjoyed your discussion with Dr. Peterson. Pick up your cross and carry our burdens willingly. Narrow is the path.
Way to bring it back, Bishop. Thru God we can.
Interesting theme!
I'm teaching philosophy and I think modern thought is eclectic because it has been composed by three elements: idealism, materialism and nihilism
Profound discussion at around 28 minutes at the strengths and limitations of the Peterson self help approach: the regeneration of the will is needed and thd reorientation of our hearts toward God - the meaning of salvation.
I can only speak from my life experience. When I was young I was willful and hedonistic. I was raised in a lousy parish so that didn't help but even if I wanted to fellowship with someone there was nothing available. That was okay since it wasn't what I wanted at that point in life anyway. I say all this because I think you have to meet people where they are. Men, especially young men, aren't as interested in philosophy as they are in action. As this video points out, you can't just set up a group where people sit around and discuss their feelings all the time and expect men to stick around. We aren't wired for it. I'm a member of a good parish now but there really isn't any outreach for men, young or otherwise. There is a vibrant women's group and we have a good youth ministry but for men between 20-50? Not so much. Someone tried to get one going but he set up the meetings for 6 AM during the week. Needless to say not a lot of men signed up.
I'll be honest, I don't have the answer. A guy like Jordan Peterson appeals to young men because he tells them it's okay to feel what you feel. It's okay to not be a feminized version of a man like they are told to be on so many levels. The church hasn't figured out how to effectively counter that trend in public education, the whole toxic masculinity angle . From what I've seen over the years the Catholic Church has done a pretty poor job overall when it comes to evangelizing, especially to young people, male and female. I wish it wasn't so but until they get out there and meet people where they are, guys like Peterson and Rogan will continue to be more of an influence. It's a different world than it was just a few decades ago. The Church needs a strategy beyond talking points and lofty prayers to bring young men back into the fold.
I've been saying the church was getting too soft since 2003... Very happy to hear that the church is acknowledging this too. Looking forward to another shift in philosophy.
Bishop Barron, I just love your explanations and the deepness of your theology. I totally needed to hear what you had to say today. Thank you and God bless you! It also made me realize I need to get back to knowing the cardinal virtues, theological virtues fruits of the Holy Spirit gifts of the Holy Spirit, and what the sins are the opposite of these. Our Catholic faith does not go through this enough, and I will have to find it on my own. Any recommendations? I am searching and thirsty for knowledge.
Bishop, you are right on target!
Just the facts, sir
I think you're spot on bp barron with people, esp men, want to called to something greater and participate in something more rigorous. I think this is part of the reason why many are drawn to the TLM and eastern rite parishes too.
I agree with Bishop on the point, that the youngsters are looking for Spiritual honesty and Morall challenge.
I agree, young people are looking but haven't found Spiritual Honesty or Moral Courage in the Roman Catholic Church. Biden and Pelosi have been pushing abortions for 40 years along with the Democratic Party, yet never were they ever rebuked and removed from the Church despite, their public claims of being Good Christians. The Bishop writes books while Roman Catholicism is being ignored and destroyed, and for all to see. Christ was an activist standing up with Courage and Resolve. Catholic Church won't exist in 20 years unless there is a Huge turnaround. I left the Catholic mostly Ceremonial Church, 6 years ago precisely because of such Hypocrisy.
*Pope Francis:* Everyone needs forgiveness, that is, to feel that they are loved as children by God the Father." The confessor's final absolution is a powerful medicine for the soul and also for everyone's psyche. (Source: Article by Robin Gomes, Vatican News)
Amen. We are God's beloved children, forgiven and justified in Christ. This is the Gospel message that no stoic, philosopher, or guru can give us.
I love that nothing surprises Father! He is the Dylan of catholicism! 🤟🏻❤️
This is a tremendous issue and discussion. In college 1969-73, a woman at a time of the creation of "women's liberation" philosophy and curricula, I was mystified. I wanted to be able to buy a house with my own credit history and get a job if I merited it with my knowledge...and THAT WAS IT! Feminism was wasted on me. Stripping for money was redefined as "exotic dancing." Really?!?!? Feminism actually was a WAR on men. So much more I could write/say. I love all of the points you are making and the spirit in which you make them!!!
For me it was the liturgy. The beige Catholicism of the typical NO left me uninspired. In 2007 I discovered the local indult Tridentine Mass. They had been forbidden to advertise their mass previously. After that first Low Traditional Mass I had a “Demascus Road Experience”. Here was a liturgy that was serious, reverent and transcendent. The Lex orandi was in perfect harmony with the lex credendi.
I was born and raised Catholic, went to Catholic School from K to 8, my mother was a Catholic School teacher for over 40 years. I believe in God, I believe in the teachings of Christ! Personally I don't think that people aren't losing faith with the teachings of God, we are losing faith with the messenger of our Lords teachings.
Should our faith be put in the messenger? It is a challenge but a must to participate in but also see beyond the human institution of the.Churchin order to remain faithful, otherwise youd miss out on Interpretation of biblical truth by the doctors of the Churcy, and have you read the Catholic Catrchism lately? I understand your point though, many Catholic parishes are struggling in leadership and right messaging. God bless!!
I see it this way.. if you are born in a big family, and one of your brothers killed a man, and you know that your father is a good person, should you stop talking with him and other family members because of your brother? Should you give up of the whole family?
Yes, some priests did horribile things, but is that the reason to give up of Christ?
What about the Eucharist? Is the Eucharist a real body of Christ? Are You shure You didn’t lose the faith in Christ? 🙏
Yeah, the child sex scandals drove many away from the Church.
I used to see movies with my grand mother when was 8; and i heard and sing since 6 so i did cause i miss they i LOVE they
So Much Truth in what Bishop Barron says. He lays down a roadmap for inner change, by depending on Jesus. WISDOM!
Surprised that the Knights of Columbus was not mentioned in the podcast and seemingly is missing in the comments. As an organization of Catholic men active on the parish and local regional level, it provides the male perspective and challenge to live the faith that are the focus of this topic.
Good evening. From my perspective, I am a woman, the men I've loved in my life whether they be family, doctor, or lawyer, etc. were people who embodied Matthew 5:33-37. Yes, they were more on the gruff side, it was what I needed to not be sucked into the tomb of gossips. Yes, they could be distant physically at times, but not emotionally and it worked better for us if we didn't speak; again, because of the "you shoulds" in our life. They were good at just being still, and we need more men like this, full of potential energy but enjoying the peace before the fire.
I pray for God to protect you bishop from all evil around you
Al final, todo nos lleva a DIOS y a su infinita sabiduria.
ÉL NOS CREÓ 💯❤️🙏🙏🙏
I got mine!! Wish I would have bought a box for my RCIA class!!
In order for physical discomfort to have meaning, it must have a purpose. I recently participated in some training that was rather martial in nature. During one drill, the instructor was not happy with the ability of some of the students to follow instruction. To establish discipline, the instructor made the students repeat the drill well beyond what was necessary to teach the skill. This accomplished two things, it established discipline among the students and made the students better at the task through additional repetition. The next day, I decided to discontinue participating in the remainder of the drills for that day. I staggered getting up from one of the drills and rather than risk becoming a danger to myself (this was a martial subject and I was holding a weapon) and others, I decided to sit out the remainder of the day and observe. If I had continued, I would have been enduring rather than learning.
Standing and not moving during the reading of the Passion of Jesus has little purpose. If the person can not stand during the duration of the Passion reading comfortably, it quickly becomes an exercise in enduring rather than learning. Likewise with the prayers of the faithful on Good Friday. Repeatedly standing and kneeling can quickly distract from rather than enhance the rite.
Yes, we need to challenge young men in the faith but the challenges must serve a purpose and not be challenges for challenges sake. How much attention is being paid to the Passion when the person is wondering, “How much longer will this go on?”
Then you didn't pay attention very well to this video did you? The PURPOSE is to understand the pain and suffering Christ went thru on Good Friday. It was stated clearly in his talk. If all you're thinking about is "when will this end" then you aren't very well thinking "Jeepers and Christ suffered 10 times more then I am now", are you.
@@JoeSmith-gb4ng That’s right, because I’m being distracted by a pointless exercise. I do much better contemplating the Passion by listening carefully and thinking about every word. The connection to Christ’s suffering is made more real by watching “The Passion of the Christ” than by anything that can happen via a pointless exercise in church.
Christ’s agony is so far beyond comprehension that there is no way some token gesture can ever truly make one understand what he went through for us. Having people stand for the duration of the reading of the Passion is just virtue signaling.
Great video. Bishop Barron, see any good movies lately? Even if it's just a movie you liked, not necessarily with a Christian theme or connection? The last one I know of you reviewed is "Once Upon A Time in Hollywood." Which I saw. There are some of your reviews I've been avoiding since I have not seen those movies yet. Particularly "Silence," by Martin Scorsese. And how about older movies, like from the golden age? Maybe you could review some of those. Thanks again.
This is a great video. Where would everyone suggest starting with aquinus on the virtues?
Such an interesting conversation! I think a lot of us lost a little faith during the pandemic when churches were locked but the liquor stores remained open. I was angry and more than a little disappointed. I'd wager that for young men, who may already be dismayed by the sexual abuse and other issues the church is dealing with, this might have been the last straw. Also, these Internet gurus were readily available and good at explaining stoicism and virtue. Sadly, the church in general doesn't make a real effort to entice and keep young people. As a single woman who's 61, I don't exactly feel needed...and I admit I was stunned the bishops didn't fight the lockdowns anywhere in the world. What a bunch of wimps. What would Jesus have done?
It's sad because I find it was many of the young priest in our diocese that wanted to risk their lives to visit Covid patients, wanted to make mass happen, but unfortunately they were being obedient to these older bishops. It's a shame we don't have more young bishops because I think being a bishop requires a certain amount of boldness that you can only find in the young, and the reality is, we live in a world where the average age of a bishop is 66 and by then, they've had the boldness beaten out of them and I'm sure have just become so jaded by the politics of church leadership. Some even afraid to voice these desires to their bishops for fear of retaliation - being passed over for promotions or sent to churches in the middle of nowhere. It shouldn't be that way.
@@memymomalex Good point. The trouble is all the priests are intimidated by bishops. I pray for all of the cancelled priests all over the world.
When someone is sick i can feel
Word.
This put me in mind of the "Dare to be a Priest like Me" billboards from Fr. Sean O'Sullivan, vocations director for Toronto back in the early 1980s (pre-internet). The billboards showed Christ on the cross with that caption. (The image can be found on line.)
Your Lordship.... The way you speak is just Phenomenal English. I wanna develop like yours. Wish there was a talk on this 😂.
I grew up in both Roman Catholic/ Jesuit schools and lost my way, so I began diving into Hinduism, Buddhism and other stuff. I find myself returning to the faith as if I'm the prodigal son at times.
On a simple everyday basis, you notice that women tend to plan a get together indoors in order to talk. Maybe at a friend’s house or at a café.
Whereas men on the other hand get together to do something, very often outdoors.
Simple things such doing a sport going hiking for day or even going fishing.
Now, the majority of evangelization is done thru listening , meditating and commenting the Scriptures.
Listening, meditating, commenting - things that women like to do when they get together. It’s their first choice on doing what makes them happy.
In any parish, constant even daily social work is often required.
Men often doing them in different sized teams in order to meet the needs of the both the Catholic and non Catholic community would not only engage men more but would be a beacon to people of all ages.
The would set an ongoing example for young people trapped in artificial depressive social media as well as other anti religious people who see us as hypocrites.
Now, we know the essential need for prayer and mystic energizing, but I believe that allowing men to live their Catholic faith by allowing them to do something together outdoors for instant would suffice anyone who works 5 or 6 days a week on aside to make a living!
I keep on reading your bible just lead the holy spirit to schow mee where to open up.Thanks Bishop Baron to have sent mee.I heared the Petersons visit in Hungary but as have read fast his whole book l couldnt go to hear him but might bee his program was also succseful..The kids are back safely from New York l think theay missed St Patrics mess althoug I have read from archtectual point of view it is also a collaboration wit Hungarians.I saw it in 1994 one day visit in New York.Metropolitan Museum etc.sleeping in a van garage.....God kept kept us safe...Manhattan etc
Bishop was off his game on this one. It’s not about how hard it is but more about connecting Christian virtues in a practical way to daily life and doing so in a way that is sensible and not hypocritical.
long live true knowledge long live the teachings of Jordan Maxwell
Yes challenge even though some men are different they still need diversity of pressure because prepares them for real life which will always be challenging throughout their life at so many levels
Our Orthodox brothers are tackling this issue well, and I hope the church learns from their example here. There is a local orthodox priest who has a series on how to be a Christian Man, and it focuses heavily on what true masculinity means and how Christ embodies that masculinity.
It’s also women that want a challenge- speaking from experience and my own reversion.
Men really do tell on themselves, don’t they?
As a Catholic man and mental health provider, I would strongly encourage greater nuance when discussing "what men need." There may be some general commonalities between men, but we men are also habituated by society in often negative ways that actually have nothing to do with being a man. For example, it was mentioned that men don't want vulnerability and sharing in their Bible studies, but is avoiding talking about our feelings true to being a man or is that simply a societally defined gender norm? As a mental health professional, I can say that this gender norm is actually really harmful to many and stands as a roadblock for many men to becoming what God made them to be - joyful. When discussing what men need, we need to first ask if this is a true need or a trained expectation. Start from Truth, and go from there
Absolutely! I felt the same way listening to this. Instead, I fear this interview reaffirms the RedPillers flooding the comments.
Many men have commented that they skipped church until the Latin Mass brought them back. So secular notions of masculine is more important than practicing the faith?
In summary, these men were uncomfortable with hearing the gospels, hymns, and such in English because it talks about dependence, love, and submission. This changes their unhealthy view of masculinity.
It seems many men are spiritually lost because they don’t know what to do in a world of failing patriarchy. But the church offers the way: Christic masculinity. But this is self-sacrifice and humility. Think Frodo, Samwise, or Aragorn from the Lord of the Rings. I assert that’s what the challenge making men leave the church: putting the desire to perform secular masculinity over salvation.
Jordan Peterson does offer a Christic lite masculinity alternative except for the self-sacrifice. Same masculinity in a new suit. That man is dangerous because his message leads/reaffirms not an insignificant amount of young (particularly white) men down the alt-right pipeline of grievance and resentment, and away from God.
I feel this entire comversation can be concisely concluded with the condemnation of the pelagian heresy. Like Bishop Barron said, virtue etc are all affirmed but its the ordering of the soul to higher absolutes that demand things of men and ultimately, those absolutes are delivered after submitting to Gods grace. Too many self help techniques involve introspection without reference to the source of goodness. Without anchoring yourself to God, its far too easy in our secular and material world to find "meaning" inside yourself, when ultimately the true and sole source of good, is God. It doesnt matter how many rehashes of ancient philosophy you read, without God and His free gift of grace, we're nothing but lost navigators without a compass.
Bishop Barron I watched this specifically to understand why my husband and son do not attend Church and have fallen away from the Teachings of the Catholic Church. Yes I did hear the complaints from them about the feminization of the homilies, actions and even the long ' dresses' the Priests are wearing while conducting Mass!!! I tried so hard to encourage my husband to go to a Catholic Men's Group and he wanted nothing to do with it at all!!!.... I do agree with you Bishop Barron, that men do seek challenges! I also believe men - like my husband seek deep purpose for their lives and meaning that relates to what they are experiencing in their lives right now in practical ways, that could be strongly spiritually compared to our Catholic Faith and Teachings. Being a woman I am not 100% sure if I have got the right approach, the right answers for men!!! However Bishop Barron I do agree with you 100%, that we, both men and women, cannot be as virtuous as we would want to be without God's Grace. We all FALL SHORT!!! We NEED THE LORD'S HELP!!! Thank you Bishop Barron and Brendon for this very insightful talk! And I'll be praying to the Lord about this dilemma concerning the lack of men attending Church- especially my own!!!
Find a Trad Mass and have him try it.
Priests don’t wear dresses. They wear ceremonial robes and have been for centuries. Unclear why this is being treated like a recent change?
Mass isn’t about your husband’s preferences. It is communion with God. If a cleric’s “dress” is worth risking salvation, I suspect your husband sband isn’t a true believer.
Valerie, I have an intuition that your husband is obstinate in more ways than making up excuses to not attend church. Take care