Brexit and Irish border - all sides join debate (discussion)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- Here to debate the issue of the border between Northern Ireland and the Republic is Nicola Byrne, President of the Irish Exporters Association, Editor of Brexit Central, Jonathan Isaby, Senator Neale Richmond, Brexit spokesperson for Fine Gael - Ireland's ruling party, Jennifer Kavanagh is a law lecturer at the Waterford Institute of Technology, Deputy Editor of Belfast based, News Letter, Ben Lowry and Ray Bassett is the former Irish Ambassador to Canada.
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I get a bit sick of English commentators talking about the Irish bailout. The British took two bailouts since the end of the Second World War, one from the Americans and one from the IMF when it faced its own threat of bankruptcy. What's that thing about glass houses?
The British took a loan from the Americans because they were totally bankrupt, after fighting TWO world wars. The first war was financially draining, but the second war bankrupted the country. If either one of those wars never happened, the UK would have not have needed to go to the USA or the IMF. Two world wars bankrupted the UK twice. Perhaps, we the Irish, should be a little more grateful towards the UK.
@@Locutus ...and say thanks for the potatoes they provide...
Locutus So the US wasn’t involved in those wars..? 😂🤦♂️
Google „Great Famine“ and educate yourself.
@@Locutus For what? The loan was repaid with huge interest.
If it's part of a serious discussion of economics, it's fair game. If it is being used to he petty or disparage ad hominem, then it's just churlish and meaningless prattle.
See this thread for plenty of that meaningless prattle.
David Cameron has a lot to answer to.. allowing a nation of Sun readers to vote on such an important decision.
It's not like they even had all the facts to make an informed choice... shame on you Cameron 👎
far Away they had a set of alternative facts given them by right wing politicians, billionaire media owners and Putin.
josh vaughan I've given up on just about everything, this world makes no sense to me anymore.. it's gone completely bonkers
Yes I agree. It's a massive mess, new infomation comes to light everyday to suggest that Brexit is not deliverable.
K. C. Questions for you and if you can answer 'yes' to these then why would you want to leave...
1, do you have a full time job?
2, do you have a roof over your head?
3, can you pay your bills?
4, can you Feed yourself?
5, do you have a car or access to transport?
6, do you go on holiday?
If you answer yes to those questions then remaining is working for you!
I can only assume your bored or want to jeopardise the life you have or you just like gambling.
K. C. Listen, I know I sounded quite self centred in my last comment but believe me I'm a 💯 humanitarian and if I believed for a minute that Brexit would help the mass population and further afield then I would be the first to welcome it with open arms.
But it won't so I won't
I'm completely on the side of the ROI government on this one and I'm a Brit any form of border is a breach of the Good Friday agreement and the Brexit leader either knew this and lied or were incompetent
I'm Irish. Thank you.
Jon south Not either or. Both.
You are, of course, correct .... to a point. However, I don't think the Good Friday Agreement can be used as a legal precedent to overturn Brexit. It's over and done, sadly.
Gosh, imagine if it could?! That would be a marvelous irony. But, no, treaties are treaties and Brexit is a bundle of newer treaties that were put together to respond to a legal decision made by referendum and confirmed by parliamentary act. Older treaties can and are often superceded by more recent treaties.
So, what you're really pointing to is the pro-Brexit leaders deciding to undo part of the Good Friday Agreement. And when you view that in the context of history ... Wow. Such flagrant arrogance and disregard for what Good Friday achieved! Such flagrant disregard for the people of Ulster in general -both sides!
I'm a neutral observer, but ... Even I have to say that Brexit has been one of the most arrogant things Britain has ever done - and likely one of the most foolish in many, many decades.
Nothing to do with gfa
Jon you talking rubbish and betray British ni citizens.. Gfa has no clause saying giving up soveigntry of ni..
EU is COLLASPING. War will kill it off.. Irish are lapping up eu money.. price is Migrancy. There is already movement to irexit as Irish has enough of Migrancy.. Neal is telling tall stories.. Being part of EU was never part of gfa.. Remove echr UK needs this overall. What was Irish nationalist doing having fracas at erne resort hotel Nov 2022..
We never joined EU. LONDON DOSNT HAVE TO PROVIDE IRELAND ANYTHING. WE CAN HAVE ANY CHECKS WE LIKE IN NORTHERN IRELAND UM
I trust the EU more than I trust the UK
As a Brit, my advice to you Ireland is stay in the EU. Ideas and progression in parallel with 27 other EU member states will serve you a lot better than siding with the UK or going it alone.
We are not going it alone we will be trading with the rest of the world. So narrow minded its unbelievable.
Ireland is a geographical area part will be in the EU and part will be outside the EU in the UK which part are you chatting too? The Irish republic could be friends with us in the UK as it does not have to take the path it has in holding up future trade deals. We the UK offered a soft digital border but they rejected it. They are showing their true republican colours now nothing new there. Time for us in the UK to stop buying goods from the Irish Republic let the EU look after them we wont be bailing them out the next time they go bankrupt.
The opinion of a brainwashed liberal. The establishment fucking despise you, and at the same time thanks you for your ignorance.
dan taylor we have much much more in common with the UK then the entire EU speaking English is a massive one
efc toffee oh yea in time the UK will do well outside the EU you can now make your own trade deals with countries like Canada America Brazil China India Australia Russia these country's have far more people to trade with then the EU and what's even better is you can decide who to trade with and who not to and also who to let into your country and who not to I hope the UK does well outside the EU cause if it does its eat defeat for the EU
Ireland will treat Britain with the same respect, Britain paid to Ireland these past several centuries of Imperialism.
Tell it the way it was Ireland was a part of the Uk with its MPs in Westminster ruled in the same way as England etc. The worst genocide in Ireland was in 1641 when the Irish Roman Catholics murdered 25% of all protestants in Ireland. The Irish didnt hate the English it was protestants they hated In 1690 they backed the English King James because he was Roman Catholic. You need to go and learn the true history of Ireland right up to when the Bigoted Republican movement divided this island forming the Irish Republic. Northern Ireland chose to remain where it was part of the UK our free decision.
ernest rogen The Irish reclaimed their land from the English settler thieves. English Imperialists then stole Irish land, sold the Irish into slavery, and murdered the Irish. The North was stolen from the Irish, to pretend it was gained democratically is ignorance to the point of stupidity.
Daniel skomp I'm not sure why you are bringing up this stuff shit happened we should be able to agree we both did some very shitty things over the years but we are now at a stage where we have moved on and need to work together to not get screwed by the EU
What world do you live in ! ?The EU is whats stopping britain from screwing over ireland .there is no we in this situation ,we will do whats best for ireland and the EU as after affect . EU has been nothing but good to us . we are firmly on the side of the EU we couldnt give a toss what happens to Britain ,its not are fault you left the EU .
It will in its hole...
As an Irish person I'm surprised at the professional Irish politicians and representatives are. But Ray Basset is a traitor.
Probably a west brit, they never change.
Just a man with an opinion. We all have opinions even if he is 100% wrong. My opinion.
I agree. But, as others have already said, he is entitled to his own opinion. even if he is obivously massively 1,000% wrong!
Basset is a basket case, he is in favour of an Irexit and now in involved in "Irish Freedom Party" which is in bed with Nigel Farage
How is he a traitor? Are you more loyal to Ireland or the EU?
The EU says Brexit is in the hands of Dublin. Don't worry Brits, The Irish will treat Britain with the same respect The British paid the Irish these past several centuries.
ernest rogen Get the fuck out of Ireland.
Britain imposed the hated border upon Ireland. Britain imposes Brexit upon Ireland which voted in entirety to remain in the EU, both Republic and colony. Britain demands Ireland be partitioned so the 6 county colony in IRELAND is not separated from Britain. But they fail to notice there is an Ocean between Ireland and Britain.
Was this before or after the British bombed Ireland , say was your cousin cletus responsible for the Monaghan bombings ?The IRA never even set off any bombs they almost always rang the police before hand , the british government let the bombs go off to gain moral support .
@@danielskomp2300 seems your on the wrong side of the ocean though if you wanted to make your own deals with the EU. Maybe if you want to be ruled by unelected people you should all move to Germany.
Happy to take our public money though for your infrastructure?
We have a high level of knife crime, high levels of poverty a housing crisis. Mass Immigration has destroyed many working man's jobs by undercutting wages and paying no taxes and health tourism is destroying the NHS. We could clearly do with that few mill we gave to the DUP for our own infrastructure.
The arrogance of Isabay and Lowry is breathtaking.
Damn, the British sound desperate.
F. OPE They are.
It's a non issue move along
you really are a bit of an idiot - you effing British will always be against EVERYONE , sorry to break it to you , the rest of the free world also dislikes you - Ireland has you over a barrel , backed by our 26 other EU members, we , if we choose can bring your feeble government to its knees, your goverment that is propped up by a racist , misogynist , climate denying , homophobic right wing cocksuckers , and TM has the gaul to call Forest Trump on his tweet ? have a look at who you are in bed with !!! have to laugh , Australia shot down your idea of a quick and good trade deal , they said it has to benefit them more than you , and the US has stated that no trade deal will be usable until late 2022/2025 - LOL , Back to WTO deal for you :-) , enjoy being broke , sure come to us , we might give you a loan at the same punitive rate that you gave us when we were on our knees , the same loan you wont allow us to pay back early becasue you want to extract the most interest as you can , what "friend" would do that to another - you reap what you sow - good luck now :-)
Dj Jarvis LOL what planet are you on, we are one of the top ten economies in the world and would be higher if we had never tried to be European we are not socialist or dishonorable enough for that. If we need to suspend our foriegn aid budget and use the money from red nose day etc to support our economy you would really have something to moan about.
have to ask , what part of my original post in factually incorrect ? please elaborate - facts now , not brexit hyperbole
As James O'Brien says, "We’re paying tens of billions of pounds to leave the world’s largest free trade area while surrendering all of our ability to define its rights & regulations.
All so that we can hopefully start negotiating an inferior arrangement with the world’s largest free trade area." Madness
John Hopkins how about thats still a better deal than Londonistan in year 2050
soupit32 - we will leave the EU all in but name - TMay will eventually agree with the common market rules - agree with the custom's union allowing free movement of good's to avoid NI and Ireland border problems- Probably she will say we will have some form of control over immigration and lie to keep brexiter's happy when common market rules express strictly free movement of people - And to achieve absolutely nothing we will sing to a bill of 50 billion and counting for the privilege - you do have to question why there is no urgency to get border control's up and running asap - and ports reopened to deal with cargo if we leave in the next few year's these issue's lead me to believe the Tory party are taking the approach I have stated above
You sound like an ignorant moron. Are you Donald Trump?
+John Hopkins
How can the EU be the worlds biggest "FREE" Trade Area?
When its costing us 50 Billion just to pay up our commitments and then were still not promised a Free Trade Deal.... All that money just so we can enter negotiations!! To me this is a Bad Deal so a No Deal is Better than a Bad Deal going under WTO rules.
Its called being made an example of...get used to it.
United Ireland 🇮🇪 time to take back what Britain should have never stole in the first place
When the old man suggest for Ireland to leave EU the women is literally laughing on his face. I love it.
How do we solve this? The unification of Ireland.
U want a war? thats what will happen if you push that any way soon.
But the unification is inevitable, not one that i thought i would see for generations to come, but it may come sooner than we all think. It will be a new generation of Ireland.
I haven't met anyone who hasn't suggested that the unification of Ireland won't happen.
You won't get a war with any English people, just NI wankers and rangers fans. And fuck those cunts, we don't want them in our country. I'm guessing you don't either, so just chuck them in the fucking sea
illiterate thug The US can take them. Loyalists can become border agents in America. Or they can protect racist statues in the south. Or join the US military and kill civilians in the middle East. Loyalists will love their new home.
😂😂😂🤣 the day is coming, better get your coat
Excellent talk. United Ireland is the obvious solution.
The south couldn’t afford the £10.5 billion that the Westminster Government give them every year,they couldn’t and don’t want to police it either.
@@paulritchie5868 they will receive EU funding, just like all the other small countries
You know except for the unruly prods.
@@paulritchie5868 it’s Ireland. Not the south. It could afford it and work towards reducing and eliminating the deficit. Northern Ireland treated like a backwater by Britain (as Ireland was when it was a colony) and a new Ireland would modernise and reshape its economy.
@@murpho999 South will do just fine.. Saves choking you to say just north
14% of Irish exports go to the UK. 44% of UK exports go to the EU.
Do you honestly think the EU car makers will suddenly stop buying UK goods and close down there business lol But I remind you its not Ireland it is the Irish republic and they cant afford to loss 14% of their exports.
They won't stop buying British services and goods, but they will buy fewer if the UK leaves the single market (partly because they'll be more expensive and partly because British service industries are relocating abroad). Brexit was not Ireland's idea. The best solution is for the UK to stay in the single market. That's why Wales and Scotland have already demanded 'special status' like Northern Ireland (ie staying in the single market).
Gar Sm. There is always going to be something to regret or dread in the future. Global warming, the future power game between the US and China, an ageing population. That does not mean that we should allow Brussels and and few spited people to derail a decision on a border. It's obvious that it needs to stay the way it is with the possibility of staying within the customs union with a special arrangement. Now let's move on to other issues
Hopefully the UK will stay within a customs union but there is bound to be more of a border than now. I expect, for example, Dublin to keep out the chlorinated chicken the Brexiteers want to import (banned by EU regulations). And of course the Brexiteers want to ‘control immigration’ - that necessitates border checks. Ireland is rightly negotiating with European partners in the hope the British see sense and minimise the damage.
Gar Sm
Leavers : buying from us is a good deal right now as the pound is low. Win win
Remainer - we import materials to produce items and the pound is low - Loose Loose
Funny how uk has a one step at a time approach to a goal that keeps shifting - but hey the little fish are gonna eat the big fish. And our banana republic will be the biggest banana shipper under no deal terms - first we need to train people to grow straight bananas coz all leavers know that is an Eu regulation.
Here we are more than a year later and they still don't have any details. What a shower of clowns.
Mhhhhh a deal with the British that’s always worked out great
The good friday agreement is a deal with the UK.
bo ptah yes paid for in blood by many innocent people that's the kind of deal you talking about?
Come with the rest of the population to 2017
Still a lot of people prefer resentment to progress.
My favorite part was when the British moderator asked the Irish panel with a straight face if the Irish government was disrespecting the will of the British people!? Oh the irony is delicious.
Plus, I can't wait to see Sammy Wilson's ruddy face next week when he learns that May called his bluff and sold the unionists out. Just wait, the Tories will agree to a regulatory agreement on the Island of Ireland that will be a customs union in all but name.
The DUP hold the keys to May's government. They could go back on the deal and May and the Conservatives lose that majority.
The DUP would have to give up the most power they've ever had to do it. They would also have to know that Corbyn would most likely win the snap election that is caused as a result of them pulling out of the Confidence and Supply agreement. And Corbyn government will go along with everything the EU is advising and may reverse Brexit entirely if they win a big majority. Thats why I think the DUP threat is a bluff.
Tom Glass. I'll take that bet Tom. There will be no customs union.
As a Brexiteer, I'm definitely on edge and feel like It's slipping away from us day by day.
Are you as confident that their will not be a regulatory scheme that acts like a customs union but is not called a "customs union" for political reasons? This I think is the most likely compromise. It gives the ROI and EU what it wants but allows May and the DUP to save face.
The British government should probably have come up with the workable solution to this before deciding to have a referendum.
They definitely should have before having the referendum.
They absolutely definitely should have before triggering article 50.
And now we're half-way through negotiations and still no closer to any workable proposals on the details of the Irish border. It's incompetence.
Ofcourse they should have, but Brexit was never meant to happen.
youwhatmate
That's no excuse, Ireland and westminster should have discussed this before the EU vote .
End occupation and Unite Ireland already
End occupation and unite Europe already.
Yes please..you asked the south about this..
Let's face it, when did the English ever care about NI?
Only when the DUP is required to add their particular brand of unionism to prop up whichever government wants or needs their support allowing it to function. Normally about 2 Billion.
The entire island of Ireland, including the tiny 6 county colony in the NE corner of Ireland voted to REMAIN, honour their vote.
The 26 counties didn't have a vote eejit - Remember they left the UK ( without a vote ) in 1922
You seem hell bent on starting a war again shows what brain power you have. The Irish Republic did not take part in the brexet vote. Now you only need to look at the last election results to see Northern Ireland is now behind the only Brexet party here. It returned more MPs than ever before in its history and now is the biggest group in Northern Ireland. This happened because of the way the EU were treating the UK in the deals on the future. The IRA failed to push us out of the UK against our wishes and we will not let the EU/ Irish Republic do it now.
Ernest - The North voted remain, and whether or not you ask for a passport you are all ,unlike British people , going to remain EU Citizens so the north is different and the EU will have say .A return to violence would be bad but makes no difference to the situation other than maybe a closer EU involvment and sactions on the UK if they start their previous oppressive tactics
5888max fuck that. Ask the white nationalists in the US to agree to take the unionists. The confedrate soliders and kkk members came from the unionist families in NI. True fact. The loyalists can have as many guns as they want and they can make it their mission to save confederate statues from harm. Ni gets peace and the US gets idiots who argue about people who don't stand for the flag. Win win.
Ashley -Flags/Flegs bloody bane of Ireland , shame that the nice blue one with the pretty gold stars has now become divisive - But to your country go further back and 8 of the signatures on the US declaration of Independence were of Ulster Scots Background , the United Irishmen were lead by a Anglican with mostly nonconformist ulster support . Plenty of Catholic Irish are Racist Idiots ,and maybe you have seen ''Gone with the wind'' the plantation is called Tara and the Family O'Hara a very Catholic Munster name !
Give Ireland back to the Irish. End the British occupation.
It's as though the panel is unaware of how many UK & Irish undocumented immigrants are living in the US.
I don't know why you throw that in there and what relevance it has to a border issues arising out of brexit between the Rep of ireland/EU and the UK.Wasn't aware of any british illegals in the US irish of course,but not the brits you could have all 60million of them for all i care Ashley fiorentino
There are more illegal UK citizens in the US than Irish, as far as visa overstayers go.
I bring that up bc there is a cognitive dissonance of anti immigrant advocates. It has been my experience, as soon as the understanding hits that anti immigrant rhetoric applies to UK citizens living elsewhere their argument suddenly changes. And fun fact: the US is having a serious crackdown on illegal immigrants. What will happen when UK citizens are subjected to the brutal treatment of the US immigrant detention centers?
The population of republic of ireland is 4.8 million the population of UK is 66m so naturally they are going to be more in number ,but as a % of population there would be more irish probably.They are politicians here trying to get a fairer deal for our undocumented.My position is whether they are irish are not they are breaking the law.We deal very severely with illegals in ireland why should we expect americans to be any different.
clay fada This answer is exactly the type of double speak that is so common. By your own rational undocumented Irish immigrants are breaking the law.
So why are Irish politicians trying to get a better deal for Irish undocumented?
Why do Irish undocumented feel entitled for fairer treatment for their undocumented?
In Ireland illegal immigrants are treated harshly. So why would America be different.
Your previous invalidates this argument. Irish undocumented are trying to get a "fairer" deal. Ireland treats illegal immigrants harshly. So does America so why are Irish politicians trying to exempt the Irish from American laws?
I don't why you call it double speak.Irishillegal immigrants aren't entitled to special treatment .Politicians are doing what politicians do get votes and they are votes to get on this issue alot of irish people have friends and family undocumented in america,including myself,but nevertheless they are breaking the law and should be dwelt with accordingly.
I don't how i can be clearer.
I write this post over 3 YEARS after this interview was first aired.
The U K is still dithering over the border. Still not sorted.
There are 3 airports and 5 seaports in northern Ireland, the only logic is to move customs to them, there is 275 road crossing, more than the EU's eastern border which only has 137 crossings.
Stop using logic your confusing the unionists.
The EU wants a border it's EU's problem
No, they don't.
Great there's no issue then
No there is an issue, its the UK government refusing to offer a workable solution to the customs problem.
Hope Ben is enjoying his Irish Sea border lol 😂
All those borders that UK had building around the world are those who had problems today
Like Andrew Maxwell said it’s not the Irish boarder it’s the British boarder in ireland that’s causing the trouble our boarder is on the beach.
Neale Richardson is very impressive.
Irish speakers so much more elegant and intelligent. Neale Richmond in a different league. What a speaker... As regards the other donkeys...
I support a united ireland and brexit and I’m not the only one
Leo Kavanagh!! And there we have it, even educated British media types have NO clue about Ireland and many British people struggle to distinguish between the North and South on a map. You created the problem by forcibly partitioning our country, now having chosen Brexit and all that comes with it, it’s your problem to solve.
Brexshit means Brexshit.
This video has not aged well
I say we ask Farrage Johnson and The Daily Fail to sort this out. Their mess. With the white van knuckle dragers of course.
Whose idea was it to not position the chairs to cover up the utilities outlet on the floor?
We have had free movement between the United Kingdom and Ireland since 1923. Why should Brexit change anything
Monarchist 18 yep this is a non issue so no idea why people are so upset
It's goods more than people to be honest
Monarchist 18 he's mostly saber rattling because his government is falling apart here in ireland
Because the two countries joined the EU together it has never been a issue , but the Uk now wants to be a foreign country . Ireland did something similar in 1949 when it lest the Commonwealth , but it is more difficult here because other EU countrys may not be as happy to allow a face saving compromise as the other commonwealth countries were
MrAckers75 So an immigrant can move to Ireland and then pass into England?
Yanis Varoufakis has a point!! Why just have the Bank of England doing Quantitative Easing! When the Government could have its own investment Bank to do the same thing, But could borrow the money free to it self and then invest it in the People!!
What you mean like Venezuela? Zimbanbwe? soviet union? Argentina?. It does not matter where currency comes from. It is mickey mouse shit anyway.. gold and silver is money. and don't you ever forget it.
Please tell me you don't mean the Greek finance minister!
+MrAckers75
At the moment the Rothschild's owned Bank of England can do Quantative Easing (Basically Print Money) So Why pay Interest to this Establishment when the Government can set up its own Bank and borrow money freely! calling this Bank the Investment Bank! Owned by the People for the People!!!!!!!
1spikelet. Because banks cannot print money. you cannot create money out of thin air. That is why it is called currency.It is not money. just letting the government create currency is as bad as letting banks do it. It will be abused. Can you imagine the Labour party printing currency.?. God help us.
Twats thats what the bank of england is It is the government bank.
How DARE the British come back and look to impose a new border across our island and drag the North out of the EU against their will. We've taken 800 years of absolute disgusting behaviour from our colonial overlords.
It's absolutely time for Ireland to play hard ball. We are finally at a stage, despite Britain where we are able to be grown up, adult and stand up for ourselves. Bring on a border, hard or soft at your peril Britain.
Why did so many important issues not become major talking points in the debates leading up to Brexit? Theresa May is looking like a turkey in December......if she falls the hairy clown who led the bandwagon could be next in line......where is he? Why isn't he focusing on this with all his abilities?
It's just another ploy to stall the UK leaving!
If y'all can't see that your just silly
MrAckers75
Cant you see what is going on here. Its divide and conquer. The EU tried this on, over Gibraltar until they got a bloody nose, and spain (realising what damage it would do to their already faltering economy) backed off for the sake of the people who crossed the border to work in Gibraltar. They failed there. Next, desperate for another weapon to fight with, they identified the tension which still exists between Northern Ireland and ROI as a prize plumb to pick.
For the purpose of causing as much mahem and dissent as they can, the EU has carried out one despicable act which so far is working exactly as they want it to, by generating this confrontation once again between the UK and ROI. Here we all are on this board all having a good go at each other.
They know that NI/UK are reluctant to ram the the stick into the nest of rats which will give rise to the IRA kicking off again, , because they dont want to see the troubles reappear. The EU sees this as our achilles heel and they are making the most of it they can regardless of the danger and risk to lives, that it will set confrontation off once again. The EU have effectively, deliberately dropped a lit candle into a powder magazine, well aware of the consequences of generating a knee jerk reaction. This shows to me the truly despicable nature of the characters that are in charge of this EU, that they would set up such an action that endangers peoples lives. That is why the UK wants out, and itt would be in your own future interests ROI if you left with us.
666VICKING1 Excellent post if the EU wants to create a hard border they will have blood on their hands. If they want to help create a workable solution they could. ROI have to do what they consider is best for themselves.
Well if it became clear how difficult Brexit would actually be that would have lost a lot of votes, as Eurosceptics became more unsure about how it could happen. But Boris really wanted to be PM and so... vague concepts over a detailed analysis.
vdotme, He's stuck hanging out on a zipwire somewhere. Safest place for him. And for everyone else.
11 months later, still no deal.
Eoghan Ryan still no deal
I'm sorry but this is an issue that needs to be sorted out with Ireland and the eu.
Ireland should try growing a pair and tell the eu there won't be a hard border full stop
Ireland should grow a pair alright and tell britian and the british to fuck off
St Malky the issue is with the eu not britain
We are happy to leave our border with you open why wouldn't we be the EU just creates problems
Ah but havnt you heard Leo has no balls. Hes heading for a hard border he could have had a soft digital border where the border would only have been marked by a few road signs. But then his Republican greed toke over his head he thought he could take Northern Ireland out of the UK by the EU back door lol. Shows how stupid he is.
The funny thing now is that UK Government total weakness has now rendered DUP irrelevant to Parliamentary Arithmetic ! They are now rightly a minor irrelevant player in Westminster. How times have changed.
Fantastic result, let's get on with it..walking away with no deal is the best thing that could possibly happen now. Well done Nigel and Co.
Should Ireland curtail it's own aspirations, policy and trade, for that of the UK, it would be disrespecting the democratic will of it's people. I'm yet to see how the UK can exit and secure a better trade situation, for one, that would improve on it's current set-up. In lieu of developments that could excise the possibility of a hard leave, I don't see how the UK doesn't take a sharp blow to trade whilst it seeks to engage new deals. The UK has chosen to go it's own way; seems odd to expect that the EU would just give ground, that member states would do the same, especially give the long historical concerns that are so painfully visible here between the North and the Republic.
The UK will get passports and will have to deal with non-EU membership queues; the UK will have to comply with EU regulations to trade into the bloc (and I don't know how it could be done without some sort of oversight like a Customs - needed also to deal with the plausible concurrent questions of illegal immigration and undocumented refugees that apparently energised the leave vote); the UK will have to abide by WTO rules until such time as new agreements can be reached. And the problem here appears to be time, especially time lost. I really hope all the experts are wrong and that UK gets through without enormous stress and difficulty.
The Irish are for the first time in years holding the cards over the British government and it's colonists in the north I just hope Leo has the balls to use the advantage - I think he does oddly the half Indian gayness might mean he is less likely to over estimate the British position than your run of the mill paddy
Not exactly - Even Nationalistic Irish politicians have a bit of over blown view of British intelligence and deviousness It's not thickness it's just a sort of cultural feeling due to history as a more cosmopolitan figure I think Varadka is less likely to avoid seeing that the Brit's are in a mess and don't know what they are up to at all
Haha what cards you fool? We are leaving the EU end of story, its not rocket science. Why can you people not grasp this?
Killbotone, its called article 50, its a 2 year transition period from the moment we enacted article 50, so we will be leaving in about a year and a half's time. It is now enshrined in law that we must leave.
The fact that the EU is ten times the size of the UK and it needs a Trade deal more than them as a Member Ireland gets to say if Uk gets a trade deal or not , in fact the wether it evens get to talk about one. the UK can not bully Ireland back as the EU will protect it - that mate is all the cards and proves the benefits of EU membership that the UK has foolishly thrown away it does not only apply to Ireland next time the UK as a dispute with sy China or the US they will win and Britain will lose
Havnt you heard Leos balls are no good lol leverage over the Uk in your dreams if you want a hard border your going the right way to get it. Time for the UK to stop buying Irish republics goods lol. Your statement shows you still full of Republican anti British hate Time you guys woke up and became our friends but hey we dont need you so do your worst it will do you more harm than us. We wont be there to bail you out the next time your wee country goes bankrupt.
19:12 cut to March 2019
Northern Ireland either has to fully accept UK Brexit and whatever European Union imposes on its Ireland border, or Northern Ireland leaves UK and rejoins with Ireland to become one country albeit now only an EU region.
YES 💯%✅ UNITED IRELAND 🇮🇪🇮🇪🇮🇪
when will people stop calling it the Irish border.... it's not it's the EU border with the UK. people so scared of mentioning the EU ? or is it because the Irish don't see them self's as EU? the UK don't want a border, the Irish don't want a border... so it's a EU border let them manage and control it, after all the Irish have given up their sovereignty to the EU. could they actually legally disagree with the EU choice of the border ? if not why don't they also leave ?
chef no I won't stfu. it's the EU border, Ireland doesn't exist within the EU... the UK doesn't exist within the EU, that's why we voted brexit. stop pandering to your masters and tell the EU f off making a border in your country
chef. no. Ireland is under the authority of the EU. you are EU property. It is the EU border and you will do what you are told by your EU masters. If you listen to the Irish traitor in the video then you will hear that you are 'europe' not Ireland. Get used to it lackey.
NaZReD
The UK votes to leave the EU and commit economical suicide (hyperbolic) and now you demand that Ireland follows you and you think they tell the EU fuck off?
Oh the irony.
Btw Ireland the "slave" has full veto rights on every deal.
You have no idea what you are talking about.
Also wasn't one reason for the Brexit to "take back control of the borders". How will you do this, if you favor an open border?
You can't deny anyone the entry into Ireland and if there is no border, they can just enter the UK.
bo ptah your ignorance of any of the problems in this issue is a complete disgrace do some research before you spout off.
Jakob . You know nothing. The Irish have always free movement in and out of the UK so we are not threatened by a soft border. If any illegal immigrants come in from Ireland then we are not obliged to give them any benefits and we can jail and deport them without interference from EU when they get caught. Judging by the amount of squealing coming from Dublin it is them who are worried by the economic consequences of Brexit. We don't give a shit about their veto. In fact they would be doing us a favour if they use it coz it would mean a Hard Brexit with no money to the EU.
Why is that guy's tie so long???
Just walk away and tell them that we will not put up any borders.If the EU want to put up boarders then the Irish really should consider there position with them...
I think you have hit the nail squarely on the head there traci beacer. The British Isles should be united in this matter.
You are absolutely correct.
This is just a stalling tactic to keep us in as long as possible
The Irish will do whats best for Ireland as long as it is agreed by the other 26
Roger Bennet What if it's not alright with the other 26? What if the other 26 demand you put up a hard border? What then?
Fool, the filthy British imposed the border partitioning Ireland. Get out, and take your Neanderthal DUPs with you please.
Any new news?
The people of the UK voted for Brexit and we keep hearing about how the Irish respect that decision. Well if that decision ends up with a boarder fence, passports, customs control etc would the Irish please respect that.
VaucluseVanguard No, the Irish government won't accept that. They're standing up for the people of Ireland and the people of Northern Ireland because the British government certainly isn't. The border will be in the Irish sea
Don't think the IRA/ UVF will accept that ....
You need to give respect to get respect. Britain has never respected Ireland, why should they expect respect now? Britain shot itself in the foot, and now must live with the consequences.
The people of all of Ireland voted to REMAIN including the tiny 6 county colony in the NE corner of Ireland. Dump the Neanderthal DUPs move your vile border to the Irish Sea where it belongs. Place the DUP at the bottom of the Irish Sea, where they belong.
We now have seen the answer to that with Leo going behind the backs of the people of Northern Ireland Traitor May should go.
again...the same old rhetoric about Ireland taking 7m during the financial crisis..and again no mention of the 'loan' that Britain took from the US around the same time (50m).
sorry, that should have been 7bn and 50bn.
6 days until the October 2018 talks which mark be end of this process and we are still no further forward than we were a year ago.
37%yes in Scotland. In 2014 we were told the indy result 55-45 was a massive support for the Union. Now 37% is a massive support to leave the EU
No one advocating for remain on the panel. How is that all sides?
The Irish ambassador to Canada just got fired
Since United States immigration at both Dublin and Shannon Airport was mentioned. How does that benefit the Republic of Ireland?
It attracts flights from third countries: flights from the Middle East to JFK for example, stop over at Shannon where passengers can go through US immigration and do a little shopping in the duty free. Ireland benefits from landing fees and revenue at the duty free.
There's about as much chance of the DUP not turning the Irish border into an ugly issue as there is of Arlene Foster appearing as a Playboy centrefold.
Damn you, I read that.
The UK government doesn't seem to have an answer . I am not sure what they were thinking of at all , the DUP could collapse the government.
A hard border would be a nightmare but it looks like it will go that way .
Can't see the IRA/ UVF being happy at their drug smuggling and people trafficking being interrupted. This may end up costing money and lives ( I hope I am wrong about the lives part )
The DUP were happy to have a soft digital border it was the Irish Republic who rejected that. Leo could have taked to the DUP instead the Irish Republics leader decided to go behind the backs of the people of Northern Ireland Leo and the EU risking the lives of our people here in Northern Ireland SHAME on them. The people will not take a new border between Northern Ireland and the rest of the UK
ernest rogen Sorry but you are getting one . WTO says there will have to be one , and most Brexit voters want you to toe the line . It doesn't matter that it will bring back violance in your region as long as they have soverinty.
The digtail border was deemed as unworkable by UK experts as well
I am afraid the Torries couldn't care less about you . So long as Arelene keeps backing the Torries there will be no issue
If the UK government don't care about Northern England what chance do Wales Scotland or Northern Ireland have ?
It's not just Republican thugs who will kick of . Do you think the UVF will take a border lying down ? Or do the deaths of innocent Catholics not bother you?
Wife comes home to find hated husband with revolver pressed to his temple. She screams with laughter saying: "Are you going to shoot yourself?" He replies: "What are you laughing at, the next bullet is for you!" That's Brexit!
Brexit is a misnomer. One assumes it means BRITAIN EXIT, when in fact, if one looks at the UK referendum vote as a whole it should be EXIT, meaning ENGLAND EXIT.
The rest of the UK apart from Wales voted to Remain. Only the English voted to leave and then that was demographically weighed in favour of the Lancaster Bomber and Spitfire Darby and Joan vote. The young voters wanted to Remain. London wants to remain. As well as being fed up with the EU, it would appear that the EXIT English are fed up with the UK. The Scots want to leave. The English want them to leave.
I am sure that the English would be chuffed if the Northern "Irish" Unionists left as well. It would save them billions in Northern Ireland subventions which could be ploughed into a creaking NH.
NI Natonalists want to leave the UK and stay in the EU.
The DUP, a small wag the dog minority relative to the rest of the UK is holding the UK government to ransom to get what they want, which is to remain part of the UK and hang on to their outmoded and redundant ideas of identity.The rest of the UK resent their special treatment.
Somebody described referenda as playing Russian roulette with a two chamber revolver. Bang! There goes, the UK, EU membership, Good Friday Agreement and peace and prosperity in our time. Brexit, or EXIT, is one unholy mess which must be resolved with a new referendum based on EU withdrawal terms, or, preferably a return to EU membership.
Where is the UK Opposition in all this? They are a disgrace for their lack of of proactivity in this matter.
It's what a slim majority wanted at that point, not what the people want now. Why would anyone want this mess we are in now?
"It's what a slim majority wanted at that point"
A majority is a majority. I'm sure if it was 52% to remain, it would have been a done deal.
"not what the people want now"
Based off what polls or statistics, or is this just what you wish?
"Why would anyone want this mess we are in now?"
What mess? I expected worse, but so far, not too bad. The Irish border is a nonsensical issue.
If we had another vote today Northern Ireland would vote out. The reason being we now see the true colours of the EU in the way it is treating the UK. You only have to look at the last election results to see that. The only brexet party has returned more MPs than ever before in its history making them the biggest group in Northern Ireland so it is fare to say Northern Ireland is NOW behind brexet.
That's how elections/referendums work mate, no matter what side you were on we have to face that we can't disregard an election that was never challenged at the time. The real people to blame would be. David Cameron for allowing the chance and the MPs that allowed for the referendum on the first place.
5:10 Half chips of the world are made in Ireland? I would like to see her source
If all imports come through the UK like they have done for years it kinda makes your backstop a mute point.
If we have an "hard border" do we have to build a dividing wall too all around NI?
What's going on about both Ireland???????
We drive through Dartford tunnel with no more toll booths and you don't see the cameras.
watching this is 2021....the first casualty of brexit was the truth.....
The uk voted to leave the single market and stop freedom of movement
its a pity the fight was only over trade in the last few hundred years
History if we chose to learn from it should teach us COMPROMISE,WORKS& IS THE ONLY way .
Very good ( if very late) analysis by Channel 4.
I don't see the problem, if S/Ireland is so fixed on a North/South border, why don't they build one?
They want it, they build it. Simples. Let them be the ones to take the flack at S/Ireland's next General Election.
the problem is you. they DON'T want a border.
eehhh have you being alive the last couple of weeks. EU/British negotiations, regulatory alignment, promise of no hard border, remain in customs union/single market.
You stupid Brit get out of our country,
Dave Phipps - The UK promised an open NI border and full alignment with the EU rules and regulations.
Interesting debate, the lady states that Southern Ireland is doing very well economically and implies they do not need the UK. With Corporation Tax at 12.5% you can see why, but as the EU becomes more integrated the rest of the EU will not allow such a low rate of CT, you would think the chairman would know that and ask that question?
What's 'Southern Ireland', Eric?
Ireland is going well economically because it took measures to deal with the economic crisis more quickly than anyone else, and has a younger, very flexible and well educated workforce and trades with the world. It is not simply the corporation tax.
we have written guarantees that our tax rate cannot be changed , we got this after the Irish rejected the Lisbon treaty, got amendments the we back and voted again once the Lisbon treaty suited Ireland , democracy , thats how it works , you English should try it some time . and yet for some reason the English think that our re vote was something to ridicule us for , they clearly dont understand why we did , shows why ye also voted for brexit , out of ignorance and bullshit
Taint. twill soon be time to start giving more to the EU.
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@ Roger
You make it sound like a bad thing.
careful. troubles will ignite again with the current attitude against us irish.
MXFXE It's brewing.This though there is the internet and drone camera's to prove the British state crimes.
Fair play Neale Richmond!
UNITED EIRE
Hows this going for you ? Ireland is not your whipping boy . You chose this you fix it. We wont be paying for it. The UK have a cheek to expect us to shut up .
The Unionist Journalist (who spoke reasonably overall) suggested that Brexit voting figures were quite similar throughout the UK and used the phrase "skeptical" to imply support for Brexit. Well that's wrong as it is perfectly possible to be a Euro-Skeptic but pro-Remain. Wanting to adjust or reform institutions is not equal to leaving. Furthermore, Scottish pro-EU vote (about 64%) if I recall correctly, is far off the situation in England overall. Discussions such as this can give insight but the horrible undercurrent of threats to peace should the GFA fail is not helped by Tory-DUP complicity nor Dublin's fundamentalist position on the border. Swiss border points don't cause poverty anywhere. The Irish border could easily be managed to facilitate and encourage trade. The issue is the GFA, already in difficulty due to the Executive Stalemate in Belfast. I cannot help but be fearful of the outcome should Brexit happen.
That was very informative, best yet.
Its another british obstacal in the progression of ireland a small province iscolated northern ireland is not viable on its own we want to grow together and prosper . Its simple but unfortunality politics allways seem to get in the way
"Gladstone spent his declining years trying to guess the answer to the Irish question; unfortunately, whenever he was getting warm, the Irish secretly changed the question."
Theresa May isn't Gladstone and Britain has nothing like the importance it had. So, now the question's changed yet again, how do we deal with it? We can't, is the answer.
Saw this when initially broadcast. Just watching it again in August 2019 and feeling I was right to be much more pessimistic than the panel at the end here. It strikes me now with just over 60 days left until BoJo takes us out that we still have nothing on the table by way of an alternative to the backstop from the architect of leave. Posturing with Angela Merkel in Berlin two days ago about being hopeful to come up with an alternative in 30 days when they have produced nothing but hot air in three years that would enable Ireland or the EU to drop the backstop.
This is from the Future there is still no deal.
It's July 2019, listening to this is really funny. Man, everones prediction was way off. I'm French Canadian. I have been looking at the Brexit process from far away. After all this drama, I doubt that the UK will ever leave. Lets see what comes next.
They want to move forward to phase 2,but they need to know the details,first.
And they won't GOTO phase 2 with out these.
So what is it phase two or not
Just leave, all this aggro goes away. May is the only one left who wants a trade deal. She is traitor. History will show
We promise to keep delivering our speciality - the chip fat as long as you deliver us the potatoes.
Friendship saved.
The option of keeping Northern Ireland inside the EU customs union and therefore aligned to the European Union let the people of N Ireland decide in a referendum. If unionists have nothing to fear from such a referendum bring it on.
Irland ONE and free.
Fine Gael who are usually pro Britain and Anti Republican did more than West Brit michèal Martin
Basset = traitor
Scotland voted to remain in the EU 62% of Scots voted to remain in the EU not 40%
The EU Commision states that any EU member country that borders on a non-EU neighbour has to maintain and administer a secure border with said country.Therefore,is it not to be expected of Ireland to respect their responsibilities and do the same ,post Brexit?
Yes, it is.
I have gone almost crazy trying to tell people this: Ireland can not just decide on their own to let goods and people flow freely from a non-EU nation into Europe through Ireland. Estonia can not suddenly decide that they will open up everything to Russia, and let Russian goods flow through the EU, as if in the single market.
everyone should understand this:
1. no cherrypicking
2. the four freedoms of the EU are INDIVISIBLE\
if UK leaves custom union and single market, no matter what future trade relations will be agreen on, a hard border is inevitable in Northern Ireland so hoping that a trade agreement will solve this is a fantasy.
There wasn’t a deal
We British and Irish have to recognise that as we are so connected geographically we are on the same boat. Attacking one another will and should not be within the interests of either of us.
The Irish aren't attacking anyone, they're just point out something the British don't wish to see.
Taint ABird. You do make a point, as is seen by the ignorance that certain Ministers have displayed on the issue, though I still feel that we should find a solution without allowing Brexit and the British, European ego war get in the way. After all the issue truly concerns the Irish nations primarily instead of London and Brussels who will be minimally affected irrespective of the outcome.
Geographically we are connected to you as much as France is , the problem is political .as in NI was politically annexed by British people planted there by your government . hence the troubles .really if it wasnt for NI we would happily wave you a kiss good bye .