Part One: Kellogg: The Great American Cum Doctor | BEHIND THE BASTARDS
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Part One: Kellogg: The Great American Cum Doctor | BEHIND THE BASTARDS
Robert is joined by Miles Gray to discuss John Harvey Kellogg.
Original Air Date: April 6, 2021
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There’s a reason the History Channel has produced hundreds of documentaries about Hitler but only a few about Dwight D. Eisenhower. Bad guys (and gals) are eternally fascinating. Behind the Bastards dives in past the Cliffs Notes of the worst humans in history and exposes the bizarre realities of their lives. Listeners will learn about the young adult novels that helped Hitler form his monstrous ideology, the founder of Blackwater’s insane quest to build his own Air Force, the bizarre lives of the sons and daughters of dictators and Saddam Hussein’s side career as a trashy romance novelist.
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#BehindtheBastards #BehindtheBastardsPodcast #RobertEvansBehindtheBastards #BehindtheBastardsMerch #BehindtheBastardsJohnLandis #BehindTheBastardsHost #BehindtheBastardsIvermectin #BestBehindtheBastardsEpisodes #BehindtheBastardsBestEpisodes
It's always wierd for me when this guy comes up, as he is my great-grandfathers brother. On a completely unrelated note that side of my family struggles a lot with mental health issues so I am sure there is absolutely no connection.
For anyone remembering, Benjamin Rush was ancestor of Stockton Rush, the billionaire moron who got all those people killed in the submarine.
That rang a bell for me, thanks for confirming!
my lovely home state of Michigan brought us so many historical people: lewis cass, John Kellogg, Charles Coughlin, Henry Ford, the DeVos family...oh wait. oh. oh god. oh god no.
I guess we also gave the world Bruce Campbell and kristen bell, Diana Ross, John Hughes, Aretha Franklin, Stevie wonder, sam raimi, technically Malcom x and rosa parks and sojourner truth, Pontiac (though he predates us really), ICP...I guess our great lakes area has done alright. and thats not even close to all of them. apparently Tom Selleck was born in Detroit?
I have a saying that explains all this, "Michigan is a southern state." you have no idea how many confederate flags I saw growing up here.
Michigan also gave us Iggy Pop, so I can forgive a bunch.
You might call them Michiganers.... you know meschuganas?
@@ivanterrible7362 And Kiss, and the White Stripes/Jack White.
22:28 literally the "Jesus is coming, look busy" bumper sticker
Incidentally, the Hebrew year of 1843 was thousands of years ago (it's currently 5783)
Weird little fact about Kellogg's: They use a picture of a rooster on the cornflakes packet as a pun. Keiliog (pronounced "kye-lee-ogg") translates from Welsh to English as rooster.
I would point out that Jewish numerology goes back a lot further than this and might have been an influence on this guy.
Medical historian Lawerence Henderson famously wrote that “Somewhere between 1910 and 1912 in this country,... a random patient, with a random disease, consulting a doctor chosen at random had, for the first time in the history of mankind, a better than fifty-fifty chance of profiting from the encounter.”
You have to remember that was passed for "medicine" in the 19th century had almost no basis in empirical science. Almost no practicing physicians had been trained in the sciences. At its best it was a collection of folk practices passed down from one generation of physicians from another with little empirical basis of efficacy. There was little to no regulation of medical practice or medical education. The landmark even in medical education was the Flexnor report which resulted in the shuttering of most medical schools in the country.
This episode really begs the question; "What North American fly has a bite that triggers life-long near fatal diarrhea?
I think the reason that some of these people seem more moral than modern day grifters is that it was much more likely in the past that normal people with basically functioning reasoning would believe this stuff. No matter how rational you are, you can only work with the knowledge that exists in your society. When every possible world-view you are presented with includes some kind of magical thinking you are nearly bound to end up believing in some variety or another. I think back then the leaders of these kinds of movements were a combination of grifters and people who genuinely just thought they were helping.
Today, moreso than in the past, the background knowledge of society acts as a filter. Those who remain in the world of cults and quackery are a selection of the most gullible and the most nefarious. It's like how things like the Nigerian Prince or gift-card scams seem really silly, but actually that's by design. It pre-filters their targets to be more vulnerable (in a variety of possible ways) so the scammers waste less time and are less likely to get caught. Basically evolutionary processes have made grifters and cults more efficient at being evil in much the same way they have for industry and finance under capitalist rule.
This makes sense, I would add that at the time it probably led genuine folks to the top more than grifters, since most people do have a hard time squaring things when they see someone consistently going back on what they have said before without genuine remorse.
Lucian of Samosata's account of Alexander the Oracle (he calls him an exploiter who preys on the superstitious and gullible for financial gain and fame) seems to propose that it's much much older than you think, and the wild west snake oil salesmen definitely backs up that most grifters are at *best* at least not poisoning people and clearly aware of their quackery.
The grifts only seem "more moral" because you haven't heard of the utterly appalling history of quackery in that period (radium "beauty glow" anyone? What about exhorting women to *give their babies liquid opium so they can go out and have fun without a babysitter by making the baby get doped into lethargic sleep* ?).
I had an interest in quackery for a while in my teens and 20s and I can tell you any morality in the grifting is because of exceptions to the exploiter/snake oil salesman/conman rule.
The only TRULY moral "grift" I can think of is the roadside showman who singlehandedly proved premature babies could thrive and weren't a death sentence if they had incubators and specific formulas. That guy read cutting-edge medical discoveries from europe and he invented the first preemie incubator design in america, and then he made it a sideshow attraction, with a whole creche of premature kiddos being tended to by wetnurses and nurses he'd hired using the money the "attraction" got.
That was after he was laughed out of the hospital he tried to sell his invention to because they thought premature births were a death sentence and weren't worth the effort.
That man was possibly the first confidence trickster who used his silver tongue to save lives and finance said life-saving endeavor with his exploitation. He's also the only "con" I've encountered that seemed altruistic in nature instead of just "harmless, at least" in my pretty extensive searching.
(I still have to look up grifts in other cultures and in the pre-1700s outside of Lucian's texts and greek travelogue ass-pulls, mind, so I'm not an authority, just someone who got obsessed with the wild west and then James Randi and then pseudoscience and woo in general for a while).
@@neoqwerty I should clarify that I although I believe you were more likely to find a genuinely good person in such a position in the past than today, I still definitely agree that the majority have always been scumbags. I also think this change over time has been stronger with religious movements than with medical scams.
Believe me I am well familiar with the history of quackery in general. There was definitely way more quackery in the past then today and I am not arguing otherwise. And the stuff they did was waaaay more gruesome and horrible. I just think that since almost literally all medicine before the 20th century was utter garbage, you can't hold all doctors of the time responsible for doing what, according to their training, they thought was supposed to help. Without the benefit of any good experimental protocols or data it's possible to convince yourself something's working for a long time. Certainly I don't doubt that it also happened that more perceptive doctors did notice that they were killing/harming people and just hoped nobody else did.
Also a big James Randi fan! I was lucky enough to see him speak when he came through town a few years before he passed.@@neoqwerty
Ya know, according to the Bible, Miller should've been put to death for blasphemy for The Great Disappointment. In all their digging for secrets, they never bother to read it.
once again, Raytheon gets the shaft, and I am Here for it! Also this episode gave me "Road to wellville" flashbacks.......
I might have done it wrong but the Jewish year 1843 would be 1918 BCE. He was a little off on his predictions he accidentally calculated the completion of Stonehenge rather then the end of the world.
The warning about part two was honestly really good to hear, as someone who knows at least some of what's coming
Gotta say, the bit about Michigan being just a weird, weird place is stunningly accurate.
When I was a kid, I wanted to grow up to be a bug doctor. Was halfway through an English degree when I realized my mistake....
Not that it particularly matters, but actually the sawing off of people's legs was entirely separate from "heroic" medicine lmao. Surgeons and doctors did two entirely different jobs... and didn't like each other at all. People also generally trusted surgeons more, because ironically you tended to die less from a cauterised amputation than taking mercury salts for a prolonged period XD I guess in small towns there was probably one guy who did both things (like how Kellogg apparently saw) but they were two totally separate disciplines with no love for each other in general.
all the biblical numerology stuff is extremely funny when you remember the bible is very explicitly anti-divination in any form, it is also very explicit noone but god himself will know when the apocalypse comes until it comes, so every person who has attempted to predict the end times is committing double blasphemy
58:42 interesting anecdote about Ben Carson, when I was born (1995) I was diagnosed with something called Chiari Malformation and needed to get decompression surgery when I was still a baby. Coincidently, one of the physicians my mom spoke to was Carson, but he actually recommended a different doctor who he said was more qualified for the surgery, a degree of humbleness he has long since lost.
Wait a minute. Is this the Road to Wellville guy? OH MY GOD IT IS. That movie is made into a goofy comedy, but it's also pretty horrifying when you consider it was actually done to people. I knew all this sounded familiar.
The movie is horrifying without even getting into all his torture treatments.
Although he might have been the first to use "bible codes" in the same way you see it with conspiracy nuts today, Miller was far from the first person to become obsessed with hidden meanings in the bible. Isaac Newton spent most of the later part of his life working on this (and other occult stuff,) and hilariously considered his work in that field to be his most important contribution to humanity. Although Newton did not predict the end of the world exactly, he did use bible "science" to conclude that it would happen no earlier than the year 2060.
On its own it's not an immediately ridiculous conclusion (that there might be significance to the number of letters in a line or word and so on, not that you can predict things with Biblical verses). There's a bit of a tradition of Jewish numerology in religious texts that was used to hide additional meanings or reference things. Basically they'd fix it so that the letters in a row all added to the same thing, or they'd reference a number as a coded indicator of a word. Some of this was sort of mystical/magic stuff, a lot of the names of God add up to the same few values (the Tetragrammaton is supposed to add to the same thing in both its short and long form if I remember correctly [which I probably don't]). But early Christendom had a tendency to form protest communities, so they really went in for coded messages at certain parts of their history. There's speculation for example, that the number 616 and 666 are references to the current Emperor, because they're the sum of his name and titles (one in Latin one in Greek), which lets you Revelation of St John as a piece of veilled criticism of the Roman Empire and Roman Imperialism. I'm nowhere near well versed enough in Jewish literary tradition to speculate on wider stuff, but I wouldn't be surprised if people like Newton and Miller had come across one or two of the actual numerological elements of the books they were reading, misunderstood them and tried to expand the system out across the entire corpus.
@@packman2321 Honestly Christian esotericism/occultism is WILD.
I've been diving into it as part of writing a Devilman fanfic (alongside bestiary allegories to Christian contemporary beliefs that make a lot of the weird make sense when reframed with the common wisdom at the time provided), and I'm fascinated by the philosophical alchemy I've uncovered (Araki actually used some of that for JoJo's Golden Wind part in the powerset he assigned Gold Experience -- it mirrors the lead-to-gold spiritual refinement via the Requiem ascension and Gold Experience's abilities mesh with the alchemical sun being a symbol of divine creation and life and healing).
I'm still ripping mouthfuls of it off to chew on (it takes time to sink in properly and percolate so I alternate between that and Solomonic magic right now) and it's pretty interesting stuff. (So's the gemmattria stuff but I need to finish the Christian side before delving into THAT mysticism school, it has a lot more fundational stuff to set up first than the alchemy stuff.)
@@neoqwertyYo, that sounds rad as fuck.
The guest really elevates an already great episode tbh
"Where did you get that bug!?" hahahahaha
There have been requests for organized playlists. Perhaps the following list will assist with this.
Apologies if the list "is too long", it's just a data dump I'm merely the messenger
(Obviously URL-ending / title, in alphabetic order)
8Xq9I0i88Ak The Jordan Peterson Episode [Part 2]
xOW4ZCSmHCI The King of Con Artists, Victor Lustig [Part 1]
MYai4CU0MUA The Last Days of L. Ron Hubbard [Part 1]
Rf4U63-smlA The Last Days of L. Ron Hubbard [Part 2]
cJpqapQjXVQ The Liver King (A Live Show)
gRsXyOSVvKU The Man Trying to Resurrect 8chan (Starring 8chan's Founder)
GbrVxyppzqE The Man Who Invented Fascism [Part 1]
3Y2Bj5rMzUE The Man Who Invented The Military-Industrial Complex [Part 1]
AfcNSao0yrA The Man Who Invented The Military-Industrial Complex [Part 2]
T1C9BRiW3aE The Man Who Teaches Our Cops To Kill
XGUenFOr70M The MDMA Cook Who Tried To Commit Genocide
P6rkk_LKQ8U The Most Evil Company In History [Part 1]
nmzTYn4vrNI The Most Evil Company In History [Part 2]
_cRRJtMAftE The Mueller Report Episode
DyWIhdg65wg The Non-Nazi Bastards Who Helped Hitler Rise To Power
UEZmAjR5gqg The Payday Loan Industry Is Bastards All The Way Down
rCZ4EfZYWdM The People Who Turned Burning Your Face Off Into A Healthcare Fad
6fye7wQ7cyY The Perfect Soldier [Part 6]
dGO2P0T86uw The Population Control Movement [Part 2]
amFSiYMGUgQ The Priests of Plague
-wX2gXYj1lo The Primal Diet Con
SRVT1codEWA The QAnon Book: A Half-a*sed, Bagel-Tossing Review
pk_2LsuX7Qo The Rise And Fall (And Rise) of Arch-Grifter Jim Bakker [Part 1]
xpP4fes4lTU The Rise And Fall (And Rise) of Arch-Grifter Jim Bakker [Part 2]
q1zwXWqZhFU The Rush Limbaugh Episodes with Paul F. Tompkins [Part 1]
234a1_m8x6w The Rush Limbaugh Episodes with Paul F. Tompkins [Part 2]
t05d8MPzfvs The Russian Scientist Who Helped Kill 30 Million People [Part 1]
H-i7xLKTI0s The Russian Scientist Who Helped Kill 30 Million People [Part 2]
SM_nBkP1bH0 The Sackler Family: America's Deadliest Drug Dealers [Part 1]
Ke5z6UvPius The Sackler Family: America's Deadliest Drug Dealers [Part 2]
3lB2ZP-8JR8 The Satanic Panic: America's First QAnon [Part 1]
y75wsjxywb8 The Satanic Panic: America's First QAnon [Part 2]
IMv9c6NvZHc The School That Raped Everbody
XWvVdjmBhHc The Second American Civil War You Never Learned About [Part 1]
56aAvxEW2JI The Second American Civil War You Never Learned About [Part 2]
K5-tlruN4o0 The Second Democratic Debate: Too Many Jebs
oTnahtgnJiA The Silly Bastards Behind the Modern Fascist Movement
68K6DlEhuZc The Story Behind All Those Nazi / Clown Memes
hTdjCiEI5sQ The Survivor: A Magazine For Nerdy Terrorists
xUyMqdKcxr4 The Terrible Secret of Sea Monkeys (Live Show)
DdStIvC8WeE The U.S. Border Patrol Is A Nightmare That Never Ends [Part 1]
9u5qagC95G8 The U.S. Border Patrol Is A Nightmare That Never Ends [Part 2]
-BhupIOnm8k The War of the Eggs
yMFxbgLxfdc The War On Vagrants [Part 1]
2-UQq-hPl3o The War On Vagrants [Part 2]
RE_DhDBOCdg The Whole Story Behind that 'We Build the Wall' GoFundMe
Fs1gr7ETmIQ The Woman Who Invented Adoption (By Stealing Thousands of Babies) [Part 1]
cQ3-u2_0qqM The Woman Who Invented Adoption (By Stealing Thousands of Babies) [Part 2]
VDoj1g7nbYU The World is Burning: Your Guide to the Current Uprisings
EA6xLDSB098 The Worst Birth Control Device Ever Invented [Part 1]
B0vQDnSa_Z8 The Worst Grifters of the Coronavirus Pandemic
DJcBNz9HOew The Worst Police Union In History [Part 1]
RH-gBCdpn7Y The Worst Police Union In History [Part 2]
AD7pGAF-oAc Tommy Robinson: The Fascist Grifter With An Addiction to Being Arrested
x1bQ4DwZIgQ Turkmenbashi: The Dictator Who Declared Himself Jesus [Part 1]
fGnLALJAV0c Turkmenbashi: The Dictator Who Declared Himself Jesus [Part 2]
tAKYcuD7sl4 Uprising: A Guide From Portland: Resistance Through Mutual Aid [Part 7]
-gUsVbCxaGU Uprising: A Guide From Portland: Tactics and Teargas [Part 9]
ZJWxk6cI16M Uprising: A Guide From Portland: The Battle of July 4th [Part 4]
CbM-s5OGVio Uprising: A Guide From Portland: The Birth of an Uprising [Part 3]
fybMAovzHEw Uprising: A Guide From Portland: The End of Uprising [Part 10]
2t9KUywZTqI Uprising: A Guide From Portland: The Fed War: Part 1 [Part 5]
x79Xh6H1SqE Uprising: A Guide From Portland: The Fed War: Part 2 [Part 6]
NxJC7S7mpn4 Uprising: A Guide From Portland: The Return of the Right [Part 8]
0BJxRc6q5ho Uprising: A Guide From Portland: We Do This Every Night [Part 2]
Ziv-JsxRVCc Uprising: A Guide From Portland: Why Portland? [Part 1]
JLdaMY9n_Oc Vince McMahon, History's Greatest Monster [Part 1]
JXCFoQwmAeE Vince McMahon, History's Greatest Monster [Part 2]
EOy1xf5zPbk Vince McMahon, History's Greatest Monster [Part 3]
bSJ23x-hgcs Vince McMahon, History's Greatest Monster [Part 4]
YDKn3t19dV0 Vince McMahon, History's Greatest Monster [Part 5]
caZUH7RAkew Vince McMahon, History's Greatest Monster [Part 6]
1zfTcM0KUNM Voices of Revolution
xCfhlKyYlio We Continued Reading Ben Shapiro's Terrible Racist Novel
rjoaOWvwZtM We Read An Unbearably Thirsty Joe Biden / Barrack Obama Mystery Novel
qEzJ5acGdC0 We Watch More of Jordan Peterson's New Show [Part 1]
-QXev_wCUDs We Watch More of Jordan Peterson's New Show [Part 2]
umTOoNfvBfM What We Learned From Ben Shapiro's Racist Novel
UcNI26qhne0 What's Alex Jones Up To Now?
eK2ADmAjiF0 Why Kidnapping Conspiracy Theories Are Everywhere [Part 1]
XQN6OJRy8Q4 Why Kidnapping Conspiracy Theories Are Everywhere [Part 2]
luqx71SK0xg Why Steve Bannon Got Arrested
yYTkwtr2yzM Why Ted Cruz S*cks: A Comprehensive Biography
The Rectal Rehydration Rodeo
You can't go to heaven if you experience too much joy? Is that what happened to Des Steel? (I haven't seen supernatural.)
EDIT: 1:17:15 It's like being fisted by Poseidon himself.
Cameo of the death sub guys great-great-great-great-great-great(?) Grandpa
Dude my mother in law also has some bizarre alternative for the definition of the word doctor. It's baffling and sometimes infuriating.
35:15 OH MY GOD. DID HE GET THESE MEDICAL IDEAS TO THE ADVENTISTS BY WAY OF A CARBON FIBER TUBE WITH TITANIUM END CAPS PARTS FROM CAMPER WORLD AND A LOGITCH CONTROLLER
Basically, yes
Miller wasn't really the first to do this kind of thing- Melchor Hoffman prophesied that the return of Christ and the Purging of the Unclean would begin in Strasbourg in 1533, and I doubt even he was the earliest one.
18:37 Well, why do you think they call people from Meschugun Meschugunas?
It's weird to me that they assumed that it was ejaculate that was making you "out of balance" and not urine, blood, ear wax, tears, and any other fluid that the body produces.
Raytheon: "We do not serve God."
The cereal you hate has provided thousands of jobs through the years in Battle Creek because of both Kelloggs
What's with the big bad fgm warning but just ignore that this guy has been getting boys mutilated by the hundreds of thousands to this day.
Double standard, and also generally unless the doctor is really shit at it at least the male version doesn't involve a full penectomy. The direct equivalent to circumcision is clitoral hood removal, which causes loss of sensitivity and irritation because either way that's removing a protective part of the body like idiots.
The clit is analogue to the dick, the labial lips are analogous to the scrotum. People would be a lot more horrified if circumcision involved removing the scrotum and forcing the balls to go back to the internal setting and a full penectomy.
(Mind, "just the foreskin" is still horrible in my opinion, it's just that fgm normally doesn't stop at just removing the foreskin.)
They seriously need to teach in schools that the only reason circumcision ever caught on outside Islam and Judaism is because quack doctors thought it stopped masturbation, and that masturbation killed you. It's incredible how many people to this day assume there is some good reason for it.
Because while male circumcision could be argued to be unnecessary and detrimental, it's much less drastic than almost all forms of FGM.
The closest equivalent to "male circumcision" involving vulvar anatomy is the removal of the clitoral hood. Which is a somewhat common elective surgery, and is recognized as relatively harmless.
Most fgm would be in the range of "cutting the penile head off" to "cutting the entire penis off" on most male anatomy.
I get not liking circumcision, but, c'mon. You're equating crabapples and pears.
Lol at Rush coming back up after the recent tragedy involving his reckless descendant & and an unsafe submarine.