Nah, no hate from me. I just don't think I'm the target demographic anymore. He seems to be fully embracing YA and that was never the direction I thought Stormlight would go in. It truly feels like the MCU in that it has went too long and become too convoluted with other things you have to read/watch first. But I'm taking nothing away from others that are loving it. And Sanderson has done a ton for the community. I have nothing but respect for him.
I know you mentioned that you read way of kings and words of radiance a while ago. I wonder if you maybe grew out of his writing because to me his books always felt YA hence why I’m not a huge fan of his writing
My main criticism of the progressively more YA writing style is that it violates one of his own storywriting principals. Promises and payoffs. Way of kings makes a promise to the readers in how it is written, a style that they like and are set to expect. Sanderson definitely understands that changing something like this will annoy many people, he's articulated that very well himself many times. My only conclusion is that he literally can't see the change in writing.
He didn't promise you anything, he is writing a huge series. If you don't like how it's going, stop reading, its as simple as that. He is the artist, not you
@@Jamie-h3e I suggest you watch Sanderson's video lecture on promises, progress, and payoffs to get a better idea of what Daniel's talking about, because he's not wrong. It isn't referring to a literal promise; it's an expectation Sanderson set up with the stylistic choices he made in the first couple of SLA books.
@ShannonThomasBT plans and people change perhaps your expectations should too. I don't agree he promised anything or has to stick with the same style over a 10 book series, plus the rest of the comsere. I'm sorry you didn't enjoy the book, what expectations did sanderson fail to meet in your opinion?
Honestly the more books you read and (there's no other way to say it) the more you get used to high quality writing, the starker is the distinction between popcorn writers and truly great writers. Think of how you wouldn't recommend a Gene Wolfe book to someone who just started reading because it would seem so dense and even boring, but for some writers and some people who've read a lot of fantasy and Sci Fi, he's considered one of the best. Sanderson's writing is creative at best, at worst it's simplistic.
@@JLchevz see thats not always true because i recently read cradle and had a blast. its not nearly good writing as a lot of authors but holy shit its paced well. Like sanderson is a way better writer, but his books are soooo much longer with slow pacing. reading a book that doesn't waste your time even if its not as good is really under apricated
A quick note on the “editing” criticism. At the end of the day, Sanderson himself is responsible for the quality that is presented on page. And if Sanderson himself has admitted that his editing has increased, this should cause even greater reason for concern. Sanderson may not be edited differently, he may just be writing poorer quality stories and prose.
It just seems unlikely that as soon as his editing team changes, his book quality falls, and it somehow has nothing to do with the editing? I don't doubt much of it is Brandon himself, but I'm convinced it's both things.
@@fearlessAx His current editor works on first law as well and those books have insanely good prose and editing in general so in that case its mostly authors process fault. But he definitely has too many beta readers and something like sensitivity readers which is just ridiculous to consider he would ever need even if they were adding some value which they are not
@@sgnox7781also Joe Abercrombie used to work as a TV editor and so he has said that a lot of his writing process involves him editing and re-writing his books. So if there's a noticeable difference in editing quality between Sanderson and Abercrombie it probably is because Abercrombie is more "Editor -minded" than Sanderson.
@@kunai9390 you are 100% right Abercrombie tries to perfect the book as much as he can when he is done writing them he talks about his process a lot in the interviews, also another writer that does it a lot is Matt Dinniman writer of dungeon crawler carl praboly a lot more authors as well which is kinda intersting because he is also using a lot of modern language but it makes sense and its better written overall and much more tight as well which is crazy to see because you would expect epic fantasy to be better written then litrpg. The difference between Abercrombie prose and Sanderson is really insane and they have the same editor so its not about editor its about their process, and Sanderson main criticism was always his prose so seeing him getting worse at it, is not what i would expect before
@@sgnox7781 exactly, so some people would say that it can't be due to a change in editor because the first Law series is edited so well. I think well maybe the editor is getting too much credit for the First Law series when in actuality the reason they're edited so well is because of Joe Abercrombie's history as a TV Editor and perhaps the change in Sanderson's editing team is a big reason why the quality has dropped in recent years. But one can only speculate.
In my experience in working at a bookstore, there’s never been a time when people were getting into Sanderson more than now. We’ve been consistently selling his books weekly since I’ve worked there (which is one and a half year long) but with the release of W&T, people have been buying his books en masse to the point where there’s shipping delays from our central storage. Especially Mistborn, Stormlight and Tress are flying off our shelves and I’ve been hearing a lot of positivity when it comes to his writing. The only real hate I’ve been seeing is from people online and honestly? I get a lot of people’s points and disappointment but I think it’s silly to start hating an author because of some of his later work lacking nuance: all his books you enjoyed are still there in their original form. I haven’t read Wind and Truth yet and maybe I won’t like it either. That doesn’t mean the whole Stormlight Archive is ruined. Books one through three are absolute fantastic works of art and book four is still solid. Keep in mind that the hate can turn into an echo chamber on the internet and that there’s people that aren’t feeding into the hate.
I haven't read book 5 yet either but looking forward to it. I enjoyed your comment. I have heard nothing but positive reviews on book 5 till I found this video lol
The modernization of language is so stark because it even breaks continuity. He used courting in RoW and dating in WaT. Just off the top of my head. So it's not just it's too modern, it's he's changing how he wrote from book to another. Goober. Bothered me a lot too.
When he added in a "shower" I rolled my eyes. Little did I know there were a lot more...Wit kept bringing in things that made me think he was from modern day Earth
This has been an issue I've had with almost every Sando book. He has always done this, he uses a lot of internetisms. I think I've read "because reasons" at least 3 times in his books. I haven't read wind and truth yet, so perhaps its really bad, but its always been something I've had to look past. Maybe others are just catching on now, it doesn't mean they're not an enjoyable read.
No hate. I haven’t read Wind and Truth yet but one less-than-amazing book does not a fall-off make. And a few book readers disliking one book is not “everyone hates Sanderson now”.
Indeed, compare it to wot, the middle was kind of a trudge to get through, then it got better again, then of course Sanderson finished it. But just because one or two books in a series doesn’t hit exactly how you like doesn’t mean there is a fall off or that it won’t get better again. Also it is subjective. There are no bad books, just books you like or don’t. Every book is good to someone.
@@DocPharmers ppl don't see wot as being a trudge in the middle because he suddenly shifted the way the characters were acting and talking, introducing new/modern day language, and interjecting awkward gay romance as a main plot point This book is indicative of a shift in Sanderson's priorities and writing, not just a bit of a boring section of the series. That's what has readers spooked. And it isn't just "a few". Every video review is full of unhappy comments
Hate is a strong word, I don't think people hate him. But I do get the feeling people are apathetic towards him, like they're bored and tired of what's he's offering.
It's not "everyone" either, that's just "internet in 2025 speak" where "hate" means "not my favourite thing ever" and "literally" means "not literally" :). (hah, edited because it's not 2024 anymore - i'm living in the past ! :)
I can't speak for everyone, but the only issues I had with the sexual identity/mental health angle was that he seemed to "turn it up to 11" in this book. Sanderson has worked those topics in to all of his Cosmere novels thus far, but they've always been "character traits" instead of "character defining" as they became in "W&T". I think this also added to the "jarring" sensation many of us felt.
I don't see why people don't just write stories where the characters or themes are like this from the very beginning. Then the audience garnered would not get whiplash in the first place.
also the fact that he used to have a very particular belief about homosexuality in his stories and has done a literal 180 an it. It is fully understandable that people feel betrayed by him as a writer. Before anyone comments about "it's just accepting people and tolerance", etc - maybe have some tolerance in the people who disagree....
Straight dudes (don't know about women bc I'm not one) just don't want to read about homosexual relationships. It's just the truth and always has been. It being there is one thing, elevating side characters to main character status because of it and having other main characters applauding as time ticks away towards the end of the world is another
Do people really think that the mental health issues only came around now for his books? Did they not read his previous books? There have been a million memes about how the radiants were just mentally ill people. Regarding the "sexual identity" aspects to the story, who cares? It's a fantasy world, why would we expect it to conform to our social values and it is no where near a major focus for the story.
From what I'm seeing, he broke all the rules of writing--and not in a good way. How does this even happen when he *literally* teaches a writing class! 🤦
@@jakesmith9150 Well there's many but I'll just mention an important one, language... He's suddenly made multiple changes without explanation which conflict with previous words that were used, and other words that have no previous concept within the books, such as therapy/therapist, shower, and racism. Syl calls Kal a racist which is a concept that doesn't exist Roshar, as discrimination was surrounding eye color and hadn't been labeled racism before. These are clear examples of Sanderson breaking internal consistency which is one of the worst mistakes that an author could make as it lowers the quality of the book and generally breaks the readers immersion.
All great art is hated,” Wit said. He shuffled in line-along with a couple hundred other people-one dreary step. “It is obscenely difficult-if not impossible-to make something that nobody hates,” Wit continued. “Conversely, it is incredibly easy-if not expected-to make something that nobody loves. Hoid
Dating, therapy, mental health. Or, I forgot THERAPY. And MENTAL HEALTH. Time and time again. There were actually a lot of small different jarring phrases, but it is not the prose on its own, but how wooden the characters started to feel explaining everything about themselves and talking, almost like, to a reader directly, out-of-character, explaining that MENTAL HEALTH is important. That whole experience was quite immersion breaking. There's plenty of books around about mental health, that are much better written. I don't think this is what readers wanted from Stormlight Archives.
Plus, some of us are already paying therapists for the therapy-speak hehe surely, there are other and more profound ways to explore mental health, especially since the genre is fantasy where one could literally explore anything...
Omg Kaladin, Shallan and Dalinar were all about mental health from the start. What did you get from Oathbringer?plus the words for therapy and mental health come from Hoid who is a worldhopper
@alejandropastorcuesta2543 They were. But they were not running around waving a big flag, signaling the reader that they stupid. Many books are about mental health, and they never turn into the travesty of almost mocking it by being so obnoxiously blant and transparent.
@alejandropastorcuesta2543 we can all justify that the word came from Hoid, but at the end of the day it was Sanderson who overused it. Used sparingly, it would have had much more effect
he lost me with wind and truth he took kaladin and made him a side character when his arc has been the main focus of the previous books... he is playing at being a therapist and yet ignores obvious parallels between his life experience(killing vs protecting) and szeth's experience (adding vs subntracting) that kalodin never once made this connection was odd... the use of real world slang and curses also took me right out of the universe
Yeah we’re only halfway through the series and Kal had the best story line in the book. If you didn’t like it then you simply don’t understand the character.
@ one line does not make for an entire character arc if you are only halfway through the series, How can you make any judgment on how he totally relegated Kal to a side character in the final book which is my complaint? I was enjoying the series all the way up until this final book that just threw me right out of the universe in part because of the treatment of Kal as a character
The thing that worries me the most is that he's not listening to criticism: We say "Hey Brandon, your writing is worsening, the topics you tackle are taking us out of the story, half the book is boring" And he answers "This is the story I want to tell" Well... yes, but tell it in a better way?
The guy wants to write an epic fantasy series with 10 books. So it's gotta be 10 and they've got to be "epic" which means, bloated and boring. So no matter if there's enough good ideas for 10 long books (evidently there's not) he will write 10 long books. No good will come of this...
I think boring is the main problem, even the 'action' the fights, the 'tension' is just dull in wind and truth, if the same social issues or whatever were tackled in an interesting way it'd be fine (read any discworld and see that)
@@Uppernorwood976You make that sound it’s mutually exclusive? Why can’t both happen? I get not kowtowing to fans every whim but they are customers at the end of the day. They allowed Sanderson to profit and make a living off the work. If anything, Sanderson should be paying attention. I know I would it if I kept seeing recurring criticisms of dialogue being bad or bloat in your books. Especially if you are just writing a long book to fill time as opposed to utilizing the page counts wisely and meaningfully to advance characters, plot or ideally both.
Wind and Truth definitely needed trimming and more patience at key moments. The pace of the story was moving fast but also slow with how many flashbacks and how long some sections were. Certainly not his best effort but nice surprises and history of Roshar. Also liked where most of the characters ended up.
As an aspiring author myself, I must say, that Brandon is probably at a point in his career, where he can dismiss a few rules to write what he wants to write. And some of his newer books also changed the subgenre and genre in general. So probably many fans don't like the YA books he wrote, which is absolutely understandable if they are adult fantasy hardcore fans. I think he followed so many rules in his writing journey that finally he earned some kind of creative freedom. Many of you don't know how many things publishers want to change in a manuscript to make it sellable. Sometimes it totally goes against what you want to write. Brandon can now confidently say 'Nope I will write whatever I want." because even when 30% of people (worst case) wouldn't buy the books the audience which buys would still be big enough for the publisher. By the way an author is an artist and artists also want to experiment, try new things and because we are people, we change. And that's a good thing. If you like his older books more, go back to your shelf and read them, cause these are already written. Just skip the ones you don't like and stop the Mimimi, people.
I don't hate, I just have some criticism of his last few books-particularly Wind and Truth. I know some people equate criticism to hate, but that is just toxic positivity. I also think that Sanderson is trying to be an author to all, which impacts his decision to use modern language and include modern social issues. Those things are fine for a contemporary work of fiction, but fantasy readers are attracted to this genre for other reasons and it's generally not to get a mirror image of modern society. When people read Wind and Truth 20 or 50 years from now it is going to be obvious that it was written now in contrast to other timeless works.
Is he? I don't think he does anything different than any other author. His work is just easily digestible for everyone. His work is like MCU of fantasy. Nothing great. But good and huge target demographic.
I think it's the size of the book and the price tag. Some people make a hobby their entire identity, and carrying a 1500-page book around lets everyone know who you are. Its like with the "classics", are you a real fantasy reader of you haven't read them?
I think Sanderson excels at communicating with the fandom- this has got him part of his hype in my opinion as he has been consistently providing answers/ updates for years now!
@@undbiter65 you're crazy if you don't realize that he is a stand out author in terms of communicating with his fans. Particularly in the fantasy genre. That is literally what he excels at above all else. He is a tier above in terms of creating a business around authorship.
@@harvirdhindsa3244 those videos are watched by people who already read him and are looking for updates. How many new fans you think those updates attract? You ever met anyone who said they weren't a fan and then saw an update video and mow they are? How is his communication marketing anything? You're confusing his transparency with marketing.
I made it my mission to read literally everything published by Sanderson over the last couple of years. I’m about 65% through at this point. Sanderson may never be my favourite author - Wind and Truth has big issues - but at the same time I deeply respect him for his work ethic and wild imagination and open communication with fans. I think his backlash is a natural consequence of him rising so high and it will eventually settle down. Honestly, at the risk of sounding parasocial, I’ve caught myself thinking ‘I hope Sanderson isn’t taking all this hate too personally’ once or twice this week! You’re inspiring me to make my own video on him!
Great video, I don't read Sanderson (just not for me), but your examination of all the subjects was top notch. I'm glad that you still get so much joy from reading. Take care.
He’s right that he’s been writing this way since Elantris and it’s been offputting since Elantris. Sanderson has been a weak stylist since his first published work. This hasn’t changed. But he’s (more often than not) been able to compensate for this weakness through his storytelling, characters and creative worldbuilding. In WaT he really made an effort to lean into his worst tendencies and, given that this is the fifth stormlight book, readers noticed. He needs to calibrate, and definitely slow down. Spend more time with each book. I’ll read the next one but I don’t hate that it’s in 8 years.
My issue is this yes it’s the story he wanted to tell. But I feel it damaged his brand not listening to his editorial team. This book could have easily trimmed out at least 100 pages and the reader would be none the wiser. 200 pages and most of his critiques would probably vanish. His delivery of his vision was just bloated. What he wanted to deliver was ultimately a worse product. It would have been better had he listened. I actually have a video coming out this month talking about this and I referenced King, Hobb, and Sanderson
In my opinion this book should have either been broken up into two books or edited down. He introduced way too much stuff in this book and rushed through them.
Sanderson is very good at plot and his brand - especially in a world where some fantasy authors aren’t finishing their series. I had to adjust a lot for his dry dry writing - his prose is extremely flat and uninspired. But the worldbuilding and reveals are great.
I was able to overlook his prose, even though it kicked me out of the story frequently, because of the great reveals and plots but this book didn't deliver in any way.
I read Elantris and Mistborn 1 back to back. I picked up Sword of Kaigen, because I need a break even after those two. Very similar, but if he bends to his audience, will his writing be worse off? I'm not concerned with length using an ereader. I read Fablehaven over the summer. It's a kids series, but Mull has more going on in 20 pages than anyone I've ever read. IMO some fantasy authors just use words as filler. A thousand pages is fine as long as they move the plot. Sandersons style doesn't always do that. I'll go back him but I need unrelated books in between.
I'm reading sword of Kaigen now, love it so far. Got a kindle for Christmas. My speed has increased. Reading quiets the mind. During teenage years I had a lot of migraines. Luckily I grew out of them. I write too, yet to publish... Cheers!
I'm glad I read Wind and Truth before the Internet reviews. I loved it, I can't wait for the next five books. I *kind of* see what people are unhappy about, but none of it bothered me.
On the matter of editing a story about Akira Toriyama, the creator of dragon ball, is commonly passed around the manga community. When writing the third arc of dragon ball z Akira’s editor rode him hard mocking his villains again and again. Because of weekly publications he wasn’t able to just fully rewrite the story so one set of villains got overtaken by another and they were overtaken by yet another villain. That villain was then transformed until we were presented with the perfect being know as Cell all the while the editor questioning the entire story. The Cell saga is widely considered the best part of dragon ball because of the length that editor was willing to go to push Akira. I feel that Brandon’s problem is that his editors can’t push him that hard. His “I want to tell this story this way” can also be seen as proof of this. He might say he’s accepting of editing but the question of how much of the story is he willing to change. Another aspect is his motivating factor may have has changed as he may be motivated to make certain statements with this work that might not have been a motivating factor before. To use some of his own story is the motivation of justice or revenge. They might dive one to try and achieve the same outcome but the methods used to reach them can change the whole thing.
I see that there are many of us. WaT is a book that made me realize that Brandon Sanderson might be no longer an author for me. I didn't like that book at all. I love the first 3 volumes of SA. Words of Radiance is probably my favorite fantasy book. But RoW for me was weak. I was telling myself for the last 4 years that it's because it's just a set up for the conclusion of the first arc in vol 5. But then WaT came out and it was even worse. I love Mistborn era 1 but era 2 for me was weak and I didn't enjoy it. I will probably read the next Cosmere books but I don't wait for them. I feel like I don't care anymore too much about that world.
So much agree with this. I had absolutely the same feeling about RoW, WaT could have justified its flaws, but in fact it made them even worse in retrospective. And I'm definitely not waiting for SA6 anymore. I will probably read it when it comes out, but I'm not going to reread all of SA prior to it like I did in preparation for SA5. Not wasting my time on this author anymore, unless he comes back to his senses and earns my trust back.
it's so crazy how subjective books are. I have lots of friends into Sanderson and they pretty much all told me that Wind and Truth was the best book yet that Sanderson has produced. I told them not to give me any spoilers since I haven't read it yet, but like I mentioned in a previous comment, it just goes to show you just how subjective books are. There is no right or wrong, only one's taste.
@@down-the-rabbit-hole don't get me wrong, I totally understand how people could like WaT, I myself do like the destination we arrived at in the most arcs. What I don't like is the journey. I mean, I could have just listened to the book summary (there is one very nice 1h22m summary on TH-cam) and would miss nothing, maybe even had more fun than reading the book.
I have not read the last few stormlight books because I dnfed rythym of war. I just wanted to agree that the first trilogy of mistborn are amazing and the further ones did not resonate with me at all. I really like his YA series skyward though and am waiting for the next installment of that series.
The translation argument is a cop out because a translator still has to consider tone, diction and audience when they decide how translate. The prose in WaT felt very juvenile and casual--especially compared to books 1-4. And that's simply not the kind of prose I want to read.
Yeah, the translation argument was always a cope out to me. He said that he uses Tolkien's philosophy, but he writes nothing like Tolkien (prose wise). It's honestly insulting
_Wind and Truth_ has been a bit of a slog for me, and I'm a little 2/3 through. There are just so many PoV characters with personal arcs wrapping up, and acting in so many different areas in (and not quite in) the world, that the overall story feels like it's crawling. I'm just not getting any momentum from any of the various arcs.
Brandon Sanderson’s recent work feels like a prime example of unchecked word spew, where no one-least of all the author-has stepped in to cut the fat. Sanderson has always been overrated, but his reliance on his former editor, Moshe Feder, has never been more apparent. Without Moshe’s guidance, his pedestrian prose and bloated storytelling are laid bare. Sanderson’s grandiosity as a writer seems to prevent him from hitting the delete key, and his lack of self-awareness leads to overly indulgent, meandering narratives that should have been streamlined. What we’re left with is a novel that reads more like a first draft, where sheer volume is mistaken for quality, and any sense of discipline or restraint has vanished. It’s a disappointing display of mediocrity from a writer who has clearly started to believe his own hype.
I think a bunch of people started reading Sanderson in their teenage years. When they were that age, they found his books compelling. Now the people who loved Mistborn in their teenage years are in their 30s, and they've found out that Sanderson's books are actually all YA novels. Everyone grows up.
At one point his prose is so deep and meaningful and then it is like you are watching TikTok video... Fall from grace for me, can't believe that same person wrote Words of Radiance and Wind and Truth. Rythm of War was already boring as hell, but this book takes the cake. You could remove 50% of it and nothing would change...
really? I absolutely loved Rythm of War. Even amazon shows it at 84% 5 stars out of like 50k reviews, I guess that proves that books are indeed 100% subjective.
@@TheBakingYeast That's true. I'm so glad I finished Wheel of Time though , because after the boring middle section like you mentioned it kept getting better and better with an amazing ending.
Hate is a strong word. I, for one, don't hate the man, and he seems like a genuinely awesome dude to be around. I just think a lot of people, especially those who were on the Sando train since Elantris or Mistborn, are getting older and getting more exposed to/have read more books. The more books you read within and without the genre the more you realize that Sando's more of an 'ideas' man than a writer. His books are fun, and he produces them quickly -- but in terms of writing he just doesn't hold up in terms of quality (sure, that's partly subjective; but writing is also a highly technical craft, and there are a lot of technical aspects that Sando fail as a writer)
Thats definitely true he is good writer to get into people to reading fantasy but once you do you realise there are way better authors out there but he is also getting worse as a writer at the same time, stormlight 4/5 and mistborn era 2 were just way weaker then his previous works
Full disclosure, never read any of his books so take this with _at least_ a pinch of salt :). But what you say tracks with what i've seen from _other_ people online - the consensus among people who are more widely read (often older fans but not exclusively) seems to be more "He's fine, enjoyed a lot of his stuff" than "He's fantastic, one of the greats". (though personally I think it's almost, if not, _entirely_ subjective - every "objective" element of "technical craft" etc. has been ignored by _at least_ one writer widely considered to be "great" - Cormac McCarthy often didn't use something as basic as punctuation "correctly" for instance - and though many claim writing is "objectively good or bad", i've yet to see anyone produce an _incontestable_ "Big list of objective criteria for great writing")
@@anonymes2884 There should be a "big objective list" but the problem is with people. Too many people disagree on objective information based on their opinions, feelings, and beliefs and not the objective reality of the subject. There are plenty of smaller objective lists available to guide learning writers and some have existed for many years, but they still require skill to implement and some people just haven't developed those skills yet, and other's don't even try.
Also I think a lot of his audience is growing up ? For a lot of people his books were their first foray into reading and the stuff doesn’t have the same impact anymore. The flaws in his writing is more glaring because the people who have read him for a long time are starting to read other, better books
It's the quality and he isn't open to any criticism. I think he is too big to be edited. He needs to listen to his love group, the fans that have been with him since the beginning and now he is on an agenda. Thank you for your viewpoint.
Maybe the fans support him lol what makes you think your opinion counts more than others? That is the only thing i don't understand about the criticism
No hate to anyone who enjoys Sanderson, love what you love! I've just never understood the hype around him, Stormlight in particular. I remember getting back into fantasy around 3 years ago and hearing about this planned 10 book series where each book was 1,000 pages long, the world-building was second to none and it was the best thing since Lord of the Rings! I remember thinking at the time that it sounded more like a marketing gimmick that would invariably be a bloated mess. But I was intrigued, so I read WoK. It was fine. I started WoR but DNFed. My main issue was that it just felt boring, had flat characters and, as I feared, was bloated in length. Given that each book is almost as long as the entire First Law trilogy, which I loved, I decided that my time would best be served exploring other authors. I can only read so much with what free time I have.
Sandersons problems: Quantity over Quality, overcomplicating for no good reason but a writers' ego (dont bother telling me you enjoy confusion as a reader, i won't believe you), nowadays he includes Zeitgeist topics, which entirely ruin the immersion into a fantasy setting... the list goes on. And, like other sucky yet still bought franchises, he won't adapt, it sells, and never change a selling product right? Its shit, but it sells so its cool. Frustrating how the buisness works, marketing-powerhouses can wipe their ass with a quality authors' success
I fell in love with Sanderson in Mistborn. I thought his prose in it was on par with Jordan in WOT. I even wrote an Amazon review saying he should be the one to pick where Jordan left off -- before it actually happened. I also really enjoyed Elantris. I thought Way of Kings was fantastic. But I haven't loved anything else of his, including Mistborn second era. I just felt the writing quality really dropped. Now as for the mondernisms in Wind & Truth, I thought he explained it reasonably well in-story. The terms were introduced to characters in Roshar by characters who'd lived on other worlds where such terms were common. Wit said as much when he called Kaladin a therapist and when he heard Lyft use a modern cuss-word. But I hated the lengths he's gone to to explore all the various mental illnesses. I'd imagine that's helped a lot of people struggling with those things but it just bugged the heck out of me. I also don't care for the in-depth look at the LGPT characters. Those story lines felt pushed in because Sanderson wanted to better understand them himself and wanted them to feel seen. But it didn't enhance the story and I didn't enjoy those scenes. People deal with diarrhea', too, but I don't want to read chapter after chapter detailed descriptions of what they're going through. Dialog has gone really down hill, too. Very sad. Very disappointing.
i’m reading the stormlight archive for the first time, it’s my first sanderson read (but far from my first fantasy), and i’m really really enjoying it. he’s definitely not the best with prose, and some dialogue and actions absolutely feel out of place for the world, but there’s no denying that he knows how to entertain and write a fun story. when you hold him against some lesser known fantasy writers, he definitely doesn’t look so great. however, there is a reason he is so popular, and i do think it’s because he writes a captivating story. but alas, just like any writer who’s ego and money get puffed up, he has reduced himself to pumping out poorly written stories with little editing because he knows no matter what, people will spend the money on anything he publishes.
Hell no you should take fans opinions positive and negative in the consideration and judge them at the end of the day its important how audience reacts to things all the best authors, movie producers, musician, mangakas, game devs do that.
Yep, this, 100%. Artists create art _regardless_ of what other people think (of course, _financially_ successful artists must at some point have created something that connected with a lot of people but if that's _why_ they do it then they're merely hacks). As fans we get to choose whether to pay for it (or not) and sure, these days especially we also get to tell the world what we thought (because of course what we think is _so_ important :), it's then up to them what they do - they don't "owe us" anything (crucially, they don't owe us the book _we_ want to read rather than the book _they_ want to write - being a fan means those two intersect, it doesn't mean the author _must_ make them do so). Lot of entitlement in fandoms these days IMO. Not a good development.
@anonymes2884 I agree tonnes of comments seem to come down to the fan wanting the story to go a different way and being shocked that the author would dare do something different. As if there is anyway to make every fan happy.
I haven’t seen any comments about actual content of the story. It has been about the quality of the prose, dialogue, and bad pacing. All of those can be fixed without changing anything about the story.
Words of Radiance is my favorite Stormlight book at the moment. I just now started Wind and Truth. But, I think Sanderson utilized the ticking clock in that novel very well and I don’t think I’ve ever seen complaints about it. It was 62 days rather than 10, and then novel was still structured in parts though. I would think a 10 day ticking clock would do a lot in making the pace seem fast. Maybe it was a little too fast? And the actual structure being split into the 10 days is a bit different. I guess I’ll see how it works on me soon though!
Part of the problem is Sanderson is prolific and consistent but not great imo. Read Martin, Jordan, Tolkien or Abercrombie and you will feel Sanderson is clearly the junior here. Sanderson is in no way bad just not one of the greats, he is just prolific and current so it is very easy to be a fan. Oh and the fantasy diction thing is just LAZY imo. Even though Tolkien talked about it I don't think I notice it in any of Tolkiens work but it is very noticeable in Sandersons.
@@nurplepain3636 100%! Also check out Larry Corriea, Son of the Black Sword for more gritty morally grey content. He also rips GRRM in his dedication in the last book with: "See George it can be done" 🤣
Thank you for spelling out and clarifying the amalgamation of the turmoil with this book I've been feeling. I felt like it was just me or a lot of "reactions" people may be blowing out of proportion, but even with your beautiful accent, you were able to explain it so much more succinctly.
The problem a lot of fans of Sanderson try and overlook is the plot. And it's best summarised with this here: A group of people unite to stop an threat to them and are attacking at this threat's central base from a disadvantageous position. They manage to succeed against it and do what was necessary to help things out for their people. What book of Sandersons am I referencing here? Is it Elantris? Final Empire - Hero of Ages, Way of Kings - Oathbringer, Warbreaker? Any of them? All of them? It's actually Steelheart, it's referencing the Reckoners trying to overthrow Steelheart. That's the problem with Sanderson, it always has been - and it's something I could marginally forgive, a framework plot isn't the be all and end all of the plot. But now we're seeing entire scenarios from previous books appearing in the different books. Adolins trial is Perrins trial, the Marasi story from tLM is the Shallan Story from RoW. And now we're getting the exact same story told to us of the characters that we've already seen before. 50% of WaT is repeating information we've already heard before from the Shallan plots to the Dalinar plots. And Sanderson put in the book the lines telling you he's aware of what hes doing and doesn't care. It was about expanding your understanding of the things you're trying to learn. So he's gone from reusing the framework of a plot to reusing a single or a couple of plotlines to then reusing nearly every single characters plot in one book. A lot of people have called Wind and Truth bad fan fiction and that's part of it ^^^ the reuse of plots, a lot of bad fan fics just take the plots of things they've already seen and reuse them with their version of characters, very rarely do you see original concepts in fan fics. I don't think it's fan fiction, I think it's losing the ability to write consistently and well. Then there's the problem of retconning things. Shallan is the worst culprit of this with her plot, there are things in it that shouldn't be in it (and no it's not what you think, I finished the atrocious book, and I consider the reveal of that to be a very badly done example) that were finished and dealt with in RoW and shouldn't be there anymore - at all. But it is because that's the framework Sanderson has to deal with. And as long as people keep ignoring things like this and screaming that people must praise him, the worse its going to get. I said this at the end of tLM that Sanderson needs to take a long break from writing, to step away and let things simmer because outside of that he's going to keep devolving while the people around him who are not his best allies for this sort of thing keep telling him everything that they shouldn't about what he should do. A decade of nothing would be a good time to recharge his skills as a writer, and to mature more as a person.
I'm currently halfway through Oathbringer and I'm really enjoying it. I've been thinking for a while on the critiques on Rythm of War and, now, Wind and Thruth and how it might change my love for the series. Thank you so much for this video, I will definitely take into the account the editing process change when reading xx
I hope the video did not bias your opinion, but hopefully will allow you to enjoy following books knowing this is something Sanderson acknowledges and wants to do! 🫶
WaT was just exhausting. Everyone has a mental health crisis and every character had these droning expositions that just went on and on. Land the plane on it already. Everyone can’t be suffering from a mental health crisis in a massive novel. Then comes in the shoe horned in LGBTQ. I have zero problem with those kinds of characters if it fits the story and is organic in its plot development but this was a clear hammer over the head shove in your face development. I was taken aback and at some points felt I was reading a PG gay romance novel. It almost took over the story and it had a major impact on a huge plot line. Also, the out of know where overt trans scenes made me pause. I stopped at certain times and was thinking what the heck is going on and why. He is free to do and write as he sees fit. It’s his universe but I won’t be along for the ride anymore. I will just wait til everything is written and then decide if I want to finish the whole arc. I have always preordered his stuff but I won’t do that ever again. Plenty to read over the next decade it takes him to finish. I wish everyone a happy journey. Maybe I will see y’all down the road. See you on the other side.
I found the Rhythm of War subpar, and I DNFed Cytonic. The stories felt too contrived. Rhythm of War had a good storyline with Navani, but everything else was disappointing. I haven't heard of him improving afterwards. Now, after a few years, other people have pointed out that his newer releases are bad. It's gone bad years ago!
When u become a rockstar author i.e. GRRM, King, Sanderson hubris starts to creep in, and IMO you begin thinking everything you write is great, because they develop ardent fans that will defend anything they release. WaT wasn’t a good book. It just wasn’t and I consider Words of Radiance an all timer in fantasy.
WoR is such a banger! I agree that WaT wasn’t at that level but seeing how Sanderson acknowledges part of the feedback and said it’s how he wants to tell the story, makes me think that he is listening but that this might not be for everyone
No hate at all from me. Wind Truth was not my favorite book in the series, but I enjoyed the book and I am motivated to continue reading his older material.
Just finished this book last night...it was a HARD read for me. There are SOOOOO many glaring problems, and this video covers most of them...I would just add that a lot of the criticism he is getting is that he went full "woke" in this book. That word is way overused in my opinion, and I personally don't have an issue with lgbtq representation in a book, but it seems so out of place in this setting and in this novel. It felt like Sanderson decided he needed to check some boxes as opposed to having elements that organically fit into his story, and it was all handled so clumsily. Also, there are so many modernisms and anachronisms on this book that it is completely immersion killing.
The problem with this statement is that unless an underrepresented minority is written with perfect representation, then it shouldn't be included and we should just default to the "traditional" characteristics. I think there is some valid critique that it wasn't foreshadowed, but I felt that Renarin being gay was very believable based on his personality. Regardless, let's not stoop to using "woke" as a criticism and focus on critiquing the quality of the writing. Demanding perfect representation or it shouldn't be included needs to stop. How about instead say "I felt that Rlain and Renarin's relationship came out of nowhere" and leave it at that rather than starting the argument with Sanderson going woke.
@@andrewf7732 I think you missed the point...representation is fantastic, and even most conservative, "anti-woke" pundants have no issue with lgbtq characters in general....the problem, and where that dreaded "woke" word comes in, is when that representation is simply present to check boxes on the virtue signaling checklist as Sanderson is clearly doing here.
@@alannapenner37 i dont blame you, concept and character ideas are cool, but the execution... its a tiring read. And dont bother self-doubting, its the author that has to deliver. If you fall asleep reading, he probably made some pacing mistakes. An uncritical consumership leads to a market full of sh1t, like we see on booktok. Slop is sold, slop is delivered
I was reading the weekly drops of the chapters until I went on holiday mid of November and I'm afraid to say that it's been on pause since then. It just had been a bit of a struggle up until then. One day I'll get back to it I guess
I’ve seen the problems with his writing since the beginning and I have also seen his strength. I honestly love him for what he is. He was such a breathe of fresh air when fantasy was only Grimdark. He’s improved but he hasn’t really changed. I think this is all us. We want to hype things, and we also want to see them fall from grace, perhaps we also want to see a come back, perhaps as a group we’ll decide some novel in the future will epitomize that. Sanderson is just about telling stories and being himself. I’m glad he knows how to do both. He has my full support going forward.
tbh that was something that really drew me into his writing, that it's a little more hopeful and not as grimdark as a lot of other fantasy. There's still bad stuff that happens, I think Kaladin's storyline in book 1 in particular gets pretty dark, but not on the level of other popular fantasy like ASOIAF. There was a period in my life I could handle and enjoyed darker stories like ASOIAF but I just can't anymore, not for several years now. I want more fantasy like stormlight
I am an aspiring author, and Brandon Sanderson was, and still is, one of my biggest inspirations for being a writer. I even wrote an entire 3,000 word thesis about him in senior year of university. However, even i will say that his line-by-line level prose can be weak at times, even if others areas like character arcs, pacing and plot are are excellent overall. I think Joe Abercrombie writes his prose, on a sentence by sentence level, better than Sanderson. Sanderson excells at marketing his books snd communicating with fans, in addition to being quite open and transparent about his writing processes. Not to mention teaching others about the writing craft via his writing courses at BYU University, all which I think is what msde him popular as an author.
i'd point out too, sanderson appeals to me in that i don't read. (im lucky to finish a book in a few months to a year. i mostly read manga, trying to change that though and have set some goals))) i have a hard time getting into a series and his style feels accessible and if i go to get a book i kinda feel like im gonna enjoy it, my first book of his was elantris and mistborn. but if i mention to people that do read often and consume books more regularly than me they kinda don't like him for the reasons you've pointed out, or they just feel kinda neutral about his work.
Im not an expert on Sanderson, but I've seen the same thing happen to a lot of other authors, particularly those with a large body of work. They start to run out of ideas, and they lose the mental sharpness that made their work shine.
Tried Mistborn 3 times and each time I tired it the story was brining and too basic. It wasn’t detailed enough to keep my attention so I stopped. I want to explore different authors.
“Ah, what do you know?” she said. “You’re a building.” “And?” the tower said. “And people fart in you. Like all the time. I bet half the people in this room are doing it right now.” "Oh, I’m fine. Just a big mess of existential crisis!" Truly peak quality prose. Especially for a fantasy series.
I personally love his books. I see some criticism directed at the size of the Cosmere, but it is an interconnected galaxy, so it would make sense to read certain books in a certain order. I have a friend who works in a book store, and they’ve been selling a ton of Sanderson books. I can see the criticism for his books, though I personally enjoyed WAT a lot. It was better than SA 3 and 4 for me, but the first two are still the best. Maybe he should roll back on the mental health and identity stuff though, I feel like that could get draining, though I haven’t had many issues with it so far.
Sanderson may be the most overrated author today. I enjoyed Mistborn era 1 l, 2, and just finished wind and truth; but none of these are as good as their ratings on Goodreads suggest. He is propped up by fandom who enjoy being apart of something.
Particularly I did enjoy those books (Mistborn era 1 and SL books 1-3) a lot, so 5 stars for me there! But I do agree, he is great with the fandom and that builds loyalty and momentum
I like Brandon Sanderson. I like that he is the most prolific fantasy author right now. That said, I read the first chapter of Wind and Truth and put it down. I lost interest in the series, and in Rhythm of War, I skimmed a lot of the chapters. I lost patience. These books are too prosy. Thinking back to his books I read, I loved the original Mistborn trilogy, the first two books of Stormlight Archive, and Warbreaker. The rest of his work, I really don't care about. Tress of the Emerald Sea I enjoyed the first half, skimmed the rest.
Your addressing of the criticisms is great. I find that I did not agree with any of the popular critiques they you mentioned, but your personal ones are fairly accurate to me. The "therapy" word being anachronistic was not the jarring part for me, but the fact that it was being used as a joke in areas that undercut the seriousness with a forced sense of levity. The thought that he needed a breather chapter at some point is very accurate. The breather would have also helped being the feeling of lack of connectivity with the characters by adding a point the characters could reflect on what has happened. In terms of the editing, the book felt standard for Sanderson to me, almost to a cliched point however. The editing did not catch the previous two points, and it missed that the climax and beginning of the resolution became vague and rushed (SPOILERS a description of the new storm instead of the reactions and the 'off-screen' death of a character are two main issues I found with it) The last issue I had personally was that none of the main characters felt like they had enough time to settle their character arcs. Something was built up with the characters, a great climax or revelation happened, and then either the story ended or the characters were thrown into a new situation without a moment of reflection for the readers.
Wait, whats so bad about about the word therapy. We got it from the greeks; therapia, to heal with speech. Isnt hellenistic fantasy, of a time before midevil fantasy?
The broader appeal in general always means narrower appeal in previous fanbase. I kind of regret being invested so much in stormlight to be discarded at the last book for being too "narrow minded"😢. Well, Sanderson is only human. He can and will make mistakes. I think I'm just going to forget about his work. I think that is better than continuing reading books that are just not for me. Also someone has a good point in the comments, writing best story for certain demografic don't nessesarly coresponds to greatest monetary gains. By switching to more childlike writing he can achieve more short term success.
I don't think anyone dislikes Brandon Sanderson. His books are another thing, being both eternally loved and just generally disliked. But him? One of the best people I have seen. And *as an author,* he's the best of the best imo.
Seems to me that Sanderson's books have suffered the fate of being placed on a pedestal. Then when it didn't meet the expectations of the readers, they are shocked and perplexed.
I really enjoyed the original Mistborn trilogy and the first two books of the Stormlight Archives. I DNF'd book 4 of the Stormlight Archives for these general reasons: Too slow Meandering Same/same throughout (over explaining) Too long by at least half Boring There are too many great books out there to slog through this any longer.
I didn't think that's really true. There are some very hateful trolls going off about everything... Very vocal minority. Trying to basically cancel anything they don't like... Often just about everything.
I wish I stopped at Oathbreaker. Rythem of war was boring and I hate Venli. I am not interested in rehabilitation of her character or her history. Wind and Truth I couldn't finish.
I could never hate him, I became a writer because of him and he is free to target his projects to different audiences. I respect it if I'm not part of the designed group anymore. And honestly I still read his work as a reference for self improvement.
I've read almost all of Sanderson's books. Elantris is still one of my books of all time. That said, I could not finish Wind & Truth. Listening to the audiobook, I got to almost 45 hours and was just done. I realized I stopped caring about almost all the characters. Adolin was the only character I continued to care about, but there was just not enough of him. The other characters just had plots I didn't care about, or I never cared about those characters. Beyond how long, boring, and repetitive the books were, he's made it clear in interviews that I'm not his target audience anymore. That's cool because not every book is for every person, so I'm moving on.
People don’t hate Sanderson. At least not more than any other extremely successful author. I think you may be just hearing a lot from a small percentage of loud people in certain groups. He has so many eyes on him that some are bound to have qualms, and those people can make posts on Reddit and there are enough Sanderson readers out there to have a lot of discourse in those threads. But Wind and Truth being somewhat disappointing to some (or even many) readers does not mean people hate him.
So far i havent loved anything for the super hyped up authors . Never read sanderson but i can imgine it being in my wheel house. I had major issues with that john gwynne series that all the book tubers love.
I'm glad that people are finally opening their eyes. I don't hate him, that's too much, but his books have always been unreadable. People say that his last book is the worst and I'm like "How is that even possible?"
I think he's too close to a small portion of the Fandom, and they have too much influence over him. It's all good, though. I'll still be here when Stormlight 6 comes out.
I do love Wind and Truth but I can see some of the problems people have with the book. What I have a problem with is that it seems that a lot of people have forgotten about the secret projects that came out the year before. Most people loved 3 out of 4 books and suddenly he is a bad author after Wind and Truth? I understand if you only read Stormlight Archive and didn't like Rhythm of War either but it is hard for an author to not have a few stinkers.
I just started with Cosmere with Mistborn and his writing & storytelling is average at best…but having said that I think the issue is with the publishing industry in itself, they market what they can sell in mass and it results in things like this… it’s like you identify a formula and repeat it mechanically without really anything outstanding
They gotta do what they gotta do is the mantra. Most Authors are/were cowed and the product reflected that in the last few years. They can write about courage but cannot demonstrate it. For instance, I thought Neal Stephenson had suffered some kind of stroke then it was explained to me. (In fact he made it a ludicrous joke of it) . At this point let it suffice to remember for every Rowling their will be a whole pact grovelers. Anyway, regardless of the recent past A Society that demands character and plot elements to be included to be published/broadcast is on the way out because it kills spirit and creativity. At least until natural self deletion catches up. Which, mercifully, seems to be happening.
What happened to Neal Stephenson? I haven't read any of his books since Seveneves was kind of a boring slog with a bunch of weak plot holes and poor characterization.
I've read the first three Stormlight books so far and enjoyed the experience, but I agree with all the major critiques listed and more. His reputation as someone who can crank out books like crazy to me is not a strength(unless you're his marketing department). The books feel criminally under-edited both in length, but even more, his rough dialogue and the rushed way he'll figure out explanations for decisions he makes in the books.
Nah, no hate from me. I just don't think I'm the target demographic anymore. He seems to be fully embracing YA and that was never the direction I thought Stormlight would go in. It truly feels like the MCU in that it has went too long and become too convoluted with other things you have to read/watch first. But I'm taking nothing away from others that are loving it. And Sanderson has done a ton for the community. I have nothing but respect for him.
YA?How is killing off major characters anywhere near YA?
@@shaunduquette5992 How is killing off someone making it adult??
I know you mentioned that you read way of kings and words of radiance a while ago. I wonder if you maybe grew out of his writing because to me his books always felt YA hence why I’m not a huge fan of his writing
@@shaunduquette5992Sanderson definitely writes ya I’ve been saying this for years. His jokes, Romance and dialogue is straight out of a ya novel🤷
Rainbow propaganda is also not quite the thing most fantasy readers want in their stories...
My main criticism of the progressively more YA writing style is that it violates one of his own storywriting principals. Promises and payoffs. Way of kings makes a promise to the readers in how it is written, a style that they like and are set to expect. Sanderson definitely understands that changing something like this will annoy many people, he's articulated that very well himself many times. My only conclusion is that he literally can't see the change in writing.
He didn't promise you anything, he is writing a huge series. If you don't like how it's going, stop reading, its as simple as that. He is the artist, not you
@@Jamie-h3e I suggest you watch Sanderson's video lecture on promises, progress, and payoffs to get a better idea of what Daniel's talking about, because he's not wrong. It isn't referring to a literal promise; it's an expectation Sanderson set up with the stylistic choices he made in the first couple of SLA books.
@ShannonThomasBT plans and people change perhaps your expectations should too. I don't agree he promised anything or has to stick with the same style over a 10 book series, plus the rest of the comsere. I'm sorry you didn't enjoy the book, what expectations did sanderson fail to meet in your opinion?
He can see the change in his paycheck…
@@Jamie-h3e then you disagree with Sanderson's own version of what he means by 'promise'
I dont hate him but the more I read other authors his flaws really stand out more
Honestly the more books you read and (there's no other way to say it) the more you get used to high quality writing, the starker is the distinction between popcorn writers and truly great writers. Think of how you wouldn't recommend a Gene Wolfe book to someone who just started reading because it would seem so dense and even boring, but for some writers and some people who've read a lot of fantasy and Sci Fi, he's considered one of the best. Sanderson's writing is creative at best, at worst it's simplistic.
@@JLchevz see thats not always true because i recently read cradle and had a blast. its not nearly good writing as a lot of authors but holy shit its paced well. Like sanderson is a way better writer, but his books are soooo much longer with slow pacing. reading a book that doesn't waste your time even if its not as good is really under apricated
A quick note on the “editing” criticism.
At the end of the day, Sanderson himself is responsible for the quality that is presented on page. And if Sanderson himself has admitted that his editing has increased, this should cause even greater reason for concern.
Sanderson may not be edited differently, he may just be writing poorer quality stories and prose.
It just seems unlikely that as soon as his editing team changes, his book quality falls, and it somehow has nothing to do with the editing? I don't doubt much of it is Brandon himself, but I'm convinced it's both things.
@@fearlessAx His current editor works on first law as well and those books have insanely good prose and editing in general so in that case its mostly authors process fault. But he definitely has too many beta readers and something like sensitivity readers which is just ridiculous to consider he would ever need even if they were adding some value which they are not
@@sgnox7781also Joe Abercrombie used to work as a TV editor and so he has said that a lot of his writing process involves him editing and re-writing his books. So if there's a noticeable difference in editing quality between Sanderson and Abercrombie it probably is because Abercrombie is more "Editor -minded" than Sanderson.
@@kunai9390 you are 100% right Abercrombie tries to perfect the book as much as he can when he is done writing them he talks about his process a lot in the interviews, also another writer that does it a lot is Matt Dinniman writer of dungeon crawler carl praboly a lot more authors as well which is kinda intersting because he is also using a lot of modern language but it makes sense and its better written overall and much more tight as well which is crazy to see because you would expect epic fantasy to be better written then litrpg. The difference between Abercrombie prose and Sanderson is really insane and they have the same editor so its not about editor its about their process, and Sanderson main criticism was always his prose so seeing him getting worse at it, is not what i would expect before
@@sgnox7781 exactly, so some people would say that it can't be due to a change in editor because the first Law series is edited so well. I think well maybe the editor is getting too much credit for the First Law series when in actuality the reason they're edited so well is because of Joe Abercrombie's history as a TV Editor and perhaps the change in Sanderson's editing team is a big reason why the quality has dropped in recent years. But one can only speculate.
One way or another, sounds like Sanderson broke every writing rule he teaches in his lectures.
In my experience in working at a bookstore, there’s never been a time when people were getting into Sanderson more than now. We’ve been consistently selling his books weekly since I’ve worked there (which is one and a half year long) but with the release of W&T, people have been buying his books en masse to the point where there’s shipping delays from our central storage. Especially Mistborn, Stormlight and Tress are flying off our shelves and I’ve been hearing a lot of positivity when it comes to his writing. The only real hate I’ve been seeing is from people online and honestly? I get a lot of people’s points and disappointment but I think it’s silly to start hating an author because of some of his later work lacking nuance: all his books you enjoyed are still there in their original form.
I haven’t read Wind and Truth yet and maybe I won’t like it either. That doesn’t mean the whole Stormlight Archive is ruined. Books one through three are absolute fantastic works of art and book four is still solid. Keep in mind that the hate can turn into an echo chamber on the internet and that there’s people that aren’t feeding into the hate.
I haven't read book 5 yet either but looking forward to it. I enjoyed your comment. I have heard nothing but positive reviews on book 5 till I found this video lol
It's still much too early to see any effect in sales as a result of this change in his writing.
@@chelouha that's a fair point
@benjamin6918 nah didn't you hear everyone hates him now, TH-cam reviewers say so
and now we are hearing about Sanderson books being returned - well this book at least.
The modernization of language is so stark because it even breaks continuity. He used courting in RoW and dating in WaT. Just off the top of my head. So it's not just it's too modern, it's he's changing how he wrote from book to another.
Goober. Bothered me a lot too.
"dating" seriously? lmao that's so weird. Language is so important dude it has to be immersive.
Goober is what he calls his mother, so maybe that one’s just an Easter egg.
When he added in a "shower" I rolled my eyes. Little did I know there were a lot more...Wit kept bringing in things that made me think he was from modern day Earth
I’m way back on book 1 of mistborn and he dropped an “edgy” in there that got a laugh from me.
This has been an issue I've had with almost every Sando book. He has always done this, he uses a lot of internetisms. I think I've read "because reasons" at least 3 times in his books.
I haven't read wind and truth yet, so perhaps its really bad, but its always been something I've had to look past. Maybe others are just catching on now, it doesn't mean they're not an enjoyable read.
No hate. I haven’t read Wind and Truth yet but one less-than-amazing book does not a fall-off make. And a few book readers disliking one book is not “everyone hates Sanderson now”.
I agree. It seems like everyone forgot about the secret projects that came out the year before
Indeed, compare it to wot, the middle was kind of a trudge to get through, then it got better again, then of course Sanderson finished it.
But just because one or two books in a series doesn’t hit exactly how you like doesn’t mean there is a fall off or that it won’t get better again.
Also it is subjective. There are no bad books, just books you like or don’t. Every book is good to someone.
@@DocPharmers I totally agree with you!
yup
@@DocPharmers ppl don't see wot as being a trudge in the middle because he suddenly shifted the way the characters were acting and talking, introducing new/modern day language, and interjecting awkward gay romance as a main plot point
This book is indicative of a shift in Sanderson's priorities and writing, not just a bit of a boring section of the series. That's what has readers spooked. And it isn't just "a few". Every video review is full of unhappy comments
Hate is a strong word, I don't think people hate him.
But I do get the feeling people are apathetic towards him, like they're bored and tired of what's he's offering.
Ahhh I hope you are right! And we don’t see this escalating even more - totally fair to move forward!
In cases like this, "Hate" is usually refereed to as displeasure rather than the feeling of hatred.
It's not "everyone" either, that's just "internet in 2025 speak" where "hate" means "not my favourite thing ever" and "literally" means "not literally" :).
(hah, edited because it's not 2024 anymore - i'm living in the past ! :)
Gotta have the strong words to get the clicks on the video, let's be honest
I can't speak for everyone, but the only issues I had with the sexual identity/mental health angle was that he seemed to "turn it up to 11" in this book. Sanderson has worked those topics in to all of his Cosmere novels thus far, but they've always been "character traits" instead of "character defining" as they became in "W&T". I think this also added to the "jarring" sensation many of us felt.
I don't see why people don't just write stories where the characters or themes are like this from the very beginning. Then the audience garnered would not get whiplash in the first place.
also the fact that he used to have a very particular belief about homosexuality in his stories and has done a literal 180 an it. It is fully understandable that people feel betrayed by him as a writer. Before anyone comments about "it's just accepting people and tolerance", etc - maybe have some tolerance in the people who disagree....
Straight dudes (don't know about women bc I'm not one) just don't want to read about homosexual relationships. It's just the truth and always has been.
It being there is one thing, elevating side characters to main character status because of it and having other main characters applauding as time ticks away towards the end of the world is another
@@LightCyrus I think he did the bulk of the writing in 2020-23, and that fits with what he wrote, unfortunately.
Do people really think that the mental health issues only came around now for his books? Did they not read his previous books? There have been a million memes about how the radiants were just mentally ill people.
Regarding the "sexual identity" aspects to the story, who cares? It's a fantasy world, why would we expect it to conform to our social values and it is no where near a major focus for the story.
He broke one of the few requirements, internal consistency.
What was the internal consistency he broke?
From what I'm seeing, he broke all the rules of writing--and not in a good way. How does this even happen when he *literally* teaches a writing class! 🤦
@@5Gburn Exactly, that's a great point.
@@jakesmith9150 Well there's many but I'll just mention an important one, language...
He's suddenly made multiple changes without explanation which conflict with previous words that were used, and other words that have no previous concept within the books, such as therapy/therapist, shower, and racism.
Syl calls Kal a racist which is a concept that doesn't exist Roshar, as discrimination was surrounding eye color and hadn't been labeled racism before.
These are clear examples of Sanderson breaking internal consistency which is one of the worst mistakes that an author could make as it lowers the quality of the book and generally breaks the readers immersion.
@@presleybaldwin3756 oh no, he did the 'muh racism' too, so sad, i was really looking forward to W&T
All great art is hated,” Wit said. He shuffled in line-along with a couple hundred other people-one dreary step. “It is obscenely difficult-if not impossible-to make something that nobody hates,” Wit continued. “Conversely, it is incredibly easy-if not expected-to make something that nobody loves.
Hoid
It insists upon itself! 😂😂
(What a self-conglatulatory author...)
Dating, therapy, mental health. Or, I forgot THERAPY. And MENTAL HEALTH. Time and time again. There were actually a lot of small different jarring phrases, but it is not the prose on its own, but how wooden the characters started to feel explaining everything about themselves and talking, almost like, to a reader directly, out-of-character, explaining that MENTAL HEALTH is important. That whole experience was quite immersion breaking. There's plenty of books around about mental health, that are much better written. I don't think this is what readers wanted from Stormlight Archives.
Plus, some of us are already paying therapists for the therapy-speak hehe surely, there are other and more profound ways to explore mental health, especially since the genre is fantasy where one could literally explore anything...
Omg Kaladin, Shallan and Dalinar were all about mental health from the start. What did you get from Oathbringer?plus the words for therapy and mental health come from Hoid who is a worldhopper
@alejandropastorcuesta2543 They were. But they were not running around waving a big flag, signaling the reader that they stupid. Many books are about mental health, and they never turn into the travesty of almost mocking it by being so obnoxiously blant and transparent.
@alejandropastorcuesta2543 we can all justify that the word came from Hoid, but at the end of the day it was Sanderson who overused it. Used sparingly, it would have had much more effect
@@jscast39 really? thats your argument?
he lost me with wind and truth he took kaladin and made him a side character when his arc has been the main focus of the previous books... he is playing at being a therapist and yet ignores obvious parallels between his life experience(killing vs protecting) and szeth's experience (adding vs subntracting) that kalodin never once made this connection was odd... the use of real world slang and curses also took me right out of the universe
Yeah we’re only halfway through the series and Kal had the best story line in the book. If you didn’t like it then you simply don’t understand the character.
@ one line does not make for an entire character arc if you are only halfway through the series, How can you make any judgment on how he totally relegated Kal to a side character in the final book which is my complaint?
I was enjoying the series all the way up until this final book that just threw me right out of the universe in part because of the treatment of Kal as a character
@@nickjohnson4397 That's not an honest criticism.
@@nickjohnson4397a shame we gotta wait 20 years to like a character in a book.
Does real life cursing take you out? How? English is English.
No hate. Just disappointment.
The thing that worries me the most is that he's not listening to criticism:
We say "Hey Brandon, your writing is worsening, the topics you tackle are taking us out of the story, half the book is boring"
And he answers "This is the story I want to tell"
Well... yes, but tell it in a better way?
The guy wants to write an epic fantasy series with 10 books. So it's gotta be 10 and they've got to be "epic" which means, bloated and boring. So no matter if there's enough good ideas for 10 long books (evidently there's not) he will write 10 long books. No good will come of this...
I’d prefer authors don’t listen to readers, and produce their own work.
I think boring is the main problem, even the 'action' the fights, the 'tension' is just dull in wind and truth, if the same social issues or whatever were tackled in an interesting way it'd be fine (read any discworld and see that)
@@Uppernorwood976You make that sound it’s mutually exclusive? Why can’t both happen? I get not kowtowing to fans every whim but they are customers at the end of the day. They allowed Sanderson to profit and make a living off the work.
If anything, Sanderson should be paying attention. I know I would it if I kept seeing recurring criticisms of dialogue being bad or bloat in your books. Especially if you are just writing a long book to fill time as opposed to utilizing the page counts wisely and meaningfully to advance characters, plot or ideally both.
@@Uppernorwood976 You should 100% listen to readers, but respond to their praise and criticism in your own way, Sanderson just plain ignoring them
Wind and Truth definitely needed trimming and more patience at key moments. The pace of the story was moving fast but also slow with how many flashbacks and how long some sections were. Certainly not his best effort but nice surprises and history of Roshar. Also liked where most of the characters ended up.
Very much agree with this!
As an aspiring author myself, I must say, that Brandon is probably at a point in his career, where he can dismiss a few rules to write what he wants to write. And some of his newer books also changed the subgenre and genre in general. So probably many fans don't like the YA books he wrote, which is absolutely understandable if they are adult fantasy hardcore fans. I think he followed so many rules in his writing journey that finally he earned some kind of creative freedom. Many of you don't know how many things publishers want to change in a manuscript to make it sellable. Sometimes it totally goes against what you want to write. Brandon can now confidently say 'Nope I will write whatever I want." because even when 30% of people (worst case) wouldn't buy the books the audience which buys would still be big enough for the publisher. By the way an author is an artist and artists also want to experiment, try new things and because we are people, we change. And that's a good thing. If you like his older books more, go back to your shelf and read them, cause these are already written. Just skip the ones you don't like and stop the Mimimi, people.
🐐👌
The exact opposite of what you suppose here has happened. He is catering to other people’s opinions now more than ever.
@@ImPerpl3xd and you base that on what?
I'd read the entire Reckoners series before I'd even touched Mistborn, but I have no idea what his other YA stuff is even about
Perfectly said
I don't hate, I just have some criticism of his last few books-particularly Wind and Truth. I know some people equate criticism to hate, but that is just toxic positivity. I also think that Sanderson is trying to be an author to all, which impacts his decision to use modern language and include modern social issues. Those things are fine for a contemporary work of fiction, but fantasy readers are attracted to this genre for other reasons and it's generally not to get a mirror image of modern society. When people read Wind and Truth 20 or 50 years from now it is going to be obvious that it was written now in contrast to other timeless works.
I like Sanderson, but he's definitely not the best Fantasy author. He's just really good at marketing.
Is he? I don't think he does anything different than any other author. His work is just easily digestible for everyone. His work is like MCU of fantasy. Nothing great. But good and huge target demographic.
I think it's the size of the book and the price tag. Some people make a hobby their entire identity, and carrying a 1500-page book around lets everyone know who you are. Its like with the "classics", are you a real fantasy reader of you haven't read them?
I think Sanderson excels at communicating with the fandom- this has got him part of his hype in my opinion as he has been consistently providing answers/ updates for years now!
@@undbiter65 you're crazy if you don't realize that he is a stand out author in terms of communicating with his fans. Particularly in the fantasy genre. That is literally what he excels at above all else. He is a tier above in terms of creating a business around authorship.
@@harvirdhindsa3244 those videos are watched by people who already read him and are looking for updates. How many new fans you think those updates attract? You ever met anyone who said they weren't a fan and then saw an update video and mow they are? How is his communication marketing anything? You're confusing his transparency with marketing.
I made it my mission to read literally everything published by Sanderson over the last couple of years. I’m about 65% through at this point.
Sanderson may never be my favourite author - Wind and Truth has big issues - but at the same time I deeply respect him for his work ethic and wild imagination and open communication with fans.
I think his backlash is a natural consequence of him rising so high and it will eventually settle down. Honestly, at the risk of sounding parasocial, I’ve caught myself thinking ‘I hope Sanderson isn’t taking all this hate too personally’ once or twice this week!
You’re inspiring me to make my own video on him!
Great video, I don't read Sanderson (just not for me), but your examination of all the subjects was top notch. I'm glad that you still get so much joy from reading. Take care.
He’s right that he’s been writing this way since Elantris and it’s been offputting since Elantris. Sanderson has been a weak stylist since his first published work. This hasn’t changed. But he’s (more often than not) been able to compensate for this weakness through his storytelling, characters and creative worldbuilding.
In WaT he really made an effort to lean into his worst tendencies and, given that this is the fifth stormlight book, readers noticed.
He needs to calibrate, and definitely slow down. Spend more time with each book. I’ll read the next one but I don’t hate that it’s in 8 years.
Stop reading then
My issue is this yes it’s the story he wanted to tell. But I feel it damaged his brand not listening to his editorial team. This book could have easily trimmed out at least 100 pages and the reader would be none the wiser. 200 pages and most of his critiques would probably vanish. His delivery of his vision was just bloated. What he wanted to deliver was ultimately a worse product. It would have been better had he listened. I actually have a video coming out this month talking about this and I referenced King, Hobb, and Sanderson
In my opinion this book should have either been broken up into two books or edited down. He introduced way too much stuff in this book and rushed through them.
Sanderson is very good at plot and his brand - especially in a world where some fantasy authors aren’t finishing their series.
I had to adjust a lot for his dry dry writing - his prose is extremely flat and uninspired. But the worldbuilding and reveals are great.
Haha he is nothing if not consistent- his productivity places any average human to shame!
I was able to overlook his prose, even though it kicked me out of the story frequently, because of the great reveals and plots but this book didn't deliver in any way.
I read Elantris and Mistborn 1 back to back. I picked up Sword of Kaigen, because I need a break even after those two. Very similar, but if he bends to his audience, will his writing be worse off? I'm not concerned with length using an ereader. I read Fablehaven over the summer. It's a kids series, but Mull has more going on in 20 pages than anyone I've ever read. IMO some fantasy authors just use words as filler. A thousand pages is fine as long as they move the plot. Sandersons style doesn't always do that. I'll go back him but I need unrelated books in between.
Taking breaks in between series is a phenomenal idea! I am doing that with Wheel of Time! Also yay for Sword of Kaigen! I hope you enjoyed it!
I'm reading sword of Kaigen now, love it so far. Got a kindle for Christmas. My speed has increased. Reading quiets the mind. During teenage years I had a lot of migraines. Luckily I grew out of them. I write too, yet to publish... Cheers!
Fablehaven was a childhood fav of mine
@@nickpeitchev7763 Nice! My Nephew is reading the series now... Loves it.
@zcvt05 I def need to reread it I reread harry potter some years ago but I think fablehaven is better
I'm glad I read Wind and Truth before the Internet reviews. I loved it, I can't wait for the next five books. I *kind of* see what people are unhappy about, but none of it bothered me.
On the matter of editing a story about Akira Toriyama, the creator of dragon ball, is commonly passed around the manga community. When writing the third arc of dragon ball z Akira’s editor rode him hard mocking his villains again and again. Because of weekly publications he wasn’t able to just fully rewrite the story so one set of villains got overtaken by another and they were overtaken by yet another villain. That villain was then transformed until we were presented with the perfect being know as Cell all the while the editor questioning the entire story. The Cell saga is widely considered the best part of dragon ball because of the length that editor was willing to go to push Akira.
I feel that Brandon’s problem is that his editors can’t push him that hard. His “I want to tell this story this way” can also be seen as proof of this. He might say he’s accepting of editing but the question of how much of the story is he willing to change.
Another aspect is his motivating factor may have has changed as he may be motivated to make certain statements with this work that might not have been a motivating factor before. To use some of his own story is the motivation of justice or revenge. They might dive one to try and achieve the same outcome but the methods used to reach them can change the whole thing.
I see that there are many of us.
WaT is a book that made me realize that Brandon Sanderson might be no longer an author for me. I didn't like that book at all. I love the first 3 volumes of SA. Words of Radiance is probably my favorite fantasy book. But RoW for me was weak. I was telling myself for the last 4 years that it's because it's just a set up for the conclusion of the first arc in vol 5. But then WaT came out and it was even worse.
I love Mistborn era 1 but era 2 for me was weak and I didn't enjoy it.
I will probably read the next Cosmere books but I don't wait for them. I feel like I don't care anymore too much about that world.
No there isn’t “many” of you. This video was tailored made for the loud minority to shout themselves hoarse.
So much agree with this. I had absolutely the same feeling about RoW, WaT could have justified its flaws, but in fact it made them even worse in retrospective. And I'm definitely not waiting for SA6 anymore. I will probably read it when it comes out, but I'm not going to reread all of SA prior to it like I did in preparation for SA5. Not wasting my time on this author anymore, unless he comes back to his senses and earns my trust back.
it's so crazy how subjective books are. I have lots of friends into Sanderson and they pretty much all told me that Wind and Truth was the best book yet that Sanderson has produced. I told them not to give me any spoilers since I haven't read it yet, but like I mentioned in a previous comment, it just goes to show you just how subjective books are. There is no right or wrong, only one's taste.
@@down-the-rabbit-hole don't get me wrong, I totally understand how people could like WaT, I myself do like the destination we arrived at in the most arcs. What I don't like is the journey. I mean, I could have just listened to the book summary (there is one very nice 1h22m summary on TH-cam) and would miss nothing, maybe even had more fun than reading the book.
I have not read the last few stormlight books because I dnfed rythym of war. I just wanted to agree that the first trilogy of mistborn are amazing and the further ones did not resonate with me at all. I really like his YA series skyward though and am waiting for the next installment of that series.
The translation argument is a cop out because a translator still has to consider tone, diction and audience when they decide how translate. The prose in WaT felt very juvenile and casual--especially compared to books 1-4. And that's simply not the kind of prose I want to read.
Yeah, the translation argument was always a cope out to me. He said that he uses Tolkien's philosophy, but he writes nothing like Tolkien (prose wise). It's honestly insulting
Exactly!
_Wind and Truth_ has been a bit of a slog for me, and I'm a little 2/3 through. There are just so many PoV characters with personal arcs wrapping up, and acting in so many different areas in (and not quite in) the world, that the overall story feels like it's crawling. I'm just not getting any momentum from any of the various arcs.
Brandon Sanderson’s recent work feels like a prime example of unchecked word spew, where no one-least of all the author-has stepped in to cut the fat. Sanderson has always been overrated, but his reliance on his former editor, Moshe Feder, has never been more apparent. Without Moshe’s guidance, his pedestrian prose and bloated storytelling are laid bare. Sanderson’s grandiosity as a writer seems to prevent him from hitting the delete key, and his lack of self-awareness leads to overly indulgent, meandering narratives that should have been streamlined. What we’re left with is a novel that reads more like a first draft, where sheer volume is mistaken for quality, and any sense of discipline or restraint has vanished. It’s a disappointing display of mediocrity from a writer who has clearly started to believe his own hype.
I think a bunch of people started reading Sanderson in their teenage years. When they were that age, they found his books compelling. Now the people who loved Mistborn in their teenage years are in their 30s, and they've found out that Sanderson's books are actually all YA novels. Everyone grows up.
At one point his prose is so deep and meaningful and then it is like you are watching TikTok video...
Fall from grace for me, can't believe that same person wrote Words of Radiance and Wind and Truth.
Rythm of War was already boring as hell, but this book takes the cake.
You could remove 50% of it and nothing would change...
His prose has always been weak. Barely acceptable. Now it's the worst it's ever been with the new editor. And it never was great.
WoK and WoR feel very different from WaT, that is totally true!
really? I absolutely loved Rythm of War. Even amazon shows it at 84% 5 stars out of like 50k reviews, I guess that proves that books are indeed 100% subjective.
If you find Rythym of War boring than there is absolutely no way you can make it through Wheel of Time (particularly the middle section)
@@TheBakingYeast That's true. I'm so glad I finished Wheel of Time though , because after the boring middle section like you mentioned it kept getting better and better with an amazing ending.
Hate is a strong word. I, for one, don't hate the man, and he seems like a genuinely awesome dude to be around.
I just think a lot of people, especially those who were on the Sando train since Elantris or Mistborn, are getting older and getting more exposed to/have read more books. The more books you read within and without the genre the more you realize that Sando's more of an 'ideas' man than a writer. His books are fun, and he produces them quickly -- but in terms of writing he just doesn't hold up in terms of quality (sure, that's partly subjective; but writing is also a highly technical craft, and there are a lot of technical aspects that Sando fail as a writer)
Thats definitely true he is good writer to get into people to reading fantasy but once you do you realise there are way better authors out there but he is also getting worse as a writer at the same time, stormlight 4/5 and mistborn era 2 were just way weaker then his previous works
You two make some great points.
Full disclosure, never read any of his books so take this with _at least_ a pinch of salt :).
But what you say tracks with what i've seen from _other_ people online - the consensus among people who are more widely read (often older fans but not exclusively) seems to be more "He's fine, enjoyed a lot of his stuff" than "He's fantastic, one of the greats".
(though personally I think it's almost, if not, _entirely_ subjective - every "objective" element of "technical craft" etc. has been ignored by _at least_ one writer widely considered to be "great" - Cormac McCarthy often didn't use something as basic as punctuation "correctly" for instance - and though many claim writing is "objectively good or bad", i've yet to see anyone produce an _incontestable_ "Big list of objective criteria for great writing")
@@anonymes2884 There should be a "big objective list" but the problem is with people. Too many people disagree on objective information based on their opinions, feelings, and beliefs and not the objective reality of the subject.
There are plenty of smaller objective lists available to guide learning writers and some have existed for many years, but they still require skill to implement and some people just haven't developed those skills yet, and other's don't even try.
Also I think a lot of his audience is growing up ? For a lot of people his books were their first foray into reading and the stuff doesn’t have the same impact anymore. The flaws in his writing is more glaring because the people who have read him for a long time are starting to read other, better books
Im in love with your bookshelf and the color themes.
It's the quality and he isn't open to any criticism. I think he is too big to be edited. He needs to listen to his love group, the fans that have been with him since the beginning and now he is on an agenda. Thank you for your viewpoint.
He literally looks at tons of comments to gauge reaction and criticisms 😂
@@nickjohnson4397 Which is great but he's listened to the wrong people, real fans are exactly who he needs to listen to, not normies and fake-fans.
Maybe the fans support him lol what makes you think your opinion counts more than others? That is the only thing i don't understand about the criticism
@@alejandropastorcuesta2543 Who are you responding to?
@@presleybaldwin3756What do you mean by "normies" in this context?
No hate to anyone who enjoys Sanderson, love what you love!
I've just never understood the hype around him, Stormlight in particular. I remember getting back into fantasy around 3 years ago and hearing about this planned 10 book series where each book was 1,000 pages long, the world-building was second to none and it was the best thing since Lord of the Rings! I remember thinking at the time that it sounded more like a marketing gimmick that would invariably be a bloated mess. But I was intrigued, so I read WoK. It was fine. I started WoR but DNFed. My main issue was that it just felt boring, had flat characters and, as I feared, was bloated in length.
Given that each book is almost as long as the entire First Law trilogy, which I loved, I decided that my time would best be served exploring other authors. I can only read so much with what free time I have.
Sandersons problems: Quantity over Quality, overcomplicating for no good reason but a writers' ego (dont bother telling me you enjoy confusion as a reader, i won't believe you), nowadays he includes Zeitgeist topics, which entirely ruin the immersion into a fantasy setting... the list goes on.
And, like other sucky yet still bought franchises, he won't adapt, it sells, and never change a selling product right? Its shit, but it sells so its cool.
Frustrating how the buisness works, marketing-powerhouses can wipe their ass with a quality authors' success
Also if they really really push a certain books it tends to succeeds even if its not great, but thats kinda every industry across the board
I fell in love with Sanderson in Mistborn. I thought his prose in it was on par with Jordan in WOT. I even wrote an Amazon review saying he should be the one to pick where Jordan left off -- before it actually happened. I also really enjoyed Elantris.
I thought Way of Kings was fantastic. But I haven't loved anything else of his, including Mistborn second era. I just felt the writing quality really dropped.
Now as for the mondernisms in Wind & Truth, I thought he explained it reasonably well in-story. The terms were introduced to characters in Roshar by characters who'd lived on other worlds where such terms were common. Wit said as much when he called Kaladin a therapist and when he heard Lyft use a modern cuss-word.
But I hated the lengths he's gone to to explore all the various mental illnesses. I'd imagine that's helped a lot of people struggling with those things but it just bugged the heck out of me.
I also don't care for the in-depth look at the LGPT characters. Those story lines felt pushed in because Sanderson wanted to better understand them himself and wanted them to feel seen. But it didn't enhance the story and I didn't enjoy those scenes. People deal with diarrhea', too, but I don't want to read chapter after chapter detailed descriptions of what they're going through.
Dialog has gone really down hill, too.
Very sad. Very disappointing.
i’m reading the stormlight archive for the first time, it’s my first sanderson read (but far from my first fantasy), and i’m really really enjoying it. he’s definitely not the best with prose, and some dialogue and actions absolutely feel out of place for the world, but there’s no denying that he knows how to entertain and write a fun story. when you hold him against some lesser known fantasy writers, he definitely doesn’t look so great. however, there is a reason he is so popular, and i do think it’s because he writes a captivating story. but alas, just like any writer who’s ego and money get puffed up, he has reduced himself to pumping out poorly written stories with little editing because he knows no matter what, people will spend the money on anything he publishes.
Where is rock tho… why is no one talking about it
If you're referring to the contest of champions at 22:31, then I think it was set up. The theory itself was based on the death rattles from book 1.
Authors should write the book they like, as many successful authors teach, the last thing you should think about are the readers.
Hell no you should take fans opinions positive and negative in the consideration and judge them at the end of the day its important how audience reacts to things all the best authors, movie producers, musician, mangakas, game devs do that.
considering he's rich *because* of the fans i think he should pay more attention to them, actually.
Yep, this, 100%. Artists create art _regardless_ of what other people think (of course, _financially_ successful artists must at some point have created something that connected with a lot of people but if that's _why_ they do it then they're merely hacks).
As fans we get to choose whether to pay for it (or not) and sure, these days especially we also get to tell the world what we thought (because of course what we think is _so_ important :), it's then up to them what they do - they don't "owe us" anything (crucially, they don't owe us the book _we_ want to read rather than the book _they_ want to write - being a fan means those two intersect, it doesn't mean the author _must_ make them do so).
Lot of entitlement in fandoms these days IMO. Not a good development.
@anonymes2884 I agree tonnes of comments seem to come down to the fan wanting the story to go a different way and being shocked that the author would dare do something different. As if there is anyway to make every fan happy.
I haven’t seen any comments about actual content of the story. It has been about the quality of the prose, dialogue, and bad pacing. All of those can be fixed without changing anything about the story.
Words of Radiance is my favorite Stormlight book at the moment. I just now started Wind and Truth. But, I think Sanderson utilized the ticking clock in that novel very well and I don’t think I’ve ever seen complaints about it. It was 62 days rather than 10, and then novel was still structured in parts though. I would think a 10 day ticking clock would do a lot in making the pace seem fast. Maybe it was a little too fast? And the actual structure being split into the 10 days is a bit different. I guess I’ll see how it works on me soon though!
Wind & Truth was great. In general, I think I like his shorter works better, but this one was just as good as the first 4 Stormlight archive books.
Es curioso que muchos de tus libros estén en español. ¿De dónde eres?
Part of the problem is Sanderson is prolific and consistent but not great imo. Read Martin, Jordan, Tolkien or Abercrombie and you will feel Sanderson is clearly the junior here. Sanderson is in no way bad just not one of the greats, he is just prolific and current so it is very easy to be a fan. Oh and the fantasy diction thing is just LAZY imo. Even though Tolkien talked about it I don't think I notice it in any of Tolkiens work but it is very noticeable in Sandersons.
Abercrombie really is the modern goat. He picked up the reins that George decided to drop
@@nurplepain3636 100%! Also check out Larry Corriea, Son of the Black Sword for more gritty morally grey content. He also rips GRRM in his dedication in the last book with: "See George it can be done" 🤣
At least Sanderson can finish an epic cycle.
@@davidb9639 That was my point that he is prolific and consistent
John Gwynne is better than Robert Jordan imo
Which Sanderson books would you recommend for newbie like me?
Probably the original mistborn trilogy!
Thank you for spelling out and clarifying the amalgamation of the turmoil with this book I've been feeling. I felt like it was just me or a lot of "reactions" people may be blowing out of proportion, but even with your beautiful accent, you were able to explain it so much more succinctly.
The problem a lot of fans of Sanderson try and overlook is the plot.
And it's best summarised with this here: A group of people unite to stop an threat to them and are attacking at this threat's central base from a disadvantageous position. They manage to succeed against it and do what was necessary to help things out for their people.
What book of Sandersons am I referencing here?
Is it Elantris? Final Empire - Hero of Ages, Way of Kings - Oathbringer, Warbreaker? Any of them? All of them?
It's actually Steelheart, it's referencing the Reckoners trying to overthrow Steelheart.
That's the problem with Sanderson, it always has been - and it's something I could marginally forgive, a framework plot isn't the be all and end all of the plot.
But now we're seeing entire scenarios from previous books appearing in the different books. Adolins trial is Perrins trial, the Marasi story from tLM is the Shallan Story from RoW.
And now we're getting the exact same story told to us of the characters that we've already seen before. 50% of WaT is repeating information we've already heard before from the Shallan plots to the Dalinar plots. And Sanderson put in the book the lines telling you he's aware of what hes doing and doesn't care. It was about expanding your understanding of the things you're trying to learn.
So he's gone from reusing the framework of a plot to reusing a single or a couple of plotlines to then reusing nearly every single characters plot in one book.
A lot of people have called Wind and Truth bad fan fiction and that's part of it ^^^ the reuse of plots, a lot of bad fan fics just take the plots of things they've already seen and reuse them with their version of characters, very rarely do you see original concepts in fan fics.
I don't think it's fan fiction, I think it's losing the ability to write consistently and well.
Then there's the problem of retconning things.
Shallan is the worst culprit of this with her plot, there are things in it that shouldn't be in it (and no it's not what you think, I finished the atrocious book, and I consider the reveal of that to be a very badly done example) that were finished and dealt with in RoW and shouldn't be there anymore - at all. But it is because that's the framework Sanderson has to deal with.
And as long as people keep ignoring things like this and screaming that people must praise him, the worse its going to get. I said this at the end of tLM that Sanderson needs to take a long break from writing, to step away and let things simmer because outside of that he's going to keep devolving while the people around him who are not his best allies for this sort of thing keep telling him everything that they shouldn't about what he should do.
A decade of nothing would be a good time to recharge his skills as a writer, and to mature more as a person.
I'm currently halfway through Oathbringer and I'm really enjoying it. I've been thinking for a while on the critiques on Rythm of War and, now, Wind and Thruth and how it might change my love for the series. Thank you so much for this video, I will definitely take into the account the editing process change when reading xx
dont listen to the haters, if you like the worlds its still really enjoyable
I hope the video did not bias your opinion, but hopefully will allow you to enjoy following books knowing this is something Sanderson acknowledges and wants to do! 🫶
I enjoyed it until I started Rhythm of War which I did not. I don’t know if I will ever read WaT
I wish I've stopped reading SA after Oathbringer.
WaT was just exhausting. Everyone has a mental health crisis and every character had these droning expositions that just went on and on. Land the plane on it already. Everyone can’t be suffering from a mental health crisis in a massive novel. Then comes in the shoe horned in LGBTQ. I have zero problem with those kinds of characters if it fits the story and is organic in its plot development but this was a clear hammer over the head shove in your face development. I was taken aback and at some points felt I was reading a PG gay romance novel. It almost took over the story and it had a major impact on a huge plot line. Also, the out of know where overt trans scenes made me pause. I stopped at certain times and was thinking what the heck is going on and why. He is free to do and write as he sees fit. It’s his universe but I won’t be along for the ride anymore. I will just wait til everything is written and then decide if I want to finish the whole arc. I have always preordered his stuff but I won’t do that ever again. Plenty to read over the next decade it takes him to finish. I wish everyone a happy journey. Maybe I will see y’all down the road. See you on the other side.
I found the Rhythm of War subpar, and I DNFed Cytonic. The stories felt too contrived. Rhythm of War had a good storyline with Navani, but everything else was disappointing.
I haven't heard of him improving afterwards. Now, after a few years, other people have pointed out that his newer releases are bad. It's gone bad years ago!
Exactly. It's just reached a critical point where people now have too much trouble deluding themselves to continue doing so
I’m done with Sanderson, he needs to get some better ghost writers, his latest batch is bad
When u become a rockstar author i.e. GRRM, King, Sanderson hubris starts to creep in, and IMO you begin thinking everything you write is great, because they develop ardent fans that will defend anything they release. WaT wasn’t a good book. It just wasn’t and I consider Words of Radiance an all timer in fantasy.
WoR is such a banger! I agree that WaT wasn’t at that level but seeing how Sanderson acknowledges part of the feedback and said it’s how he wants to tell the story, makes me think that he is listening but that this might not be for everyone
No hate at all from me. Wind Truth was not my favorite book in the series, but I enjoyed the book and I am motivated to continue reading his older material.
Just finished this book last night...it was a HARD read for me. There are SOOOOO many glaring problems, and this video covers most of them...I would just add that a lot of the criticism he is getting is that he went full "woke" in this book. That word is way overused in my opinion, and I personally don't have an issue with lgbtq representation in a book, but it seems so out of place in this setting and in this novel. It felt like Sanderson decided he needed to check some boxes as opposed to having elements that organically fit into his story, and it was all handled so clumsily. Also, there are so many modernisms and anachronisms on this book that it is completely immersion killing.
This reads like "I'm not a homophobe, BUT..."
@@joelleblanc8670 well im not a homophobe BUT....I completely agree, so out of place
The problem with this statement is that unless an underrepresented minority is written with perfect representation, then it shouldn't be included and we should just default to the "traditional" characteristics. I think there is some valid critique that it wasn't foreshadowed, but I felt that Renarin being gay was very believable based on his personality. Regardless, let's not stoop to using "woke" as a criticism and focus on critiquing the quality of the writing. Demanding perfect representation or it shouldn't be included needs to stop.
How about instead say "I felt that Rlain and Renarin's relationship came out of nowhere" and leave it at that rather than starting the argument with Sanderson going woke.
@@joelleblanc8670 and your comment reads like, "anyone who is not is lockstep with my personal feelings on this topic must be homophobic"
@@andrewf7732 I think you missed the point...representation is fantastic, and even most conservative, "anti-woke" pundants have no issue with lgbtq characters in general....the problem, and where that dreaded "woke" word comes in, is when that representation is simply present to check boxes on the virtue signaling checklist as Sanderson is clearly doing here.
I've been saying Sanderson is the most overhyped author of all time for years, and people used to spit at me
People get unreasonably angry when I mention I DNF'd Mistborn :S
Anyone who spits at you over books is demented.
well of ascension is the worst book i ever read
you are 100% right in my book
The power of marketing... makes people celebrate complete underwhelming mediocrity
@@alannapenner37 i dont blame you, concept and character ideas are cool, but the execution... its a tiring read.
And dont bother self-doubting, its the author that has to deliver. If you fall asleep reading, he probably made some pacing mistakes.
An uncritical consumership leads to a market full of sh1t, like we see on booktok. Slop is sold, slop is delivered
I was reading the weekly drops of the chapters until I went on holiday mid of November and I'm afraid to say that it's been on pause since then. It just had been a bit of a struggle up until then. One day I'll get back to it I guess
I hope everything is alright! Book will be there for you and hopefully you will enjoy it enough!
I’ve seen the problems with his writing since the beginning and I have also seen his strength. I honestly love him for what he is. He was such a breathe of fresh air when fantasy was only Grimdark.
He’s improved but he hasn’t really changed. I think this is all us. We want to hype things, and we also want to see them fall from grace, perhaps we also want to see a come back, perhaps as a group we’ll decide some novel in the future will epitomize that.
Sanderson is just about telling stories and being himself. I’m glad he knows how to do both. He has my full support going forward.
tbh that was something that really drew me into his writing, that it's a little more hopeful and not as grimdark as a lot of other fantasy. There's still bad stuff that happens, I think Kaladin's storyline in book 1 in particular gets pretty dark, but not on the level of other popular fantasy like ASOIAF. There was a period in my life I could handle and enjoyed darker stories like ASOIAF but I just can't anymore, not for several years now. I want more fantasy like stormlight
I am an aspiring author, and Brandon Sanderson was, and still is, one of my biggest inspirations for being a writer. I even wrote an entire 3,000 word thesis about him in senior year of university.
However, even i will say that his line-by-line level prose can be weak at times, even if others areas like character arcs, pacing and plot are are excellent overall. I think Joe Abercrombie writes his prose, on a sentence by sentence level, better than Sanderson.
Sanderson excells at marketing his books snd communicating with fans, in addition to being quite open and transparent about his writing processes. Not to mention teaching others about the writing craft via his writing courses at BYU University, all which I think is what msde him popular as an author.
Brandseron steps into….the panderverse.🤯
There is disaappintment and critisism and then there is "hate" ...
I suspect people who like Wind and Truth also think Rings of Power is a good show.
i'd point out too, sanderson appeals to me in that i don't read. (im lucky to finish a book in a few months to a year. i mostly read manga, trying to change that though and have set some goals))) i have a hard time getting into a series and his style feels accessible and if i go to get a book i kinda feel like im gonna enjoy it, my first book of his was elantris and mistborn. but if i mention to people that do read often and consume books more regularly than me they kinda don't like him for the reasons you've pointed out, or they just feel kinda neutral about his work.
Fair point! I am glad you are enjoying the books! I also started with Elantris and then Mistborn!
I just thought they hated him because he sucks.
Im not an expert on Sanderson, but I've seen the same thing happen to a lot of other authors, particularly those with a large body of work. They start to run out of ideas, and they lose the mental sharpness that made their work shine.
Tried Mistborn 3 times and each time I tired it the story was brining and too basic. It wasn’t detailed enough to keep my attention so I stopped. I want to explore different authors.
“Ah, what do you know?” she said. “You’re a building.”
“And?” the tower said.
“And people fart in you. Like all the time. I bet half the people in this room are doing it right now.”
"Oh, I’m fine. Just a big mess of existential crisis!"
Truly peak quality prose. Especially for a fantasy series.
MCU lite and wokeness killed it for me.
I personally love his books. I see some criticism directed at the size of the Cosmere, but it is an interconnected galaxy, so it would make sense to read certain books in a certain order. I have a friend who works in a book store, and they’ve been selling a ton of Sanderson books. I can see the criticism for his books, though I personally enjoyed WAT a lot. It was better than SA 3 and 4 for me, but the first two are still the best.
Maybe he should roll back on the mental health and identity stuff though, I feel like that could get draining, though I haven’t had many issues with it so far.
Ever since i saw him hand candy he coughed on to students in some writer's workshop, I lacked interest in his books.
Sanderson may be the most overrated author today. I enjoyed Mistborn era 1 l, 2, and just finished wind and truth; but none of these are as good as their ratings on Goodreads suggest. He is propped up by fandom who enjoy being apart of something.
Particularly I did enjoy those books (Mistborn era 1 and SL books 1-3) a lot, so 5 stars for me there! But I do agree, he is great with the fandom and that builds loyalty and momentum
I like Brandon Sanderson. I like that he is the most prolific fantasy author right now. That said, I read the first chapter of Wind and Truth and put it down. I lost interest in the series, and in Rhythm of War, I skimmed a lot of the chapters. I lost patience. These books are too prosy. Thinking back to his books I read, I loved the original Mistborn trilogy, the first two books of Stormlight Archive, and Warbreaker. The rest of his work, I really don't care about. Tress of the Emerald Sea I enjoyed the first half, skimmed the rest.
Would you still recommend this series then? Did you personally enjoy the book, despite its faults?
Your addressing of the criticisms is great. I find that I did not agree with any of the popular critiques they you mentioned, but your personal ones are fairly accurate to me.
The "therapy" word being anachronistic was not the jarring part for me, but the fact that it was being used as a joke in areas that undercut the seriousness with a forced sense of levity.
The thought that he needed a breather chapter at some point is very accurate. The breather would have also helped being the feeling of lack of connectivity with the characters by adding a point the characters could reflect on what has happened.
In terms of the editing, the book felt standard for Sanderson to me, almost to a cliched point however. The editing did not catch the previous two points, and it missed that the climax and beginning of the resolution became vague and rushed (SPOILERS a description of the new storm instead of the reactions and the 'off-screen' death of a character are two main issues I found with it)
The last issue I had personally was that none of the main characters felt like they had enough time to settle their character arcs. Something was built up with the characters, a great climax or revelation happened, and then either the story ended or the characters were thrown into a new situation without a moment of reflection for the readers.
Wait, whats so bad about about the word therapy. We got it from the greeks; therapia, to heal with speech. Isnt hellenistic fantasy, of a time before midevil fantasy?
The broader appeal in general always means narrower appeal in previous fanbase.
I kind of regret being invested so much in stormlight to be discarded at the last book for being too "narrow minded"😢.
Well, Sanderson is only human. He can and will make mistakes. I think I'm just going to forget about his work. I think that is better than continuing reading books that are just not for me.
Also someone has a good point in the comments, writing best story for certain demografic don't nessesarly coresponds to greatest monetary gains. By switching to more childlike writing he can achieve more short term success.
I don't think anyone dislikes Brandon Sanderson. His books are another thing, being both eternally loved and just generally disliked. But him? One of the best people I have seen. And *as an author,* he's the best of the best imo.
Seems to me that Sanderson's books have suffered the fate of being placed on a pedestal. Then when it didn't meet the expectations of the readers, they are shocked and perplexed.
I really enjoyed the original Mistborn trilogy and the first two books of the Stormlight Archives.
I DNF'd book 4 of the Stormlight Archives for these general reasons:
Too slow
Meandering
Same/same throughout (over explaining)
Too long by at least half
Boring
There are too many great books out there to slog through this any longer.
Fair enough! I am so glad you got to enjoy some of his books and are now seeking new 5 star reads!
"Too slow
Meandering
Same/same throughout (over explaining)
Too long by at least half
Boring"
you just said the same thing 5 times in a row.
@@user-ly2ll5od1r Wanted to make sure you "got it"
😬
I didn't think that's really true. There are some very hateful trolls going off about everything... Very vocal minority. Trying to basically cancel anything they don't like... Often just about everything.
I wish I stopped at Oathbreaker. Rythem of war was boring and I hate Venli. I am not interested in rehabilitation of her character or her history. Wind and Truth I couldn't finish.
I could never hate him, I became a writer because of him and he is free to target his projects to different audiences. I respect it if I'm not part of the designed group anymore. And honestly I still read his work as a reference for self improvement.
I've read almost all of Sanderson's books. Elantris is still one of my books of all time. That said, I could not finish Wind & Truth. Listening to the audiobook, I got to almost 45 hours and was just done. I realized I stopped caring about almost all the characters. Adolin was the only character I continued to care about, but there was just not enough of him. The other characters just had plots I didn't care about, or I never cared about those characters. Beyond how long, boring, and repetitive the books were, he's made it clear in interviews that I'm not his target audience anymore. That's cool because not every book is for every person, so I'm moving on.
People don’t hate Sanderson. At least not more than any other extremely successful author. I think you may be just hearing a lot from a small percentage of loud people in certain groups. He has so many eyes on him that some are bound to have qualms, and those people can make posts on Reddit and there are enough Sanderson readers out there to have a lot of discourse in those threads. But Wind and Truth being somewhat disappointing to some (or even many) readers does not mean people hate him.
Looks like Rory has a man crush.😂
@GaryIrving-x5o har har, people say author bad…you say author not bad. You love author, har har
@roryhector6581 Yeah, that's it.
My opinions haven't changed. I never liked his books. 🤣
I mean apart from whack leftie political stuff the overall quality of his writing dropped. He is doing too much and too quickly.
So far i havent loved anything for the super hyped up authors . Never read sanderson but i can imgine it being in my wheel house. I had major issues with that john gwynne series that all the book tubers love.
I'm glad that people are finally opening their eyes. I don't hate him, that's too much, but his books have always been unreadable. People say that his last book is the worst and I'm like "How is that even possible?"
Anyone who has read complex, beautiful high fantasy (Paul Anderson, Lord Dunsany), cannot thoroughly enjoy the overly simplistic language of Sanderson
I loved Wind and Truth from page to page!
I just wanted more and more of Stormlight content
I think he's too close to a small portion of the Fandom, and they have too much influence over him.
It's all good, though. I'll still be here when Stormlight 6 comes out.
I do love Wind and Truth but I can see some of the problems people have with the book. What I have a problem with is that it seems that a lot of people have forgotten about the secret projects that came out the year before. Most people loved 3 out of 4 books and suddenly he is a bad author after Wind and Truth? I understand if you only read Stormlight Archive and didn't like Rhythm of War either but it is hard for an author to not have a few stinkers.
I just started with Cosmere with Mistborn and his writing & storytelling is average at best…but having said that I think the issue is with the publishing industry in itself, they market what they can sell in mass and it results in things like this… it’s like you identify a formula and repeat it mechanically without really anything outstanding
They gotta do what they gotta do is the mantra. Most Authors are/were cowed and the product reflected that in the last few years. They can write about courage but cannot demonstrate it. For instance, I thought Neal Stephenson had suffered some kind of stroke then it was explained to me. (In fact he made it a ludicrous joke of it) . At this point let it suffice to remember for every Rowling their will be a whole pact grovelers. Anyway, regardless of the recent past A Society that demands character and plot elements to be included to be published/broadcast is on the way out because it kills spirit and creativity. At least until natural self deletion catches up. Which, mercifully, seems to be happening.
What happened to Neal Stephenson? I haven't read any of his books since Seveneves was kind of a boring slog with a bunch of weak plot holes and poor characterization.
I've read the first three Stormlight books so far and enjoyed the experience, but I agree with all the major critiques listed and more. His reputation as someone who can crank out books like crazy to me is not a strength(unless you're his marketing department). The books feel criminally under-edited both in length, but even more, his rough dialogue and the rushed way he'll figure out explanations for decisions he makes in the books.
He wants to get in with the Hollywood people and he's getting more obnoxious with his woke lefty BS.