Wollongong got shafted so many times it's ridiculous. First the federation didnt let them host the 2002 grand final at home in Wollongong, they then won it anyway but went from back-to-back champions with a squad of top talents and owning their own Stadium, to being broke in the 2nd tier after being shafted out of their stadium and then from the A-league a bunch of times.
Illawarra can have their own A-League team and NRL team like the NBL team. They can afford to fund both A-League and NRL teams. They should hand St George back to Kogarah and stand alone again. Always been a good area for Soccer with the Wolves. A Canberra team as well rather than having 3 Sydney and Melbourne teams.
100% from the start, it should have been Wollongong Wolves - not CCM. Seems so obvious when I say it out aloud, but here we are 20 years later. Still no team from Wollongong in the A-League...
As a Kiwi, I hope Auckland continues to see huge success in interest. Seems the A-League often forgets you need 2 things to make a new club successful, strong/stable financiers AND a strong base of support among a local population. Auckland, with its 1.7 million people, seems like the perfect bid.
i'd like auckland and Wellington to do well and give something to the competition. Crazy that the A League has 3 teams in Melb and 5 teams in NSW. Disaster. Should have been kept at 10 teams or 11 including Auck. Are any Auckland teams called the Auckland Orcas. Seem obvious to me. Just a thought. I expect its a common nickname.
Probably a stronger market than Wellington. Though Phoenix have done very, very well for a club that hasn't won anything since they were formed. In the coming years, that should make for a good local derby.
As long as they both play 'home games' all over the country. Dunners chc nelson napier tauranga and new Plymouth and maybe the tron should get at least a game per season. Maybe not for the Darby thou
As a Macarthur resident, i was astonished they won the bid. I knew then it would be an unmitigated disater. The fact they havent folded yet is bewildering.
Western United actually have some potential imo. 4k average attendance isn't a lot but, in a 5k capacity privately owned ground that's gonna start adding up financially for the club. They just need to play the long game and hope that they grow with the suburb.
The fact that western finally stopped being a gypsy side and settled on Tarneit, just shows they need to accept their situation and tap in to the new community there. They’re betting on 25-30 years in the future they they’re are embedded in the region.
3 teams in Melbourne is ridiculous. Even worse is 5 teams in NSW. Meanwhile you have Brisbane and Perth capturing 6 million people on the bottom of the ladder. No teams have no profile at all currently. Should have kept it at 10 teams.
Canberra has been tried multiple times in the old NSL and couldn't get crowds above 1500 and folded quickly. What makes it different this time around ?
No, no Canberra. Canberra United is having a hard time staying afloat, let alone the other national teams (Capitals, Cavalry) looking for handouts from a cash strapped ACT government. Only the Giants and Raiders have a large enough fanbase to sustain an ongoing presence. The sooner the Canberra bid is squashed the better. (I had family involved with the Cannons debacle, I don't want to see that happen again.)
@@widyasantoso4910 I actually think Canberra has the population but doesn't need a team. Really in A league it should be only one or two teams per major city. Regional areas aren't big enough.
Western United's name is ridiculous ... containing no reference to their actual location. Adelaide and Perth are more "west" than they are. They should be referencing "Melbourne" in their name somehow ... that would at least give them an identity. Every other team in the league references their location in their name.
I couldn’t agree more. It’s the same thing with the Western Bulldogs in the AFL. Victoria are the America of Australia, they forget that other areas in this country exist!
Southern expansion was a joke, and only had any momentum because of the civil war between Football Illawarra and the Wolves. No one in the Illawarra wanted any team apart from the Wolves.
5 teams in NSW is way too much. how does central coast or newcastle even exist. its a joke. 2 in sydney is sufficient and maybe a large regional area at most. anything more is ridiculous.
not enough people. Should be 3 teams max in NSW. 2 in Syd. How does Newcastle get a team? How about put teams in significant population bases for starters, otherwise it becomes an amateur league.
@@drewbadenochPT I always assumed that Central coast was many hundred of kms away with a big population base. Never been to NSW. Then I see Newcastle and Sydney are nearby. How can there be 5 teams in that area. If someone suggested a team in Mandurah and Bunbury then you'd have people saying how ridiculous it was. Obviously less population. But its the same amount of rubbish.
@@afldomain if they started today it would be ready for the 27/28 season, would only take a couple of years to build. Similar timeline to sfs mrs and Parramatta, once they were flattened.
Having to play a chunk of home fixtures at AAMI Park can not have been helpful. I understand the logistics (can't hold every home game at Whitten Oval or Kardinia), but if you want residents of Western Melbourne to get behind a local team, it's a pretty big ask to tell them "most of your home games are going to be in Richmond. You'll have to drive across the Westgate and through city traffic in order to watch them play, and then go through all of that again in pitch black on the way home". If they can build a proper 10-15K stadium, and get decent results, crowd numbers shouldn't be too much of a problem, ESPECIALLY if playing Victory.
Wollongong not getting a team feels ridiculous to me, they only have half an NRL team and a middling NBL team, while someone in Southeast Sydney or West Melbourne can get to a BBL match, or NRL or AFL depending on the city much easier. Canberra deserve a look without a full time BBL team, and Ipswich or Fremantle have enough local identity to survive
Putting a team in a Market smaller than the Central Coast that has Established Competition is Nuts, if people have to choose between Soccer and Basketball in the Summer most will choose Basketball because Basketball is played inside with Aircon
there is no team called fremantle though. i assume they'd be trying to get a few clubs south of fremantle to combine. stick it to 10 teams including the 2. NZ teams.
I kind of get why they weren't added to the league during its 2005 formation (had to cover the major cities in Australia, plus they probably wanted a couple of former NSL clubs that soccer fans would recognize), but once FFA started drifting into proper expansion in the late 2000's, Wollongong should have been a top priority. Imagine if they fielded a team in the 2009-10 season ahead of NQF........would probably be financially stable to this day.
@Chris-acneboy I've been a longtime fan of Wollongong, but to me, if there was one other place that I could argue might deserve it more, it would be Canberra. It makes no sense that there can be 5 teams in the Sydney to Newcastle area and nothing south. Just look at how Canberra love their rugby union and rugby league teams...
@@_Dei_ The issue is - and I really don't know how it can be done to make it happen - that it's a corporate league, and not a pyramid/tier system like in the UK and Europe. 5 clubs in the one town or city isn't so much an issue, rather, the other, smaller teams aren't given a chance to grow and develop. The other issue is, as somewhat addressed in this video - identity. A club has to come from the area that you live - like what you mentioned. But it has to resonate with the culture of that area and the people from within it. Just plonking clubs here, there and everywhere creates the same kinds of issues that the Chinese and Saudi leagues face. A dead, bloated shell of a league with nobody interested in following it - although those might be slightly extreme examples. But people have to resonate with that club and want to be a part of it. Another thing I have noticed, especially here, is the teams are so far apart that traveling "away" just seems ridiculous and almost a holiday in itself. And that leads me to think that a tiered system might help with smaller clubs developing in the cities and states that then can work up to the Premier/A-League. I don't know if something like what the American's do with their Football system might work too. Say each State has it's own smaller or minor league that compete and the top two or three teams get promoted to the A-League or something like that. Or have Play-offs. You get the idea... I've been to a few Glory games now - new to the club. It's... It's ok. Shit level of football, but I am ok with that. The fan base at the season holders end is fantastic - only a few hundred, but very vocal and lively from what I've seen. The rest of the stadium is a bit dead and flat. I do not like the promotion of corporatism and merchandise, however. I want to go to support my local team and to be entertained, not preached to. But that's another matter in and of itself.
@@apropercuppa8612 Agree with all you've said, and that's what hurts the most being a Wollongong fan. We have a team, a team with history and that is much loved. Even in the NSL days, it felt like they hated us and wanted us gone. That move of the 2nd grand-final win to Sydney... Wollongong vs South Melbourne (I think) was criminal. No one in Sydney wanted to watch it. We could have sold out Wollongong Showground a few times over. Instead, it was played to a near empty stadium. I don't even watch the A-League. I'm clearly not the target audience...
Great vid Brad, wondering if our convo about Western before the game with Cody helped with the vid. Our support is fortunately growing stronger (slowly) and it's mostly thanks to the love that the club has for us fans. Looking forward to the next vid!
I felt that western utd and MacArthur kinda diluted the Sydney and Melbourne rivalry in a pretty bad way…. There used to be a time where it’s was hard to get tickets to these derby games but now more often than not ever since the inception of these third wheels team, you can often get tickets to these derby games the same day… Not like afl in melbs or NRL in Sydney where they have 10+ teams in the same city…. And still have fine rivalries (albeit some are shit)… That why I feel the afl shouldn’t have a third team in WA or SA as more likely its will heavily dilute showdown or western derby quite significantly…. It’s probs the same for the third teams in syd and Melbs in a league
As sad as the lack of support for Macarthur is, the area deserves a rep. Cahill and Brett Emerton, among other soccerooos, grew up round there and it has a huge local junior scene. Just needs to sort out their promotion at youth level. I still think Tassie could be great. They are always forgotten in most national league so surely the locals would get around the football team
When Wollongong Wolves got dropped from the league i stopped supporting the league. Everyone just stayed home and watched overseas football. My father took me as a kid to watch every home game at Brandon Park and as Howlers club member it was the only thing i was looking forward to. Our dreams got taken away. Club was out of the league and on top of that it moved away. Memories is what we have.
Great video. The way that Geoff Gallop (who was the worst choice to run football) intended to have both a new Sydney and Melbourne in the league when the allowed a bidding war was allowed broke hearts of football fans outside of the so-called "Metropolitan Bubble". Fun fact: the former owners of Melbourne Victory, Harry Stamoulis and Robert Belteky were the architects behind the Tasmania A-League bid.
I remember reading Foxtel paid the FFA $5m, (you read correctly), to have a seat at the table regarding expansion. $5m buys you more than just a seat, they got to pick the two new teams and they wanted them in big population centres.
So a bunch of suits in the boardroom of a cable TV company, were able to locate the two expansion clubs over anyone with knowledge of Australia's football demographics? The state of football in this country makes so much sense now.
They are neither clubs nor teams; they are soulless franchises owned by equally soulless property developers. Having said that, WU have built an actual football stadium with an actual football pitch that plays like a billiard table. And that's my 2 cents worth.
@@waggafletcher because aami parks turf is shit? Constantly voted one of the best in the world. They didn't build a stadium, they built a single tiered npl style Bay on council owned land.
I'm not that privvy to Macarthur, but I rate WUN's fanbase. Small but loyal. Nice to see that their local fans can now go to a game, without having to fang it across the Westgate Bridge.
@@AugustThrone Typically that’s only if they’re ⚽️-loving rich people, which Clive Palmer wasn’t and thus why he ditched GCU the moment he grew bored of it all.
@@AugustThrone where did I say I didn't? Wu have bigger crowds because they can afford to give away thousands of memberships and millions of tickets. I emailed wufc for a free ticket to see if I liked it and they just sent it across..
Good video. Firstly, David galloped is a flog that almost destroyed the aleague. The atmosphere of active support drew crowds and that flog killed it. We are still recovering from that. Secondly, not sure why people wanna see western united and MacArthur fail. I don’t want to see anymore clubs fail, I want to see more teams added to have a longer comp. Not sure how MacArthur have failed to capitalise on a booming region, perhaps because most people were already either wsw or sfc fans. I would like to see Wollongong wolves and a Canberra team added next.
They're already in their 5th season and their crowds have stagnated not grown. If being too new was a problem then we'd see consistent growth in crowds year on year as they better establish themselves but this is not the case. West Sydney and Sydney FC were already well supported by people in South West Sydney so they've been doomed from the beginning imo.
Success will not make the club work. Win everything. Win every time. No one will ever care, that's not how you build a sustainable club in this country. If anything - winning everything will only bring the demise of the club sooner. If they can barley make money now, how will having games in Asia every year help? How long will the investors be willing to throw more money into the giant pile of burning money?... Let me guess, you think they will - forever - because they are so passionate about McArthur having a club. Because this region just deeply deserves its place in the A-league. If so, you are dreaming. The club simply has no appeal and will never have a real fan base.
If they're both paying their way, there isn't a problem. More teams can be added in due course. Running a hate campaign isn't gonna help either of them.
2014-2019 A-League seasons are unmatched too any other seasons so far. Hopefully crowds become the same again. I don't agree with most rebrandings of clubs but one i agree with is Melbourne Heart to Melbourne City idk who thought Melbourne Heart was a good name.
Firstly the tickets need to come down in price. When Glory started in Perth in the nineties it was ten dollars. It got good crowds and a fantastic atmosphere. The A League may need to take a few steps back before going forward. A twenty dollar adult entry would do wonders. Obviously it costs but you might make up part of the difference through food and beverage and merchandise sales. Otherwise the League will need to absorb the costs. Then we can return to expansion. Second teams in Perth, Adelaide and Brisbane plus Hobart, Canberra and Wollongong should be achievable in a twenty year plan. And by 2050 we should have the making of a second division.
Canterbury surely have to be a serious contender. Christchurch is the 2nd largest city in NZ and they’d be the sole representative for the South Island , 1.3million people. And a brand new world class stadium is currently being built. They’re the only highly populated region left without a side.
It's not about the crowds, more teams - more spots for young aussies. In the entire league there's about 5 aussie strikers regularly playing and then people wonder why we can't produce strikers for the national team? It should be 3x that much. We finally have a season that is long enough that it lines up with europe so I expect the quality of the league to improve over the next 5 years. Socceroos doing well will bring more viewers to the a-league - we already know this.
The problem is the A league can attract much much better imports than the A league lifer level players that come through, and strikers make such a huge difference. Also any young striker who is any good scores 8 goals in a season then jumps to Europe despite having proven nothing of being a top level A league player. In summary, the aussie strikers who can't do better than the A League are not good, and any young striker who is A league level (able to score more than 5 a season regularly) is off overseas before they're ready. Next one to leave is Waddingham who despite being a great player for his age is still not an above average A League line leading number 9, but he'll go to Europe and probably stagnate at age 20. He'll probably leave with a goal every 3 games. He should really stay 2 more years and improve to the point he's scoring 1 in 2. But it doesn't happen like that. We likely see him go, not improve, and come back the same level of player at age 26
Should have been Canberra and Tasmania. Why expand the competition with teams already in cities with multiple Football Clubs???? This ain't the 1890s where suburban rivalry can sustain a competition within a few select cities.
@@samthornton5911 I've never been to NSW. I reckon its ridiculous that you have 3 in Sydney and then Central coast and Newcastle. Central coast never should have got a team. But until teams move you can't keep adding more teams. Its like me deciding a few cities in Qld need teams, and then Bunbury in south west... Its the same biased mindset.
Imagine being from Perth and wanting to get into the a league, you see western united, nice kit, newly established and quickly winning silverware, you jump on board, follow all the club socials and players, purchase a kit only to find that tickets to their home games are played in AAMI park on the other side of the continent. Now imagine being from west of Melbourne and jumping onto either the M. Victory or M. City bandwagon, buy a member ship, attend games, only to one day drive past a newly developed stadium down the road from you dedicated to Western United.
Great Video. Would have liked some info re the FA and APL breaking apart and the impact of Covid but otherwise fantastic. Promotion / relegation would be the best thing for the A League, but protecting your own self interests (no competition to my franchise) seems to be the way of Soccer in this country. I think Macarthur can grow its fanbase - but they haven't started building their highly promoted $30m Training Facility yet either. Small stadiums are a must while the crowds are small, in my opinion. People go for the atmosphere and nothing worse than an empty stadium.
Went past W.U's home ground out Tarneit way last night. It will take a while to build up the support base, and stadium. Might take 50 years. Personally, I would have brought in South Melbourne as they have a stadium, club system all ready to go. W.U. is basically a club to get people to buy property out in the distant western suburbs. Once they sell I am sure the club will be jettisoned.
New markets are the key to growing a truly national competition. Gallop F'd up Rugby League, and then F'd up A-league. A Tassie team (in a state often starved of teams in national sport comps), Canberra, and second teams in Adelaide & WA would build new market derbies and rivalries. Wollongong has always deserved to stay in the comp.
@@mattturner2828 no it wasn't. Otherwise it would have been called Geelong. Plus Geelong don't have a stadium for football and aren't particularly interested in anything non cats. Plus tarneit is just up the road for em
I’ve just moved to south east Sydney from the UK, what are the barriers for an A-League club to be founded here or for like the Sutherland sharks to expand.
I don’t think the A-League will add anymore teams to Sydney. If Sydney gets another team, it’ll be via promotion, but there are no plans for that in the near future.
People need to learn to be patient, not every club needs to be an instant success from the getgo. WU and Macarthur are a work inprogress. They are building their base and both clubs already achieved on field success. All they need is time.
There are already 5 teams in NSW though. I don't know how Newcastle get a team when they're only 2 hours from Sydney. Don't know what central coast is exactly, but if its near newcastle or sydney then how does that get a team. someone that's really sydney centric has done that. I wonder if they ever have travelled out of sydney.
@@BDub2024Canberra isn’t in NSW and Newcastle is a football heartland with a rich footballing history and a bigger population base than any non capital city in the country aside from the GC.
@@kirinjcallinan1 Canberra (ACT) is stuck in the middle of NSW. Five teams in NSW is ridiculous as is. If Mcarthur and Mariners can get dumped then it might free up a spot for Canberra. Certainly Canberra has the population to make it more viable. But its supposed to be a national competition and then they stick all the teams in cities in nsw.
@@BDub2024living in Canberra I can tell you majority of us have no interest in NSW teams despite football being the most popular sport here. With a population of 478k, the FA are clueless to sleep on that market. You could easily get a 100k fanbase if Canberra actually had a team to support
@@MIKEYYYYYx its about having teams spread out across Australia and not over a third in one State. ACT sits within NSW so the problem doesn't go away. I'd say drop some nsw teams and I'd agree. Certainly the Macarthur team could just go straight to Canberra and rebrand. Remember Perth has 3 million people but it doesn't mean full stadiums. What are they getting now? 8k max. Then Brisbane is about the same size as Perth plus Gold Coast region... yet they're near the bottom. FA is just not putting in the effort into the big market teams and it will hurt the league and definitely viewership and sponsorship. But they're so Sydney centric they just don't get it. In principle I agree with Canberra for soccer, but not convinced for AFL.
The original Frank Lowe plan was the best! Let each league have their own team! One city one team! Australia is not big enough to have 18 team divisions with promotion relegation! Owners kill teams!
Western United was the stupidest idea ever. Firstly, the West of Melbourne is not some "united" area. There's the true established West with a long history of an entrenched community (Footscray, Sunshine, Braybrook, St Albans, Yarraville, etc) then there's the fake, soulless, imported West of Tarneit, Wyndham and Werribee, ironically divided by a big land of nothing and in the bloody sticks. Neither of these have anything in common and to think they do or ever will is ridiculous and secondly the colours have no connection to the West whatsoever.
Also, they ignored the demographics of those outer suburbs, which is comprised of lots of people from the sub-continent and they are more into cricket than soccer.
I live in the western suburbs of Melbourne, Maidstone specifically, and to go watch Western United play a home game at Tarneit is a much bigger hassle than traveling to see Melbourne Victory or Melbourne City. It’s nowhere near where I live, doesn’t feel like a local team at all.
approx 350k juniors play AFL compared to 750K juniors play soccer in Australia yet the AFL gets 50x the funding Soccer does. Its tough managing junior teams at public clubs, you dont get the support you would in AFL. its a shame because the demand is there to play. Australian Government need to inject a heap of $ into Football Australia and improve the academy's. We would be much more competitive on the world stage and if we ever get that success, the stadiums will fill, wont happen overnight though. good content bro
If you can't keep our best players in the A-league... who's gonna watch? Why should the Australian government be spending money in developing players that'll only end up playing for overseas clubs?... At least the AFL is home grown and expanding so makes sense that the government would invest.
@@yff9978that’s not scaleable. The national team can only ever be one team playing a limited number of games each year and an even more limited number of home games. That’s not an investment. A domestic league has the capacity to grow, play more games in more places more often and create economic growth in its path. The national team can’t do that because there is no growth potential. Even if we were the best national team in the world - which we never will be - even then there is a cap on what turnover that team could produce because being the best doesn’t mean more world cups more often with more games. The difference between the fixture schedule for world #1 and world #20 is 3-4 extra games.
I think A league teams need to be more engaged in their local communities like NRL and AFL clubs are. These teams need proper clubhouses for a start. Penriths set up made them more money than the football team did for a long time, and probably still does. Proper community engagement and support will then provide the financial indepence these clubs need to grow and not worry about TV revenue so much. Heck, it might even start allowing proper investment in youth football and the dividends that provideds down the track.
Great video thank you. Looking forward to some more expansion, hopefully Canberra gets off the ground. Can’t help but think Adelaide, Perth and Brisbane need rivalries. I’m hoping for a Gold Coast team soon.
Maybe it's the fact there's no pro/rel and that teams in the right areas will naturally gather larger crowds, earning more money to improve the quality of the play and therefore the best placed teams naturally filter out to the top
Aleague football is also horrible!!! I’ve watch NPL games that were more entertaining and more talented players! The new tier system won’t have promotion or relegation because the ALeague are scared of losing there babies ! It’s all about money as you know!
Go Macarthur Bulls. They are not quite yet, but they will become a legend club, and with success their support will grow. The next expansion clubs will go to Canberra and Wollongong, and then others. It is good they gave a 3rd team to Sydney and Melbourne now, as both cities need at least 3 teams.
That the A-League has managed to survive the various no-hopers that have been stealing both oxygen and their wages while bumbling at the top is nothing short of a miracle.
i don't think that is a problem. it more relates to someone so established in Sydney and NSW and clearly not listening to anything outside Melb and Sydney. That's the issue.
Overall a good video. It would be interesting to see if WU and Mac current finances. I still tHink they are generations or 50 years away from drawing decent crowds. Overall the crowds are down for the A League as a result of expanding way too early. Existing clubs are not strong enough even victory Sydney fc drawing poor crowds outside of derby games. News corp destroyed the A League as well. If I was running the show I would never go back to them.
People forget that Canberra has folded twice in the past and probably isn’t viable. I would like to see regional teams built. Coffs for example has facilities already to hold 8-10k people (perfect size for where the a league is atm). No other major sport near by and could be built up on locals with an eventual derby vs Newcastle. Trying to tap into areas of strong afl/nrl doesn’t make sense to me….imagine the a league having a strong hold in north coast NSW, NSW hinterland, tweed, Vic border (wadonga) - all regional areas, with airports, with a wealth of young soccer participants, with no other national team to support in any other code. Grow from the outer areas and slowly come back to the cities….
5 teams in NSW is way too much. 3 is really the most it should have. Its not NSWFA. It needs 3 in NSW, 2 in Vic, Brisb, Adel, Perth, Wellington Auckland. 10 should be it. Its really a NSW centric viewpoint. How about what's happening in the rest of Australia.
Perth and Brisbane at the bottom. The two teams that actually need to be strong. Both clubs service a population of almost 6 million people. Go beyond Brisbane in Qld and the numbers are significantly more. Allowing those teams to bottom out while they giving a few cities extra teams that no one barracks for is a disgrace.
Should have been geelong. Western united bid was a geelong bid originally I think it changed to another Melbourne one due to free land being offered by Wyndham
Western United was placed out in the sticks around a heavily Indian populated area . Move it 15 kms east towards the real western suburbs and it would have been a power house with the best fans ! Better to have a cricket pitch where they are at now
Why is everyone saying Wollongong? Firstly, they wouldn’t call the team “Wollongong” - they would avoid using any geographic place name. Secondly, the region can barely support the NRL team and the NBL team has nearly folded many times, going into administration.
Some of those market places in Qld, will never be successful for soccer. The two rugby codes dominate and in Gold Coast and Brisbane AFL are also in the mix. It should have been kept at 10 teams.
Meanwhile Macarthur has just announced a $40M dollar debt. What a joke. Western United have strong potential imo, especially with the new boutique stadium and an expanding area, but Macarthur will likely fold or relocate. Bring on Canberra and Wollongong Wolves
the a League should of never added a 3rd team in Melbourne Melbourne victory is mostly the west and north and Melbourne city is south east Melbourne city should of never got rid of there Identity when it was called Melbourne heart they should of left the name and the clubs Identity alone with out changing it in Sydney alone you have to many teams coming out of there alone with Sydney fc jets central coast and western Sydney adding more wont work
Pro/rel will never work in Australia. The game is 4th or 5th rate in Australia and crowds are a joke in the A-League as well as the NPL leagues. The sheer geographical size of Australia and the small population and limited appeal the game has, pro/rel would absolutely destroy clubs. Second tier clubs won't be able to afford the flights to & from the various capital cities plus who's going to fund it and who's going to watch it? A-League's crowds & ratings are abysmal as it is. Everyone rabbits on about rugby union being on its deathbed but the ratings and crowds for football outside of the national teams are even worse than union.
@@BDub2024 Yep. I get fed up of hearing people waffle on about pro/rel in this country. The only sport in Australia where that would've worked was Aussie Rules until the mid 80's when the then VFL went full potato adding franchises like West Coast, Brisbane Bears & Adelaide.
@@peterkehoe481 AFL was more tribal so there was a bit more opportunity for promotion relegation. But for A League disaster. Can you imagine having Glory and Roar demoted for next season. So no A league soccer in Perth or Brisbane. So all the members quit, sponsors drop off and crowds stay away. Basically none of them return. So when Glory went up to first division again they're playing in an empty stadium in a city of 3 million basically. Brisbane is a similar size to Perth, but then you have the Gold Coast region. So they have no top line football for an entire season!!!
@BDub2024 I was thinking about instead of the other NSW and Vic teams, Macarthur FC and Western United. But soccer is ridiculous pal. It was invented for 5 year olds and people who are grown men are obsessed with it because they want to be like David Beckham. I suppose you think that London, Liverpool and Manchester have too many teams too. Just face the fact that Gallop is an ass.
Since the Lowey days Football in this country has gone downhill. Too much recruitment of executives from other codes with no vision of what Football can achieve. These executives/CEO have the mindset we need the to be associated with other codes i.e. playing on chopped up rugby fields. It is criminal where the game is after the success of the last three World Cups, where did all the money go? 1. Sack the whole of Football Australia and bring in people who are passionate about Football with no association with any other codes in Australia. 2. Upgrade the facilities at large local clubs with the intention to play games at these grounds. We do not have the supporters to fill 30,000+ stadiums. This will improve the atmosphere at games and make the games more marketable. 3. Money saved by clubs not having to pay leases at large stadiums should bring in BIG marquee signs, names that will put bums on seats. 4. Promote young talent, find the next Kewell and Cahil. At this point in time there is no standout Australian talent the public knows. The lack of an Aussie superstar is hurting the game. 5. Spend money on coach who can get the best from the National Team. We need the Socceroo's to be performing and capturing the imagination of the Australian public. We need to stop complaining about the lack of government funding and make the game self-sufficient. We need the public to associate soccer with excitement. I was lucky enough to attend the Spurs v Everton game this year. The facilities at Tottenham Stadium were superb, the atmosphere was electric. Every fan leapt from their seats as each goal was scored, the fans (opposition/home) burst into song throughout the game. It was amazing to hear 50,000+ fans singing the same song. Behind me young kids talking about the players and what the was going wrong. I took my daughter who hates football, and she loved it, she wants to go back. We need to create the same atmosphere in the A-League. It will take time but repeating the same mistakes and expecting a different outcome is insane. A fresh untainted approach is required.
I've been in Campbelltown for a little while and never met anyone follows the bulls. It's a working class town that prefers rugby. I think they were expecting the imported people to care about the franchise
Utterly ridiculous. Rumour is Foxtel forced more Sydney and Melb teams, but the League chose these dumb additions. Why wouldn't you admit South Melb already with a large fan base and would bring lots of general interest.
The original owners of Melbourne Victory, they own a bunch of public gyms as well as BA a sports uniform manufacturer, they wanted to have another go at A-League ownership but they came in too late, I have no idea where in Melbourne they would've put the team.
I think the real strength of the Auckland bid is the failure of the kingz and knights, partially due to where their stadium is based. Anyway COYN FUCK JAFAS
The Western United bid burned a lot of people, a Geelong based team was the hope for many before it fell away/merged with the Western United one. A majority of those based in Geelong and surrounding region did not change allegiances from their City/Heart or Victory roots as Western "United" is not a home town team. I know the moment I heard the Western bid was favoured I lost all interest in following them. I wasn't too aware of the Team 11 bid and now having lived in the area on and off growing and now living only a couple minutes from where the proposed stadium was to be built the Western bid looks increasingly bad. The SE suburbs and Dandenong in particular is a heartland for football with numerous NPL clubs in various divisions in the area and the stadium being next to PT and a major roads (Princess Highway & East Link) should have made it a slam dunk no brainer. Unfortunately the A-League and the game itself has not taken advantage of the 2006 World Cup qualification or the Asia Cup success and has been completely mismanaged.
Soccer is dying in Australia due to absolute mismanagement by the FFA , but you can’t knock what both clubs have done sporting wise Western United won the league in 2022 and Macarther have won two Australian Cups. That’s better than the so called big boys in Perth Glory , Adelaide Utd and Brisbane Roar in the last 5 years to name but three. Both teams do just fine. Newcastle and Perth only just have higher average attendances too. Remember Western UTD haven’t had a home since they were born. They have played all around the state. Once they have an identity it will be better.
@@Lupi33zand have excited owners who spend up big, but often aren’t there in 5 years time. Clive Palmer an obvious chap. Blazed cash, got results, bad mouthed the local community, played Mickey Mouse with crowd caps and got bored and left. WU and MacArthur came in without solid stadium plans, and in WU’s case a load of BS. A place with a bit of identity and football history helps.
MacArthur are a joke how we lost an Australia cup to them at home I’ll never know, also on their most recent visit to AAMI park they had no fans at the ground which was hilarious
How Wollongong missed out is criminal.
Wollongong got shafted so many times it's ridiculous. First the federation didnt let them host the 2002 grand final at home in Wollongong, they then won it anyway but went from back-to-back champions with a squad of top talents and owning their own Stadium, to being broke in the 2nd tier after being shafted out of their stadium and then from the A-league a bunch of times.
Illawarra can have their own A-League team and NRL team like the NBL team. They can afford to fund both A-League and NRL teams. They should hand St George back to Kogarah and stand alone again. Always been a good area for Soccer with the Wolves. A Canberra team as well rather than having 3 Sydney and Melbourne teams.
The Wolves 🐺
100% from the start, it should have been Wollongong Wolves - not CCM. Seems so obvious when I say it out aloud, but here we are 20 years later. Still no team from Wollongong in the A-League...
@Gregemio i See No reason wolves and Mariners shouldnt have been in together.
As a Kiwi, I hope Auckland continues to see huge success in interest.
Seems the A-League often forgets you need 2 things to make a new club successful, strong/stable financiers AND a strong base of support among a local population.
Auckland, with its 1.7 million people, seems like the perfect bid.
i'd like auckland and Wellington to do well and give something to the competition. Crazy that the A League has 3 teams in Melb and 5 teams in NSW. Disaster. Should have been kept at 10 teams or 11 including Auck. Are any Auckland teams called the Auckland Orcas. Seem obvious to me. Just a thought. I expect its a common nickname.
Probably a stronger market than Wellington. Though Phoenix have done very, very well for a club that hasn't won anything since they were formed. In the coming years, that should make for a good local derby.
@@BDub2024 QLD has more people playing football than Victoria but only has 1 team in comparison to Victoria's 3 teams
As long as they both play 'home games' all over the country. Dunners chc nelson napier tauranga and new Plymouth and maybe the tron should get at least a game per season. Maybe not for the Darby thou
@@thepolishnz Wellington and Auckland should only play in their cites. They are not teams for New Zealand.
As a Macarthur resident, i was astonished they won the bid. I knew then it would be an unmitigated disater. The fact they havent folded yet is bewildering.
the tickets are a rip off otherwise i'd go to the games
i think it won the tender because of all the new housing
It's mainly because Campbelltown council charges Macarthur peppercorn rent to play games at Leumeah
I think availability of an already built stadium was a big factor in a lot of the decisions.
Yeah i live in campbelltown and i was so shocked that we won the bid and nowhere we are as a pretty alright team
Western United actually have some potential imo. 4k average attendance isn't a lot but, in a 5k capacity privately owned ground that's gonna start adding up financially for the club. They just need to play the long game and hope that they grow with the suburb.
The fact that western finally stopped being a gypsy side and settled on Tarneit, just shows they need to accept their situation and tap in to the new community there. They’re betting on 25-30 years in the future they they’re are embedded in the region.
They finally have an identity but they’re a joke of a club on all fronts
bro indians dont play soccer and its full of indians
@@That1Nixfan it's council owned they don't own the "training ground" that's why rebels were mooted to play there
3 teams in Melbourne is ridiculous. Even worse is 5 teams in NSW. Meanwhile you have Brisbane and Perth capturing 6 million people on the bottom of the ladder. No teams have no profile at all currently. Should have kept it at 10 teams.
I’ve said for years Wollongong & Canberra should have come in.
just you huh
Canberra has been tried multiple times in the old NSL and couldn't get crowds above 1500 and folded quickly. What makes it different this time around ?
maybe canberra. but too many teams in the comp. should be 10 max.
No, no Canberra. Canberra United is having a hard time staying afloat, let alone the other national teams (Capitals, Cavalry) looking for handouts from a cash strapped ACT government. Only the Giants and Raiders have a large enough fanbase to sustain an ongoing presence. The sooner the Canberra bid is squashed the better. (I had family involved with the Cannons debacle, I don't want to see that happen again.)
@@widyasantoso4910 I actually think Canberra has the population but doesn't need a team. Really in A league it should be only one or two teams per major city. Regional areas aren't big enough.
Western United's name is ridiculous ... containing no reference to their actual location. Adelaide and Perth are more "west" than they are. They should be referencing "Melbourne" in their name somehow ... that would at least give them an identity. Every other team in the league references their location in their name.
Agree.
Wyndham United perhaps?
I couldn’t agree more. It’s the same thing with the Western Bulldogs in the AFL. Victoria are the America of Australia, they forget that other areas in this country exist!
The Melbourne Olives. 'cause green and black lol
typical plastic McFranchise name
@@brentonjc every other team ay? The central coast?? Central Coast of Melbourne of course
Gallop is an example of failing from job to job
He has worked out the formula on how a CEO can continually fail and get a huge pay out.
It's called failing upwards.
He reminds me of Elon Musk. Somehow manages to succeed without any actual skills or brains.
As a Melbourne Storm fan, I could add another voice to that choir...
He’s from the biggest failure of a professional sport possible; Rugby league. Why and how was he trusted with football?
almost denying wellington another 10 years then to announce a 3rd team in melbourne and sydney 1 year later is crazy
Fantastic video, thank you for the research and time taken to make this, I really appreciate it
Southern expansion was a joke, and only had any momentum because of the civil war between Football Illawarra and the Wolves. No one in the Illawarra wanted any team apart from the Wolves.
5 teams in NSW is way too much. how does central coast or newcastle even exist. its a joke. 2 in sydney is sufficient and maybe a large regional area at most. anything more is ridiculous.
Wollongong would have been such a good addition
Already has a stadium fans and its own geographical location
not enough people. Should be 3 teams max in NSW. 2 in Syd. How does Newcastle get a team? How about put teams in significant population bases for starters, otherwise it becomes an amateur league.
@ theres 2 teams on the central coast.. make that make sense!
@@drewbadenochPT I always assumed that Central coast was many hundred of kms away with a big population base. Never been to NSW. Then I see Newcastle and Sydney are nearby. How can there be 5 teams in that area. If someone suggested a team in Mandurah and Bunbury then you'd have people saying how ridiculous it was. Obviously less population. But its the same amount of rubbish.
@@BDub2024 Newcastle have a big history in Football! ⚽
Long before NRL Bargeball (Knits/Headlice) was established!
Would have added them ahead of WUN, Macarthur, or goddamn North Queensland, personally.
Once western united build their stadium, i can see an average 7-9k crowds in the future honestly
When will that be ?
@@wackywacky2497 seriously probably 10 years if im being realistic, the stadium has had no signs of progress at all but you never know
@@afldomain if they started today it would be ready for the 27/28 season, would only take a couple of years to build. Similar timeline to sfs mrs and Parramatta, once they were flattened.
Covid stuffed up western uniteds stadium plans threw it back a few years they will get there should have had it if it wasn't for covid
Having to play a chunk of home fixtures at AAMI Park can not have been helpful. I understand the logistics (can't hold every home game at Whitten Oval or Kardinia), but if you want residents of Western Melbourne to get behind a local team, it's a pretty big ask to tell them "most of your home games are going to be in Richmond. You'll have to drive across the Westgate and through city traffic in order to watch them play, and then go through all of that again in pitch black on the way home".
If they can build a proper 10-15K stadium, and get decent results, crowd numbers shouldn't be too much of a problem, ESPECIALLY if playing Victory.
Wollongong not getting a team feels ridiculous to me, they only have half an NRL team and a middling NBL team, while someone in Southeast Sydney or West Melbourne can get to a BBL match, or NRL or AFL depending on the city much easier. Canberra deserve a look without a full time BBL team, and Ipswich or Fremantle have enough local identity to survive
Putting a team in a Market smaller than the Central Coast that has Established Competition is Nuts, if people have to choose between Soccer and Basketball in the Summer most will choose Basketball because Basketball is played inside with Aircon
there is no team called fremantle though. i assume they'd be trying to get a few clubs south of fremantle to combine. stick it to 10 teams including the 2. NZ teams.
I kind of get why they weren't added to the league during its 2005 formation (had to cover the major cities in Australia, plus they probably wanted a couple of former NSL clubs that soccer fans would recognize), but once FFA started drifting into proper expansion in the late 2000's, Wollongong should have been a top priority. Imagine if they fielded a team in the 2009-10 season ahead of NQF........would probably be financially stable to this day.
Canberra is a must - went to uni there and ANU had 17 mens teams. Soccer is the game there and the city itself is growing rapidly.
Just pay the entry fee and they will be admitted.
@Chris-acneboy I've been a longtime fan of Wollongong, but to me, if there was one other place that I could argue might deserve it more, it would be Canberra. It makes no sense that there can be 5 teams in the Sydney to Newcastle area and nothing south. Just look at how Canberra love their rugby union and rugby league teams...
@@_Dei_ The issue is - and I really don't know how it can be done to make it happen - that it's a corporate league, and not a pyramid/tier system like in the UK and Europe. 5 clubs in the one town or city isn't so much an issue, rather, the other, smaller teams aren't given a chance to grow and develop.
The other issue is, as somewhat addressed in this video - identity. A club has to come from the area that you live - like what you mentioned. But it has to resonate with the culture of that area and the people from within it. Just plonking clubs here, there and everywhere creates the same kinds of issues that the Chinese and Saudi leagues face. A dead, bloated shell of a league with nobody interested in following it - although those might be slightly extreme examples. But people have to resonate with that club and want to be a part of it. Another thing I have noticed, especially here, is the teams are so far apart that traveling "away" just seems ridiculous and almost a holiday in itself. And that leads me to think that a tiered system might help with smaller clubs developing in the cities and states that then can work up to the Premier/A-League. I don't know if something like what the American's do with their Football system might work too. Say each State has it's own smaller or minor league that compete and the top two or three teams get promoted to the A-League or something like that. Or have Play-offs. You get the idea...
I've been to a few Glory games now - new to the club. It's... It's ok. Shit level of football, but I am ok with that. The fan base at the season holders end is fantastic - only a few hundred, but very vocal and lively from what I've seen. The rest of the stadium is a bit dead and flat. I do not like the promotion of corporatism and merchandise, however. I want to go to support my local team and to be entertained, not preached to. But that's another matter in and of itself.
@@apropercuppa8612 Agree with all you've said, and that's what hurts the most being a Wollongong fan. We have a team, a team with history and that is much loved. Even in the NSL days, it felt like they hated us and wanted us gone. That move of the 2nd grand-final win to Sydney... Wollongong vs South Melbourne (I think) was criminal. No one in Sydney wanted to watch it. We could have sold out Wollongong Showground a few times over. Instead, it was played to a near empty stadium. I don't even watch the A-League. I'm clearly not the target audience...
full of public servants in canberra. they don't like getting hurt, so football (soccer) should be popular.
the absolute carnage that is this story. the incompetence of the various people in charge has been beyond comprehension.
Great video and summary of the expansion. Fingers crossed for Western.
🤞
Great vid Brad, wondering if our convo about Western before the game with Cody helped with the vid. Our support is fortunately growing stronger (slowly) and it's mostly thanks to the love that the club has for us fans. Looking forward to the next vid!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Canberra needs a men's side, so does Wollongong.
you need less teams not more. 5 in nsw is way too much. Drop 3 clubs from nsw first.
I felt that western utd and MacArthur kinda diluted the Sydney and Melbourne rivalry in a pretty bad way….
There used to be a time where it’s was hard to get tickets to these derby games but now more often than not ever since the inception of these third wheels team, you can often get tickets to these derby games the same day…
Not like afl in melbs or NRL in Sydney where they have 10+ teams in the same city…. And still have fine rivalries (albeit some are shit)…
That why I feel the afl shouldn’t have a third team in WA or SA as more likely its will heavily dilute showdown or western derby quite significantly…. It’s probs the same for the third teams in syd and Melbs in a league
As sad as the lack of support for Macarthur is, the area deserves a rep. Cahill and Brett Emerton, among other soccerooos, grew up round there and it has a huge local junior scene. Just needs to sort out their promotion at youth level. I still think Tassie could be great. They are always forgotten in most national league so surely the locals would get around the football team
When Wollongong Wolves got dropped from the league i stopped supporting the league. Everyone just stayed home and watched overseas football. My father took me as a kid to watch every home game at Brandon Park and as Howlers club member it was the only thing i was looking forward to. Our dreams got taken away. Club was out of the league and on top of that it moved away. Memories is what we have.
I dont think it got dropped. It never got invited.
Great video. The way that Geoff Gallop (who was the worst choice to run football) intended to have both a new Sydney and Melbourne in the league when the allowed a bidding war was allowed broke hearts of football fans outside of the so-called "Metropolitan Bubble".
Fun fact: the former owners of Melbourne Victory, Harry Stamoulis and Robert Belteky were the architects behind the Tasmania A-League bid.
*David Gallop
Geoff Gallop is the former WA Premier from back in the early-‘00s, lol
@@ArachKing lol I just got that.
Don't blame me... I am Tasmanian lol
Great video. i enjoyed this. You highlighted a lot and went into great detail. You got a sub!
Thanks for the sub!
Great video mate!!
I remember reading Foxtel paid the FFA $5m, (you read correctly), to have a seat at the table regarding expansion.
$5m buys you more than just a seat, they got to pick the two new teams and they wanted them in big population centres.
Foxtel own the Melb Storm its exactly the same way they setup that franchise.
So a bunch of suits in the boardroom of a cable TV company, were able to locate the two expansion clubs over anyone with knowledge of Australia's football demographics?
The state of football in this country makes so much sense now.
@@juz882010 They don't own the storm anymore, they sold them almost a decade ago.
Doing the opposite of what Gallop thought has always in the best interest of the A-League. Thank goodness we were not nixed!
They are neither clubs nor teams; they are soulless franchises owned by equally soulless property developers. Having said that, WU have built an actual football stadium with an actual football pitch that plays like a billiard table.
And that's my 2 cents worth.
@@waggafletcher because aami parks turf is shit? Constantly voted one of the best in the world. They didn't build a stadium, they built a single tiered npl style Bay on council owned land.
I'm not that privvy to Macarthur, but I rate WUN's fanbase. Small but loyal. Nice to see that their local fans can now go to a game, without having to fang it across the Westgate Bridge.
Western United has potential, Macarthur feels like a lost cause though.
Macarthur and Western United still draw bigger crowds than the old NSL clubs that tried to get in for the expansion.
have you been to games? south are very close to WU numbers and thats without daddy property owners and the aliga funds tap
@@74_pelicans I dont know if you know but having rich people invest money into the game is a positive not a negative.
@@AugustThrone Typically that’s only if they’re ⚽️-loving rich people, which Clive Palmer wasn’t and thus why he ditched GCU the moment he grew bored of it all.
@@AugustThrone where did I say I didn't? Wu have bigger crowds because they can afford to give away thousands of memberships and millions of tickets. I emailed wufc for a free ticket to see if I liked it and they just sent it across..
Thanks for explaining all this. I send best wishes to all footie fans "down under" - i luv the Australian Cup
Really enjoyed this video, good job! 👍🏾⚽
Thanks for watching
Excellent video
Good video. Firstly, David galloped is a flog that almost destroyed the aleague. The atmosphere of active support drew crowds and that flog killed it. We are still recovering from that. Secondly, not sure why people wanna see western united and MacArthur fail. I don’t want to see anymore clubs fail, I want to see more teams added to have a longer comp. Not sure how MacArthur have failed to capitalise on a booming region, perhaps because most people were already either wsw or sfc fans. I would like to see Wollongong wolves and a Canberra team added next.
Yeah, as much as Macarthur and Western United were not the right options, them failing would be a disaster for the A-League.
As you've said Macarthur is the fastest growing region in Sydney & we've already won 2 Australia Cups just give it a bit more time :)
They need to expand to a 16 team comp & add Canberra, Gold Coast & either a Tasmania team or Townsville!
They're already in their 5th season and their crowds have stagnated not grown. If being too new was a problem then we'd see consistent growth in crowds year on year as they better establish themselves but this is not the case. West Sydney and Sydney FC were already well supported by people in South West Sydney so they've been doomed from the beginning imo.
MacArthur needs a Women's side.
Success will not make the club work. Win everything. Win every time. No one will ever care, that's not how you build a sustainable club in this country.
If anything - winning everything will only bring the demise of the club sooner. If they can barley make money now, how will having games in Asia every year help?
How long will the investors be willing to throw more money into the giant pile of burning money?... Let me guess, you think they will - forever - because they are so passionate about McArthur having a club. Because this region just deeply deserves its place in the A-league. If so, you are dreaming. The club simply has no appeal and will never have a real fan base.
@@Gregemioagree. Get rid of the club and have a club in Wollongong.
If they're both paying their way, there isn't a problem. More teams can be added in due course. Running a hate campaign isn't gonna help either of them.
2014-2019 A-League seasons are unmatched too any other seasons so far. Hopefully crowds become the same again.
I don't agree with most rebrandings of clubs but one i agree with is Melbourne Heart to Melbourne City idk who thought Melbourne Heart was a good name.
Wanderers is another ridiculous one with Mariners.
Firstly the tickets need to come down in price. When Glory started in Perth in the nineties it was ten dollars. It got good crowds and a fantastic atmosphere. The A League may need to take a few steps back before going forward. A twenty dollar adult entry would do wonders. Obviously it costs but you might make up part of the difference through food and beverage and merchandise sales. Otherwise the League will need to absorb the costs. Then we can return to expansion. Second teams in Perth, Adelaide and Brisbane plus Hobart, Canberra and Wollongong should be achievable in a twenty year plan. And by 2050 we should have the making of a second division.
A second division would be disaster.
Canterbury surely have to be a serious contender. Christchurch is the 2nd largest city in NZ and they’d be the sole representative for the South Island , 1.3million people. And a brand new world class stadium is currently being built. They’re the only highly populated region left without a side.
It's not about the crowds, more teams - more spots for young aussies. In the entire league there's about 5 aussie strikers regularly playing and then people wonder why we can't produce strikers for the national team? It should be 3x that much. We finally have a season that is long enough that it lines up with europe so I expect the quality of the league to improve over the next 5 years.
Socceroos doing well will bring more viewers to the a-league - we already know this.
someone has to pay their wages... its all about crowds. Even if its semi pro someone has to pay for flights and accommodation.
The problem is the A league can attract much much better imports than the A league lifer level players that come through, and strikers make such a huge difference. Also any young striker who is any good scores 8 goals in a season then jumps to Europe despite having proven nothing of being a top level A league player.
In summary, the aussie strikers who can't do better than the A League are not good, and any young striker who is A league level (able to score more than 5 a season regularly) is off overseas before they're ready.
Next one to leave is Waddingham who despite being a great player for his age is still not an above average A League line leading number 9, but he'll go to Europe and probably stagnate at age 20. He'll probably leave with a goal every 3 games. He should really stay 2 more years and improve to the point he's scoring 1 in 2. But it doesn't happen like that. We likely see him go, not improve, and come back the same level of player at age 26
Should have been Canberra and Tasmania.
Why expand the competition with teams already in cities with multiple Football Clubs????
This ain't the 1890s where suburban rivalry can sustain a competition within a few select cities.
too many teams in regional nsw too.
@@BDub2024but which team would you remove from nsw and be realistic
@@samthornton5911 I've never been to NSW. I reckon its ridiculous that you have 3 in Sydney and then Central coast and Newcastle. Central coast never should have got a team. But until teams move you can't keep adding more teams. Its like me deciding a few cities in Qld need teams, and then Bunbury in south west... Its the same biased mindset.
Imagine being from Perth and wanting to get into the a league, you see western united, nice kit, newly established and quickly winning silverware, you jump on board, follow all the club socials and players, purchase a kit only to find that tickets to their home games are played in AAMI park on the other side of the continent.
Now imagine being from west of Melbourne and jumping onto either the M. Victory or M. City bandwagon, buy a member ship, attend games, only to one day drive past a newly developed stadium down the road from you dedicated to Western United.
i guess you're mocking the name eh. there is no need for 3 clubs from Melb or Syd.
Great Video. Would have liked some info re the FA and APL breaking apart and the impact of Covid but otherwise fantastic. Promotion / relegation would be the best thing for the A League, but protecting your own self interests (no competition to my franchise) seems to be the way of Soccer in this country. I think Macarthur can grow its fanbase - but they haven't started building their highly promoted $30m Training Facility yet either. Small stadiums are a must while the crowds are small, in my opinion. People go for the atmosphere and nothing worse than an empty stadium.
Went past W.U's home ground out Tarneit way last night. It will take a while to build up the support base, and stadium. Might take 50 years. Personally, I would have brought in South Melbourne as they have a stadium, club system all ready to go. W.U. is basically a club to get people to buy property out in the distant western suburbs. Once they sell I am sure the club will be jettisoned.
New markets are the key to growing a truly national competition. Gallop F'd up Rugby League, and then F'd up A-league. A Tassie team (in a state often starved of teams in national sport comps), Canberra, and second teams in Adelaide & WA would build new market derbies and rivalries. Wollongong has always deserved to stay in the comp.
We all forget the WM bid was originally a Geelong bid. Would have been a much better location for a franchise
@@mattturner2828 no it wasn't. Otherwise it would have been called Geelong. Plus Geelong don't have a stadium for football and aren't particularly interested in anything non cats. Plus tarneit is just up the road for em
I’ve just moved to south east Sydney from the UK, what are the barriers for an A-League club to be founded here or for like the Sutherland sharks to expand.
I don’t think the A-League will add anymore teams to Sydney. If Sydney gets another team, it’ll be via promotion, but there are no plans for that in the near future.
People need to learn to be patient, not every club needs to be an instant success from the getgo.
WU and Macarthur are a work inprogress. They are building their base and both clubs already achieved on field success. All they need is time.
you see these teams and then you see how Auckland FC are doing so far with crowds, if only Canberra got the team
There are already 5 teams in NSW though. I don't know how Newcastle get a team when they're only 2 hours from Sydney. Don't know what central coast is exactly, but if its near newcastle or sydney then how does that get a team. someone that's really sydney centric has done that. I wonder if they ever have travelled out of sydney.
@@BDub2024Canberra isn’t in NSW and Newcastle is a football heartland with a rich footballing history and a bigger population base than any non capital city in the country aside from the GC.
@@kirinjcallinan1 Canberra (ACT) is stuck in the middle of NSW. Five teams in NSW is ridiculous as is. If Mcarthur and Mariners can get dumped then it might free up a spot for Canberra. Certainly Canberra has the population to make it more viable. But its supposed to be a national competition and then they stick all the teams in cities in nsw.
@@BDub2024living in Canberra I can tell you majority of us have no interest in NSW teams despite football being the most popular sport here. With a population of 478k, the FA are clueless to sleep on that market. You could easily get a 100k fanbase if Canberra actually had a team to support
@@MIKEYYYYYx its about having teams spread out across Australia and not over a third in one State. ACT sits within NSW so the problem doesn't go away. I'd say drop some nsw teams and I'd agree. Certainly the Macarthur team could just go straight to Canberra and rebrand. Remember Perth has 3 million people but it doesn't mean full stadiums. What are they getting now? 8k max. Then Brisbane is about the same size as Perth plus Gold Coast region... yet they're near the bottom. FA is just not putting in the effort into the big market teams and it will hurt the league and definitely viewership and sponsorship. But they're so Sydney centric they just don't get it. In principle I agree with Canberra for soccer, but not convinced for AFL.
The original Frank Lowe plan was the best! Let each league have their own team! One city one team! Australia is not big enough to have 18 team divisions with promotion relegation! Owners kill teams!
Western United was the stupidest idea ever. Firstly, the West of Melbourne is not some "united" area. There's the true established West with a long history of an entrenched community (Footscray, Sunshine, Braybrook, St Albans, Yarraville, etc) then there's the fake, soulless, imported West of Tarneit, Wyndham and Werribee, ironically divided by a big land of nothing and in the bloody sticks. Neither of these have anything in common and to think they do or ever will is ridiculous and secondly the colours have no connection to the West whatsoever.
Also, they ignored the demographics of those outer suburbs, which is comprised of lots of people from the sub-continent and they are more into cricket than soccer.
@@aussieboy77 The population of Wyndham is expected to hit 450k by 2040. It will be bigger than the ACT or Tasmania entirely on its own.
I live in the western suburbs of Melbourne, Maidstone specifically, and to go watch Western United play a home game at Tarneit is a much bigger hassle than traveling to see Melbourne Victory or Melbourne City.
It’s nowhere near where I live, doesn’t feel like a local team at all.
@@ninjaskeleton6140 Isn't there a V/Line service that runs out to Tarneit?
@@aussieboy77 just a line on the map, with no meaningful news of rail extension
approx 350k juniors play AFL compared to 750K juniors play soccer in Australia yet the AFL gets 50x the funding Soccer does. Its tough managing junior teams at public clubs, you dont get the support you would in AFL. its a shame because the demand is there to play. Australian Government need to inject a heap of $ into Football Australia and improve the academy's. We would be much more competitive on the world stage and if we ever get that success, the stadiums will fill, wont happen overnight though. good content bro
If you can't keep our best players in the A-league... who's gonna watch?
Why should the Australian government be spending money in developing players that'll only end up playing for overseas clubs?...
At least the AFL is home grown and expanding so makes sense that the government would invest.
@@Shaun-o8g because of the potential money the international side could bring in
@@yff9978that’s not scaleable.
The national team can only ever be one team playing a limited number of games each year and an even more limited number of home games. That’s not an investment.
A domestic league has the capacity to grow, play more games in more places more often and create economic growth in its path. The national team can’t do that because there is no growth potential. Even if we were the best national team in the world - which we never will be - even then there is a cap on what turnover that team could produce because being the best doesn’t mean more world cups more often with more games.
The difference between the fixture schedule for world #1 and world #20 is 3-4 extra games.
@@yff9978 " because of the potential"...not worth the gamble. AFL is a guarantee long term investment for the future and is HOME GROWN.
@@yff9978 Leeds United went broke trying to invest money into soccer Australia (still not recovered)...do you want our government to do the same?...
I think A league teams need to be more engaged in their local communities like NRL and AFL clubs are. These teams need proper clubhouses for a start. Penriths set up made them more money than the football team did for a long time, and probably still does. Proper community engagement and support will then provide the financial indepence these clubs need to grow and not worry about TV revenue so much. Heck, it might even start allowing proper investment in youth football and the dividends that provideds down the track.
The only A-League sides that actually do this are the Mariners, Jets and Wanderers(though to a lesser extent than before, from what I know)
too many teams in NSW for starters. 5 is truly ridiculous.
Great video, love the channel.
Glad you enjoy it
Great video thank you. Looking forward to some more expansion, hopefully Canberra gets off the ground.
Can’t help but think Adelaide, Perth and Brisbane need rivalries. I’m hoping for a Gold Coast team soon.
Maybe it's the fact there's no pro/rel and that teams in the right areas will naturally gather larger crowds, earning more money to improve the quality of the play and therefore the best placed teams naturally filter out to the top
Aleague football is also horrible!!! I’ve watch NPL games that were more entertaining and more talented players! The new tier system won’t have promotion or relegation because the ALeague are scared of losing there babies ! It’s all about money as you know!
"Bogan flog" is the perfect description of the Macarthur "active support". They are embarrassing.
No commentary on why South Melbourne weren’t selected? The A league is dying a slow death because they turned their back on real football fans.
No because the video’s purpose was to detail why Western and Macarthur got in. Not why others missed out
That itself is its own video ngl
@@ALeagueCouchCriticsI'd watch that video
you didn't need a third team in melbourne. if they'd relocated west, would that have been good enough?
Real football fans 😂
Go Macarthur Bulls. They are not quite yet, but they will become a legend club, and with success their support will grow. The next expansion clubs will go to Canberra and Wollongong, and then others. It is good they gave a 3rd team to Sydney and Melbourne now, as both cities need at least 3 teams.
No one is travelling 1.5 hours from the other side of town to watch a game in Tarneit.
That the A-League has managed to survive the various no-hopers that have been stealing both oxygen and their wages while bumbling at the top is nothing short of a miracle.
The bulls will be fine, crowds are slowly going up and engagement has improved overall
Getting a non soccer person to lead the game??? You seriously asking how it went wrong? Fmd.
That being said, Stephen Lowy, Danny Townsend and James Johnson have all been ⚽️ people who haven’t fared much better than Gallop at all TBH.
i don't think that is a problem. it more relates to someone so established in Sydney and NSW and clearly not listening to anything outside Melb and Sydney. That's the issue.
Whats the background music?
Overall a good video. It would be interesting to see if WU and Mac current finances. I still tHink they are generations or 50 years away from drawing decent crowds. Overall the crowds are down for the A League as a result of expanding way too early. Existing clubs are not strong enough even victory Sydney fc drawing poor crowds outside of derby games. News corp destroyed the A League as well. If I was running the show I would never go back to them.
As soon as the powerbrockers behind Westfield's and foxtel disappeared, the league had no chance.
San marino last 6 games: 2W 1D 3L
Romas last 6 games 1W 1D 4L 😂😂😂😂😂
Need 20 plus teams and a relegation system. Football solved in Australia.👌😉
That 'Southern Expansion' bid: it's like they didn't see the Dragons+Steelers merger and half the fan base lose interest.
It's an absolute joke that MacArthur and Western Melb got a start ahead of Wollongong and Canberra. Absolutely ridiculous.
Third Melbourne side should have been SE Melbourne. One of the largest growth corridors and neglected by other codes.
People forget that Canberra has folded twice in the past and probably isn’t viable. I would like to see regional teams built. Coffs for example has facilities already to hold 8-10k people (perfect size for where the a league is atm). No other major sport near by and could be built up on locals with an eventual derby vs Newcastle. Trying to tap into areas of strong afl/nrl doesn’t make sense to me….imagine the a league having a strong hold in north coast NSW, NSW hinterland, tweed, Vic border (wadonga) - all regional areas, with airports, with a wealth of young soccer participants, with no other national team to support in any other code. Grow from the outer areas and slowly come back to the cities….
5 teams in NSW is way too much. 3 is really the most it should have. Its not NSWFA. It needs 3 in NSW, 2 in Vic, Brisb, Adel, Perth, Wellington Auckland. 10 should be it. Its really a NSW centric viewpoint. How about what's happening in the rest of Australia.
Perth and Brisbane at the bottom. The two teams that actually need to be strong. Both clubs service a population of almost 6 million people. Go beyond Brisbane in Qld and the numbers are significantly more. Allowing those teams to bottom out while they giving a few cities extra teams that no one barracks for is a disgrace.
Should have been geelong. Western united bid was a geelong bid originally I think it changed to another Melbourne one due to free land being offered by Wyndham
Western United was placed out in the sticks around a heavily Indian populated area . Move it 15 kms east towards the real western suburbs and it would have been a power house with the best fans ! Better to have a cricket pitch where they are at now
Imagine they get the Indian community on board? If they do that they could almost become the biggest club in the league
It’s an alright idea. But in Melbourne anyone that had any interest in the A League was already onboard with Melbourne Victory.
Why is everyone saying Wollongong?
Firstly, they wouldn’t call the team “Wollongong” - they would avoid using any geographic place name.
Secondly, the region can barely support the NRL team and the NBL team has nearly folded many times, going into administration.
If only we had a Time Machine!!
There is no team called Fremantle City locally. Unless it was a combination of a few first division teams.
Decent commentary but the background music is too loud and annoyingly not required
Thanks for the feedback
Some of those market places in Qld, will never be successful for soccer. The two rugby codes dominate and in Gold Coast and Brisbane AFL are also in the mix. It should have been kept at 10 teams.
Meanwhile Macarthur has just announced a $40M dollar debt. What a joke.
Western United have strong potential imo, especially with the new boutique stadium and an expanding area, but Macarthur will likely fold or relocate. Bring on Canberra and Wollongong Wolves
great vid, that's Jeff Hopkins though not Geoff lord
Yeah not sure what happened there 😅
the a League should of never added a 3rd team in Melbourne Melbourne victory is mostly the west and north and Melbourne city is south east Melbourne city should of never got rid of there Identity when it was called Melbourne heart they should of left the name and the clubs Identity alone with out changing it in Sydney alone you have to many teams coming out of there alone with Sydney fc jets central coast and western Sydney adding more wont work
8 teams in Vic and NSW is ridiculous. Should be 5 in both states max.
Without Promotion/Relegation the A league will continue to suffer.
Pro/rel will never work in Australia. The game is 4th or 5th rate in Australia and crowds are a joke in the A-League as well as the NPL leagues. The sheer geographical size of Australia and the small population and limited appeal the game has, pro/rel would absolutely destroy clubs. Second tier clubs won't be able to afford the flights to & from the various capital cities plus who's going to fund it and who's going to watch it? A-League's crowds & ratings are abysmal as it is. Everyone rabbits on about rugby union being on its deathbed but the ratings and crowds for football outside of the national teams are even worse than union.
@@peterkehoe481 Socceroos makes them alot of money its carrying the sport.
that would be a disaster.
@@BDub2024 Yep. I get fed up of hearing people waffle on about pro/rel in this country. The only sport in Australia where that would've worked was Aussie Rules until the mid 80's when the then VFL went full potato adding franchises like West Coast, Brisbane Bears & Adelaide.
@@peterkehoe481 AFL was more tribal so there was a bit more opportunity for promotion relegation. But for A League disaster. Can you imagine having Glory and Roar demoted for next season. So no A league soccer in Perth or Brisbane. So all the members quit, sponsors drop off and crowds stay away. Basically none of them return. So when Glory went up to first division again they're playing in an empty stadium in a city of 3 million basically. Brisbane is a similar size to Perth, but then you have the Gold Coast region. So they have no top line football for an entire season!!!
Should have been Wollongong and the Dandenong Thunder.
Ridiculous. No thre are already too many teams in NSW and Vic.
@BDub2024 I was thinking about instead of the other NSW and Vic teams, Macarthur FC and Western United.
But soccer is ridiculous pal. It was invented for 5 year olds and people who are grown men are obsessed with it because they want to be like David Beckham.
I suppose you think that London, Liverpool and Manchester have too many teams too.
Just face the fact that Gallop is an ass.
Since the Lowey days Football in this country has gone downhill. Too much recruitment of executives from other codes with no vision of what Football can achieve. These executives/CEO have the mindset we need the to be associated with other codes i.e. playing on chopped up rugby fields. It is criminal where the game is after the success of the last three World Cups, where did all the money go?
1. Sack the whole of Football Australia and bring in people who are passionate about Football with no association with any other codes in Australia.
2. Upgrade the facilities at large local clubs with the intention to play games at these grounds. We do not have the supporters to fill 30,000+ stadiums. This will improve the atmosphere at games and make the games more marketable.
3. Money saved by clubs not having to pay leases at large stadiums should bring in BIG marquee signs, names that will put bums on seats.
4. Promote young talent, find the next Kewell and Cahil. At this point in time there is no standout Australian talent the public knows. The lack of an Aussie superstar is hurting the game.
5. Spend money on coach who can get the best from the National Team. We need the Socceroo's to be performing and capturing the imagination of the Australian public.
We need to stop complaining about the lack of government funding and make the game self-sufficient. We need the public to associate soccer with excitement. I was lucky enough to attend the Spurs v Everton game this year. The facilities at Tottenham Stadium were superb, the atmosphere was electric. Every fan leapt from their seats as each goal was scored, the fans (opposition/home) burst into song throughout the game. It was amazing to hear 50,000+ fans singing the same song. Behind me young kids talking about the players and what the was going wrong. I took my daughter who hates football, and she loved it, she wants to go back.
We need to create the same atmosphere in the A-League. It will take time but repeating the same mistakes and expecting a different outcome is insane. A fresh untainted approach is required.
Yet Macarthur have won the Australian Cup twice and are very competitive in the league
There's no way it could be worse than PNG in the NRL.
Can’t wait for Promotion Relegation
I've been in Campbelltown for a little while and never met anyone follows the bulls. It's a working class town that prefers rugby. I think they were expecting the imported people to care about the franchise
Why would the A League hire the superleague lawyer responsible for the stagnation of the sport of Rugby League for nearly two decades.
Make a video on the success of the mariners
Utterly ridiculous. Rumour is Foxtel forced more Sydney and Melb teams, but the League chose these dumb additions. Why wouldn't you admit South Melb already with a large fan base and would bring lots of general interest.
wtf is belgravia leisure
The original owners of Melbourne Victory, they own a bunch of public gyms as well as BA a sports uniform manufacturer, they wanted to have another go at A-League ownership but they came in too late, I have no idea where in Melbourne they would've put the team.
They are both good teams but should have joined the A-league after more important areas like Auckland (finally in now), Canberra, Hobart, Qld 2 etc
I think the real strength of the Auckland bid is the failure of the kingz and knights, partially due to where their stadium is based. Anyway COYN FUCK JAFAS
David Gallop isn't fit to run a family bbq, let alone be the lead of a major sporting league
The Western United bid burned a lot of people, a Geelong based team was the hope for many before it fell away/merged with the Western United one. A majority of those based in Geelong and surrounding region did not change allegiances from their City/Heart or Victory roots as Western "United" is not a home town team. I know the moment I heard the Western bid was favoured I lost all interest in following them.
I wasn't too aware of the Team 11 bid and now having lived in the area on and off growing and now living only a couple minutes from where the proposed stadium was to be built the Western bid looks increasingly bad. The SE suburbs and Dandenong in particular is a heartland for football with numerous NPL clubs in various divisions in the area and the stadium being next to PT and a major roads (Princess Highway & East Link) should have made it a slam dunk no brainer.
Unfortunately the A-League and the game itself has not taken advantage of the 2006 World Cup qualification or the Asia Cup success and has been completely mismanaged.
Soccer is dying in Australia due to absolute mismanagement by the FFA , but you can’t knock what both clubs have done sporting wise Western United won the league in 2022 and Macarther have won two Australian Cups. That’s better than the so called big boys in Perth Glory , Adelaide Utd and Brisbane Roar in the last 5 years to name but three. Both teams do just fine. Newcastle and Perth only just have higher average attendances too. Remember Western UTD haven’t had a home since they were born. They have played all around the state. Once they have an identity it will be better.
its a salary cap league and new franchises are given all kinds of concessions to ensure on field success
@@Lupi33zand have excited owners who spend up big, but often aren’t there in 5 years time. Clive Palmer an obvious chap. Blazed cash, got results, bad mouthed the local community, played Mickey Mouse with crowd caps and got bored and left.
WU and MacArthur came in without solid stadium plans, and in WU’s case a load of BS.
A place with a bit of identity and football history helps.
to have the big population bases struggling is shocking for football and the promotion of it.
MacArthur are a joke how we lost an Australia cup to them at home I’ll never know, also on their most recent visit to AAMI park they had no fans at the ground which was hilarious
Wait since when A League teams have away fans from another state? It’s rarely happened. What’s your point?
The B-league couldn’t come any quicker, even with the reminder of this
It most certainly won’t be called that; too on-the-nose and just straight up silly in context