People are getting mad at me for saying Vegeta doesn't let his guard down. This is based on the FNF and Whis training statement about how he acts in a fight, not with him never underestimating a villain or something.. weird conflation. Also to clarify, I DO think Goku cares about protecting his friends before this. However I think this is more so teaching him to value things outside of his clique/own world. With the Senzu Bean scene after thinking / talking about it, I think it's probably based on a few things not just Piccolo. I think it's based on his morality arc with Piccolo Jr, giving energy to Frieza, and based on giving the Senzu bean to Cell so he could experience the fear and pain he wants to inflict on others. However I want to clarify that it's still not the same type of mistake he was making with Gohan, I wouldn't call it a mistake at all. His mistake with Cell is his misunderstanding of Gohan, which isn't present with Moro.
@@absolutelyfookinnobody2843 does that take away the pain physical mental abuse and trauma of being violently murdered by foreign soldiers and knowing you friends and loved ones will probably suffer the same fate
Hit the nail on the head, man. Goku’s merciful and forgiving nature is what sets him apart and has saved the universe in multiple ways multiple times. He was never looking at the bigger picture of it all and was acting purely in the moment, but all the same. This is Goku stepping into his own in a way, and I’ve always hated that people just overlooked that fact.
@@crowing3886 Idk if you meant to respond to me, but all the same, Goku didn’t know that the universes were going to be destroyed as a result of the ToP. Further still, the universes were going to be destroyed *despite* the ToP, and the tournament actually gave everyone a chance to survive, and they did.
Goku: "The strongest guys always seem to be villains..." No wonder he wants to create strong allies by teaching them to value the universe. Amazing conclusion, Seth.
If Jiren was good he had a hell of a slip given he was willing to murder Goku’s friends. But I guess the Pride Troopers understood it was stress and knew his values and backstories, despite him devaluing all of them to Goku. They understood that he was desperate and gave him a second chance because him allowing the Pride Troopers meant that he cared about justice, and Jiren accepted being completely humbled by the teamwork needed to defeat him. That is unfortunately the only way to reconcile how the anime portrays stuff. Jiren was given better motives and didn’t do stuff like sacrifice everything he had just for that wish that drastically.
@@bluntes i just think those kinds of stakes can make anybody crazy, especially when you're the only possible savior of your universe. Jiren is not an evil character imo
low key that point at the end with jiren being what goku thought he wanted and moro being the personification of every villain he had ever faced. Is leading me to suspect that granola might be representing something of goku's past, future or even just the species that he is due to the bardock references
@@leultrainstinct406 exactly, we got to see a glimpse of the terrible stuff via Vegeta's first appearance but now we really get to see all the horrible things that the sayains have done.
Also while we don't know if Granola is supposed to be the big bad of the next arc yet, it's interesting that Goku's going to potentially face a sympathetic villain/antagonist which I don't really think has been done before.
@@lock4097 facts I’m so excited. We’ve always seen the damage frieza and his army caused to the saiyans and others. They’ve been painted out as victims for so long, sometimes I forget they were ruthless killers too. now we get to see more of the damage they caused, and the consequences of those merciless actions.
20:19 I still remember reading someone's comment on another channel about this, which goes something like. "Goku really kneeled down (to Moro) and said: do you even lift bro?
I knew it's a joke but some people actaully think this way when the author's were literally referencing pervious moments. The community does not really view the series in another light besides oogabooga power.
Lmaoo But fr tho people gotta stop sleeping on db. It’s a master of hiding deep and meaningful theme in subtle ways, behind a giant wall of simplicity. If you analyze db and z enough, you can find similar elements I feel like if people took db as a whole(not gt and evolution) seriously, it would be more appreciated for it plot, characters, and themes. Not just the fights
I love the fact that people are angry that Goku in Ultra Instinct Omen is yelling for his transformation while he did the exact same thing when he received Ultra Instinct Omen for the second time against Kefla and no one minded it at all, they even thought it was cool due to the different voice
This arc was a perfect summary of the entire dragon ball series. It’s got all the villains put into one. All the lessons put into one it’s all pretty good in my opinion.
Honestly, I was cool with the first part of the arc. I loved the design of Moro along with the idea of magic vs. power. Then Vegeta getting PISSED that 'stupid god ki' and 'stupid magic' were keeping him down so he opted for another strategy. Also, PLEASE do a Vegeta video!
While I do really like this interpretation, especially that last part, I have one of my own that I like to think about as well. Moro and Goku are pretty much opposites and we mainly see this with their strength. Moro derives his strength from forcibly feeding on others, whereas Goku's strength comes from the motivation his friends give him and sharing their collective will. Essentially, they both gather their strength from others, but Moro does it destructively and Goku does it constructively. Well, Goku's "strength from friends" and Moro's "strength from stealing" both allow them to gain the powers of Merus and while they have tested each other in the past, this final confrontation solidifies why Goku is right. The final battle ensues and Moro's stealing gets the better of him, as he can't contain the angel abilities due to not having practice. Moro then proceeds to steal from everybody on Earth, but this practice has turned his mind to mush, whereas Goku has the perfect clarity and spiritual mastery to finish him off. He proceeds to deafeat him literally through the power of the friends he made along the way, and proves you shouldn't cheat on standardized tests. Study groups are better. Anyway, I just wanted to share that.
Yeah! Even at the end Moro is about to win because using the energy of the earth he stole, but Goku defeats him with the energy of the people of earth, who are sharing it willingly to help.
Also you could say that Goku becomes the "Hero trope" when he goes UI after Merus dies meaning that yes Moro and Goku are the opposite, Villain trope vs Hero trope
Seth you just opened my eyes to this fight in a whole new way. This is basically Goku being the most Goku he has ever been trying to give someone a second chance at life to be better than he was before and Rise Above his selfishness. Thank you for this beautiful insight into my favorite Dragon Ball character.
My personal theory that’s also kinda the reason he dropped out of MUI because he started to feel enraged towards Jiren, while here it is like Seth said like the weights
The anime's not that reliable in terms of how UI works. Goku literally gets mad in his fight with Jiren and the anime framed it like he powered up from it. If anything it should have made him weaker.
Today, I learned a lesson of my life as well, to give someone a chance even if its not that satisfying. You convinced me to acknowledge the depth of an arc that I hated so much while reading. Thank you, I'm definitely going reread this story and wait for the upcoming projects that Toyotaro is working on.
To add Meerus point of his sacrifice was to provoke a strong feeling in him. So instead he got angry like Super Saiyan, he contain his feelings which he needed to be in UI. That’s why as well.
Yup. And that was another moment of overlooked development goku had in this arc. He gained a new level of emotional mastery he never had before. If he saw a good friend die in front of his eyes, he would’ve raged. But now he was calm.
@@leultrainstinct406 so instead of doing the smart thing and doing what merus would’ve wanted him to do; he decided to try to redeem Moro and put his home and universe at risk? I’m pretty sure merus wanted goku to kill the villain.
@@trentmoore6947 goku isnt going to just change at the drop of a hat. He still has the need to try to change people's ways into good. Once moro was actually a serious threat (at least a big enough threat that whis told goku to finish it) goku was almost immediately ready to kill moro, it was just too late and moro became earth
I'm blown away by the character analysis! I'm kinda dumb so I picked up none of this when reading the manga, to me it was just more fighting and hair-dye. I love that an analysis like this could have even be made about this arc.
It didn't blow over your head, so don't feel like you're dumb. Art is subjective, and there are numerous analyses that can make themselves sound like they reached inevitable conclusions, especially when they get to talk in an echo chamber with no one presenting counterpoints. These kinds of talks are more sophistry than an objectively conclusive description.
I dont think Vegeta's "doubting his opponents" thing actually makes sense though. He never underestimated his enemies, but instead OVERESTIMATING himself. Edit: minor spelling error
@@txl1472 not really, because he wants his opponent to get powerups and such, just not expecting them to make a difference, especially if he's been dogging them the whole fight. If you wanna call out Vegeta, I'm on board, just call it like it is. Saying Vegeta underestimates his opponents isn't what it is, so just because the end result is the same, the functionality is different.
@@jadedsilverlining9427 bro you saying "he wants his opponents to get powerups and such, just not expecting them to make a difference" is literally underestimating his opponent. Trunks didn't underestimate cell and told vegeta not to be stupid but he let him transform cause of his ego
Agreed, vegeta overestimated his own power so much, despite letting his opponents power up, it was because he thought he was untouchable, so even with any amount of a power up, he is still the untouchable god that wrecks everyone, but knows exactly what their fighting power actually is
That’s dragon ball in a nutshell lmao. That’s what makes it special. There a whole bunch of simplicity on the surface. And the fights add even more distractions because they’re so simple. That’s why ppl say dB IS OnLY AbouT FiGHtinG. But under it all, there are a bunch of hidden gems and powerful themes.
@@leultrainstinct406 which so funny when I see so many vids of people analyzing other series and talking how deep and intricate they are but with DB they can never seem to see past the surface level stuff Which leads them to saying things like "DB is nothing but fighting, screaming, big laser beams and power levels when this is 100% false There's so much depth and subtleties in DB that fly straight over heads of not just the detractors of the series but also many people within the fanbase itself Which is kinda sad since DB is such a simple series
@@edwardmyers9492 pretty much bcuz many people just talk about Super when it’s hot and use that to gain more sub and view cough cough itsanimegirl cough cough.
@@HuyBui-uq4oj another thing I'm seeing is that a lot people tend to underestimate the writting in the series as well as ridicule people for appreciating it by saying that we're over analyzing it when in fact all we are doing is telling you happens because most of the fanbase clearly didn't get it They say some retarded shit like "because toriyama is a gag writer they think that everything he does in the story is a joke when nothing within the series implies this DB is clearly a series that he takes a lot more seriously than his other works such as Dr. Slump
@@edwardmyers9492 it’s like, yeah, we don’t get the same level of writing as One piece, but a simple story doesn’t equal bad. Having a bigass cast of characters is pointless if a big chunk ended up like tenten from Naruto. At least most of the fighters in db has their character arc.
My opinion of the entire arc honestly changed upon a reread of the TOP going into a full read of the Moro arc through to current. It all held together much better, but I think the spread out release as well as way too much hyperbole on both sides of the fandom as the arc played out negatively effected a lot of people's takes. My current favorite of Super just over the Black arc now 🐐
People don't like Goku's character in this arc but I think his speech with Moro is actually accurate to Goku's morality. Without headcanon or dub bias. Goku is purely reactionary and if he beats a bad guy, he gets over it until they try something else. Which is why Goku doesn't care about Freeza after he already beat him before in ROF. He considers you redeemed if he beats you. It probably wasn't handled right with the sensu bean but it isn't out of character for Goku to not care about a villain if they aren't a threat or weak. This is something even Geekdom gets wrong.
I guess Goku shouldn't have told Gohan to kill cell when cell wasn't a threat to Gohan after his body was messed up by gohan,Goku should've tried to give ultimatum but he didn't during the battle.Let's be honest this is regression due that scene and dialogue with him regretted his decision at the Cell games and i think he apologize again for doing it again at the end of the moro arc,Like if going to do stuff like this don't regret it.
@@supaseru242 lol it isn't regression at all. The difference with cell is that Goku and Gohan had ALREADY given Cell several chances at mercy. Gohan LITERALLY refused to fight Cell seriously for like the first half of their fight because he was convinced that he could change Cell. And like Seth pointed out, the situation with Moro isn't ANYTHING like what goku did to cell. Goku willingly gave cell a senzu bean out of the selfish desire to see gohan fight cell at full power. This isn't even similar AT ALL to goku sparing Moro out of mercy and the teachings of Merus.
@@jantheking7028 I can't remember Goku given Cell several chances at mercy,Though gohan said he didn't want to keep fighting Cell for many reasons which i can explain which can come convoluted but not because he could or wanted to change cell.
@@supaseru242 goku gave cell senzu cuz he wanted to prove that his successor can easily defeat all the past generations enemies as cell is combination of all the strongest fighters,he gave cell senzu bean to torment gohan so gohan will be pushed to his limits and will break his limits Piccolo didn't belive gohan even he thought gohan couldn't do it Even gohan didn't belive in himself, the only person who believed in gohan was goku and he was right gohan did it
@@calm6959 basically, Goku has no problem killing someone if he thinks he can't handle them, but he'll spare them if he does think he can (or can beat them in a rematch). He's fine with killing when he's not actually in control (e.g. telling Gohan to kill Cell) or there's an immediate need to stop a threat without any way besides "kill them" (Zamasu)
Thank you! Finally a good analysis on it. I was getting tired of hearing people overly criticizing the senzu bean scene and not understanding the character development in the arc
Facts. It’s had multiple great arcs in a row, broke the internet, had one of the most critically acclaimed anime movies of all time yet people still wanna disrespect it.
I don't really like DB as much as I used to but I still keep up with it. I'm just waiting for the anime to come back at this point, I don't like the manga the same way I like the anime.
@@leultrainstinct406 people be like "oh aot is the best anime of all time" when half the time the characters don't even act like they should but dragon ball has some of the best consistency yet they clown on it. Love to see it
@@Not_Claptrap Nah dude, I love DB, DBZ and DBS, but AOT really is one of the best anime. The pacing, the animation, and the storyline is great. The only thing I kinda don't like about AOT is the main characters, the only ones I like are Levi and the potato girl.
I think Goku ripping his shirt and giving Moro the senzu was Goku testing if Meerus was right about his way of thinking, and in the end he learned that Meerus was right
That would be "Limit Break Survivor", specifically the version that plays in the "Dragon Ball Super" episode where Universes Two and Six are eliminated.
Dude, you basically just summed up everything I have to say about the arc. A lot of the negativity regarding the ending is based on a lack of understanding.
Honestly bro. All those negatively perceived moments like the senzu bean, were amazing moments that were just misunderstood. I hope people start to appreciate the greatness of the arc after understanding
The ending wasn't bad, but it was just disappointing. The arc built up to Vegeta getting the win, but it was more of an assist instead and that was disappointing. I still like the ending but they should've went the obvious route instead of trying to do plot twist after plot twist. The arc overall was great and the first 80 percent was spectacular but the last 20 percent was a little disappointing.
@@numbah1669 i wouldn't say so. It was more or less establishing Vegeta learning to drop his pride and reshape the way he approaches combat and the Moro arc displays his approach and what it will lead to, and it shows since Vegeta was handling Moro better then UI Omen Goku. It ultimately was building up to Goku learning to achieve Autonomous Ultra Instinct at the end and learn Merus' lesson and grow as a person. This is at least what I see.
@@numbah1669 Thats fair I guess, I can understand vegeta fans being angry about what happened to him at the end, but I wouldn't say that what happened to him makes the entire ending bad. He still played a crucial role in defeating Moro by giving Goku the energy to use that ki avatar form.
In case anyone is wondering "why all the Z parallels, what about Super?" Moro is mostly based around Z, others cover DBS. Merus is an anti-Zamasu, but many have already pointed that out and this could be a 20 minute video on its own. Saganbo's Galactic Bandit Brigade has 10 elite fighters, essentially a Tournament of Power team (credit to What If Theory), which also represents the U6 tournament. There's a trio of females who have a thick-girl transformation like Ribrianne (also an anime reference). There's a metal man and they call back to Magetta to beat him, a panda dude similar to Botamo, and 73 at least looks like Hit. Also a member of Zarbon's race and Saganbo is a good Nappa parallel for more Z stuff. And because this is a massive rabbit hole, Moro destroys Saganbo's body like King Piccolo destroys Drum's. The Z-Fighters vs. the prisoners references Resurrection F and Krillin even calls Goku with his energy (Trunks also does that in Goku Black arc in anime). This is both Z and Super sort of but still worth noting. And it goes without saying this is a DBS story so some stuff comes natural. I got nothing for Broly though, other than one direct reference in the arc early on. Side note: DBS has several side stories which include villains who are now Galactic Patrol prisoners. I would love if all of them came back relevant through Moro, and that would really hammer in the theme when minor stories retroactively built up this Saga.
@@idespairsyt5928 Yeah, if they just removed the ridiculous ending, I would have given it a 7/10, regardless of the really confusing things that happened.
Been saying this, another good video is totallymarks review. It seems dragon ball fans refuse to analyze anything when reading and look at things black an white. There is always a reason behind son goku’s actions.
You do know that had they not lucked out with Uub's power, that was GG right? And Goku had no idea the grand Supreme kai had headed to Uub's village to get the God ki.
@@SuspiciousIguana But that just reinforces the lesson Goku is living out, doesn’t it? To value life utterly, even those we deem evil, because you never know how they might end up helping you as a consequence of this mercy, intentionally or not. Life has innate value and sanctity, and this respect for life and others has been why Goku has been this reformer of sorts for all the people he interacts with. It’s those reformations that have saved the universe time and time again. Goku saves everyone in direct and indirect ways.
@@TheParadoxCreator that gives way way too much credit to Goku than is due. Goku is, in the simplest words, dumb. Even during the Cell Saga fiasco that was something very visible. He thinks simple and straight. A time line destroying entity wants a playmate? Let's bring another of them! Or tell them to organize a ToP(though it may have indirectly been helpful). Goku is quite simply rather lucky. The world itself supports him to keep at his quest for more and more power as if an existence stronger than Zeno was helping him (cough the Mangaka). While fans may dig around and create Goku's plausible intentions, IF he had truly wanted to just give Moro a chance at redemption, he'd have struck him down the instance when it was all a waste. Instead he appeared to be playing around still, much like Gohan did as a child against perfect cell. In that sense, DB GT had a much more mature Goku who had come to realize the weight of his actions. The DB super Goku is nothing but a warrior who wants to fight. Him giving a senzu to Moro is simply that, that Goku isn't an angel and he isn't someone who would protect the world. He just wants to fight.
I just finished this arc last night. Here in Texas we’re going through a snowstorm and I knew I wasn’t going to work today. So I stayed up reading the complete arc in one night. And why I automatically loved it right away this analysis just made me love it even more. We now NEED a Vegeta analysis PLEASE
I just wanna say, I respect the hell out of the fact that Seth does his best to remain unbiased towards any controversial topics mentioned (such as if __ is stronger than __) and does not shrug off anyone’s opinion as being ridiculous. That kind of professionalism is rare in topics like these.
Nah, that is mostly his dbz fights. When Vegeta fought Buu, he knew he would lose or die. When Vegeta fought Beerus, he knew Beerus was stronger but acted out of emotion. As for Hit, Vegeta never really underestimated him, but he kinda did at the same time. For Goku Black, Vegeta underestimated him in their first encounter, but not when they met again. For Jiren, Vegeta didn't underestimated him, he saw Jiren beat Goku but he tried to fight Jiren anyways because he was trying to get ultra instinct.
@@jantheking7028 goku in saiyan saga, raccoom, zarbon, frieza (twice arguably if you count RoF), the androids, cell, goku again in buu saga, beerus (twice), hit, goku black, jiren, toppo and at the end moro. Sorry if i missed some
@@vherox3826 He didn't underestmiate Jiren, Hit, or Toppo. In fact, he actually overestimated Toppo because Vegeta felt the need to do the final explosion even though he already had the upperhand against Toppo before he used it. But yea, resuerection F could count because Vegeta underrestimated frieza which led to earth being destroyed.
Vegeta didn't underestimate Beerus in the movie or the television show, he underestimated him in the manga, this very manga! Piccolo might not have been told about that, but he was right there to see Vegeta undestimate Jiren. Again, not talking about the Anime where Vegeta actually had the upper hand and was doing all he could to win before Jiren just got fed up and brought the beatdown. Manga Vegeta talks down to Jiren with no justification whatsoever and gets immediately crushed.
@SethTheProgrammer You are by far the most well spoken, sensible and thorough of all the different manga related content creators I have seen on youtube thus far. Keep it up dude, as this was an absolute pleasure to watch! Cheers yo.
I really like the perspective of the arc in this video. it’s not bad or lazy story writing it’s the culmination of everything Goku has done or learned. Just wish that it didn’t come right after the tournament, some spacing would have been nice to let the concept of juxtaposed characters breath
That’s fair, but at the same time having goku finally master his ultimate technique, the technique that is the accumulation of all his fighting experience and masters teachings, against everything Moro represented, was perfect.
In a way, I think Moro only represented all his mortal villains. So Moving forward, he’s gonna face godly villains and he’ll have to learn new things in order to beat them. And here’s where I think he’ll have to face more thought provoking questions concerning the gods.
There was something in between, the problem was that was a two hour movie in between the longest anime arc of super and the longest manga arc of super. I get that they wanted to give Super an iconic villain, one that wasn't part Goku, a misunderstood attack dog, a simple tournament opponent or a reused character like Freeza, who isn't really even Super since he came back before super, but yes, I think not only another Cell type villain but also letting Goku master ultra instinct were both too early. Something else could have come between this and Broly.
Seth. I am so glad there are people like you. People that can articulate things that I know but have trouble explaining. Strong work my man. Strong work..
I doubt a lot of people caught the galactus inspiration or moro being the embodiment of all the past villains. Everyone thought toyotaro was just copying. Seth did recap a lot but at least he gave his opinion on things where as most db youtubers don't as much.
@@roleiosports3695 after watching this, its become clear the next arc is about Vegeta, the person who is seemingly the antagonist if the new arc is someone who had their life destroyed by the saiyans and the frieza force, Vegeta was both of those, he is the prince of all saiyans aswell was one of the frieza force main members, In the t.o.p arc Vegeta directly says that he is a solo fighter with no master which is quiet against m.u.i, this results in him losing, in the new arc Vegeta is going out of his way to ask Beerus to teach him In the last arc Vegeta started showing signs of full redemptions, hes trying to rewrite his bad deeds, in this arc it might fully become that, he is going to willingly change his entirety of his old younger selves to become someone new, which is what goku did he changed his younger self who only cared about fighting to someone who wants justice The new chapter is comint out tmr
@@Tektabyte facts. Everything vegeta learned about letting go and not carrying the guilt, will be passed on to Granolah because they’re two sides of the same coin. Usually goku reforms the bad guy, but now it’s vegeta’s turn
Just...wow. This is the best character essay someone has made for Goku, at least that I've ever seen. Simply amazing script and you drove the point home with perfection.
Moro in my opinion is the most intelligent villain in the series, while he lets Goku and Vegeta train, I don't see it as the same way as Cell as Moro notes and respects Goku & Vegeta's power and plans ahead where Cell thought he couldn't be beaten no matter what. Glad the human characters came back, Gohan was cool. Moro is stronger than Broly and Jiren. My only disappointment was I wish Merus stayed dead as the cost of victory, and his death was different from others.
I don’t think Moro is stronger than jiren or broly when it’s just him after he fused with the other dude(don’t remember his name) he then was able to compete against mui goku. Also Mui goku in moro ark was stronger than top arc so it would be a close bout between base Moro(non fused) and jiren/broly I also think Broly will eventually overpower Moro because Moro is cocky and doesn’t know broly has infinite power. That’s just my opinion don’t know if I’m correct but I think I am.
Baby is clearly smarter, he straight up tried to kill goku the second he got to earth and took over the entire planet, something no other villain in db has ever done btw
@@killerbee5282 where did you pull that bs out of? If broly had infinite power then why the hell did he lose to Gogeta, it’s pretty clear broly hit his ceiling by the end of their fight
@@shockwavesyndrome6433 "That's just my opinion". Also by infinite power he meant something along Cyborg's infinite energy, don't act like you didn't understand.
you got me with the line about the villains being the worthless people who could do good, is like what garou and shigaraki believes and its just heartbreaking, i hate nowadays beign the devils advocate for people who do bad things, but you know, i grew up thinking that everybody could be a good person, later in life i became grimm, but i still have some kind of hope of seing the good in everyone, so your conclussion was just beatifull and so relatable with life and society, what makes dragon ball look so good, i love you dude!
What they miss is that almost all of the fights are built up and are then wrapped up before moving on to the next buildup. It's not complex storytelling by any stretch, but plotless is definitely a stretch.
My desired approach to conflict in fiction is TriTrump (INT/Psychic) Mind - Body(STR/VIT) \ / Spirit (Magic/Chi) I have seen bits of that instead of BIGGER NUMBER/HIGHEST LEVEL in some bits of Super, but if there was more I would hope people would not hate on DBZ so much...
The plot falls apart in Z. The original DB is underrated. Z created all of these issues. -power levels are the only thing that matter. Not Martial skill anymore. -no stakes since the Dragon Balls are constantly used to wish everything back. -side characters don't mean shit. Only the Saiyans.
@@gianni3611 That's why I said we might see him, but the author could just tease us and we don't see frieza till the next arc and grahnola somehow doesn't find him
@@mariomaster4568 Same. I think it would be cool if Goku and Vegeta trained Grahnola to fight Frieza. Maybe Goku and Vegeta can train Grahnola AND Broly at the same time since Grahnola is a fast learner like Broly and Goku promised at the end of the Broly movie that he would train Broly.
@@cavvaldiv5536 stop lowballing I bet you’re another causal who doesn’t pay attention to the deep layers we could all see that he was suppressing his power out of the sheer kindness of his heart, Moro is oil drum WITH THE LID ON at least
Those are people who aren't looking. Seriously Jack Kirby is really important, look at any appearance of The One above all, he has Kirby's face. His home is based of Jack Kirby's old home on Long Island. Dude is as important to Marvel and comics as a whole as Stan was if not more
I agree with both of you, although I believe that Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko and Stan Lee are each as important as each other, without those three Marvel would not be here today.
That is actually a new way for me to see this. The only problem for me is that Moro is a bit too plain but the fight is actually really interesting. Thank you for the analysis.
I feel like whis wants goku to realise his own strength instead of just relying on others strength in the latest chap we clearly see whis telling goku to develop his own style to fight with (can you make a video about that )
Nah he’ll still rely on others. That’s one of db’s biggest themes. But this is uncharted territory for goku. In fact, he’s the only mortal to actually approach angel territory. So He’s basically looking for some kinda “how to guide” from whis but he’s telling that he needs to continue to use his own fighting style. It’s the only reason he got this far in the first place.
@@leultrainstinct406 I believe that what Whis, and by extension, Toyo are trying to say, is Goku needs to stop taking from his master's, and to create something of his own. Basically pushing him towards becoming a mentor of some sorts, for his inevitable teaching of Uub.
@@PBJavon that’s a good point goku doesn’t have many original moves lol. Even his signature move was from roshi. But at the same time, that’s the point. Goku would’ve never gotten to where he’s at if it weren’t for the people around him . So i think it’s more so that ui is the pinnacle of the things goku learned from past masters, and his own fighting experience. Now that he’s at this pinnacle, instead of copying techniques from others, he needs to develop his own. He’s essentially at a point where he’s his own master. As a master, he needs to continue to develop his own fighting style to pass on to the next generation aka uub. So thanks to everyone who helped him along the way with their knowledge, he became a master. But as a master, he needs to focus on developing his own style. And one day, he’ll have his own signature move and teachings to pass on to the next generation.
Except he doesn't heavily rely on others. He only does it when it's necessary. Super writers just doesnt know where to take Gokus character. Before it's "Goku wants to reach new levels on his own" thanks to Battle of Gods, now hes relying on others too much? The same guy who didn't want to rely on fusion against a Buu or the Dragonballs dealing with Dr Gero?
You took the bad taste of this arc's ending out of my stomach. Thank you for sharing your view on this topic. Hopefully, the current arc stays consistent with Goku's character progression.
Great observations looking at the story in full. Db fans aren't used to digging deeper or context clues and take things face value it's good to have things help the fans appreciate the Arch's and series more. Great video and we need that Vegeta video
I just love how you called Moro a c u next Tuesday and just casually went right passed it, I agree whole heartedly and replayed that part 10 times just now 😂
The Dragonball universe is so inspirational there’s so many life lessons you cn learn by dissecting the content to the smallest example. This is more than just an anime it gives a lot of people hope and excitement with all the evil shit going on in our real world
Wow this is a very deep video. After watching this video I now see the whole Moro Arc in a much different light. I wonder what Geekdom101's opinion would be on this video.
@@dinogt8477 who said I was joking lol. It really is. Only arcs above it are saiyan, frieza, and the top(anime). Its on par with cell. Cell would be higher, but it had a pretty big plot hole.
Also, in real life, some martial artists, of certain disciplines, will let out a shout before a fight, meant to align their body and spirit, or something- of course, they aren’t mad
I mean you can say this but Goku literally didn't do this throughout his entire time in the Tournament of Power in Ultra Instinct I mean I don't care but still it's not something you have to do it's something you choose to do.
@@AverageGamerXP Think about it. Goku and pretty much all the other Dragon Ball Characters yell when they charge their energy, or charge at someone. It's their habit, or their Instinct. Just like how Goku still yells "Kamehame-Ha!!!" whenever he does it. He's not angry (half the time).
@@DorienTheHeroOfTheArts Yeah but you don't have to say the words it's not a requirement to initiate the move. Gohan didn't even need two hands to initiate the kamehameha let alone say the words. My argument isn't if Goku was angry my argument it's not a requirement to yell when you initiate a power up sequence. I found it cooler when Goku said less in Ultra Instinct it gave off a more serious tone from him, but who actually cares weather he talks are not it's not that serious.
@@AverageGamerXP Yeah, true. It's just like exhaling when you throw a punch, or like Seth said, yelling when lifting weights or moving a couch. But, yeah you're right. It really isn't that serious😁
Great analysis and this is also why I liked this arc so much. Moro's entire arc is meant to narratively set Goku and Vegeta's character arcs to be updated. Narratively, the ToP arc served to show that Goku's desire to fight stronger opponents regardless of the consequences and his unwavering belief that he and his allies will pull through (Either through fighting or that he could somehow say, convince his friend Zeno that he and the others not be erased) were potentially a detriment to the universe and that Goku himself, it's savior, could also be the cause of it being destroyed if his values weren't adjusted in some way to value protecting the universe more. This entire arc is set up to go about resolving that issue, giving Goku and Vegeta newer purposes in defending something, rather than just fighting for the sake of fighting. Vegeta had shades of this already starting during the Cell Games, but it's finally expanded beyond his family in Moro's arc. Goku meanwhile had no such sort of desire beyond his immediate friends and family, and this arc was meant to help give him that sense of justice and allow him to develop more. Narratively this arc wouldn't have worked if it was before ToP in my opinion. it's actually specifically because of the ToP that this works as well as it does.
@@leultrainstinct406 both the developments were underrated. Goku learns he must not be selfish and fight fie himself while merus showed that even those who must stay neutral can lean to one side or the other
@@jantheking7028 YES YES YES. If the anime comes back any time soon then it will catch up to the manga pretty quickly. I feel like a good way to slow that down is show more of goku and merus training to build a better relationship between merus and goku (plus merus and the viewer)
I keep coming back to this review because it's SO much better than Totally Not Mark's, he clearly didn't understand the bigger picture and thought the villain references were lazy. I'm glad people like you exist for commentary to provide a more clearer picture and how a "simple story" can have a deeper meaning when viewed properly.
@@jobsidian4219 Not really, the arc was great in terms of DB standards and it was the best arc since the cell saga in my opinion. The villain was meh because his personality wasn't all that, but the arc itself was great because it had extra lore, new concepts (Grand kai taking over buu), delved deeper into how the angels work, and even provided very good moments for side characters. Yamcha actually won a battle in this arc for the first time since the original DB lol. The artwork was good and very detailed, especially towards the end.
am not really a fan of cell saga. It didn't really explain origin like what race is he where did he come from, why is fighting the gods in the first place? Yeah The arc had it's good moments like piccolo and gohan vs 73 and vegeta character development (at least in the beginning). Moro henchmen didn't really look or feel that intimidating to me. I feel that moro should still rely more on his magic and smarts instead acting more like a meathead chad. Plus moro is base cell when he not in his first form he my least favorite DBZ era villain (In my opinion)
I didn’t fully read this arc but it sounds pretty epic. I like that Goku is evolving from more of self centered character with questionable morality to an actual legit hero.
Glad Seth Make this video I am tired to see some people hating DBS again & again not with many solid reasons yes I hope that will clear some misunderstanding
Its a trend to hate on super, so people who read the manga do it thinking its bad, so of course if you start reading something like that, everything you read will be bad for you.
In my case i have enjoyed the TOP(anime) and this arc a lot, as much as db and dbz and after watching seth videos i realize some things that i didnt before from this two arcs and made me like them even more.
![BOWKYLION - วิงวอน (ex-change) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cLdnZWDaO-w/mqdefault.jpg)
People are getting mad at me for saying Vegeta doesn't let his guard down. This is based on the FNF and Whis training statement about how he acts in a fight, not with him never underestimating a villain or something.. weird conflation.
Also to clarify, I DO think Goku cares about protecting his friends before this. However I think this is more so teaching him to value things outside of his clique/own world.
With the Senzu Bean scene after thinking / talking about it, I think it's probably based on a few things not just Piccolo. I think it's based on his morality arc with Piccolo Jr, giving energy to Frieza, and based on giving the Senzu bean to Cell so he could experience the fear and pain he wants to inflict on others. However I want to clarify that it's still not the same type of mistake he was making with Gohan, I wouldn't call it a mistake at all. His mistake with Cell is his misunderstanding of Gohan, which isn't present with Moro.
.
Yo seth!
Hj
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Yes very deep
Goku seeing Freeza genociding the Namekians: “Hey knock it off”
Yea because he can just wish them back
@@johnredford1 well congrats I guess...😅
@@absolutelyfookinnobody2843 does that take away the pain physical mental abuse and trauma of being violently murdered by foreign soldiers and knowing you friends and loved ones will probably suffer the same fate
@@auglybluething1995 yes
@@johnredford1 wow that's kind of weird I thought I would never hear that name again just a robot of course I don't give a fuck about the other guy
Seth gonna act like he didn't just pit a bear and a whole damn ape against each other
😭
Now we gotta see elephant vs hippo
Elephant stomps btw
Haha 😂
Prolly smoking some good shit
@@trollking4058 elephant kinda kicks the hyppo and it dies lol. What I want to see is leopard vs cheetah ngl
I would personally love a “ strength of prince vegeta” video
Same unfortunately the video won't be as long or good as the goku one since dbz writers hate vegeta
@@some_shitposting_idiot3023 Nah it's that Vegeta gets most of his development later on in the series than Goku, the mc
@@youravictim38 and its still not that much
Mee2
@@some_shitposting_idiot3023 Are you joking? Vegeta has arguably the most development in the series.
Hit the nail on the head, man. Goku’s merciful and forgiving nature is what sets him apart and has saved the universe in multiple ways multiple times. He was never looking at the bigger picture of it all and was acting purely in the moment, but all the same. This is Goku stepping into his own in a way, and I’ve always hated that people just overlooked that fact.
The moro arc was about Goku, the new arc is about Vegeta now
@@Tektabyte I haven’t read anything just yet, but that’s cool
Because he still put universes on danger. NOBODY with common sense would do what Goku does hoping to get plot armor to save you lol.
@@crowing3886 Idk if you meant to respond to me, but all the same, Goku didn’t know that the universes were going to be destroyed as a result of the ToP. Further still, the universes were going to be destroyed *despite* the ToP, and the tournament actually gave everyone a chance to survive, and they did.
@@Tektabyte do you think he's going to get a win this arc or just character development?
Goku: "The strongest guys always seem to be villains..." No wonder he wants to create strong allies by teaching them to value the universe. Amazing conclusion, Seth.
The strongest one in he's universe is good. Even Jiren technically was good
If Jiren was good he had a hell of a slip given he was willing to murder Goku’s friends.
But I guess the Pride Troopers understood it was stress and knew his values and backstories, despite him devaluing all of them to Goku. They understood that he was desperate and gave him a second chance because him allowing the Pride Troopers meant that he cared about justice, and Jiren accepted being completely humbled by the teamwork needed to defeat him.
That is unfortunately the only way to reconcile how the anime portrays stuff. Jiren was given better motives and didn’t do stuff like sacrifice everything he had just for that wish that drastically.
@@iantaakalla8180 His whole universe was gonna be destroyed if he lost. Isnt that motivation enough?
@@alexanderblack6619 well yeah, but jiren was willing to kill gokus friends on the spectator stand
@@bluntes i just think those kinds of stakes can make anybody crazy, especially when you're the only possible savior of your universe. Jiren is not an evil character imo
low key that point at the end with jiren being what goku thought he wanted and moro being the personification of every villain he had ever faced. Is leading me to suspect that granola might be representing something of goku's past, future or even just the species that he is due to the bardock references
Exactly what I was thinking. For the first time, goku will have to directly answer for the sins of his ancestors
@@leultrainstinct406 exactly, we got to see a glimpse of the terrible stuff via Vegeta's first appearance but now we really get to see all the horrible things that the sayains have done.
Also while we don't know if Granola is supposed to be the big bad of the next arc yet, it's interesting that Goku's going to potentially face a sympathetic villain/antagonist which I don't really think has been done before.
@Arache Bailey granola like baby from gt as both lost their race against the saiyans
@@lock4097 facts I’m so excited. We’ve always seen the damage frieza and his army caused to the saiyans and others. They’ve been painted out as victims for so long, sometimes I forget they were ruthless killers too. now we get to see more of the damage they caused, and the consequences of those merciless actions.
20:19 I still remember reading someone's comment on another channel about this, which goes something like.
"Goku really kneeled down (to Moro) and said: do you even lift bro?
Lmao he really did that 💀
No
Unrealentgaming review chapter 65 i think
@@wanilimbe Can't remember, maybe a Geekdom101 video perhaps?
Holy shit I liked that arc but this analysis gives a whole other side of appreciation
Fr tho that shot changed my whole perspective
Same here.
Still ass
same
@Kenley Bazile oof opinions but i mean it is the internet so i shouldn't even warn you tbh
Dragon ball fans: NO YOU CANT GIVE MORO A SENZU😡😡😡🤬
Goku: *Not thinking*
head empty
@@tonybalongna mind blank
Exactly, total instinct man.
@@A.S._Trunks total instinct until he makes a surprised Pikachu face after moro becomes a planet.
@Lucas Frejborg *not thinking intensifies*
Toriyama and toyotaron: Yes, thats exactly what we were planning.
😂😂
I knew it's a joke but some people actaully think this way when the author's were literally referencing pervious moments. The community does not really view the series in another light besides oogabooga power.
@@teawsome1236 yee
I mean they probably did but at a more basic level
Lmaoo
But fr tho people gotta stop sleeping on db. It’s a master of hiding deep and meaningful theme in subtle ways, behind a giant wall of simplicity. If you analyze db and z enough, you can find similar elements
I feel like if people took db as a whole(not gt and evolution) seriously, it would be more appreciated for it plot, characters, and themes. Not just the fights
I love the fact that people are angry that Goku in Ultra Instinct Omen is yelling for his transformation while he did the exact same thing when he received Ultra Instinct Omen for the second time against Kefla and no one minded it at all, they even thought it was cool due to the different voice
@@formidablefoe157 lol he deleted his comments
@@Bleeperblopper497 his account got deleted
@@Bleeperblopper497 who
ye I meant the moment I watched this video I thought about the scream he made vs kefla
@@IIIISai what
This arc was a perfect summary of the entire dragon ball series. It’s got all the villains put into one. All the lessons put into one it’s all pretty good in my opinion.
Honestly, I was cool with the first part of the arc. I loved the design of Moro along with the idea of magic vs. power. Then Vegeta getting PISSED that 'stupid god ki' and 'stupid magic' were keeping him down so he opted for another strategy. Also, PLEASE do a Vegeta video!
He should make that one Vegeta learns the technique which Beerus wants him to learn.
Are you one of those fake verified channels that uses bots?
@@jantheking7028 I think that's a check emoji in his name.
Jantheking you must be new here
@@RovalisGTO New where?
While I do really like this interpretation, especially that last part, I have one of my own that I like to think about as well. Moro and Goku are pretty much opposites and we mainly see this with their strength. Moro derives his strength from forcibly feeding on others, whereas Goku's strength comes from the motivation his friends give him and sharing their collective will. Essentially, they both gather their strength from others, but Moro does it destructively and Goku does it constructively. Well, Goku's "strength from friends" and Moro's "strength from stealing" both allow them to gain the powers of Merus and while they have tested each other in the past, this final confrontation solidifies why Goku is right. The final battle ensues and Moro's stealing gets the better of him, as he can't contain the angel abilities due to not having practice. Moro then proceeds to steal from everybody on Earth, but this practice has turned his mind to mush, whereas Goku has the perfect clarity and spiritual mastery to finish him off. He proceeds to deafeat him literally through the power of the friends he made along the way, and proves you shouldn't cheat on standardized tests. Study groups are better.
Anyway, I just wanted to share that.
I like it
Yeah! Even at the end Moro is about to win because using the energy of the earth he stole, but Goku defeats him with the energy of the people of earth, who are sharing it willingly to help.
Thanks for sharing
Also you could say that Goku becomes the "Hero trope" when he goes UI after Merus dies meaning that yes Moro and Goku are the opposite, Villain trope vs Hero trope
That’s a great depiction!
Seth you just opened my eyes to this fight in a whole new way. This is basically Goku being the most Goku he has ever been trying to give someone a second chance at life to be better than he was before and Rise Above his selfishness. Thank you for this beautiful insight into my favorite Dragon Ball character.
Goku litterally screams in MUI in the anime.
@Xxxx pretty iconic scream in super suprised you haven't seen it
My personal theory that’s also kinda the reason he dropped out of MUI because he started to feel enraged towards Jiren, while here it is like Seth said like the weights
The anime's not that reliable in terms of how UI works. Goku literally gets mad in his fight with Jiren and the anime framed it like he powered up from it. If anything it should have made him weaker.
@@j0doe1 yea he powered up and almost immediately afterwards dropped out of the form, he got his boost then it was gone
Dramatic effect most likely
Today, I learned a lesson of my life as well, to give someone a chance even if its not that satisfying. You convinced me to acknowledge the depth of an arc that I hated so much while reading.
Thank you, I'm definitely going reread this story and wait for the upcoming projects that Toyotaro is working on.
Merus: 'Save the world, my final message. Goodbye.'
Goku: And i took that personally.
Throwback meme.
windows 95 startup sound
Of course he had to comeback 🙄
You win
To add Meerus point of his sacrifice was to provoke a strong feeling in him. So instead he got angry like Super Saiyan, he contain his feelings which he needed to be in UI. That’s why as well.
Merus*
@@shivajones108 bro lol
Yup. And that was another moment of overlooked development goku had in this arc. He gained a new level of emotional mastery he never had before.
If he saw a good friend die in front of his eyes, he would’ve raged. But now he was calm.
@@leultrainstinct406 so instead of doing the smart thing and doing what merus would’ve wanted him to do; he decided to try to redeem Moro and put his home and universe at risk? I’m pretty sure merus wanted goku to kill the villain.
@@trentmoore6947 goku isnt going to just change at the drop of a hat. He still has the need to try to change people's ways into good. Once moro was actually a serious threat (at least a big enough threat that whis told goku to finish it) goku was almost immediately ready to kill moro, it was just too late and moro became earth
I'm blown away by the character analysis! I'm kinda dumb so I picked up none of this when reading the manga, to me it was just more fighting and hair-dye. I love that an analysis like this could have even be made about this arc.
Glad you admitted it, unlike other DB fans.
You were right the first time
It didn't blow over your head, so don't feel like you're dumb. Art is subjective, and there are numerous analyses that can make themselves sound like they reached inevitable conclusions, especially when they get to talk in an echo chamber with no one presenting counterpoints. These kinds of talks are more sophistry than an objectively conclusive description.
@@Blaisem It did blow over his head, not sure what tf you're saying.
@@Blaisem Thanks! I'm working on being less self depreciating.
I dont think Vegeta's "doubting his opponents" thing actually makes sense though. He never underestimated his enemies, but instead OVERESTIMATING himself.
Edit: minor spelling error
That works vice versa
@@txl1472 not really, because he wants his opponent to get powerups and such, just not expecting them to make a difference, especially if he's been dogging them the whole fight. If you wanna call out Vegeta, I'm on board, just call it like it is.
Saying Vegeta underestimates his opponents isn't what it is, so just because the end result is the same, the functionality is different.
@@jadedsilverlining9427 bro you saying "he wants his opponents to get powerups and such, just not expecting them to make a difference" is literally underestimating his opponent. Trunks didn't underestimate cell and told vegeta not to be stupid but he let him transform cause of his ego
Agreed, vegeta overestimated his own power so much, despite letting his opponents power up, it was because he thought he was untouchable, so even with any amount of a power up, he is still the untouchable god that wrecks everyone, but knows exactly what their fighting power actually is
Good on you Seth! Road to 1M!!!
I did NOT expect to see you here😂. Love your videos man they’re helping me a lot.
If he uploaded more I’m sure he would grow a lot faster
This video changed my opinion on this arc, glad to have seen this.
It is kinda funny how deep ideas can be done in such a way they fly over the heads of so many people.
That’s dragon ball in a nutshell lmao. That’s what makes it special. There a whole bunch of simplicity on the surface. And the fights add even more distractions because they’re so simple. That’s why ppl say dB IS OnLY AbouT FiGHtinG. But under it all, there are a bunch of hidden gems and powerful themes.
@@leultrainstinct406 which so funny when I see so many vids of people analyzing other series and talking how deep and intricate they are but with DB they can never seem to see past the surface level stuff
Which leads them to saying things like "DB is nothing but fighting, screaming, big laser beams and power levels when this is 100% false
There's so much depth and subtleties in DB that fly straight over heads of not just the detractors of the series but also many people within the fanbase itself
Which is kinda sad since DB is such a simple series
@@edwardmyers9492 pretty much bcuz many people just talk about Super when it’s hot and use that to gain more sub and view cough cough itsanimegirl cough cough.
@@HuyBui-uq4oj another thing I'm seeing is that a lot people tend to underestimate the writting in the series as well as ridicule people for appreciating it by saying that we're over analyzing it when in fact all we are doing is telling you happens because most of the fanbase clearly didn't get it
They say some retarded shit like "because toriyama is a gag writer they think that everything he does in the story is a joke when nothing within the series implies this
DB is clearly a series that he takes a lot more seriously than his other works such as Dr. Slump
@@edwardmyers9492 it’s like, yeah, we don’t get the same level of writing as One piece, but a simple story doesn’t equal bad. Having a bigass cast of characters is pointless if a big chunk ended up like tenten from Naruto. At least most of the fighters in db has their character arc.
My opinion of the entire arc honestly changed upon a reread of the TOP going into a full read of the Moro arc through to current. It all held together much better, but I think the spread out release as well as way too much hyperbole on both sides of the fandom as the arc played out negatively effected a lot of people's takes.
My current favorite of Super just over the Black arc now 🐐
Seth is being a better wife for Goku than Chi-Chi.
Lmao
LOL
But then Goku had a shotgun wedding (he touched Chichi) because he didn’t know about privates better.
🧢🧢🧢🧢🧢
Dam you sounding like Seth wife tho 🤧😂
People don't like Goku's character in this arc but I think his speech with Moro is actually accurate to Goku's morality. Without headcanon or dub bias. Goku is purely reactionary and if he beats a bad guy, he gets over it until they try something else. Which is why Goku doesn't care about Freeza after he already beat him before in ROF. He considers you redeemed if he beats you. It probably wasn't handled right with the sensu bean but it isn't out of character for Goku to not care about a villain if they aren't a threat or weak. This is something even Geekdom gets wrong.
I guess Goku shouldn't have told Gohan to kill cell when cell wasn't a threat to Gohan after his body was messed up by gohan,Goku should've tried to give ultimatum but he didn't during the battle.Let's be honest this is regression due that scene and dialogue with him regretted his decision at the Cell games and i think he apologize again for doing it again at the end of the moro arc,Like if going to do stuff like this don't regret it.
@@supaseru242 lol it isn't regression at all. The difference with cell is that Goku and Gohan had ALREADY given Cell several chances at mercy. Gohan LITERALLY refused to fight Cell seriously for like the first half of their fight because he was convinced that he could change Cell. And like Seth pointed out, the situation with Moro isn't ANYTHING like what goku did to cell. Goku willingly gave cell a senzu bean out of the selfish desire to see gohan fight cell at full power. This isn't even similar AT ALL to goku sparing Moro out of mercy and the teachings of Merus.
@@jantheking7028 I can't remember Goku given Cell several chances at mercy,Though gohan said he didn't want to keep fighting Cell for many reasons which i can explain which can come convoluted but not because he could or wanted to change cell.
@@supaseru242 goku gave cell senzu cuz he wanted to prove that his successor can easily defeat all the past generations enemies as cell is combination of all the strongest fighters,he gave cell senzu bean to torment gohan so gohan will be pushed to his limits and will break his limits
Piccolo didn't belive gohan even he thought gohan couldn't do it
Even gohan didn't belive in himself, the only person who believed in gohan was goku and he was right gohan did it
@@calm6959 basically, Goku has no problem killing someone if he thinks he can't handle them, but he'll spare them if he does think he can (or can beat them in a rematch). He's fine with killing when he's not actually in control (e.g. telling Gohan to kill Cell) or there's an immediate need to stop a threat without any way besides "kill them" (Zamasu)
Thank you! Finally a good analysis on it. I was getting tired of hearing people overly criticizing the senzu bean scene and not understanding the character development in the arc
Dragon ball has become so underrated
Facts. It’s had multiple great arcs in a row, broke the internet, had one of the most critically acclaimed anime movies of all time yet people still wanna disrespect it.
I don't really like DB as much as I used to but I still keep up with it. I'm just waiting for the anime to come back at this point, I don't like the manga the same way I like the anime.
@@leultrainstinct406 people be like "oh aot is the best anime of all time" when half the time the characters don't even act like they should but dragon ball has some of the best consistency yet they clown on it. Love to see it
@@Not_Claptrap Nah dude, I love DB, DBZ and DBS, but AOT really is one of the best anime. The pacing, the animation, and the storyline is great. The only thing I kinda don't like about AOT is the main characters, the only ones I like are Levi and the potato girl.
@@jantheking7028 Yo Sasha and Levi are the best
I think Goku ripping his shirt and giving Moro the senzu was Goku testing if Meerus was right about his way of thinking, and in the end he learned that Meerus was right
Honestly like the fact, that you actually realize DBZ isn't mindless action.
Also would like to know the OST used
That would be "Limit Break Survivor", specifically the version that plays in the "Dragon Ball Super" episode where Universes Two and Six are eliminated.
Dude, you basically just summed up everything I have to say about the arc. A lot of the negativity regarding the ending is based on a lack of understanding.
Fr
Honestly bro. All those negatively perceived moments like the senzu bean, were amazing moments that were just misunderstood. I hope people start to appreciate the greatness of the arc after understanding
The ending wasn't bad, but it was just disappointing. The arc built up to Vegeta getting the win, but it was more of an assist instead and that was disappointing. I still like the ending but they should've went the obvious route instead of trying to do plot twist after plot twist. The arc overall was great and the first 80 percent was spectacular but the last 20 percent was a little disappointing.
@@numbah1669 i wouldn't say so. It was more or less establishing Vegeta learning to drop his pride and reshape the way he approaches combat and the Moro arc displays his approach and what it will lead to, and it shows since Vegeta was handling Moro better then UI Omen Goku. It ultimately was building up to Goku learning to achieve Autonomous Ultra Instinct at the end and learn Merus' lesson and grow as a person. This is at least what I see.
@@numbah1669 Thats fair I guess, I can understand vegeta fans being angry about what happened to him at the end, but I wouldn't say that what happened to him makes the entire ending bad. He still played a crucial role in defeating Moro by giving Goku the energy to use that ki avatar form.
Don’t let this make you forget the fact that hisokas bungee gum has the properties of gum and rubber.
stfu and take my Like
@@6em974 ☝️
lmfao Why do I see this everywhere💀
Don’t let this make you forget that Kurenai tried to use genjutsu on Itachi.
This is nice but don't bring something up to distract people from the fact kurenai tried to put itachi in a genjustsu
In case anyone is wondering "why all the Z parallels, what about Super?" Moro is mostly based around Z, others cover DBS.
Merus is an anti-Zamasu, but many have already pointed that out and this could be a 20 minute video on its own.
Saganbo's Galactic Bandit Brigade has 10 elite fighters, essentially a Tournament of Power team (credit to What If Theory), which also represents the U6 tournament. There's a trio of females who have a thick-girl transformation like Ribrianne (also an anime reference). There's a metal man and they call back to Magetta to beat him, a panda dude similar to Botamo, and 73 at least looks like Hit. Also a member of Zarbon's race and Saganbo is a good Nappa parallel for more Z stuff. And because this is a massive rabbit hole, Moro destroys Saganbo's body like King Piccolo destroys Drum's.
The Z-Fighters vs. the prisoners references Resurrection F and Krillin even calls Goku with his energy (Trunks also does that in Goku Black arc in anime). This is both Z and Super sort of but still worth noting.
And it goes without saying this is a DBS story so some stuff comes natural. I got nothing for Broly though, other than one direct reference in the arc early on.
Side note: DBS has several side stories which include villains who are now Galactic Patrol prisoners. I would love if all of them came back relevant through Moro, and that would really hammer in the theme when minor stories retroactively built up this Saga.
Yup.
Moro arc is one of the greatest arcs since dbz
Best arc sice cell saga
@@jantheking7028 Maybe.
@@jantheking7028 true
Goku black arc is actually pretty cool too
@@idespairsyt5928 Yeah, if they just removed the ridiculous ending, I would have given it a 7/10, regardless of the really confusing things that happened.
Been saying this, another good video is totallymarks review. It seems dragon ball fans refuse to analyze anything when reading and look at things black an white. There is always a reason behind son goku’s actions.
Always. Yet people think all he cares about his fighting. That false narrative is why he’s so under appreciated as a character
You do know that had they not lucked out with Uub's power, that was GG right? And Goku had no idea the grand Supreme kai had headed to Uub's village to get the God ki.
yes
@@SuspiciousIguana But that just reinforces the lesson Goku is living out, doesn’t it? To value life utterly, even those we deem evil, because you never know how they might end up helping you as a consequence of this mercy, intentionally or not. Life has innate value and sanctity, and this respect for life and others has been why Goku has been this reformer of sorts for all the people he interacts with. It’s those reformations that have saved the universe time and time again. Goku saves everyone in direct and indirect ways.
@@TheParadoxCreator that gives way way too much credit to Goku than is due. Goku is, in the simplest words, dumb. Even during the Cell Saga fiasco that was something very visible. He thinks simple and straight. A time line destroying entity wants a playmate? Let's bring another of them! Or tell them to organize a ToP(though it may have indirectly been helpful).
Goku is quite simply rather lucky. The world itself supports him to keep at his quest for more and more power as if an existence stronger than Zeno was helping him (cough the Mangaka).
While fans may dig around and create Goku's plausible intentions, IF he had truly wanted to just give Moro a chance at redemption, he'd have struck him down the instance when it was all a waste. Instead he appeared to be playing around still, much like Gohan did as a child against perfect cell.
In that sense, DB GT had a much more mature Goku who had come to realize the weight of his actions. The DB super Goku is nothing but a warrior who wants to fight. Him giving a senzu to Moro is simply that, that Goku isn't an angel and he isn't someone who would protect the world. He just wants to fight.
This is honestly a brilliant take on why this arc was so good, which I haven't been able to put into words.
I just finished this arc last night. Here in Texas we’re going through a snowstorm and I knew I wasn’t going to work today. So I stayed up reading the complete arc in one night. And why I automatically loved it right away this analysis just made me love it even more.
We now NEED a Vegeta analysis PLEASE
This has given me a whole new outlook on Moro as a character and the arc as a whole. Thank you.
You Honestly Made this arc 100times better for me
I just wanna say, I respect the hell out of the fact that Seth does his best to remain unbiased towards any controversial topics mentioned (such as if __ is stronger than __) and does not shrug off anyone’s opinion as being ridiculous. That kind of professionalism is rare in topics like these.
Piccolo: Vegeta isn;t one to underestimate his enemies
That's prettty much most of his fights
Nah, that is mostly his dbz fights. When Vegeta fought Buu, he knew he would lose or die. When Vegeta fought Beerus, he knew Beerus was stronger but acted out of emotion. As for Hit, Vegeta never really underestimated him, but he kinda did at the same time. For Goku Black, Vegeta underestimated him in their first encounter, but not when they met again. For Jiren, Vegeta didn't underestimated him, he saw Jiren beat Goku but he tried to fight Jiren anyways because he was trying to get ultra instinct.
@@jantheking7028 true so i guess most of his fights
@@jantheking7028 goku in saiyan saga, raccoom, zarbon, frieza (twice arguably if you count RoF), the androids, cell, goku again in buu saga, beerus (twice), hit, goku black, jiren, toppo and at the end moro. Sorry if i missed some
@@vherox3826 He didn't underestmiate Jiren, Hit, or Toppo. In fact, he actually overestimated Toppo because Vegeta felt the need to do the final explosion even though he already had the upperhand against Toppo before he used it. But yea, resuerection F could count because Vegeta underrestimated frieza which led to earth being destroyed.
Vegeta didn't underestimate Beerus in the movie or the television show, he underestimated him in the manga, this very manga! Piccolo might not have been told about that, but he was right there to see Vegeta undestimate Jiren. Again, not talking about the Anime where Vegeta actually had the upper hand and was doing all he could to win before Jiren just got fed up and brought the beatdown. Manga Vegeta talks down to Jiren with no justification whatsoever and gets immediately crushed.
Goku is the G.O.A.T hands down!!! Man he's forever my all time favorite hero!!
Me too bro 😜
Damn that Kakarot!
@@samuelmurphy2891 ha looks like someone also loves goku than you vegeta
Me too.
I mean, TECHNICALLY Moro is the G.O.A.T
@SethTheProgrammer You are by far the most well spoken, sensible and thorough of all the different manga related content creators I have seen on youtube thus far. Keep it up dude, as this was an absolute pleasure to watch! Cheers yo.
I really like the perspective of the arc in this video. it’s not bad or lazy story writing it’s the culmination of everything Goku has done or learned. Just wish that it didn’t come right after the tournament, some spacing would have been nice to let the concept of juxtaposed characters breath
That’s fair, but at the same time having goku finally master his ultimate technique, the technique that is the accumulation of all his fighting experience and masters teachings, against everything Moro represented, was perfect.
In a way, I think Moro only represented all his mortal villains. So Moving forward, he’s gonna face godly villains and he’ll have to learn new things in order to beat them. And here’s where I think he’ll have to face more thought provoking questions concerning the gods.
He already learned this lesson in the cell saga and straight up said that he regrets giving cell his sense bean
@@noahmpinto14 bro did you even watch the video?
There was something in between, the problem was that was a two hour movie in between the longest anime arc of super and the longest manga arc of super. I get that they wanted to give Super an iconic villain, one that wasn't part Goku, a misunderstood attack dog, a simple tournament opponent or a reused character like Freeza, who isn't really even Super since he came back before super, but yes, I think not only another Cell type villain but also letting Goku master ultra instinct were both too early. Something else could have come between this and Broly.
Goku has yelled in UI sign before??? Why are people upset about that?
Fr he yelled like 20 times in the top alone lol. Idk why either. just finding things to complain about
@@leultrainstinct406 yeah it's one the things about fighting or beyond what you can normally do, yelling gives you adrenaline.
Because it's "out of character." I really don't see what the big deal is smh.
Yeah and when he yelled he started losing control of it lol
你六Ryujin你 He yelled like in the middle of the kefla fight, he never lost control then.
Man this is spot on. Now that I could back up and see it as a whole story. It also seems to be raising the stakes for future god scale villains
Seth. I am so glad there are people like you. People that can articulate things that I know but have trouble explaining. Strong work my man. Strong work..
This is low key just a manga summery of the moro arc
But a pretty well done one at that.
And an excellent analysis, lets not pretend Seth didn't take the W.
I doubt a lot of people caught the galactus inspiration or moro being the embodiment of all the past villains.
Everyone thought toyotaro was just copying. Seth did recap a lot but at least he gave his opinion on things where as most db youtubers don't as much.
@@roleiosports3695 after watching this, its become clear the next arc is about Vegeta, the person who is seemingly the antagonist if the new arc is someone who had their life destroyed by the saiyans and the frieza force, Vegeta was both of those, he is the prince of all saiyans aswell was one of the frieza force main members,
In the t.o.p arc Vegeta directly says that he is a solo fighter with no master which is quiet against m.u.i, this results in him losing, in the new arc Vegeta is going out of his way to ask Beerus to teach him
In the last arc Vegeta started showing signs of full redemptions, hes trying to rewrite his bad deeds, in this arc it might fully become that, he is going to willingly change his entirety of his old younger selves to become someone new, which is what goku did he changed his younger self who only cared about fighting to someone who wants justice
The new chapter is comint out tmr
@@Tektabyte facts. Everything vegeta learned about letting go and not carrying the guilt, will be passed on to Granolah because they’re two sides of the same coin. Usually goku reforms the bad guy, but now it’s vegeta’s turn
Seth has just shitted on those youtubers that complains about every DBS leak manga images
facts
Yes
Those were annoying af.
@SSJ4GAWD LEDGER why ? Oh wait I saw your name
Nah he explained it from his own perspective. I still think this arc was dogshit and boring.
Just...wow. This is the best character essay someone has made for Goku, at least that I've ever seen. Simply amazing script and you drove the point home with perfection.
Moro in my opinion is the most intelligent villain in the series, while he lets Goku and Vegeta train, I don't see it as the same way as Cell as Moro notes and respects Goku & Vegeta's power and plans ahead where Cell thought he couldn't be beaten no matter what. Glad the human characters came back, Gohan was cool. Moro is stronger than Broly and Jiren. My only disappointment was I wish Merus stayed dead as the cost of victory, and his death was different from others.
I don’t think Moro is stronger than jiren or broly when it’s just him after he fused with the other dude(don’t remember his name) he then was able to compete against mui goku. Also Mui goku in moro ark was stronger than top arc so it would be a close bout between base Moro(non fused) and jiren/broly I also think Broly will eventually overpower Moro because Moro is cocky and doesn’t know broly has infinite power. That’s just my opinion don’t know if I’m correct but I think I am.
Baby is clearly smarter, he straight up tried to kill goku the second he got to earth and took over the entire planet, something no other villain in db has ever done btw
@@killerbee5282 where did you pull that bs out of? If broly had infinite power then why the hell did he lose to Gogeta, it’s pretty clear broly hit his ceiling by the end of their fight
@@shockwavesyndrome6433 General Blue and Tao. Those poor guys tried really hard.
@@shockwavesyndrome6433 "That's just my opinion". Also by infinite power he meant something along Cyborg's infinite energy, don't act like you didn't understand.
What really mattered during that fight was.......UI Goku looks clean
Damn right
Fr it’s gonna break the internet when it gets animated
@@leultrainstinct406 And they’re going to use the movie animation,which is much easier,and cooler for fights
@@coolerreviews6580 is that confirmed? I’m pretty sure we still don’t know the art directors
That boy looks like a god
When the world needed him most, he returned.
you got me with the line about the villains being the worthless people who could do good, is like what garou and shigaraki believes and its just heartbreaking, i hate nowadays beign the devils advocate for people who do bad things, but you know, i grew up thinking that everybody could be a good person, later in life i became grimm, but i still have some kind of hope of seing the good in everyone, so your conclussion was just beatifull and so relatable with life and society, what makes dragon ball look so good, i love you dude!
Dragon ball is underrated in terms of writing and say “it’s plotless action” when they really miss a lot of the deeper lore
What they miss is that almost all of the fights are built up and are then wrapped up before moving on to the next buildup. It's not complex storytelling by any stretch, but plotless is definitely a stretch.
Well blame Super, because it doesn't take the liberty to work beyond the stereotypes.
My desired approach to conflict in fiction is TriTrump
(INT/Psychic) Mind - Body(STR/VIT)
\ /
Spirit (Magic/Chi)
I have seen bits of that instead of BIGGER NUMBER/HIGHEST LEVEL in some bits of Super, but if there was more I would hope people would not hate on DBZ so much...
The plot falls apart in Z. The original DB is underrated. Z created all of these issues.
-power levels are the only thing that matter. Not Martial skill anymore.
-no stakes since the Dragon Balls are constantly used to wish everything back.
-side characters don't mean shit. Only the Saiyans.
Dragon ball is why we respect dbz but the storyline is trash period soon as they start wishing ppl back it was over 😂😂😂
I already liked this arc honestly but this vid just made me think of it in a different and better way
I can't wait for the rest of the grahnola arc is finished. It seems like it's going to be pretty good, might even see frieza
There's no way we won't see Frieza. Grahnola's whole purpose is to kill him, so it wouldn't even make sense for Frieza to not show up at some point.
@@gianni3611 That's why I said we might see him, but the author could just tease us and we don't see frieza till the next arc and grahnola somehow doesn't find him
We will see freiza. I’m just interested to see his reaction to vegeta and ESPECIALLY GOKU.
@@mariomaster4568 Same. I think it would be cool if Goku and Vegeta trained Grahnola to fight Frieza. Maybe Goku and Vegeta can train Grahnola AND Broly at the same time since Grahnola is a fast learner like Broly and Goku promised at the end of the Broly movie that he would train Broly.
I loved the Moro arc. Reading the whole arc after it finished was much better experience then waiting month to month.
Real Question Here: _"Can Moro Eat A Tin Can?"_
@Kyle Haefele Get lost, you're dreaming. Moro is wooden barrel level, no more, no less.
Well it was stated that he is able to eat at least 43 cents in pennies
Yo
Yes Yes he can
@@cavvaldiv5536 stop lowballing I bet you’re another causal who doesn’t pay attention to the deep layers we could all see that he was suppressing his power out of the sheer kindness of his heart, Moro is oil drum WITH THE LID ON at least
it always gets me sad when people know Stan Lee but forget about Jack Kirby 😔
Those are people who aren't looking. Seriously Jack Kirby is really important, look at any appearance of The One above all, he has Kirby's face. His home is based of Jack Kirby's old home on Long Island. Dude is as important to Marvel and comics as a whole as Stan was if not more
I agree with both of you, although I believe that Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko and Stan Lee are each as important as each other, without those three Marvel would not be here today.
@@custommediacreations u got a point
@@indianpotatofarmer6508 thank you, I apologise if I sounded rude.
@@custommediacreations no prob Man U made a good point and I didn’t think u were rude
Bravo Seth. Incredible work. Looking forward to see more in the future!
Man your final words in this video gaved me real chills man...great work!
That is actually a new way for me to see this. The only problem for me is that Moro is a bit too plain but the fight is actually really interesting.
Thank you for the analysis.
We need a similar video with the granolah arc
I feel like whis wants goku to realise his own strength instead of just relying on others strength in the latest chap we clearly see whis telling goku to develop his own style to fight with (can you make a video about that )
Nah he’ll still rely on others. That’s one of db’s biggest themes. But this is uncharted territory for goku. In fact, he’s the only mortal to actually approach angel territory. So He’s basically looking for some kinda “how to guide” from whis but he’s telling that he needs to continue to use his own fighting style. It’s the only reason he got this far in the first place.
@@leultrainstinct406 I believe that what Whis, and by extension, Toyo are trying to say, is Goku needs to stop taking from his master's, and to create something of his own. Basically pushing him towards becoming a mentor of some sorts, for his inevitable teaching of Uub.
@@PBJavon that’s a good point goku doesn’t have many original moves lol. Even his signature move was from roshi. But at the same time, that’s the point. Goku would’ve never gotten to where he’s at if it weren’t for the people around him . So i think it’s more so that ui is the pinnacle of the things goku learned from past masters, and his own fighting experience. Now that he’s at this pinnacle, instead of copying techniques from others, he needs to develop his own. He’s essentially at a point where he’s his own master. As a master, he needs to continue to develop his own fighting style to pass on to the next generation aka uub. So thanks to everyone who helped him along the way with their knowledge, he became a master. But as a master, he needs to focus on developing his own style. And one day, he’ll have his own signature move and teachings to pass on to the next generation.
Except he doesn't heavily rely on others. He only does it when it's necessary. Super writers just doesnt know where to take Gokus character. Before it's "Goku wants to reach new levels on his own" thanks to Battle of Gods, now hes relying on others too much? The same guy who didn't want to rely on fusion against a Buu or the Dragonballs dealing with Dr Gero?
@@UnifiedEntity you realise that Goku does not have a unique technique to the day right ? Lol 😅
You took the bad taste of this arc's ending out of my stomach. Thank you for sharing your view on this topic. Hopefully, the current arc stays consistent with Goku's character progression.
What character progression
Gokus character is ruined
Loved this man! Enough of unnecessary "DBS is trash" videos
I just subbed to your channel, and now I see you in many places!
But dbs is still trash tho
Beacuse it is
I love all dragonball but DBS moro arc turned into pure blasphemous garbage which should be burned with fire and brimstone
@@ramon4184 lol not at all.
Great analysis,wouldn’t have said it better myself.
This video was beautiful. Seth has ascended yet again!! 🤯🤯🤯
the ending to your video is just poetic i couldn't have thought of it that way, and now ill live by it
ikr
"I can talk about Vegeta in an=" YEEEEEES. All things Vegeta please.
I just finished the arc so this is perfect
I'm just hoping this next arc is even more promising. Love how Super, in general, is handling world building.
@@jackdamenace13 facts
What did you think about it when you just finished it?
enjoyed it very much. people just nitpick so much.
@Kaleb Cotton both great arcs
Great observations looking at the story in full. Db fans aren't used to digging deeper or context clues and take things face value it's good to have things help the fans appreciate the Arch's and series more. Great video and we need that Vegeta video
@Kenley Bazile 😂 ur opinion but ok. Somethings take a different approach.
I just love how you called Moro a c u next Tuesday and just casually went right passed it, I agree whole heartedly and replayed that part 10 times just now 😂
Honestly this would be a great introduction to Goku and others being a Time Patroller protecting the time itself finding his answer as you described.
I said this on Twitter.
Moro is literally “what if dragon ball z was the GOAT”
Yooo that was good. I Like This comment:)
The Dragonball universe is so inspirational there’s so many life lessons you cn learn by dissecting the content to the smallest example. This is more than just an anime it gives a lot of people hope and excitement with all the evil shit going on in our real world
Very Great video. This shines a whole new light on the arc for me.
Wow this is a very deep video. After watching this video I now see the whole Moro Arc in a much different light. I wonder what Geekdom101's opinion would be on this video.
Nice ass video,very informative and does a nice job breaking it all down. Definitely shows that dragon isn't all muscles,grunts and energy beams
By god that was a great analysis
Wow that’s a pretty deep and cool way to view this arch. Personally I was fan of it already but that made it even more symbolic and love it more now
i had absolutely no issues with this arc and now I can explain why thanks to this video.
So much care, thought and time was put into this video, it’s hard not to appreciate. This might be your best video yet Seth!
As a martial artist, we yell to concentrate our power before a strike or technique
Can we get a vegeta appreciation video? Like a vid about his feats stats and stuff we took for granted or missed? Please Seth!
Shit... You put it to words. You somehow made me love this arc even more than I already did.
Same
One of the greatest arcs in db history imo.
Micah Adeyemo nice joke
@@dinogt8477 who said I was joking lol. It really is. Only arcs above it are saiyan, frieza, and the top(anime). Its on par with cell. Cell would be higher, but it had a pretty big plot hole.
@@leultrainstinct406 I agree although i might put the ToP, Cell, and Moro arcs all on the same pedestal
This is a great video🔥
"The greatest way to defeat an enemy, is to make them your friend." -Sensei Wu
I don’t even read the manga but this was a beautiful video Seth I took so many lessons from this, thank you
Also, in real life, some martial artists, of certain disciplines, will let out a shout before a fight, meant to align their body and spirit, or something- of course, they aren’t mad
In a layman's terms, they're basically hyping themselves up and building up adrenaline.
I mean you can say this but Goku literally didn't do this throughout his entire time in the Tournament of Power in Ultra Instinct I mean I don't care but still it's not something you have to do it's something you choose to do.
@@AverageGamerXP Think about it. Goku and pretty much all the other Dragon Ball Characters yell when they charge their energy, or charge at someone. It's their habit, or their Instinct. Just like how Goku still yells "Kamehame-Ha!!!" whenever he does it. He's not angry (half the time).
@@DorienTheHeroOfTheArts Yeah but you don't have to say the words it's not a requirement to initiate the move. Gohan didn't even need two hands to initiate the kamehameha let alone say the words. My argument isn't if Goku was angry my argument it's not a requirement to yell when you initiate a power up sequence. I found it cooler when Goku said less in Ultra Instinct it gave off a more serious tone from him, but who actually cares weather he talks are not it's not that serious.
@@AverageGamerXP Yeah, true. It's just like exhaling when you throw a punch, or like Seth said, yelling when lifting weights or moving a couch. But, yeah you're right. It really isn't that serious😁
Great analysis and this is also why I liked this arc so much. Moro's entire arc is meant to narratively set Goku and Vegeta's character arcs to be updated.
Narratively, the ToP arc served to show that Goku's desire to fight stronger opponents regardless of the consequences and his unwavering belief that he and his allies will pull through (Either through fighting or that he could somehow say, convince his friend Zeno that he and the others not be erased) were potentially a detriment to the universe and that Goku himself, it's savior, could also be the cause of it being destroyed if his values weren't adjusted in some way to value protecting the universe more.
This entire arc is set up to go about resolving that issue, giving Goku and Vegeta newer purposes in defending something, rather than just fighting for the sake of fighting. Vegeta had shades of this already starting during the Cell Games, but it's finally expanded beyond his family in Moro's arc. Goku meanwhile had no such sort of desire beyond his immediate friends and family, and this arc was meant to help give him that sense of justice and allow him to develop more.
Narratively this arc wouldn't have worked if it was before ToP in my opinion. it's actually specifically because of the ToP that this works as well as it does.
Goku finally became a “hero”
All thanks to merus. His character development in this arc was severely underrated
@@leultrainstinct406 facts
@@leultrainstinct406 both the developments were underrated. Goku learns he must not be selfish and fight fie himself while merus showed that even those who must stay neutral can lean to one side or the other
@@Not_Claptrap I wish merus was in the moro arc more, I wouldn't mind some filler episodes with him in the anime to expand on his relation to goku.
@@jantheking7028 YES YES YES. If the anime comes back any time soon then it will catch up to the manga pretty quickly. I feel like a good way to slow that down is show more of goku and merus training to build a better relationship between merus and goku (plus merus and the viewer)
I keep coming back to this review because it's SO much better than Totally Not Mark's, he clearly didn't understand the bigger picture and thought the villain references were lazy. I'm glad people like you exist for commentary to provide a more clearer picture and how a "simple story" can have a deeper meaning when viewed properly.
Moro really pulled every villain😭😭😭😭😭Still an amazing arc that most people didn’t realize over 2 years
Wouldn't call it amazing.
For db standards it's a ok arc
@@jobsidian4219 yeah
@@jobsidian4219 Not really, the arc was great in terms of DB standards and it was the best arc since the cell saga in my opinion. The villain was meh because his personality wasn't all that, but the arc itself was great because it had extra lore, new concepts (Grand kai taking over buu), delved deeper into how the angels work, and even provided very good moments for side characters. Yamcha actually won a battle in this arc for the first time since the original DB lol. The artwork was good and very detailed, especially towards the end.
am not really a fan of cell saga.
It didn't really explain origin like what race is he where did he come from, why is fighting the gods in the first place?
Yeah The arc had it's good moments like piccolo and gohan vs 73 and vegeta character development (at least in the beginning). Moro henchmen didn't really look or feel that intimidating to me. I feel that moro should still rely more on his magic and smarts instead acting more like a meathead chad.
Plus moro is base cell when he not in his first form he my least favorite DBZ era villain
(In my opinion)
I didn’t fully read this arc but it sounds pretty epic. I like that Goku is evolving from more of self centered character with questionable morality to an actual legit hero.
Glad Seth Make this video
I am tired to see some people hating DBS again & again not with many solid reasons yes
I hope that will clear some misunderstanding
Exactly DBS Is Awesome People That Hate Super Are Haters And Some Toxic GT Fanboys
Its a trend to hate on super, so people who read the manga do it thinking its bad, so of course if you start reading something like that, everything you read will be bad for you.
In my case i have enjoyed the TOP(anime) and this arc a lot, as much as db and dbz and after watching seth videos i realize some things that i didnt before from this two arcs and made me like them even more.
@@XJSPlays02 Not true, you can't just assume everyone who dislikes DBS is a DBGT fan. A lot of DBGT fans hate DBS, but many of them like it.
@@shaolinfantastic9118 Example:me
Aw man this explanation made the moro arc that much better for me