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The tubes seems to be one area where these players should go, to getting different sound signatures out of them. Hi-Res was not the area they should have concentrated but I think Sony wanted to sell us all our CD's again, as they did from LP to cassette to CD. I think they can work on improving noise, driving power and battery life as well.
And I still missed some stuff 🥵 Forgot to mention that you can transfer music to the device over WiFi (and do firmware updates), which is a bit clunky but useful when a Micro SD card reader isn't handy.
@@SuperReview you forgot to mention the MOST important issue my friend...the very reason that you are here, since no body cares about your taste in design...MUSIC QUALITY...ok.
The op amps and the LPF really have way more to do with the sound than the dacs used. I found quite a bit of difference between the 3.5 out and the 4.4 solid state. I found all the modes on the warmish side and smoothed over with the 3.5 being the closest to neutral. The tube sound is very euphoric though and very smooth, although as he said UL mode is a hybrid of SS and tubes so it has very forward higher mids and sounds like it has a bump in the lower treble to give some clarity. It's a great unit to listen to and chill out with, it's not super resolving and pretty much all files sound good on it.
The power doubling on the balanced output sounds about right. It is the way that amps generally work in balanced vs single-ended config for a given power supply. But also understand that doubling the output only increases the audio by just 3 db. That's it. But it may make a difference to a given set of headphones.
Do you still use the N3Pro regularly? Has it held up against more recent competition sonically? I’m looking for something warmer than most DAPs. Sold my AP80 Pro and returned the Hiby RS2 for being too treble harsh.
@@SuperReview Yeah, I guess it's too flimsy and not really built for fiddling longterm. Volume could be adjusted though through Hiby Link (on your phone) and through the N3 Pro's screen (scrolling/tapping the volume up and down) once you engaged that full paged volume mode. Doing that gets annoying since the screen unlock is also linked on that volume rocker and it's either you turn off the screen if you're supposed to fiddle with volume or you wont even get to turn on the screen if it does lock. I guess I'll see more once they fix it in about March or so. 😂 The WiFi option is also bothersome since it's only used for updating the OS. Also, the Bluetooth mode sounds crappy on a wireless IEM which is weird since my phone sounds better on Bluetooth IEMs.
I prefer to have a bigger screen in this DAP as it made things easier to scroll long lists of songs. Anyway amazing review as usual. Comprehensive information. Keep up the good work!
@@SuperReview what do you think about LG V30? Is the sound quality from this DAP is noticably better than the LG's Quad DAC like the V30? Thank you very much! 😀
I've not owned a V30 so can't say. Differences between DACs is generally very very minor in my opinion, so if you're looking to go from one to the other purely for objective audio improvements, I would lower expectations.
I am wondering whether it acts as a wireless receiver (Airplay, DLNA). Hiby r3 pro can do so actually, so I really hope this one does! Thanks for the review btw.
Hi... I am thinking of buying a headphone amp for sundara.. But i think buying cayin n 3pro can do justice to sundara.. In terms of output. Will it b able to drive sundara well.. Your suggestion is very valuable to me.
Yeah...ive just bought the Cayin N3 pro...then watched this review and read the comments...im probally going to send back right away.....i have the the hiby R5 and the cayin N3 pro seems like a downgrade * edit the cayin n3 pro has plenty of power for iems..it pairs very well with the KZ DQ6 ..55/100 steps on low gain on 24ohm load,113db sensitivity
@@SuperReview it might be ok i will see what the output power is like on IEMs in solid state, 250 mw should be enough, but every review i watch highlights the player has not alot of power, im not sure what the single ended output is on the hiby R5 i cannot find any info in the user manuals or online, i know its ultra powerful in balanced, well both the cayin and hiby are
Efficiency of the (1) system processor, (2) DAC, and (3) amplification. Generally, more powerful amp = less efficient, even when running at lower volumes.
You are correct -- Bluetooth relies on the DAC and amp in the headphone, and most players will get better battery life over Bluetooth vs. using on-board systems. Cayin doesn't report battery life on Bluetooth and I didn't test it personally.
I get that this was a live stream but I'd appreciate if when uploading to TH-cam u could trim out useless bits and in a higher frame rate, anyways good work :)
hey man, i am really confused right now. How is the battery life so short on these? A Ipod can play music for 21h straight! I am currently thinking on either getting the fiio m9 or the sony nw-a105. How´d you compare those two? Battery life?? I am mostly listening through bluetooth with my momentum wireless 3 over ear headphones... Thank you so much, you seem very credible and honest;)
I use the Cayin more than the R2. R2 is pretty solid, but doesn't have a standout feature, while the Cayin feels kinda special even if I don't use the tube all the time.
@@SuperReview Thank you for the reply. I know you said time and again that describing dap sound quality is a bit difficult but i am afraid i have to ask: balanced out vs balanced out, which sounds better?
Hi. I currently use an iFi Hip DAC attached to an iPhone or an iPad... How does that DAC compare to the Cayin N3Pro? The iFi's sound is great, but something more mobile and less clunky would be nice, if the sound was as good or better. Thanks.
I think you'd be hard pressed to hear any difference between the hip-dac and the N3Pro on its solid state amp. The hip-dac might have a slightly relaxed upper midrange in comparison, but in terms of quality, resolution, etc., they're both great.
Gotcha. I've only tried it with Sundara, which the Cayin powers well. The tube output is the weakest output power of the N3Pro, but it's most powerful at lower impedances (vs. some OTL amps that have lowest power at low impedances). I believe N3Pro is not OTL.
Nice Content. Recently Ive become audiophile, Looking forward to see more content, Can you suggest some TH-camrs that worth watching like similar to you?
The tonality of the solid state is good but the sound from the tube is miehhhhh.... Slow UI.... Cannot bring myself to buy it. So if you want to buy it for the tube experience.... i suggest you audition it first before buying.... my thoughts.... not great and has a weird tonality.
I never used it, but the second 3.5mm on this device is an input -- ostensibly you could use the N3Pro as an amplifier for some other source. EDIT: Correction. The second 3.5mm port on this is a line-out, which bypasses some of the internal amplification to connect to an external amp. Not something I'd use.
Haven't tried that, but I would expect the battery needs a minimum level of charge before it'll turn on. And I expect your MacBook will be able to charge it faster than the N3Pro drains itself, but I haven't tested.
I'm pretty sure it's an LED light to exaggerate the effect. I have another DAP with a similar tube, but without the LED trick, and you CAN still see the glowing tube, just not nearly as obviously.
Ii heard that tubes have a limited lifetime...i know its sound is very great but i wouldnt pay that much money for something which gets exhausted or broken earlier than the battery....;-)
@@SuperReview Is there anything written in the specs how many hours the tubes have as lifetime? I know in the exchangable amp 9 with tubes of ibasso its normally specified with 30 000 hours...thats more than enough io assume...;-)
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Can you please review KZ DQ6
The tubes seems to be one area where these players should go, to getting different sound signatures out of them. Hi-Res was not the area they should have concentrated but I think Sony wanted to sell us all our CD's again, as they did from LP to cassette to CD. I think they can work on improving noise, driving power and battery life as well.
You really dig deeper in every review you make. That’s a lot of work. Thanks
And I still missed some stuff 🥵 Forgot to mention that you can transfer music to the device over WiFi (and do firmware updates), which is a bit clunky but useful when a Micro SD card reader isn't handy.
@@SuperReview you forgot to mention the MOST important issue my friend...the very reason that you are here, since no body cares about your taste in design...MUSIC QUALITY...ok.
The op amps and the LPF really have way more to do with the sound than the dacs used. I found quite a bit of difference between the 3.5 out and the 4.4 solid state. I found all the modes on the warmish side and smoothed over with the 3.5 being the closest to neutral.
The tube sound is very euphoric though and very smooth, although as he said UL mode is a hybrid of SS and tubes so it has very forward higher mids and sounds like it has a bump in the lower treble to give some clarity. It's a great unit to listen to and chill out with, it's not super resolving and pretty much all files sound good on it.
Really like the form factor of this and previous n3! Just thought its a little thick, i very much like the screen ratio. This was quite a hit 👌
28:57 On the couch, feet up & chill’n, that’s my favourite headphone setting 👍🏼
Quite a comprehensive video that might have pushed me over the fence
10 rotations total to deafen myself instead of sliding it into my pocket? Why was that a complaint
First time I watch your reviews... Great job. Thorough, yet simple and straightforward. Well done! Just subscribed!
🤙
The power doubling on the balanced output sounds about right. It is the way that amps generally work in balanced vs single-ended config for a given power supply. But also understand that doubling the output only increases the audio by just 3 db. That's it. But it may make a difference to a given set of headphones.
Do you still use the N3Pro regularly? Has it held up against more recent competition sonically? I’m looking for something warmer than most DAPs. Sold my AP80 Pro and returned the Hiby RS2 for being too treble harsh.
I don't use it much lately, no, I'm spoiled by Android players. Nothing to do with the sound, N3Pro sounds good.
True enough I broke my volume rocker in about 2 months of use. Sent it back to Cayin and they said it will take 3 months or more to get it back. 🤦♂️😑
Btw, to get to the now playing just tap the home (O) button twice while a song is playing. 😅
Yeah, I had no idea that's a button until someone else (I think Antdroid) found it out and told me. Bummer about the knob, though! What happened?
@@SuperReview Yeah, I guess it's too flimsy and not really built for fiddling longterm. Volume could be adjusted though through Hiby Link (on your phone) and through the N3 Pro's screen (scrolling/tapping the volume up and down) once you engaged that full paged volume mode. Doing that gets annoying since the screen unlock is also linked on that volume rocker and it's either you turn off the screen if you're supposed to fiddle with volume or you wont even get to turn on the screen if it does lock. I guess I'll see more once they fix it in about March or so. 😂
The WiFi option is also bothersome since it's only used for updating the OS. Also, the Bluetooth mode sounds crappy on a wireless IEM which is weird since my phone sounds better on Bluetooth IEMs.
That's surprising. I'll be honest, I didn't use the Bluetooth once.
Another great and super nice review.,,, Thank you for this
I prefer to have a bigger screen in this DAP as it made things easier to scroll long lists of songs. Anyway amazing review as usual. Comprehensive information. Keep up the good work!
What's your go-to DAP? Low key, my Xperia 10 is a pretty good transport for the tall screen. Just needs playback buttons.
@@SuperReview what do you think about LG V30? Is the sound quality from this DAP is noticably better than the LG's Quad DAC like the V30? Thank you very much! 😀
I've not owned a V30 so can't say. Differences between DACs is generally very very minor in my opinion, so if you're looking to go from one to the other purely for objective audio improvements, I would lower expectations.
@@SuperReview thanks for the suggestion 👍
I am wondering whether it acts as a wireless receiver (Airplay, DLNA). Hiby r3 pro can do so actually, so I really hope this one does! Thanks for the review btw.
Loved the new innovation of tube, but I would have loved a bigger display!!
Amazing video like always!!
I'd be OK with a larger screen and moving the tube window to the back :D
@@SuperReview completely my point!!
Hi... I am thinking of buying a headphone amp for sundara.. But i think buying cayin n 3pro can do justice to sundara.. In terms of output. Will it b able to drive sundara well.. Your suggestion is very valuable to me.
Yes, no problem with Sundara. Especially if you get a balanced cable for Sundara.
Is screen protector applied out of the box?
Yeah...ive just bought the Cayin N3 pro...then watched this review and read the comments...im probally going to send back right away.....i have the the hiby R5 and the cayin N3 pro seems like a downgrade * edit the cayin n3 pro has plenty of power for iems..it pairs very well with the KZ DQ6 ..55/100 steps on low gain on 24ohm load,113db sensitivity
In what way? I have a Hiby R5s, I go between that and the N3pro depending on mood.
@@SuperReview it might be ok i will see what the output power is like on IEMs in solid state, 250 mw should be enough, but every review i watch highlights the player has not alot of power, im not sure what the single ended output is on the hiby R5 i cannot find any info in the user manuals or online, i know its ultra powerful in balanced, well both the cayin and hiby are
@@SuperReview i have the cowon plenue D2 as well, thats a great little player, had it a couple of years now
The D2 is pretty charming.
Superb
wonder how a ipod (850mah) can play 21h music and a sony nw-a105 (1200 i think) only 10h. Where is that difference coming from??
Efficiency of the (1) system processor, (2) DAC, and (3) amplification. Generally, more powerful amp = less efficient, even when running at lower volumes.
@@SuperReview Is that also active when running with bluetooth? Taught DAC and amplifier is build into the bluetooth headphones
You are correct -- Bluetooth relies on the DAC and amp in the headphone, and most players will get better battery life over Bluetooth vs. using on-board systems. Cayin doesn't report battery life on Bluetooth and I didn't test it personally.
Timestamps when he’s reviewing the sound quality?
Added.
@@SuperReview thank u so much!
I get that this was a live stream but I'd appreciate if when uploading to TH-cam u could trim out useless bits and in a higher frame rate, anyways good work :)
I trim out the downtime afterward, but takes TH-cam a while to process.
Hi Mark, thanks for the video. Have you tried this DAP with the FD5 and the SA6, if yes, do you think it matches well with these IEMs?
I gotta be honest, I'm not much of a matching sources to headphones/earphones kinda guy.
Super* Review
Thanks anyway :-)
hey man,
i am really confused right now. How is the battery life so short on these? A Ipod can play music for 21h straight!
I am currently thinking on either getting the fiio m9 or the sony nw-a105.
How´d you compare those two? Battery life?? I am mostly listening through bluetooth with my momentum wireless 3 over ear headphones...
Thank you so much, you seem very credible and honest;)
Battery life on the Sony A105 is poor compared to FiiO M9.
Well usually iPods have lower power more efficient amps and dacs compared to the rest.
It would be interesting to hear your opinion on the new TempoTec V6. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year from Ukraine! 🇺🇦
Thanks for this review. Device sucks if UX sucks. I'll just buy a proper tube amp.
This UX is barebones and doesn't annoy me, which is more than I can say for some others.
This or Cowon Plenue R2?
I use the Cayin more than the R2. R2 is pretty solid, but doesn't have a standout feature, while the Cayin feels kinda special even if I don't use the tube all the time.
@@SuperReview Thank you for the reply. I know you said time and again that describing dap sound quality is a bit difficult but i am afraid i have to ask: balanced out vs balanced out, which sounds better?
I barely used balanced on either. Not much to describe.
Have you used M3X from Shanling? Which one shouild I go for? I'm pretty much newbies in dap world.
I haven't used it, no.
Hi. I currently use an iFi Hip DAC attached to an iPhone or an iPad... How does that DAC compare to the Cayin N3Pro? The iFi's sound is great, but something more mobile and less clunky would be nice, if the sound was as good or better. Thanks.
I think you'd be hard pressed to hear any difference between the hip-dac and the N3Pro on its solid state amp. The hip-dac might have a slightly relaxed upper midrange in comparison, but in terms of quality, resolution, etc., they're both great.
@@SuperReview Cool. Thanks for the reply. I'm intrigued by the tube amp, but the iFi is pretty darn nice for my needs at the moment.
Would this work well with planar magnetic headphones?
Sure, why not?
Tube amps and planars are notoriously unfriendly with traditional tube amps.
Gotcha. I've only tried it with Sundara, which the Cayin powers well. The tube output is the weakest output power of the N3Pro, but it's most powerful at lower impedances (vs. some OTL amps that have lowest power at low impedances). I believe N3Pro is not OTL.
Off-topic Question, a105 or zx300(roughly same price)? Whats your main dap/one you pick up the most?
A105 for me, I don't used balanced cables often.
Nice Content. Recently Ive become audiophile,
Looking forward to see more content,
Can you suggest some TH-camrs that worth watching like similar to you?
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@@SuperReview wow thats very kind of you. Thanks a lot.
Bro can u give me the day&dad ranking?
The tonality of the solid state is good but the sound from the tube is miehhhhh.... Slow UI.... Cannot bring myself to buy it. So if you want to buy it for the tube experience.... i suggest you audition it first before buying.... my thoughts.... not great and has a weird tonality.
Any other suggestions for portable tubes? I've also got a GAD H1 that's got some tubiness with less change to the FR.
@@SuperReview little bear b4x, zishan ad3, oriolus ba300s
What's the point of having two 3,5 mm ports instead of one for ex in Fiio m6?
I never used it, but the second 3.5mm on this device is an input -- ostensibly you could use the N3Pro as an amplifier for some other source.
EDIT: Correction. The second 3.5mm port on this is a line-out, which bypasses some of the internal amplification to connect to an external amp. Not something I'd use.
Where can I buy this? In their website I don’t see any option to buy.
Musicteck has it: shop.musicteck.com/products/cayin-n3pro-fully-balanced-dual-timbre-portable-digital-audio-player
what do you think of shanling m3x ? It also cost about $230.
I haven't tried it. Looks pretty nice, though kinda old version of Android. I wonder if it has Play store.
"Relaxed" "Laid back"
Why not just, you know, measure it
Well I've got a tape measure and a kitchen scale, what would you like to know?
Can it power up by USB bus power when the battery is dead? I mean I am wondering if I can you just USB without draining battery power with macbook.
Haven't tried that, but I would expect the battery needs a minimum level of charge before it'll turn on. And I expect your MacBook will be able to charge it faster than the N3Pro drains itself, but I haven't tested.
@@SuperReview Cool! Thank you!
Can you EQ using neutron player on hi res audio files?
I don't use EQ generally, and this player doesn't run Neutron.
Can you make a review on the thx panda or the sennheiser momentum 3
I am working on Panda review. Haven't heard the Momentum 3.
@@SuperReview oh okay! People say the momentum 3 sound “good” for Bluetooth over the ears, but the main question is how they sound to you😅
who knows this is a real tube or just a led or a tube animation,
i have the mcintosh ma12000 with real tubes see my videos,
great video btw
I'm pretty sure it's an LED light to exaggerate the effect. I have another DAP with a similar tube, but without the LED trick, and you CAN still see the glowing tube, just not nearly as obviously.
Hey, do you have a dedicated cameraman?
Nope, just an Elgato Stream Deck.
Ii heard that tubes have a limited lifetime...i know its sound is very great but i wouldnt pay that much money for something which gets exhausted or broken earlier than the battery....;-)
We'll see if it's a problem, but I'm personally not concerned about it.
@@SuperReview Is there anything written in the specs how many hours the tubes have as lifetime? I know in the exchangable amp 9 with tubes of ibasso its normally specified with 30 000 hours...thats more than enough io assume...;-)
Haven't seen anything like that, but I also have looked. Might find it here: en.cayin.cn/download/?itemid=132
ahhh no ol spin this time
Never be the same again...
I'm still different.