I've owned 4 kit cars and built 2 from scratch; the PRO's - fabulous exhilarating driving and a great hobby, the CON's - I could have been about £40k richer if I'd taken up knitting instead!
Haha!I think the way we are, guys like all of us would just find ways of making even knitting expensive haha! What kits have you had and has been your favourite kit car out of the four Malcolm?
1st was a Sylva Striker which I built with a 1360 8000 rpm race XFlow engine but I had to replace the cam because it was too wild for the road. 2nd I built a Locost with the personal involvement of Mr Champion himself, this ran a 1700 Xflow 3rd Was a newly built Quantum Xtreme which ran a 2.1 Pinto running around 170hp 4th Was another pre-built Xtreme and I spent a fortune on a bespoke Zetec turbo installation which produced 293hp but I had to reduce the boost as it kept breaking gearboxes. Overall I would say the Pinto powered Quantum was best as it had plenty of oomph even on the circuit and was comfy as I am 6'4" tall. I'm a classic Mercedes man these days although I still dream of the Volvo T5 engine that I would have like to have dropped in the Quantum!
It's good to hear the down sides, or reality, of kit cars with bike/car engines. Thank you for taking the time to share you experience, gives me better clarity on which to go for.
Cheers Doug! Kit cars are a difficult one for me to get my head around. They are equally amazing and impractical which makes them difficult to love, but the driving experience and cost for utterly bonkers performance make them so appealing. I wouldn't have one as a sole track car any more, I am lucky in having a more practical toy to use along side the odd day in the MK these days. All made possible with how cheap these kit cars are to keep on a monthly basis.
Thanks for replying. Yeah, I guess that's something we will find out very quickly on its first track day at Castle Coombe 3rd July. We've put a Gpz900r sump on it, which does away with the big pot. Then added a second pressure relief valve. Lines linked to a much larger GSXF750 oil cooler. Topped the oil to the top of sight glass. Currently holding 3.7 litres in total. Added a oil pressure and oil temperature gauge to.
As said on FB bud, thanks so much for the support. Really do appreciate it 👍. Curborough Chequered Flag day sounds like a win although that place scares me these days after my little off haha!
Just so low you become invisible to so many. I remember driving in my DC2 Integra and a friend in his Westfield... When he was along side I couldn't see him as he was lower that the door line!
Thanks Tommis! Never easy or natural for me to just sit and talk to a camera but I had a chunk of stuff I wanted to put out there I wish I had known before buying one!
Caterham CSR owner here. Well done. Great vid! Sevens are great fun. To fellow mortals I'd give the advice to drive one once you've past the novice driver level. Chances are you'll get overconfident and crash. Of course there are different/no rules for racing gods who feel they are born in the wrong body, who feel they should have had four wheels at birth.
I appreciate your honesty with "They are easy to work on, which is good because they fall apart" followed by a video of your wing disappearing behind you. That bit of insight is not something most people consider about when owning a track car.
I had a honda blackbird engined Westfield. On tracks it was the most amazing driving experience ever. Great for learning suspension setup on to as you could feel exactly what was going on. But as you say it became a competition/track car not a Sunday drive out or touring car...
Great video mate... good to hear someone with experience across both types of engine and not just some internet warrior banging on. I've built 4 bike engined cars, all Westfields (2 Fireblades, a Blackbird and converted a Pinto engined one to ZX12-R), and I currently run a Megabusa that I bought factory built. I agree with everything you said about usability with regards to the car engined ones but these types of car are there to make you feel alive, and everything you said about lightweight, the sequential 'box, even no windscreens, it just ramps up the adrenalin and gives you the biggest kick... it's the only thing keeping me away from bikes themselves. The 'blade is the best engine overall; you can't beat the 'busa for muscle but, on balance (power, weight, complexity, usability), the Fireblade is king. Drive safe mate!
Thanks loads mate! Sounds like you have a BEC addiction haha!! Fantastic to know you rate the Fireblades highly! I'd always wondered if they just didn't cut it in a world full of Busa kits!! As said in the vid, I have the car really aggressively geared so I stand a chance against them!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS We ran a 3.91 diff on a live axled car and it was ace... was only geared for 116mph (IIRC🤔)... but it'd get to 100 in 8.6 secs, so not too shabby... and so light. It was 447kg with a full tank of fuel... Anyway, have fun mate! Might see you about 😎👍🏻
Thanks loads mate! I try my best haha! Unfortunately the track days I had planned in it this year have all been canned as a small issue has turned into a bigger engine rebuild :(.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Hi mate...No it's good advice.. I found the video interesting for me because I drive a Seven replica called a Kaipan... I live in the Czech Republic and wanted a Caterham but.... They're too expensive and difficult to register here with the Czechs having more draconian rules than even the Germans. The Kaipan has a 1.8 turbo from the VAG group fitted. It's got about 200 hp with the previous builder/owner doing a remap. At first I found it difficult to drive with the boost coming sometimes mid corner but it's amazing how we adapt to power. I've owned loads of interesting stuff from Lotuses to Porsche 911 through M series BMWs etc etc. But this car I really love. Drive safe mate. I like your channel.Mick
Great video. Not sure I agree with everything said but I guess to some extent it depends on the type of kit car, engine and drivetrain setup. For example many are versions of the infamous Seven whereas mine is a mid-engined exoskeletal car with a GSX-R1000, no clonks or knocks other than selecting 1st gear to pull away from standstill. I do have a flatshifter though which is just brilliant I have to say. My car is just epic on track or road though with the engine and intakes just behind my left ear it is somewhat loud! Ear plugs and/or helmets are a must but cost very little. One thing is for sure, love 'em or hate 'em, BECs are addictive! Great video mate, look forward to seeing more.
Fantastic! There certainly isn't much like the experience of these BECs for the money is there! I get what you mean re only clunks being from the prop/gear engagement in first but I think the majority of the difference for me was going from an car engine on big rubber engine mounts to a bike engine solidly mounted to the chassis... you feel everything haha! Thanks Steve, I am itching for some more seat time in it at the mo!
Totally understand everything you’re saying, bike engined cars are in a world of their own. 👍🏼 I built a Stuart Taylor LocoBlade with a Honda Fireblade engine back in 2002 and my only regret was not being able to take it on the IOM TT circuit to check the size of my marbles! 😂
Thanks Bill! Very difficult to compare to much else aren't they! Good and bad hahaa! Fantastic! I'd LOVE to get over to IOM TT in it one day too! Be a nice little pilgrimage to do in memory of my friend who's engine it was. I know he always wanted to go.
I rode a GSXR1100 with a 1260 bore, ignition advancer, laser race exhaust and tuned engine with lighter internals, mounted in a Spondon frame around the IOM. I found my nuts were far, far smaller than I thought!
This is the way to run these cars, on the track. In my Westfield on the road it just triggers other drivers left right and centre, just the fact that it exists, that it's small, it's loud, etc, can't really drive it on the roads anymore without at least one other driver trying to kill you. So yes, do the track days, have fun with it around like minded people.
Sad but totally true. Driving standards are only getting worse imho too and the road conditions are shocking at the moment. I'd always love a motorbike but simply feel as if I cant for the same reasons.
Brilliant! Ooo 1k limit! That’s ace! We did a little mx5 NB 2k track car build (including buying car) and it was some of the most fun days we’ve ever had in cars! Something so great about keeping things humble, honest and enjoyable!
Came across this video by accident. Really enjoyed your relaxed presenting style and interesting content. Your car looks like a total weapon, found myself thinking what I could sell so that I could get a car like yours. Subscribed 👍
Thanks for the kind words Phil! Haha brilliant! They are a strange one, can often feel like a chore to own but the good days are REALLY good! Unfortunately my engine developed a nasty little knock which turned out to be a broken crank! So a very expensive rebuild due :(. I've been focussing on getting my little mx5 turbo race car finished instead to keep me sane... th-cam.com/video/6gkv8PSY0A8/w-d-xo.html
When you mentioned vibration I thought of the Mazda rotary. They're light, extremely high power to weight ratio, and they don't vibrate the same way so are possibly easier on the chassis.
I agree with all your points as I have a Busa powered one, this winter I am adding a full cage just for the safety points you mention as currently it only has a rear hoop. While doing the work I found the front lower wishbone mounts peeling away also. Great Video maybe meet you at a track one day.
Ahh fantastic. The busas sure have some damn pace! It's incredible how many of us have the same issues with chassis welds/points pealing away, atleast a pretty easy fix especially when you add in the extra triangulation plates to give it more strength. See you on track in 2019 🙌🙌
Watched that vid last night haha! Looks bloody capable! First corner and the chincane look eventful, shame Knockhill is so far away from us. Last time I was there was 10years ago!
I had a Bec in 2009 and loved it. Completely agree on checking everything including welds. I had the front right side snap while pushing it. I went back to bikes but as an ultimate 4 wheel thrill these are it I reckon
Interesting video, and something I've wondered about. I haven't actually driven any kit cars, but a Fireblade is one of the most refined bikes you can buy.... No crashing or banging so might be down to the install 🤔
Thanks Steve. They unfortunately all do it, it's to do with the 2 peice prop to diff as I agree the actual bike motor itself to use and operate is absolutely great. I think the other biggie is going from a low reving engine mounted on big rubber mounts to a totally solid mounted motor that revs so high.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Yes, I can imagine. Worth it for the top end I'm sure though 😁. I came across your videos from the karting and had my first experience in one of those recently (kz gearbox) and that certainly was a shock 😱
Oh totally! It feels like a total uncompromised race tool now! Haha yes how crazy are those gearbox karts! People had told me about the vibrations from the motor but it wasn't until I got in one and genuinely thought it was going to make my eyeballs and bowels fall out 😂😂. I'm out in the kart tomorrow for hopefully a test day with a bit more luck than the last!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Yes. My engine is either off or on too which makes it interesting in the wet. Good luck and I look forward to seeing how you get on. I saw your buddy actually at Shenington a month or so ago.... Broken down obvs 😂
I’m on the fence between a kit build of this with a bike engine or a track bike. Great insight and honest review. The safety and weather isn’t a concern for me. So I’ll be on the phone to MK ASAP 👍👍
Thanks Mark! Mega tricky that! I've zero experience with bikes so can't really comment haha! Although one of the best things about the Kits is being able to take your mates out in it... th-cam.com/video/97zruLLCU2E/w-d-xo.html
Well, the Goblin Kit Car (by DF Kit Cars) really shows an excellent template for an affordable rear-engine kit car built around a front-wheel-drive engine-transmission module (Chevrolet Cobalt). You can pretty-much use this same idea to build your own kit car, if you can TIG weld and have a tubing bender (A Nissan Maxima makes an excellent core unit). Keep in mind, the weak point of ANY motorcycle-engine-powered kit car is the transmission. Not sure about the U.K., but a lot of examples of catastrophic transmission failures when using integral motorcycle transmissions have happened here in the U.S....after all, the motorcycle transmissions are meant to propel a 500-lb bike and rider to fast speeds for short times, not 1300-lb cars with rider(s) to very fast speeds and keep them there during a race...
You do see some mental kits coming out of the US! Agreed on the bike gearboxes. So many struggle with them, especially the Busas and R1 engines. This is why I was happy to go for the 2010 CBR Fireblade option. Renown within the Kit car community as a very robust and reliable unit, especially the gearboxes. Using a slipper clutch took time to adjust to though! I am so used to heal and toe throttle matching that banging it down a few cogs then simply letting off the clutch took some faith at first haha!
Well said, I've had both pinto powered dax rush I then swapped to zetec, but I was always wanting more power... Which is expensive to get even 10-20bhp..wrote the car off and bought a hayabusa Westfield... Different experience altogether... I do have a name for it... Fragile princess... (High maintenance!) The transmission is definitely the weak point... RGB is rubbish by design but I've now modified the flaws out of it... You also said you have to be constantly spannering... Yep.. Dead right.. There's always stuff falls off mine from a snapped gear lever to a front wishbone pick up bracket weld fail... It happens... RAC.. 👍 The other thing is you can definitely use a bike engined car for road... I go touring a lot even with no roof or screen, just have to be selective with the weather.. 😁 Fantastic experience that any other car would be so difficult to match, even a car like a supercar would be hard to match as you'd have extensive worry and cost problems.. Could you dare drill a hole anywhere in a car costing 500k?
Haha love the busakit name! Yeah most of the guys I know with Busa powered kits have gearbox issues tbf. Agreed on road use... you can if you aren't soft like me haha! This is it though... it really is a unique experience and so amplified by the fact you are in something so light and rudimental!
speaking of Kit cars, My father has an old Fiber Fab "Jamaican V8". It was designed for a 1960's Corvette Driveline, and it's driveline is from a 1964 Vette with a 327 "Fuelie" (fuel Injected). Unfortunately, it did not have the original Fuel injection when he got it, having been replaced with an edelbrock. He still had the fuel injection distributor though, with the tach (tachometer) drive. While Not as light as this Locost, it's much lighter than the Vette, or even a Opel GT. According to Fiber Fab, it got its looks from a Lamborghini Muara, however, it reminds me of an Opel GT with a widebody kit. It's practically an opel on steroids!
How brilliant! I had a good look into the fiberfab kits after reading your comment. We had something that looked similar called a ‘nova’ although that used a classic vw beetle chassis which is far less manly than a vette haha!
Great review, MK R1 ourselves. late 2008 so last of the flat plane screamers . We ride bikes also - so also was going to be a BEC. Can't fault MK and their service. Also seen you other vid re dev - great stuff. You on BEC owners and NWKCOG ? as recognise the car.
Thanks bud, It had to be done and so glad We did the install. Makes it so special! Totaly see massive appeal, especially if you are into your bikes. I had always planned to get into bikes before the accident always planned a vfr400 and love the 675 daytonas! I am on NWKCOG and a few other groups on facebook, I will have to get on BEC owners 👍.
Great video. My Westfield SEIGHT (I built it in 2002) has been thrashed for 13000 miles and it's not broken yet, although I did change the gearbox to a T5. If I built another I would go for a S2000 engine
Thanks dude! Fantastic to hear! Gives us all hope haha! Same, I always planned to go F20C! Even had the exhaust manifold ready for it but was left the cbr motor and had to do something with it! Shame F20s have gone so mad money though tbh. I recently sold my s2000 because prices just went too high for me to be battering it about in.
I checked my engine mount brackets on my Westfield recently and I was shocked to find cracks forming. I had to weld them up and now I need to check them on a regular basis. I will now need to check the chassis, diff area can be a problem.
Such a worry isn't it! Really is something you HAVE to do regularly as a 'kit' owner :(. The things that could happen if we don't regular check aren't worth thinking about :(!!
Just the same as a car engine matey. The differential is on the rear axle of the car so I was able to use the same sierra diff with Quaife ATB LSD as I used with the car set up. Much the same as a car engine drives it’s gearbox, which drives a prop shaft, which drives the differential... the motorbike engine drives its gearbox to a sprocket, you then get a sprocket adapter which instead of driving a chain, now drives a propshaft to the rear differential 👍. Only real difference is bike engines dont need such high final drive ratios in comparison.
Thanks Stephen! Oh wow, now that is a seriously good problem to have! I’d love to know what an ecoboost motor would be like i one of these! The ecoboost motors I’ve driven have been so impressive for what they are! Probably not too log before we are sticking electric motors in them!
@@fortyfour1654 Very true, I wonder if it would be possible on sprint/hillclimb cars where you could run significantly less battery packs due to only needing short bursts.
Fantastic!! People go mad about weight saving, I'd focus on lots of triangulation and strength over light weight. Lots of gussets/plates etc! Let us know how it goes! Mega stuff!
I had a concept of mounting a Corvair (aircooled 6 cyl) in front with the clutch and trans axle in back for weight distribution (engine panels/tins reversed). ;-)
Well, In the extremely slim chance you decide to go forward with it Please let me know. Btw - That's one of the simpler (of several) concepts I have. ;-)
I wish I could pal but sorry to say I have recently sold the car. Had it for 10 years and it was just time to move on! Not sure what to replace it with though, it's very unique!
Thinking of buying a kit car and putting a turbo busa engine in it. I don't want to keep spending so much on cars. The more I look into it the more I want to do it.
Totally get the appeal as 'normal' cars you can just keep spending and spending on wheras you can get the kit cars to a place where really any further money investing in it becomes a bit pointless. A turbo busa would be a liitttlllee extreme haha!! Im not a huge fan of boost + kit cars. I don't know many who actually get anything like the potential out of them. Just seem to be point and squirt. Wheras with the Nasp ones circa 200hp you can still blend power out of corners and really exploit them.
@CIRCUIT : DRIVER I've heard about 330bhp is as much as you want to get out of them. As you said, after a certain point its pointless as you can't use the power. I reckon that would be achievable without a crazy turbo if the engine had the right stuff done to it. I love your car, thanks for taking the time to reply!
Car engine for road, bike engine for track. Simple as that. On the SC59 blade you have to be careful with 2010 engines too, very close to the changeover point on the chocolate crank teeth and if a bike was broken registered as 2010 it could easily have been built in 09. The other thing is they have a weak 3rd gear, and if it blows it'll more often than not put a hole in your crankcases - i run a billet standard ratio replacement in both my engines made by nova.
I had a concept of mounting a Chevrolet Corvair (air cooled 6 cyl) up front in one of those with the trans-axle mounted behind the seats (weight distribution). ;-)
Would certainly help! These things are so crazy sensitive to weight distribution. With the car engine in, it felt very much like a light weight version of a roadster. But once I went to the bike engine it felt totally different. Far more prone to understeer with the lack of front end weight. Also incredible how much difference driving with a passenger feels, suddenly incredibly rear weighted and pendulums about much more. Got to keep those slides nice and shallow then haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS "These things are so crazy sensitive to weight distribution." Awesome info. Fun video. Saw a Seven in 1975ish with a rotary and 10" slicks. Wanted one ever since.
Late to the party here as I am just getting back into 7's after some bittersweet experiences and generally life taking hold. I built a Deman SR7 in 2005/6 along with a professional racer. My car and cheque book but mainly his skills. The proprietor of Deman at the time was Dan Mann (yes, Dan Mann....and a bloke ex-pat as well) and he was into bike engines so his influence convinced me to put a bike engine into my car. It was a 2001 Yamaha R1 that was bought off ebay from a stolen bike/theft/police chase if you can believe it. Got it for $1200. Advantages. Light weight. Easy to package. Less wiring. Little to no transmission. Sequential shift. Wonderful noise. Mods galore. I really did scare women and small children when I had a chance and enjoyed every minute of it. But, I was not a track car guy and in 2006 and where I live there were no tracks so this was a city car. Not so good. Light clutch. Lower ground height. You can literally smell every car in traffic. Bike engines are for track days. A vehicle engine is for the street. I was conned by an out of town test pilot to drive my car...and he did, and basically burned the clutch out then drove 6 hours home. My mistake. Was not happy about that incident in particular and tried to change it but the life part took over. I lost my job and I had to sell my car. As well, with 7 with a bike engine, if you sell it, it'll attract other bikers not racers or car folk. And I can vouch the two are very very different. My 2 cents from one who live it. If you have access to a track - bike engines are easy to find. If you want to do back roads a Miata or MX-5 engine would be the smart choice.
Brilliant to hear you are getting back to it mate! Agree totally, if anything though for me I'm not sure how much I enjoy them at all on the road these days, I guess it depends on where you live but the road conditions and driving standards here are just getting too bad. I do enjoy the little mx5s on the road though! Great fun! Ahhh what a nightmare with the test driver, I don't mind letting folk drive my cars except for the Kit car... for the same reason! Takes some time to gel with how to operate it and in that time i don't fancy the gearbox/clutch woes that come with it... every time I would go and see MK, Danny would be there rebuilding the busa gearbox on the track hire car lol. Sorry to hear about the set backs, it happens doesn't it :(... my MK stayed broken for about 3 years when the engine failed.
That would sound great! I get the idea of mounting the box far back but we sit so far back in them I am unsure if it may make it too rear weighted? Certainly feels much more rear biased now with the bike engine compared to when it had the zetec motor. Don't think it feels as good on the limit for it.
Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. I meant to say that I'd mount the engine forward (of cab) with it rotated around so trans-axle mounts face the cab. I hope that's clearer?
Will, I've been dreaming of a "bike engine in a car" for a while. The high revs and sequential gear, with the light weight and simplicity is (to me) soooo attractive. But, in your video, you make very clear it is not a road-going product -- too loud and too harsh. Can it be made into a road product while keeping simple and light? Rubber bushings in the engine/trans/diff, some acoustics, and adjustable suspension? Would love to hear your ideas about it. Thanks!
Oh hell yes! You are totally right, get the engine and diff mounted on some nice rubber pucks and that will take out a lot of the issue. My chassis is also fully rose jointed too so going for rubber bushings throughout would make it feel much more refined. Also simple things like seat being padded and everything you touch being ergonomic and/or padded instead of the bare billet metal I have could help. Windscreen wouldn’t go amiss too haha. I think another big thing with comfort/usability in mind would be bike engine choice. The Fireblade is brilliant for my application but the 1000cc nature of this makes it very peaky and abrupt. Going for something like a hyabusa with that bit more engine capacity would make it feel much more adjustable, especially in the wet. This is a conversation I had with a few of the Seven owners that have had both 1000cc and 1300cc bike powered kits. As in the wet the 1000cc engines can be like a two stroke power band haha! I’d also try an electronic paddleshift, set up well it could make things feel very slick! Any other suggestions mate? Tyre and pad choice too can go a long way, less aggressive pads and a tyre with lots of side wall flex like the A021s are brilliant for feel on the road and absorbing much of the shuffling you feel with a car so light on normal roads.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS , Your description is very much what I was thinking -- busa engine NA, bushings and paddings with tight settings, windscreen, beefy wide tires, and... a manual gear shift - yeah, I'm old. Another question: In the US (LHD), how would you place the engine and align the propshaft? I have seen people placing the shaft diagonally across passenger seat and don't like the idea. I thought a jack-shaft (with a reverse option) would be better. I also thought of placing the engine the same way it sits on the bike, and a diff-like attachment to the engine, spinning a drive shaft to the back exactly like shaft-bikes do -- have no idea how doable this is. I need to get less time bike riding, more time working on my welding skills, purchase square tubes and start experimenting....
Brilliant!! If you have seen any of our other content you will know how much we bloody love MX5s haha!! It's so great that manufacturers are now using them as donors over the old Sierras! 13b NA sound great but very expensive haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS yeahh we love the mx5's aswell , lots of support. They are fairly cheap and still readily availeble here. The Rx8 was a 16 hour drive. The chassis is still getting welded , so around december we will have it up and running. Itll sound insane , 9700rpm revlimiter and loads of room left for maybe a turbo eventually... 🤔😂
Of course bud... The shifter is for changing gears. As it has a motorbike engine the gears are normally changed up and down with your left foot. We run a cable from the foot gearbox shifter to the hand shifter you see on the vids 👍.
I quite like the idea of a bike engine in my Westfield but I do a fairly high mileage in it. For my purposes I'll be sticking with the old Pinto. It's a heavy old lump but stands a lot of abuse. If I built a track car then I would go for a large capacity bike engine.
Totally agree! I really never intended to use a bike engine. The horror stories always put me off and unfortunately my Fireblade has bitten me hard recently. It developed a small knock which has turned out to be a completely knackered crank and a very expensive bill. I always intended to use an f20c S2000 engine.
I know about cheap to track, for years I tracked an N/A MR2 , the most fun I ever had BUT then I wanted to go faster and bought a Z06 Vette then OMG, brakes, rotors, tires ,fuel no more cheap to track 🤦♂️
haha amazing! We are all drawn in aren't we!! No one is ever immune to always wanting a little bit more even if it takes going too far to realise this :).
1.wonder how a flag on a long stick, like on a bumper car, would work preventing you from becoming a bumper car. Maybe some sort of insulation high density foam covered in thin wood could help in a crash, like in a helmet
Hahaha yeah I like the flag on a stick idea! Maybe just wrapping everything in bubble wrap haha! I just stopped bothering with it on the road to be honest mate :(.
Just came accross your great video, If money permits I will go for the Quaife box with reverse, it ads a bit more weight but the reverse is so handy. Question is how long a bike engine last and the gearbox compare to a road car, before it needs rebuild ? Thinking for most road use. Thanks
Hi there, first off I would stay WELL away from the reverse box... nothing but very costly issues. Have a look at the electric reverse kits you can get which use a starter motor on a 'cog' that slips in between your prop and rear diff casing. In terms of longevity... seriously depends on the bike engine you go for. Most have issues worth really delving into and researching.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Thanks for your reply, I forgot to mention, I am thing of a mid engine car this is why I was thinking of the,Quaife diff with reverse. Thanks
Theses cars will scare the Out of you. I drove a Rotus 7 here in the states. Twin rotor, turbo charged. came out of second just under 110 MPH. fastest car I’ve ever driven. 3, 4, 5 was just unbelievable. My nerves gave out at 170. If you ever get the chance do take it for a run.
Hahahaa! Well put! They really do struggle top speed wise compared to the regular stuff :(. Downside to having the aero efficiency of a house brick ahha!
It's basically a very large Go-Kart with suspension and a more durable engine ... I think I want one, as I already have many racing Karts and a modded Porsche 996TT.
Fantastic! I don't know if you have seen any of our other vids but there's a few from when I tried some 210 gearbox karting a few years back. Love the sound of your 996! Car mad haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS 210 gearbox is neat, a truly vintage motor! Wish we had those in the USA. FYI - there are a couple vids of my a few karts I built for vintage karting... 270cc Dual B-Bomb kart: th-cam.com/video/macY5n_R3gE/w-d-xo.html Dual BM-130 kart: th-cam.com/video/0t8iwKLebAQ/w-d-xo.html Both are scary as hell to drive, even compared to my 996 Turbo.
It's odd that you had so many problems with your Type 9 in the past. My Dad's Sprint/Hillclimb Westfield with a C20XE making 240bhp / 180lb/ft has one in at the moment and it's been a dream so far; it was just meant to be a stand-in whilst the 4-Speed dog box got rebuilt, but he's gone faster at some events with the type 9.
Jeez! That's good! Perhaps it's the short time frames of use that are helping it although I can't imagine the static launches are exactly easy on it! Good to hear though!
Just curious about the bike gearing and clutch. Could it be usable at all on the street with the super tall first? Looking at my own bike engine car project right now.
Hi mate, I certainly think so! You can chose which final drive differential you use which can make it as long or short geared as you like. I had a 3.9fd in mine at first and it was utterly bonkers! Topped out at circa 120mph and had super short gearing but did limit what tracks I could take it to. Now I have gone to a 3.4fd which has in all honesty gone too far the other way and subdued it too much. A 3.6 will be fitted to give me the goldilocks ratio haha! Good luck with your project mate, they really are unique little things!
Very interesting and the 'shaking itself apart' resonates with me after 2 diff bolts coming free at Silverstone earlier this year....will now inspect after every track day. I have a question though. I have just repowered mine with a Rotrex, forged Duratec and bespoke cooling etc and when I get it back in a week or so, it will have around 400hp (which I know is too much....it's largely for bragging rights and I've had a fly by wire with variable power dial on the dash...I suspect I'll end up setting it around 300hp, aka Caterham 620). But with this in mind, my question is this: I run R888's at present but am concerned for traction now and so have considered slicks (as I see you use). Is the risk of wishbone/suspension joint collapse increased SO much (to the point of worrying about using the car) and if so, would you stick with a decent track day tyre, like the 888's?
Fantastic! I bet that is totally ridiculous to drive haha! Ooo great question!! I must admit I only buy ‘used’ slicks so they have had the best taken out of them. They feel very much similar to an r888 i terms of grip level... just feel a good bit number... but the super low cost appeals to me haha! I would certainly expect new slicks to put more stress on your car, I know of a few who have sheared rosejoints and arms running them. I guess be even more vigilant and really look for any vulnerable areas. I had a big box section lower brace added recently to beef things up further 👍. More weight, yes, but I’d rather things be well over spec in these hellish little toys haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS as I thought, thanks for that. If used slicks are roughly similar to 888's, I'll see how it goes on those. Have my first track day at Silverstone on the 25th so I'll try not to die! Thanks for responding.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I did 3 at Silverstone last year, love the track! Will just be nice to be quick on the straights now, not just the corners....fingers crossed!
Great stuff! Bloody hell an LS motor in one of these would be utterly MENTAL! I do think some kit companies have done it and woah would I love to drive one! I would imagine it would verge on being undrivable though haha!
V8's in these are quick in a straight line but the weight destroys the balance that the 7 has. On a track a lightweight 4 cylinder like the bike engine car will normally be quicker. Even decent 4 cylinder car engined cars are quicker track cars. The Radical Hyabusa based V8 would be an option to keep the weight in the envelope.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS thanks. I've got an Indy R so went rose jointed wishbones for castor too. When you talk about the triangulation of the front pick up points where have you braced them? Top and bottom? Thanks again.
@@seancarsonuk Yes! Great stuff! It's hard to explain but basically where the wishbone pickup U shape brackets sit on the chassis I have had plates put in that tie/triangulate the bottom edges of the U shape to the bottom edges of the chassis box section. Only small plates but have done the job.
Great to give MK a call or AB Performance. They would guide you through things really well. The basics are very similar to a car powered kit... You still use a car rear diff and you still have a prop shaft... Just it's connected to an adapter that bolts on to the bike sprocket... so instead of driving a chain it drives a prop shaft. Bike engine choice is pretty crucial though in terms of reliability!
Can I ask you what chassis it is? Modifying to this level a locost/westfield would not have the same result? I'm from italy and those are so rare At the moment I have a grande punto abarth with proper lsd and 280cv but I want a tool for the mountain, I can't decide between a mx5 turbo with 280hp or one of those imported from UK.. The reliability of the bike engines is good? Clutch how many miles before swap?
Hi Lorenzo. It’s an MK Indy RR chassis. Loads of manufacturers are now moving from older Ford Sierra based donor cars to Mazda mx5s which is cool. Westfields are fantastic along with Caterhams and I like the MNRs too. Difficult to chose between a kit car and an mx5 turbo. They are both fantastic fun! At least in Italy you have much better weather than us in the UK! The mx5 turbos are great for the money, I built one last year and recently sold it to build an s2000 track/road car instead. Mx5 playlist... th-cam.com/play/PL0NyyXFCy426unJs4F3zA4Q-LJb9tCsgx.html The bike engines are certainly meant to be more temperamental than the car engines, especially the bike gearboxes. I have been lucky with my cbr fireblade engine, but I know others haven’t been!
He's right about the skill needed to handle these lightweight weapons. 100bhp in one of these would be enough for me on the road and I like to think I'm quite handy behind the wheel (don't we all!).
Totally agree too i’m sorry to say. I could go out tomorrow and take cbt, bike licence then get a 1000cc superbike. Could even be on track the next day on it... wouldn’t really be great though would it! Infact it would be downright madness... it’s not quite as bad as driving a kit car fast but similar in terms of being bad ideas haha! I really found trying out mx5s first to have my silly moments in and lots of slow rally car control days at oulton have made it somewhat accessible.
I have a car engined Westfield with about 150hp and even on the road you get to the stage of wanting more power. I think somewhere around the 200hp would make for an awesome 7. Bike engines are so good because of the reduction in weight and getting hp outputs up close to the 200hp mark. The 7 ethos is simplify and add lightness.
I know what you mean about not being seen by other road users. I tried a Tiger on the road and felt so vulnerable. I now have a silver 911 and people still pull out on me every now and then, having clearly not seen me. Silver seems to make me invisible. I might add an orange stripe to improve my chances.
Totally! They just don't see you! Great stuff on the 911. What year did you go for? I am really tempted to go for a gen2 987 Cayman S now my s2000 is being sold.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I have a 1998 996 C2. I always wanted a 911 and it was the only one I could afford. I've done a lot to lighten it and it's made a big difference. It's fun to drive and rewarding to go fast in but it's taken a lot of development to get it there. It's also very handy to have the back seats as I have two kids (who love the car). I did my ARDS test in a Cayman at Thruxton and it's definitely the better car though. Having said that, if I was going for a two seater then I would be after an Elise or an Exige, I have a real thing about most road cars being far too heavy, but that's just my preference. I got the 911 to scratch an itch and it turns out that it's fun and practical, and I still love looking at its arse.
@@TheFleetflyer Fantastic! Glad to hear it! Really hope I can slide a Cayman about like I do the S2000! Sure will give it a go anyways haha! Ahh I struggle with the Lotus's. Just seem SO much money to even be an option these days :(. Sadly I feel like I 'must' own one at some point though regardless haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I'm sure you'll do just fine getting a Cayman loose. When I drove one it was wonderfully balanced in stock form, whereas my 911 was an understeering pig of a thing until I improved it with many many changes. Having raced Formula Vee though, my heart will always belong to mid-engined lightweight cars, and there I will always long to return.
I have the choice between a raptor zx10r and a tiger Avon zetec turbo to buy.just don't know which one to pick.i will only use it on the roads.but in Portugal windy roads and uphill mostly.what.you think ?your opinion might help..thanks.
I've got a Westfield with a 4age toyota engine coupled to a type 9 ford gearbox and I find it a great compromise because it'll potter around the lanes but at the same time it will rev and go like a stabbed rat when you want to give it the beans.
Haha! I can't imagine the cost of some of the original Lotus 7s now! Caterhams are just a bit too much for me, granted they do hold their value very well mind! Bet that busa sr7 is bloody brilliant!
Hi Sam, all very doable. The easiest option is giving the car to MK or another kit car outfit to take care of the IVA for you. There is a no doubt a bike engined kit requires more attention to get through an IVA as you'd expect. Nothing too major though.
Hi, I've built a Locost zzr1100 BEC and I've set the ride height from the floor pan, front 95mm and rear 110 mm. Do you think that's too low. I also have a sump guard which sits 70mm off the ground. Thanks
I will measure how close mine is mate. I had to get a billet sump to replace the oem one as it sat too low. The sump guard will hopefully do it's job if you ever get close! I wonder how much the car will dive under braking too?
Great disussion thanks. Could I get some advice ? I've ridden lots of bikes most recent being 149bhp Daytona 955i by no means slow with 60 over 3 secsd, hence would be interested to get into something like this having had the taste of serious performance, I'm sure I could handle. Not for road use just occasional track bike is no brainer and would like it a hoot. would probably be never road use, silly speeds aren't for the road anyway Just kind of struck me this is the best way, dont ride anymore, done a few track days, but would be so cool to do this in a car but with bike guts. How to get hold of something reasonable but well priced what would be a good starting point setup / brand etc? The MK was mentioned previous for instance ? What sort of price ranges ? Possible to build yourself in kit form? etc
Hi Antony, totally get you! I know quite a few who have moved over from bikes to these! They really are an awesome experience for the money! In my opinion I wouldn’t buy one new/in kit form as it’s just not cost effective compared to the ready built ones! Certainly a good time to buy one too in the middle of winter when so many consider selling through lack of usability. Regarding kit car manufacturers Caterhams are brilliant but expensive (hold their value mind), westfields are again a great well established company, MK have recently been bought out by kitcardirect and the new owners are fantastic, I love the chassis on the RR version like mine, like a kitcar on steroids! MNR also have a great reputation and I have been really impressed with GBS Zero kit cars developments recently. Many companies are now going away from their sierra bases and developing new kits based on the mx5s which I think is amazing and totally worth a look at. I should hopefully testing MKs RX5 chassis soon! In terms of engine application, if you loved the bikes then great to get a bike powered kit! Busas seem to be very popular! I love my cbr though!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARSI forgot I had posted this! I actually ended up start of this year getting an ex 80s formula ford ! Came with a working engine Blackbird CBR1100xx but state of finish was rough/unfinished and with the wrong body ( I've been trying to restore to more like original RF86). It cost me just over £2k so was kinda bargain for such a potential car. The initial state was a bit of a shock though, some things good a lot bad and almost gave up and sold it once this year. Originally was someone tried to make road legal but not completed/ in a very good state of completion... only recenly been getting further help and it starts as I was having problems with that and following the final steps to get it useful. ......not come a lot further with its project status given carona and I've not been fuloughed like many but done what I can/ got help with it. The only downside its definitely NOT a roadcar or even normal track day car but can be used in some places. I'm really excited to get it running, it should be amazing on a purposed single seater event but might go later for a MK hayabusa kind of thing.
Curborough 🙌. Lovely little sprint track with a demon of a ditch running the length of the track... I’ve ended up in it 😂. Cheap to rent for the day. We usually go with a group called ‘the chequered flag’. £60 for the day inc food!
Mr,CD..you are very young,,why don't you Built Reverse Trike Race Car,,Now the craze of young people,,,Motorcycle Engine,,sequitial gearbox,,,,3wheel all disc brake,,Mid Engine will not vagg tail offroad, ,,,cheap to build and maintain,,1or 2 seater,,ONLY 1 problem is Reverse Gear ⚙ 😀,,, Have to use electric motor,,,🤝🍻
Unfortunately not Augustin. Pretty basic though... Just wherever a front U bracket was welded onto box section would then be strengthened with small plates that tied them into the bottom of the box section.
Hi Dustin, I ran a 3.9 final drive for the first couple of years and it was amazing! Limited me to shorter circuits though as the terminal speed was so low. Have now moved to a 3.34 but i all honesty it was a mistake. I think the 3.62 is the one to go for. I run an AB Performance billet sump with baffle plate which is essential for sump clearance issues and to protect from surge. Oil cooler and a large electric water pump really help too.
Never used one myself matey. Imho they seemed a little low on power and I know a few who have had gearbox issues with Them. I guess it depends on year you are going for though as that was the older motors 👍
I've owned 4 kit cars and built 2 from scratch; the PRO's - fabulous exhilarating driving and a great hobby, the CON's - I could have been about £40k richer if I'd taken up knitting instead!
Haha!I think the way we are, guys like all of us would just find ways of making even knitting expensive haha! What kits have you had and has been your favourite kit car out of the four Malcolm?
1st was a Sylva Striker which I built with a 1360 8000 rpm race XFlow engine but I had to replace the cam because it was too wild for the road.
2nd I built a Locost with the personal involvement of Mr Champion himself, this ran a 1700 Xflow
3rd Was a newly built Quantum Xtreme which ran a 2.1 Pinto running around 170hp
4th Was another pre-built Xtreme and I spent a fortune on a bespoke Zetec turbo installation which produced 293hp but I had to reduce the boost as it kept breaking gearboxes.
Overall I would say the Pinto powered Quantum was best as it had plenty of oomph even on the circuit and was comfy as I am 6'4" tall.
I'm a classic Mercedes man these days although I still dream of the Volvo T5 engine that I would have like to have dropped in the Quantum!
@@malcolmlane-ley2044 I found a Quantum H4i abandoned in Kent
Brilliant short piece for those of us considering our next move
Thanks
Thanks Chris! For me the low costs and access to truly bonkers performance outweighs all of the negatives 👍
It's good to hear the down sides, or reality, of kit cars with bike/car engines. Thank you for taking the time to share you experience, gives me better clarity on which to go for.
Cheers Doug! Kit cars are a difficult one for me to get my head around. They are equally amazing and impractical which makes them difficult to love, but the driving experience and cost for utterly bonkers performance make them so appealing. I wouldn't have one as a sole track car any more, I am lucky in having a more practical toy to use along side the odd day in the MK these days. All made possible with how cheap these kit cars are to keep on a monthly basis.
The scene with your girlfriend screaming "Stop it!" has made me a fan. Thanks for adding that in the video :D
hahaha! Brilliant! Poor Koral!
th-cam.com/video/24gWZjo2NCI/w-d-xo.html
Thanks for replying. Yeah, I guess that's something we will find out very quickly on its first track day at Castle Coombe 3rd July. We've put a Gpz900r sump on it, which does away with the big pot. Then added a second pressure relief valve. Lines linked to a much larger GSXF750 oil cooler. Topped the oil to the top of sight glass. Currently holding 3.7 litres in total. Added a oil pressure and oil temperature gauge to.
Thanks for a no nonsense overview. Much appreciated!
Cheers Dan! As much as I love the things they aren't the easiest things to live with haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I know the feeling. I have two old Jaguars and assorted other vehicles.
Awesome video as always and all the info i needed. Thanks 😁
As said on FB bud, thanks so much for the support. Really do appreciate it 👍. Curborough Chequered Flag day sounds like a win although that place scares me these days after my little off haha!
Well done , learned a lot ⭐️
Thanks for posting this....i didn’t even think about the dangers of not being seen....then again i plan on building a shell.
Just so low you become invisible to so many. I remember driving in my DC2 Integra and a friend in his Westfield... When he was along side I couldn't see him as he was lower that the door line!
Really good video and interesting to hear from someone that can compare car and bike engine in exactly the same chassis.
Thanks Steve! Yess very lucky, they are great toys to own as you know! Certainly gives me access to performance I shouldn't really be able to afford!
This was super informative! Thanks!
Thanks Tommis! Never easy or natural for me to just sit and talk to a camera but I had a chunk of stuff I wanted to put out there I wish I had known before buying one!
Great vid thanks for taking the time to make :)
Thanks bud, they are awesome toys but deffo have a few downsides!
Caterham CSR owner here. Well done. Great vid!
Sevens are great fun. To fellow mortals I'd give the advice to drive one once you've past the novice driver level. Chances are you'll get overconfident and crash.
Of course there are different/no rules for racing gods who feel they are born in the wrong body, who feel they should have had four wheels at birth.
Normal guy, speaking normally, no bullshit, you can not watch this and not learn something 👍🏻
I love the high pitch sound from the high revs on motorbike engine.
Didn't even think about reversing I guess it's probably more suited to track use
Absolute theatre! I forget how good it sounds haha!
I appreciate your honesty with "They are easy to work on, which is good because they fall apart" followed by a video of your wing disappearing behind you. That bit of insight is not something most people consider about when owning a track car.
haha thanks bud! Yeah the vibrations from a solid mounted engine just rattle everything to bits! Including myself haha!
I had a honda blackbird engined Westfield. On tracks it was the most amazing driving experience ever. Great for learning suspension setup on to as you could feel exactly what was going on. But as you say it became a competition/track car not a Sunday drive out or touring car...
That was very interesting and informative. Thanks
Thanks dude! Was fun to make!
Excellent video.......experienced guy.
Thanks Ian! Means loads! I feel very lucky to of had the experiences in these mental little sevens!
Great video mate... good to hear someone with experience across both types of engine and not just some internet warrior banging on. I've built 4 bike engined cars, all Westfields (2 Fireblades, a Blackbird and converted a Pinto engined one to ZX12-R), and I currently run a Megabusa that I bought factory built. I agree with everything you said about usability with regards to the car engined ones but these types of car are there to make you feel alive, and everything you said about lightweight, the sequential 'box, even no windscreens, it just ramps up the adrenalin and gives you the biggest kick... it's the only thing keeping me away from bikes themselves. The 'blade is the best engine overall; you can't beat the 'busa for muscle but, on balance (power, weight, complexity, usability), the Fireblade is king. Drive safe mate!
Thanks loads mate! Sounds like you have a BEC addiction haha!! Fantastic to know you rate the Fireblades highly! I'd always wondered if they just didn't cut it in a world full of Busa kits!! As said in the vid, I have the car really aggressively geared so I stand a chance against them!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS We ran a 3.91 diff on a live axled car and it was ace... was only geared for 116mph (IIRC🤔)... but it'd get to 100 in 8.6 secs, so not too shabby... and so light. It was 447kg with a full tank of fuel... Anyway, have fun mate! Might see you about 😎👍🏻
I run the same 3.9 for years and it was utterly bonkers haha! Fantastic! Aye, drive safe and see you at a Track soon 🙌👍
good video with some excellent advice.... drive safe mate!
Thanks loads mate! I try my best haha! Unfortunately the track days I had planned in it this year have all been canned as a small issue has turned into a bigger engine rebuild :(.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Hi mate...No it's good advice.. I found the video interesting for me because I drive a Seven replica called a Kaipan... I live in the Czech Republic and wanted a Caterham but.... They're too expensive and difficult to register here with the Czechs having more draconian rules than even the Germans. The Kaipan has a 1.8 turbo from the VAG group fitted. It's got about 200 hp with the previous builder/owner doing a remap. At first I found it difficult to drive with the boost coming sometimes mid corner but it's amazing how we adapt to power. I've owned loads of interesting stuff from Lotuses to Porsche 911 through M series BMWs etc etc. But this car I really love. Drive safe mate. I like your channel.Mick
Great video. Not sure I agree with everything said but I guess to some extent it depends on the type of kit car, engine and drivetrain setup. For example many are versions of the infamous Seven whereas mine is a mid-engined exoskeletal car with a GSX-R1000, no clonks or knocks other than selecting 1st gear to pull away from standstill. I do have a flatshifter though which is just brilliant I have to say. My car is just epic on track or road though with the engine and intakes just behind my left ear it is somewhat loud! Ear plugs and/or helmets are a must but cost very little. One thing is for sure, love 'em or hate 'em, BECs are addictive! Great video mate, look forward to seeing more.
Fantastic! There certainly isn't much like the experience of these BECs for the money is there! I get what you mean re only clunks being from the prop/gear engagement in first but I think the majority of the difference for me was going from an car engine on big rubber engine mounts to a bike engine solidly mounted to the chassis... you feel everything haha! Thanks Steve, I am itching for some more seat time in it at the mo!
Really interesting and useful review. Thank you! 🙂
Paul 😎
Thanks Paul! I love it for the theatre and sense of occasion! You have to be in the right mood for them but my god do they make you feel alive haha!
Really well done video (regardless of topic)
Thank you! Was fun to put together!
Totally understand everything you’re saying, bike engined cars are in a world of their own. 👍🏼 I built a Stuart Taylor LocoBlade with a Honda Fireblade engine back in 2002 and my only regret was not being able to take it on the IOM TT circuit to check the size of my marbles! 😂
Thanks Bill! Very difficult to compare to much else aren't they! Good and bad hahaa! Fantastic! I'd LOVE to get over to IOM TT in it one day too! Be a nice little pilgrimage to do in memory of my friend who's engine it was. I know he always wanted to go.
I rode a GSXR1100 with a 1260 bore, ignition advancer, laser race exhaust and tuned engine with lighter internals, mounted in a Spondon frame around the IOM. I found my nuts were far, far smaller than I thought!
This is the way to run these cars, on the track. In my Westfield on the road it just triggers other drivers left right and centre, just the fact that it exists, that it's small, it's loud, etc, can't really drive it on the roads anymore without at least one other driver trying to kill you. So yes, do the track days, have fun with it around like minded people.
Sad but totally true. Driving standards are only getting worse imho too and the road conditions are shocking at the moment. I'd always love a motorbike but simply feel as if I cant for the same reasons.
Good informative video. You are a lucky guy..
Thanks Tom! They really do open up crazy levels of performance to normal folk like me haha!
Great insight, we are starting a 1k budget build on here, would love to gave the budget for a bike engined build.
Brilliant! Ooo 1k limit! That’s ace! We did a little mx5 NB 2k track car build (including buying car) and it was some of the most fun days we’ve ever had in cars! Something so great about keeping things humble, honest and enjoyable!
Came across this video by accident. Really enjoyed your relaxed presenting style and interesting content. Your car looks like a total weapon, found myself thinking what I could sell so that I could get a car like yours. Subscribed 👍
Thanks for the kind words Phil! Haha brilliant! They are a strange one, can often feel like a chore to own but the good days are REALLY good! Unfortunately my engine developed a nasty little knock which turned out to be a broken crank! So a very expensive rebuild due :(. I've been focussing on getting my little mx5 turbo race car finished instead to keep me sane... th-cam.com/video/6gkv8PSY0A8/w-d-xo.html
When you mentioned vibration I thought of the Mazda rotary. They're light, extremely high power to weight ratio, and they don't vibrate the same way so are possibly easier on the chassis.
I agree with all your points as I have a Busa powered one, this winter I am adding a full cage just for the safety points you mention as currently it only has a rear hoop. While doing the work I found the front lower wishbone mounts peeling away also. Great Video maybe meet you at a track one day.
Ahh fantastic. The busas sure have some damn pace! It's incredible how many of us have the same issues with chassis welds/points pealing away, atleast a pretty easy fix especially when you add in the extra triangulation plates to give it more strength. See you on track in 2019 🙌🙌
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS th-cam.com/video/LutcqOK-j-w/w-d-xo.html
Watched that vid last night haha! Looks bloody capable! First corner and the chincane look eventful, shame Knockhill is so far away from us. Last time I was there was 10years ago!
Super video very well done,,valuable information 😎🤝
Thanks loads mate! The engine is currently being rebuilt! Hoping for lots of days in it next year!
I had a Bec in 2009 and loved it. Completely agree on checking everything including welds. I had the front right side snap while pushing it. I went back to bikes but as an ultimate 4 wheel thrill these are it I reckon
Interesting video, and something I've wondered about. I haven't actually driven any kit cars, but a Fireblade is one of the most refined bikes you can buy.... No crashing or banging so might be down to the install 🤔
Thanks Steve. They unfortunately all do it, it's to do with the 2 peice prop to diff as I agree the actual bike motor itself to use and operate is absolutely great. I think the other biggie is going from a low reving engine mounted on big rubber mounts to a totally solid mounted motor that revs so high.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Yes, I can imagine. Worth it for the top end I'm sure though 😁. I came across your videos from the karting and had my first experience in one of those recently (kz gearbox) and that certainly was a shock 😱
Oh totally! It feels like a total uncompromised race tool now! Haha yes how crazy are those gearbox karts! People had told me about the vibrations from the motor but it wasn't until I got in one and genuinely thought it was going to make my eyeballs and bowels fall out 😂😂. I'm out in the kart tomorrow for hopefully a test day with a bit more luck than the last!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Yes. My engine is either off or on too which makes it interesting in the wet. Good luck and I look forward to seeing how you get on. I saw your buddy actually at Shenington a month or so ago.... Broken down obvs 😂
I’m on the fence between a kit build of this with a bike engine or a track bike. Great insight and honest review. The safety and weather isn’t a concern for me. So I’ll be on the phone to MK ASAP 👍👍
Thanks Mark! Mega tricky that! I've zero experience with bikes so can't really comment haha! Although one of the best things about the Kits is being able to take your mates out in it... th-cam.com/video/97zruLLCU2E/w-d-xo.html
Well, the Goblin Kit Car (by DF Kit Cars) really shows an excellent template for an affordable rear-engine kit car built around a front-wheel-drive engine-transmission module (Chevrolet Cobalt). You can pretty-much use this same idea to build your own kit car, if you can TIG weld and have a tubing bender (A Nissan Maxima makes an excellent core unit). Keep in mind, the weak point of ANY motorcycle-engine-powered kit car is the transmission. Not sure about the U.K., but a lot of examples of catastrophic transmission failures when using integral motorcycle transmissions have happened here in the U.S....after all, the motorcycle transmissions are meant to propel a 500-lb bike and rider to fast speeds for short times, not 1300-lb cars with rider(s) to very fast speeds and keep them there during a race...
You do see some mental kits coming out of the US! Agreed on the bike gearboxes. So many struggle with them, especially the Busas and R1 engines. This is why I was happy to go for the 2010 CBR Fireblade option. Renown within the Kit car community as a very robust and reliable unit, especially the gearboxes. Using a slipper clutch took time to adjust to though! I am so used to heal and toe throttle matching that banging it down a few cogs then simply letting off the clutch took some faith at first haha!
Well said !
Thanks for the informative video. Just out of interest, which of the two engines was faster around the track and by how much ?
Good one. !!
thankyou!
Add a Lexan windscreen .....
And some vinyl along the bottom with simple velcro so no rain drips down to the dash.
Nice idea with the velcro! Will do that!
Well said, I've had both pinto powered dax rush I then swapped to zetec, but I was always wanting more power... Which is expensive to get even 10-20bhp..wrote the car off and bought a hayabusa Westfield... Different experience altogether... I do have a name for it... Fragile princess... (High maintenance!)
The transmission is definitely the weak point... RGB is rubbish by design but I've now modified the flaws out of it... You also said you have to be constantly spannering... Yep.. Dead right.. There's always stuff falls off mine from a snapped gear lever to a front wishbone pick up bracket weld fail... It happens... RAC.. 👍
The other thing is you can definitely use a bike engined car for road... I go touring a lot even with no roof or screen, just have to be selective with the weather.. 😁
Fantastic experience that any other car would be so difficult to match, even a car like a supercar would be hard to match as you'd have extensive worry and cost problems.. Could you dare drill a hole anywhere in a car costing 500k?
Haha love the busakit name! Yeah most of the guys I know with Busa powered kits have gearbox issues tbf. Agreed on road use... you can if you aren't soft like me haha! This is it though... it really is a unique experience and so amplified by the fact you are in something so light and rudimental!
speaking of Kit cars, My father has an old Fiber Fab "Jamaican V8". It was designed for a 1960's Corvette Driveline, and it's driveline is from a 1964 Vette with a 327 "Fuelie" (fuel Injected). Unfortunately, it did not have the original Fuel injection when he got it, having been replaced with an edelbrock. He still had the fuel injection distributor though, with the tach (tachometer) drive. While Not as light as this Locost, it's much lighter than the Vette, or even a Opel GT.
According to Fiber Fab, it got its looks from a Lamborghini Muara, however, it reminds me of an Opel GT with a widebody kit. It's practically an opel on steroids!
How brilliant! I had a good look into the fiberfab kits after reading your comment. We had something that looked similar called a ‘nova’ although that used a classic vw beetle chassis which is far less manly than a vette haha!
Great review, MK R1 ourselves. late 2008 so last of the flat plane screamers .
We ride bikes also - so also was going to be a BEC.
Can't fault MK and their service.
Also seen you other vid re dev - great stuff.
You on BEC owners and NWKCOG ? as recognise the car.
Thanks bud, It had to be done and so glad We did the install. Makes it so special! Totaly see massive appeal, especially if you are into your bikes. I had always planned to get into bikes before the accident always planned a vfr400 and love the 675 daytonas! I am on NWKCOG and a few other groups on facebook, I will have to get on BEC owners 👍.
Great video. My Westfield SEIGHT (I built it in 2002) has been thrashed for 13000 miles and it's not broken yet, although I did change the gearbox to a T5. If I built another I would go for a S2000 engine
Thanks dude! Fantastic to hear! Gives us all hope haha! Same, I always planned to go F20C! Even had the exhaust manifold ready for it but was left the cbr motor and had to do something with it! Shame F20s have gone so mad money though tbh. I recently sold my s2000 because prices just went too high for me to be battering it about in.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I checked the prices. Wow. I will need to look at other options, or rob a bank!
@@carguyuk7525 hahahahah shocking as f*ck isn't it!!! I just couldn't deal with an engine failure and having to replace an engine!! Scary stuff!
Think you did a good job on the report.
Thank you! They are a chore to own but the good times are so soo good ☺️🙌
Brilliant ...
Thanks bud! Have a great Christmas! Need some track time together in 2019 👍
I would use NordLocks to secure all the bolts that vibrate loose instead of standard split lockwashers.
Id want a kit car with a car engine, as they have more torque, than bike engines.
I checked my engine mount brackets on my Westfield recently and I was shocked to find cracks forming. I had to weld them up and now I need to check them on a regular basis. I will now need to check the chassis, diff area can be a problem.
Such a worry isn't it! Really is something you HAVE to do regularly as a 'kit' owner :(. The things that could happen if we don't regular check aren't worth thinking about :(!!
How do motorcycle kit cars come across the problem of no differentials?
Just the same as a car engine matey. The differential is on the rear axle of the car so I was able to use the same sierra diff with Quaife ATB LSD as I used with the car set up. Much the same as a car engine drives it’s gearbox, which drives a prop shaft, which drives the differential... the motorbike engine drives its gearbox to a sprocket, you then get a sprocket adapter which instead of driving a chain, now drives a propshaft to the rear differential 👍. Only real difference is bike engines dont need such high final drive ratios in comparison.
I just built a Formula SAE car with a 2006 cbr600rr engine in my garage. I just have it setup with a live axle. The handling on the car is ridiculous
Very cool.
Thanks dude, k24 hybrid user name intrigues me haha! Keep a look out for a k24 s1 Elise on our channel in 2021 :)
Brilliant vid dude, I still can’t decide if I’m going Kawasaki ZZR1400 or Ford Ecoboost in mine locost #firstworldproblems
Thanks Stephen! Oh wow, now that is a seriously good problem to have! I’d love to know what an ecoboost motor would be like i one of these! The ecoboost motors I’ve driven have been so impressive for what they are! Probably not too log before we are sticking electric motors in them!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS
With electric....comes WEIGHT!
@@fortyfour1654 Very true, I wonder if it would be possible on sprint/hillclimb cars where you could run significantly less battery packs due to only needing short bursts.
i just just bought the locust build book, and i'm working on building the car myself.
Fantastic!! People go mad about weight saving, I'd focus on lots of triangulation and strength over light weight. Lots of gussets/plates etc! Let us know how it goes! Mega stuff!
I had a concept of mounting a Corvair (aircooled 6 cyl) in front with the clutch and trans axle in back for weight distribution (engine panels/tins reversed). ;-)
Hehe yep would be mega, we had a convo about it a while back :)!
Well, In the extremely slim chance you decide to go forward with it Please let me know.
Btw - That's one of the simpler (of several) concepts I have. ;-)
Good😊👍
Looks ace dude ! Bring it up curbs tomorrow and take me out for a lap . ?
I wish I could pal but sorry to say I have recently sold the car. Had it for 10 years and it was just time to move on! Not sure what to replace it with though, it's very unique!
Thinking of buying a kit car and putting a turbo busa engine in it. I don't want to keep spending so much on cars. The more I look into it the more I want to do it.
Totally get the appeal as 'normal' cars you can just keep spending and spending on wheras you can get the kit cars to a place where really any further money investing in it becomes a bit pointless. A turbo busa would be a liitttlllee extreme haha!! Im not a huge fan of boost + kit cars. I don't know many who actually get anything like the potential out of them. Just seem to be point and squirt. Wheras with the Nasp ones circa 200hp you can still blend power out of corners and really exploit them.
@CIRCUIT : DRIVER I've heard about 330bhp is as much as you want to get out of them. As you said, after a certain point its pointless as you can't use the power. I reckon that would be achievable without a crazy turbo if the engine had the right stuff done to it.
I love your car, thanks for taking the time to reply!
Car engine for road, bike engine for track. Simple as that. On the SC59 blade you have to be careful with 2010 engines too, very close to the changeover point on the chocolate crank teeth and if a bike was broken registered as 2010 it could easily have been built in 09. The other thing is they have a weak 3rd gear, and if it blows it'll more often than not put a hole in your crankcases - i run a billet standard ratio replacement in both my engines made by nova.
overtake a E36 nice :)
Sorry forgot to mention I was thinking a mid engine, to be able to use the Quaife diff...
I had a concept of mounting a Chevrolet Corvair (air cooled 6 cyl) up front in one of those with the trans-axle mounted behind the seats (weight distribution). ;-)
Would certainly help! These things are so crazy sensitive to weight distribution. With the car engine in, it felt very much like a light weight version of a roadster. But once I went to the bike engine it felt totally different. Far more prone to understeer with the lack of front end weight. Also incredible how much difference driving with a passenger feels, suddenly incredibly rear weighted and pendulums about much more. Got to keep those slides nice and shallow then haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS "These things are so crazy sensitive to weight distribution."
Awesome info. Fun video.
Saw a Seven in 1975ish with a rotary and 10" slicks.
Wanted one ever since.
Late to the party here as I am just getting back into 7's after some bittersweet experiences and generally life taking hold. I built a Deman SR7 in 2005/6 along with a professional racer. My car and cheque book but mainly his skills. The proprietor of Deman at the time was Dan Mann (yes, Dan Mann....and a bloke ex-pat as well) and he was into bike engines so his influence convinced me to put a bike engine into my car. It was a 2001 Yamaha R1 that was bought off ebay from a stolen bike/theft/police chase if you can believe it. Got it for $1200. Advantages. Light weight. Easy to package. Less wiring. Little to no transmission. Sequential shift. Wonderful noise. Mods galore. I really did scare women and small children when I had a chance and enjoyed every minute of it. But, I was not a track car guy and in 2006 and where I live there were no tracks so this was a city car. Not so good. Light clutch. Lower ground height. You can literally smell every car in traffic. Bike engines are for track days. A vehicle engine is for the street. I was conned by an out of town test pilot to drive my car...and he did, and basically burned the clutch out then drove 6 hours home. My mistake. Was not happy about that incident in particular and tried to change it but the life part took over. I lost my job and I had to sell my car. As well, with 7 with a bike engine, if you sell it, it'll attract other bikers not racers or car folk. And I can vouch the two are very very different. My 2 cents from one who live it. If you have access to a track - bike engines are easy to find. If you want to do back roads a Miata or MX-5 engine would be the smart choice.
Brilliant to hear you are getting back to it mate! Agree totally, if anything though for me I'm not sure how much I enjoy them at all on the road these days, I guess it depends on where you live but the road conditions and driving standards here are just getting too bad. I do enjoy the little mx5s on the road though! Great fun! Ahhh what a nightmare with the test driver, I don't mind letting folk drive my cars except for the Kit car... for the same reason! Takes some time to gel with how to operate it and in that time i don't fancy the gearbox/clutch woes that come with it... every time I would go and see MK, Danny would be there rebuilding the busa gearbox on the track hire car lol. Sorry to hear about the set backs, it happens doesn't it :(... my MK stayed broken for about 3 years when the engine failed.
I had a concept of mounting a "Corvair" engine (air-cooled 110hp or 140hp boxer six) with the trans-axle in the back (balance).
That would sound great! I get the idea of mounting the box far back but we sit so far back in them I am unsure if it may make it too rear weighted? Certainly feels much more rear biased now with the bike engine compared to when it had the zetec motor. Don't think it feels as good on the limit for it.
Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. I meant to say that I'd mount the engine forward (of cab) with it rotated around so trans-axle mounts face the cab. I hope that's clearer?
Ahh sorry totally with you now! That sounds like it could be a winner.
No problem. winner or not all my concepts are unique, that's a simpler one. ;-)
Will, I've been dreaming of a "bike engine in a car" for a while. The high revs and sequential gear, with the light weight and simplicity is (to me) soooo attractive. But, in your video, you make very clear it is not a road-going product -- too loud and too harsh. Can it be made into a road product while keeping simple and light? Rubber bushings in the engine/trans/diff, some acoustics, and adjustable suspension? Would love to hear your ideas about it. Thanks!
Oh hell yes! You are totally right, get the engine and diff mounted on some nice rubber pucks and that will take out a lot of the issue. My chassis is also fully rose jointed too so going for rubber bushings throughout would make it feel much more refined. Also simple things like seat being padded and everything you touch being ergonomic and/or padded instead of the bare billet metal I have could help. Windscreen wouldn’t go amiss too haha. I think another big thing with comfort/usability in mind would be bike engine choice. The Fireblade is brilliant for my application but the 1000cc nature of this makes it very peaky and abrupt. Going for something like a hyabusa with that bit more engine capacity would make it feel much more adjustable, especially in the wet. This is a conversation I had with a few of the Seven owners that have had both 1000cc and 1300cc bike powered kits. As in the wet the 1000cc engines can be like a two stroke power band haha! I’d also try an electronic paddleshift, set up well it could make things feel very slick! Any other suggestions mate? Tyre and pad choice too can go a long way, less aggressive pads and a tyre with lots of side wall flex like the A021s are brilliant for feel on the road and absorbing much of the shuffling you feel with a car so light on normal roads.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS , Your description is very much what I was thinking -- busa engine NA, bushings and paddings with tight settings, windscreen, beefy wide tires, and... a manual gear shift - yeah, I'm old. Another question: In the US (LHD), how would you place the engine and align the propshaft? I have seen people placing the shaft diagonally across passenger seat and don't like the idea. I thought a jack-shaft (with a reverse option) would be better. I also thought of placing the engine the same way it sits on the bike, and a diff-like attachment to the engine, spinning a drive shaft to the back exactly like shaft-bikes do -- have no idea how doable this is.
I need to get less time bike riding, more time working on my welding skills, purchase square tubes and start experimenting....
Im currently finishing up my MK indy with the mk2 1.8L mx5 drivetrain. Next one is going to be a 13b NA build. Goal is 250hp with a intake and tune :)
Brilliant!! If you have seen any of our other content you will know how much we bloody love MX5s haha!! It's so great that manufacturers are now using them as donors over the old Sierras! 13b NA sound great but very expensive haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS yeahh we love the mx5's aswell , lots of support. They are fairly cheap and still readily availeble here. The Rx8 was a 16 hour drive. The chassis is still getting welded , so around december we will have it up and running. Itll sound insane , 9700rpm revlimiter and loads of room left for maybe a turbo eventually... 🤔😂
May I ask what the shifter is and how it works? It seems cool and I am intrigued...
Of course bud... The shifter is for changing gears. As it has a motorbike engine the gears are normally changed up and down with your left foot. We run a cable from the foot gearbox shifter to the hand shifter you see on the vids 👍.
I quite like the idea of a bike engine in my Westfield but I do a fairly high mileage in it. For my purposes I'll be sticking with the old Pinto. It's a heavy old lump but stands a lot of abuse. If I built a track car then I would go for a large capacity bike engine.
Totally agree! I really never intended to use a bike engine. The horror stories always put me off and unfortunately my Fireblade has bitten me hard recently. It developed a small knock which has turned out to be a completely knackered crank and a very expensive bill. I always intended to use an f20c S2000 engine.
I know about cheap to track, for years I tracked an N/A MR2 , the most fun I ever had BUT then I wanted to go faster and bought a Z06 Vette then OMG, brakes, rotors, tires ,fuel no more cheap to track 🤦♂️
haha amazing! We are all drawn in aren't we!! No one is ever immune to always wanting a little bit more even if it takes going too far to realise this :).
1.wonder how a flag on a long stick, like on a bumper car, would work preventing you from becoming a bumper car. Maybe some sort of insulation high density foam covered in thin wood could help in a crash, like in a helmet
Hahaha yeah I like the flag on a stick idea! Maybe just wrapping everything in bubble wrap haha! I just stopped bothering with it on the road to be honest mate :(.
It's your opinion but it's a very good opinion
Haha! Thanks Alan!
Just came accross your great video, If money permits I will go for the Quaife box with reverse, it ads a bit more weight but the reverse is so handy. Question is how long a bike engine last and the gearbox compare to a road car, before it needs rebuild ? Thinking for most road use. Thanks
Hi there, first off I would stay WELL away from the reverse box... nothing but very costly issues. Have a look at the electric reverse kits you can get which use a starter motor on a 'cog' that slips in between your prop and rear diff casing. In terms of longevity... seriously depends on the bike engine you go for. Most have issues worth really delving into and researching.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Thanks for your reply, I forgot to mention, I am thing of a mid engine car this is why I was thinking of the,Quaife diff with reverse. Thanks
Theses cars will scare the Out of you. I drove a Rotus 7 here in the states. Twin rotor, turbo charged. came out of second just under 110 MPH. fastest car I’ve ever driven. 3, 4, 5 was just unbelievable. My nerves gave out at 170. If you ever get the chance do take it for a run.
Hahahaa! Well put! They really do struggle top speed wise compared to the regular stuff :(. Downside to having the aero efficiency of a house brick ahha!
If you could do track days with a kart especially a 250 E these would all make mincemeat of any track day car!
Yes, and if you could take a jet ski down the local canal I'm sure you'd make mincemeat of any narrowboat too 🤣.
It's basically a very large Go-Kart with suspension and a more durable engine ... I think I want one, as I already have many racing Karts and a modded Porsche 996TT.
Fantastic! I don't know if you have seen any of our other vids but there's a few from when I tried some 210 gearbox karting a few years back. Love the sound of your 996! Car mad haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS 210 gearbox is neat, a truly vintage motor! Wish we had those in the USA. FYI - there are a couple vids of my a few karts I built for vintage karting... 270cc Dual B-Bomb kart: th-cam.com/video/macY5n_R3gE/w-d-xo.html
Dual BM-130 kart: th-cam.com/video/0t8iwKLebAQ/w-d-xo.html
Both are scary as hell to drive, even compared to my 996 Turbo.
It's odd that you had so many problems with your Type 9 in the past. My Dad's Sprint/Hillclimb Westfield with a C20XE making 240bhp / 180lb/ft has one in at the moment and it's been a dream so far; it was just meant to be a stand-in whilst the 4-Speed dog box got rebuilt, but he's gone faster at some events with the type 9.
Jeez! That's good! Perhaps it's the short time frames of use that are helping it although I can't imagine the static launches are exactly easy on it! Good to hear though!
You considered poly-mounts for the engine instead of full on solid mounts, might make things loosening themselves a bit less of a regular occurrence!
Would certainly help things wouldn't it! I'd have to redesign the mounts but even a small amount of damping would be a big improvement!
been racing mine for 13 years know , they are a riot and so cheap to run and maintain
😎😎 Looks awesome! I've had a fair bit of trouble with mine recently but at least it's damn easy to work on!
Just curious about the bike gearing and clutch.
Could it be usable at all on the street with the super tall first?
Looking at my own bike engine car project right now.
Hi mate, I certainly think so! You can chose which final drive differential you use which can make it as long or short geared as you like. I had a 3.9fd in mine at first and it was utterly bonkers! Topped out at circa 120mph and had super short gearing but did limit what tracks I could take it to. Now I have gone to a 3.4fd which has in all honesty gone too far the other way and subdued it too much. A 3.6 will be fitted to give me the goldilocks ratio haha! Good luck with your project mate, they really are unique little things!
Very interesting and the 'shaking itself apart' resonates with me after 2 diff bolts coming free at Silverstone earlier this year....will now inspect after every track day.
I have a question though. I have just repowered mine with a Rotrex, forged Duratec and bespoke cooling etc and when I get it back in a week or so, it will have around 400hp (which I know is too much....it's largely for bragging rights and I've had a fly by wire with variable power dial on the dash...I suspect I'll end up setting it around 300hp, aka Caterham 620). But with this in mind, my question is this:
I run R888's at present but am concerned for traction now and so have considered slicks (as I see you use). Is the risk of wishbone/suspension joint collapse increased SO much (to the point of worrying about using the car) and if so, would you stick with a decent track day tyre, like the 888's?
Fantastic! I bet that is totally ridiculous to drive haha! Ooo great question!! I must admit I only buy ‘used’ slicks so they have had the best taken out of them. They feel very much similar to an r888 i terms of grip level... just feel a good bit number... but the super low cost appeals to me haha! I would certainly expect new slicks to put more stress on your car, I know of a few who have sheared rosejoints and arms running them. I guess be even more vigilant and really look for any vulnerable areas. I had a big box section lower brace added recently to beef things up further 👍. More weight, yes, but I’d rather things be well over spec in these hellish little toys haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS as I thought, thanks for that. If used slicks are roughly similar to 888's, I'll see how it goes on those. Have my first track day at Silverstone on the 25th so I'll try not to die!
Thanks for responding.
@@justinwerb9131 Ahh fantastic. I do a good few days with Circuit Days. They are brilliant! The full GP layout too you lucky thing!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I did 3 at Silverstone last year, love the track! Will just be nice to be quick on the straights now, not just the corners....fingers crossed!
I found this really interesting thought about putting in a corvette sl7 engine in if I get a Mk Indy kit , is that even possible?
Great stuff! Bloody hell an LS motor in one of these would be utterly MENTAL! I do think some kit companies have done it and woah would I love to drive one! I would imagine it would verge on being undrivable though haha!
V8's in these are quick in a straight line but the weight destroys the balance that the 7 has. On a track a lightweight 4 cylinder like the bike engine car will normally be quicker. Even decent 4 cylinder car engined cars are quicker track cars.
The Radical Hyabusa based V8 would be an option to keep the weight in the envelope.
Interesting. What geo are you running front and rear? Looks very quick. Cheers.
Cheers dude! Nothing major, 2.5 F 2 R camber, almost parallel toe at front and a little in at the rear... and as much castor as i can get!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS thanks. I've got an Indy R so went rose jointed wishbones for castor too. When you talk about the triangulation of the front pick up points where have you braced them? Top and bottom? Thanks again.
@@seancarsonuk Yes! Great stuff! It's hard to explain but basically where the wishbone pickup U shape brackets sit on the chassis I have had plates put in that tie/triangulate the bottom edges of the U shape to the bottom edges of the chassis box section. Only small plates but have done the job.
Where does one find info on mounting a bike engine: drivetrain, differential, etc?
Great to give MK a call or AB Performance. They would guide you through things really well. The basics are very similar to a car powered kit... You still use a car rear diff and you still have a prop shaft... Just it's connected to an adapter that bolts on to the bike sprocket... so instead of driving a chain it drives a prop shaft. Bike engine choice is pretty crucial though in terms of reliability!
Can I ask you what chassis it is?
Modifying to this level a locost/westfield would not have the same result?
I'm from italy and those are so rare
At the moment I have a grande punto abarth with proper lsd and 280cv but I want a tool for the mountain, I can't decide between a mx5 turbo with 280hp or one of those imported from UK..
The reliability of the bike engines is good? Clutch how many miles before swap?
Hi Lorenzo. It’s an MK Indy RR chassis. Loads of manufacturers are now moving from older Ford Sierra based donor cars to Mazda mx5s which is cool. Westfields are fantastic along with Caterhams and I like the MNRs too.
Difficult to chose between a kit car and an mx5 turbo. They are both fantastic fun! At least in Italy you have much better weather than us in the UK! The mx5 turbos are great for the money, I built one last year and recently sold it to build an s2000 track/road car instead. Mx5 playlist...
th-cam.com/play/PL0NyyXFCy426unJs4F3zA4Q-LJb9tCsgx.html
The bike engines are certainly meant to be more temperamental than the car engines, especially the bike gearboxes. I have been lucky with my cbr fireblade engine, but I know others haven’t been!
He's right about the skill needed to handle these lightweight weapons. 100bhp in one of these would be enough for me on the road and I like to think I'm quite handy behind the wheel (don't we all!).
Totally agree too i’m sorry to say. I could go out tomorrow and take cbt, bike licence then get a 1000cc superbike. Could even be on track the next day on it... wouldn’t really be great though would it! Infact it would be downright madness... it’s not quite as bad as driving a kit car fast but similar in terms of being bad ideas haha! I really found trying out mx5s first to have my silly moments in and lots of slow rally car control days at oulton have made it somewhat accessible.
I have a car engined Westfield with about 150hp and even on the road you get to the stage of wanting more power. I think somewhere around the 200hp would make for an awesome 7. Bike engines are so good because of the reduction in weight and getting hp outputs up close to the 200hp mark. The 7 ethos is simplify and add lightness.
what make and model are the wheels
Hi Kimi, they are Compomotive CXRs :)
fun
Almost too much haha!
You should try torque seal rather then paint pen. It cracks if the bolt moves so it easier to see.
Will have a look at that! Either is better than nothing haha. They vibrate themselves to a million pieces!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS Great video, really interesting to see the difference between zetec and blade engine power.
I know what you mean about not being seen by other road users. I tried a Tiger on the road and felt so vulnerable. I now have a silver 911 and people still pull out on me every now and then, having clearly not seen me. Silver seems to make me invisible. I might add an orange stripe to improve my chances.
Totally! They just don't see you! Great stuff on the 911. What year did you go for? I am really tempted to go for a gen2 987 Cayman S now my s2000 is being sold.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I have a 1998 996 C2. I always wanted a 911 and it was the only one I could afford. I've done a lot to lighten it and it's made a big difference. It's fun to drive and rewarding to go fast in but it's taken a lot of development to get it there. It's also very handy to have the back seats as I have two kids (who love the car). I did my ARDS test in a Cayman at Thruxton and it's definitely the better car though. Having said that, if I was going for a two seater then I would be after an Elise or an Exige, I have a real thing about most road cars being far too heavy, but that's just my preference. I got the 911 to scratch an itch and it turns out that it's fun and practical, and I still love looking at its arse.
@@TheFleetflyer Fantastic! Glad to hear it! Really hope I can slide a Cayman about like I do the S2000! Sure will give it a go anyways haha! Ahh I struggle with the Lotus's. Just seem SO much money to even be an option these days :(. Sadly I feel like I 'must' own one at some point though regardless haha!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS I'm sure you'll do just fine getting a Cayman loose. When I drove one it was wonderfully balanced in stock form, whereas my 911 was an understeering pig of a thing until I improved it with many many changes. Having raced Formula Vee though, my heart will always belong to mid-engined lightweight cars, and there I will always long to return.
I have the choice between a raptor zx10r and a tiger Avon zetec turbo to buy.just don't know which one to pick.i will only use it on the roads.but in Portugal windy roads and uphill mostly.what.you think ?your opinion might help..thanks.
I think you can’t lose living in Portugal! Pick either and enjoy 🥰🥰🥰🙌. I honestly don’t know which I would choose!
Thanks man.tough one.im sure I will enjoy either.👍👍☺️
The MT75 gearbox is much better made and stronger than the type 9
I've got a Westfield with a 4age toyota engine coupled to a type 9 ford gearbox and I find it a great compromise because it'll potter around the lanes but at the same time it will rev and go like a stabbed rat when you want to give it the beans.
Yep! Friken perfect! I hate the type 9 boxes, but a 4age is hard to beat in a Westy!! On ITBs I guess???
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS yeah it is with omex 600 running the engine management.
@@carlfrizell2849 Bloody dreamy!
I love my Busa SR7.
Mine’s not a Lotus (or Caterham) but ... what’s that they say? ... Lots Of Trouble Usually Serious.
Haha! I can't imagine the cost of some of the original Lotus 7s now! Caterhams are just a bit too much for me, granted they do hold their value very well mind! Bet that busa sr7 is bloody brilliant!
I Love my Deman Motorsport SR7 ... www.dropbox.com/s/t4jh1wskvmoy8tk/2014-09-27%2012.46.00.jpg?dl=0
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS ... btw ... your vid is generating quite a bit of discussion at SevenSpot ... facebook.com/groups/SevenSpot/
Would really consider one of these, is it hard to make them road legal? Any issues with doing that
Hi Sam, all very doable. The easiest option is giving the car to MK or another kit car outfit to take care of the IVA for you. There is a no doubt a bike engined kit requires more attention to get through an IVA as you'd expect. Nothing too major though.
Hi, I've built a Locost zzr1100 BEC and I've set the ride height from the floor pan, front 95mm and rear 110 mm. Do you think that's too low. I also have a sump guard which sits 70mm off the ground. Thanks
I will measure how close mine is mate. I had to get a billet sump to replace the oem one as it sat too low. The sump guard will hopefully do it's job if you ever get close! I wonder how much the car will dive under braking too?
Great disussion thanks. Could I get some advice ?
I've ridden lots of bikes most recent being 149bhp Daytona 955i by no means slow with 60 over 3 secsd,
hence would be interested to get into something like this having had the taste of serious performance, I'm sure I could handle.
Not for road use just occasional track bike is no brainer and would like it a hoot. would probably be never road use, silly speeds aren't for the road anyway
Just kind of struck me this is the best way, dont ride anymore, done a few track days, but would be so cool to do this in a car but with bike guts.
How to get hold of something reasonable but well priced what would be a good starting point setup / brand etc? The MK was mentioned previous for instance ? What sort of price ranges ? Possible to build yourself in kit form? etc
Hi Antony, totally get you! I know quite a few who have moved over from bikes to these! They really are an awesome experience for the money! In my opinion I wouldn’t buy one new/in kit form as it’s just not cost effective compared to the ready built ones! Certainly a good time to buy one too in the middle of winter when so many consider selling through lack of usability. Regarding kit car manufacturers Caterhams are brilliant but expensive (hold their value mind), westfields are again a great well established company, MK have recently been bought out by kitcardirect and the new owners are fantastic, I love the chassis on the RR version like mine, like a kitcar on steroids! MNR also have a great reputation and I have been really impressed with GBS Zero kit cars developments recently. Many companies are now going away from their sierra bases and developing new kits based on the mx5s which I think is amazing and totally worth a look at. I should hopefully testing MKs RX5 chassis soon! In terms of engine application, if you loved the bikes then great to get a bike powered kit! Busas seem to be very popular! I love my cbr though!
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARSI forgot I had posted this!
I actually ended up start of this year getting an ex 80s formula ford !
Came with a working engine Blackbird CBR1100xx but state of finish was rough/unfinished and with the wrong body ( I've been trying to restore to more like original RF86).
It cost me just over £2k so was kinda bargain for such a potential car. The initial state was a bit of a shock though, some things good a lot bad and almost gave up and sold it once this year.
Originally was someone tried to make road legal but not completed/ in a very good state of completion... only recenly been getting further help and it starts as I was having problems with that and following the final steps to get it useful.
......not come a lot further with its project status given carona and I've not been fuloughed like many but done what I can/ got help with it.
The only downside its definitely NOT a roadcar or even normal track day car but can be used in some places.
I'm really excited to get it running, it should be amazing on a purposed single seater event but might go later for a MK hayabusa kind of thing.
2:48 - Heh, that's the same track as Car Throttle tests on
Curborough 🙌. Lovely little sprint track with a demon of a ditch running the length of the track... I’ve ended up in it 😂. Cheap to rent for the day. We usually go with a group called ‘the chequered flag’. £60 for the day inc food!
Mr,CD..you are very young,,why don't you Built Reverse Trike Race Car,,Now the craze of young people,,,Motorcycle Engine,,sequitial gearbox,,,,3wheel all disc brake,,Mid Engine will not vagg tail offroad, ,,,cheap to build and maintain,,1or 2 seater,,ONLY 1 problem is Reverse Gear ⚙ 😀,,, Have to use electric motor,,,🤝🍻
Hi, you say that you triangulated, do you have any plans of those triangles?
Unfortunately not Augustin. Pretty basic though... Just wherever a front U bracket was welded onto box section would then be strengthened with small plates that tied them into the bottom of the box section.
What diff ratio do u run and what mods are needed to be done engine to make it safe for track use?
Hi Dustin, I ran a 3.9 final drive for the first couple of years and it was amazing! Limited me to shorter circuits though as the terminal speed was so low. Have now moved to a 3.34 but i all honesty it was a mistake. I think the 3.62 is the one to go for. I run an AB Performance billet sump with baffle plate which is essential for sump clearance issues and to protect from surge. Oil cooler and a large electric water pump really help too.
@@CIRCUITDRIVERCARS i want to use the R1 motor. u had any experiences with these motors?
Never used one myself matey. Imho they seemed a little low on power and I know a few who have had gearbox issues with Them. I guess it depends on year you are going for though as that was the older motors 👍
Ive got 5.5k to spend on one of these to take to a track. Any recommendations?
So tricky as I'd be pointing my dollar towards a sweet NC mx5 with track mods or even a little turbo mk1/2 mx5 at that price :).