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Can A Blackmagic Pocket 6K Pro Compare To A ARRI 35?!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ส.ค. 2024
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#pocket6kpro #arri35 #cinematch #filmconvert
00:00 - intro
00:36 - New ARRI 35
03:07 - CineMatch
05:31 - Sample Footage
I made a MAJOR boo-boo in this video. On the close up eye macro shot for the pocket 6k pro the clip when imported was kept in its original Gen4 color science which is why the banding and colors look to be breaking so much worse than expected. The thumbnail is actually it converted to Gen5 and it looks a lot better. The points I mention definitely are still true when comparing them but it’s not as extreme!
I’m totally confused. The opening A/B comparisons were completely different scenes with completely different light. While it is really easy to make greens and browns from different cameras look very similar, the most useful place to see differences in camera color science is with skin tones. Local color, local contrast, Color separation and complexity all show up in well exposed skin. And an even more useful example is when that skin is both being struck by sunlight and in shade.I think it would be much more useful if this side by side comparison of the same person’s skin was made in your next post.
Did you watch anything past the intro? Lol I explain that this is a non scientific comparison because well I don’t have access to filming with the actual $70K camera right now. Which is why I positioned the video early on as me just finding as close examples as I could to show the cameras characteristic differences. Sorry you weren’t happy with the video. I’d certainly love to get my hands on the camera for an actual comparison.
@@initialfocus I think the main confusion is that you seem to be missing the conversion LUT on the ARRI in those opening shots, so we only see it in logc
@@initialfocus Sorry, based on your post’s title, I was expecting an actual comparison.
I re opened the project and found the LOG C4 arris new lut was not found in my lut folder because I had to re install my OS the other day so it exported without the lut on that first comparison clip. My bad 🤦🏻♂️
That’s fair. Apologizes for unintentionally click baiting. Very fine line we all have to ride between something we know will get clicks but without straight up lying. I understand this can be easily misinterpreted.
Great video but in my opinion, the eye shot comparison shouldn't be compared in the first place because the clip that was shot using the BMPCC6KPRO doesn't have enough light to expose the subject as per the clip shot with Arri is well exposed. Overall, thank you for this great video! I love learning.
The eye comparisons aren’t very convincing because of the bad lighting and honestly because the Arri footage must have been shot with 20 - 40k lenses the footage would be vastly better… Put that 1k lens on the Arri and the 20-40k lens on the bmpcc6k… That’s a test…. -
The A35 would still look better if the lenses were reversed.
As a German (who also lives 5min from Headquarters in Munich) I can say to you, that in German your first pronounciation is correct, the second one sounds very american....
So you’re saying my RRRREEEE sounds more right than the AIREEE? 🙌🏼😂
@@initialfocus Yes, absolutely! You can also listen to yourself, how Arri Staff says it:
th-cam.com/video/zw5AsP_4Jl4/w-d-xo.html&start_radio=1&rv=zw5AsP_4Jl4&t=18
Image quality isn't a point of inflection on which we should measure or compare these cameras, because A) it's excellent either way and B) it far reached the place of subjectivity. Now, to the reason why ARRI costs north of 100k$ are ten fold: 1) Reliability 2) Serviceability 3) Market price retention in the long run (rentals don't lose as much money when changing stock so they are prone to invest and thereby keep it worthy of high cost) 4) Excellent customer support throughout the life cycle of the camera 5) Ergonomics and usability on a big set 6) ARRI's outstanding reputation and excellence 7) Use in 90% of Oscar nominated films throughout cinema history - Kubrick famously owned and aided in development of ARRI cameras for his films 8) Pin-point match-ability between each and every ARRI camera because most use the same sensor, ARRI famously doesn't chance high resolutions 9) Prestige factor of owning the literally best money can buy and rates and production opportunities that may associate with that 10) Very good choices on the used market and guess what, ARRI will still service it for a life time because it's theirs as well as yours.
Unconverted RAW vs footage converted to REC709 seems impossible to compare
Both clips are shown in their respective raw formats (BRAW and ARRI RAW) and then also shown with each companies rec709 conversion. With that I wanted to see how it handled noise, colors, skin tones, etc. just a fun idea I thought. Hindsight I wish I took some of the clips and tried to grade them to see how close I could push the pocket footage to match.
@@initialfocus Perhaps you just want to start over. We are all anxious to see the comparison. But this just doesn’t seem to work. Also, the comparison clips are so short but you barely have any time to look at anything.
@@putneynewsservice7340 Spoiler: The A35 is better in every possible way than the BM cameras (except price)
Even the shot with the campfire - WTH? This is user error. Night shot compare to a day shot and expect the same dynamic range? Hmmm… This is a major fail.
The ARRI is just gorgeous. Ursa isn't far behind. But my bank account loves my 6k pro ha ha. She does get a beautiful image though. Also, one of the best things I ever did was dedicate an entire month to color science and grading. Its amazing how little I actually knew to get good shot from BRAW. I knew what to do but not why. Its a really deep conversation with yourself when you dig in and understand how many layers down one decision will affect another.
And not to hijack the thread, but cant remember if I mentioned the new BM firmware update and the "gyro" setting. For quite a few weeks I didn't much care, but on a curiosity run, I discovered it actually fixes the rolling shutter issue on the BMPCC6k pro. Havent heard many people mention this. RS is one my only major gripes with this camera, sometimes its REALLY bad. When I tried the "gyro" setting I noticed it immediately corrected RS and its insane. Of course you must shoot Braw for the metadata and if you use a zoom you have to input what lens you have dialed in. Also obviously it doesnt work with OIS lenses or gimbles. but for straight hand held, "gyro" almost completely wipes out rolling shutter, and the actual stabilization looks quite solid and doesnt warp the image much at all. anyway, back to regularly scheduled programming. have a great rest of your weekend
what was the best resource you used for color science?
@@damienthorn2917 well its a long answer, but theres3 main parts: color science in general, blackmagic's color science relating to their cameras, and color grading as an art. "Daria Fissoun" is amazingly talented and some of her older videos in resolve are outstanding. But the important part is to break everything down to digestible chunks that make sense. its really not as difficult as people make it out to be, and once you actually understand whats going on, its rather quite simple. its like learning any language. at first you can only decipher things to make sense, but then you can start conversations, so to speak, as you become more fluent. I would also suggest looking up videos on colorists who worked on films, and theyre method. Look for ones who talk about the process, and not just the tools they used. you just dont want to be the guy who slaps a LUT on something "cuz it looks cool". I mean nothing wrong with that, but youre not learning and when something doesnt look right, its just one band aid after another. anyway sorry for rambling. best of luck and make some beautiful imagery! no mater what, just get out there and shoot and experiment and have fun. We can get frustrated but dont ever let it bring you down. this is art.
ARRI is a contraction of ARnold and RIchter. Arnold and Richter. Hence the AR from Arnold and the RI from Richter. Easy!
Are-ree?
Ghosting in forest is a combo of wider aperture and less-differentiated lighting than in the ARRI shot.
We’ve got two Arri Alexa’s at work ..and now an FS6 what do I film on ? My phone 😂
Hello. How would "cinematch" work along with "color space transform" in Davinci?
Or by using Cinematch we don't have to use Color space transform?
can you please compare the pocket 4K to an arri thats quite in competition with it
Thank you mate. Very great comparison video. Btw how do you compare 6kpro vs 4k? Are they close to eatch others?
This Aspect ratio is fire on my 11in iPad. 4x3?
Great comparo. I look forward to your iPhone 14 🆚 your Black Magic comparison. Gr8 vid as usual. 🎥 🇺🇸
The reason of the price difference between the Blackmagic and the Arri does not come down to Image quality alone. Most semiprofessional camera sensors should be capable of delivering a quality for professional use. What you buy in addition to the camera itself and its superior connectivity for a hollywood production environment, customer support etc etc what drives the price. And as you mention, the the Nuances in image quality.
However, its great how achieving cinematic image quality has democracized.
I remember the times when you needed to put a "35mm adaptor" in front a Sony VX2000 where the Image of an DSLR lens was projected on a screen that you actually filmed to achieve a film look 😂
What shoes are you sporting in that beach shot? I dig them.
Haha thanks! They are The Rocks Under Amour workout shoes 😂
Lol
U didn't apply the Rec.709 convertion lut at the start :D
This isn't a meaningful comparison, it means nothing. Two cameras with different footage, at different times, under different conditions... Why are you even calling this a comparison? I've watched a number of your videos over the years and have always looked at you as a beginner camera operator. However, at this point you have done enough of these videos to know better. All things being equal, with a good director and DP these cameras are are virtually interchangeable as far as image quality goes. If you are a garbage DP it doesn't matter what camera you have, you will produce garbage. But a good DP will make due with any modern camera. Time for you to be a little more scientific about your reviews.
Code doesn't work on the plugin.
How about 12K URSA vs Arri 3.7/4k
I don't like this comparison, because you're using a rec709 color space. Blackmagic is notorious for having second rate rec709 luts, they really should improve them. But if you did this comparison in color management/wide gamut intermediate, you'd have way better colors from the Pocket 6k and better dynamic range. I would encourage you to try this. Bottom line, Arri did a way better job with their luts, but that difference diminishes in color management
Interesting. So what color space would you recommend setting my timeline in for BRAW? Always open to feedback.
@@initialfocus hey Michael. If you shot in Braw, I would go to projects settings > color management > change color science to YRGB color managed > uncheck the "automated color management" tab > select "HDR Davinci wide gamut intermediate" under color processing mode > select "rec709 gamma 2.4" under output color space > then save the project at the bottom. The moment you save, you're going to see a very dramatic difference in color and dynamic range. Make sure to grade with HDR color wheels, so you can get the benefits of the extra colors and dynamic range. Primary wheels won't get this benefit
I'll do a video response on this and let you know when it's up. Love your channel, keep it up 👍
@@leebrandt33 I am eagerly waiting for this video. let me go subscribe
honestly, in general, the setup step is missing from quite a few "comparison" videos, and even color grading tutorials. Project set up and color management settings are key to understanding processes and following along. I even saw a color grading video where the person was using the "film emulation LUTS" in resolve without doing a color transform to cineon, and then complaining about how it just makes everything dark. literally hundreds of people agreeing and mocking the LUTS without even realizing how to use them or what they are even for in the first place.
@@benjaminmagambo3849 I realized that I made the post with my second channel, so subscribe to this one instead. I'll be uploading the video today or tomorrow. Cheers
great video, great comparison. very detailed.
Loved the video, man and so the lightin!!! (headshot) Well, you're comparing a $ 2,000 camera with a $$$$$$$$ Arri/erri, lol, but I'm very happy you did it so people can understand how good is the camera we have! What's the lens you use?
Thanks for your work Michael
Thanks for watching! 🙌🏼
I think if you woulda lit the eye similarly in your test shot, having the correct amount of light, with the appropriate angles and diffusion, you would have noticed a nearly unrecognizable difference. Even if this is a non-scientific comparison - there's no way you didn't own enough light to do that at least. It is highly important to match some things in a test shot, if your discussion is regarding sensors - lighting the scene properly is what makes these images look the way they do, it's not as simple as just a close up with 2 different sensors. The lighting will bring color, images depth, sauration, and clarity back into that shot you presented.
haha, I always love looking at BM fanboy comments for humor and entertainment. It is like you think that Hollywood doesnt have the talent or resources to use whatever they want but chooses Arri over BM "just because." If you cant tell the difference between the Arri 35 and a BMPCC6K Pro then you need to quit the hobby or profession and get an eye exam.
You forgot to color grade
ITT: Blackmagic fanboys are big mad at how bad their camera looks against the new Arri 35.
Whoa, thank you so much! Not that I could afford a Arri, but it really nailed down my decision to get a bmpcc 😂
The Arri 35 looked so much better than any BM camera, it wasnt even funny. BM fanboys are hilarious!
Your 2 opening comparison shots are 2 differents shots. No need to watch anything else. You clearly have an issue editing your video. Next time try to get an intro that kinda match your clickbaity title. then the rest of the color grading errors all other the place. This video is so confusing that it actually leaves you with less information at the end that what you had without watching it. Just a confusing mess.
Thank you for your time, BUT! To me it is completely useless test trying to recreate same scenes. The only one way to really see the deference is to shoot on them side by side. Sorry))
bmp sud 2 update another camera
you spelled Arri right, it is not Aerri. I am German and used to work at ARRI.
Not even close. And also very funny when you said that you are confident that its easy to match them up 16:35 . If you want to make advertisements for some product doesn't mean you need to say not professional stuff. This video could be much better if you put more honesty in it. Good luck anyway.
Great comparison 🤘 Love the Shawshank clip🤣
I completely agree with your points on resolution. Personally I prefer larger pixels (lowlight) over higher resolution.
This is a pretty rough video. Recommend skip.
I bet these youtube Full-Frame fans think this camera is trash. lol
Good Job
Thanks!
Спасибо. очень здоровское видео. Полезное. Удачи.
My God he's soo close to the camera.
Man I thought it was just me, but I stamp this dude is too close to the camera.
One more BIG Boo-Boo. I thought the plug-in used, and who sponsored the video was Cinematch.
You gave thanks at the end to another plug-in that does film emulation called FilmConvert.
Hopefully the sponsor hasn’t seen it yet.
Not a boo-boo lol FilmConvert is the parent company who makes Cinematch that’s why I thanked both names as I use them both all the time. We just happen to focus on cinematch in this one 👍🏼
kinda pointless comparison by using the wrong lut with the arri footage
I didn’t…. It was the new lut for this camera
Why would you compare cameras by using different shots? Entirely pointless. I don't compare two people's ability to cook by letting them make two different recipes.
Have you seen any cooking competition show ever? 😂
if there was an Ofcom equivalent for youtube.. you would be and should be banned.... too much inaccurate info and misleading content
Noisy fan. Taking more than 3 minutes to warm up. Rip off NVMe storage. Propitiatory Firmware. No ND's. Clunky menu. - Good dynamic range. Too expensive.
So much energy wasted :-)
Most of the video is about colours.
X-Rite Digital ColorChecker SG and there is very little difference left,even grain will improve.
The price for Arri dynamic range is very high.
So you dont think color separation is a thing? Wow, just wow.
This test made no sense - not saying BMPCC would out perform ARRI but even in the close up eye shot, you’re talking about noise and colors - the BMPCC shot was heavily underexposed so of course the color rendering would be off and it would be noisier, while the ARRI shot is far better exposed. This is a big fail.
How about you make a "properly exposed" eye shot and upload it with the name "My Blackmagic camera is as good as an Arri 35" and go viral. Obviously, you will become a laughing stock but bring on the comedy!
@@mpbootcamp7009 You sound absolutely retarded. Did I ever say the BMPCC footage would look better than the ARRI? I simply said you cannot do a comparison where one shot was severely underexposed and compare it to another shot that was properly exposed. If that is too difficult for you to comprehend, you're an idiot that doesn't even deserve a response. Bye.
WTF is this video? Where’s the side by side comparison? How can you make a test of two different sensors in two different conditions? I feel dumb I fell for the clickbait
What do I think?
I think with camera systems like BMD cams and others in that class and price bracket, and if you're a small or no-budget producer and you hire an Arri, I think you're fired for wasting a sizeable portion of a limited budget on only slightly improved IQ that a general audience will never notice if their life depended on it. That's what I think.
Filmmaking is part art, part business. Most small to medium b and c-list cinematographers/producers should NOT be shooting on Arri. Arri was built explicitly to be priced for Hollywood hire. IQ is one selling point, not the sale all up. Hollywood needs reliability because there's a lot of money tied up in time.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with BMD and similar for 99.99999999% of productions.
If you're on a big budget set and can afford an Arri package then go for it. It makes business sense. If not, you're just a nitpicky moron in my opinion.
You wanna know what kind of cinematographer/producer doesn't get a callback? One that wastes a ton of money on incremental IQ improvements and puts a production way over budget.
Dude, you really think the difference is slight? Wow. I am watching this compressed YT footage on a calibrated monitor and the differences are so glaring that I cannot get past it.
Super-Cool Video. Thanks a lot. (from Germany)
The correct vocal sound, when you say „Arri“…sorry for my poor english…is totally different…from what i heard from you in this video.
Again.
Sorry for that. 🫣
At the beginning…the „A“…you sound like „Aiii“…is different in german. It would be much more like „Ahh…“, or „Uhh“.
On top of that…at the end…the „i“…you sounded like „iee“…
Is totally different in german.
Much more like „ih“, with no „e“ sound.
In total: it is not „aiirrieeh“. It goes like „ahhrrih“. Or even better: „Uhhrih“. Because our „A“…resembles better your „Uhh“… 🙈🎯🤡🥳🏆🫣🤓
I guess this is one of the craziest comments ever. 🫣 But it is true. 🤡
hahaha first 30 seconds into the video and a WTF moment.. showing log footage of two different scenes and then applying conversion lut to only one camera./... wtf.. so sloppy
can you leave to link of the arri footages ? @michaeltobin
Colors are horrible on both
Omg horrible comparison🤦🏽♂️ I’m blocking you! And you’re over annunciating
while you’re explaining I’m done!
Unless you want to use an Alexa 35 to make videos for you tube, which would lead you to be a patient in some psychiatric hospital, I would say that you could also compare the Alexa 35 with an Iphone 13 which the images on youtube would be however similar. But one question I would like to ask, is anyone who spends $70,000 on a cinema camera really so stupid?