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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 มี.ค. 2020
- Is Self Levelling worth it?
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Finally auto bed levelling, that actually levels the bed automatically.
"Auto bed tramming" never sounded as catchy I guess.
@Will Swift Beds inherently warp with heat, abl is supposed to compensate for that. Aside from that being able to adjust the bed level is just a good idea since there can be a hundred different reasons why one corner wouldn't match up to the other in height
ratrig
@Will Swift "why don't they just do the impossible" has self explanatory answers. BUT that's only half the problem. The gantry has to be square to the bed. Whether you go fixed bed or fixed gantry the bed being a flat plane and the moving components remaining square is a struggle. When the printer heats up the unlike metals expand at different rates. You also have weight. The weight of a toolhead or gantry as it gets to the center point has an effect on how close the nozzle is to the bed. We are working at consumer DIY levels. Nothing's perfect so we compensate.
In my short 5 years of 3D printing, not much compares to the feeling of not worrying about if your bed is level.
All 3D printers should be like this in the future
It leveled it so fast! it just snapped into place after the probe! So cool.
Excellent iteration. It appears most people have never seen something like this and don't understand the true advantages. The greatest benefit here is that the nozzle actually trams perpendicular to the build plate, resulting in practically identical parts across the entire build surface accurately and automatically. The most common form of automatic bed leveling today is not tramming, but merely drags the nozzle at varying angles at a mostly correct distance using a virtual map. Other benefits include less computation for the printing sequence, and of a 3 point bed system in general, having honed flat build plates STAY that way.
Thank you !
Really simple, logical, and efficient. That's great. Thanks.
I came across your channel with a search for a self-levelling bed. +1 SUBS!
I mean the whole auto leveling is really cool and all, but I was more amazed by the speed of the head. That's impressively stable for something moving so fast.
yes, this printer can move :) studio.th-cam.com/users/videoSpZlMYXZW-o/edit
@@MirageC That link doesn't work for us people that don't own your YT account ;)
@@MirageC can't see the link
Please upload I would like to see it if possible. Thanks
@@ManIkWeet jokes on u us smart people just hacked into his account and watched it anyways
Giving the bed 3 degrees of freedom, ingenious, yet simple, why haven't I thought about that before
That's a cool design. The only other printer I've seen do something similar was the Voron Printers. The 1.8 has 2 Z motors which tilt the bed and the 2.4 has 4 Z motors that tilt the whole gantry. The bed does not move at all
DUDE, that's epic AF!
Just brilliant! What a great project!
I have a Fabtotum printer which I love for its multi functionality, but as a printer it is a few light years away from the performance you aachieve with the hevort. It makes me wanna have one as well. Maybe one Day.
this is the craziest thing i have seen in 3d printing so far.... bring a kit!
In the works NOW!
amazing work!!! colossal background!
As 3 axis printing becomes a thing a bed like this could really make a powerful printer if the slicer could utilize it properly.
definitely!
If you are thinking of anything beyond a bed leveling mcode, we aren’t talking about 3 axis printing anymore. There are more capable kinematic options for 4+ axis printing, but this is a pretty cool approach to 3+2 axis printing.
I know this comment is 3 years old but just came to say, someone has since accomplished this by using very sturdy ball joint assemblies and long mounting screws since then. In fact it might even have been the OP of this video I don't remember. But there is another guy in China who's created a system with MUCH greater freedom of rotation, I think like almost full freedom between rotation/tilt of the print head and tilt/rotation of the build surface. He printed a vase then printed designs all over the curved outside surface with different colors and it works pretty well. We'll get there with home and diy printers soon 🙂
Im so glad i found you this is what i want to achieve plus more man Im a huge fan brother from Seattle I love your tech and builds efficiency badazz! these are the parts im into my top companies love it im so hyped
Thank you! Make sure to join the FB support group, quite a lot is happening there ;) facebook.com/groups/hevort
i think i will start make my 3d auto leveling aswell. that work really nice
This looks sick!
that's just amazing.
Simply impressive. And i'm talking about the whole machine
Really cool. Thanks
I had a thought. You could have two hotends at different angles on an axis, and tilt the bed depending on which one you want, so you would get the benefits of a switching hot-end setup without the servo, weight, etc.
I have a HEVO and I was thinking to mod it. I think I'll made this mod.
I would love to see that being used for non planer 3d Printing
Me too! I need a slicer/software partner :)
@@MirageC dude, you're preaching to the choir. I'd have already tried to do a hybrid belt printer if the slicer wasn't so awful to figure out.
@@MirageC I saw this article that this company called nonplanar that sells elongated nozzles for this type of printing (3dprint.com/265174/start-non-planar-3d-printing-today-on-your-ender-3-with-nonplanar-xyz/). This guy from Germany did a masters thesis on it (tams.informatik.uni-hamburg.de/research/3d-printing/nonplanar_printing/index.php) and used slic3r to do the prints. He also includes github files for Slic3r which I have know a idea how it's supposed to be implemented. Maybe you can understand all that stuff and make it work for your printer because that would be the next level and amazing.
I hope more manfuactureres adopt this soon, it's such a time saver, my bed need releveling every week or so, this would make it so much easier.
How? You can do the same with software...
@@GRBtutorials No you can't, you can only poorly emulate it, which negatively affects the print quality compared to a properly leveled bed.
Brilliant!
coolest printer yet!
I can say One think WOW ... want to have printner like that awesome
This is absolut awesome
Fantastic! Could you show in more detail the bed attachment? How does it swivel? In the render we could see it briefly, but could you elaborate? Thank you as always!
That's so smart.
просто охренительно! Высший пилотаж!)))
one day man, one day I'll do something like this too!
Wonder if I could start it small with like some crappier steppers to do very small movement on the 3 points (maybe geared to let them actually do their job) and like M3 screws to have a pitch so fine it won't drop when the system turns off...
Your stuff sure inspires crazy ideas.
Thank you! Yes, any cheap stepper can get you pretty far. Using imagination and creativity will make the rest, no matter how much funds or resources you have available ;)
cool ! may i know what pro & con between this and prusa bed leveling
Ohh fish, this is amazing.
I Love it!
I also use a mirror tile as a build surface with salt crystal to grip the first layer, here is an in-depth PDF of the technique to apply the salt, written by the inventor, it is dissolved in water and then applied with a kitchen towel or cloth to the hotbed, when the water has evaporated salt crystals are left and PLA sticks to the bed in the same fashion as the Ultrabase surfaces.
@t
www.uantwerpen.be/images/uantwerpen/container11343/files/bonding_pla_with_salt_water_v20160713.pdf
Great work, congratulations!
I am trying to do an autoleveling system like this. Could you point me a direction to a firmware that runs such a routine? I am using duet wifi2 board with duex5 expansion board. Thank you!
very good work ! can you share more on how to configure duet to behave like yours with 3 indimendent z steppers ? thx and take care
it's perfect
Very impressive design)
Thank you :) And it works great!
NICE!!!!!
The two tubes next to the nozzle are the cooling vents, or are just two rods for protecting the head? Regards
Would this be worth it for anything other than glass beds? Because the imperfect surface of metal build plates would necessitate mesh bed levelling either way, I would guess, leading me to believe there isn't much need for literal bed levelling when you're already doing mesh bed levelling. Nevertheless, this is extremely cool, and will probably be a game changer if build surface imperfections can be controlled for some other way in the future.
Now I hate my printer and want yours. Badly. This is awesome!!!
How does this work in the sofware or do u run it before u start, also is there a sofware that uses ur leveling as an axis to cant it to get better angle so have less supports needed?
Wow, that's interesting. Have you tried to do 5DOF printing with this setup?
EDIT: Apparently you have lol. This might be interesting for tool changing and ASMBL and to "iron" the top surface. Although that can be achieved otherwise too.
The design kind of reminds me of Nicholas Seward designs haha.
Because the single nozzle and the probe are level to each other, then you only need to level the bed. If there was a 2x2 array of nozzles would you need to adjust the nozzle array and the bed?
Wow!🤯
Hey Mirage, i was wondering what you used to build your insulation?
Wondering is it possible to be like a axial printer on the top with a delta bed on the bottom, make it able to make twisting print...
Hi, what kind sticker do you use (between glass and aluminum heated bed) ?
Really liked how the glass sticks without any clips.
crasher it is a thermal silicone sheet. See it here :th-cam.com/video/IzifvD5SfN8/w-d-xo.html
With this would it be possible to print without supports simply by tilting the bed to reduce the overhang angle during printing?
Spent the video singing along, and had to rewatch cuz I missed everything
Is it possible to homing with excessive Z-axis twist?
I wonder if maybe the tool head is hitting the bedplate.
Are there any alternatives?
Very nice. What you think about use ballscrew also on x axis?
Motors would have to rotate MUCH faster due to pitch of the ballscrews. And given the back and forward movement switch required by those two axis, I cannot see it as a positive thing. If this was a CNC and required strength in XY while no need for speed, this would be good.
Wow, that is awesome. And complicated. But... You have a de-facto 5 degree 3D printer... A little slicer tweaking and you could do some amazing things with that. If you added linkages to the mechanism, and some extra motors, you could have a full 6 degree printer.
Just a little slicer tweaking. That's going to have to wait until cura 10.4. it would be nice if it was fully optimized. 🙂The planar prints are one thing that has to be explored.
That's amazing! Great work! BTW, how does the filament stick so perfectly on the bed without any heating? Is just perfect leveling all that is needed?
bed is heated and I am using Magigoo bed adhesive.
'True' self levelling. This is my dream. So done with having to do manual and 'adjusted' meshing (UBL etc), that doesn't really level anything.
what filament is the green parts printed on?
Watching videos from this channel I realized how boring are the other channels reviewing prusa-clones from china. Great job!
amazing creation i have two questions, could you upgrade it by adding four of those induction bed leveling probes in each corner so that it would update the balance of the bed dynamically during printing ?
and could you use the bed tilting ability during printing to enable more convenient non-planar printing angles ? / use it to print overhangs or arches with a real angle ?
thanks for the great video, very inspiring !
Thank you for your comment. I am not sure what you mean by dynamically adjust the bed dynamically during print. This is a CoreXY, the bed is moving downwards to create the Z axis, therefore reference to the XY plane would be difficult to be made as the print progresses. The weight of the printed part is assumed to not affect the build plate attitude/position. Even if it does, this would be happening very gradually and be compensated by the plastic being squished a little less against the previous layer.
As for the non planar printing, yes it is the intention to use eventual 3+2 axis slicer capability to achieve greater overhang angles.
Envy engaged
Does it possible to remake a new video on how to make self level z step motor? i mean the whole process.
What material are you printing directly to the glass with?
Mind-blowing Would love to copy your design if its opensource :)
nice
Huh, I may need to grab an SKR Pro V1.2 over the regular V1.4 Turbo just so I can do this :D
Good morning. I want to ask you, can i do this with my Merlin motherboard? Is marlin can do this?
Hello Sir
Does the printer also compensate for crowned bedsurface while printing. Like the G29 command
in Marlin.
Thank you for the answer.
Regards Daniel
Yes, I am using mesh bed compensation (G29) as well as self leveling (G32). All done through the Duet control board.
im building hypercube , but the part with the programming im stuck .:( do you have a tutorial how to make a program
I want one of these. Is there a BOM and STLS/github?
That is really fast printing! how is it possible?
So when you want to print a cube, will it still be a cube when you're done printing?🤔🤔🤔 How about making the bed flat level and parallel so it stays that way?
Volcano nozzle? And, with the BL Touch, it doesn't seem to lose accuracy with that fast of a probing?
Never had issue with innaccurate probing at those speen. And yes that was a Volcano heater block.
wait did you have a heated bed there - or it wasnt printing ABS? Or how did it stick so well to the bed surface? I mean you just put on the mirror surface and start printing instantly, so it shouldnt have time to heat up from the heating element.
Awesome feature, I need to build this! What hardware and software do you use?
I am using Duet Wifi control board with RepRap Firmware V2. Read more here: www.hevort.com
With this is it now possible to do true non-planar printing operations like 5-axis milling machines? Since you can tilt the bed, some parts of prints wouldn't need supports or can be printed for optimal surface finish.
Exactely, this is the goal. Now only a software is required.
Great kinematic! I'm about to build a new CoreXY machine, and I will definitly implement something similar!
About software, I made some experimentations to 3D print a sphere, and have it sliced as if it was a plane:forum.duet3d.com/topic/10934/5-axis-3d-printing/13?_=1592983855969
The idea is to map the STL sphere to a plane, slice it, and then map back the G-Code plane to a sphere.
Did you come up with this independently, or did you see similar solutions? It's impressively quick. I'm only aware of the Railcore II doing triple axis Z in 2018
Triple Z has been around for a while. Duet had this capability all along. I simply developped a system that would maintain the center of the bed in the same XY coordinates along all possible attitude for eventual non planar printing. I initially started with another approach involving linear rods, but if was not working well.
is it necessary to have linear rails for the Z axis? I get that for the high speed moving X and Y they provide better rigidity, but considering the Z axis barely moves, why not just use 3 rods, they are a lot cheaper?
Yes rods would work too. I chose rails for compactness and maximize print area.
great idea, but this kind of leveling helps only when the bed is plane, cause for this case you need a software solution that during printing the printer correct the Z-level depends on the nozzel position in XY.--> overengeneered.
That is correct, software compensation of the irregularities from the print surface are still being mapped and stored for each build plates. Once the map loaded, the printer will level the build plate to the best possible attitude. Printing can then start using the topographic software compensation and tapper it off after X number of layers.
@@MirageC to be honest I read today mich regarding that Project. Very nice. I can imagine that if the head could be rotate would be also nice addon.
у меня один вопрос - зачем? у меня принтер последний раз требовал настройки стола пол года назад, только потому , что я менял сопло. из чего должен быть сделан принтер если у него всё время перекашивает поверхность стола????
I like the way this printer is running looks like it can aslo take some abusing rough unit were can i find the plans to build something like this
Look at the links in the video description, you will find the Thingiverse page as well as a Facebook support group. :)
@@MirageC sounds good thanks for sharing
music was a bit loud buddy! great video tho :)
do you think a zesty nimble or flex3drive can keep up with high speeds that the hevort can push out?
Unfortunately no. Zesty Nimble uses fairly high gear ration due to worm gear config. While this is good recipe for torque, it affects maximum speed. Plus the cable would start have flexing artifact from those steep acceleration and Jerk values.
The real auto bed levelling
Do you still have the bed floating on springs or mounted solid to the frame under it?
Springs. They allow thermal expansion from the plate and a very convenient to protect the heatbreak from user mistake ;)
Hello,good job are you using Duet3D?
AlphaZ thank you for the kind words. Yes I am using a DuetWifi combined to a Duex5 expansion board.
hmmmm nice
Mhh... I might consider building myself a CoreXY 3D Printer to replace my Prusa i3 taking up a somewhat unamusing amount of space in my closet due to the Y-Axis moving back and forth but I kinda have to wonder where the benefit of using two extra stepper motors to do _actual_ hardware based bed levelling with 3 independent Z-Axis is as opposed to just doing a 9-Point Mesh bed levelling and compensating in software?
I guess Multimaterial 3D Printing, like how I'm now doing with my MMU2S equipped i3 MK3S, will not be an out of the box option, eh?
Software compensation is still being done on the HevORT, same as what you are using on your Prusa. Software compensation should only be used to map the variation of build plate flatness. Bringing that build plate and all its variations to a levelled position is what the 3 Z actuation points will do. Larger build plates should not use software to compensate the levelling, this means that Z axis will need to work harder to maintain nozzle height. This will limit achievable speed and quality. HevORT will bring the build surface to the best possible attitude from the start and then software compensate Z for surface mesh deviations. Software compensation will then gradually fade off to null over a certain number of layers.
@@MirageC Sounds reasonable as an argument 🤔
what MM/s is this?
Is this compatible with mesh bed levelling? I understand that if you have the bed restricted at all you will experience some sort of warp
This Z axis allows for Banks of about 30 degree without any constraint. No warp.
wow
How much this machine cost and does delivery available in india?
Hey, can you tell me how you manage it to actually level the bed before printing? I use a Duet board and 3 z-Motors too, but it is only compensating during the printing by moving the z-axes...
You should be able to set your probe locations in your bed.g file. Then if you run a G32 in your Start G-Code (Try to do it after your bed comes to temp) then it should compensate.
legacyofbob is correct, I use G32 command at start of print after bed has reached temp. See details here: duet3d.dozuki.com/Wiki/Bed_levelling_using_multiple_independent_Z_motors
Ok, thank both of you for your answers. I think I am running into problems because i also use three top Enstops (z=0) as well as the BLTouch. I first want to level the bed more or less with the enstops and after that i want to use the BL Touch to level exactly. I'm going to try to write a macro that is run after the endstop levelling. It will re-config the axis levelling to BLtouch. This way it may work :)
Why do you need 4 sample points when leveling? A plane is defined by 3 points. Just curious.
The thing is that no build plate is perfect, therefore if one corner is lifted the 3 point positioning might miss it. The 4 point will average the deviation throughout the bed.
🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔1. Why not gyroscope MEMS sensor to the tray, and 6 axis robotic arm and hand with toolchanger ability? That way you can build up an SIPlace machine and even a whole mini manufacturing line if you can chain up the printbeds/trays. 2. What would happen if you replace filament with granulated plastic, and use compressed air to spray/shoot out the melted plastic/materials like inkjet printers? 3. Why on earth can not be seen buildplate/eject-load tray function in between 3d printers? 4. Vacuum locked buildplate or material lock? 🤔🤔🤔🤔
Many good questions and Idea. Thank for the interrest and sharing. This is still a DIY hobby printer, robotic arms and gyroscope sounds nice but a bit out of reach for most at the moment. Filament is still the best option out there for rapid and consistent 3d printing. Some new options are being developped, but I will not enter that race for the moment. This printer does tilt the bed 30 degree forward for parts ejection with the help of 2 servo tappers.
@@MirageC Thank you. I am just brainstorm here. But I have few more questions: 1.This tilting is not what Kossel printers (with some tweaking) already can do IMHO with 3 arms instead tilting the bed? Because seems to me basically a "reverse" Kossel 🤔🤔🤔 2. Why most of the 3D printers are using cube chassis instead of a dome? Why is the build plate always a sheet instead of any form? Wouldn't be possible to print from angle or follow the form? IMHO you couldn't make fine forms, or can't target any point in your workspace if you are only describing your 3D space with squares/cubes... I mean XYZ still missing the angle 🤔 Maybe the earlier idea to spray the material is little bit technically too much, but as far as I remember inkjet printer cartridge electronics are using fluid surface tensions and electricity to shoot the drops on paper. Right? In any color... What would be to use the same technics to print out 3d objects? I have already know some printers are able to print embossed 🤔🤔 BLTouch is a nice tool, but don't we have IR distance sensors available on market? Wouldn't be much faster to scan the surface with multiple beams at once? One right-to-left move and you have the surface? 🤔🤔
Say the bed starts off REALLY skewed at like 30 degrees or something. Would that mean that the extruder nozzle would hit the buildplate before the probe does? I mean it will probably never happen, but I’m still curious haha.
My plan is eventually to have a dedicated tool head for probe that would be switched to via a tool changer system. Or simply have a piezo orion probe. Both scenario can get rid of all items surrounding the nozzle. And my HevACS system for part cooling makes the nozzle the only thing sticking out of the print head.
@@MirageC I see, kinda like a proper CNC milling machine 😄. Im really eager to see how far you take it! If i had the money, time and coding knowledge I would definitely make such a printer. Currently I have a shitty Anet A6 that can print some cool stuff, but the bed levelling in particular is just such a pain and takes like half an hour to properly do. I think you can get marlin software or something to install the probe you have, but I don’t think I have the coding knowledge to make that work sadly. About that, how much do you think your printer costs currently with all the upgrades included? Just curious haha :P
Sorry. I'm just now getting to this point in my 3d printing expertise. Is this self leveling in RepRap?
Yes RRF supports this. DuetRRF does it via M671 and the calling of G32.
triple z motors to custom resin printer please