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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ค. 2024
- Yes, the Spanish Inquisition was full of corruption and violence, but was it as bad as pop history claims? Probably not.
Fr. Casey, from @BreakingInTheHabit, reclaims some more Catholic history by explaining the real history, causes, and outcomes of the inquisitions we think we know.
This is one video you shouldn’t have made. Sure, the images in people’s minds might be overblown, but the truth is just as horrifying. You’re putting perfume on a pig.
Well said !
He is saying the truth about it. why let the myth be propagated. 3k dead isnt millions. People think its millions. Millions of dead is more of a xx century atheist regimes thing.
One thing that should be done is to show the death toll from religious persecutions in Protestant countries. For example, in Great Britain more people were executed for witchcraft than Spain, Italy and Portugal combined. What's more, witch hunts and executions occurred in the English American colonies, something that never happened in Spanish America.
Another thing to note about the Spanish Inquisition in particular and Catholic inquisitions in general is an extreme reluctance to persecute those accused of witchcraft. The Catholic Church believed most accusations sprang from local folklore and individuals attempting to slander others, and thus knew most witches weren’t really witches. In the 300+ years of the Spanish Inquisition, only one person was ever executed for witchcraft.
So are witches real?
@@jamesparson yeah
@@decomposegaming So you belief magic is real, and that black cats are a bad omen?
@@RinoMacEight Are you even trying to make an argument at this point or are you just saying ridiculous things just to make your position look more true. Yes witches are real witches are people like Wiccans and Shamans and people like that.
@@decomposegaming I am just trying to figure in what kinds of supernatural nonsense you else believe in. And no, Shamans are not witches, Wicca ... sure, but it's an oversimplifcation and "witch" has a massive cultural load and can very quickly mis-represented. So, in your world-view, since Wicca do not follow the Christian doctrine, should they be persecuted and punished? (That was the point I was going to lead to)
"Thw Spanish Inquisition" by Hemry Kamen is a scholarly but readable volume for those interested in the actual history. Recommended.
To judge the past by the comfort and wisdom of the present is foolish, and arrogant.
I Guess all those Jews and Muslims fled their homeland in Spain or died because the Spanish Inquisition was hardly a problem for them, and the religion of the Roman Catholic church had little to do with it. I wonder how many Roman Catholics fled or died in comparison.
@@xunqianbaidu6917 “Exigit Sinceras devotionis affectus.” 1478 making way for the Inquisition and Alhambra decree would suggest your statement is inaccurate.
and even that little bit is dubious, mind you.
@@xunqianbaidu6917 So was I. “Exigit…” etc was the papal bull that authorized the formation of the later Inquisition and the Alhambra decree the direct result of that bull. I literally cited the two papers that forced Moors (moriscos) and Jews to convert or leave and enabled that expulsion with Rome’s consent all over them.
@@xunqianbaidu6917 This is a wonderful rhetorical trick, and one that I sometimes employed. I point to over a century of oppression during the Reconquista authorized by a papal bull, you point to a specific event in the 17th century (1600's, to be clear) where the pope sent an envoy to stop, specifically, the expulsion of the Moriscos. Evidence suggests however, that forced conversion, including separating parents from children was part of the option supported by Rome. So yes, you're technically right, that in one specific event the Pope was against the expulsion of the Moriscos. It cannot be said however, that this absolves the Catholic church's authorization and complicity in the atrocities of both the expulsions (which, really, started with Alhambra decree for both Jews and Muslims) and the Inquisition that followed.
Actually, several millions. From Nazi Germany, the Soviets, the Mohammedians (aka Muslims), and even the Jews. And that doesn't even consider modern persecution in Africa and SE Asia. When Christians were about 1% of the population there there was no problem. Now with up to 25% of all adults there being Christian, now conservative elements in those countries that preached tolerance are now looking the other way while thousands are killed every month. No other religion has been as persecuted as Christianity, period.
History grad here. Not all inquisitions were like the spanish inquisition, but all of them were about pressuring divergent thought out of existence, erasing the remains of older beliefs. Look for Carlo Ginzburg's earlier studies to see the italian inquisition doing just that
Divergent from doctrine of the church. Ie: heretical.
@@papallegatepoope3010 heretical carries an element of personal judgement, and therefore prejudicial
@@boxerfencer it’s not, it’s just to say someone who claims to be Catholic or maybe who claims to be Christian but denies a fundamental truth. It’s not to say they are bad but to say they are wrong. Some things are not up for debate and to deny them is wrong.
@@papallegatepoope3010 "some things are not up to debate"? Yeah, as with the natural sciences, but even then findings are always provisional. If what you say is were true, there wouldnt be development within the catholic chunch through time, but history shows otherwise.
@@boxerfencer some things do develop over time, but I’m not talking about traditions am I? I’m talking about truth.
Was there really much of a difference between Church and "Secular" governments of the time? The monarch of the day were directly dependent on the church for their authority and Vice versa. Religion had a very strong hand in governance at the time. Viewing this relationship through the lenses of modern religious and political separations doesnt make sense.
Absolutely, they were often at odds. the French once even kidnapped the Pope and selected the following popes for almost a century, effectively puppetting the Catholic Church.
This is why we have said that Governmental Politics is taken up in Religion that controls most spheres of Society.
These monarchs, land lords & what have you, probably didn't have the faith & it, properly in order, more often then not, they would misuse the knowledge that they DID have, to further their own agenda, exalting themselves above their people instead of exalting God and give (honest) thanks for all that they have received from His goodness.
But corruption and greed could take hold of any 'physical institution' and unrightful acts of violence or persecution has occured, for sure.
I noticed he kept using that term "secular" as well to help distance the Church from such actions but During that time period could you really say they weren't one in the same and playing off each other giving each other authority and justifications
I went to a spanish inquisition museum in cartegena colombia, which had a number of old torture devices and a guillotine. In this case I really don’t think it was a matter of Protestants trying to slander catholics, as cartegena was fully controlled by spain. And it also likely wasn’t anything related to punishing muslims or jews, but rather those who continued to practice indigenous american religions. There are also sketches from the 1500s from poma de ayala, who was half spanish and half inca, who worked with the catholic clergy, and who documented a lot of abuse on the indigenous population by the catholic clergy, which they framed as punishment for heresy. I don’t think we should pretend that this kind of thing didn’t occur pretty extensively throughout the americas by those wanting to indoctrinate the native population.
Ese museo es sensacionalista y fake.
La Inquisición española no podía juzgar a indigenas americanos porque eran neófitos en la Fe católica .Estaba totalmente prohibido y no hubo prácticamente ningún caso en 300 años
What comes to mind is the Spanish Black leyend and a bunch of lies hold against my country.
While you made some valid points here, I don't think it comes off well to say that "only" a few thousand people were killed or that prisoners could be tortured "only" once. To me this minimizes the suffering and seems unempathetic. I don't suppose you or I would volunteer to be one of those people subjected to torture "only" one time, nor would we like to be a family member of one of the people who was executed. I appreciate your courage in tackling a difficult subject, but I think your approach could have been better.
I would gladly volunteer for inquisitorial review. Do not judge the past by the present norms. The main thing is, Christendom is no more. There are few Christian countries left, and fewer Catholic ones. Whenever someone says, "This is bad." My response is generally, "Compared to what?" Point me to a society of the same period which was better. It is easy to criticize, but it is difficult to make things objectively better.
its 'only' because the common view is that of millions of dead and torture chambers. comparing to 3k dead over various centuries is nothing. xx century atheist regimes indeed had millions of dead under their belt.
We're also judging a historical event by modern standards. We could also look at the fact that there are modern groups who torture and kill people for Allah. These groups are both secular and religious, so it is remarkable that the Catholic church was doing a lot less of killing and torture even when they could have done a lot more had they wanted to.
Then make your own video
You can interpret “only once” as unsympathetic or as a colloquial way to say it was a singular event that was not repeated.
Faith is inconsistent with killing a person for not having that same faith. The Cathars were a crime against humanity and the Church was directly responsible. It doesn’t matter that the secular authorities carried out the sentence, the Church sent them there to be killed. They knew what would happen. I guess “thou shalt not kill” only applies if you agreed with the Church without question. It’s simple, the Church should not have killed anyone - ever.
The Hebrew word for “kill” in that commandment is closer to the English word for murder. The Old Testament is actually filled with laws for which transgression is punishable by death.
Not in any way defending the Inquisition here, but you gotta get your knowledge of scripture straight if you wanna use it to form an argument.
NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU GLOSS OVER THE SPANISH INQUISITION, IT WAS BAD.
The U.S government has done much worse things in a much smaller span of time so go read up on that .
@clo8862 Diverting the subject is just whitewashing the topic!
@@parsaeye ohh yeah white washing thats absurd im mexican and have ancestors that were crypto jews that eventually became catholic either by force or to fit in . Things happen conquests , colonization new ideas enforced the arabs did it by the sword the chinese did it get over it snowflake .
Factual historical context is not “gloss”.
To say these inquisitions were “bad” is fundamentally true but overly-simplistic. The Holocaust was also “bad”, but the two events are hardly comparable. The word “bad” may be a starting point but it’s not an analysis.
If you really want to know what you’re taking about, you need to go deeper, apply some objective judgement, and recognize the nuances in the story.
That’s what Fr Casey is doing. And I appreciate the effort.
@patricktalley4185 If you really want to know the truth about the Inquisition, you need to study the subject at an academic level. The young father is here to whitewash the subject!
Father Casey, please redo this video with disclaimers and clear statements of intention because I think most of us are not getting from it what you were trying to achieve.
Can you give me further sources on it ? For example a book
Myth of the Spanish Inquisition by BBC on TH-cam. Echoes Fr. Casey's comments
I applaud your courage and intellectual curiosity for even attempting to tackle this topic, but I have to wonder if some subjects (particularly such complex and clearly controversial historical matters as the Inquisition) can be adequately explored in a single, relatively brief TH-cam presentation. You share a number of thought-provoking facts, but in having to condense complicated and subtle arguments into bite-size chunks that resemble a PowerPoint presentation, the format ends up raising more questions than providing complete answers. Your presentation works better as an introduction for a whole extended series on the topic, rather than a convincing, stand-alone argument for reframing the viewer's perspective on an important part of Catholic history.
I agree, the channel Catholic Truth dives in a little more, while still insufficient. At least it can spark the curiosity to find out the Truth
I suspect the video's goal was accomplished, propaganda and revisionist history.
Well said
Is there another reclaiming catholicism coming out?
Please do one on the mediaeval inquisitions where people were burned at the stake and all. I can’t find a trustworthy source for an explanation on this disturbing period of our church.
I do disagree with the last part of the vid. With the fake news & misinformation as being another inquisition. And we do have the right of different political opinions.
The fake news is very much real and it is a multiple tentacled monster.
On one hand , fake / real news spreads hate and contempt for christianity by highlighting inquisition, slavery, crusades, witch burning, conquests, religious mysteries, nun rap es, paedo phile priests.
On the other hand , fake news portrays other religions as peaceful, beautiful ( which could be a big lie)
This will lead to slow wipe out of one religion and growth of another.
Didn't the inquisition also not Form the basis for the modern judicial system?
No, the two main streams of the modern judicial system are the English and Napoleonic codes.
@@WagesOfDestruction in the anglosphere? Yes. In the rest of the western world (most of it, btw), no.
So? It doesn’t justify all the innocent people that suffered under it
What is the church if it’s not it’s members? Isn’t the biblical interpretation of the body of Christ, known to be the people who are believers in Christ and/or church members?
Typical Church.
If it's a good thing, 'cuz God made it so. If it's a bad thing, God didn't cause it.
If it's a good thing, credits to the Church. If it's a bad thing, it's just a bad person in the Church.
Please more! Father Casey should do a deep dive into Franciscan spiritualiy/theology on Patheos. I subscribed because of him.
Well, I certainly wasn't expecting this... 😜
Nobody was...
Does the Catholic Church own Patheos, now? WTH happened?!
These are simply the facts.
Nobody expected thus video from Fr. Casey!
I would laugh if I wasn't so upset and disappointed.
Oh, I've seen some of his other work, and I wasn't suprised. Disappointed and disgusted, yes, but definitely not surprised.
@@CelticShae What made you feel that way about Fr. Casey? I've been watching his content for a little over a year and find him very engaging.
@@seraph5765 I agree. But I do think that his theology compels him to generally defend the Catholic church and its doctrines and practices rather than challenge it.
@@helens8977 Well, yes. He is a Catholic priest after all.
I was waiting for the Monty Python clip!
Compairing something with the US could make anything look good... :)
At a time when the Church is weighing its conscience on the death penalty and encouraging a "Culture of Life", the whole, "it wasn't so bad" take on what was an objectively terrible time in world history sounds pretty cringe...
I only give you the benefit of the doubt because it's a fair thing to do...
I only give Monty Python references and links. It may not be fair, but it's what Brian would've wanted.
th-cam.com/video/Cj8n4MfhjUc/w-d-xo.html
I understand you try to sell a position here, still trying to put the inquisition in a rather positive perspective sounds wrong. What do you think gives you (and with you I mean the church) the right to decide over other people? I feel sad to see the video concluding on a.. "it was needed", rather than with a "and we are deeply sorry and feel ashamed for the suffering we caused to thousands of people". That's what I wish from my church. I hope I am not misunderstood here, i believe in the "Santa chiesa cattolica apostolica" and today more than ever wish it to stay strong and help the people in need, but for this, we all need to realize what we have done and ask (not only God) for forgiveness.
Well, i think "by its fruits shall you know" speaks volumes here.
I hear inquisition and I think of the Grand Inquisitor of Star Wars
Haha same
Sickening and sad to hear atrocities described as if the church and it's members at any weren't conscious of the murder and torture.
Even more barbaric were the English tortures of Catholics thanks to Cromwell. Seems like everyone back in the day were torture oriented.
What the f©k kind of an argument is that, Barb? "Thousands were tortured and murdered by order of the Catholic Church, but Cromwell was worse." Good freaking gourd. Get your thinking and morals straight. You think Jesus is down with "we did slightly fewer, but more brutal muders" as a moral argument?
Guess you didn’t watch the whole thing or didn’t choose to hear the parts you didn’t like.
Torture people if you, burn them if you must, but DO NOT criticize Monty Python!!!🤬😂😂😂
FINALLY
MONTY PYTHON EXPLAINED.
JC and the other guys were satirising this kind of revisionist history.
Daddy you are cute, but not -the inquisition may not have been -*-*that*-*- bad- cute
I appreciate your care for the truth.
Why does Pope Francis say not to share your faith when Jesus said to go out into all the world and share the Gospel of Truth?
There is NO justification for torture or the persecution of those with different beliefs. The Catholic church should be UNEQUIVOCALLY repenting of these sins, not offering lame excuses.
Should they repent for how they treat atheists.
I agree totally, we should overturn roe v wade on the state level now and stop murdering babies
Hey @Patheos you gunna keep acting like you don't read the comments and your teaching a bunch of 4 year olds who haven't done their research buddy??? 🤣
This is good rhetoric. I have to talk to my atheist friends of what they think of inquisitions
Yeah atheists are a great source of facts. The honest thing to do would be to take what this priest said, and take it to scholarly sources that have peer review.
Good video 😃🕊️
Not really he really undermined religious persecution on innocent people
@@rupertsmith5815 Hello Rupert . Remember that is you start judging with our actual values the past times ( as 1500 AC) you will found that all our ancestry were wrong . So is better to concentrate in the facts and no in the judging.
@@fernandopaz5201 That is kinda ridiculous, you shouldn’t judge someone for doing something bad ? What a terrible mentality
@@rupertsmith5815 remenber that I am talking of people of the past . A lot of things that now are bad for us it weren’t for them . Imagine that in the future our grandsons judge you for things that are bad for them but in your time wasn’t for you . This makes you a bad person? I don’t think so . Blessings 🕊
@@fernandopaz5201 And it is safe to assume I will never commit a genocide on a minority group.
And yes I should be judge for stuff I did in the past because as we advance we learn more and more and we have to acknowledge how awful we were in the past and judge those who did, especially when people are tortured and murdered
An apologist for the numerous inquisitions of the Catholic church is no better than a holocaust denier. A good person would acknowledge the crimes of his church and beg forgiveness.
I am sure you are 100% correct. Spanish inquisitors were saints. And who says people died, no one died every one in the era attained eternal life.
so you're saying you didn't watch the video. Got it.
Let me add another prespective, from muslim prespective.
What we know that the Caliph sent fleets to rescue muslims and jews who fled the inquisition, and of course they cannot evacuate the entire peninsula.
And for ur information muslim is the majority in iberia once,and then the reconquista came and then the inquisition and there u go...
Where are those muslims gone?
And of course, in other part of the world the caliphate also using some fleets on wars and rescuing muslims on another part of the world
Again, it's impossible to evacuate the entire iberia
Wow! I was sitting here thinking it was rivers of blood and burnings at the stake etc
80 Waldensian leaders were burned at the stake in Strasbourg in 1211 during the Medieval Inquisition. Those 80 are honored as holy individuals by Waldensians to this day. Yet you don't mention their executions, and claim that the Medieval Inquisition was necessary to root out heresy. How would you feel if someone from a different religion implied that a Catholic martyr deserved to die because they followed the wrong religion?
He didn't say they deserved to die, what he implied is that they had to be questioned. Probably he didn't mention that because the focus of the video was the Spanish Inquisition.
@@luisoncpp "the Christians were a heretical group that denied the truth of the Roman religion, ignored their religious duties, and referred to the gods as demons. In response to this, the Emperor issued an edict calling on local leaders to question those in their local area and to root out heresy. Unfortunately, this turned out to be fairly ineffective, requiring the Emperor to send legions out with the aim of pastoring people to the truth."
This is a word-for-word recreation of what Fr. Casey said in this video, with a few substitutions to apply to early Christianity. It's what people would probably say about the persecution of Christians if paganism had won out. But anyone with any degree of knowledge about this period would immediately see how ridiculous it is. It wouldn't have taken that much extra time to mention that, if people did not want to be "pastored to the truth", they would be brutally killed.
If this is a click bait title it works.
Nice video, comparing all the data between secular, ecclesiastical, religious and political motivated inquisitions.. with nice lighthearted background music while dissecting and analyzing the truth .. almost make me forgot that those were horrible murderous bloody events that sadly The Roman Catholic Church took part of it … lol
The Roman Catholic Church is a giant entity not an individual. Members of the Catholic Church took part in the inquisitions, not the church itself.
@@theocsbstudent9486 well it’s still a big part of the Roman Catholic Church History.. The CDC used to be the inquisitor office,the Vatican even have an official executioner. Agatino Bellomo, last person executed by the Papal States, two months before Rome was captured by Italian army (July 9, 1870)… gosh so much for loving your enemy …. Lol
@@theocsbstudent9486 what is the church if it’s not it’s members? Isn’t the biblical interpretation of the body of Christ, known to be the people who are believers in Christ and/or church members?
@@gottliebgrubber92 A theologian you are not. Imagine that historical facts can not be fully comprehended from one event presented as if it’s standing on its own. That is never, ever, the case.
CALLED IT.
We all called it. F*cking apologetics. COME ON, CASEY. I used to think you had integrity. I'm not ashamed to admit it when I'm wrong, though. "I wash my hands of his blood" was said by Pilate, you know.
Bust this - In Goa, India the Catholic Church carried out inquisitions till 19th century, killing hundreds of hindus and muslims and even Malankara Orthodox church members, in the name of God, hundreds of years after inquisitions were abolished in the west ...... what about that?
The inquisition in GOA was not carried out by the Church. It was carried out by the Portugese who had colonised GOA. The GOA inquisition was carried on the order of the King of Portugal
I think the intention of the video is clear enough for people who are thinking clearly and, overall, it is a good video, but most people judge based purely on emotions and don't read the context. For future videos that touch topics like this one, it may be better to add at the beginning some explanation about how you are not saying that everything that happened isn't terrible or reprehensible or that it was somehow justified. When teaching (especially in topics full polemics like this), always explain in the most basic way so that even the most ignorant human could understand without having too much previous knowledge.
For example, since the fact that there is an anti-spanish propaganda that exaggerates greatly all things related to the inquisition wasn't thoroughly explained, people will think that you are trying to justify or diminish it's importance. This can be seen also when you mention the amounts of executions, when the idea that there is an anti-spanish propaganda has been learned previously, one can learn some data that reinforces the idea. If, on the other hand, they have not learned it, they will think that you are downplaying it.
Remember that always, emotions overcome reason. It shuts down the brain so that you have no choice other than accept what has been told to you, even though it doesn't make sense. That's why propaganda is so effective. In the mind of the people, words about statistics, logics, principles and reasonings always loses to more visceral, passionate and emotional narrative. In this case, the people propagating the black legend will always make emphasize things shocking facts like the latter ones.
If you try to correct the misinformation caused by the propaganda, it must be in a way that can overcome the brain's shutdown generated by the overflow of emotions. A good exercise would be trying to think and reason as someone who doesn't have the studies you have and doesn't know what you know. Read the script and try to reason as someone who is controlled by the propaganda, that way you may have a higher chance to make them see other sides of the story.
Hmm, he indeed gave a disclaimer, but I think a disclaimer is not enough, what it's necessary it's an argument to first convince that it can be harmful to take something wrong out of proportion, that being more angry is not always better(even if it's against something that it's wrong), and that trying to get perspective for something that has been taken out of proportion doesn't mean to justify it.
This argument could take a whole video, and it would be a little out of topic given that it's not religion-specific, but it would be worth it.
I agree, the disclaimer may be as well a video by itself and trying to convey both the disclaimer and the content of the video won't be easy by any means, but it is worth as you have said.
I'm a Protestant who loves some of your videos and used to really respect you. But within the first few minutes of this video you were saying that people with beliefs like mine needed to be "rooted out", and it only got worse from there. Theology that differs from the Catholic Church's teaching isn't inherently immoral (which you seem to imply several times throughout the video), and it isn't remotely comparable to fake news. I almost can't believe you actually equated people who have a slightly different interpretation of the Bible with people who endorse lies, prejudice and violence.
It's also impressive what lengths you go to to absolve the Catholic church of all the harm they did. Most of the torture and executions were done by the secular government, sure, but what religion did those secular officials follow? What religious leader could have ordered them to stop, but didn't? I'll give you a hint: it sure wasn't the Dalai Lama. The fact is that the hate against Jews and Muslims that fueled the Spanish Inquisition was largely spurred by the Catholic Church. Christians had lived in relative peace with Jews and Muslims in Spain for centuries before Ferdinand and Isabella (called Los Reyes Católicos in Spain) came to power and decided the only religion allowed was Catholicism.
Sanitized history isn't real history. History changed to make a person or institution look good isn't real history. I really hope no one who watches this video thinks they're getting a full and unbiased report.
The inquisition happened several centuries ago, when power and might was right. We cannot judge inquisition on todays standards
@@banubanu1136 God and his Word never changes. It wasn't 'right' then and it isn't 'right' now. That type of behavior and attitude remains eternally never 'right'.
@@banubanu1136 I agree. This video is however set by today's standards so I think his comments stand.
@@banubanu1136 "right" is not the right word to describe that. Maybe "normal" or "expected" could be a better fit. Even today it's possible to recognize many things that are normal and that they definitely wrong.
@@WagesOfDestruction what do u want Fr Casey to say now ?? Can we do anything now to revert the atrocities that happened in the past.
Who is there , who has never sinned ?
Once we have committed sin, dont we ask forgiveness and move on ?
Or once we commit a sin, should we condemn ourselves to become the worst person living ?
Btw The cathars were hunted down in the world's first genocide
Carcassonne and Beziers fyi
@@fedevida1951
Expected.
See below.
The Spanish inquisition is bad in the sense that it is an event that wouldn't have been preferred, or it could be done better on one's opinion. However, I don't think it is bad in the sense that "ohhh the Church like deliberately planned this out, on purpose, coordinated evil". Not true whatsoever. If one would put a fair, realistic, and clear/unbiased understanding of the events in the past. I don't think the people and Church members would think or do as such at the time. Especially when you consider that these are also people think and deliberate with many considerations, which it would be more rational and less barbaric from what a human could do or come up with. We have to be fair around this. Disproving an idea that "it was that bad". (Like in a sense that the Church was on point guilty or something, which is not)
Should have just recorded a 10 second video saying “ it wasn’t us” 🤷🏻♂️
It worked and it is what was needed to restore Spain.
Before you all complain, this practice still exists and it is practiced most by the Islamic religion.
Sharia police ring a bell?
How about mercy killing?
They follow essentially the same beliefs, processes and practices in their home countries as the
Spanish Inquisition.
You have people secretly alerting authorities, authorities with no uniforms door knocking, unfair trails and biased/partisan legal system. That is how they keep other religions out and why their culture, way of thinking is essentially untouched while that of the West has been eroded.
This practice is what is needed to restore and what is needed to maintain Europe if there is such a unity in the will and unity in the preservation of Europe that was just in the last couple of centuries ago.
"St. Pope John Paul II made many apologies. During his long reign as Pope, he apologized to Jews, women, people convicted by the Inquisition, Muslims killed by the Crusaders and almost everyone who had suffered at the hands of the Catholic Church over the years. Even before he became the Pope, he was a prominent editor and supporter of initiatives like the Letter of Reconciliation of the Polish Bishops to the German Bishops from 1965. As Pope, he officially made public apologies for over 100 of these wrongdoings."
This video-cui bono? It wouldn’t be a good for the victims of the inquisitions. I mean, your summary of the Medieval inquistion ignores the part where people were burned at the stake for heresy (80 Waldensians, Joan of Arc-though she was later exonerated and canonized, so, it’s fine). It also ignores the papal bull requiring the extermination of the Waldensians, saved by local intervention.
Cui Bono? “Hey guys, it wasn’t really that bad” is never a good rhetorical tack to take with events that resulted in the deaths of thousands, and the confiscation of property worth millions. And while those deaths are fewer than in public perception, what’s Christian about burning effigies of those who escaped (leaving aside those actually burned)? What’s good about the probe into the faith of Ignatius of Loyola or Theresa of Avila? Did the Grand Inquisitors have the Parable of the Tares in mind when they swore their oath of office?
I think you’re well-meaning, and I think you put the full passion of your faith into what you do, but the research is definitely lacking (as well as a knowledge of the perception of the church by outsiders). Defending and downplaying the guilt of the Inquistion isn’t a great way to evangelize. Sorry.
Well put!
Interesting history...
Oh wow, might as well justify what happened in Germany in 1941
Because 2 thousand is comparable to millions? What?
@@lukelancaster1114 It doesn’t matter how many people died it isn’t a competition all of the people that suffered under persecution for different beliefs and ethnicity is horrible and not justifiable
Good one. But I admit I was dreading this talk. I knew you’d get around to it. I had no idea of the real history of the inquisition process. Now I want to know more. Not that I don’t believe you, but that I want to know more. Thanks for an evenhanded invitation for this topic. As ever, you avoid drama and innuendo and just give us facts.
Great video and very informative!!!
I am watching this to see if you reference the AD1600 brutal and burning alive at the stake of the Giordano Bruno, a mere renegade priest who had tried to leave his robes and go around Europe to speculate pointlessly as a university lecturer, and could easily have been ignored. (He has been a stick to beat you with by scientists ever since, who claim him as a martyr for science on no scientific grounds whatsoever.) And then there was the murderous treachery of the bishops in Germany against the Czech preacher Jan Huss, AD1415, who was less lucky than Luther a century later. What people object to, and what I object to, is the arrogation of the powers of capital punishment to the RC church. I am glad that Napoleon Bonaparte cut you down to size, one of the few good things he ever did. If your 'truth' and your rightousness is so great, you should argue it, not torture people and burn them alive at the stake, any collection of psychopaths can do what the Inquistion did.
This same channel has a video on it. With Fr. Casey
The woke Catholic monk🤣🤣🤣
Flag the video as spam and misleading.
Wait..., spam? You truly are petty, just so you know.
@@rutgerkerpel306 petty because I identified the video as misleading? Or spam? Please read my full length comment where I do a quick description as to why it amounts to propaganda piece, and please tell me where I went wrong.
Doesn't matter whether the charge was "formal" heresy or whatever - nobody, neither the Church fathers or the secular authorities, has the right to sit in judgement over another person's holiness - and even less of a right to torture and execute people. While I have great love, respect and reverence for members of religious orders (nuns and monks) and parish priests as well; I reject the institutional Church and do not recognize its hierarchical structure as legitimate; because, I believe, the modern organizational structure of the church is the exact opposite of what Jesus intended his movement to be. The church went from being a loosely connected group of autonomous anarchist communities who all claimed to follow Jesus through apostolic succession (some with radically different views of Jesus), where all the members shared everything and lived as one family in communal settings, and whose works of mercy (caring for the weak and disenfranchised) were simultaneously acts of subversive opposition to the rich and powerful and their government. The Church went from those egalitarian communities to what it became under Constantine (and still remains today), a state sanctioned institution demanding doctrinal and creedal uniformity.
The "spirit" or intentions if the Inquisition may have been as pure and unblemished as newly fallen snow; the victims of the Inquisition still remained dead. What justice is there for them? Any institution claiming to be holy cannot commit such injustices. You cannot claim to worship the God of justice while simultaneously committing acts of injustice.
Jesus intended Christianity to be a nonviolent, anarchist movement called the "Kingdom of God." The moment someone was baptized, they ceased to be a citizen of the nation they lived in and became a citizen of the Kingdom of God. The Kingdom of God that Jesus instituted is an Earthly political entity/ideology that is all about no longer giving your allegiance to human leaders; and making God your leader instead. Now that doesn't mean, "theocracy." Theocracies are still run by human beings claiming to rule in God's name. In stead, the Kingdom Of God is about no governments, no human hierarchies, and no domination systems (systems that subjugate and exploit other humans under threat of force and violence).
@@drjanitor3747 Jesus said you can judge a tree by its fruit. A good tree produces good fruit, and an evil tree produces evil fruit. The mainstream orthodox church has literally become a force for imperialism and oppression - doesn't sound like good fruit to me.
There is no orthodox Christianity today. Every church that exists today is a heresy. As soon as the church went from being a loosely connected group of autonomous anarchist communities all who claimed to follow Jesus through apostolic succession (some with radically different views of Jesus), who shared everything and lived as one family, and who stood in direct opposition to the rich and powerful and their government by caring for the weak and disenfranchised; ss soon as the church went from that to what it became under Constantine, a state-sanctioned institution demanding doctrinal and creedal uniformity, it became a heresy.
The so-called "orthodox" church, by becoming an institution of the government and a force for imperialism has condemned itself. The Church fathers will be judged for that.
@@drjanitor3747 no it's not. It conforms precisely with scripture. What is contrary to scripture is the institutional Church and its so-called "orthodoxy."
@@drjanitor3747 Lol... 1) You don't know what I know.
2) Catholicism is orthodoxy. "Orthodoxy" means "correct theory, doctrine, or practice." I'm not talking about the Eastern Orthodox Church.
@@drjanitor3747 Biblical scholars call it orthodoxy. I'm a member of a religious order and I have my masters degree in New Testament and Ancient Christianity. I am well educated in this field.
@@drjanitor3747 the Eastern and Oriental churches didn't leave the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church left them.
So some torture is OK? Is that how Jesus operated? This is the most ridiculous explanation(excuse) I ever heard
"Yeah, my guy. I mean, it sucks that you murdered my sister, but it's all good because you thought you had a good reason and it's not like you're a serial killer or a mass murderer. Wanna hug it out and go get a pint?"
I think it would have been helpful, though perhaps somewhat divisive, to show how many of the myths and exaggerated images of the Inquisition came about from Protestant propaganda, which took root in Protestant nations and would form the cultural basis for works like "The Pit and Pendulum" from Edgar Allan Poe, which helped to perpetuate these myths.
I'm disappointed in you Casey. When one of the commandments of your faith is "You shall not kill" you would expect that killing a single person would be reason enough for regret and lament and condemn the inquisition.
But what should I expect from someone who belongs to an institution that has protected rapist and child murderers for centuries?
Of course you find a way to justify it, otherwise, you wouldn't belong to it
We cannot blame present day christians for what happened in the past, we cannot judge past atrocities based on todays standards. By criticising the church for its past atrocities, we are only going further away from religion, and eventually fall into the trap of even more atrocious pagan religions. Let us forgive and forget and move forward in christian faith.
@@banubanu1136 that's not true, we grow as a society by learning about our past, acknowledging it, striving to be better, think more justly and vowing not to repeat it. Pretending we are the good guys, that all our bad deeds were righteous, that we are the truth, the only light in a see of darkness, without us killing 'heretics' the world would be a worse place, pushing up nice gentle kindly friendly faces like Fr. Casey here, to educate us on how vile lies have misinformed and directed us away from truth. Well that's how we fall into the same trap.
@@messianicrogue even i am saying the same thing what u have said , in my last sentence. Let us forgive, forget and move forward in christian faith. I am not denying the christian atrocities, but u cannot undo, what has already happened. By reminding ourselves repeatedly about the past atrocities, we will diminish our faith.
Remember father Casey is not the only gentle face. Every other religion is also hiding thier evil face behind a smiling gentle mask. At least christianity has come a long way from those evil days, but some religions are still continuing without any change for the better.
@@banubanu1136 I am blaming this specific present day christian for being surprisingly okay with the crimes of past christians
@@falnica what do u want the present christians to do ? Regarding the past ? Some of the present day christians are the descendants of either the victims or perpetrators of past christian atrocities, what can be done now ?
All present day living people are also descendants of cavemen, uncivilsed violent hunters, what can we do now ?
So there's good torture and bad torture now?? Seriously Father Casey I respect you but I fear you are selling out now you are with Patheos. Please come back.
Thank you for these videos, Father. I enjoy, and agree, with most of what you say. However, as in this video, you state your opinion which tends towards liberalism. For example, your opinion about some very solid bishops who follow the teachings of the Church and who have been punished for doing so. I was saddened when I saw that video.
In this video you make a statement about "fake news" and "conspiracy theories." Certainly, most of the news stories from the major networks are either lies, deceptions, or manipulations, and in the case of Fox, half-truths - which is why Tucker Carlson was let-go.
To be sure, there are some pretty squirrely conspiracy theories out there, but there are some true conspiracies that exist. It's irresponsible to white-wash all conspiracies, Father, and you make the same mistake as those who spread misconceptions about the Inquisition. Without looking into something more deeply, you perpetuate the myth.
May I, respectfully, suggest some titles?
, by David Rockefeller, who admits that he and his family are part of conspiracy. This was shocking.
, by D.W. Griffin
, by Carroll Quigley (Harvard, Ph.D., and Bill Clinton’s mentor at Georgetown)
, by Zbigniew Brzezinski (Harvard, Ph.D., and National Security Advisor to President Carter)
, Edward Bernays (Sigmund Freud’s nephew)
, by Claus Schwab (Founder, World Economic Forum)
Blessings. +
I always love your content Fr Casey. God bless you and the good work you do in His name
They still killed jews who refused to convert. This is nothing more than anti Semitic apologism. I expect better in this day and age, but maybe I shouldn't be surprised.
Spanish inquisition.
Not ottoman genocide
Unsubscribing from Patheos now 👎
Lipstick on a sow
Tell me, "I think the n@21$ were the good guys" without directly stating, "I think the n@21$ were th good guys."
Ayre b habalo
Very well said Father. It’s not easy confronting something like this, but now I feel I have a more complete understanding of the inquisition in its modern and historic context.
Entirely secular .definition please
Well, I for one, enjoyed this introspective. And I'm not even Catholic. Haters gonna hate. I'd rather be a learner anyways.
They hated me first.
Dude, do you hear what you’re saying? Saying it fast in a dismissive tone doesn’t change the fact that the church that you confess as “infallible” tortured and killed your brothers and sisters in Christ-many of whom believe the same things as Protestants today believe. I’m glad you think that between 3,000 and 5,000 people (tallied by a church that covers up pedophiles) is no big deal
Omg the audacity of this video
KID…. I’ll give you credit because people lied to you! Jeremiah 16:19 prophecy will come to pass!!!
What a piece of propaganda on your part! You know , a simpler way of assessing this phenomenon is simply by looking at the architectural evidence still around. In many cities of Spain, Italy and Latin America huge, imposing buildings that were once the seat of the Holy Office give telling commentary. These buildings were giant reminders that the Inquisition was not some passing difficulty that people had to navigate, but an ever -present source of fear for the populace. You present more recently understood statistics, and seem to think that mollifies the severity of the issue. Organizations that seek terrorize a population have always understood that you do not need to do a lot to terrorize people, in fact, you don't need big numbers. You just need to do enough to instill a climate of fear, which provides control without having to do much. But that does not make it any less a crime against humanity. Your propaganda video can only be read then as a piece of ambition or a real evidence of misanthropy.
Your cursory take on the role of inquisitional process being one to instruct true belief rather than punish conviniently overlooks repeat offenders, which were burned at the stake, let alone to say anything about violating basic humanist rights, such as personal election.
Interestingly, you label divergent believers criminals, and absolve the church by saying secular authorities administered punishment. You also do the same by attributing escalation to secular authorities, ignoring that local churchmen often did as they pleased, often pressing the crown into action as with Spain, which doesn't absolve the church any less, as doesn't the fact that inquisitors were sometimes elected by the crown. Its not as if they ceased to be members of the church upon election.
You paint a benign and innocent process, amounting to a damage control PR campaign and willfully participating in revisionist history. You sound like a propaganda minister.
Good to know the inquisitional institution still exists. Thanks for the warning.
There so many things wrong with this piece im not sure where to continue but surprised it was allowed up. This video should be flagged as misinformation or disinformation, essentially fake news, and ultimately propaganda.
FREEMASON LIES AND LIES ABOUT THE SAINT INQUISITION, THANKS A LOT TO THE SAINT CATHOLIC CHURCH.
Hundreds of millions of people over hundreds of years were terrorised, for their alleged or actual beliefs with the very real prospect of torture or death.
Nice try.
I don't know. It seems like there's little nice and that he wasn't really trying that hard. Though, I suppose it did try my patience to sit through, so maybe that qualifies it ;)
2 min in already lies detected.
Er thumbscrew , rack ,wheel, leg clamps. thanks mother church
can't criticize their creativity though.
"Nobleman: I cannot think of another method of torturing my heretic prisoners"
"Christian Monk: Hold my mead!"
Thou shalt not judge - haha you catholics have broken this law a thousand times and more during inquisitions ...... by scripture alone u r guilty, forget about humanitarian terms ....
If you are trying to justify the hate of the Catholic Church? You are not of God...Apostacy is more like it given you worship idols.
This is disgusting.