Have you ever had a sense of impending danger and slowed down when driving and nothing happens ? Nope? that's because you have no need to remember that occasion and the thousand other times stuff like that happens. You only remember when you slowed and you were glad you did.
cos even merely intending to research in that direction is severely repressed and denounced, and any related data of the kind is entirely ignored eg. the 50yrs of rigorous rebirth investigation in virginia uni
@Terre Schill If you don't know how to measure something you literally do not know there is something to measure. Provide a clear example of compelling evidence of these claims please.
@@backwardthoughts1022 That's pure conspiracy. If anyone could find a reliable method to demonstrate that our brains (or minds or thoughts or ideas) could have any impact on the outside world not through means of our bodies going and doing it, they would win the Nobel prize. What is more likely, than people have tried to study the supernatural and come up short, or that anyone who tries to study it gets suppressed by "big science"? edit: your comment feels like you want to have it both ways. Research is severely suppressed, and also The University of Virginia Studied it for 50 years. Can you explain a bit more what you mean here because when I looked this up it didn't seam suppressed or cancelled. It did face criticism, but thats par for the course when trying to break ground in science.
@@b.g.5869physical measurement of the nonphysical... should put that in your stand-up routine. in real life you would need to develop rigorous methods of observing the object you wish to understand ie. the mind, and then applied to rigorous peer review akin to god tier mathematicians ie. you without the rigorous method have nfi what they are doing
@Terre Schill it's a waste of time if you're not willing to honestly accept what the evidence or lack of evidence suggests, particularly when there's such an obvious incentive for _wanting_ it to be true. Let's consider for example this idea that the brain isn't the source of consciousness but merely a sort of receiver. First of all, there's absolutely no evidence for this whatsoever and is obviously not predicated on any objective indication that something like this is going on but because it superficially seems to get our personal conscious experience safely removed from our mortal brains. But it's obviously just wishful thinking because even if it were true you'd still cease to exist when the receiver died. Similarly, suppose our personal conscious experience isn't _entirely_ caused by brain activity, and that there are other factors contributing to it which we're currently unaware of. It's still clear that it's dependent upon brain activity and without it our personal conscious experience ceases, predictably and reliably. NDEs are certainly not compelling evidence of life after death. One important thing to remember about near death experiences is that they are not experiences of death. Nobody has ever come back from the dead, a fact obscured by terms like "clinically dead". Most NDEs have fairly trivial explanations, and to point to the small number of cases in which they're not readily explained isn't an argument for life after death (or if it is it's an obviously logically fallacious appeal to ignorance; the absence of an explanation isn't evidence of life after death). One of the problems with NDEs is that we don't know for sure whether the experience being recalled actually occurred while the person was ostensibly unconscious or merely confabulated it that way. It's hardly surprising that a person emerging from a nearly brain dead state would recall events in a flawed manner, and indeed many people emerging from such states definitely have inaccurate recollections of events, such as recalling being in a car crash when in fact they were assaulted etc. We also know now, as brain activity measurement technology has improved, that people who years ago would have been naively declared "brain dead" we now know actually could have had brain activity too low to be detected by the technology of the time. In fact, we now know that brain activity doesn't cease entirely for up to several hours after death. This has been determined by measuring brain activity of deceased persons from their last breath. So we know that there's still _some_ brain activity up to as much as several hours after death, longer than any reported NDE experiencer was ostensibly unconscious, so there's really no good reason to think they were ever truly brain dead, particularly when they have no permanent brain damage. This is why NDEs are so unreliable. Either the person reporting them has suffered serious brain damage, and therefore is an unreliable narrator, or they haven't suffered serious brain damage, in which case it indicates they were never close to brain death.
Wouldn't you think that in the million or so years of evolution that has passed for the humanoid race that the process of evolution might have found something like telepathy worth developing, think how useful it would have been back in the day with hunter communities. I dear say that back then there was a kind of unspoken communication. But if it was some sort of telepathy then by now we would all be using telepathy every day instead of mobile phones. Instead we are talking about very questionable accounts and possibilities among a very few individuals. I think his opening statement was the key, we all wish it was true.
Another great discussion; ESP doesn't so much fascinate me as it makes me wonder that there might be frequencies that still elude us but that some, on occasion, consciously experience.
Women were accused of 'witchcraft' and murdered for deeds they never did. They may have been smart, had land, spoke out against the church's greed, and were blamed for otherworldly things because that is inexplicable.
This is a very old interview obviously but as for why Kuhn wastes time with cranks like this from time to time, it's due to an ill conceived if well intentioned desire to "hear all sides". It's certainly not because Kuhn finds what his guest says plausible. Presenting a wide variety of views is fine but I think we all realize that having a confused mentally ill person from the Staten Island Ferry Terminal on for an hour would be a waste of time. Charles Tarte isn't much better. This wasn't a total waste of time however because there actually is a lot of truth to the connection between belief in nonsense like ESP and fear of death (or more specifically, fear that death represents the permanent cessation of our personal conscious experience). I give Tart credit for at least being aware of this obvious motivation. It's not just ESP of course. It's the same reason people believe in gods and ghosts etc; it's really all about wanting our personal conscious experience to survive death. What Tart says about there being no hope for the survival of our personal conscious experience if materialism is correct isn't actually true. It's possible that our personal conscious experience continues after death or is in some way eternal; it's just extremely unlikely based on what we know about the connection to our personal conscious experience and brain activity. It also doesn't necessarily follow that if materialism is false we're more likely to be immortal. Our personal conscious experience is clearly dependent on brain activity whether materialism is true or not. Whether the brain is truly fundamentally made of 'stuff' or just _appears_ to be, brain activity is brain activity and it's clear that our personal conscious experience is dependent on it.
sound pretty dumb. start with the first 10min below which includes reports from 10+ years of direct observation and investigation by willian james and more from his other colleagues th-cam.com/video/z1KMw--SFdg/w-d-xo.html
@@Watercloud-11 I have, and the consensus among scientists is that those studies were insufficient and relied on biases and known tricks used by mentalists to come up with their data. There is 0 evidence (novel predictions) to support it's existence. I understand that people want it to be true, and I'm not claiming that it *couldn't* be true, but its irresponsible to claim that we have evidence of ESP when in fact we do not, and we may never.
Since a little kid I have had all forms of ESP; from seeing spirits (My mothers father was long dead before I arrived, and yet I could see him from time to time and described him to my mother, with his distinctive clothing>I first did that around age 3 by asking who the old man was. There were no photos of him, but she recognized the description and especially the particular clothes he usually appeared in). Out of body experiences, telepathy, knowing where others are/what they are doing from a vast distance, etc. The one which has always pointed to far more than a mere material universe is seeing the future. Things like telepathy, even seeing spirits, can be explained in a materialistic manner. As I have always viewed this world as all connected on many levels (I never knew about Einstein nor Quantum Physics when I was a pre-teen). Foreknowledge though, very precise details, throws everything up in the air. I have a record written before events take place and these are there for my family and friends to view, before or after whatever. Some future events I can avoid, or warn others to. Some though, no matter how hard I try to change, come to pass regardless. It is as though some events are actually written in stone way way back. One recent one was a car crash where a white Astra crashed into the side of my car (her fault.. or was it the Cosmic Trickster?). I had all the details written a few times in my book before this took place, as well as the type of road (cobbles), and the conditions. I rarely drive on those types of road, but it all happened just as foreseen. I had a strong hunch that very day too, that there would be an accident, and was driving more carefully than usual too... but sometimes there is no escaping fate.
Fascinating, how can be sure that what you are experiencing is real and not a construct of your imagination coupled with coincidences (akin to the experiences one might have under the influence of hallucinogens) please. I am rather cynical as I was raised in a family of multi generational amateur spiritualists and having not seen anything or experienced that I could ascribe to the supernatural I conclude it is almost certain brain chemistry in action, but know it’s not done with intent of false claims.
@@yp77738yp77739 How can you know it's not imagination and coincidence? Well, if you've never had an experience, I suppose you're going to say its all "anecdotal". Just stories. And you will deny. However, the transmission of verifiable and complex bits of information is hard to refute as mere probability. In that I have to disagree a bit with Harald the Younger who stated that "Things like telepathy ... can be explained in a materialistic manner" Well no they can't. Information sent at great distance w/o loss, and seemingly faster than the speed of light, defy any known electromagnetic means of transmission. Not to mention that it fails to explain how "brains" send and receive. And the complexity of the information received synchronously defies all probabilty: As an 11 year old kid reading J.B. Rhine, I conducted a telepathy experiment with neighborhood friends. The first three tries were blanks. The forth kid, a quite guy on the Autism spectrum, was the sender and I was the receiver. I later learned that he had concocted in his mind an image of a contraption that did not exist in reality and that was what he was sending. I as the receiver was befuddled by what was appearing on this screen that appeared in my head. I saw a hardwood box about 16 inches on a side. It was open topped. It contained a rotating black cylinder rotating clockwise with no apparent driver or motor. The cylinder filled the box and protruded about 1/4 way out of the box. The whole contraption was oddly balanced on the tip of the box, tilted at 45 degrees. I couldn't figure what I was seeing. I burst into the room where the sender kid was sitting and confronted him with this vision and said what the heck is that? He blinked uncharacteristically and, with a Cheshire grin, said "Don't you know what that is"? He had invented in his mind a visual cross between an old wax cylinder record player and a modern record player. I said "How was I supposed to know what that was without a tone arm". He said he didn't include a playback head in the image he was sending. At the time I considered the experiment a failure though I had received exactly the visual image he had sent. I just didn't understand the semantics behind his trick. So what are the statistical odds of that happening by chance? It's like 1 over 2 to the power of 2 followed by the number zeroes equal to all the grains of sand on this planet... Ya, the skeptics can call that a "non-zero" probability. Ya, right. These are not simple zener card experiments here where the odds are 1 in 5...
@@yp77738yp77739 being cynical is not healthy because essentially you forever doubt everything people say, which isn't a good mind-set to possess. i can tell you now with no reason to lie that i have experienced out of body states, whereby i was separate from my body. i was able to verify things whilst separate from the body, which were later proven accurate. you cannot be cynical all your life. until you have the experience yourself, keep an open mind. trying use "open-minded" instead of "cynical".
The absolute strangest, most unexplainable thing I have personally experienced in my Life, was about 20 years ago, I was hanging outside, my Son who was 18 at time, got on his Bike, said he was going to Gas station 1/4 mile down road. 5 minutes later, I'm sitting, my eyes start to go back, and forth in my head, really fast, kinda freaks me, at moment, I then, see a "vision" of my Son, being hit by Car on Bike. As I'm processing this very weird thing that just happened, that had never happened before, or since, my Son, carrying mangled Bike, mad about a "Dumb Lady" that hit him. Thank Goodness he was unhurt. I still think of that experience often, craziest thing. Wish I could control it.
It sounds difficult to accept , but the most likely explanation is coincidence . Just imagine the number of parents who have had that “vision” when they see their kids riding off. I’ve certainly had it. And worse . 99.999999% of those visions result in the child coming back unharmed and the vision forgotten about . Very occasionally they crash and this coincides with the vision . Given the numbers involved : this will happen regularly by pure chance to several people every day
@@tonyatkinson2210 Not buying it. Reason, the R.E.M. This was not me moving my eyes back, and forth, it was involuntary, it was as if my Brain went to "Sleep" stage where REM occurs. I didnt really "see" anything, I just knew it happened. Are you a Physicist? Mathematician? No, then I doubt you are qualified enough to talk about odds on this matter, not being mean, just accurate.
@@Tom_Quixote See? Ya probably ain't great at math, and you have 0 clue of the odds we are talking here. There are Scientific Theories, Studies going on about "Information". Its Theorized that there is some kind of Quantum Entanglement in our Brains when we interact, and exchange info, with others, especially with those we know well, are close to, even our Pets, (isnt that all Life is? A constant intake/output of info) and that the info may still "transmit", even though, you are not in proximity. That sounds more plausible than coincidence. If this is "True" it is an explanation for a lot of things, that "Makes Sense", like how you might "know" what somebody is gonna say before they say it, what they are thinking, or go to call a friend, and they call you right when you get phone, or they answer and say "I was just gonna call you", "ESP", my experience etc, etc., (Typical Human experiences, we blow off as coincidence) so, I guess you do need to 1 be to figure it out, because with your way of thinking, it's stays a coincidence.
@@timorean320 so you fell asleep and had a dream? You don’t need to be a mathematician to realise that the number of parents who have “visions “ of catastrophic scenarios about the kids activities in a population of 7 billion must be quite high and that would be almost inevitable that at least a few of these would come true every year
Tart came to UC Berkeley way back when and gave a great talk on eeg in OOBE. I remember going up after and having a great talk with him. He is an EE in his original education and I liked that people in hard sciences are into this stuff. But if you have had personal experiences you follow the real science. I also say all the time that physics education prepares you to expect the world to not be simple to understand.
I'm confused. Mr. Kuhn has interviewed scientists who've seriously searched for evidence of psi who say they could not find any. Yet here, he implies that there is. So, what is it? The absence of any such background info made watching this painful and unfulfilling.
St.Paul said "prove all things,hold fast to that which is good"....lots of Catholics have deep spiritual experiences...obviously he's not fimiliar with the Catholic tradition
All these "if we're *just* meat brains" type sentences are so silly to me. They try to make a point that materialism is too reductionistic, that there must be something else. The brain is WILDLY complex and intricate and beautiful and I don't understand why taking that approach is mocked as being more reductionistic than any dualist or idealist view that tries to intuit a more simple answer to these questions. I don't think materialists (I certainly don't) claim that people who pray are "just deluding themselves". I don't think their prayers have any tangible effects on the outside world, but it does seem to benefit the person praying in the same way various forms of meditation do. What's wrong with saying that it's good to sit with your thoughts, good to contemplate your own failures, good to think of your friends and loved ones in need, good to slow your thoughts for a moment? He's once again projecting his own view that materialism reduces things to meaninglessness.
the issue is there is no mechanism for electricity fat protein water in infinite combination to appear or appear to appear as color sound etc. whereas if awareness can only be produced by the previous moment of awareness, this radically changes things. the religious worship in magical meat chunks is preventing the study and funding for developing rigorous methods of observing the actual object we need to examine ie. the mind. the former is called religious dogma or metaphysics at best, the latter is the basis of science.
@@backwardthoughts1022 Molecules can't move. So it's JUST IMPOSSIBLE for a collection of fats and water and protein in the shape of a muscle to move by itself. ONLY THE ACTION OF ANGELS can explain how my index finger taps out these words.
@@bozo5632 when the protein etc are observed the muscle is observed and vic versa. when any part or flection of the brain is observed no color sound etc is ever observed. who knows what your point about so-called nonmoving molecules is supposed to be.
@@backwardthoughts1022 Observe a brain in action and you see chemicals reacting and neurons firing, all correlated with apparent mental activity. Some particular neuron lights up, and the subject says "Red." Other neurons activate, and he says "Blue." Remove some other neurons and he sees nothing, forever. But it has nothing to do with mere matter and meat, huh?
Same thing in almost every video by Kuhn: he loves to talk, talk, talk about the Truth . . . but never actually tries any _method_ (like meditation, Self-Inquiry, drugs, etc) for realizing it. Pffffft . . .
I was experiencing esp. Imagine blind salamander in dark cave, suddenly touch by ur finger, what it will think, who touching me , no bodies here. yes universe is more mysterious than we know.
Yes, we are always looking for ways to connect with the nature of reality. But too seperate us from the reality of the natural world that created us as well. As much as we would love to believe otherwise, we are not special or have special powers. For temporary artifacts of the random nature of this reality we think to highly of our place in it. Are we trying to find a god that isnt so self- contradictory and failing miserably at it ? So must find a connection where we can be our own god ? 🤔
the cia and monroe institute believed in it to the tune of millions of dollars - “in the magical universe there are no coincidences and there are no accidents. nothing happens unless someone wills it to happen” ― William S Burroughs some wills are evidently stronger than others lol
The Buddha if he existed had the right idea- ‘ test ideas to if they work and don’t just fall for doctrines for the sake of it even Buddhist doctrines’ 👍
It's intriguing perhaps as a study of the psychology of people who believe in it. I can do several "ESP" tricks that nearly always fool certain people into thinking I can do magic. I can "psychically" bend spoons and keys. I can "psychically" read minds and tell you what card you're holding. Some people just want to believe.
@@jackfergus7437 I can distinguish the words they used, I just can't make sense out of what they said. If ESP doesn't exist, I'm doing you a favor being a jerk about it. Better me than your bookie.
I saw a program once about a female scientist who had conducted experiments to try and prove paranormal phenomenon. After 25 or 30 years she gave up because she could simply find nothing there.
It's not remotely intriguing. And yes, belief in any sort of woo whatsoever all comes down to the fact that people don't want to believe that death is final. Some people just don't require evidence or facts or logic.
I'm not Catholic, but in defense of what they really teach, you have it all wrong on the saints and canonization. They don't canonize after the "saint's" death to make sure he/she doesn't do anything that could blow it. The whole concept of canonization MEANS that the Church has added that person to the "canon", i.e., the officially acknowledged list, of those who are...guess where...in heaven (which I suppose even you will have to admit is a pretty hard trick to pull off if you haven't died yet), and, being in heaven, are capable of receiving and interceding for the needs of the faithful still on earth. Your take on it was needlessly snarky, puerile--I'd even say snotty. It was a jarring departure from the otherwise rational (as "we intellectuals", as you put it) tone of your explanations. Obviously you've got a chip on your shoulder in this department that. Former Catholic, probably. Nobody worse on Catholics than former Catholics.
Evidently , like many pseudoskeptics and materialists, you are clueless on the subject . There is plenty of evidence, Etzel Cardeña published a review of the evidence in Psychological American in 2018 concluding that there was more evidence in favor of psi than the evidence for aspirin that generated its recommendation to prevent heart problems. She published several meta-analyses with positive results for psi. He also pointed out that the more "rigorous" the study was, the greater the effect tended to be, which refutes the mantra of the "skeptics" that the results are due to "methodological errors", (which they could never prove in all these decades that they have been repeating that)
Judaism started at the foot of Sina. Three million experienced God at the same time. It's the only religion that didn't start with one man's vision. Not only that. They were all slaves on the lowest rung of the latter.
for the Psychokinesis statement: yes humans have been killing those who become a gate for God (like messengers, like Jesus) and God has exerted psychokinesis action through them without following the chain of causation (like for Jesus brining dead back to life), Psychokinesis or as mentioned in Qur'an Kon-fa-yakon, is one of the qualities that God is described with, but seems that quality is purely under God's control.
![F.HERO Ft. JSPKK x ลำไย ไหทองคำ x M-PEE - ไม่สนิทบิดหมด (Thai Riders Anthem) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kPJZ0UihBfk/mqdefault.jpg)
![⭐️( ลอยกระทง 2024 ) Ver. แดนซ์ Remix BY [ ดีเจกิต รีมิกซ์ ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/rMWOLhgXUHc/mqdefault.jpg)
Consciousness is MORE than brain. I never accepted this construct until I had an Out of Body Experience myself.
Have you ever had a sense of impending danger and slowed down when driving and been glad you did
Ever have the sense it's your lucky day then stuff goes sideways?
@@MagnumInnominandum nope
Have you ever had a sense of impending danger and slowed down when driving and nothing happens ? Nope? that's because you have no need to remember that occasion and the thousand other times stuff like that happens. You only remember when you slowed and you were glad you did.
Yep . And many times when I’ve slowed down and nothing happened
@@jcfal1708 the thing is, you don't really know what might have happened had you not slowed down.
"When it happens in real life..." Why does it never happen in rigorous scientific studies?
cos even merely intending to research in that direction is severely repressed and denounced, and any related data of the kind is entirely ignored eg. the 50yrs of rigorous rebirth investigation in virginia uni
@Terre Schill If you don't know how to measure something you literally do not know there is something to measure.
Provide a clear example of compelling evidence of these claims please.
@@backwardthoughts1022 That's pure conspiracy. If anyone could find a reliable method to demonstrate that our brains (or minds or thoughts or ideas) could have any impact on the outside world not through means of our bodies going and doing it, they would win the Nobel prize. What is more likely, than people have tried to study the supernatural and come up short, or that anyone who tries to study it gets suppressed by "big science"?
edit: your comment feels like you want to have it both ways. Research is severely suppressed, and also The University of Virginia Studied it for 50 years. Can you explain a bit more what you mean here because when I looked this up it didn't seam suppressed or cancelled. It did face criticism, but thats par for the course when trying to break ground in science.
@@b.g.5869physical measurement of the nonphysical... should put that in your stand-up routine. in real life you would need to develop rigorous methods of observing the object you wish to understand ie. the mind, and then applied to rigorous peer review akin to god tier mathematicians ie. you without the rigorous method have nfi what they are doing
@Terre Schill it's a waste of time if you're not willing to honestly accept what the evidence or lack of evidence suggests, particularly when there's such an obvious incentive for _wanting_ it to be true.
Let's consider for example this idea that the brain isn't the source of consciousness but merely a sort of receiver.
First of all, there's absolutely no evidence for this whatsoever and is obviously not predicated on any objective indication that something like this is going on but because it superficially seems to get our personal conscious experience safely removed from our mortal brains.
But it's obviously just wishful thinking because even if it were true you'd still cease to exist when the receiver died.
Similarly, suppose our personal conscious experience isn't _entirely_ caused by brain activity, and that there are other factors contributing to it which we're currently unaware of. It's still clear that it's dependent upon brain activity and without it our personal conscious experience ceases, predictably and reliably.
NDEs are certainly not compelling evidence of life after death. One important thing to remember about near death experiences is that they are not experiences of death. Nobody has ever come back from the dead, a fact obscured by terms like "clinically dead".
Most NDEs have fairly trivial explanations, and to point to the small number of cases in which they're not readily explained isn't an argument for life after death (or if it is it's an obviously logically fallacious appeal to ignorance; the absence of an explanation isn't evidence of life after death).
One of the problems with NDEs is that we don't know for sure whether the experience being recalled actually occurred while the person was ostensibly unconscious or merely confabulated it that way.
It's hardly surprising that a person emerging from a nearly brain dead state would recall events in a flawed manner, and indeed many people emerging from such states definitely have inaccurate recollections of events, such as recalling being in a car crash when in fact they were assaulted etc.
We also know now, as brain activity measurement technology has improved, that people who years ago would have been naively declared "brain dead" we now know actually could have had brain activity too low to be detected by the technology of the time.
In fact, we now know that brain activity doesn't cease entirely for up to several hours after death. This has been determined by measuring brain activity of deceased persons from their last breath.
So we know that there's still _some_ brain activity up to as much as several hours after death, longer than any reported NDE experiencer was ostensibly unconscious, so there's really no good reason to think they were ever truly brain dead, particularly when they have no permanent brain damage.
This is why NDEs are so unreliable.
Either the person reporting them has suffered serious brain damage, and therefore is an unreliable narrator, or they haven't suffered serious brain damage, in which case it indicates they were never close to brain death.
The most important and least understood scientific frontier.
Human intelligence (ESP) is more important than artificial and may be our advantage over artificial. An advantage we may need.
@ 4:30 - "reality is only material" - that's merely an unproven hypothesis.
Wouldn't you think that in the million or so years of evolution that has passed for the humanoid race that the process of evolution might have found something like telepathy worth developing, think how useful it would have been back in the day with hunter communities. I dear say that back then there was a kind of unspoken communication. But if it was some sort of telepathy then by now we would all be using telepathy every day instead of mobile phones. Instead we are talking about very questionable accounts and possibilities among a very few individuals. I think his opening statement was the key, we all wish it was true.
Another great discussion; ESP doesn't so much fascinate me as it makes me wonder that there might be frequencies that still elude us but that some, on occasion, consciously experience.
"...frequencies that still elude us..."?? How about dimensions.
@@elarakamai , the tenth would explain it all.
Yes.. like the tip of an iceberg.
Women were accused of 'witchcraft' and murdered for deeds they never did. They may have been smart, had land, spoke out against the church's greed, and were blamed for otherworldly things because that is inexplicable.
Wow, great conversation. Thought provoking. That's why I'm here.
Is it feeling and breath provoking? I don't agree with you but no need to argue.
Dr Charles Tart, thank you very much. Say no more!
I get the sense that RLK was as fascinated with this discussion as I was. Charlie is what one might call an honest broker.. and very thoughtful.
He's on the right path.
Everyone think they are on right path
@@subhuman3408 Aren’t you a good little twist
Where is the evidence for experimental telepathy? That's kind of important information and I'm sick of these people not getting pressed about it.
This is a very old interview obviously but as for why Kuhn wastes time with cranks like this from time to time, it's due to an ill conceived if well intentioned desire to "hear all sides".
It's certainly not because Kuhn finds what his guest says plausible.
Presenting a wide variety of views is fine but I think we all realize that having a confused mentally ill person from the Staten Island Ferry Terminal on for an hour would be a waste of time. Charles Tarte isn't much better.
This wasn't a total waste of time however because there actually is a lot of truth to the connection between belief in nonsense like ESP and fear of death (or more specifically, fear that death represents the permanent cessation of our personal conscious experience).
I give Tart credit for at least being aware of this obvious motivation.
It's not just ESP of course. It's the same reason people believe in gods and ghosts etc; it's really all about wanting our personal conscious experience to survive death.
What Tart says about there being no hope for the survival of our personal conscious experience if materialism is correct isn't actually true. It's possible that our personal conscious experience continues after death or is in some way eternal; it's just extremely unlikely based on what we know about the connection to our personal conscious experience and brain activity.
It also doesn't necessarily follow that if materialism is false we're more likely to be immortal.
Our personal conscious experience is clearly dependent on brain activity whether materialism is true or not. Whether the brain is truly fundamentally made of 'stuff' or just _appears_ to be, brain activity is brain activity and it's clear that our personal conscious experience is dependent on it.
there are plenty of experiments on remote viewing, look it up.
sound pretty dumb. start with the first 10min below which includes reports from 10+ years of direct observation and investigation by willian james and more from his other colleagues
th-cam.com/video/z1KMw--SFdg/w-d-xo.html
@@Watercloud-11 I have, and the consensus among scientists is that those studies were insufficient and relied on biases and known tricks used by mentalists to come up with their data. There is 0 evidence (novel predictions) to support it's existence. I understand that people want it to be true, and I'm not claiming that it *couldn't* be true, but its irresponsible to claim that we have evidence of ESP when in fact we do not, and we may never.
@@Watercloud-11 But no evidence, which in itself is evidence.
Since a little kid I have had all forms of ESP; from seeing spirits (My mothers father was long dead before I arrived, and yet I could see him from time to time and described him to my mother, with his distinctive clothing>I first did that around age 3 by asking who the old man was. There were no photos of him, but she recognized the description and especially the particular clothes he usually appeared in). Out of body experiences, telepathy, knowing where others are/what they are doing from a vast distance, etc.
The one which has always pointed to far more than a mere material universe is seeing the future. Things like telepathy, even seeing spirits, can be explained in a materialistic manner. As I have always viewed this world as all connected on many levels (I never knew about Einstein nor Quantum Physics when I was a pre-teen). Foreknowledge though, very precise details, throws everything up in the air. I have a record written before events take place and these are there for my family and friends to view, before or after whatever.
Some future events I can avoid, or warn others to. Some though, no matter how hard I try to change, come to pass regardless. It is as though some events are actually written in stone way way back. One recent one was a car crash where a white Astra crashed into the side of my car (her fault.. or was it the Cosmic Trickster?). I had all the details written a few times in my book before this took place, as well as the type of road (cobbles), and the conditions. I rarely drive on those types of road, but it all happened just as foreseen. I had a strong hunch that very day too, that there would be an accident, and was driving more carefully than usual too... but sometimes there is no escaping fate.
🙂
Fascinating, how can be sure that what you are experiencing is real and not a construct of your imagination coupled with coincidences (akin to the experiences one might have under the influence of hallucinogens) please. I am rather cynical as I was raised in a family of multi generational amateur spiritualists and having not seen anything or experienced that I could ascribe to the supernatural I conclude it is almost certain brain chemistry in action, but know it’s not done with intent of false claims.
@@yp77738yp77739 How can you know it's not imagination and coincidence? Well, if you've never had an experience, I suppose you're going to say its all "anecdotal". Just stories. And you will deny. However, the transmission of verifiable and complex bits of information is hard to refute as mere probability. In that I have to disagree a bit with Harald the Younger who stated that "Things like telepathy ... can be explained in a materialistic manner" Well no they can't. Information sent at great distance w/o loss, and seemingly faster than the speed of light, defy any known electromagnetic means of transmission. Not to mention that it fails to explain how "brains" send and receive. And the complexity of the information received synchronously defies all probabilty:
As an 11 year old kid reading J.B. Rhine, I conducted a telepathy experiment with neighborhood friends. The first three tries were blanks. The forth kid, a quite guy on the Autism spectrum, was the sender and I was the receiver. I later learned that he had concocted in his mind an image of a contraption that did not exist in reality and that was what he was sending. I as the receiver was befuddled by what was appearing on this screen that appeared in my head. I saw a hardwood box about 16 inches on a side. It was open topped. It contained a rotating black cylinder rotating clockwise with no apparent driver or motor. The cylinder filled the box and protruded about 1/4 way out of the box. The whole contraption was oddly balanced on the tip of the box, tilted at 45 degrees. I couldn't figure what I was seeing. I burst into the room where the sender kid was sitting and confronted him with this vision and said what the heck is that? He blinked uncharacteristically and, with a Cheshire grin, said "Don't you know what that is"? He had invented in his mind a visual cross between an old wax cylinder record player and a modern record player. I said "How was I supposed to know what that was without a tone arm". He said he didn't include a playback head in the image he was sending. At the time I considered the experiment a failure though I had received exactly the visual image he had sent. I just didn't understand the semantics behind his trick. So what are the statistical odds of that happening by chance? It's like 1 over 2 to the power of 2 followed by the number zeroes equal to all the grains of sand on this planet... Ya, the skeptics can call that a "non-zero" probability. Ya, right. These are not simple zener card experiments here where the odds are 1 in 5...
That's interesting. Did you have those details about the car also written down (white Astra)?
@@yp77738yp77739 being cynical is not healthy because essentially you forever doubt everything people say, which isn't a good mind-set to possess.
i can tell you now with no reason to lie that i have experienced out of body states, whereby i was separate from my body. i was able to verify things whilst separate from the body, which were later proven accurate.
you cannot be cynical all your life.
until you have the experience yourself, keep an open mind.
trying use "open-minded" instead of "cynical".
The solid core of reality is you will (each of us) will find out the Truth when we die, and learn the answer to this question from the other side.
Eagle Don, if there is no other side and at death, for you, everything stops, how will you learn this?
The absolute strangest, most unexplainable thing I have personally experienced in my Life, was about 20 years ago, I was hanging outside, my Son who was 18 at time, got on his Bike, said he was going to Gas station 1/4 mile down road. 5 minutes later, I'm sitting, my eyes start to go back, and forth in my head, really fast, kinda freaks me, at moment, I then, see a "vision" of my Son, being hit by Car on Bike. As I'm processing this very weird thing that just happened, that had never happened before, or since, my Son, carrying mangled Bike, mad about a "Dumb Lady" that hit him. Thank Goodness he was unhurt. I still think of that experience often, craziest thing. Wish I could control it.
It sounds difficult to accept , but the most likely explanation is coincidence .
Just imagine the number of parents who have had that “vision” when they see their kids riding off. I’ve certainly had it. And worse .
99.999999% of those visions result in the child coming back unharmed and the vision forgotten about . Very occasionally they crash and this coincides with the vision .
Given the numbers involved : this will happen regularly by pure chance to several people every day
@@tonyatkinson2210 Not buying it. Reason, the R.E.M. This was not me moving my eyes back, and forth, it was involuntary, it was as if my Brain went to "Sleep" stage where REM occurs. I didnt really "see" anything, I just knew it happened. Are you a Physicist? Mathematician? No, then I doubt you are qualified enough to talk about odds on this matter, not being mean, just accurate.
@@timorean320 You don't need to be a mathematician to see that Tony's argument makes sense.
@@Tom_Quixote See? Ya probably ain't great at math, and you have 0 clue of the odds we are talking here. There are Scientific Theories, Studies going on about "Information". Its Theorized that there is some kind of Quantum Entanglement in our Brains when we interact, and exchange info, with others, especially with those we know well, are close to, even our Pets, (isnt that all Life is? A constant intake/output of info) and that the info may still "transmit", even though, you are not in proximity. That sounds more plausible than coincidence. If this is "True" it is an explanation for a lot of things, that "Makes Sense", like how you might "know" what somebody is gonna say before they say it, what they are thinking, or go to call a friend, and they call you right when you get phone, or they answer and say "I was just gonna call you", "ESP", my experience etc, etc., (Typical Human experiences, we blow off as coincidence) so, I guess you do need to 1 be to figure it out, because with your way of thinking, it's stays a coincidence.
@@timorean320 so you fell asleep and had a dream?
You don’t need to be a mathematician to realise that the number of parents who have “visions “ of catastrophic scenarios about the kids activities in a population of 7 billion must be quite high and that would be almost inevitable that at least a few of these would come true every year
Tart came to UC Berkeley way back when and gave a great talk on eeg in OOBE. I remember going up after and having a great talk with him. He is an EE in his original education and I liked that people in hard sciences are into this stuff. But if you have had personal experiences you follow the real science. I also say all the time that physics education prepares you to expect the world to not be simple to understand.
It doesn't seem you are getting Closer To Truth. You smashed into truth and made a Uturn.
I'm confused. Mr. Kuhn has interviewed scientists who've seriously searched for evidence of psi who say they could not find any. Yet here, he implies that there is. So, what is it? The absence of any such background info made watching this painful and unfulfilling.
Gee, if I ever start a cult, I'll have to remember that it's useful to name others as saints but only if they're dead.
I had a gut feeling this would be the next CTT video.
It came to me in a dream.
Amateur! I watched the entire episode on my crystal ball before these guys ever met.
@@mikel5582 cute, i watched this in my scrying table before these guys were even born
how can human experience be studied, similar to physical nature studied by scientific experiment?
Yes that's exactly what it should be! Test, question and work at getting a first hand experience. Otherwise what's the point?
Good interpretation and comprehension !
St.Paul said "prove all things,hold fast to that which is good"....lots of Catholics have deep spiritual experiences...obviously he's not fimiliar with the Catholic tradition
are ESP and other paranormal phenomenon considered to be conscious experience? how might mathematics relate to paranormal phenomenon?
My question to the guest is: Are we answerable to a supreme being?
Charles is a wise man.
All these "if we're *just* meat brains" type sentences are so silly to me. They try to make a point that materialism is too reductionistic, that there must be something else. The brain is WILDLY complex and intricate and beautiful and I don't understand why taking that approach is mocked as being more reductionistic than any dualist or idealist view that tries to intuit a more simple answer to these questions.
I don't think materialists (I certainly don't) claim that people who pray are "just deluding themselves". I don't think their prayers have any tangible effects on the outside world, but it does seem to benefit the person praying in the same way various forms of meditation do. What's wrong with saying that it's good to sit with your thoughts, good to contemplate your own failures, good to think of your friends and loved ones in need, good to slow your thoughts for a moment? He's once again projecting his own view that materialism reduces things to meaninglessness.
Why aren't they equally mystified by muscles as by brains? Is motion not mysterious enough for them?
the issue is there is no mechanism for electricity fat protein water in infinite combination to appear or appear to appear as color sound etc.
whereas if awareness can only be produced by the previous moment of awareness, this radically changes things.
the religious worship in magical meat chunks is preventing the study and funding for developing rigorous methods of observing the actual object we need to examine ie. the mind. the former is called religious dogma or metaphysics at best, the latter is the basis of science.
@@backwardthoughts1022 Molecules can't move. So it's JUST IMPOSSIBLE for a collection of fats and water and protein in the shape of a muscle to move by itself. ONLY THE ACTION OF ANGELS can explain how my index finger taps out these words.
@@bozo5632 when the protein etc are observed the muscle is observed and vic versa. when any part or flection of the brain is observed no color sound etc is ever observed. who knows what your point about so-called nonmoving molecules is supposed to be.
@@backwardthoughts1022 Observe a brain in action and you see chemicals reacting and neurons firing, all correlated with apparent mental activity. Some particular neuron lights up, and the subject says "Red." Other neurons activate, and he says "Blue." Remove some other neurons and he sees nothing, forever.
But it has nothing to do with mere matter and meat, huh?
Same thing in almost every video by Kuhn: he loves to talk, talk, talk about the Truth . . . but never actually tries any _method_ (like meditation, Self-Inquiry, drugs, etc) for realizing it. Pffffft . . .
We don't know what 95% of what the universe is made of. And we are so sure we know what is real or not
Try Criss Angel, David Blaine and Steven Frayne in ESP Test.
I was experiencing esp. Imagine blind salamander in dark cave, suddenly touch by ur finger, what it will think, who touching me , no bodies here. yes universe is more mysterious than we know.
Pitbulls are dangerous and frankly disgusting.
Yes, we are always looking for ways to connect with the nature of reality. But too seperate us from the reality of the natural world that created us as well.
As much as we would love to believe otherwise, we are not special or have special powers.
For temporary artifacts of the random nature of this reality we think to highly of our place in it.
Are we trying to find a god that isnt so self- contradictory and failing miserably at it ? So must find a connection where we can be our own god ? 🤔
the cia and monroe institute believed in it to the tune of millions of dollars -
“in the magical universe there are no coincidences and there are no accidents. nothing happens unless someone wills it to happen”
― William S Burroughs
some wills are evidently stronger than others lol
The Buddha if he existed had the right idea- ‘ test ideas to if they work and don’t just fall for doctrines for the sake of it even Buddhist doctrines’ 👍
It's intriguing perhaps as a study of the psychology of people who believe in it.
I can do several "ESP" tricks that nearly always fool certain people into thinking I can do magic. I can "psychically" bend spoons and keys. I can "psychically" read minds and tell you what card you're holding.
Some people just want to believe.
ppl triple your iq disagree. sorry bro.
Finally science meets religion and someone actually talks about it. Cool
ESP? Similar to Santa Claus really nice idea that doesn't exist.
There is nothing wrong with having an intelligent discussion about something. Nobody forces people to watch this.
I'd rather it be something intelligible.
@@bozo5632Earphones and a dictionary may suffice ❤️ continue learning
@@jackfergus7437 I can distinguish the words they used, I just can't make sense out of what they said.
If ESP doesn't exist, I'm doing you a favor being a jerk about it. Better me than your bookie.
Would y'all please setup some esp experiments rather than discussing?
There have been thousands . None have demostrated imreal effects under vigorous test conditions
I saw a program once about a female scientist who had conducted experiments to try and prove paranormal phenomenon. After 25 or 30 years she gave up because she could simply find nothing there.
Good ESP!
Um @0:11 "When it happens in life" It NEVER happens in life.
I am telepathetic!
Then you know the rest, se
It's not remotely intriguing.
And yes, belief in any sort of woo whatsoever all comes down to the fact that people don't want to believe that death is final.
Some people just don't require evidence or facts or logic.
An extra for the movies.
I'm not Catholic, but in defense of what they really teach, you have it all wrong on the saints and canonization. They don't canonize after the "saint's" death to make sure he/she doesn't do anything that could blow it. The whole concept of canonization MEANS that the Church has added that person to the "canon", i.e., the officially acknowledged list, of those who are...guess where...in heaven (which I suppose even you will have to admit is a pretty hard trick to pull off if you haven't died yet), and, being in heaven, are capable of receiving and interceding for the needs of the faithful still on earth. Your take on it was needlessly snarky, puerile--I'd even say snotty. It was a jarring departure from the otherwise rational (as "we intellectuals", as you put it) tone of your explanations. Obviously you've got a chip on your shoulder in this department that. Former Catholic, probably. Nobody worse on Catholics than former Catholics.
Prayer is telepathy 🙏🙏🙏 Buddha 🙏🙏🙏
TransDual . . .
Quantum . . .
NonLocality
🙏
7M's of 'religion' ~
[woMan]
Mystical Experience
Message
Movement
Myth
Machinery
Monuments
. . .
BS, pure and simple.
Good grief!! A discussion about parlor tricks.
Tin foul hat video
Bad interview. Nail the guy down with what evidence he has; the rest is gibberish.
🙏😻
TransDual . . .
InFinity
This is utter bollocks.
Can we stick with science please? Gods, esp, souls, life after death? Might as well be talking Santa Claus, Easter bunny and Tooth fairy.
Reflection of your ignorance.
There is no scientific evidence for ESP, so why bother discussing it as if it existed?
The Institute of Noetic Sciences says differently.
Evidently , like many pseudoskeptics and materialists, you are clueless on the subject .
There is plenty of evidence, Etzel Cardeña published a review of the evidence in Psychological American in 2018 concluding that there was more evidence in favor of psi than the evidence for aspirin that generated its recommendation to prevent heart problems. She published several meta-analyses with positive results for psi.
He also pointed out that the more "rigorous" the study was, the greater the effect tended to be, which refutes the mantra of the "skeptics" that the results are due to "methodological errors", (which they could never prove in all these decades that they have been repeating that)
Put one bad idea into a good brain and get - this.
WTF??? @4:44 NO WE DO NOT HAVE ANY EVIDENCE FOR TELEPATHY
😂😂😂😂😂 yet not a shred of evidence, just wishful thinking 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Judaism started at the foot of Sina. Three million experienced God at the same time. It's the only religion that didn't start with one man's vision. Not only that. They were all slaves on the lowest rung of the latter.
Were you there?
for the Psychokinesis statement: yes humans have been killing those who become a gate for God (like messengers, like Jesus) and God has exerted psychokinesis action through them without following the chain of causation (like for Jesus brining dead back to life), Psychokinesis or as mentioned in Qur'an Kon-fa-yakon, is one of the qualities that God is described with, but seems that quality is purely under God's control.
Total bullshit!
*How can people be intrigued by something that doesn't exist?*
Because human beings are naturally fantasy-prone
We don't know. Human beings are very arrogant thinking we can solve and explain everything.
People are intrigued by lots of things that don't exist.
No evidence at all for this
No Replicability? 🫠
Focus on ANY existing valid evidence for these phenomena instead of the speculations presented.
I am telepathetic!
I am telepathetic!
I know
@@beefandbarley do you believe in free will?