I hear you and I am glad you get on well with ballpoints, even really cheap ones. I was once able to do the same. However as I have become older, stiffer and more prone to aches and pains I really can’t do more than a couple of words with them and have returned to fountain pens, even cheap ones. It wasn’t so long ago I couldn’t imagine being bested by a type of pen.
I have a bunch of colored BIC Cristal 1.6 mm ballpoints and they write smooth on copy paper (for me, at least). I add some pressure on a down stroke for a thicker line if I want to get fancy, but I only do that for fun, not everyday writing.
Wouldn't you say a fountain pen involves zero pressure, while a ballpoint involves some, even if not much? If I watch your videos writing with a dip nib, your thumb stays pink, but in this vid, with every pen, the edge of your thumb and forefinger have turned white with pressure.
Few things: 1. Yes, a fountain pen essentially requires zero pressure, but you have to provide some pressure downward on the nib in order to stabilize the pen. So writing with a fountain pen vs a ballpoint pen is basically the same as far as pressure goes. Both require some downward pressure for stabilization that is greater than the downward pressure that will make the ink flow. 2. In this video, I'm writing with my fingers and therefore I am applying more grip pressure than when I write with my arm. That's why you see more tension in my grip. Good observation. 3. Feel free to try this yourself. See how little pressure is needed to write with a ballpoint pen. Don't mistake grip pressure for downward pressure on the paper. Both a fountain pen and a ballpoint pen require the same grip pressure to hold and stabilize the pen.
@@PerfectBiscuits Thanks for the thoughtful reply, and also thanks for the detailed discussion and scientific challenge, as I think I just relaxed my grip with both fountain pens and ballpoints. For a few weeks I've been using Bic medium Roundstics for Palmer warmups and thought I had to press harder with them than fountains. Just now, I tried to write with equal pressure with both, and found that I could in fact write with a ballpoint with the pressure I'd been using for fountain pens ... but it came out about half as dark as with the previous ballpoint pressure, and very uneven, with some lines looking like grey thread. I then went back to writing with very slight pressure and it was noticeably smoother-looking and darker, more like normal ballpoint appearance. Next, I tried a fountain pen, to test what you say about "downward pressure for stabilization." I tried to write with literally taking my index finger (traditional tripod grip) off the pen entirely, but this let the pen wobble in my hand. So it seemed you were right. However, I then found that just resting my index finger on the pen, with only its own weight, was enough to stabilize. This is very valuable information, as I had been getting bloodless thumbs and forefingers even when using fountain pens, overgripping, and this fixed it, so thanks again. I then picked up a Roundstic to try with this new even-looser grip, and found it even fainter than before, with about a third of the lines literally disappearing, and missing the first word entirely. In summary, in my experience, fountain pens require less pressure than ballpoints, really only index finger weight, but thank you for the helpful experiment showing me I'd been overgripping both. And I'll buy what you say about finger writing being responsible for the white fingers, but it would be interesting to see your Palmer writing with a Bic.
@@joefrank7531 when writing Palmer, you definitely need to apply a little downward pressure, but it is very minimal. So minimal that I can’t ever imagine it causing an issue with pain or fatigue in the hand or arm muscles. Anyway, appreciate the comments and I think I’ll have to make a follow up video based on this discussion.
@@PerfectBiscuits Thanks, looking forward to it. And I might be able to save you some time by admitting I just thought to look at your prev videos and saw that your very last one had you writing Palmer with a ballpoint with pink thumb and index. However, it wasn't a Bic, so maybe it's just Bics giving me a problem? Or paper? I just tried writing with the same Bic on cheaper paper than the fp friendly stuff I'd been using and it seemed the same, so I don't think it's the paper. Next I brought out 6 fancier ballpoints, and only 2 wrote with my new lowered pressure, a Pentel RSVP and a fancy commemorative one. More data pts for your vid. And I wouldn't say there's pain involved with ballpoints, I just find the (for me) increased pressure a little less comfortable than fps, and resulting in uneven line weight, since ballpoints are so pressure sensitive (mostly).
I hear you and I am glad you get on well with ballpoints, even really cheap ones.
I was once able to do the same. However as I have become older, stiffer and more prone to aches and pains I really can’t do more than a couple of words with them and have returned to fountain pens, even cheap ones.
It wasn’t so long ago I couldn’t imagine being bested by a type of pen.
@@juicylouisey i knew this comment was coming
Both BIC and Staedtler do biros in fine medium and thick. For Bic thick is 1.6mm
I have a bunch of colored BIC Cristal 1.6 mm ballpoints and they write smooth on copy paper (for me, at least). I add some pressure on a down stroke for a thicker line if I want to get fancy, but I only do that for fun, not everyday writing.
Mashallah my God bless you sir i am from India ❤❤❤
Do you help with print?
Do you have any recommendations on ball pens?
@@m0209051 I write with the Bic pens and this custom turned pen with a Cross refill. In the past I’ve enjoyed the Parker Jotter.
Wouldn't you say a fountain pen involves zero pressure, while a ballpoint involves some, even if not much? If I watch your videos writing with a dip nib, your thumb stays pink, but in this vid, with every pen, the edge of your thumb and forefinger have turned white with pressure.
Few things:
1. Yes, a fountain pen essentially requires zero pressure, but you have to provide some pressure downward on the nib in order to stabilize the pen. So writing with a fountain pen vs a ballpoint pen is basically the same as far as pressure goes. Both require some downward pressure for stabilization that is greater than the downward pressure that will make the ink flow.
2. In this video, I'm writing with my fingers and therefore I am applying more grip pressure than when I write with my arm. That's why you see more tension in my grip. Good observation.
3. Feel free to try this yourself. See how little pressure is needed to write with a ballpoint pen. Don't mistake grip pressure for downward pressure on the paper. Both a fountain pen and a ballpoint pen require the same grip pressure to hold and stabilize the pen.
@@PerfectBiscuits Thanks for the thoughtful reply, and also thanks for the detailed discussion and scientific challenge, as I think I just relaxed my grip with both fountain pens and ballpoints.
For a few weeks I've been using Bic medium Roundstics for Palmer warmups and thought I had to press harder with them than fountains. Just now, I tried to write with equal pressure with both, and found that I could in fact write with a ballpoint with the pressure I'd been using for fountain pens ... but it came out about half as dark as with the previous ballpoint pressure, and very uneven, with some lines looking like grey thread. I then went back to writing with very slight pressure and it was noticeably smoother-looking and darker, more like normal ballpoint appearance.
Next, I tried a fountain pen, to test what you say about "downward pressure for stabilization." I tried to write with literally taking my index finger (traditional tripod grip) off the pen entirely, but this let the pen wobble in my hand. So it seemed you were right. However, I then found that just resting my index finger on the pen, with only its own weight, was enough to stabilize. This is very valuable information, as I had been getting bloodless thumbs and forefingers even when using fountain pens, overgripping, and this fixed it, so thanks again.
I then picked up a Roundstic to try with this new even-looser grip, and found it even fainter than before, with about a third of the lines literally disappearing, and missing the first word entirely.
In summary, in my experience, fountain pens require less pressure than ballpoints, really only index finger weight, but thank you for the helpful experiment showing me I'd been overgripping both.
And I'll buy what you say about finger writing being responsible for the white fingers, but it would be interesting to see your Palmer writing with a Bic.
@@joefrank7531 when writing Palmer, you definitely need to apply a little downward pressure, but it is very minimal. So minimal that I can’t ever imagine it causing an issue with pain or fatigue in the hand or arm muscles.
Anyway, appreciate the comments and I think I’ll have to make a follow up video based on this discussion.
@@PerfectBiscuits Thanks, looking forward to it.
And I might be able to save you some time by admitting I just thought to look at your prev videos and saw that your very last one had you writing Palmer with a ballpoint with pink thumb and index.
However, it wasn't a Bic, so maybe it's just Bics giving me a problem? Or paper? I just tried writing with the same Bic on cheaper paper than the fp friendly stuff I'd been using and it seemed the same, so I don't think it's the paper.
Next I brought out 6 fancier ballpoints, and only 2 wrote with my new lowered pressure, a Pentel RSVP and a fancy commemorative one. More data pts for your vid.
And I wouldn't say there's pain involved with ballpoints, I just find the (for me) increased pressure a little less comfortable than fps, and resulting in uneven line weight, since ballpoints are so pressure sensitive (mostly).