Fully adjustable power curve, the ability to run both brakes on the bars, 60+hp, almost jo gyroscopic inertia AND I can ride it almost anywhere means this is an absolute win for me.
Actually, if every bike on the track were electric they will be able to hear each other. It's the noise from ICE bikes that makes it hard to hear the electric bikes.
@@Tazdeviloo7they always notice . People live and love knowing they stopped someone having fun. We had a bmx track in the woods in the 90s.and two miserable sea hags would call the cops.
Really loved the commentary and discussion around the pros/cons. The biggest advantage I see with this tech is the lack of noise, and that it may help prevent future closures of tracks. Heck, it may even eventually allow new tracks to open as there wouldn't be an issue with annoying neighbors. I see it as a good thing for the sport, and though I love gas bikes, think how much gas bikes have changed in the last 20 years. All the concerns like battery life will get improved over time, and once the traditional manufacturers start building electric variants of the YZ's/CR's/etc... the race will be on. Also I love the idea of less maintenance: No air filters, no top/bottom end rebuilds, no valve adjustments, etc... Keeping your brakes fresh, and adjusting/lubing your chain may be the extent of much of our wrenching going forward. I do like Nick's comment about the clutch, and think that's a good point. I've heard that the Varg lets you move the brake pedal up to the bars, and move things around, so who knows, maybe they could wire up some sort of physical fail-safe. One last point on Nick's comment about the bikes making it too easy to go fast: I definitely see there being the potential for a "spec" class, where a grid of all electric bikes could be "locked" into certain power modes/settings, to make for identical riding characteristics for each bike (other than suspension/brakes), which would actually put the racing much more back on rider ability if everyone has essentially the same platform to operate on. Similar to what's done in the car racing world with Balance of Power, to keep different cars competetive. Really excited to see where the sport goes from here!
Nick's point about having a clutch is a good one, but it harkens us old heads back to the days of power windows in cars. SO MANY people wanted a manual override to roll down electric power windows in case of getting trapped in fire, heat or water. At the end of the day you either trust the technology or you don't. Eventually, "manual" windows were no longer offered as an option and if you wanted a modern car, you had to have power windows. The same thing will happen here.
Nick has a valid point. I rode one and I did not think about it once. I did notice how crazy responsive a blip of the throttle is in the air. It can indeed get scary fast if you get in a situation with the stuck throttle for whatever reason. Other that that I had a really good time on the bike and rode for half an hour straight. I would normally be exhausted around 15 mins on my 125 ;)
@@JanWillemvanCappelleni got stuck throttle on a mini bike when i was 12 and went through the side gate in the yard. Hate to think of a stuck throttle on a 250 or 450 ..!!
Good point about it being to easy to go fast! I think even the four strokes were negative in that aspect. They raised the severity of injury. People go faster than they should be going.
@@mototodd In a panic situation with a split second to react I don’t think you’re going to find a red off button with your thumb. Most of us can find and use a clutch lever in that situation though.
@@amoore2165 It's funny you say that. Because the big, red button, which in case of emergency you hit with your fist and thus disconnects all the power supply - is called the "panic button"...
Can the rear brake overpower the engine on these? I had a throttle stick on me once and I pulled the clutch and stomped the rear brake. The kill switch wouldn't work because it was revving too high and I ended up having to stall the engine by dumping the clutch while holding the brake.
I met Nick in the 90's..his personality never changed! Still keeps it real with some level of dumb humor..lol I used to have a crush on his sister...saw her at Mini o's maybe 95? I was like.."who's that girl at the races" my friends were like "it's Nick Wey's sister" I was like "no shit?" Anyways..fast forward you can do nothing but respect Nick, i love watching him ride again as a fan. I never talked to his sister...just figured i would share my Nick Wey story.
Seems like many people don't know this yet, but adding a faux clutch to modulate power input coming from the throttle is very easy. You can do it with a magnet and Hall sensor connected to a lever, through an electric throttle box connected to a regular clutch or brake lever, via potentiometer, etc. All you have to do is modulate the input voltage (typically 4-5v) from the signal line of the throttle to the controller and bam, you have a clutch. Part of the beauty of these electric bikes is that they are highly and easily customizable.
Same here in USA... even though we have more open space and open land, it's hard to find areas where the neighbors won't complain about noise. But with electric dirt bikes, even someone with a small parcel of only a couple acres could ride in their backyard... these things make less noise than a circular saw
@@Kampy_Yes in some area's/States its very hard to find places to ride other than The actual Motocross race Tracks, I was in the Midwest and couldn't find any place to ride or just practice. It's all ktro area or Farms. On the west coast there is a lot more open land.
@@ladylog5470I forget the details a law is in place in California and maybe other states that in about 3 years no internal combustion engine motorcycles will be allowed anywhere except on purpose built tracks.
Great review but the battery isnt liquid cooled, its air cooled like the Alta is. The difference between the Stark battery pack and the Alta battery pack is 1) Stark uses 21700 size cells with lower impedance, meaning lower heat generated. 2) Stark pack has the cells oriented horizontally and each cell is thermally connected to the case at equal distances which makes cooling more even and efficient compared to Alta battery cells are oriented vertically stacked and the center cells got hotter than the exterior cells. 3) cooling fins are larger on the Stark pack vs the Alta pack.
@@randallgd I saw a range test where a top rider rode the bike hard on an mx track for an hour, from 100% charge to 10% charge, and then it took 2.5 hours to charge it back up to 100%. Way too long for me, until they get that charge time down to 30 minutes or less, I will never buy one. I also heard the battery is only good for 500 hours, then you need a new one, for $7,000.
Ha. “I heard . . . “ And “I also heard . . .” Battery life is measured by recharge cycles, not hours, so you heard wrong. The battery will last the life of the bike, so you heard wrong again.
Josh Hill spent some time on the Stark VARG. He also said adding a Clutch would provide instant override - (Safety issue) - I like Feeding in power - Its a right of passage -
The no clutch , controls on bars stuff takes about 10 / 15 minutes to fall in love with ; feels more roadracer in the inputs really ( almost a delicate operation ... ) That's on a Storm Thingy ; can't wait for the big four to get their stuff together so I don't have to mumble the name of wot I'm riding ...
The KXF rider talking about having a clutch for safety, you can add a clutch leaver power disconnect or have it as a motor kill switch, you can also add a brake leaver motor cutout switch like ebikes have.
Sure but once everyone, (Or many) reach the full potential and reach the bikes limits of as fast as you can go them what. I mean even now They are almost all going RC, JS, CR, Mcgrath speeds. Now there are so many fast dudes. If the can all do the same lap times then what, who gets the better start?
@rtsstream Right, but when it comes to Pro's, they are already sometimes within tenths of a second of each other. And for amateur's it doesn't seem like easier to go fast is necessary a good thing, I feel like 4-strokes already made it easier to go fast and Many many people quit due to injury, (it's the number one reason quit)I'm not against electric, but I don't think they need to be this fast, if everyone is on equal equipment than it's all good especially at the amateur level
The skill will never vanish with these. Remember when EFI 4-strokes took over the carb 2-strokes and everyone thought the same thing? People adapt to what's new and the skills only get better
An advanced 2 stroke rider still has more skills than the majority of 4 stroke riders, so does that mean they will likely find these bikes easier to ride fast and safer than 4 stroke riders
I think the "danger aspect" is twofold. On the other hand, electric is easier to ride and less things to think about, which could be less risk. I would say a modern 450 is just as dangerous for a beginner as a Varg because of more things to keep track of and a "powerband" that is harder to manage.
I agree with the clutch. I wasn't thinking about the throttle getting stuck open. For me it was more about when arm pump kicks in or getting squarely in a section and getting whiskey throttle the clutch is just a good safety Lever.
Small piece of flexible plastic stuck in the back wheel like use to do bicycles to make them sound like motorcycles would give you some engine noise lol. Or Ace of spades card in the spokes lol.
I absolutely believe electric motocross bikes have a place in our sport. I've been riding 27 years now and I actually think these bike will be good for our sport. These bikes can be setup to be ALL the same so every person is on an identical map meaning it's TRULY comes down rider ability. I'd absolutely purchase the 60HP version and ride it at about 50HP-55HP. My next bike I was going to get another 350 but this time a KTM 350 instead of the Husqvarna 350 but I may even consider something like this. Hopefully the price will come down a little bit over time but I think as far as maintenance is concerned it evens out anyways. Excellent review ✌️
It should last much much longer than an ICE bike with less than half the wearable components. E.g. Teslas that hit 100k miles have shown their batteries still performing at 95% of when new
@@jpslaym0936 that's brilliant, I didn't know that. I know they use 21700 low impedance cells to get the best performance but it's good knowing they're reliable to.
I want one. But waiting for the 10 other companies that are making them to get production going. Love the look of the Honda. I figure 6-18 months there will be 5 minimum to choose from.
My biggest complaint of my buddies Honda Africa Twin DCT was that there is no instinctual (without thinking) immediate disconnect of power. It takes "whiskey throttle" to a whole new level. I imagine that this must be similar. I am curious about the possibility of utilizing a clutch between the motor and drive train. It seems as one could get the motor to act like it has a torque curve to shorten the gap of ICE feel that so many of us are accustom too, and that way you give the rider back some more control over the motorcycle.
Mode 3 is 450F mode Mode 5 is crotch rocket mode On dirt. Is it time for a dirtbike with a thumb throttle? Whisky throttle and no clutch button on a dirty crotch rocket.
They could literally create a map that is identical across all bikes to level the field and make it all about the rider. It could even mimic a specific ICE bike.
I'd like to see a slightly smaller, lighter version as well, similar to a 125cc-stroke chassis with a ridable 40-45hp and a clutch for more control of wheel-spin etc
@@martynclinton8092 but you're going to clutch it? the solutions strike me as redundant. it's not like you're riding with fingers on the clutch with this bike.
So what if you don’t have Internet can you ride this thing? I see it has a phone so what happens if you lose Internet connection will your bike just shut off on you? What happens if you crash in your stark phone breaks? Cause I live in the rural area my phones always battling for Internet connection
Im buying a horse farm....an building a Small supercross track an a motocross track one of my neighbors house is 600 feet the other house is a 1000 feet even though there is no noise ordinance im gonna wrap my 23 YZ 250 EXHaust to the silence i ve already figured out the 24 CRF 250R honda is the quietest 4 stroke an the lightest...i want to take a little of the bite off the volume of my exhaust my motor is going to Tom Morgan for stage 3 so its gonna be wicked fast and a screamer...i not quiet ready for the full electric bike but its a pure solution....i like a little noise thats the fun of it...i saw ken Roczen rode it a year ago an it looks an ken look very comfortable on the Stark...the drive chain lash sounds was very irrating...thats all but riding it i dont care just watching it is the case...Nick still rides....wow. jk
The dude who said hes worried that the ebike because it allows slower riders to ride much faster means that it reduces competition with faster riders., what? Hes assuming that current fast guys wont be faster on ebikes and therefore a gap to slower riders. Perhaps he means hes worried about ebikes and ICE bikes mixing during races which I dont think should happen
Was not mentioned, but Obviously you need to bring your noisy gas generator to the track with you'; and also not mentioned was how long it takes to charge the battery fully. How many volts and amp hours is the battery?
@@bobjohnson2920 As time goes on it is less about saving the planet and more about the performance. And if this bike is any indication, this is the future.
As an old fart ex MXer, these things look scary fast, and at 59, my knees, back and 3 heart stents, say a firm No!! But I'd DEFINITELY stick Enduro lights, and a set of Gold Anodised Excel Supermoto rims, on this puppy and ride it on the road like I'd stolen it!!! 😁😊.
Cool idea, but an electric moto or supercross race would be about as exciting as going to Catholic Mass! they will have music blasting or piped in engine sounds, half the appeal of dirtbikes in general, the sounds and smells. take a lesson from F1 E series, yeah the one that no one watches.
F1 isn’t even a good comparison. I have been to many stadium E bike races and they are great. I don’t have to have my kids in earmuffs, you can talk about the race during the race, the riders can hear. A lot or riders wear earplugs to block out the noise.
@@kurtheidelbach I have been going to races and racing myself, never had to wear hearing protection and my hearing is perfect. go watch a BMX event, boring as sh!t, they pipe in music blasting 3x as loud as any motorcycle. so your point is mute. half the experience of a race is aural. why do you think companies spend so much R&D on the sound of the exhaust. Then when the lithium runs out or catches fire, have fun watching the 3,000 degree flames.
@@jetdr safe audio levels are 70dBa with hearing hamate starting at 85dBa. SX, NASCAR, Monster Truck are all way way above that. Especially if you have decent seats. Most responsible people care about their kids. Again, you can’t fix stupid 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂
As an enthusiast, I absolutely love the innovation. But you cant peel this old school die hard off my vintage 2 strokes 😅. I pick my Mod 1995 CR250 time and time again over so many bikes for a daily bike. I still race a 1989 CR250. Its the challange thats fun to me.
It doesn't need the phone to function. You can remove the phone and just ride with the maps already created. The phone is just to alter maps and see battery life and other data.
@@bmotomo421You can program the modes, order spare parts and other things. It also records your rides with gps tracks, airtime, lap times etc. Seems like a good solution and the phone is protected and quite sturdy. It also connects to Stark so they will troubleshoot it in case of problems. I had someone report in errors and got a response in a few hours with an update for the software
A cell phone is the easiest interface to adjust ride maps. Why would you want to be stuck with the maps stark creates when you can adjust power and engine braking to suit your needs.
@benjaminhawkins3767 A cell phone isn't the only technology that can do that stuff. Is the phone touch screen? Can it get wet while riding without affecting the bike? Is the cellphone nessisary to charge the battery? Who other than the owner has access to the phone? It's just seems like a very unusual way to opporate a motorcycle. Will it hold up in a hard crash? What happens when the bike travels into an area where there is no cell service? There seem to still be so many unknowns. The phone is the most concerning, though.
Its a good yard bike because it cant compete yet in mx sx battery wont last. It can woods race but will need 2 to 4 batteries to finish 2 plus hr races which can cos to 30k plus. They are already at local races
@@gpaull2 it is not made to be swapped out, and a new battery cost $7,000, that you can only buy from Stark Varg. I also read that they are only good for 500 hours, they once said they would last 1000 hours, then they changed it to 500 hours. So after 500 hours of riding time you have to buy a new $7,000 battery from Stark Varg, no thanks.
I heard the battery life is 500 hours, if you ride it a lot that is maybe 2 years of riding, then you have to pay $7,000 for a new battery, no thank you. I also saw a range test where the bike went from 100% charge to 10% charge in an hour, then it took 2.5 hours to charge it back up to 100%, that is way too long to charge for an hour of riding time. Until they can charge it from 10% to 100% in 30 minutes, or less, I will never buy one. And the real deal killer is buying a new $7,000 battery every 2 years, never.
450 needs an new piston every 50 hours so 500 bucks if you let a shop do it. full engine rebuild 100 hours. 500 hours : 10 new pistons 2500 dollar + 5x engine rebuild for 1000 a pop "7500 dollars total. plus al the air filters oil changes and fuel. most gas bikes are done after 500 hours of enduro/racing. Agree with the charge time isseu . maybe if the battery's get cheaper you can swap them.
@@bertr286 Yeah but that money for stuff on a gas bike is spread out over a 2 year period, a little at a time, and you save a lot of money of you do it yourself, with the Stark Varg, when the battery dies out, you have to fork over $7,000 at one time. Then pay for the shipping too.
If the power within the computer ranges from about a 125 to a 450 factory setup, this could be extremely dangerous for newer/inexperienced riders who might think they need all the HP possible right off the bat… A clutch (or something similar) would definitely help, but I wonder what else could be implemented to help out the idiots of the world… 🤔 (& yeah I know, “natural selection”)… but still…
No clutch and no shifter is kinda weird. Would take awhile to adjust to this, I rely on those so much. 😮 Rode one this Weekend for first time. Everyone else loved it, I was not into it. Would take a lot of time to get the new feel.
I’d get one with the rear handbrake. I wonder if there’s an electric switch that deactivates the power while the brake is activated. Either way, a finger on the rear brake lever could be useful and also allow you to keep both feet planted. It’d take awhile to get used to it of course
Looking back now at these early reviews, some of the commentary is so stupid. “Essentially it felt completely different to my gasoline dirt bike and here’s all the ways it didn’t feel the same and instead of me taking time to get used to it I’m just going to portray all these things as a negative of the bike design versus me not being used to or comfortable on it yet”. Like, no way? Shocking.
Fully adjustable power curve, the ability to run both brakes on the bars, 60+hp, almost jo gyroscopic inertia AND I can ride it almost anywhere means this is an absolute win for me.
Imagine how much yelling we could do at each other with no engine noise!
😂😂
Actually, if every bike on the track were electric they will be able to hear each other. It's the noise from ICE bikes that makes it hard to hear the electric bikes.
Åäcktjuallie /woooosh @@jrnmoe3740
Can’t help thinking I could have a track in my back garden an no one can complain anymore 👍🏻
They will complain about something either the dust the noise of the tires the noise of the motor whining
@@denniswilder3014Not if they don't notice
@@Tazdeviloo7they always notice . People live and love knowing they stopped someone having fun. We had a bmx track in the woods in the 90s.and two miserable sea hags would call the cops.
Really loved the commentary and discussion around the pros/cons. The biggest advantage I see with this tech is the lack of noise, and that it may help prevent future closures of tracks. Heck, it may even eventually allow new tracks to open as there wouldn't be an issue with annoying neighbors. I see it as a good thing for the sport, and though I love gas bikes, think how much gas bikes have changed in the last 20 years. All the concerns like battery life will get improved over time, and once the traditional manufacturers start building electric variants of the YZ's/CR's/etc... the race will be on. Also I love the idea of less maintenance: No air filters, no top/bottom end rebuilds, no valve adjustments, etc... Keeping your brakes fresh, and adjusting/lubing your chain may be the extent of much of our wrenching going forward. I do like Nick's comment about the clutch, and think that's a good point. I've heard that the Varg lets you move the brake pedal up to the bars, and move things around, so who knows, maybe they could wire up some sort of physical fail-safe.
One last point on Nick's comment about the bikes making it too easy to go fast: I definitely see there being the potential for a "spec" class, where a grid of all electric bikes could be "locked" into certain power modes/settings, to make for identical riding characteristics for each bike (other than suspension/brakes), which would actually put the racing much more back on rider ability if everyone has essentially the same platform to operate on. Similar to what's done in the car racing world with Balance of Power, to keep different cars competetive.
Really excited to see where the sport goes from here!
Nick's point about having a clutch is a good one, but it harkens us old heads back to the days of power windows in cars. SO MANY people wanted a manual override to roll down electric power windows in case of getting trapped in fire, heat or water. At the end of the day you either trust the technology or you don't. Eventually, "manual" windows were no longer offered as an option and if you wanted a modern car, you had to have power windows. The same thing will happen here.
Nick has a valid point. I rode one and I did not think about it once. I did notice how crazy responsive a blip of the throttle is in the air. It can indeed get scary fast if you get in a situation with the stuck throttle for whatever reason. Other that that I had a really good time on the bike and rode for half an hour straight. I would normally be exhausted around 15 mins on my 125 ;)
@@JanWillemvanCappelleni got stuck throttle on a mini bike when i was 12 and went through the side gate in the yard. Hate to think of a stuck throttle on a 250 or 450 ..!!
Good point about it being to easy to go fast! I think even the four strokes were negative in that aspect. They raised the severity of injury. People go faster than they should be going.
I turned the stark down to 40hp by choice when I Test rode it :D only did one lap on 80hp to feel it :D way to much for my skill level 😂
That’s a really good idea to have a clutch lever as an emergency shut off. Never even thought about that.
Or the red off button could be used
@@mototodd In a panic situation with a split second to react I don’t think you’re going to find a red off button with your thumb. Most of us can find and use a clutch lever in that situation though.
To have the rear brake on the left hand is such a game changer, but for some reason he chose to have the foot brake instead
@@amoore2165 It's funny you say that. Because the big, red button, which in case of emergency you hit with your fist and thus disconnects all the power supply - is called the "panic button"...
Can the rear brake overpower the engine on these? I had a throttle stick on me once and I pulled the clutch and stomped the rear brake. The kill switch wouldn't work because it was revving too high and I ended up having to stall the engine by dumping the clutch while holding the brake.
Nick is crazy smart, enjoyed his thoughts!!
Bringing back the Open class scariness!!!😁
Yup… 80HP and 600+ lb/ft torque will do it!
I met Nick in the 90's..his personality never changed! Still keeps it real with some level of dumb humor..lol I used to have a crush on his sister...saw her at Mini o's maybe 95? I was like.."who's that girl at the races" my friends were like "it's Nick Wey's sister" I was like "no shit?" Anyways..fast forward you can do nothing but respect Nick, i love watching him ride again as a fan. I never talked to his sister...just figured i would share my Nick Wey story.
Seems like many people don't know this yet, but adding a faux clutch to modulate power input coming from the throttle is very easy. You can do it with a magnet and Hall sensor connected to a lever, through an electric throttle box connected to a regular clutch or brake lever, via potentiometer, etc. All you have to do is modulate the input voltage (typically 4-5v) from the signal line of the throttle to the controller and bam, you have a clutch.
Part of the beauty of these electric bikes is that they are highly and easily customizable.
I'll bet someone in e-bikes is reading this
For us people in Europe this is a good addition for riding in more places
Same here in USA... even though we have more open space and open land, it's hard to find areas where the neighbors won't complain about noise. But with electric dirt bikes, even someone with a small parcel of only a couple acres could ride in their backyard... these things make less noise than a circular saw
@@Kampy_Yes in some area's/States its very hard to find places to ride other than The actual Motocross race Tracks, I was in the Midwest and couldn't find any place to ride or just practice. It's all ktro area or Farms.
On the west coast there is a lot more open land.
@@Kampy_ exactly!
Almost every local track in so cali has been closed in the last decade because of noise complaints. Milestones, comp edge, race town 395 r all gone.
@@ladylog5470I forget the details a law is in place in California and maybe other states that in about 3 years no internal combustion engine motorcycles will be allowed anywhere except on purpose built tracks.
Being able to tune each modes power and engine braking (in an old guy too) effectively gives you 5 bikes in one, which justifies the price to me.
Great training bike, even better for newbies and for the parts of the country with noise issues. it's the future mate.
Yet you’ll never think it’s too slow. It’s crazy fast
80hp is for the timbersled guys!!! i personally cant wait to get a surron and a varg!
Great review but the battery isnt liquid cooled, its air cooled like the Alta is. The difference between the Stark battery pack and the Alta battery pack is 1) Stark uses 21700 size cells with lower impedance, meaning lower heat generated. 2) Stark pack has the cells oriented horizontally and each cell is thermally connected to the case at equal distances which makes cooling more even and efficient compared to Alta battery cells are oriented vertically stacked and the center cells got hotter than the exterior cells. 3) cooling fins are larger on the Stark pack vs the Alta pack.
@bwhaskell Curious how long to charge back up after say a 30min moto? say with a generator? Thanks!
@@randallgd I saw a range test where a top rider rode the bike hard on an mx track for an hour, from 100% charge to 10% charge, and then it took 2.5 hours to charge it back up to 100%. Way too long for me, until they get that charge time down to 30 minutes or less, I will never buy one. I also heard the battery is only good for 500 hours, then you need a new one, for $7,000.
7k for a 6kw battery is pure insanity... What a ripoff
Ha. “I heard . . . “ And “I also heard . . .”
Battery life is measured by recharge cycles, not hours, so you heard wrong. The battery will last the life of the bike, so you heard wrong again.
@@ChitFromChinola Stark Varg says you are wrong, clown. They say the battery is good for 500 hour of riding time, look it up, fool.
Josh Hill spent some time on the Stark VARG. He also said adding a Clutch would provide instant override - (Safety issue) -
I like Feeding in power - Its a right of passage -
The no clutch , controls on bars stuff takes about 10 / 15 minutes to fall in love with ; feels more roadracer in the inputs really ( almost a delicate operation ... )
That's on a Storm Thingy ; can't wait for the big four to get their stuff together so I don't have to mumble the name of wot I'm riding ...
Nick is awesome and presented some very valid points. And Kris is just top tier. Both killer riders who speak true words.
The KXF rider talking about having a clutch for safety, you can add a clutch leaver power disconnect or have it as a motor kill switch, you can also add a brake leaver motor cutout switch like ebikes have.
Once all our kids are riding Electric, I would have thought it will be about who has the better skills. Welcome to the future.
Sure but once everyone, (Or many) reach the full potential and reach the bikes limits of as fast as you can go them what.
I mean even now They are almost all going RC, JS, CR, Mcgrath speeds.
Now there are so many fast dudes.
If the can all do the same lap times then what, who gets the better start?
@@MX-CO whoever is willing to take a bigger risk..
@rtsstream Right, but when it comes to Pro's, they are already sometimes within tenths of a second of each other.
And for amateur's it doesn't seem like easier to go fast is necessary a good thing, I feel like 4-strokes already made it easier to go fast and Many many people quit due to injury, (it's the number one reason quit)I'm not against electric, but I don't think they need to be this fast, if everyone is on equal equipment than it's all good especially at the amateur level
The skill will never vanish with these. Remember when EFI 4-strokes took over the carb 2-strokes and everyone thought the same thing? People adapt to what's new and the skills only get better
An advanced 2 stroke rider still has more skills than the majority of 4 stroke riders, so does that mean they will likely find these bikes easier to ride fast and safer than 4 stroke riders
Been waiting a long time to see this bike at Glen Helen.
I think the "danger aspect" is twofold. On the other hand, electric is easier to ride and less things to think about, which could be less risk. I would say a modern 450 is just as dangerous for a beginner as a Varg because of more things to keep track of and a "powerband" that is harder to manage.
Good stuff. And nice work Mr Cudby.
The best thing about this is that you can hear the 2 stroke clear
Nick is the man, living the life at retirement
Its kinda funny how the revving of the bikes around him are in sync with him accelerating 😂
I agree with the clutch. I wasn't thinking about the throttle getting stuck open. For me it was more about when arm pump kicks in or getting squarely in a section and getting whiskey throttle the clutch is just a good safety Lever.
Damn its good seeing Nick Wey ride! Homie makes an electronic bicycle look badass as fuck, lol.
Small piece of flexible plastic stuck in the back wheel like use to do bicycles to make them sound like motorcycles would give you some engine noise lol. Or Ace of spades card in the spokes lol.
I absolutely believe electric motocross bikes have a place in our sport. I've been riding 27 years now and I actually think these bike will be good for our sport. These bikes can be setup to be ALL the same so every person is on an identical map meaning it's TRULY comes down rider ability. I'd absolutely purchase the 60HP version and ride it at about 50HP-55HP. My next bike I was going to get another 350 but this time a KTM 350 instead of the Husqvarna 350 but I may even consider something like this. Hopefully the price will come down a little bit over time but I think as far as maintenance is concerned it evens out anyways. Excellent review ✌️
It should last much much longer than an ICE bike with less than half the wearable components. E.g. Teslas that hit 100k miles have shown their batteries still performing at 95% of when new
@@jpslaym0936 that's brilliant, I didn't know that. I know they use 21700 low impedance cells to get the best performance but it's good knowing they're reliable to.
I don't know how many times pulling in the clutch on my bike saved me from a potentially bad crash. I see what Nick is saying.
Awesome show guys!! I feel like this is the first 450 built. Could it happen that fast? Could 4 strokes be taken over as fast as the 2 strokes?
I hope they don't mix them, give electric it's own separate race classes
@@MX-CO Agreed. There are classes for different CC's (horsepower) so this needs it's own class.
@@MX-CO No way they're separated. Did they make a 4-stroke class? They have to run together, that's the point.
@@usualsuspectsfor1k So? Did they make 2 & 4 strokes separate?
You can order it with a left hand rear brake lever. Great for right hand turn starts.
Nick way is spot on 👏
Nick's style is perfect.
I want one. But waiting for the 10 other companies that are making them to get production going. Love the look of the Honda. I figure 6-18 months there will be 5 minimum to choose from.
Sometimes the only thing you get for being a pioneer is an azz full of arrows.
You're way off on your time. More likely 2-5 years away. The Honda everyone is assuming will be out soon is the same prototype the've had since '17.
My biggest complaint of my buddies Honda Africa Twin DCT was that there is no instinctual (without thinking) immediate disconnect of power. It takes "whiskey throttle" to a whole new level. I imagine that this must be similar.
I am curious about the possibility of utilizing a clutch between the motor and drive train. It seems as one could get the motor to act like it has a torque curve to shorten the gap of ICE feel that so many of us are accustom too, and that way you give the rider back some more control over the motorcycle.
Did I notice that correctly....bike starts in neutral, then it's 1-down and 4-up on the left switch? That makes me really happy.
No those are just power modes.
Good job guys.
I wonder if they plan on throwing some supermoto tires on it, and setting it up for the supermoto/street riding??
Great review.Everything from soup to nuts.
Mode 3 is 450F mode
Mode 5 is crotch rocket mode
On dirt. Is it time for a dirtbike with a thumb throttle? Whisky throttle and no clutch button on a dirty crotch rocket.
Isn't there a kill switch on the left bar? Couldn't you hit the kill switch? How accessible is it? Thanks!
I love the fact that I can ride it on my street and don't piss off my neighbors anymore, lol
Just think how cool it would be with a Ti exhaust and a big bore kit!
you mean "jailbreaking" it with your iPhone?! LOL
Races will sound like RC e-buggy classes
They could literally create a map that is identical across all bikes to level the field and make it all about the rider. It could even mimic a specific ICE bike.
Salute fellas 💯
Is it possible to add regenerative braking perhaps.
Put a clutch on one and I would buy it
Why not just put the rear brake there
I'd like to see a slightly smaller, lighter version as well, similar to a 125cc-stroke chassis with a ridable 40-45hp and a clutch for more control of wheel-spin etc
is the kill switch not there for safety if the throttle gets stuck?
If 60hp takes u for a ride you ain’t gonna get to the kill switch
@@martynclinton8092 but you're going to clutch it? the solutions strike me as redundant. it's not like you're riding with fingers on the clutch with this bike.
Did Keefer just say he doesn't like 2-strokes? SHAME!
Did he not watch Jett Lawrence dominate this entire season... He's talkin about the 450 class as if everybody was relatively even in skill
Good point
I think the lack of noise is gonna be a danger on tracks. Hearing a bike is usually the first sign of a faster rider behind you
I think thats 100 percent true if you have a mix of ICE and electric, but if all electric bikes in pack I think you can hear approaching riders
@@jpslaym0936 hell, in a pack of electric bikes, you could just call out "on your left!"
So what if you don’t have Internet can you ride this thing? I see it has a phone so what happens if you lose Internet connection will your bike just shut off on you? What happens if you crash in your stark phone breaks? Cause I live in the rural area my phones always battling for Internet connection
I want a clutch too. Any decent rider modulates power more with the clutch than the throttle, especially in hard enduro type riding.
Because they have to with ICE, but it's pointless with electric.
So does a Stark Varg have a phone number?
Whats its weight in kilograms and how long is run time on these steeds
Rear brake on the left.!
Clutch ,yes well said nic . Just for safety, kind of a disconnect.
A one finger disconnect.
what brand is the forks and shock?
Most e bikes cut power on the brake switches
Can you still drag a brake in the ruts?
@@gpaull2 What for?
Im buying a horse farm....an building a
Small supercross track an a motocross track one of my neighbors house is 600 feet the other house is a 1000 feet even though there is no noise ordinance im gonna wrap my 23 YZ 250 EXHaust to the silence i ve already figured out the 24 CRF 250R honda is the quietest 4 stroke an the lightest...i want to take a little of the bite off the volume of my exhaust my motor is going to Tom Morgan for stage 3 so its gonna be wicked fast and a screamer...i not quiet ready for the full electric bike but its a pure solution....i like a little noise thats the fun of it...i saw ken Roczen rode it a year ago an it looks an ken look very comfortable on the Stark...the drive chain lash sounds was very irrating...thats all but riding it i dont care just watching it is the case...Nick still rides....wow. jk
The Alta was fun, with that being said… I don’t want another electric bike… done that, been there.
Awesome review but god damn does that two stroke sound so fing good @4:16
I rode 200k on a track just 50m from housing complex on E motorcycle - no one could hear me having Fun
come on racer x, its 2023 u are pro ! use 4k
What are the odds of the throttle sticking on an electric?
The dude who said hes worried that the ebike because it allows slower riders to ride much faster means that it reduces competition with faster riders., what? Hes assuming that current fast guys wont be faster on ebikes and therefore a gap to slower riders. Perhaps he means hes worried about ebikes and ICE bikes mixing during races which I dont think should happen
Was not mentioned, but Obviously you need to bring your noisy gas generator to the track with you'; and also not mentioned was how long it takes to charge the battery fully. How many volts and amp hours is the battery?
So true, then they tell you how they are saving the planet lol
Look it up... easy answer.
@@bobjohnson2920 As time goes on it is less about saving the planet and more about the performance. And if this bike is any indication, this is the future.
As an old fart ex MXer, these things look scary fast, and at 59, my knees, back and 3 heart stents, say a firm No!! But I'd DEFINITELY stick Enduro lights, and a set of Gold Anodised Excel Supermoto rims, on this puppy and ride it on the road like I'd stolen it!!! 😁😊.
Can’t you press the red button to kill the bike instead of a clutch?
How Does it compare to the Alta?
I did a podcast on my website about the differences.
Cool idea, but an electric moto or supercross race would be about as exciting as going to Catholic Mass! they will have music blasting or piped in engine sounds, half the appeal of dirtbikes in general, the sounds and smells. take a lesson from F1 E series, yeah the one that no one watches.
F1 isn’t even a good comparison. I have been to many stadium E bike races and they are great. I don’t have to have my kids in earmuffs, you can talk about the race during the race, the riders can hear. A lot or riders wear earplugs to block out the noise.
Nah, your children are safe at a super cross race.
@@kurtheidelbach I have been going to races and racing myself, never had to wear hearing protection and my hearing is perfect. go watch a BMX event, boring as sh!t, they pipe in music blasting 3x as loud as any motorcycle. so your point is mute. half the experience of a race is aural. why do you think companies spend so much R&D on the sound of the exhaust. Then when the lithium runs out or catches fire, have fun watching the 3,000 degree flames.
@@Marleysdad808 No, actually the noise at a Supercross event is much higher then the safe level for a child moron
@@jetdr safe audio levels are 70dBa with hearing hamate starting at 85dBa. SX, NASCAR, Monster Truck are all way way above that. Especially if you have decent seats. Most responsible people care about their kids. Again, you can’t fix stupid 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂
put a set of slicks on it boost over load on tarmac
As an enthusiast, I absolutely love the innovation. But you cant peel this old school die hard off my vintage 2 strokes 😅. I pick my Mod 1995 CR250 time and time again over so many bikes for a daily bike. I still race a 1989 CR250. Its the challange thats fun to me.
Need to take it to sand dunes where power is needed.
Nice socks dude...lol
Can you tell us why it needs a cell phone to function? And, does the phone require a separate cell service?
It doesn't need the phone to function. You can remove the phone and just ride with the maps already created.
The phone is just to alter maps and see battery life and other data.
@@benjaminhawkins3767Then, why a cell phone? Many bikes have different ride modes without having a cell phone
@@bmotomo421You can program the modes, order spare parts and other things. It also records your rides with gps tracks, airtime, lap times etc. Seems like a good solution and the phone is protected and quite sturdy. It also connects to Stark so they will troubleshoot it in case of problems. I had someone report in errors and got a response in a few hours with an update for the software
A cell phone is the easiest interface to adjust ride maps. Why would you want to be stuck with the maps stark creates when you can adjust power and engine braking to suit your needs.
@benjaminhawkins3767 A cell phone isn't the only technology that can do that stuff. Is the phone touch screen? Can it get wet while riding without affecting the bike? Is the cellphone nessisary to charge the battery? Who other than the owner has access to the phone? It's just seems like a very unusual way to opporate a motorcycle. Will it hold up in a hard crash? What happens when the bike travels into an area where there is no cell service? There seem to still be so many unknowns. The phone is the most concerning, though.
Its a good yard bike because it cant compete yet in mx sx battery wont last. It can woods race but will need 2 to 4 batteries to finish 2 plus hr races which can cos to 30k plus. They are already at local races
After I heard 70hp, all I could think was DUNES!
Is the battery easily swapable? I didn’t think it was?
@@gpaull2 it is not made to be swapped out, and a new battery cost $7,000, that you can only buy from Stark Varg. I also read that they are only good for 500 hours, they once said they would last 1000 hours, then they changed it to 500 hours. So after 500 hours of riding time you have to buy a new $7,000 battery from Stark Varg, no thanks.
I heard the battery life is 500 hours, if you ride it a lot that is maybe 2 years of riding, then you have to pay $7,000 for a new battery, no thank you.
I also saw a range test where the bike went from 100% charge to 10% charge in an hour, then it took 2.5 hours to charge it back up to 100%, that is way too long to charge for an hour of riding time. Until they can charge it from 10% to 100% in 30 minutes, or less, I will never buy one.
And the real deal killer is buying a new $7,000 battery every 2 years, never.
450 needs an new piston every 50 hours so 500 bucks if you let a shop do it. full engine rebuild 100 hours. 500 hours : 10 new pistons 2500 dollar + 5x engine rebuild for 1000 a pop "7500 dollars total. plus al the air filters oil changes and fuel. most gas bikes are done after 500 hours of enduro/racing.
Agree with the charge time isseu . maybe if the battery's get cheaper you can swap them.
@@bertr286 Yeah but that money for stuff on a gas bike is spread out over a 2 year period, a little at a time, and you save a lot of money of you do it yourself, with the Stark Varg, when the battery dies out, you have to fork over $7,000 at one time. Then pay for the shipping too.
Expensive novelty
I’m sure they could easily put a Kill switch on it..
If the power within the computer ranges from about a 125 to a 450 factory setup, this could be extremely dangerous for newer/inexperienced riders who might think they need all the HP possible right off the bat… A clutch (or something similar) would definitely help, but I wonder what else could be implemented to help out the idiots of the world… 🤔
(& yeah I know, “natural selection”)… but still…
No clutch and no shifter is kinda weird. Would take awhile to adjust to this, I rely on those so much. 😮
Rode one this Weekend for first time. Everyone else loved it, I was not into it. Would take a lot of time to get the new feel.
I’d get one with the rear handbrake. I wonder if there’s an electric switch that deactivates the power while the brake is activated. Either way, a finger on the rear brake lever could be useful and also allow you to keep both feet planted. It’d take awhile to get used to it of course
I took me about 15min to adapt, some adapt fast some slower but everyone will I think.
Im a weekend warrior so i don’t have a really strong muscle memory. I think faster guys will take longer to adapt
Looking back now at these early reviews, some of the commentary is so stupid. “Essentially it felt completely different to my gasoline dirt bike and here’s all the ways it didn’t feel the same and instead of me taking time to get used to it I’m just going to portray all these things as a negative of the bike design versus me not being used to or comfortable on it yet”. Like, no way? Shocking.
Nick just push the red button and it will turn off or pull the phone off.
With no shifting and no clutching there nothing to do on the bike.
Its like going from being a factory worker to being an executive in a cushy office.
IROC on Vargs? Then we'll find out who the best riders really are. Once everybody gets used to them.
I think it's funny how everyone is talking shit on electric saying "get a real bike" now that the varg is here, it's too powerful 😂
The big question here is iPhone or Android 😆 🤣
E bikes have pedals. E moto?
Imagine no oil, air filter, fuel or engine rebuilds for YEARS of riding, makes this thing really cheap.
They could have come up with a better name than Stark Varg….pretty much the equivalent of Qweef Leaf if you ask me.
It is a really cool name if you understand Swedish.
Lmfao😂 that actually sounds better and lets you know its a electric bike.. stanky one though
I only speak Qweef ma~man 🤷🏻♂@@sendaaja8809
Means strong wolf in Swedish.
Bro, it’s a bad ass name
Damn. Most peolle riding a bike cant keep up with this. Even if they are pro. Very quick
Cute, but still rather have a new CR250R. Bring them back Honda.
No thanks. Already owned a modded SurRon and Nicot EBeast, think I’ll stick to gas!
Thanks to the lack of a clutch, if they come out with a training wheel option even snowmobilers and quadtards will be able to ride a bike now! 😂