UK Crypto Taxes - Be Careful If You're Leaving the UK
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ก.ค. 2024
- Book a call: calendly.com/worldtaxandy
New Course: International Tax - Fundamentals for Beginners: www.udemy.com/course/internat...
A common approach that UK crypto investors have used to avoid capital gains taxes on their crypto is to leave the UK and become a resident of country with no capital gains taxes such as UAE, Singapore, Hong Kong or Malaysia.
Unfortunately, the UK rules are nuanced and many advisors haven't given the full picture of the rules, leading some to be hit with pretty heavy tax charges when they return to the UK. In this video I explain why this is and what you can do to ensure you don't get caught in the same position.
0:00 Introduction
1:24 What's the problem?
1:44 Temporary non resident rules
2:42 Example: Leaving the UK & returning after 3 years
3:44 Exemptions
5:22 Key message
6:13 Summary
A BIT ABOUT ME
I've been advising on international tax since 2014, and qualified as a Chartered Accountant in 2018. I worked for consulting firms PricewaterhouseCoopers and BDO, before I started a remote international tax consultancy firm, Degen Tax Advisers, in 2020.
I work with online entrepreneurs to help them navigate the complex world of international tax. I work with e-commerce businesses, digital nomads, content creators, tech startups, crypto investors and many more in the digital space. Like my clients I'm pretty nomadic. I've lived in the UK, US, Japan, South Korea, China, Malaysia, Thailand, Vietnam and Singapore. Currently I'm spending most of my time around Southeast Asia.
DISCLAIMER
My videos are for general guidance, education and providing you an introduction to the concepts of international tax. They in no way constitute specific advice to your specific circumstances. I accept no liability for any reliance placed upon the content of these videos or references, therein.
![ลักพาตัว เอาลูกเอิร์นกลับมา...!! [เอิร์นไดเม่]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/f4NVKlZ5qkk/mqdefault.jpg)
The most common question I've had from this video is "How many days can I spend in the UK if I'm non resident?" Here is a follow up video which explains this
th-cam.com/video/ujPQafH6_TU/w-d-xo.html
Best option is to leave the Uk and not go back. That way, even if u pay tax, you dont have to live in the UK.
This was my plan anyway 😂
What? No more Boris, Liz, Keir or Rishi... whoa... where do I sign up?
Best thing i ever did 6 years ago
Exactly!! Get out and stay out!!
Open bank account abroad and cash in the cypto into local currency, buy 1oz gold britania coins then sell them to gold dealer in the UK where the money is depositied into UK bank account. Gold coins are CGT free in the UK as they are legal tender
Ever tried to take large amount of cash in or out of the UK? Gold is a no no. This is not good advice.
Better than ur none advice 😂@@MrRawUK
What if your crypto is on coinbase?
@@MrRawUK ur advice is worse
You still disposed of the crypto. Steps 2-5 don't mattter.
Buying local currency, gold coins, selling them and moving money back to UK all don't matter.
You realised the gains, so can't come back to the UK for 5 years.
The bigger picture that people need to address is the whole notion of tax altogether
The idea that you have to pay tax at all needs to be addressed, yet alone capital gains tax
Tax is another thing that was established for a certain purpose but has never been reviewed for its overall legitimacy, people are like zombies, just assume that is a right of government and that its status as a right of government can never be reviewed or challenged
I used to think those people that said tax was theft were madmen, but now having lived on this rock for a long time, I finally understand what they meant and I agree with them.
It's past time the legitimacy of tax is reviewed and a better system of contributing to a society developed, one that sees participation as a benefit and not as some taxation overlords being giving wealth extraction powers over individuals
The system is broken, people need to take a step back and revisit the whole notion of taxation and its legitimacy afresh.
Yeah I agree it needs more scrutinising by society. The more we slip towards higher taxes & socialism the more we'll stagnate or even regress as a society. At present taxes paid disappear into a black hole of the country's budget, with seemingly no accountability. The past few years (especially the covid scandals, dodgy contracts, cronyism etc) should have woken people up to that reality.
To truly progress we need free markets & freedom of speech, and the ability to hold leaders into account when they're not using our funds appropriately. This is part of my motivation for this channel actually - the ability to 'vote with your feet' , i.e leave a country when you disagree with its running, is a critical component of democracy. The more options people have the better, because stagnant authoritarian societies will be left behind and the good ideas will flow elsewhere.
How else are they going to house all these middle age male migrants??
I think the new paradigm will be fully decentralised immutable ledgers. I can imagine a future where nation states are on a Bitcoin standard and they disclose their public addresses so everyone can look up where money from the tax pot is going to. It's kind of like how shady crypto companies get quickly exposed because everyone can see where they send money on the blockchain. I can imagine a massive increase in accountability and all the best outcomes because of that.
@@WorldTaxAndy
the absurdity is with when residing overseas, you use none of the facilities and support systems of being a resident. So this whole 'If theres no taxes who will build/maintan the roads' narrative falls apart
someone said if the government can print as much money as they want ( hence the inflation) why they need tax on us at all !
I have only been having to consider this because of the extreme overeach of the UK in crypto. I have been looking for a video like this so thanks.
very glad i found your channel - i will be touch! great info, very helpful and happy new year
This is a very good informative channel especially about crypto taxes for non uk residents keep the good work up and thank you
Thank you very much indeed. I was unaware of this rule and this video was a gold mine for me.
Czech Republic does not have capital gains tax, 0 tax if you are a digital nomad.
Great informative video and great info in your responses to comments. Learned more here than scanning HMRC’s entire portal!Thanks much appreciated.
Thanks for the kind words and also love your channel, subscribed!
Very helpful, thank you Andy.
Awesome, exactly what I was looking for. Cheers
Subscribed bro! Keep up the good work!
This is a fantastic video. I’m planning to move to Slovenia. But I wasn’t sure how long I had to stay outside the uk. Now I know and that’s fine.
So just never come back. Got it 👌🏼
Declaring your crypto holdings to HMRC is like a bank declaring their vault holdings to bank robbers.
Amazing video people definitely need to educate themselves on Crypto taxes if your in the game
Great video great advice i will definitely look at contacting you when i need to cash out
This is a great vid thank you, please do more crypto related vids, one on the Philippines would be fantastic.
Thamk you for this video, i think a lot of people are unaware of this
Great advice thanks :)
Excellent video
Great advice. Just subscribed
Thanks for the clarification Andy. It is my understanding that if I'm tax resident in another country and spend less than 16 days per year in the UK, for the full 5 years then I'd be safe from any CGT liability then. Irrespective of any other tests or ties to the UK.
Yes exactly. The ties are irrelevant if you meet an automatic non residence test, of which less than 16 days is one of these.
So having left UK mkee than 10 years ago with annual holiday of 3-4 weeks back to UK is fine.
@@letssee5213 Yes, no worries there - you won't be a UK tax resident in that case.
Hi Andy, great video. I was wondering if you could clarify something for me please? I will have been non domiciled from the the uk for 5 years but won’t be cashing in until the 5th year due to crypto market cycles.
Am I still ok or do I have to incur the gains during the first year of the 5? Thanks in advance
@@georgekubu5094 Hi George, thanks for the kind words - if you've been non UK tax resident for 5 years already, then you're free to cash out when want to, you wouldn't have to worry about any UK tax in this case. So you are free to focus on the market cycle & optimal time to cash out, because UK tax won't come into it for you
Cheers for this video Andy even better when it's from a fellow Scotman!
Subscribed tae!
thanks for this video and explaining it in such a simple way..
Glad I found your channel! Your a good guy for the good people!! Subscribed !! I have a ton load of questions… how can I get in touch ?
Thanks Paul much appreciated, feel free to reach out via www.degenwealth.com
Never knew this but thanks
Awesome video , I thank you 🙏, it’s awful that people are so scared of the UK 🇬🇧 unpleasant system of tax Specially residence of many countries are in advantage.
Great vid! Can you use this strategy, leave the UK, set up a fresh crypto account abroad, trade there and make gains there, leave the gains there and don't cash out, come back to the UK and wait for the crypto cycle to go back abroad to cash out abroad?
Hi andy great infos.taxation is such complex subject. I m a but confused is it 16 or 90 days in the uk that trigger the tax residency. Thx again to help all of us with some clarify.
Hi Thanks for the kind words, so unfortunately the UK rules are quite complicated and there's no set number of days for everyone - you have to review your situation against the UK Statutory Residency Test (SRT) and see how many days you are allowed.
In general most people will be allowed 90 days. But it will depend on your ties to the UK - I've prepared a summary sheet explaining the SRT so feel free to check this out, hopefully this can clarify where you would stand
docs.google.com/document/d/1eqcDA62uGt0Nm99EaY2h-OsXeCj-DvZWVu6eaJNSQdw/edit
Hello Andy, if you leave the UK and become tax resident in Germany. You then cash out some crypto which you've held for over a year so, aren't charged any CGT under the German tax rules. Is there any risk under the double taxation agreement, that HMRC could tax your Capital Gains because Germany didn't? Assuming that you don't return to the UK for 5 full tax years.
What happens if you set up an investment or asset management company then sell your crypto to the company. Then put the companies in the name of a trust where your the beneficiary that pays yourself a wage. Is that a tax free way to stop the loss of the government stealing your gains?
Who irons your shirts andy 👀😃. Good video. Subscribed
🤣
That’s very helpful Andy.. but what if I’m cashing my crypto in Singapore for instance and use this money to buy a property in Spain or Malta.. would I still have to pay taxes in the UK?
Glad this helps - so yes this would generally be fine: tax free in Singapore which you're then free to spend on property elsewhere after. But the 5 year UK rule would still apply meaning they can still come after the crypto gain IF you do become UK tax resident before 5 years is up. So it would be good to spend most of your time in Malta/Spain in that case.
Unfortunately I've lost all my money in crypto and I have nothing to offer the tax people. I've also lost access to all my accounts owing to the UK regulator restricting access to the exchanges I was signed up to.
I've been scammed, police, gov couldn't help me regain this (scammers been arrested in US), but they still like me to pay taxes to them ... I guess I need to ask some expert lawyer, spend some money (probably if I ever get it back, maybe someone will ask me for a "little" tax). If there is any loss there is no help, if you succeed there is a tax. This is rip off
Why did they restricted access to the accounts?
@@riddim. I can no longer access the crypto exchanges I was signed up to from the UK.
@wickhunter7733 why??
@@riddim. Ask the UK regulator. Sorry I can't help you
Andy, great video. I have been out of the UK now for 16 years, my last return 2009, I have a military pension and my state pension next year paid into my UK bank account. I have crypto, not a lot and not above the threshold of 6000 now 3000 gbp, I have been advised to declare this on a self employed tax return for this year 23/24 as I earn money as a teacher, with what you mention on your video then this mean I could then not declare the crypto. I have no intention of returning to the UK. It leaves me very confused about the UK system??
Hi Andy, great video - thanks. It will be good to understand how long you have to leave the UK initially to be treated as a non-resident for tax purposes (appreciating it will require being that for at least 5 years)? Is it the 183 days? Thanks
Hi thanks for the kind words. So a bare minimum to be considered a UK non resident is 183 days, however it depends on the rest of your ties. In many case you'll need to be outside the UK for 275 days for the first year to ensure you're a non resident, but its highly case specific. I made a more detailed video on days spent in the UK here vs your ties.
th-cam.com/video/ujPQafH6_TU/w-d-xo.html
There are overseas ties which can help you too if the days in the UK might be a concern, for example, if you become a tax resident of another country, then you may be protected IF the UK has a double tax treaty with that country.
Hi Andy, Is 5 year also applicable for pensioners who went abroad to cash in pension (e.g. sipp flex drawdown) tax-free? There are dozens of countries that do not tax pension income at all.
Hi Lee, the rules typically don't apply to pension income or withdrawals - they would apply in a case where you realised capital gains, but this is quite rare. For example, SIPP investments are free from CGT, so the 5 year rule wouldn't impact you.
🎯 Key Takeaways for quick navigation:
00:00 *🌍 Mitigating UK Capital Gains Tax by Leaving the Country*
- The concept of moving abroad to avoid UK capital gains tax on unrealized crypto gains.
- Common destinations include Dubai, Singapore, Hong Kong, and Malaysia due to no capital gains taxes.
- Warning about the lack of awareness regarding the nuances and potential pitfalls of such advice.
01:12 *📚 Introduction to Temporary Non-Resident Rules*
- Overview of the temporary non-resident rules in UK tax legislation.
- These rules potentially apply to individuals who move abroad but return to the UK within 5 years, making them liable for capital gains tax on gains made while abroad.
02:19 *🏦 Impact of Returning to the UK Within 5 Years*
- Explanation of how gains made abroad can be taxed upon returning to the UK if considered a temporary non-resident.
- Emphasizes the risk of high tax charges if returning within 5 years, potentially leading to higher tax rates on repatriated gains.
03:53 *⚖️ Exceptions and Exemptions to the Rule*
- Assets acquired and disposed of while being a temporary non-resident might not be taxed.
- The focus is on preventing the avoidance of tax on unrealized gains made while in the UK and then exploiting tax residency benefits abroad.
05:30 *📅 Importance of Spending at Least 5 Years Abroad*
- To avoid the temporary non-resident rules, one must not be a UK tax resident for 5 consecutive years after leaving.
- Importance of understanding and complying with the UK statutory residency test to ensure non-residency status.
06:25 *🛑 Key Pitfalls to Avoid When Leaving the UK with Unrealized Gains*
- Highlighting the significance of being aware of the temporary non-resident rules and planning accordingly.
- Advises spending a minimum of 5 years outside the UK to fully benefit from the tax strategy without falling into the temporary non-residency trap.
Made with HARPA AI
Do you have to realise the gains after the 5 years out of the country , or can I move out sell and then stay out for another 5 years ?
Hi Andy, thanks for the information. Is there an optimal date to leave the UK to spend as short as time as possible away for the UK before returning without incurring tax? I would assume that it would be the last day of the tax year ie 5th of April. The reason I ask is I've heard other people say that to be 'safe' you need to be away 7 years. If I left the UK on the 5th of April 2024 would I have no UK tax liability for CGT realise while I was away, if I returned on the 6th April 2029?
Hi Ned, 7 years seems like overkill to me if you genuinely don't meet the tax residency rules for 5 consecutive years. Perhaps for some, if they're spending significant days in the UK during that period and have a lot of UK ties, it could be conservative to stay out for longer, but if you just ensure you definitely meet non residency under the statutory residency test (SRT) then I wouldn't worry about needing to do more than 5 years.
So yes if you left on the 5th of April 2024, the earliest you could return (as a tax resident) without triggering temporary non resident rules would be the 6th of April 2029. Note this still means you can return to the UK for holidays, visits etc but just need to keep aware of your limitations regarding days spent under the SRT (for most people this is 90 days max, but for some this can be less if they have a lot of ties).
Thanks Andy this was really helpful. It does annoy me that the Capital Gains allowance was set at 12.5K and hadn't changed since 1984 I believe. This allowance has been eroded by inflation anyway but to now have it slashed to just 3K next year show's how miss managed the country has been. Not to mention capping how much you can invest in Crypto. No wonder people are leaving.
Not true. The cgt exemption was 3000 in 1980, rising slowly to 12300 by 2021.
And in 1984 it was 5300.
But it is definitely annoying they are now cutting it down to 6k then 3k next tax year.
Great video. What is the current capital gains tax % in the UK for crypto? tks
Hi, thanks for the kind words - 10% if your overall annual income is below £50,270, and 20% if its above the £50,270 threshold
Great info. So if you sell Assets with a CGT gain (UK) say in year 4 of a 5 year overseas trip, is CGT applicable on return to the UK in year 6? ie is it 5 years after you sell the assets? thanks
Hi, thanks for the comment and great question. No CGT would be due in this scenario. the Temp non resident rules apply only to those who return to the year in year 5 or earlier. If you come back in year 6, then you don't fall under the scope of the rules meaning all of your activity during those years is not subject to UK tax
Is it possible to hire you as an accountant for dealing with crypto tax? I'm a US citizen living in the UK, and have no intent of ever going back to the US, but I completely have no idea what to do the moment I sell my crypto. I was even dabbling in crypto a few years ago (before I knew anything about the tax situation) but never really made anything, and don't know if I can even access most of the trade information from that time period. I've kept everything down to one exchange this time around, so I can easily get the info from this cycle.
The answer to this tax problem is DON'T COME BACK within 7 years
Not even for a weekend?
Hi thank you for this great video. I was wondering if it matters when I leave the uk? I mean if I am a resident for most of the tax year and leave the country than for example to Switzerland in March and sell all my assets as soon as I am registered there? Or can there still cgt apply for me?
Hi, thanks for the kind words. The date you leave can be important. Lets say you leave in March, meaning you spent 11 months of the year in the UK thus are a UK tax resident. You can still qualify for split year treatment, which is a tax relief for people who have left/arrived in the UK partway during a tax year. Basically this means any income you had after you left the UK gets treated as non UK income and not subject to UK tax. So for example income generated post-March would be eligible in this case.
Would be good to hear a breakdown of how the double tax treaties with other countries work.
Thanks for the suggestion - I'll definitely be covering this soon as its extremely important but frequently misunderstood.
What does it mean exactly when you say 'coming back within 5 years'? Would a 3-day visit be deemed as a comeback to the country, and would that trigger the tax event? Thank you
UPDATE: Just checked some comments below and got an answer to my question, thank you Andy.
No problem, and I'll actually be making a video shortly about this to give more detail about how you can work out exactly how many days you can spend in the UK as a visitor. So whilst in 99% of cases I see, people can stay up to 90 days with no problems, there's some nuance in there that's important to confirm.
What if I cashed out some crypto and paid the UK tax on it. Enough to last 5 tax years amd move abroad to a more tax friendly country before cashing in the rest after them 5 tax years?
Who, in there right mind would want to go back to the uk to live.
Does selling crypto into stablecoins still count as crystallising gains or would it be just fiat?
Do you have to officially declare somehow/somewhere the date that you leave the UK and provide evidence for this? Great info by the way.
Hi, thanks for the kind words - it depends on your current situation. If you currently file self assessment tax returns, then the easiest way is to phone up HMRC and advise them that you're a non resident for X tax year in question - they will typically remove you from their self assessment records. If you still have UK sourced income (e.g a uk rental property) then you'd continue to file tax returns but you'd specify your dates in the UK in the non residency section of the return. You don't need to formally declare your dates exited the UK - being a non resident under the UK law is sufficient - however it's wise to keep records (e.g flight tickets, hotel/accomodation receipts etc) which can help you if you are ever questioned by HMRC
If a fully Non UK resident since 2021 , but you cash out via a Exchange that was previously set up on a UK address, does this have any implication on CGT? The address was not changed because had no permanent address abroad just temporary ABBs etc?
No thankfully the address of an exchange or bank account has nothing to do with the UK residency rules. The UK Statutory Residency Test is the only thing that matters, which thankfully does not have exchange/account address as criteria. You can still use UK accounts whilst abroad without tax consequences.
Merci Andy
If you bought your crypto whilst you were living abroad and cash them in now in the UK, are you liable to pay CGT on them?
In which countries is off ramping your crypto into fiat easy??
Would like to ask, can I cash out 2 months for example after I left the UK and NEVER come back into the country. Will they want me to pay capital gain taxes still, even that I will never be living in the UK.
So, what if come back to UK after 5 years and 1 month or 6 years?
Hi, but if send my crypto to my father account (he live in Moldova) withdraw money and come here, don't need to pay any taxes
03:00 what about just visiting back into the UK for a week or so? Are you liable for tax even then?
Thankfully no, you can visit the UK as long as you don't meet the criteria for UK tax resident. For most people this usually means they can spend up to 90 days in the UK without worrying about tax.
You can use a tax residency assessment calculator to work out how many days you can get based on your situation www.taxd.co.uk/uk-tax-residence-calculator
what if you leave a business behind in the UK, but you leave for 5 plus years if not ever... do you still pay the CGT in the UK?
Hi Andy, just stumbled on your channel as I'm working on working out how much taxes i owe. I recently moved out of uk and hopefully, if my PR works out, dont intend to return back to uk for a ehile (holidays, yes. Live and work, no).
My question is, if I've just moved out of UK, am I i liable to pay taxes on past gains that I've realised ehile living in UK?
And
What is the best way to complile trading history across multiple platforms (some of which have gone under(can i write the failed exchange *cough cough ftx* as a tax loss)) and convert it into GBP as some trades are on BTC pairs and USD/T.
Appreciate your response!
Hi thanks for the questions - past gains would generally be taxable if you were a uk tax resident in the year you made the gain. But you can also deduct costs/losses so it would first off be important to work that out. There's a few good crypto calculator softwares out there e.g Koinly. In the cases where you don't have the date e.g FTX, HMRC usually accepts a reasonable estimation of your position. Also a failed exchange would mean you've lost possession of assets, which is a disposal from yourself, a taxable event - meaning the losses could be tax deductible
Andy you didn't mention how many DAYS back in the UK triggers Capital Gains Tax for crypto ? Surely 1 x day back in the UK is not a problem ?
No, one day will not be a problem. For most people, even 89 days won’t be a problem. Its all about ensuring you don’t become a UK resident. But its not quite as simple as prescribing a set number of days because the Uk residency rules are complex and not just days dependent. You can look up HMRC’s statutory residency test to understand exactly how many days you’d be allowed based on your UK ties. But a good rule of thumb for most is less than 90 days.
How could it be deemed to have taken money out of the Uk system if you made it on crypto which is global and for the main part not recognised as money?
It's hypocritical on the part of the UK in my view especially when they don't consider it money, but the way tax law is set up, the UK has the right to tax its residents on worldwide income and assets regardless of where they're located.
There are some exceptions (if you are non-domiciled which broadly means your permanent home is outside the UK & you intend to return/settle there in future). But for everyone else they will try to tax you on worldwide activity unless you become a non-resident.
What about the spread betting accounts? They used to be free of tax. I am sure you can trade crypto CFD's on there. Problem solved right..
Spread betting is indeed tax free for UK residents, but CFDs can still be hit by capital gains tax. So its just important to understand whether your trading is classed as spread betting or CFDs - usually the platform you use should disclose this clearly. Spread betting is usually only open to UK residents.
When it says if you hold crypto more than a year its considered capital gains. What happens if I buy say Bitcoin, but within that year I buy more Bitcoin. Does it count from the date of initial investment or do you count from each buy
In general it can be considered capital gains if you're not actively trading (which often requires you to be a full time trader which most do not meet) even if you don't hold the crypto more than one year.
The date of the initial investment is crucial for determining whether you're a long term investor or not. But if you sell the BTC, the price paid is typically averaged out between both purchases.
Hi Andy, I guess there will be no tax if I win crypto (any value in £ in UK or abroad) i.e airdrop as a lottery win or gambling. What you think? Btw, thx for great strait to the point video
Hi, thanks for the kind words. As a UK resident, indeed lottery or gambling winnings are non-taxable. That said it would be important to distinguish between lottery wins vs other airdrops e.g for participating in a community, using a platform etc. Because the latter can be taxable.
Note, if you're not a UK tax resident, you won't have to worry about UK tax on any airdrops.
At what point do they know you have sold and should pay tax?
The tax reporting from exchanges isn’t accurate as you may transfer from one exchange to another
They won't know from exchange. Like I made comment earlier . They r up to their neck. If they do, it will only be if that money hits ur UK bank account
No capital gains tax in New Zealand
Thinking of establishing a Labuan entity as lived outside UK more than 10 yrs. I have bought crypto using an Australian based broker and presume that any sales of it by them would not lead to Australian CGT as I am not resident there. Potentially I could withdraw funds from any sales via the Australian broker directly to Labuan?
Yes so long as you're not Aus resident then no Aus CGT applies. Funds can be withdrawn direct to Labuan tax free taking advantage of the current tax free status of capital gains
If i move its for good. Am looking at options
Im a Brit living in Thailand but have been told I am better off opening a company in Singapore and drawing down my cry pto from there due to new tax rules in Thailand. Do you have any advice on this?
Thanks for the kind words - yes so the Thai rules have created a lot of uncertainty. Bringing cash into Thailand looks like it will become more difficult from a tax planning perspective, so as a rule of thumb, having a structure outside Thailand (be it a Singapore or other entity) can ensure you don't remit funds into the country, keeping you relatively tax efficient. That said, spending cash in Thailand can still be seen as a remittance, so you'd still have to be careful on this side of things, but generally yes a SG entity can work well here.
What if you moved to Singapore and sold your crypto for a gain at an exchange which you are verified at with UK KYC (UK ID + UK proof of address) and then sent the cash to a UK bank account to spend but remained abroad and never came back to the UK. Thanks!
Hi - this would still be fine. Having a UK account or bank account does not make you a UK tax resident. Therefore, so long as you meet the non residency requirements (meaning you dont meet the UK statutory residency test which for most people means spending less than 90 days per year in the UK after leaving) then you can cash out without any UK capital gains concerns.
Would you have to be in Singapore for a certain time period ?@@WorldTaxAndy
A video explaining how much time you can spend in the UK each year after leaving would be great theres nit much content about this
Thanks for the kind words, much appreciated, and yes there’s been some questions on this so will definitely make a video soon
Quick question,how many politicians or rich people (etc David cameron)who has off-shore bank accounts in those tax heaven countries facing same problem Im having with my 60k crypto holdings? Uk is running completely corrupt law makers and politicians. They not having it if you jump one class up.
Yep there was so much blatant tax evasion uncovered by the Paradise Papers / Panama Papers that the average man would have been heavily fined/imprisoned for but the masses of CEOs, politicians and business leaders managed to somehow get away with nothing more than media scrutiny but no criminal prosecutions. Likewise Bernie Ecclestone was recently found guilty of tax fraud worth over half a billion pounds but only got a suspended sentence meanwhile there's hundreds of small business owners, contractors & tradesman in the UK who have been jailed for unreported tax of a few thousand - different rules for the elites vs the working class.
What about losses can they be used to claim against tax. ie if you have been trading Forex ( whether it be crypto, or fiat )
of course it can, you can claim losses up to 5 years after, many people do this to avoid high tax, make 100k in year 2, 3 years later, claim a loss that is substantial . and you'll get most if not all the tax back from the year two 100k income
I’ve been a tax resident of a crypto haven for 5 years but all the crypto I bought is through a UK exchange and from a UK bank account; my plan and how I’ve secured profits before is to transfer it to another cryptocurrency, and then offload that crypto to a private wallet and then convert that to stable coins and take it out in the country I live in. Will I be liable for uk CGT?
Hi, you won't have to worry about UK taxes or any taxes on your crypto if you're in a crypto tax haven. Having a UK bank account does not count towards the UK residency test thankfully, so you are still free to use this and eventually withdraw into crypto where you live.
Hi Andy, my account on crypto exchange is set as Polish citizen & address. I'm an UK resident. Is HMRC able to check if I owe something ? I'm not Polish tax resident since 2010.
They can't check sh1t. People don't realise that hmrc can't even handle calls let alone handle access to people's crypto exchanges.
Hi, at the moment it's doubtful and HMRC would still rely on self reporting. There are international moves to share information on crypto between governments but that's at an early stage. There are sharing agreements in place such as the Common Reporting Standard (CRS) regarding bank accounts and financial accounts, to which over 100 countries have signed, including both the UK and Poland. But for now this tends to be isolated to banks/financial accounts.
Hello Andy, say I have 150k in crypto and wanted to cash it what tax % would I pay on this in the uk can you explain please
Hi Charlie, generally you will pay 10% or 20% depending on your income tax bracket. This % is on the gains, not the total proceeds. 10% applies if your overall annual income is below £50,270. 20% applies if your income above the £50,270 threshold
I hate how they make tax seem like it's a "debt" like we've borrowed money and we owe it.
we've never been free
If you use a brokerage platform and sell your crypto through that, would you be liable to pay tax at the point of sale or withdrawal from the brokerage to your bank account?
I'd like to reinvest my gains into stocks when I sell and was hoping i'd only need to sort tax when I withdraw the money
Hi, technically HMRC views any trades (crypto to crypto or to fiat) as taxable events rather than when the cash hits the bank account. That said, this is extremely difficult to track when there's a lot of trades, and even crypto tax software isn't always accurate. So in HMRC investigations they have often accepted a best attempt effort at calculating tax based on fiat out less fiat in - to get a rough approximation of gains - note this doesn't guarantee they'll accept this in every case.
Is there not a period of time that you have to wait until you can cash out for instance you left UK in lets say June are you not liable for tax in UK until the next financial tax year the following April and dont you need to let HMRC know you are now living overseas and want to remove your UK tax residency before you can actually cash anything out
You are able to cash out as soon as you're a non UK resident. In theory, this could be immediately after leaving, but it highly depends on your leaving date.
The next UK tax year starts on 6 April 2024. So lets say you leave on the 6th of April and will be a non-resident for that tax year (24/25) - in this case you can cash out from 6 April with no problems.
However, lets say you left on 6th of March, having been a UK resident for the year. You generally have to wait until at least 6 April until cashing out. If you cash out on 10th of March, then that is considered UK income since you're considered to be a UK tax resident for the whole year.
If you left in June, it's early enough that you will likely be a UK non-resident for the entire tax year. But its important to check your situation against the Statutory Residency Test.
You can phone HMRC and advise them that you're non resident (if you currently file self assessment tax returns as self employed). Or if you're in a salaried job, you can tell them via an SA109 form.
What if a UK tax resident holding crypto moves to Hong Kong on 6th April, 2024, realises a 100,000 pound gain on 7th April, 2024 then visits the UK on 8th April but spends a maximum of fifteen days in the UK in the 2024-25 tax year? There would be no capital gains tax payable in this case, correct?
Yes, correct, they'd be considered non-UK tax resident for the entire tax year, thus any gains triggered during a UK visit wouldn't count as UK taxable income so long as they didn't trigger tax residency.
I assume you would need to give up any director roles you have even if it dormant??.. also, what if someone dies and leaves you money...doea that make you a tax resident again?
Hi, it all comes down to the UK Statutory Residency Test - if you don't meet residency under this test, then you don't have to worry. You can be a non-resident director which is very common these days, so you don't have to give that up. You can also receive inheritance without triggering any tax residency issues.
Guys does malaysia still have no capital gains tax? I think they officially introduced it this month. Do correct me if I'm wrong
Hi, Malaysia has indeed introduced capital gains as of 2024 so you have to be more careful if you're there. Specifically it applies when the proceeds of disposal are received in Malaysia - meaning you could still avoid it by keeping the proceeds outside of Malaysia. But this requires some extra planning.
Great video thanks for the advice - I have lived and worked out of the UK now for over 10 years (in a tax free country). Could you advise me if I am potentially liable to pay UK tax because my crypto exchange (coinbase) is set up through the UK system?
you didn't listen or watch did you
@@KILL3RAKH4NI did watch the video. I guess your saying that tax is only based on the domicile of the person and not the location of where crypto is stored?
Hi, so as long as you're living in a tax free country then you won't have to worry about UK taxes or any taxes on your crypto. Having a UK exchange does not count towards the UK residency test thankfully, so you are still free to trade through this as you also are through UK brokerages, UK banks etc - so long as you're not UK tax resident they cannot charge capital gains tax on these.
@@WorldTaxAndy Thank you, much appreciated
Until there is regulation and transparency, how realistically will the UK Gov find out if you had crypto and sold it unless they question any returning funds. Really helpful information, thanks for this.
Yes at the moment there is still that practical point about traceability - currently HMRC has agreements with some of the larger exchanges (Coinbase, Binance, Kraken) to send them basic information of UK customers (name, address etc), so the more trading you do on a centralised exchange the higher the probability of them knowing. That said, it doesn't mean they know anything about the value of your holdings or your trades; but it increases the risk that they may have you on record as someone they could possibly investigate and target.
it seems so complex that it might be a case when HRMC have got to grips with everything and your trading history, they might come looking for you will a demand down the line? i dont think i have any uk tax liability as out of the uk living in asia for years, but if i did, i think id pay something vs nothing on the hope theyd go after the nonpayers..??@@WorldTaxAndy
My mate made a profit with bitcoin. He lives in London and failed to declare to HMRC.
@@carlyndolphingood on him people r stup1d if they r filling out tax forms
If someone decides to move to Dubai to save CG, Are we allowed to enter UK as non tax resident ( leisure purpose) after leaving UK?, can we continue to stay in UK without working? On this case do we still face CG tax in UK if we return?
If I'm working in UAE, And come to UK just once in a year, And have stayed in UK just for 30 days, Do I still get text on my income by the UK government question mark
I.e. When transferring my whole salary into my UK bank account full stop
Hi, you shouldn't have any problems - transferring salary into the UK does not make you a UK tax resident or taxable in the UK. It's all about whether you meet the UK statutory residency test.
Most people can spend up to 90 days in the UK under these, although I explain in more depth in this video.
th-cam.com/video/ujPQafH6_TU/w-d-xo.html
But to summarise, with only 30 days in the UK, its extremely unlikely you'd be taxable in the UK.
how would they know you've cashed out in a different country?
Crypto exchange platforms report to your tax governing body when you do make a withdrawal on an asset in which you made a profit on ..
bro, the chartered accountant,
Jersey in channel islands have no capital gains tax too, no need to fly far away
Indeed, Jersey is a good option for capital gains purposes.
I find it difficult to understand Uk banking and government rules .
I have been banking my crypto profits with TSB for 7 years . Now im told its to risky for me to be trading crypto (£78k) profit in 2023 .
So i loose out , the bank loose's out , and worst of all, the goverment loose's all the tax i would pay on these profits in future !
Yeah its ridiculous. The banks have no problem if I want to deposit thousands into William Hill or Betfair but the minute I throw a few quid onto Binance or Coinbase they'll block it and tell me it's because they're "protecting" me.
It makes no sense like many things in Britain today.
@@WorldTaxAndy What they are actually protecting is themselves, from deposit capital flight.
They are worried about their customers getting the banking is a scam lightbulb moment & transfering their money into deflationary crypto & other assets in order to protect against the constant debasement of currency. This would put banks in breach of the regulatory requirement to have a mandatory percentage of assets backed by liquid deposit capital.
They are crapping themselves that people might, en masse, do as i did; completely drain their bank account.
How dare WE make money on OUR money.
Don't need a bank. I have been using XRP for all my payments everywhere in the world. No more stupid 10% remittance fees for the privilege of my bank hitting the button marked 'Send money'. Used to cost me a fortune in ✌️ fees✌️ now I have total control with zero limits.
Our protection? Utter garbage.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I haven't cashed out above the UK capital gains tax threshold since I've held crypto from 2019. I've purchased all my crypto whilst living in the UK. I'm planning on selling in 2024 / 25 could I avoid UK capital gains if I moved to Dubai and lived there for 5 years? If I sold whilst living in the UK but then moved to Dubai would I be penalised?
Hi, if you're non-UK resident for 24/25 then yes you could avoid uk capital gains tax if you're in Dubai. You also wouldn't be taxed in Dubai which has no capital gains taxes. Remaining non UK tax resident for 5 years ensures you won't have any issues on your return. There's no issues with selling whilst in the UK IF you are a non-UK tax resident. So really you just have to ensure you don't spend too many days in the UK whilst you're a non tax resident.
Does this only matter if you want to move back to the UK? If you just want to visit a few times a year, does it matter? Also can you still draw your state pension?
No worries if you don't want to come back to the UK. This only concerns you if you do intend to move back full time within 5 years. On state pension yes you can still draw this if you're abroad - but note that in some countries your state pension won't increase in line with UK state pensions - so if you want to keep getting the increases in pension then you would have to move to one of the following countries: www.gov.uk/state-pension-if-you-retire-abroad/rates-of-state-pension
isle of man is a good location for UK people that don't want to be too far from home. No visa requirements for anyone with a uk/Irish passport but you do need a work permit to work (not that difficult to get around)
Edit: No capital gains taxes. No inheritance tax.
only issue is this ruling about having to be away for 5 years and not being able to spend, I think it's 15 nights on mainland UK turf in any year during that time. Fuckers! Be as well somewhere sunny!
@@RomantiqueVoyage you need to do more research on this. If you spend 15 or less mainland UK then you DEFINITELY are not UK resident, however it is perfectly possible to spend more nights than this, but it does depend on a multitude of other factors. Andy has a different video going into many of the nuances if you look - its called "Non-UK Tax Residents - How Many Days Can You Spend in the UK?" Can't post a direct link as it will get blocked...
@@ellisromeroright @@ellisromero, 15 days. So there’s a “multitude of other factors” ? There’s a surprise!
@@RomantiqueVoyage watch the video - it makes a lot of sense. 15 days is one of the automatic non-resident tests, but for example if you work abroad full time you can spend up to 90 days in the UK... but in extreme cases it can be as many as 182 days but that depends on not having "ties to the UK" such as having a home, having close family etc...
@@ellisromeroThank you. Got it now! 👍🏼
Great video Andy, very glad i've found your channel today.
I quit my job in March 2023, spent May-July in Thailand, August-October in UK (living with family), November 23 - March 24 in Thailand & plan to relocated to south east asia in JUne this year!
I've never cashed any crypto to a bank account in the UK
Will the HMRC have access to my trading activity on foregin trading exchanges like MEXC & on chain (dencenralised exchange trading)?
I dont plan to cash out for a good 12-18months
I have no job here after quitting my job and selling my house
What means do HMRC have to checking trading history?
At what point does someone in my position (spending max 90 days in UK moving forward & no job/house) stop being liable to pay tax?
Hi thanks for the kind words and congrats on the relocation. In theory, no, MEXC does not currently have a sharing agreement like Binance or Coinbase do with HMRC. On chain stuff is generally not traceable until it hits an exchange which is reporting info on account holders i.e Coinbase, Binance. However, nothing to worry about anyway even if they could access your info, so long as you're non UK tax resident once you sell/realise the gains, and ensure you don't become a UK resident within 5 tax years.
If you're a non-UK tax resident (which generally applies to most people in the situation with no job/work/house in the UK and less than 90 days) then you stop becoming liable to UK tax on the first day of the tax year in which this is the case - i.e 6 April of the taxyear. So for example if you left in June 2023, but you meet the qualification for non residency for the tax year 23/24, then technically you're non resident from the 6 April 2023. This can be nuanced and case dependent though so its just important you know the specific UK laws and how your situation relates to them
@WorldTaxAndy thanks so much for the detailed response Andy. I struggle to get clear advice like this from anyone so I really do appreciate you coming back to me.
I'm so glad I stuck to my thesis around crypto and got out the rat race, and deep into blockchain when everyone was calling me crazy.
Do you offer consultancy services by the way?
@@ThatsnotwhereIparkedmycar No problem always enjoy helping people get some clarity, having escaped myself a few years ago its only right I can do my bit to help others do the same. And yes I do provide consulting, feel free to reach out via www.degenwealth.com
Best way is sell everything here all the crypto you have and move in before the new tax years (4 April) to whatever you want to go. And then buy all the crypto back when you arrive in the new country you moving too
Does the capital gains tax allowance of 6k count on top of salary? I make around 50k can I take out 6k tax free per financial year? If made no other gains elsewhere.
Yes it is on the top of your salary, allowance for 2023/24 is £6000, next financial year is only £3000 and will be dropping
@@Marlenabena perfect thanks for you help 🙏
@@jfraser1903 Happy to help!