The wingtips of the propellors are a leaky airflow, wasting energy and fuel. The dual counter-rotating propellor-pairs are noisy because air is compressed and released. It's as if the engine is "clapping it hands" as propellor tips converge with each other. Ice buildup on the Props was also an issue!
Those of us who seriously practice Risk Management spot the issues I listed immediately. RISK is not painful until it morphs into an ISSUE, so new technical ideas have to pass a rigerous scrutiniy to identify how known Risks can be shielded from the circumstances the will create the ISSUE. In this case, I believe that no such serious discussion has been presented.
In Europe we introduced the A400M. At altitude of FL 300 this plane is very clearly to hear and much louder than regular airliners. I guess with that fans it will be the same.
This has been around for 40 years. It pops up every 10 years or so. 0:03 They haven’t been put on planes yet. And they won’t be. They make far too much noise, they are slow, and the efficiency gains aren’t as good when you are running your engine longer because it takes more time to get there.
Back through the decades Popular Mechanics magazine kept predicting the return of the turbo prop. And jet engine companies kept making the front fan bigger and said "good enough"
I've been with Boeing for 20 years now and I could tell you it's safe to say after we outsource cut some costs and use some super glue. These things won't work like they're intended to.
There’s a reason these jets were never used…noise. In the 80s theses engines tested on the outer limits of stage 3 noise levels and today we are at stage 5 which is something like nearly 20 dB lower. Also, counter rotating props are a horrible idea for maintenance and longevity-too many moving parts in opposite directions and hence only the Russians employ that technique today. Plus, moving your blade to the outside on the endings where you cannot contain them in the advent of a failure or FOD hit, goes in counter to the last 30 years of standards and policy making for “contained blade separation”. Just ain’t gonna happen.
Those protruding parts don't look right. It's an ugly engine that i think might end causing more problems than it solves. Efficiency is one thing but there's other factors too. I think these engine manufacturers are simply under alot of pressure to produce these efficient engines and going with cheap options.
Good point about the uncontained blade liberation dangers. I suspect they will reinforce the concerned fuselage areas for less weight gain compared to a shroud. Noise reduction on submarines has come a long way and they are probably applying the similar tech here. It looks like this may go into production on low cost focused airlines if funding permits development
Not so sure about the blade containment. The turboprops have the same concern. This is a key issue being discussed with the authorities. This is not a Turboprop, not a Turbofan, it’s a new kind of engine. They have to create new rules to control it. By the way, every turbofan engine has to contain all parts in case of a fan blade failure, but none of them can contain an HPT Disc rupture. The real danger is here whatever the engine type.
It is of the most importance the PR people think of a fancy name for the new engines. This new duct fan or high by pass turbo fan is just a glorified turbo prop , and the industry spent lots of time and money telling the public the jets are superior to props and props are a step backwards. They managed to hide the fact from the ignorant public the jets are still struggling with the "sound barrier" for 3/4 century. Jets nowadays are no faster than those in the 1960s. The avionics and manors at the coffin's corner improved a lot.
Vortexes peeling off the rotating blades make a noise, a lot of noise. I won’t hold my breath on this one. The open blades will be hard on tall baggage handlers.
Wait till the first one throws a blade without a containment ring. Remember that C-130 that lost a prop blade a few years ago which effectively removed the cockpit from the rest of the fuselage? Or at the very least, it goes through the fuselage like the largest and fastest samurai sword you ever saw. No thanks.
I like all the aviation experts here commenting on how it wouldn't work. You would think the people who would know what could work and what would not are the ones with billions to invest and thousands of aviation engineers, but no, I guess some dude on youtube comments knows better
So why not build a large turbine contra rotating turboprop for the A320 / 737 sized aircraft? Possibly with an over fuselage wing. Go on Rolls Royce Allison you can do this
Right ... Some kind of housing or nacelle for the front to better channel relative wind? Kinda curious also about this? Plus, I think it would 'look' better to the flying public.
By installing more fan blades there's no need to increase fan diameter if getting more thrust.You can increase rpm also but not so much because of vibration.
This video has so many aircraft identification errors it’s almost comical. Apparently the creator doesn’t have a firm grasp on the differences between the 727 and 737. Clearly the script is being generated by a computer voice but for crying out loud, double check your information for accuracy before you upload it to TH-cam
Jet engines have to pass a contained failure of the turbine blade test. How will they treat this type of engine? Will the consider these blades propellers or turbines?
Looks like a lot of trouble for nothing. They say the noise level was cut down, I don't believe it. We will not fly in a aircraft equipped with this engine. I think what we have now is the best for passenger aircraft.
Every few years they pull this one out again and proclaim it the hot new thing. Until the public or executives find out just how much noise it makes. Look up the XF-84 “Thunderscreech” for an example of how far back this goes. And just how bad it can be. That one physically disabled the ground crew out to 100 yards.
If the price of oil keeps rising and stays high there will be a lot of money dumped into fuel efficiency research. Maybe will see some new break through a sooner.
Airbus ended production of the 380 in 2021 - how old is this video? Looks more like a turboprop at this point and probably has significant speed issues, just like all turboprops do.
The "Entire aircraft industry" that'll be destroyed includes potential purchasers of this GE engine, GE itself, aircraft tyre manufacturers and many others, so the claim it total nonsense. What he actually said was that it'll IMPACT the industry.,which I very much doubt.
I don't think i would want an unducted fan under the wing. What happens if a blade dislodges. There is nothing stopping that blade from entering the fuselage. no thanks.
So ... Boeing will not develop a new model for now because they wait for this exact technological breakthrough to incorporate it on their next model. Meanwhile, this engine is planned to be tested on an Airbus 380 ... it's a bit hard to imagine how this engine will destroy the entire aviation industry by catching the two market leaders by surprise ;-)
So, It seems, that aircraft industry will just lobby more loose regulation for engine noise and we'll go back to open fan engines. And it will be sold to the public as great innovation. Welcome back to the 50''s of XX century 🤣
This only makes sense on airfreighters.. These engines are only more efficient at slower speeds, lower altitudes and people don't want to see those blades, as they represent a real visual threat (real or not), so they need to target the retrofit market. Airfreight also is not as severely constrained by time slot performance (thus can avoid weather conditions that may be a constraint) or have the huger passenger liabilities. Passenger traffic is very fickle to economic conditions and there is a great concern of this turning negative in the near future, while airfreight is less elastic. I'm laughing at the hydrogen 'wokeness'.. it will never happen in large aircraft, perhaps a few 'woke' propeller small trainers (that only have to be able to fly for two hours at the most) due to cost, ground facilities and weight.
The wingtips of the propellors are a leaky airflow, wasting energy and fuel. The dual counter-rotating propellor-pairs are noisy because air is compressed and released. It's as if the engine is "clapping it hands" as propellor tips converge with each other. Ice buildup on the Props was also an issue!
I wonder why they didn’t hire you😂
@@martinandersson5278 Boeing wouldn't allow it.
@@generaclesdey4622That's sounds about right. You seem to know what you're talking about. Why would Boeing need someone like that?! 😂
Those of us who seriously practice Risk Management spot the issues I listed immediately. RISK is not painful until it morphs into an ISSUE, so new technical ideas have to pass a rigerous scrutiniy to identify how known Risks can be shielded from the circumstances the will create the ISSUE. In this case, I believe that no such serious discussion has been presented.
In Europe we introduced the A400M. At altitude of FL 300 this plane is very clearly to hear and much louder than regular airliners. I guess with that fans it will be the same.
Been hearing this for four decades...
This has been around for 40 years. It pops up every 10 years or so. 0:03 They haven’t been put on planes yet. And they won’t be. They make far too much noise, they are slow, and the efficiency gains aren’t as good when you are running your engine longer because it takes more time to get there.
Because this video is clickbait.
Back through the decades Popular Mechanics magazine kept predicting the return of the turbo prop. And jet engine companies kept making the front fan bigger and said "good enough"
This isn't even a turbo prop, this is a turbo fan without a shroud
@@btoiscool . In an emergency these engines are slow to increase power.
Much like a race car with a heavy flywheel.
So basically they are inventing turboprop again.
yeah its turbo prop all right. just to rename it to sound more fancy
This ain't happening, this video is clickbait.
Great video 👏👏👏
This channel deserves more subscribers!
I've been with Boeing for 20 years now and I could tell you it's safe to say after we outsource cut some costs and use some super glue. These things won't work like they're intended to.
If GE CEO really said "This NEW engine will destroy the entire aviation industry" then who does he think GE is going to sell this engine to?
This video is clickbait.
Boeing 😂 currently in a mess with quality control issue and 737 incident.
The engine looks like a flower 🌸 7:41
As an aerospace contractor, for over 10 years, I'll believe it when I see it flying!
There’s a reason these jets were never used…noise. In the 80s theses engines tested on the outer limits of stage 3 noise levels and today we are at stage 5 which is something like nearly 20 dB lower. Also, counter rotating props are a horrible idea for maintenance and longevity-too many moving parts in opposite directions and hence only the Russians employ that technique today. Plus, moving your blade to the outside on the endings where you cannot contain them in the advent of a failure or FOD hit, goes in counter to the last 30 years of standards and policy making for “contained blade separation”. Just ain’t gonna happen.
Those protruding parts don't look right. It's an ugly engine that i think might end causing more problems than it solves. Efficiency is one thing but there's other factors too. I think these engine manufacturers are simply under alot of pressure to produce these efficient engines and going with cheap options.
Good point about the uncontained blade liberation dangers.
I suspect they will reinforce the concerned fuselage areas for less weight gain compared to a shroud.
Noise reduction on submarines has come a long way and they are probably applying the similar tech here.
It looks like this may go into production on low cost focused airlines if funding permits development
Nightmare fuel.
Not so sure about the blade containment. The turboprops have the same concern.
This is a key issue being discussed with the authorities. This is not a Turboprop, not a Turbofan, it’s a new kind of engine. They have to create new rules to control it.
By the way, every turbofan engine has to contain all parts in case of a fan blade failure, but none of them can contain an HPT Disc rupture. The real danger is here whatever the engine type.
Turboprops' rules !!
It is of the most importance the PR people think of a fancy name for the new engines. This new duct fan or high by pass turbo fan is just a glorified turbo prop , and the industry spent lots of time and money telling the public the jets are superior to props and props are a step backwards. They managed to hide the fact from the ignorant public the jets are still struggling with the "sound barrier" for 3/4 century. Jets nowadays are no faster than those in the 1960s. The avionics and manors at the coffin's corner improved a lot.
Vortexes peeling off the rotating blades make a noise, a lot of noise. I won’t hold my breath on this one. The open blades will be hard on tall baggage handlers.
Vortices not “vortexes”.
I wonder how many planes with these types of engines with crash due to bad weather and maintenance and bird strikes😂👀👀
I was in a P- 3 squadron in the Navy and the props were one of the biggest maintenance items for the mechanics.
If they equip the 737 I am sure many will fall
Wait till the first one throws a blade without a containment ring. Remember that C-130 that lost a prop blade a few years ago which effectively removed the cockpit from the rest of the fuselage? Or at the very least, it goes through the fuselage like the largest and fastest samurai sword you ever saw. No thanks.
That C-30 Crash was bad!
I can't unknow that now.
I like all the aviation experts here commenting on how it wouldn't work. You would think the people who would know what could work and what would not are the ones with billions to invest and thousands of aviation engineers, but no, I guess some dude on youtube comments knows better
The engines on the antonov-70 looks a lot like that, but they are classified as turboprops. Makes me wonder if there is still a clear distinction
"no more turbofans"
-has a picture of a turbo fan in the thumbnail
What is the difference between a turboprop and an open rotor?
Considering the noise problem, perhaps they could be used for transoceanic flights. But that's a helluva restriction.
how is this going to work in extreme cold?
Turboprops work in extreme cold too.
@imano8265 can you explain, I'm dumb
3:36 Haha, A320 written on a Boeing 737. 😅
So why not build a large turbine contra rotating turboprop for the A320 / 737 sized aircraft? Possibly with an over fuselage wing.
Go on Rolls Royce Allison you can do this
its an old design that was never adopted decades ago.& will never be adopted now either.
How do they contain a blade failure when the prop blades are not shielded?
Why isn't there a funnel in front of the engines to force more air in?
Right ... Some kind of housing or nacelle for the front to better channel relative wind? Kinda curious also about this? Plus, I think it would 'look' better to the flying public.
@@jameswaters3939 😅
By installing more fan blades there's no need to increase fan diameter if getting more thrust.You can increase rpm also but not so much because of vibration.
Not quite how it works, you going to need a cowling over that and it will become a turbofan yet again.
so how will those vortex generation in tips be more silent now?
Who is Aviatrix? There seems to be a lot of corporate referencing on this clip. Instant red-flag.
So what happens when one of these blades separates and slices through the fuselage?
Insurance claim.
Blocked for "Destroy the entire"
For future watchers: Boeing was once a big name in aviation.
This video has so many aircraft identification errors it’s almost comical. Apparently the creator doesn’t have a firm grasp on the differences between the 727 and 737. Clearly the script is being generated by a computer voice but for crying out loud, double check your information for accuracy before you upload it to TH-cam
It’s seems like it would be impossible to contain a failure, leaving parts puncturing the fuselage.
Flew on an airbus A320 INEO yesterday featuring the Pratt Whitney motors that were insane. Loved it.
I remember them hanging such on a DC-9. And that was supposed to change the world (according to Aviation Week). LOL.
What happens when there's a bird strike those blaze will snapped off and hit the aircraft fuselage😮 they haven't thought of that
Jet engines have to pass a contained failure of the turbine blade test. How will they treat this type of engine? Will the consider these blades propellers or turbines?
So basically, they realized it was a stupid idea 30 years ago, but these engineering departments need funding, so...
Clickbait much?
Looks like a lot of trouble for nothing. They say the noise level was cut down, I don't believe it. We will not fly in a aircraft equipped with this engine. I think what we have now is the best for passenger aircraft.
Every few years they pull this one out again and proclaim it the hot new thing. Until the public or executives find out just how much noise it makes. Look up the XF-84 “Thunderscreech” for an example of how far back this goes. And just how bad it can be. That one physically disabled the ground crew out to 100 yards.
If the price of oil keeps rising and stays high there will be a lot of money dumped into fuel efficiency research. Maybe will see some new break through a sooner.
New engine since the 80s.
And the robot voice doesn't say Propeller even once.
So basically super propellor engines ?
huge fan
Its called a contra-rotating turbo prop.
make these new engine allready.
"Destroy the entire aviation industry." Get real!
The new engines are better, anyone who says otherwise better watch their backs
Airbus ended production of the 380 in 2021 - how old is this video? Looks more like a turboprop at this point and probably has significant speed issues, just like all turboprops do.
They intend to use liquid hydrogen. I see many issues with that.
It's really dangerous in Bird strike
:27 Once Boeing gets new management, a new aircraft program will start.
The "Entire aircraft industry" that'll be destroyed includes potential purchasers of this GE engine, GE itself, aircraft tyre manufacturers and many others, so the claim it total nonsense.
What he actually said was that it'll IMPACT the industry.,which I very much doubt.
I don't think i would want an unducted fan under the wing. What happens if a blade dislodges. There is nothing stopping that blade from entering the fuselage. no thanks.
Yet another crappy aerospace video with an even more crappy headline. Geared turbofans are the future, not these engines
So ... Boeing will not develop a new model for now because they wait for this exact technological breakthrough to incorporate it on their next model. Meanwhile, this engine is planned to be tested on an Airbus 380 ... it's a bit hard to imagine how this engine will destroy the entire aviation industry by catching the two market leaders by surprise ;-)
Shouldn’t these be classified as “Turboprops”
🛫👍
"snecma" and "smegma" are incredibly close...
Goodbye nacelle! Sounds like a sad love song: if some girl isn’t named Nacelle already I’d be surprised.
Seems like a safety hazard
Umm!! 🤔I don't think so
This Wont be better than TurboFan as the Thrust is Not Contained So a Lot is Wasted .
If it does, the blood will be on your hands.
So, It seems, that aircraft industry will just lobby more loose regulation for engine noise and we'll go back to open fan engines.
And it will be sold to the public as great innovation.
Welcome back to the 50''s of XX century 🤣
The Y2K society 🤣
Then they unbalance the aircraft and it bites the dust, thanks Boeing
The noise will kill this BS jet engine. To darn loud.
Blocked for "destroy the entire" and the fake audience. It's getting old.
This only makes sense on airfreighters.. These engines are only more efficient at slower speeds, lower altitudes and people don't want to see those blades, as they represent a real visual threat (real or not), so they need to target the retrofit market. Airfreight also is not as severely constrained by time slot performance (thus can avoid weather conditions that may be a constraint) or have the huger passenger liabilities. Passenger traffic is very fickle to economic conditions and there is a great concern of this turning negative in the near future, while airfreight is less elastic. I'm laughing at the hydrogen 'wokeness'.. it will never happen in large aircraft, perhaps a few 'woke' propeller small trainers (that only have to be able to fly for two hours at the most) due to cost, ground facilities and weight.
"Destroy the aviation industry." Juvenile verbiage. Grow up
What new engine? IT is the same as the Tupolev - TU95. So, NEW WHERE? WHAT A JOKE.
Complete plagiarism. Should be struck and channel banned. Mentour Now!
What a BS claim. Overused phrase.Simply click bate. Just move on to the next video.
Hyperbole much?
How this would destroy the insdustry? Click bIt much
First
This is trash, jet airplanes aren't going back to turboprops....lol
Nothing new here. Never successful due to excessive noise and fragility.
I'm wondering how these engines handle bird strikes.
This has been tried. It failed.
Turbo props are an outdated technology.
I don’t know why, but I think I would still feel better about having an enclosed engine
So this new engine will commit suicide? Stupid title.