I've heard stories that Stolar was in corporate espionage with Sony in order to derail Sega as a hardware manufacturer and drive them out of the hardware race.
Honestly Nakayama can be blamed for a series of bad decisions that ultimately gutted Sega's ability to keep their console business going. He clearly did not understand markets and public relations outside of Japan and his insistence on things like the 32X and the Saturn's early launch destroyed not only consumers' faith but 3rd party publishers' faith in Sega. It killed any hope of Sega's consoles having proper 3rd party support in the west for not only the Saturn but any console they made going forward. It's astounding the sheer amount of arrogance of his decisions.
Trust takes a lifetime to build but only a moment to destroy. Sega pushed way too much claptrap through the door when a tidy box would have worked. It was like a total panic.
You have no idea how accurate that last bit is. We met with Sega about 6 months before the launch of the 32x. There where both Sega Japan and Sega US reps in the meeting and at one point during the meeting the Japanese Sega rep went absolutely Yakuza on the Sega US guys when they said something that was "inaccurate".
I was at this first E3 in a professional capacity. I still remember us wigging out that the Saturn was available immediately. Kalinske put on a good face during our time with him after the announcement but you could tell not all was well.
Thank you for making this! The failure of the Sega Saturn has always fascinated and saddened me. I loved my Saturn, when I got it as a kid, but it was so unpopular that other kids literally made fun of me for it.
I never went with the Saturn and that said I felt like a traitor going to Sony, a virtually unknown newcomer when it came to video games back then. I felt though that I made the right choice with the success of it and afterwards Sega was so, so far in the back of my mind I didn't even take notice of anything that was happening with the Saturn. I remember the first time I played the Saturn it was at my best friend's at the time and he got both Saturn and PlayStation. I remember playing Clockwork Knight and didn't think much of it at all. Which is basically why I chose the PlayStation over the Saturn. When I saw the 2D shooters though I really wanted one but never did get one as I was on a 1 console at a time basis because my parents wanted me and them get their money's worth out of said consoles I had at the time. It meant whenever I wanted a new console I had to sell the one I had before getting a new one.
@jabroni destroyer It wasn't dog shit. It had a much better library than the N64 and quite a good amount of gems that you couldn't play on the other 2 consoles. I had all 3 consoles and definitely played my Saturn a bit more than the N64.
@jabroni destroyer You don't know what the hell you're talking about. The Capcom Versus games were superior on the Saturn, as were games like Mega-Man X. Vampire Savior shit all over Dark Stalkers 3 on the PlayStation (superior animation) and Street Fighter Zero 3 was superior to its Dreamcast counterpart. The Saturn also had superior sound hardware and a good portion of its games had Red Book audio. You probably had the shitty North American controllers. Any Saturn owner worth that knew anything about the console would own the superior Japanese 6 button pad. It was much better than the stiff ass PlayStation D-pad and buttons. I had to buy the Asciiware arcade stick for arcade games, because of that shitty controller. At least the Dual-shock was an improvement.
If I were running Sega of America in 1994, here's what I would have done differently. First I would have just cancelled the 32X before it made it to retail, in hindsight their really was no reason the 32X needed to exist, it would have been a better use of time and company resources to focus on developing launch titles for the Saturn in the west, and marketing them for the launch later next year. Also if it really wasn't possible to get a new Sonic game out in time for the Saturns launch, I would have just taken Sonic CD and have a Saturn version of that made as a pack in title, and as a hold over until a later date when a 3D Sonic game could be made, I also would have insisted that Knuckles Chaotix be developed for the Saturn instead. While were at it why not take several of the Sega CD's High Quality titles that flopped like both the Lunar games, Snatcher, Popful Mail, Shining Force CD, and have Saturn ports of those made. Sort of like how Nintendo would bring over it's Wii U library as Switch games. Not only would they have strengthen the Saturn's launch line up, but would have also given them a second chance to shine on a brand new machine. I would have also kept the original Genesis around for afew more years as a budget option. Of course that's only assuming that Sega of Japan's President would have listened to any helpful advice from the American branch of the Company, and didn't decide to rush the release of the Saturn out in a panic to get an edge over the PlayStation in the west.
When I hear of companies shooting themselves in the foot, I always think of Commodore and almost everything they did after the Commodore 64, with the obvious exception of the Amiga 500, but even there, once you did a bit deeper, they were shooting themselves in the foot. The end result being that one of the pioneers of the Computer industry is now gone and not even known by whole generations.
I remember my Saturn v PS1 moment. Stood in Cardiff Virgin Megastore in the run up to Christmas 95. There were demo units of both consoles, I'd never played either. I was a sega kid and I was pretty certain there was already a Saturn on top of the wardrobe awaiting wrapping. Can't remember what fame Saturn was playing but I remember it being a slow jerky mess. The PS1 had Tekken and I stood there playing it with my jaw on the floor for about 20 minutes. My mother realised what was going on and was not impressed, we had a frank conversation later that night about what console I wanted. It felt like I was telling her I didn't want to go to back for a levels or something. I was the only one of my mates that Christmas to get a PS1, the others stayed loyal to Sega and I was far from being the cool kid in the group. But by the following round of birthdays I'd say everyone had a PS1.
The 32X/Sega CD/Saturn debacle lead directly to the failure of the Dreamcast as the public's confidence in Sega was shattered by that point. Too bad because the Dreamcast is one of the greatest consoles of all time. Sega's last console hurrah.
Not purely because of that; keep in mind that upon launch the Dreamcast was a massive hit. So it appeared that the damage done by the Saturn and the mega drive add ons was becoming a distant memory. The main issue was that shortly after Dreamcasts launch the PS2 was launched and due to the overwhelming success of the PS1 people decided to wait for that, skipping sega's offering in the process.
@@whatamalike That's true. The Dreamcast did do well initially, I had forgotten about that. You're right that it was the impending launch of the PS2 (and the promise of the Xbox and Gamecube shortly thereafter) that ultimately sunk the DC. However, I do think a big part of that was still consumer confidence. If the public had trust in Sega, why would they care about other consoles? Of course, the PS1 had a massive fan base so perhaps it was inevitable that, no matter how good the Dreamcast was, there would be a lot people holding out for the PS2.
@@whatamalike Sure. A lot of people were waiting for the PS2, but Sega did say that the competition was too much for them. The upcoming Microsoft Xbox and Nintendo Gamecube are also the reason why Sega got out of the hardware business.
Stirling work as always Kim! You never disappoint & you are very much appreciated by this grizzled old gamer. Your documentaries are unsurpassed in quality and always brighten my up day to watch. Seeing a new Kim Justice upload pop up in my feed is like getting an unexpected little present! I have learned much from your extremely extensive, well researched & informative body of work. Thankyou for all your hard work and for spoiling us with consistent, top quality content. Like I say, it is very much appreciated :)
here in Portugal the Saturn was quite successful too, like Japan. It gave PS1 a run for its money, but international failure and discontinuing the console made PS1 then take off massively here. Nintendo was a non-issue here, Sega had won every generation by miles, and both the Saturn and even the flop Dreamcast beat Nintendo 64 and Gamecube.
It's very sad Sega made so many mistakes during that time but it's ironic that while I was a Super Nintendo kid it was the Sega Saturn that made me into a Sega fan to me this period in time was Sega at it's best
29:21 That has to be the SADDEST use of 'Last Wave', ever. Made me realize once for and all how much arcades and even local multiplayer have fallen(especially in post-2020) in favor of online play that won't work on a particular machine after the servers go down and is more solitary; not as engaging or fun for me. 😢 Yes, failing arcades and competition may have had something to do with their downfall, intentional or not, but in the end, Sega ultimately did it to themselves - a divided house never stands. And this is coming from a Nintendo lover.
I agree on the "A divided house never stands" and that Sega did it to themselves. Many mistakes from Sega of Japan of America like thinking the Atari Jaguar was a threat and it leading to the 32X when they knew the Saturn was about to come out in Japan and the 32X would do SoJ no good as the Mega Drive was not successful there, therefore no one would by the add-on if they didn't have the main console. SoA mistake was doing the 32X because they did not want the Saturn to come because they felt the Playstation was going to do 3D games better than the Saturn could, but they should have known the Saturn was going to get released in American whether they liked it or not and that having another add-on would make people not trust Sega and would drive their customers away.
Christmas 1995 - Sega Saturn - Mk2 controllers - Sega Rally, Virtua Fighter 2, Panzer Dragoon 2. Picked up Worldwide Soccer 97 on Boxing Day. It seemed that for the entirety of 1996 myself and my friends did nothing other than play games on my Saturn.
7:47 "The Saturn port [Virtua Fighter] is virtually indistinguishable from the arcade" I'm sorry, Kim. But, you are totally wrong. The original port of VF was a terrible rush job. So much so that Sega later released VF Remix. Owners of VF could get Remix free w/proof of purchase. I know this was true at least in NA (my friend got his free copy of VF Remix). Remix actually improved upon the arcade original while bearing a closer resemblance to the excellent port of VF2.
I was a kid during that era of gaming. Somehow the PlayStation launch just passed me by. I knew what it was, I recognized Crash bandicoot when he would show up in commercials, but console video games at that time were always either Nintendo or Sega to me. Since my family was poor and couldn't afford those, I stuck with PC gaming on my old 486. I pretty much missed the entire 32-64 generation, opting for whatever I could get as shareware instead. I didn't own a new console until the GameCube came out because I was old enough to have a part-time job then.
You could always tell how good a console was doing by how many you saw in the local Cash Converters. Needless to say, there were always plenty of Saturns and 32X's to keep the Jaguars company. It still saddens me how Sega fell so far so fast.
This is my favorite video from you Kim. When I read that you had to change the music, I figured it was The Godfather theme. Too bad, it fit the video really well. Still cool though! I hope you consider doing something like this for the Dreamcast someday.
This video made me read the "Console Wars" book and I highly recommend it to anyone interested in this topic. It was great fun and highly informative, like this video!
It's down to the fact that Sega got greedy and they forgot about the customers and that they were trying to beat everyone else at sales and that was what lead to there downfall and that was also there biggest mistake you know among others and that's why Sega stopped making console's and just stick with making games for all the other company's and that's why the competition beat them
Sega thought only Namco could touch them in terms of cutting edge 3D hardware and since Namco weren't planning to enter the home console market, 3DO was the only real competition, Atari didn't have the resources or backing to make a go of the Jaguar.
Superb analysis , through this video i learned more info about Saturn's failure than many other video ... combined ,thanks !!! --P.S. I was also a former MegaDrive/Genesis (and later Playstation) owner ,and at that time , huge SEGA fan , who never understood what the h@#$ SEGA was trying to do by releasing a 32bit add-on for the MegaDrive , which would be ... *obselete* very soon since they were also about to launch ... a new 32bit console !! And i was thinking all these while i was what ? 15-16years old !! couldn't those simple things be considered by the SEGA executives as well ?? Oh my God , what SEGA was thinking back then ?? unbelievable how self-destructive this company had become !!
I traded all my nes games into funcoland to get the sega cd back in 1993 when I was 9. My dad had issues hooking it up to start and the games really weren't for a 9 year old. We skipped Saturn and I had a ps1 and n64 due to the lack of faith we had in sega after the sega cd. I did get a dreamcast at launch but i think my story holds for most and why the saturn didnt sell
I knew no-one in the 90s who had a Saturn. I had a PS1 and N64 but never saw the need for a Saturn. It was really badly handled in the West and there were next to no adverts for it. It's no wonder it flopped here. It's a shame as when I got one in the early 2000s I thought it wasn't bad and by quite a few accounts it actually holds up better than its competitors now
One of the major problems with this story is that we're only hearing Tom Kalinske's side of the Saturn saga. Hearing from Japanese executives would help tremendously and probably balance the coverage somewhat. I must admit that I'm a bit skeptical to the notion that Kalinske had little or no input in Saturn's early days, including the early launch. As always, there's a bit of a Rashomon side to this saga, and nobody ever wants to own up to failure. I don't think Sega ever really stood a chance in Generation 5 in the West. They were deluged with bad press and negative hype all through the latter half of 1994 until the Saturn launch, their many hardware platforms had given them a bad reputation for dropping consoles far too early, and third-party software developers were far more excited about Sony's new Playstation. I think Western devs were especially looking to Sony as an escape from the draconian business practices of Sega and Nintendo, and those bridges had been pretty well burned during Generation 4. Sony, of course, did nearly everything right. They understood the need for successful relations with software publishers and retailers, their hardware was very effective at producing 3D graphics, and they were masters of hype. They knew how to sell to the public and how to overhype technology most users couldn't possibly understand. We're talking "500K, 360K polygons" and "T-Rex demo" stuff. And don't forget all that massive hype for Playstation 2, like the claim it would render 88 million polygons/second, or that the US government might ban its sale in the US because it technically qualified as a "super computer." I think my favorite story was the one where Saddam Hussein wanted to steal the PS2 for use in his secret weapons programs. That was a real hoot. Saturn, meanwhile, got hit with an absolutely fatal reputation for 3D graphics that haunt it to this day. It's almost like a zombie chant, "Can't Doo Three Dee...Can't Doo Three Dee..." Much of this was their fault in the early titles like Virtua Fighter and Daytona USA, and the early US launch once again deserves a slap upside the head. But Sega did dramatically improve the software, and the arrival of Virtua Fighter 2, Sega Rally, Virtua Cop and Panzer Dragoon Zwei should have buried that mantra forever. Unfortunately, most gamers stopped paying attention and already tuned out. Many were already on Sony's bandwagon. Most were waiting for Nintendo 64 to arrive. In the end, the videogame business has always been driven by hits, and Sega, for whatever reasons, could never generate those hits. Virtua Fighter was huge in Japan, but barely registered in the States. And Saturn was missing the two key elements that made Genesis a success: Sonic and Sports, specifically American Football. There's no excuse for dropping the ball on that. What the hell happened to the Sega Sports brand? Why was Sonic Xtreme such a wreck? For that, we can absolutely blame Kalinske. And nobody anticipated the public souring on 2D and arcade videogames as quickly as they did. Part of me wonders if Kalinske was quietly hoping that Saturn would fail and die a very quick death, leaving him in position to boast, "I told you so" and then push for a new console that could launch in 1996 against Nintendo. He never did like the Hitachi hardware design and always pushed for alternatives, most famously the Silicon Graphics chipset that became the Nintendo 64. He seemed to drag his heels, treat Saturn like an odd luxury product, shipped software in those ghastly plastic coffins, replaced the brilliant JP controller with that US monstrosity. Heck, even the US Saturn looks terrible with its cheap black color and balloon font logo. The JP Saturn looks so much better, it's not even funny--and why didn't we get the eggshell white Model 2 Saturn? That puppy looks gorgeous. Again, no Sonic. No sports. Playstation launched with excellent football and hockey games, and a solid basketball game soon followed. All the good Saturn sports titles were from Japan. From the US side, we got...ugh, NHL All-Star Hockey, possibly the worst hockey videogame of all time. And no basketball. And no freakin' football. What the hell?! Oh, well, water under the bridge. Today, Saturn is an all-time classic games console. But in the '90s in the USA? It was a bit frustrating to live through.
Silicon Graphics wanted something like $150 for their chipset, per unit, they proposed for the Saturn. You then add the cost of a CD Drive, Ram, custom soundchip etc and Saturn would of been even more expensive than the Playstation, than it already was.
Sega's Japanese executives don't really like giving interviews about things like this. All we have is the American and European perspectives on this. Might have to just it with a teeny grain of salt if you will. Btw I know your comment is over a year old, but I still felt the need to say something regardless.
@@G.L.999 regarding that 1st part, if so, they refuse to say the truth or even own up their mistakes. Thus why we'll never hear from SoJ about the whole problem. I won't be surprised if Console Wars never got published in Japanese to the point the old executives would even knew the book exists...
@@christiandacanay3086 It probably wasn't published over there. Which is why I said we should take with a teeny grain of salt; as well as some scepticism.
Always a delight to watch your videos, even if the topic is quite sad ! It's kind of "fun" to see that so many years later, Sony did another "e3 95" when then announced the PS4 and its price, just after the shitstorm of the Xbox One reveal...
On top of that, the PS4 reveal did more than the good price reveal- a LOT of stuff that the Xbox One failed to give, making the players really happy OVER 9000. So technically, Xbox One did a Saturn... and blew up in their faces. XD
Saturn was brought forward early in the USA as Sega knew due to the Saturn being the most expensive console to manufacture out of 3DO,Saturn and PlayStation, they couldn't bring the launch price down to meet Sony, so they wanted to launch first and gain a head start. What the launch did was alienate retailers and publishers. Publishers had no games ready for launch, so Saturn launched with 3 Sega games, third parties felt Sega wanted all the launch software revenue for themselves
Great video. I was a Saturn owner and this was a superb insight into the era. I still loved my satyrn even though it began to slip away. When we lost tomb raider 2 to the ps1, i knew it was all over !
Weird to look back on, this period, because I think back to living it and whilst still being a SEGA boy, something in the back of my mind was telling me they were f'cking up. The Saturn was a great console, but it didn't matter. It was still seen as a toy, while the Playstation was sold as a lifestyle accessory.
Dual processing had been seen in Sega consoles before Kim, both Block Out and F-22 Interceptor on the Megs Drive used the systems 68000 and Z80 chips to handle the maths for the polygon 3D. The Mega CD 68000 CPU was used in parallel with the MD 68000 The Atari Jaguar used the 68000 to run.A.I routines, Object Processor, Blitter,Tom and Jerry chips, in it's flagship titles
I always wonder what would have happened if the Saturn had been held back until Christmas 1995, and then launched with Virtua Fighter 2, Sega Rally, and Virtua Cop. That would have given the 32X a good run and the Saturn a really special launch.
Don’t agree that the Saturn port was “virtually indistinguishable from the arcade” it’s clearly inferior, and so rife with bugs that Sega had to release an update to the game. Fans were quite disappointed with it at launch.
Another great video Kim. Brought back some good memories. I actually chose the Saturn over the PlayStation being a die hard Sega fan when I was young. To this day I've never bought a new PlayStation console (I do own a PS1, PS2,PS3 and a PSP now though) I don't play as much as I used to but do enjoy watching yours and many other retro gaming TH-cam channels. The 16bit Sega days will never be beaten in my eyes, the best time to be gaming and I got to be a kid through it all! Sega til I die! :)
Never going to happen but I keep hoping for Sega to return to the hardware game (maybe not a console but to partner up for peripherals at least). The model 2 controller is still the best 2D-controller ever made imho (amazing D-pads) and the 3D controller was super comfortable and to this day idk why not more controllers use the hollowed out globe stick. They owned the arcades. Not sure if they still do as there never were any near me. I got to choose between a Saturn or PS as a kid (had played both at friend's houses). Picked the Saturn, never in doubt, and to this day feel I made the right decision 100%. Only years later I found out why the Saturn failed so bad... Because Sega. Never saw a single commercial here in Scandinavia. Also personally don't like RPG's but that's where the casuals are.
I remember in 1995, opting for the Saturn as my 32 bit system due to me being a Mega Drive owner! It makes as much sense as an SNES owner waiting for the N64! However, I had to switch to PlayStation in 1998 due to the Saturn having almost completely died off! I think if the Saturn had just been a consolized model 2 (Sega should’ve foreseen that 3D was the future, I hear their own Virtua Fighter is what influenced Sony to focus on 3D for the PlayStation!) and had Mega Drive backwards compatibility, it might have fared better.
Another excellent video! I really love your channel. I was dumb and jumped on the Sony bandwagon. I loved the PlayStation but now I look back and see all the amazing Sega games I missed out on.
The Saturn had three fundamental flaws: First, it wasn't able to do arcade perfect visuals even at launch. That should have clued Sega in to the fact that this wasn't good enough hardware. Second, price. Third, weird marketing in the US and Europe. I remember as a kid having no idea what was going on with Saturn commercials. I don't think I ever saw something so weird again till early PS3 commercials.
Too complicated to program for. No transparency effects. Although it was powerful in some areas it lacked basic features that the PS and N64 got right. Sony nailed it right out of the block. SEGA floundered.
Thanks Kim, great video as always. I never understood why Sega didn't do a true arcade console to play all their arcade games from the AM2 ones right up to Model 3 games. I certainly would but be for all those amazing games and what if they could network for multiplayer online so people could playing Daytona and Virtua Racing... Oh boy 🏁😁👍
Sounds like your talking about the Dreamcast, unfortunately all the Sony zealots would rather watch pretty graphics other than actually "play" a game. Ironic that the PLAYstation has less PLAYability than both Sega and Nintendo's efforts, just goes to show the power of marketing.
@@jesuszamora6949 It wasn't the price of the console that dissuaded me but the cartridges. Although, now that I think about it, Sega 16-bit systems games we're around £50 so if I was any good at saving it would have been possible. I'd have had a smaller games collection though. I'm not sure if a wider selection of games would have been available had more people purchased the Neo Geo. £100 a game was a LOT of money back then.
While an ex roomie gave me his Dreamcast to make up for late rent, I refused to buy anything Sega made after the Saturn. Nothing more disappointing than buying a console only to see it go tits up less than a few years later. I also used to beta test for the Genesis/Megadrive, so I felt dumped on thrice over.
If I could rewrite history I'd have turned the SVP into the 32X there by not wasting the chips for one cart and producing cheaper carts to plug into it, 9 months could have helped promotion but really the 32X itself was too expensive to make much like the Saturn. Tom was good for 16-bit but terrible for 32-bit, while Bernie was just an idiot with the SS IE. "Don't do the things the platform does well, do more of what it's bad at.". O_o??? Still better communication between east & west could have helped, seemed like none. True there is nothing good about cutting everyone's timetable shorter. :P Certainly the bigger story compared to the last crop before them, who remembers the launch of CD-i, 3DO, or Jaguar these days? The only major flaw often forgotten about Playstation1 was it didn't have analog joysticks which turned out to be key requirement for good 3D game control, making the PS Classic design all the more confusing, not a lot of nostalgia for poorly controlled 3D games.
I got one at launch with virtua fighter and Daytona. My mega drive 32x cd was in its way out so the Saturn being a Sega fan was the logical choice with no regrets I did get the psx but I didn’t find it better just a different choice of game, but the Dreamcast was my favourite and still is. Easy to burn games for after that died.
Pretty sure Saturn initially had one 32 bit Hitachi chip then they saw what Sony were doing, panicked and added the second to beef up it's 3d capabilities.
This is mostly a good summation of what happened, and I like the video. You do make one significant mistake that you repeat several times early in the video: Virtua Fighter for 32X released in October 1995, not at launch in 1994. It was actually the last 32X game made by Sega of Japan; they had mostly abandoned the system several months prior, but Virtua Fighter was important enough to get a game. Similarly, Virtua Fighter 2 would get a Genesis port in 1996, even though otherwise Sega of Japan had abandoned the Genesis back in mid '95 at the same time as the 32X. The 32X launch titles were Star Wars Arcade, Doom, and Space Harrier, with Virtua Racing Deluxe being the other release in '94 in Japan. Virtua Fighter for Saturn released too late to have any impact on the 32X, that's why it didn't help. Good video otherwise, though.
They're supposedly considering it, it's a competitive market right now and Sega aren't the first party developers they used to be so it would be hard going, but supposedly Tommy Tallarico owns the rights to Intellivision and is planning to come out with a new console soon, plus Sega's making a Mega Drive Mini so they are sorta getting into the hardware business either way, who knows what could happen.
It should also be pointed out that after the first year of the PlayStation Sony fired all the North American staff that helped make it a success. Strange, don't you think?
Dual processing hadn't been seen in consoles before? 🤔 Errm, the 68000 and Z80 processors were used in the Mega Drive to help with the Maths on 3D titles such as F-22 and Block Out. The Mega CD used both the MD and MCD 68000 processors in parallel..
You're saying SOA was behind the 32X? Uh, no. Kalinske never wanted to bring that thing over, but they were stuck with it. It never really had a chance. Then when Nakiyama sabotaged the saturn launch, that was the last nail.
Not entirely. Nakayama wanted to make a 32-bit cartridge console, but the SoA team thought it was a horrible idea to bring something that wasn't a substantial upgrade over to the Genesis. They basically wanted to make a SuperGrafx. Gaming Historian has a wonderful little video on the subject. th-cam.com/video/sjilAAhp8NI/w-d-xo.html The 32X was not the BEST idea, but if Sega hadn't pushed the Saturn so soon, it would have had a chance. Conversely, could you imagine Sega releasing a 32-bit stand-alone cart console, THEN put out the Saturn?
I thought it was well known that the 32X version of Virtua fighter (given the hardware) was way more impressive then the Saturn version. A locked 30 fps framerate and better controls at the cost of not even that much polygons. There's a reason Sega released VF remix for the Saturn...
Sega have IPs of gold known worldwide even now and they have so little imagination of how to capitalise on them, its frustrating to watch. Off the top of my head i would have moved into the mobile market with original games based on classics not just the original games (made a fair few bucks for big N). Id license 3rd party smaller companies to work on download budget titles of franchises to keep the names ticking over, smaller games and demanded quality from the many quality small companies who have produced great games on a budget who would love to work on a Sega IP. I think a 2D style old school Zelda Golden Axe adventure, A Space Harrier bejeweled style game with its classic Icons is so easy, An outrun endless runner type game. Its easy just think Sega FFS. And im not even a big Sega fan, great video as always.
I agree with your points, also Sega have already done a Legend of Zelda style Golden Axe game. It’s called Golden Axe Warrior and was released on the Master System. You can obviously download a ROM, or it’s been rereleased on the Sega Mega Drive/Genesis Ultimate Collection on the Xbox 360/PS3.
32X was intended to be the low cost machine American stores like Target, K-Mart,Seers etc could stock, Sega America had hoped to get it out at retail for $100, but that was impossible
I traded in my Genesis, Sega CD and 32X at Funcoland on the day the Playstation launched.... and bought a Sega Saturn :) They were already giving away 2 free games in addition to Virtua Fighter at that point.
I'm so happy to see you releasing so much content lately! I have a youtube channel currently, which has no content yet but I will be making some soon! I would like to thank you, Kim for being one of the people who has inspired me to do so! I will provide you with a link to my channel once I get it up and upload my 1st video!!! :) I hope you're having a great day!
Am I right in thinking that the opening soundtrack is from a Sonic game? I forget which one but I'm definitely sure it's from one of the early Genesis Sonic games.
Saturn was planned in 2 models, Jupiter an entry level cartridge machine,with planned CD add on with added Ram and Saturn, the high end CD version, but SOJ canned Jupiter as they realised they'd be selling consumers inferior versions of Saturn games at higher prices, via Jupiter cartridges
If you liked this then think about having a gander through my social media, and get yourself on my Patreon: www.patreon.com/KimbleJustice
Hey Kim, what's the theme name on 26:55 ?
I've heard stories that Stolar was in corporate espionage with Sony in order to derail Sega as a hardware manufacturer and drive them out of the hardware race.
Honestly Nakayama can be blamed for a series of bad decisions that ultimately gutted Sega's ability to keep their console business going. He clearly did not understand markets and public relations outside of Japan and his insistence on things like the 32X and the Saturn's early launch destroyed not only consumers' faith but 3rd party publishers' faith in Sega. It killed any hope of Sega's consoles having proper 3rd party support in the west for not only the Saturn but any console they made going forward. It's astounding the sheer amount of arrogance of his decisions.
Trust takes a lifetime to build but only a moment to destroy. Sega pushed way too much claptrap through the door when a tidy box would have worked. It was like a total panic.
You have no idea how accurate that last bit is. We met with Sega about 6 months before the launch of the 32x. There where both Sega Japan and Sega US reps in the meeting and at one point during the meeting the Japanese Sega rep went absolutely Yakuza on the Sega US guys when they said something that was "inaccurate".
I was at this first E3 in a professional capacity. I still remember us wigging out that the Saturn was available immediately. Kalinske put on a good face during our time with him after the announcement but you could tell not all was well.
Thank you for making this! The failure of the Sega Saturn has always fascinated and saddened me. I loved my Saturn, when I got it as a kid, but it was so unpopular that other kids literally made fun of me for it.
They regretted it when I showed them virtua fighter 2.
I never went with the Saturn and that said I felt like a traitor going to Sony, a virtually unknown newcomer when it came to video games back then.
I felt though that I made the right choice with the success of it and afterwards Sega was so, so far in the back of my mind I didn't even take notice of anything that was happening with the Saturn. I remember the first time I played the Saturn it was at my best friend's at the time and he got both Saturn and PlayStation. I remember playing Clockwork Knight and didn't think much of it at all. Which is basically why I chose the PlayStation over the Saturn.
When I saw the 2D shooters though I really wanted one but never did get one as I was on a 1 console at a time basis because my parents wanted me and them get their money's worth out of said consoles I had at the time. It meant whenever I wanted a new console I had to sell the one I had before getting a new one.
thespiralgoeson me too. Although everyone wanted to play Sega Rally
@jabroni destroyer It wasn't dog shit. It had a much better library than the N64 and quite a good amount of gems that you couldn't play on the other 2 consoles. I had all 3 consoles and definitely played my Saturn a bit more than the N64.
@jabroni destroyer You don't know what the hell you're talking about. The Capcom Versus games were superior on the Saturn, as were games like Mega-Man X. Vampire Savior shit all over Dark Stalkers 3 on the PlayStation (superior animation) and Street Fighter Zero 3 was superior to its Dreamcast counterpart.
The Saturn also had superior sound hardware and a good portion of its games had Red Book audio.
You probably had the shitty North American controllers. Any Saturn owner worth that knew anything about the console would own the superior Japanese 6 button pad. It was much better than the stiff ass PlayStation D-pad and buttons. I had to buy the Asciiware arcade stick for arcade games, because of that shitty controller. At least the Dual-shock was an improvement.
An excellent and well put together vid Kim as always, glad to see it back up.
If I were running Sega of America in 1994, here's what I would have done differently.
First I would have just cancelled the 32X before it made it to retail, in hindsight their really was no reason the 32X needed to exist, it would have been a better use of time and company resources to focus on developing launch titles for the Saturn in the west, and marketing them for the launch later next year.
Also if it really wasn't possible to get a new Sonic game out in time for the Saturns launch, I would have just taken Sonic CD and have a Saturn version of that made as a pack in title, and as a hold over until a later date when a 3D Sonic game could be made, I also would have insisted that Knuckles Chaotix be developed for the Saturn instead.
While were at it why not take several of the Sega CD's High Quality titles that flopped like both the Lunar games, Snatcher, Popful Mail, Shining Force CD, and have Saturn ports of those made. Sort of like how Nintendo would bring over it's Wii U library as Switch games. Not only would they have strengthen the Saturn's launch line up, but would have also given them a second chance to shine on a brand new machine.
I would have also kept the original Genesis around for afew more years as a budget option. Of course that's only assuming that Sega of Japan's President would have listened to any helpful advice from the American branch of the Company, and didn't decide to rush the release of the Saturn out in a panic to get an edge over the PlayStation in the west.
Glad you reuploaded this, Kim. Watching companies shoot themselves in the foot is incredibly fascinating.
You mean like anything Atari did right before and after the North American VG Crash.
When I hear of companies shooting themselves in the foot, I always think of Commodore and almost everything they did after the Commodore 64, with the obvious exception of the Amiga 500, but even there, once you did a bit deeper, they were shooting themselves in the foot. The end result being that one of the pioneers of the Computer industry is now gone and not even known by whole generations.
I remember my Saturn v PS1 moment. Stood in Cardiff Virgin Megastore in the run up to Christmas 95. There were demo units of both consoles, I'd never played either. I was a sega kid and I was pretty certain there was already a Saturn on top of the wardrobe awaiting wrapping. Can't remember what fame Saturn was playing but I remember it being a slow jerky mess. The PS1 had Tekken and I stood there playing it with my jaw on the floor for about 20 minutes. My mother realised what was going on and was not impressed, we had a frank conversation later that night about what console I wanted. It felt like I was telling her I didn't want to go to back for a levels or something. I was the only one of my mates that Christmas to get a PS1, the others stayed loyal to Sega and I was far from being the cool kid in the group. But by the following round of birthdays I'd say everyone had a PS1.
The 32X/Sega CD/Saturn debacle lead directly to the failure of the Dreamcast as the public's confidence in Sega was shattered by that point. Too bad because the Dreamcast is one of the greatest consoles of all time. Sega's last console hurrah.
Indeed. Trust is hard to earn and easy to lose.
Not purely because of that; keep in mind that upon launch the Dreamcast was a massive hit. So it appeared that the damage done by the Saturn and the mega drive add ons was becoming a distant memory. The main issue was that shortly after Dreamcasts launch the PS2 was launched and due to the overwhelming success of the PS1 people decided to wait for that, skipping sega's offering in the process.
@@whatamalike That's true. The Dreamcast did do well initially, I had forgotten about that. You're right that it was the impending launch of the PS2 (and the promise of the Xbox and Gamecube shortly thereafter) that ultimately sunk the DC. However, I do think a big part of that was still consumer confidence. If the public had trust in Sega, why would they care about other consoles? Of course, the PS1 had a massive fan base so perhaps it was inevitable that, no matter how good the Dreamcast was, there would be a lot people holding out for the PS2.
It's true. I waited for ps2 even though I had been a huge Sega fan before Saturn.
@@whatamalike Sure. A lot of people were waiting for the PS2, but Sega did say that the competition was too much for them. The upcoming Microsoft Xbox and Nintendo Gamecube are also the reason why Sega got out of the hardware business.
Stirling work as always Kim! You never disappoint & you are very much appreciated by this grizzled old gamer. Your documentaries are unsurpassed in quality and always brighten my up day to watch. Seeing a new Kim Justice upload pop up in my feed is like getting an unexpected little present!
I have learned much from your extremely extensive, well researched & informative body of work.
Thankyou for all your hard work and for spoiling us with consistent, top quality content. Like I say, it is very much appreciated :)
This is so good I've watched this a few times already. The pacing, editing and scope are excellent. You're a badass, Kim.
"And no, Sonic R doesn't count." - A very wise woman.
Andrew Vrba *it
@@wussup12345 Douche.
@Diabeto Kills Nice moronic comment, Moron.
Oh yeah thats right its a troon who makes good content godspeed
@@cloudtx Truth hurts, don't it? Kim's an "it". Not a woman.
here in Portugal the Saturn was quite successful too, like Japan. It gave PS1 a run for its money, but international failure and discontinuing the console made PS1 then take off massively here. Nintendo was a non-issue here, Sega had won every generation by miles, and both the Saturn and even the flop Dreamcast beat Nintendo 64 and Gamecube.
I love how you open this one with "Doomsday" from Sonic and Knickles
Always a depressing topic for me because the Saturn is such an excellent system. Sega shot themselves in the foot though.
Informative, well narrated and polished to a shine production (as usual). Excellent work.
It's very sad Sega made so many mistakes during that time but it's ironic that while I was a Super Nintendo kid it was the Sega Saturn that made me into a Sega fan to me this period in time was Sega at it's best
Nintendo PlayStation does what Segain’t? Ironic indeed.
SNES and Saturn?
You have very Japanese tastes! 🇯🇵
29:21 That has to be the SADDEST use of 'Last Wave', ever. Made me realize once for and all how much arcades and even local multiplayer have fallen(especially in post-2020) in favor of online play that won't work on a particular machine after the servers go down and is more solitary; not as engaging or fun for me. 😢
Yes, failing arcades and competition may have had something to do with their downfall, intentional or not, but in the end, Sega ultimately did it to themselves - a divided house never stands.
And this is coming from a Nintendo lover.
I agree on the "A divided house never stands" and that Sega did it to themselves. Many mistakes from Sega of Japan of America like thinking the Atari Jaguar was a threat and it leading to the 32X when they knew the Saturn was about to come out in Japan and the 32X would do SoJ no good as the Mega Drive was not successful there, therefore no one would by the add-on if they didn't have the main console.
SoA mistake was doing the 32X because they did not want the Saturn to come because they felt the Playstation was going to do 3D games better than the Saturn could, but they should have known the Saturn was going to get released in American whether they liked it or not and that having another add-on would make people not trust Sega and would drive their customers away.
Christmas 1995 - Sega Saturn - Mk2 controllers - Sega Rally, Virtua Fighter 2, Panzer Dragoon 2.
Picked up Worldwide Soccer 97 on Boxing Day.
It seemed that for the entirety of 1996 myself and my friends did nothing other than play games on my Saturn.
7:47 "The Saturn port [Virtua Fighter] is virtually indistinguishable from the arcade"
I'm sorry, Kim. But, you are totally wrong. The original port of VF was a terrible rush job. So much so that Sega later released VF Remix. Owners of VF could get Remix free w/proof of purchase.
I know this was true at least in NA (my friend got his free copy of VF Remix). Remix actually improved upon the arcade original while bearing a closer resemblance to the excellent port of VF2.
Yep, glitch, frame rate issues etc, competent, but not nearly indistinguishable
The fact you have the NOLF music in the background is rather wonderful.
Oh man now I have to dig out my NOLF 1&2 discs
This was one of the first videos that I saw on your channel (after the Molyneux saga)
Masterful work Kim!
Very interesting story about the console wars. Thank you!
I was a kid during that era of gaming. Somehow the PlayStation launch just passed me by. I knew what it was, I recognized Crash bandicoot when he would show up in commercials, but console video games at that time were always either Nintendo or Sega to me. Since my family was poor and couldn't afford those, I stuck with PC gaming on my old 486.
I pretty much missed the entire 32-64 generation, opting for whatever I could get as shareware instead.
I didn't own a new console until the GameCube came out because I was old enough to have a part-time job then.
You could always tell how good a console was doing by how many you saw in the local Cash Converters. Needless to say, there were always plenty of Saturns and 32X's to keep the Jaguars company. It still saddens me how Sega fell so far so fast.
Once again an excellent video Kim , i enjoyed every minute Just like the first time i watched it!!!
This is my favorite video from you Kim. When I read that you had to change the music, I figured it was The Godfather theme. Too bad, it fit the video really well. Still cool though! I hope you consider doing something like this for the Dreamcast someday.
This video made me read the "Console Wars" book and I highly recommend it to anyone interested in this topic. It was great fun and highly informative, like this video!
Another fantastic vid. Considered, well-researched and, above all, thoroughly entertaining, many thanks!
It's down to the fact that Sega got greedy and they forgot about the customers and that they were trying to beat everyone else at sales and that was what lead to there downfall and that was also there biggest mistake you know among others and that's why Sega stopped making console's and just stick with making games for all the other company's and that's why the competition beat them
Sega thought only Namco could touch them in terms of cutting edge 3D hardware and since Namco weren't planning to enter the home console market, 3DO was the only real competition, Atari didn't have the resources or backing to make a go of the Jaguar.
Superb analysis , through this video i learned more info about Saturn's failure than many other video ... combined ,thanks !!!
--P.S. I was also a former MegaDrive/Genesis (and later Playstation) owner ,and at that time , huge SEGA fan , who never understood what the h@#$ SEGA was trying to do by releasing a 32bit add-on for the MegaDrive , which would be ... *obselete* very soon since they were also about to launch ... a new 32bit console !!
And i was thinking all these while i was what ? 15-16years old !! couldn't those simple things be considered by the SEGA executives as well ??
Oh my God , what SEGA was thinking back then ?? unbelievable how self-destructive this company had become !!
I traded all my nes games into funcoland to get the sega cd back in 1993 when I was 9. My dad had issues hooking it up to start and the games really weren't for a 9 year old. We skipped Saturn and I had a ps1 and n64 due to the lack of faith we had in sega after the sega cd. I did get a dreamcast at launch but i think my story holds for most and why the saturn didnt sell
I knew no-one in the 90s who had a Saturn. I had a PS1 and N64 but never saw the need for a Saturn. It was really badly handled in the West and there were next to no adverts for it. It's no wonder it flopped here.
It's a shame as when I got one in the early 2000s I thought it wasn't bad and by quite a few accounts it actually holds up better than its competitors now
I knew loads of people who had one but got rid very quickly once it was clear games were not going to be released for it.
One of the major problems with this story is that we're only hearing Tom Kalinske's side of the Saturn saga. Hearing from Japanese executives would help tremendously and probably balance the coverage somewhat. I must admit that I'm a bit skeptical to the notion that Kalinske had little or no input in Saturn's early days, including the early launch. As always, there's a bit of a Rashomon side to this saga, and nobody ever wants to own up to failure.
I don't think Sega ever really stood a chance in Generation 5 in the West. They were deluged with bad press and negative hype all through the latter half of 1994 until the Saturn launch, their many hardware platforms had given them a bad reputation for dropping consoles far too early, and third-party software developers were far more excited about Sony's new Playstation. I think Western devs were especially looking to Sony as an escape from the draconian business practices of Sega and Nintendo, and those bridges had been pretty well burned during Generation 4.
Sony, of course, did nearly everything right. They understood the need for successful relations with software publishers and retailers, their hardware was very effective at producing 3D graphics, and they were masters of hype. They knew how to sell to the public and how to overhype technology most users couldn't possibly understand. We're talking "500K, 360K polygons" and "T-Rex demo" stuff. And don't forget all that massive hype for Playstation 2, like the claim it would render 88 million polygons/second, or that the US government might ban its sale in the US because it technically qualified as a "super computer." I think my favorite story was the one where Saddam Hussein wanted to steal the PS2 for use in his secret weapons programs. That was a real hoot.
Saturn, meanwhile, got hit with an absolutely fatal reputation for 3D graphics that haunt it to this day. It's almost like a zombie chant, "Can't Doo Three Dee...Can't Doo Three Dee..." Much of this was their fault in the early titles like Virtua Fighter and Daytona USA, and the early US launch once again deserves a slap upside the head. But Sega did dramatically improve the software, and the arrival of Virtua Fighter 2, Sega Rally, Virtua Cop and Panzer Dragoon Zwei should have buried that mantra forever. Unfortunately, most gamers stopped paying attention and already tuned out. Many were already on Sony's bandwagon. Most were waiting for Nintendo 64 to arrive.
In the end, the videogame business has always been driven by hits, and Sega, for whatever reasons, could never generate those hits. Virtua Fighter was huge in Japan, but barely registered in the States. And Saturn was missing the two key elements that made Genesis a success: Sonic and Sports, specifically American Football. There's no excuse for dropping the ball on that. What the hell happened to the Sega Sports brand? Why was Sonic Xtreme such a wreck? For that, we can absolutely blame Kalinske. And nobody anticipated the public souring on 2D and arcade videogames as quickly as they did.
Part of me wonders if Kalinske was quietly hoping that Saturn would fail and die a very quick death, leaving him in position to boast, "I told you so" and then push for a new console that could launch in 1996 against Nintendo. He never did like the Hitachi hardware design and always pushed for alternatives, most famously the Silicon Graphics chipset that became the Nintendo 64. He seemed to drag his heels, treat Saturn like an odd luxury product, shipped software in those ghastly plastic coffins, replaced the brilliant JP controller with that US monstrosity. Heck, even the US Saturn looks terrible with its cheap black color and balloon font logo. The JP Saturn looks so much better, it's not even funny--and why didn't we get the eggshell white Model 2 Saturn? That puppy looks gorgeous.
Again, no Sonic. No sports. Playstation launched with excellent football and hockey games, and a solid basketball game soon followed. All the good Saturn sports titles were from Japan. From the US side, we got...ugh, NHL All-Star Hockey, possibly the worst hockey videogame of all time. And no basketball. And no freakin' football. What the hell?!
Oh, well, water under the bridge. Today, Saturn is an all-time classic games console. But in the '90s in the USA? It was a bit frustrating to live through.
Silicon Graphics wanted something like $150 for their chipset, per unit, they proposed for the Saturn.
You then add the cost of a CD Drive, Ram, custom soundchip etc and Saturn would of been even more expensive than the Playstation, than it already was.
Sega's Japanese executives don't really like giving interviews about things like this. All we have is the American and European perspectives on this. Might have to just it with a teeny grain of salt if you will.
Btw I know your comment is over a year old, but I still felt the need to say something regardless.
Check out the story behind Sonic X. Sega of Japan seems to have been dicks... Such big dicks in fact that they sunk the console thanks to it.
@@G.L.999 regarding that 1st part, if so, they refuse to say the truth or even own up their mistakes. Thus why we'll never hear from SoJ about the whole problem. I won't be surprised if Console Wars never got published in Japanese to the point the old executives would even knew the book exists...
@@christiandacanay3086 It probably wasn't published over there. Which is why I said we should take with a teeny grain of salt; as well as some scepticism.
I liked the saturn.... Such a shame how sega just ran its business :(..... Great vid kim.. Loved it x
Always a delight to watch your videos, even if the topic is quite sad !
It's kind of "fun" to see that so many years later, Sony did another "e3 95" when then announced the PS4 and its price, just after the shitstorm of the Xbox One reveal...
On top of that, the PS4 reveal did more than the good price reveal- a LOT of stuff that the Xbox One failed to give, making the players really happy OVER 9000. So technically, Xbox One did a Saturn... and blew up in their faces. XD
Glad to see this video again. One of my favorites from you.
Saturn was brought forward early in the USA as Sega knew due to the Saturn being the most expensive console to manufacture out of 3DO,Saturn and PlayStation, they couldn't bring the launch price down to meet Sony, so they wanted to launch first and gain a head start.
What the launch did was alienate retailers and publishers.
Publishers had no games ready for launch, so Saturn launched with 3 Sega games, third parties felt Sega wanted all the launch software revenue for themselves
Great video. I was a Saturn owner and this was a superb insight into the era. I still loved my satyrn even though it began to slip away. When we lost tomb raider 2 to the ps1, i knew it was all over !
I was born on September 7th 1995 and was due on the 2nd... that's so weird. I missed Sega by a few days.
Weird to look back on, this period, because I think back to living it and whilst still being a SEGA boy, something in the back of my mind was telling me they were f'cking up. The Saturn was a great console, but it didn't matter. It was still seen as a toy, while the Playstation was sold as a lifestyle accessory.
I liked the "Game over yeah" at the end.
Best game over screen ever
Dual processing had been seen in Sega consoles before Kim, both Block Out and F-22 Interceptor on the Megs Drive used the systems 68000 and Z80 chips to handle the maths for the polygon 3D.
The Mega CD 68000 CPU was used in parallel with the MD 68000
The Atari Jaguar used the 68000 to run.A.I routines, Object Processor, Blitter,Tom and Jerry chips, in it's flagship titles
The 32X probably split some of their market share away from the Saturn as well. So sad.
Did it, though? 665K worldwide isn't exactly a huge debt in the big thing. People were just tired of Sega's shit.
I always wonder what would have happened if the Saturn had been held back until Christmas 1995, and then launched with Virtua Fighter 2, Sega Rally, and Virtua Cop. That would have given the 32X a good run and the Saturn a really special launch.
I loved this story iv heard this story countless times, dear you told it in the only way you know how With a bullet to the point, i love your work.
@Diabeto Kills what is my Diabetic friend?
Don’t agree that the Saturn port was “virtually indistinguishable from the arcade” it’s clearly inferior, and so rife with bugs that Sega had to release an update to the game. Fans were quite disappointed with it at launch.
They fumbled it hard with the Saturn. It was such a good console.
such a good channel, thanks kim
Another great video Kim.
Brought back some good memories. I actually chose the Saturn over the PlayStation being a die hard Sega fan when I was young. To this day I've never bought a new PlayStation console (I do own a PS1, PS2,PS3 and a PSP now though)
I don't play as much as I used to but do enjoy watching yours and many other retro gaming TH-cam channels. The 16bit Sega days will never be beaten in my eyes, the best time to be gaming and I got to be a kid through it all! Sega til I die! :)
Never going to happen but I keep hoping for Sega to return to the hardware game (maybe not a console but to partner up for peripherals at least). The model 2 controller is still the best 2D-controller ever made imho (amazing D-pads) and the 3D controller was super comfortable and to this day idk why not more controllers use the hollowed out globe stick. They owned the arcades. Not sure if they still do as there never were any near me.
I got to choose between a Saturn or PS as a kid (had played both at friend's houses). Picked the Saturn, never in doubt, and to this day feel I made the right decision 100%. Only years later I found out why the Saturn failed so bad... Because Sega. Never saw a single commercial here in Scandinavia. Also personally don't like RPG's but that's where the casuals are.
That Sonic music in the intro is perfect.
God Tier TH-cam
I remember in 1995, opting for the Saturn as my 32 bit system due to me being a Mega Drive owner! It makes as much sense as an SNES owner waiting for the N64! However, I had to switch to PlayStation in 1998 due to the Saturn having almost completely died off! I think if the Saturn had just been a consolized model 2 (Sega should’ve foreseen that 3D was the future, I hear their own Virtua Fighter is what influenced Sony to focus on 3D for the PlayStation!) and had Mega Drive backwards compatibility, it might have fared better.
Clearly Sony read their Sun Tzu vis a vis the Saturn launch: "Never interrupt your adversary while he is making a mistake."
you mean napoleon
Another excellent video! I really love your channel. I was dumb and jumped on the Sony bandwagon. I loved the PlayStation but now I look back and see all the amazing Sega games I missed out on.
20million pound marketing for you.
The Saturn had three fundamental flaws:
First, it wasn't able to do arcade perfect visuals even at launch. That should have clued Sega in to the fact that this wasn't good enough hardware.
Second, price.
Third, weird marketing in the US and Europe. I remember as a kid having no idea what was going on with Saturn commercials. I don't think I ever saw something so weird again till early PS3 commercials.
The Japanese Sega team killed Sega because of honour and not admitting Americans made Sega popular.
So sad the Saturn didn't do better than it did. One of my favourite consoles by far.
Too complicated to program for. No transparency effects. Although it was powerful in some areas it lacked basic features that the PS and N64 got right.
Sony nailed it right out of the block. SEGA floundered.
Yeah, for me it's a dead heat between the Saturn and the SNES as far as favorite retro consoles go (the PS2 being close behind).
Great system ruined on the back of stupid execs. Never had a shot.
again, very nice journalism Kim, thanks :D
No!!! Bring back the old music!!! (still great vid though)
What did people of the UK think of the 32X at the time since Sega was more popular over there!?
Saturn went with Quads to try and avoid the polygon warping found on Playstation titles.
Back then when I was 8 years old, even my parents who knew nothing about video games knew it was smarter to wait for the PlayStation.
Thanks Kim, great video as always. I never understood why Sega didn't do a true arcade console to play all their arcade games from the AM2 ones right up to Model 3 games.
I certainly would but be for all those amazing games and what if they could network for multiplayer online so people could playing Daytona and Virtua Racing... Oh boy 🏁😁👍
Sounds like your talking about the Dreamcast, unfortunately all the Sony zealots would rather watch pretty graphics other than actually "play" a game. Ironic that the PLAYstation has less PLAYability than both Sega and Nintendo's efforts, just goes to show the power of marketing.
Because that worked SO well for SNK.
@@jesuszamora6949 overpriced. Let's face it if you could afford it you'd have loved a Neo Geo.
@@MGForums That's kinda the point. Making a console a straight-up arcade board would make it prohibitively expensive for most people.
@@jesuszamora6949 It wasn't the price of the console that dissuaded me but the cartridges. Although, now that I think about it, Sega 16-bit systems games we're around £50 so if I was any good at saving it would have been possible. I'd have had a smaller games collection though. I'm not sure if a wider selection of games would have been available had more people purchased the Neo Geo. £100 a game was a LOT of money back then.
Kim Justice Sega related content? Yeaaaaah !!!
While an ex roomie gave me his Dreamcast to make up for late rent, I refused to buy anything Sega made after the Saturn. Nothing more disappointing than buying a console only to see it go tits up less than a few years later. I also used to beta test for the Genesis/Megadrive, so I felt dumped on thrice over.
I wasn't going to buy a PS1, and then I played Tenchu Stealth Assassin and I had to get one.
Good taste! Tenchu FTW!
If I could rewrite history I'd have turned the SVP into the 32X there by not wasting the chips for one cart and producing cheaper carts to plug into it, 9 months could have helped promotion but really the 32X itself was too expensive to make much like the Saturn. Tom was good for 16-bit but terrible for 32-bit, while Bernie was just an idiot with the SS IE. "Don't do the things the platform does well, do more of what it's bad at.". O_o???
Still better communication between east & west could have helped, seemed like none. True there is nothing good about cutting everyone's timetable shorter. :P Certainly the bigger story compared to the last crop before them, who remembers the launch of CD-i, 3DO, or Jaguar these days? The only major flaw often forgotten about Playstation1 was it didn't have analog joysticks which turned out to be key requirement for good 3D game control, making the PS Classic design all the more confusing, not a lot of nostalgia for poorly controlled 3D games.
The music selection in this video brings nostalgic tears to my eyes. :)
Have you heard of recent sega leaked documents?
I got one at launch with virtua fighter and Daytona.
My mega drive 32x cd was in its way out so the Saturn being a Sega fan was the logical choice with no regrets I did get the psx but I didn’t find it better just a different choice of game, but the Dreamcast was my favourite and still is.
Easy to burn games for after that died.
Pretty sure Saturn initially had one 32 bit Hitachi chip then they saw what Sony were doing, panicked and added the second to beef up it's 3d capabilities.
Brilliant video Kim! Thank you.
This is mostly a good summation of what happened, and I like the video. You do make one significant mistake that you repeat several times early in the video: Virtua Fighter for 32X released in October 1995, not at launch in 1994. It was actually the last 32X game made by Sega of Japan; they had mostly abandoned the system several months prior, but Virtua Fighter was important enough to get a game. Similarly, Virtua Fighter 2 would get a Genesis port in 1996, even though otherwise Sega of Japan had abandoned the Genesis back in mid '95 at the same time as the 32X. The 32X launch titles were Star Wars Arcade, Doom, and Space Harrier, with Virtua Racing Deluxe being the other release in '94 in Japan. Virtua Fighter for Saturn released too late to have any impact on the 32X, that's why it didn't help. Good video otherwise, though.
Pitty Sega shot themselves in the foot. Let's hope Sega make a new console soon with Sega games galore!
They're supposedly considering it, it's a competitive market right now and Sega aren't the first party developers they used to be so it would be hard going, but supposedly Tommy Tallarico owns the rights to Intellivision and is planning to come out with a new console soon, plus Sega's making a Mega Drive Mini so they are sorta getting into the hardware business either way, who knows what could happen.
excellent doc,well worth a rewatch.
Great video as usual!
It should also be pointed out that after the first year of the PlayStation Sony fired all the North American staff that helped make it a success. Strange, don't you think?
Half of them became sleeper agents
Dual processing hadn't been seen in consoles before? 🤔
Errm, the 68000 and Z80 processors were used in the Mega Drive to help with the Maths on 3D titles such as F-22 and Block Out.
The Mega CD used both the MD and MCD 68000 processors in parallel..
I always click like before I even watch yer vids. Bloody good as always :)
Best Sega Game on the Saturn was Fighters Mega Mix which is truly the craziest fishing game ever
Sega, after beating Nintendo at your home country at the cost of everything else: Nintendo... what did you get?
You're saying SOA was behind the 32X? Uh, no. Kalinske never wanted to bring that thing over, but they were stuck with it. It never really had a chance. Then when Nakiyama sabotaged the saturn launch, that was the last nail.
Not entirely. Nakayama wanted to make a 32-bit cartridge console, but the SoA team thought it was a horrible idea to bring something that wasn't a substantial upgrade over to the Genesis. They basically wanted to make a SuperGrafx.
Gaming Historian has a wonderful little video on the subject.
th-cam.com/video/sjilAAhp8NI/w-d-xo.html
The 32X was not the BEST idea, but if Sega hadn't pushed the Saturn so soon, it would have had a chance. Conversely, could you imagine Sega releasing a 32-bit stand-alone cart console, THEN put out the Saturn?
excellent and informative video as usual Kim! Which audio was taken out of the original upload?
I think it was the godfather theme at the end.
I thought it was well known that the 32X version of Virtua fighter (given the hardware) was way more impressive then the Saturn version. A locked 30 fps framerate and better controls at the cost of not even that much polygons. There's a reason Sega released VF remix for the Saturn...
Awesome!! Love all your Sega content man, such great content
Nice to see this vid again! :)
Sega have IPs of gold known worldwide even now and they have so little imagination of how to capitalise on them, its frustrating to watch. Off the top of my head i would have moved into the mobile market with original games based on classics not just the original games (made a fair few bucks for big N). Id license 3rd party smaller companies to work on download budget titles of franchises to keep the names ticking over, smaller games and demanded quality from the many quality small companies who have produced great games on a budget who would love to work on a Sega IP. I think a 2D style old school Zelda Golden Axe adventure, A Space Harrier bejeweled style game with its classic Icons is so easy, An outrun endless runner type game. Its easy just think Sega FFS. And im not even a big Sega fan, great video as always.
I agree with your points, also Sega have already done a Legend of Zelda style Golden Axe game. It’s called Golden Axe Warrior and was released on the Master System. You can obviously download a ROM, or it’s been rereleased on the Sega Mega Drive/Genesis Ultimate Collection on the Xbox 360/PS3.
32X was intended to be the low cost machine American stores like Target, K-Mart,Seers etc could stock, Sega America had hoped to get it out at retail for $100, but that was impossible
I traded in my Genesis, Sega CD and 32X at Funcoland on the day the Playstation launched.... and bought a Sega Saturn :) They were already giving away 2 free games in addition to Virtua Fighter at that point.
6 former Sega board of directors don't like this video.
I'm so happy to see you releasing so much content lately! I have a youtube channel currently, which has no content yet but I will be making some soon! I would like to thank you, Kim for being one of the people who has inspired me to do so! I will provide you with a link to my channel once I get it up and upload my 1st video!!! :) I hope you're having a great day!
Am I right in thinking that the opening soundtrack is from a Sonic game? I forget which one but I'm definitely sure it's from one of the early Genesis Sonic games.
First time watching... love it.. got yourself another subscriber xx
Launching without a good 3d Sonic game was another colossal mistake in the West.
Great watch
Saturn was planned in 2 models, Jupiter an entry level cartridge machine,with planned CD add on with added Ram and Saturn, the high end CD version, but SOJ canned Jupiter as they realised they'd be selling consumers inferior versions of Saturn games at higher prices, via Jupiter cartridges