@nivaldowesley666 Absolutely! Correct!George and Marv Wolfman! Are still being underappreciated and robbed financially! From that incredible Epic run! Just think of Teen Titans Go as an example! SMH
As I get older, i think about things , that as a younger man, i would never admit, but now that I'm old, George Perez's , Susan Richards... zowie! I preferred a poster of her than Cheryl Tiegs, don't tell anyone.
The Lee and Kirby Silver Surfer graphic novel was a masterpiece. It’s a shame that it hasn’t been reprinted. I hope they do a gallery edition when they sort the legal issues out
This is why Stan Lee and Jack Kirby were such an incredible team. Like Lennon and McCartney, one was usually able to bring out the best in the other: harmony through discord produces beautiful works.
The 2 part story arc by Wein/Perez with the FF and Impossible Man vs Klaw and Molecule Man were my first FF comics bought off of the spinner rack when I was 8 years old...I must of read those issues a hundred times.
Great essay! I started reading FF with 171 and go a lot of back issues from the 150’s up. This was my favorite era to be honest. Joe Sinnott is the true master of the art but Perez and Pollard really were my favorite artists for him to ink. 200 still feels like an epic story that I go back to over and over. Thank you!
I met Joe Sinnott at a comic convention in Syracuse in the 80s, when he drew a sketch of Dr. Doom for me, a sketch of Sue Richards for my mother, and a sketch of Medusa for my sister. He signed my #200! Very gracious man.
Wow - your video appeared surprisingly on my Home page this morning, and I am so glad it did. Almost like XMas arrived a week early. For the FF fans that first stumbled across this excellent book for the first time in the seventies, these stories were the launchpad to the wonderous stories of the sixties. Having both Big John and George Perez drawing a considerable amount in this series provided a more updated version of these characters. Having Joe Sinnott inking aided in the transition from the King's masterpieces. Thanks for your efforts on your video.
Nice work! Looking forward to your 80’s FF essay. I remember the whole Byrne era well, particularly how Sue was depicted as being the most powerful member of the FF in her fight with Doom, and (much less importantly) the “Wendy’s Friends” bit.
Wow, don't know how this video ended up in my feed, but I'm glad it did! I got into comics in the mid-70s, and yeah FF was a huge part of that. I came in right around the transition from Buckler to Perez, with Salem's Seven becoming a favorite baddie team for me. This was a wonderful trip to the beginnings of my affection for comics, so thank you! Liked and subscribed!
Love this video I'm doing a deep dive on your channel after seeing the love hardwork, and knowledge you've put into this. First class all the way, thank you for putting this out there. I am a huge fan of rich buckled and Ross andru I didn't realize how amazing they were when I was younger.
Nice work - glad to have found your channel! Man, I can remember buying that issue against Salem's Seven from the quarter bins in the mid-80s! I loved scouring the Marvel Universe issues for new characters to find, and those Salem's Seven designs really stuck out!
About march 8th or so of 1970, Lee both got the package of art for the ff from Kirby, followed by his phone call that it was his last. Buscema thought, without him, marvel would close shop. Romita thought, that at the least, Thor and the ff, would be canceled, and was shocked when lee told him he was going to do the book, after Steranko turned the job down.
#116 by Goodwin is one of my favorite post-Kirby FF issues, and it's far better than the preceding issue introducing the Overmind. Goodwin, one of the most underappeciated writers, did a great salvage job on the storyline. The Salem's Seven story by Len Wein and Perez is also excellent.
I know some of the writers didn’t stay with the book long enough, but I enjoyed the 70s Fantastic Four issues! Rich Buckler, John Buscema, George Perez and John Byrne all did amazing work! 💙👍🏼💙
I love this era of Marvel, and FF, grew up on that in the late 70s, and early 80s (the publication of these comics happened about 4-5 years later in my country, Sweden, than in the US, and publishing here didn't follow exactly the American order of publication, stories were thrown around in a weird time-line). The books were magic, the artwork and stories, and it was all just wow, like you mention in the beginning, some comics just get you hooked as a kid, and open up these worlds. My favorite artists will remain always; Rich Buckler and John Buscema. However, Joe Sinnott cannot be denied, his work is always immaculate. The Namor Stories with Magneto, illustrated by John Romita are so wonderful. What an artist! (Yeah Nixon was featured a lot, lol). John Byrne and Joe Sinnott as artists together (in the Galactus, Skrulls, Terrax and Sphinx issues) are so great. Thank you for this video. Great work.
My introduction to marvel as a kid were the mid 80s around the 25th anniversary and issue 300. Reading back issues was an expensive hobby back then but thankfully recent years have made online editions very affordable. I've recently read all 416 issues of volume 1. Looking forward to the 80s summary. As much as the Thing is my favourite, the She Hulk era was pretty sweet.
I get that it's hard to follow up Lee and Kirby at their best... but for me the 70s FF was just as good. I love that era. (Only the All-New X-Men could top it, imo.) Buscema, Buckler, Perez, Pollard, Byrne... incredible art all the way through.
Johnny getting thrown over by Crystal for Quicksilver was brutal enough, but to see him smiling as the newlyweds depart for their honeymoon was out of character and a missed opportunity for pathos. The "happy ending" was poor writing. Johnny would've been heartbroken for some time after.
You beat me to saying that! At the time, i was still recovering from the end of a hopeless relationship, and when i read that issue, thought that it greatly needed another page, showing johnny weeping in his sister or bens arms from his hurt and loss. his smiling and unconcern was so phony, cause he was long shown to be bonkers over her from ff45 onwards.
I first met Marvel, and the FF in the 1970's (issue, I think, 167, the Thing AND the Hulk vs. the FF on the top of the St. Louis Arch). I fell in love with them that very first issue, and STILL consider it the best version of the FF.
George Perez would be the easy answer for best FF artist of the 70s but I'm going to go with the highly underrated Keith Pollard. Fantastic Four #185 is one of the first FF comics I ever read and it traumatized me as a kid because the heroes lost in a great cliffhanger.
Stan Lee relied a lot on Jack Kirby's direction for creating and plotting comics but Kirby was only doing two comics by the end of the 60s, and Lee was writing other comics without him at the time. However, the "Thor" and "Fantastic Four" comics were important flagstone pieces of the company, and somebody was needed to replace Kirby who could draw comics at breakneck speed and help to create storylines. Lee was capable of scripting comics on his own though, with the right artists. He had already done the "Silver Surfer" with John Buscema. Buscema had a strong, realistic style with which he at least tried to be as dynamic and stunning as Kirby, but Joe Sinnott's inking kept the traditional feel on the comics Kirby had done alive, although other inkers did well over Kirby's drawing. Neal Adams's drawing on two "Thor" issues also suited them well with Sinnott inking them. Vince Collecta did ink John Buscema for one issue of "Thor" before Kirby's last issue of the comic book. Rich Buckler fused Kirby's and Buscema's styles to create a realistic and powerful effect, that again owed just as much to Sinnott. On other comics though, with different inkers, Buckler also revealed the influence of Steranko and Adams. Stan Lee did quite well I think doing the writing and plotting on the two comics that Kirby left, creating the Overmind character, but it can't be known how much Buscema contributed to creating the storylines. I first saw Perez's stuff on the "Inhumans" and wasn't really impressed, but once again, with Joe Sinnott inking his stuff on the "Fantastic Four", it looked very good, even though it lacked the realism and power of Buscema and Buckler.
Born in 1960 I started reading comics as soon as I could read. I still remember when they raised the issue price from 10 cents to 12 cents - made me upset since my 25c allowance could only by 1 instead of 2 a week. Most of what I got was Superman books . I do remember my first marvel books as being Fantastic Four. This was about the time of Franklin’s birth. Strange metal home in the middle of nowhere. I remember that.
My understanding is that Kirby finished that Janus/Nega-Man story, but that Stan either didn't like it or held it back to deploy later, with changes in the story. I think it took less time for Jack to pencil 20 pages than to decide not to; often he'd pencil more than he needed and take unused segments and insert them in other comics. FF 108 was released the same month as Forever People # 1 and New Gods # 1, which may have been deliberate, from what I've read, though I'm willing to be corrected on this. That same month, December 1970, Marvel released multiple comics with Kirby reprints, including the double-sized _Special Marvel Edition_ with Thor and _Fear_ with monster reprints. Also on sale that month, more recycled Kirby in _Creatures on the Loose_ , _Where Monsters Dwell_ , _Where Creatures Roam_ and a _SHIELD_ giant. Marvel's response to Kirby's new concepts at DC was to flood the market with more Kirby at Marvel.
By shelfing what would have been ff 102, Lee solved two problems. The first, using the continued subby story, to hopefully getting the majority of the readership to still buy, even if by Romita. The second, to have a new mostly Kirby book on the stands the month new gods and forever people came out
I like this era a lot, especially the issues that bring back the Frightful Four with a new member -- THE BRUTE -- who is a counter-earth version of Reed. I like it how they got rid of the real Reed and the fake Reed posed as a member of the Fantastic Four. This era also saw the return of THE MOLECULE MAN which was awesome.
I actually enjoyed all the artists that lend their talent to the FF back in the 70s. My only issue was I felt Marvel drop the ball on Franklin Richards. There so much potential in developing this young character. It was as if the writers were afraid or reluctant to do anything with him. Franklin losing is powers was a major bummer. My favorite artist after Kirby was Rich Buckler but all were very good. Joe Sinnott inks was fantastic.
I could have sworn I read that Johnny was replaced by HERBIE in the cartoon because the network was afraid of having a human character that burst into flames fearing that children would try setting themselves on fire!
As someone who’s read all the FF comics up to the end of the Byrne run recently, I have to say that FF was very consistent and solid up until the Byrne run where things really changed. I call it the era where FF grew up.
I thought you would probably mention the dump Sue campaign that happened in the 70s. Also they got a power upgrade in the 70s somehow people complained about them taking so many beatings so they flew through another cosmic storm or something I can't remember the story but all of them got a power boost.
I love that you give Joe Sinnot his due. He made so many comics look great. You can look at the pencillers without Sinnot on them and see the difference. Sadly inkers don’t get their due.
I started collecting comics at the age of 9 with FF 149, so the issues between 103 and 200 are really the sweet spot in my FF collection. While the stories in this range did not introduce the kinds of characters that Lee/Kirby did (issues 36 through 52 contain an unbelievable number of characters that are important to this day), I feel the stories age better because the 1960s were such different times to what we now live in. I'm not referring to the differences in technology, but rather the tone. The 1960s FF comics were very sexist compared to those in the 1970s and beyond.
Looking back, interesting how four people can go to space in the same ship, get exposed by the same cosmic rays but come back to earth with totally different powers.
Love to see you cover Rom Spaceknight in three videos. As well as Richard rider Nova #1-#25, MTIO Annual #3. Powerman/IF#73, Hulk #296 MTIO #99, X-Men #187 & #188 Dire Wraiths. Avengers & FF Dire Wraiths.
The Thing/Hulk team up was a fun story that led to the Thing losing his powers during a fight on the St Louis Gateway Arch. This eventually led to the creation of the Thing suit.
That's the one ((( I ))) started Marvel with. I especially enjoyed the friendly "argument" of the writers\editors as Sue forms an invisible "land bridge" to get from the lake to solid ground. That goofy exchange is what brought me into the FF\Marvel. If the creators could engage in good-natured "ribbing" in the middle of the action, that told me the people in charge were a fun-loving group of guys.
I couldn't get into the Fantastic Four until John Byrne (and then going back and reading the Kirby issues, naturally). Everything in between can be passed.
I started reading the FF with #204, and I remember not only seeing the FF cartoon with Herbie, but Byrne's explanation for why the Human Torch wasn't in the cartoon. But I was really more of a DC guy than a Marvel fan, and didn't keep with the series for too long.
I'm surprised you didn't mention the period where Medusa took Sue's place on the team. She seemed a lot more useful in a fight than Sue had up to that point. My favorite FF artists from the '70s are John Buscema and George Perez. FF 197, where Reed regains his powers and fights the Red Ghost in space, is possibly my favorite FF issue of all time. FF 197-200 is a story I'd recommend, along with the Arkon storyline from 1975, FF 155-157, the Gorr/Galactus/Counter-Earth storyline, the Frightful Four/Brute storyline beginning in 177, and the issue where Galactus battles the Sphinx.
I was a DC kid in the ‘60’s and found most Marvels full of schlocky dialog not to my taste ( except their early ‘60’s wonderful monster comics). But the Fantastic Four was something else. It was in my top 4 of eagerly anticipated issues ( the others- Green Lantern, Adventure, and the Gold Key Tarzans) It had spell-binding stories and astonishing art. And those 72 page giants even had a new story in them! For a time, it was The World’s Greatest Comics Magazine.
I want to answer your viewer question, but you got the highlights. I recommend the first 7 issues of MTIO for Ben's fans, though he is too mean in the opening scene of #1. His scenes with the character who became Aquarian- Wundarr- are different for him, very good.
One of my earliest memories of comics collecting was an FF vs. Annihulus book from 1976. I think the cover price was either 20 or 25 cents. I picked up their title on occasion, but I remember thinking the book was kind of corny, even for a 7-year old. By '78, I was already engrossed with X-Men and how much more mature those books were compared to most other Marvel titles. But once Byrne came aboard FF by '79, I was drawn in at that point by his visuals.
I started reading comics in the first quarter of 1973 with Avengers 109. Best writing, art, storylines, etc. era ever. The Avengers/Defenders war crossover was my favorite storyline, Note that Franklin Richards and his powers were a side plot that was only interesting because of guest stars and crossovers.
Those Lee/Kirby stories are amazing, but I'm quite fond of some of the stuff from 70s Fantastic Four -- Johnny's red suit, Sue temporarily being replaced by Medusa, Thundra's frequent appearances --- and, of course, Perez!!! Len Wein and George Perez produced some memorable stories. The Wolfman/Pollard era was decent, but Doug Moench was not well-suited for writing FF stories -- so glad Byrne took over.
In my opinion the best marvel artists of all time are Jack Kirby , Jim Steranko , Steve Ditko , John Romita , Bob Layton ,Barry Windsor - Smith , Paul Gulacy e George Perez . Art finalists : Joe Sinnot , Frank Giacoya , Jack Abel and Chic Stone .
The '70s FFs were, er, fantastic, as were the '60s and the '80s. The DeFalco/Ryan issues in the '90s were brilliant. Perez's Thing was too good to be true, further set in orange brick by Marvel Two-In-One. The FF cartoon, with storyboards by Jack Kirby, was pretty good for its time. The Fantastic Five miniseries was also as good as it gets. Marvel Comics dug its own grave with its choices after Stan Lee and Jack Kirby and their worthy progeny were out of the way. Fault Dismally has misrepresented their legacy. I'll stick to my back issues and the early films.
Even I used to love Thing in the 70&80s!😂 He qas just so relatable overall & they NEVER tried making him into something he wasn't but in the 90s somebody at Marvel must've either really LOVED or HATED his Character because he's been a joke ever since, Reed became a madman thinking his intelligence makes him better then everyone else, Susan started getting hit on by heroes & villains while being ignored by Reed & Johnny went from being an annoying forever teenage minded carefree punk to the most brave & heroic person then the rest of them combined! They did great with Franklin in the 90& early 2000s now they're acting like they don't know what to do with him & Valeria SUCKS as much as her Father does! NOBODY cares about her!😂💯📠
9:54 I bought that issue when it came out. I hated the Herbie the robot character in the tv show, but thought the explanation in the book was pretty funny
I have to admit by the late 70s I really didn’t miss Kirby leaving Marvel. I think he was pretty much spent. His art, while relatively great in the 60s, was by the late 70s looking rather quaint and cartoonish. Compared to Perez or Byrne or Pollard, it looks antiquated. Kirby was one of the giants no doubt but by 1978 he was done. I liked the Frightful Four stories from the 70’s.
Sinnott is actually the worst thing that happens, Pollard, Perez, and even Byrne have their art destroyed. This happens on other books later under Tom Palmer. While both men are good artists, they would basically ignore the pencils, so they may as well have cut out the middle man and drawn it themselves. Pollard's art in Amazing Spider-Man with Marv Wolfman writing is still my all time Spidey run.
Cadence Communications were done with Kirby by 1980, he demanded things, he expected RESPECT for his past work and they HATED THAT, the rat bastards, meanwhile Stan was trying to be a big shot in LA, going to the Playboy mansion and working on getting the teevee shows made, all of which but Hulk were UNWATCHABLE
the mistakes , I think, was the whole Beast/Evil Reed Richards Negative Zone storyline it went way too long and the Franklin Richards stuff..............goes NOWHERE, I think because they were afraid to have him be an omnipotent character, something Byrne and Claremont were NOT afraid of with Phoenix
The seventies was when Romita and Buscema put Marvel characters on model, giving them a look that the company had to emulate (Kirby and Ditko relied upon hairstyle only to differentiate characters). This lasted until Ron Frenz dumped the Romita Peter Parker look and Byrne turned Reed Richards into Professor Kelp. In that era, artists found ways to stylize the Thing. Buscema made the rocks small and gave him a bottom lip. Perez had him look like a posable action figure. Buckler, after breaking free of Buscema, rendered the Thing as a living broken sidewalk charging at the reader.
I have every issue of the Fantastic Four published between 1970-1979, and they're a bit of a mixed bag. Roy Thomas and Gerry Conway wrote around 60 issues of the FF during the early and mid 70s, and they're often too goofy for their own good, filled with stereotypical Silver Age dialogue and concepts. What I don't understand is how Roy could be so dramatic on titles like The Incredible Hulk, Submariner, and Doctor Strange, but never took things seriously on FF. So there's plenty of wisecracks and facetious captions during his FF run, and it's a bit too much even for a Bronze Age comic book. Gerry is a bit of a more mature writer than Roy is, but his run is only marginally better than what Thomas brought to the title. Then Len Wein comes in after Gerry, and what a difference! Grant Morrison has said on numerous occassions that Len Wein is his favorite comic book writer, and it's not hard to see why. His writing is so more mature than someone like a Roy Thomas or Marv Wolfman, and every issue of his FF is an instant classic. Len's issues also reflect the more off-beat, fantastical nature of some of the FF's classic stories, as a quest for their kidnapped son and nanny lead them to New Salem, an eerie, isolated village in the mountains...all wrapped up with one of Wein's trademark ironic endings. I can honestly say I have never read a Len Wein comic that wasn't nothing short of genius.
My first issue had a Yellow Gorilla climbing the Baxter Building. On a separate note Rich Buckler is a massively underrated, especially when he's later at DC.
I became disenchanted with Buckler after reading FF 153 a few weeks after reading "Prisoners of the Pharoah," which was reprinted in Giant-Size Avengers 2.
It doesn't matter who was doing the book then because they were all better than the last ten years it has become unreadable and seeing the trailer for the new movie has been disappointing
I must have gotten out of the Fantastic Four by the 1970s. My subscription ran out and I just didn't renew. I stayed with Spider-Man a lot longer but that eventually wore off too. It sucks growing up. Fantastic Four got too stupid. I mean, I could take the Inhumans. Medusa, with her hair was pretty cool and I liked the romance between Johnny and Crystal but that slobbering dog was just too much. Also, Galactus was just too big. I mean a thing that eats planets? What the ever-lovin' eff? And Silver Surfer was a stupid character to base a whole line of comics on. These stories were too over-the-top for me and that's what made me lose interest.
After Kennedy's hair made it's cameo,it went on to battle the absorbing man,entertain a small stint in the frightful four. Usurp the silver surfer's board , when it attained the power cosmic and became a herald of Galactus. Traveling the limitless spaceways to find it's true love,a rock drifting aimlessly through the ancient abyss, that was floating near another rock. I wanna rock!😂❤🪨
Those George Perez fantastic fours in the 70s made me fall in love with comic books and him as an artist!
same! his teen titans is amazing!
@nivaldowesley666 Absolutely! Correct!George and Marv Wolfman! Are still being underappreciated and robbed financially! From that incredible Epic run! Just think of Teen Titans Go as an example! SMH
I think it was like 167-170, the Hulk team-up leads into ben losing powers and replaced by Luke Cage. Some of the best FF comics ever.
As I get older, i think about things , that as a younger man, i would never admit, but now that I'm old, George Perez's , Susan Richards... zowie! I preferred a poster of her than Cheryl Tiegs, don't tell anyone.
I also love George's brief run on JLA before he made the Teen Titans rule.
The Lee and Kirby Silver Surfer graphic novel was a masterpiece. It’s a shame that it hasn’t been reprinted. I hope they do a gallery edition when they sort the legal issues out
Me, too.
@@chazkhaira6621 The John Byrne one shot silver surfer special is also a Masterpiece!
Great episode! Thanks for giving Ron Wilson some overdue love :)
In his outline for FF#1 Lee wrote the Thing as a character who would often be antagonistic. It was an idea he always loved and one Kirby didn't.
This is why Stan Lee and Jack Kirby were such an incredible team. Like Lennon and McCartney, one was usually able to bring out the best in the other: harmony through discord produces beautiful works.
@Namelbmert well put. That push and pull resulted in stories that reflected the best in both of them.
Grimm and Richards were best friends....Sue used to be Grimm's girlfriend but ended up with Richards. Gotta be some underlying resentment.
I loved these books and John Romita and John Buscema.
The 2 part story arc by Wein/Perez with the FF and Impossible Man vs Klaw and Molecule Man were my first FF comics bought off of the spinner rack when I was 8 years old...I must of read those issues a hundred times.
I ❤ 70's FF
Great essay! I started reading FF with 171 and go a lot of back issues from the 150’s up. This was my favorite era to be honest. Joe Sinnott is the true master of the art but Perez and Pollard really were my favorite artists for him to ink. 200 still feels like an epic story that I go back to over and over. Thank you!
I met Joe Sinnott at a comic convention in Syracuse in the 80s, when he drew a sketch of Dr. Doom for me, a sketch of Sue Richards for my mother, and a sketch of Medusa for my sister. He signed my #200! Very gracious man.
Jack Kirby was hard to beat.
@@rodneymarsden3003 that's why he is still the king! His costume designs alone are Legendary! A true genius! He was!
Wow - your video appeared surprisingly on my Home page this morning, and I am so glad it did. Almost like XMas arrived a week early. For the FF fans that first stumbled across this excellent book for the first time in the seventies, these stories were the launchpad to the wonderous stories of the sixties. Having both Big John and George Perez drawing a considerable amount in this series provided a more updated version of these characters. Having Joe Sinnott inking aided in the transition from the King's masterpieces. Thanks for your efforts on your video.
One of my first comic books was FF # 160 with the Thing from another dimension battling Arkon. I had no idea what I was reading, but I loved it.
Although I love the 60s comics, I really love the 70s comics
Nice work! Looking forward to your 80’s FF essay. I remember the whole Byrne era well, particularly how Sue was depicted as being the most powerful member of the FF in her fight with Doom, and (much less importantly) the “Wendy’s Friends” bit.
Wow, don't know how this video ended up in my feed, but I'm glad it did! I got into comics in the mid-70s, and yeah FF was a huge part of that. I came in right around the transition from Buckler to Perez, with Salem's Seven becoming a favorite baddie team for me. This was a wonderful trip to the beginnings of my affection for comics, so thank you! Liked and subscribed!
Love this video I'm doing a deep dive on your channel after seeing the love hardwork, and knowledge you've put into this. First class all the way, thank you for putting this out there. I am a huge fan of rich buckled and Ross andru I didn't realize how amazing they were when I was younger.
Nice work - glad to have found your channel! Man, I can remember buying that issue against Salem's Seven from the quarter bins in the mid-80s! I loved scouring the Marvel Universe issues for new characters to find, and those Salem's Seven designs really stuck out!
Just discovered this channel. Added you to the small list of comic TH-camrs that actually know what they're talking about.
About march 8th or so of 1970, Lee both got the package of art for the ff from Kirby, followed by his phone call that it was his last. Buscema thought, without him, marvel would close shop. Romita thought, that at the least, Thor and the ff, would be canceled, and was shocked when lee told him he was going to do the book, after Steranko turned the job down.
Informative and great video
#116 by Goodwin is one of my favorite post-Kirby FF issues, and it's far better than the preceding issue introducing the Overmind. Goodwin, one of the most underappeciated writers, did a great salvage job on the storyline. The Salem's Seven story by Len Wein and Perez is also excellent.
I know some of the writers didn’t stay with the book long enough, but I enjoyed the 70s Fantastic Four issues! Rich Buckler, John Buscema, George Perez and John Byrne all did amazing work! 💙👍🏼💙
Great job on this. Looking forward to the next video.
Ben Grimm is Marvel’s greatest character hands down! Nice detailed video.
I love this era of Marvel, and FF, grew up on that in the late 70s, and early 80s (the publication of these comics happened about 4-5 years later in my country, Sweden, than in the US, and publishing here didn't follow exactly the American order of publication, stories were thrown around in a weird time-line). The books were magic, the artwork and stories, and it was all just wow, like you mention in the beginning, some comics just get you hooked as a kid, and open up these worlds. My favorite artists will remain always; Rich Buckler and John Buscema. However, Joe Sinnott cannot be denied, his work is always immaculate. The Namor Stories with Magneto, illustrated by John Romita are so wonderful. What an artist! (Yeah Nixon was featured a lot, lol). John Byrne and Joe Sinnott as artists together (in the Galactus, Skrulls, Terrax and Sphinx issues) are so great. Thank you for this video. Great work.
My introduction to marvel as a kid were the mid 80s around the 25th anniversary and issue 300. Reading back issues was an expensive hobby back then but thankfully recent years have made online editions very affordable. I've recently read all 416 issues of volume 1. Looking forward to the 80s summary. As much as the Thing is my favourite, the She Hulk era was pretty sweet.
I still have a few in the house somewhere. I know that they are yellow 💛. From the last time I saw them.
That was my decade of reading everything from Marvel, and FF was always a favortite.
The Perez era is where i jumped on. It was wild to see HERBIE in Ff , but he's not who you think he is!
I get that it's hard to follow up Lee and Kirby at their best... but for me the 70s FF was just as good. I love that era. (Only the All-New X-Men could top it, imo.) Buscema, Buckler, Perez, Pollard, Byrne... incredible art all the way through.
Jack the King Kirby was really good.
Lee and Kirby's Fantastic Four is what got me hooked on the series in the first place.
Johnny getting thrown over by Crystal for Quicksilver was brutal enough, but to see him smiling as the newlyweds depart for their honeymoon was out of character and a missed opportunity for pathos. The "happy ending" was poor writing. Johnny would've been heartbroken for some time after.
You beat me to saying that! At the time, i was still recovering from the end of a hopeless relationship, and when i read that issue, thought that it greatly needed another page, showing johnny weeping in his sister or bens arms from his hurt and loss. his smiling and unconcern was so phony, cause he was long shown to be bonkers over her from ff45 onwards.
I first met Marvel, and the FF in the 1970's (issue, I think, 167, the Thing AND the Hulk vs. the FF on the top of the St. Louis Arch). I fell in love with them that very first issue, and STILL consider it the best version of the FF.
George Perez would be the easy answer for best FF artist of the 70s but I'm going to go with the highly underrated Keith Pollard. Fantastic Four #185 is one of the first FF comics I ever read and it traumatized me as a kid because the heroes lost in a great cliffhanger.
Jihn byrns time on the fantastic four was the true golden era of that line in my opinion
Stan Lee relied a lot on Jack Kirby's direction for creating and plotting comics but Kirby was only doing two comics by the end of the 60s, and Lee was writing other comics without him at the time. However, the "Thor" and "Fantastic Four" comics were important flagstone pieces of the company, and somebody was needed to replace Kirby who could draw comics at breakneck speed and help to create storylines. Lee was capable of scripting comics on his own though, with the right artists. He had already done the "Silver Surfer" with John Buscema. Buscema had a strong, realistic style with which he at least tried to be as dynamic and stunning as Kirby, but Joe Sinnott's inking kept the traditional feel on the comics Kirby had done alive, although other inkers did well over Kirby's drawing. Neal Adams's drawing on two "Thor" issues also suited them well with Sinnott inking them. Vince Collecta did ink John Buscema for one issue of "Thor" before Kirby's last issue of the comic book. Rich Buckler fused Kirby's and Buscema's styles to create a realistic and powerful effect, that again owed just as much to Sinnott. On other comics though, with different inkers, Buckler also revealed the influence of Steranko and Adams.
Stan Lee did quite well I think doing the writing and plotting on the two comics that Kirby left, creating the Overmind character, but it can't be known how much Buscema contributed to creating the storylines. I first saw Perez's stuff on the "Inhumans" and wasn't really impressed, but once again, with Joe Sinnott inking his stuff on the "Fantastic Four", it looked very good, even though it lacked the realism and power of Buscema and Buckler.
Born in 1960 I started reading comics as soon as I could read. I still remember when they raised the issue price from 10 cents to 12 cents - made me upset since my 25c allowance could only by 1 instead of 2 a week. Most of what I got was Superman books . I do remember my first marvel books as being Fantastic Four. This was about the time of Franklin’s birth. Strange metal home in the middle of nowhere. I remember that.
As herky jerky as the 70s were for the FF, there were some gems 💎 in the dirt ✴️ here as well. The art is some of the most endurung as well.
I was a reader back then. One of my favorites wss when they fought the Molecule Man when he took over Reed Richards.
so good man, thank you
First time watching a video from your channel. I really enjoyed this! Subscribed.
We love The Thing best.
Speaking as someone who was a teenager in the 70s, I'm afraid the highlight of the decade for me was Buscema drawing Medusa in that backless costume!
My understanding is that Kirby finished that Janus/Nega-Man story, but that Stan either didn't like it or held it back to deploy later, with changes in the story. I think it took less time for Jack to pencil 20 pages than to decide not to; often he'd pencil more than he needed and take unused segments and insert them in other comics.
FF 108 was released the same month as Forever People # 1 and New Gods # 1, which may have been deliberate, from what I've read, though I'm willing to be corrected on this. That same month, December 1970, Marvel released multiple comics with Kirby reprints, including the double-sized _Special Marvel Edition_ with Thor and _Fear_ with monster reprints. Also on sale that month, more recycled Kirby in _Creatures on the Loose_ , _Where Monsters Dwell_ , _Where Creatures Roam_ and a _SHIELD_ giant. Marvel's response to Kirby's new concepts at DC was to flood the market with more Kirby at Marvel.
By shelfing what would have been ff 102, Lee solved two problems. The first, using the continued subby story, to hopefully getting the majority of the readership to still buy, even if by Romita. The second, to have a new mostly Kirby book on the stands the month new gods and forever people came out
@@jmen4ever257 Didn't even consider that, but it's a great observation. Thanks.
Great video
I like this era a lot, especially the issues that bring back the Frightful Four with a new member -- THE BRUTE -- who is a counter-earth version of Reed. I like it how they got rid of the real Reed and the fake Reed posed as a member of the Fantastic Four. This era also saw the return of THE MOLECULE MAN which was awesome.
The classic of my childhood was the Skrull-aging-ray/Sphinx/Galactus/Terrax/Spider-Man/Champions story.
I actually enjoyed all the artists that lend their talent to the FF back in the 70s. My only issue was I felt Marvel drop the ball on Franklin Richards. There so much potential in developing this young character. It was as if the writers were afraid or reluctant to do anything with him. Franklin losing is powers was a major bummer. My favorite artist after Kirby was Rich Buckler but all were very good. Joe Sinnott inks was fantastic.
I could have sworn I read that Johnny was replaced by HERBIE in the cartoon because the network was afraid of having a human character that burst into flames fearing that children would try setting themselves on fire!
Just wanted to point out most of this run is collected in the epic collections out right now.
As someone who’s read all the FF comics up to the end of the Byrne run recently, I have to say that FF was very consistent and solid up until the Byrne run where things really changed. I call it the era where FF grew up.
I thought you would probably mention the dump Sue campaign that happened in the 70s. Also they got a power upgrade in the 70s somehow people complained about them taking so many beatings so they flew through another cosmic storm or something I can't remember the story but all of them got a power boost.
I love that you give Joe Sinnot his due. He made so many comics look great. You can look at the pencillers without Sinnot on them and see the difference. Sadly inkers don’t get their due.
I started collecting comics at the age of 9 with FF 149, so the issues between 103 and 200 are really the sweet spot in my FF collection. While the stories in this range did not introduce the kinds of characters that Lee/Kirby did (issues 36 through 52 contain an unbelievable number of characters that are important to this day), I feel the stories age better because the 1960s were such different times to what we now live in. I'm not referring to the differences in technology, but rather the tone. The 1960s FF comics were very sexist compared to those in the 1970s and beyond.
Looking back, interesting how four people can go to space in the same ship, get exposed by the same cosmic rays but come back to earth with totally different powers.
Love to see you cover Rom Spaceknight in three videos. As well as Richard rider Nova #1-#25, MTIO Annual #3. Powerman/IF#73, Hulk #296 MTIO #99, X-Men #187 & #188 Dire Wraiths. Avengers & FF Dire Wraiths.
The Thing/Hulk team up was a fun story that led to the Thing losing his powers during a fight on the St Louis Gateway Arch. This eventually led to the creation of the Thing suit.
That's the one ((( I ))) started Marvel with. I especially enjoyed the friendly "argument" of the writers\editors as Sue forms an invisible "land bridge" to get from the lake to solid ground. That goofy exchange is what brought me into the FF\Marvel. If the creators could engage in good-natured "ribbing" in the middle of the action, that told me the people in charge were a fun-loving group of guys.
I couldn't get into the Fantastic Four until John Byrne (and then going back and reading the Kirby issues, naturally). Everything in between can be passed.
George Perez’s FF era remains my favourite.
I started reading the FF with #204, and I remember not only seeing the FF cartoon with Herbie, but Byrne's explanation for why the Human Torch wasn't in the cartoon. But I was really more of a DC guy than a Marvel fan, and didn't keep with the series for too long.
I'm surprised you didn't mention the period where Medusa took Sue's place on the team. She seemed a lot more useful in a fight than Sue had up to that point. My favorite FF artists from the '70s are John Buscema and George Perez. FF 197, where Reed regains his powers and fights the Red Ghost in space, is possibly my favorite FF issue of all time. FF 197-200 is a story I'd recommend, along with the Arkon storyline from 1975, FF 155-157, the Gorr/Galactus/Counter-Earth storyline, the Frightful Four/Brute storyline beginning in 177, and the issue where Galactus battles the Sphinx.
George Perez ruled the FF 70s, but Keith Pollard did a fine job as well.
As a comic lover, I only dig all the old stuff. 😊 3:43
I was a DC kid in the ‘60’s and found most Marvels full of schlocky dialog not to my taste ( except their early ‘60’s wonderful monster comics). But the Fantastic Four was something else. It was in my top 4 of eagerly anticipated issues ( the others- Green Lantern, Adventure, and the Gold Key Tarzans) It had spell-binding stories and astonishing art. And those 72 page giants even had a new story in them! For a time, it was The World’s Greatest Comics Magazine.
I think that GIant size issue no 4 was very first exposure to the Fantastic Four as well the orginal X-men which is reprinted in that issue.
I want to answer your viewer question, but you got the highlights. I recommend the first 7 issues of MTIO for Ben's fans, though he is too mean in the opening scene of #1. His scenes with the character who became Aquarian- Wundarr- are different for him, very good.
09:02 I need a complete video of this master-piece
One of my earliest memories of comics collecting was an FF vs. Annihulus book from 1976. I think the cover price was either 20 or 25 cents. I picked up their title on occasion, but I remember thinking the book was kind of corny, even for a 7-year old. By '78, I was already engrossed with X-Men and how much more mature those books were compared to most other Marvel titles. But once Byrne came aboard FF by '79, I was drawn in at that point by his visuals.
😮good job
I started reading comics in the first quarter of 1973 with Avengers 109. Best writing, art, storylines, etc. era ever. The Avengers/Defenders war crossover was my favorite storyline, Note that Franklin Richards and his powers were a side plot that was only interesting because of guest stars and crossovers.
John Buscema - he was the BEST !
Those Lee/Kirby stories are amazing, but I'm quite fond of some of the stuff from 70s Fantastic Four -- Johnny's red suit, Sue temporarily being replaced by Medusa, Thundra's frequent appearances --- and, of course, Perez!!! Len Wein and George Perez produced some memorable stories. The Wolfman/Pollard era was decent, but Doug Moench was not well-suited for writing FF stories -- so glad Byrne took over.
In my opinion the best marvel artists of all time are Jack Kirby , Jim Steranko , Steve Ditko , John Romita , Bob Layton ,Barry Windsor - Smith , Paul Gulacy e George Perez . Art finalists : Joe Sinnot , Frank Giacoya , Jack Abel and Chic Stone .
The '70s FFs were, er, fantastic, as were the '60s and the '80s. The DeFalco/Ryan issues in the '90s were brilliant.
Perez's Thing was too good to be true, further set in orange brick by Marvel Two-In-One.
The FF cartoon, with storyboards by Jack Kirby, was pretty good for its time.
The Fantastic Five miniseries was also as good as it gets.
Marvel Comics dug its own grave with its choices after Stan Lee and Jack Kirby and their worthy progeny were out of the way. Fault Dismally has misrepresented their legacy.
I'll stick to my back issues and the early films.
excellent just found your channel new sub here
The Thing will always be my favorite, I hated that everybody in Marvel got written to be stronger except for him (except for the spikey era).
Pretty sure Mephisto wasn't in # 157 of FF. That was from Silver Surfer's own comic.
Interesting thx
Even I used to love Thing in the 70&80s!😂 He qas just so relatable overall & they NEVER tried making him into something he wasn't but in the 90s somebody at Marvel must've either really LOVED or HATED his Character because he's been a joke ever since, Reed became a madman thinking his intelligence makes him better then everyone else, Susan started getting hit on by heroes & villains while being ignored by Reed & Johnny went from being an annoying forever teenage minded carefree punk to the most brave & heroic person then the rest of them combined! They did great with Franklin in the 90& early 2000s now they're acting like they don't know what to do with him & Valeria SUCKS as much as her Father does! NOBODY cares about her!😂💯📠
Sometimes I can't decide if I like John Buscema's or Kirby's work better.
Edit: Also, I LOVED Ron Wilson on Two-In-One.
9:54 I bought that issue when it came out. I hated the Herbie the robot character in the tv show, but thought the explanation in the book was pretty funny
I have to admit by the late 70s I really didn’t miss Kirby leaving Marvel. I think he was pretty much spent. His art, while relatively great in the 60s, was by the late 70s looking rather quaint and cartoonish. Compared to Perez or Byrne or Pollard, it looks antiquated. Kirby was one of the giants no doubt but by 1978 he was done. I liked the Frightful Four stories from the 70’s.
Sinnott is actually the worst thing that happens, Pollard, Perez, and even Byrne have their art destroyed. This happens on other books later under Tom Palmer. While both men are good artists, they would basically ignore the pencils, so they may as well have cut out the middle man and drawn it themselves. Pollard's art in Amazing Spider-Man with Marv Wolfman writing is still my all time Spidey run.
Cadence Communications were done with Kirby by 1980, he demanded things, he expected RESPECT for his past work and they HATED THAT, the rat bastards,
meanwhile Stan was trying to be a big shot in LA, going to the Playboy mansion and working on getting the teevee shows made, all of which but Hulk were UNWATCHABLE
I first bought a Giant Sized FF in the 70's.I thought Medusa was a founding member.🤔😆😆😆
the mistakes , I think, was the whole Beast/Evil Reed Richards Negative Zone storyline
it went way too long
and the Franklin Richards stuff..............goes NOWHERE, I think because they were afraid to have him be an omnipotent character, something Byrne and Claremont were NOT afraid of with Phoenix
The seventies was when Romita and Buscema put Marvel characters on model, giving them a look that the company had to emulate (Kirby and Ditko relied upon hairstyle only to differentiate characters). This lasted until Ron Frenz dumped the Romita Peter Parker look and Byrne turned Reed Richards into Professor Kelp. In that era, artists found ways to stylize the Thing. Buscema made the rocks small and gave him a bottom lip. Perez had him look like a posable action figure. Buckler, after breaking free of Buscema, rendered the Thing as a living broken sidewalk charging at the reader.
Professor Kelp😂
Rich Bucklers art was a high point of the 1970s
........even if he was a Kirby fanboy
You should of mentioned the "crappy" Steranko cover... but other than that you have done a great job here... thank you.
I have every issue of the Fantastic Four published between 1970-1979, and they're a bit of a mixed bag. Roy Thomas and Gerry Conway wrote around 60 issues of the FF during the early and mid 70s, and they're often too goofy for their own good, filled with stereotypical Silver Age dialogue and concepts. What I don't understand is how Roy could be so dramatic on titles like The Incredible Hulk, Submariner, and Doctor Strange, but never took things seriously on FF. So there's plenty of wisecracks and facetious captions during his FF run, and it's a bit too much even for a Bronze Age comic book. Gerry is a bit of a more mature writer than Roy is, but his run is only marginally better than what Thomas brought to the title.
Then Len Wein comes in after Gerry, and what a difference! Grant Morrison has said on numerous occassions that Len Wein is his favorite comic book writer, and it's not hard to see why. His writing is so more mature than someone like a Roy Thomas or Marv Wolfman, and every issue of his FF is an instant classic. Len's issues also reflect the more off-beat, fantastical nature of some of the FF's classic stories, as a quest for their kidnapped son and nanny lead them to New Salem, an eerie, isolated village in the mountains...all wrapped up with one of Wein's trademark ironic endings. I can honestly say I have never read a Len Wein comic that wasn't nothing short of genius.
🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩
My first issue had a Yellow Gorilla climbing the Baxter Building. On a separate note Rich Buckler is a massively underrated, especially when he's later at DC.
I became disenchanted with Buckler after reading FF 153 a few weeks after reading "Prisoners of the Pharoah," which was reprinted in Giant-Size Avengers 2.
Marvel Two in One is a GREAT book for 50-60 issues, then the art turns to chicken scratches
It doesn't matter who was doing the book then because they were all better than the last ten years it has become unreadable and seeing the trailer for the new movie has been disappointing
I must have gotten out of the Fantastic Four by the 1970s. My subscription ran out and I just didn't renew. I stayed with Spider-Man a lot longer but that eventually wore off too. It sucks growing up.
Fantastic Four got too stupid. I mean, I could take the Inhumans. Medusa, with her hair was pretty cool and I liked the romance between Johnny and Crystal but that slobbering dog was just too much.
Also, Galactus was just too big. I mean a thing that eats planets? What the ever-lovin' eff? And Silver Surfer was a stupid character to base a whole line of comics on. These stories were too over-the-top for me and that's what made me lose interest.
The inability to find a suitable plot line for lame characters.
I'm sorry but I can't stand Kirby. All those bucktoothed, blocky fingered monstrosities... ugh
After Kennedy's hair made it's cameo,it went on to battle the absorbing man,entertain a small stint in the frightful four. Usurp the silver surfer's board , when it attained the power cosmic and became a herald of Galactus. Traveling the limitless spaceways to find it's true love,a rock drifting aimlessly through the ancient abyss, that was floating near another rock. I wanna rock!😂❤🪨
Ah, the lost Official Marvel Handbook entry.
No offense to fans
I almost found George Perez‘s artwork blah
Just discovered this channel. Added you to the small list of comic TH-camrs that actually know what they're talking about.