Wow this episode has us digesting a lot. what a journey we wont soon forget! Stay tuned for band of brothers and haunting of hill house coming soon! Watch Band of Brothers AND The Haunting of Hill House EARLY & UNCUT over on Patreon! www.patreon.com/spartanandpudgey
35:33 what the series touch on here with the black stars and time is a flat circle and carcosa etc and all the quotes, is taken from books written by robert w. chambers an author that is even older than hp lovecraft and he influenced and inspired lovecraft alot actually. There's themes in the books about Carcosa, a cosmic eldritch city in another dimension, ruled by the King in Yellow named later on as Hastur, basically an alien being of godlike power that influences humanity subtly through literature and writing that when they read or listen to his music, it drives them insane etc What's great about true detective is that while its an amazing show its also a great nod to all of that wild lore!
Detective pudg, careful down the path of this show. The "king in yellow" is a story before Lovecraft that inspired him which he also incorporated. Before that, remember the dinner scene with kids and Rust when they asked if he ever shot someone and how Marty didn't. That Rust would be the one to take the shot that Marty. Consider that the "King in Yellow" is masked as a theater play that drives people towards madness. That the green beard swapped roles and accents like an actor in a play or in a TV show. The world they live in has no Lovecraft so they must live in the same world of those stories. If you enjoy stories like this pudgy you should watch, "MindHunter." But be warned, it didn't get renewed.
At the end, at the silo, Rust was seeing time in space in a circle. Rust believed in nothing. When he died he felt his daughter and his father and his beliefs changed. There was an end and life on the other side, no matter how dark or innocent your heart is. Marty, who was religious, questions Rust if it's just not one of his stories fulfilling his fantasies...Rust talk. Marty tells him not to change, but Rust changed...Time is no longer a flat circle. See the writer interview.
I agree, it has something more, it's like haunted. The chemistry between the actors, between the characters, the themes, the writing, the landscapes, "the psychosphere"...
I couldn't even finish the last "season" of "True Detective"... it was so badly written and acted, I think only the main actress did well, but the dialogs and story ingeneral were a disaster.
the black stars, the flat circle, the yelllow king, carcosa, and all that stuff resonated with fans of cosmic horror (chambers and lovecraft). these are all cosmic horror concepts (even some of rust’s bleak philosophies), so when the show starfs unfolding and revealing the cult stuff all of us cosmic horror fans were like “holy shit! this is lovecraftian!”
In many ways the story also unfolds like a mixture of a story from Chambers' "The King in Yellow" with a classicaly lovecraftian ending of a small victory at most against the cold causality of the universe. In many ways this really is *the* best Weired Fiction screen version ever done. Best regards Raoul G. Kunz
Actually, Lovecraft and Chambers run deep in this trilogy. All 3 seasons of True Detective have underlying tones of Lovecrafts and Chambers work. I would even argue that it's somehow part of one of their universes. Or possibly both lol
Really interesting connections to Lovecraft, which I wasn't aware of. There's also a very strong connection to Southern Gothic literature: obviously the setting, also the cultish elements, the keeping of dead bodies in the home, the incestuous, isolated families/communities, the corrupt reality beneath the surface of society. Interesting to think of this a a blending of Lovecraft and Southern Gothic.
Yep, same. Went into it knowing nothing of the Lovecraft connection just that it was a good show. And I started getting a hint after the first spiral “hallucination” of something at least supernatural oh and “yellow king” and thought..s “Hastur”? I know Lovecraft’s mythology is like split in two and his successor connected the two figures to be the same and Lovecraft never really, but it’s a logical one. None the less if not the same, still and cosmic Eldritch figure/god in the show.
The entire mythology of this season is taken from the works of Robert Chambers, a predecessor of Lovecraft. Carcosa is a mystical city under strange alien stars, ruled by a mysterious King in Yellow. In fact, in literature of this kind, the main technique is silence, so this is almost all that we know about Carcosa and the Yellow King. Rust's dark philosophy is based on the pessimistic and anti-natalist views of Thomas Ligotti, in which he substantiates the meaninglessness of existence and human life. The man with scars calls Rust the Priest, apparently because, thanks to his dark philosophy and drug-induced visions, he was the only one who could look into the sick mind of the Yellow King, acting as a kind of prophet. There will never be such a complete and unique work as the first season, but still, in my opinion, the third season is also good, it has its own philosophy, although it may seem too drawn out and boring.
"Take off your mask!" - This is a nod to a short story called 'The Mask' in Robert W. Chambers' book 'The King In Yellow'. The opening of the story is an excerpt from a fictional play: Camilla: You, sir, should unmask. Stranger: Indeed? Cassilda: Indeed it’s time. We all have laid aside disguise but you. Stranger: I wear no mask. Camilla: (Terrified, aside to Cassilda.) No mask? No mask! The catatonic victim in the hospital screams a similar line to Rust when he asks about the scars: "His face? His face!" Masks are featured a lot throughout: the men in the videos wear masks, the children are blindfolded, the dolls in the house are faceless, the bodies in Carcosa have their faces covered, Rust talks about the cartel cutting around the face and ripping the skin down in front of a mirror. Rust was wearing a mask the entire time: the mask of his negativity and nihilism. One he's worn since the death of his daughter, one he uses to keep his focus on his impossible mission to catch all the bad guys, while not allowing his sorrow and pain to catch up with him. Like Marty, he's a delusional man, deeply flawed, and in denial of those flaws. Like Marty says, they suffer from the detective's curse of looking at the wrong thing. In Rust's case, he is trying to rid the world of the filth he envies, the truly detached and evil that are unbothered by the kind of emotional attachment he's worked so hard to lose, instead of finding peace and meaning in life. The little mirror in his apartment that he stares into represents that little glimmer of the truth, the bit of humanity still hidden inside him, beneath all that armour and disinterest. Rust's mask does come off, but it takes dying to do it. When he recovers, he realises that all the shit he spouts about the accidental nature of our humanity in the face of animal urges doesn't insulate him or make him stronger, even if it's true. He removes that mask, and acknowledges that the love he felt for his daughter, and all his previous happiness, are in fact an important part of who is, of what it means to be human. That's my take anyway.
Rust was ready to die when he removed the knife from his stomach. He had finished what he came back to do after shooting Childress. This is why he said he shouldn't be here.
@@mndayman Yeah he alluded that to Marty in the previous episode where he said he came back to "tie off a loose end". Meaning to finish the case and either die in the process or perhaps end his own life. Of course all this changed after his experience of waking up in the hospital.
When Rust talks about when he felt the love of his dead daughter it teared me up because 2 years ago when I died for a few minutes, I felt the same big love from whatever was out there and I would have died in peace... its really weird.
Yeah, our brain's are wired to activate the portions governing memory recall and emotion during the active dying process. A gift of nature to ease our ending.
I’ve to say, I’ve seen Spartan tear up twice only and both times he did it watching Matthew McConaughey. Same brother, same. But what a series this was. An absolute Gem and I was super excited to watch it with you guys.
I think leaving so much unexamined was a perfect choice for this series, like what the cult was about and what did they believe and why did they do what they did. People like Marty would say "because they're crazy", and someone like Rust can kind of empathise and get into the head of the killer (what a True Detective does). Rust was a narcotics undercover agent for years so he is familiar with drug induced experiences and mysticism. He obsessed over the mysticism (black stars, the yellow king, time is a flat circle etc). This last episode has him chasing the killer through Carcosa (the fabled place he keeps hearing of), with the symbols and mythos running through his mind. I feel like at the end he sees what the psychotic killer sees, and what maybe his drugged up victims saw (the swirling black hole above them). It's like he's so deep into this case that he can literally see inside the mind of a madman and understand it.
And it plays into the cosmic horror aspect of the show: "we didn't get them all, but we got ours". A human being would never be able to fully grasp the Gods, just like two State Detectives would never be able to take down a sex trafficking ring this big, as it might very well involve senators and whatnot. And maybe there is a supernatural aspect to this, which makes it even more impossible for Rust and Marty to take it down. Still, they did what they could, which is what Absurdism (Rust's philosophy by the end of the show) is about: the universe is vast and uncaring, but we're alive, so we have to believe what we do matter, otherwise we'll go insane.
FYI: I don't know about season 2 but season 3 is also set in Louisiana and DEFINITELY takes place in the same universe as season 1. Beyond that, I won't spoil anything. Season 3 is actually pretty good and is well worth a watch. It's a different story and the biggest complaint that people have with season 3 is that it's not season 1. It's a new story with a new mystery and new characters.
My complain about S3 is (without spoiling) the mystery itself of what happened is not that interesting AND the fact it actually didnt matter whether our protagonists came out of retirement or not. Those who saw it will undertand-
@@arturovandeley Subjective for sure. I found the mystery just as interesting as season 1, the only part that it lacks in comparison in my opinion is that the characters aren't as great. But I liked season 3 a lot. But I also liked season 2 too, but it certainly is the weakest of the three. Haven't even seen the 4th one.
Not dying instantly when shot, especially by a handgun, isn’t as unusual as you think. Guns are not death-rays, you don’t just (always) drop to the ground after being hit. If the central nervous system hasn’t been disrupted, often people can keep fighting/running for a bit. Rust’s final shot to the brain, obviously, disrupted the CNS. The guy with the scars is depicted as being huge (I say depicted because the actor is 6 foot 2 but through clever camera work they gave him a few more inches) and men that size can, with the right mix of adrenaline and don’t-give-a-damn, absorb surprising amounts of damage.
@@BornRanger TH-cam removed my comment because, you know, TH-cam, so we'll try again. This is an age-restricted video (going to name it versus link it) of a sheriff's deputy putting (according to the actual news story) nine rounds into the torso of a man who would not stop coming at him with a club. Yes, he does eventually go down, but he sure absorbs hits with very little acknowledgement of them. And yes, I promise you, this law enforcement officer had hollow points. HP rounds are almost exclusively carried by law enforcement and yes, most civilians. Only the military is running around with non-expanding ammo (and citizens of a few restricted states). Handguns are portable, not powerful (in comparison to rifles and shotguns). Plug the title below into your search window and watch a guy walk through hollow points--and he is not a giant bear of a man like the villain in TD is: "Police: Sheriff’s Deputy Shoots, Kills Laytonsville Man Who Was 'Driving Erratically'"
@@t1mpani they definitely couldn't have put him down immediatelly, but realistically he wouldn't be standing long enough to get on top of Marty, pull out the axe and then try to attack him again.
@@BornRanger Well, you’re saying “couldn’t” in a world of a million variables. In my own deployment, I’ve seen one guy shot in the torso who didn’t even realize he’d been shot for a few minutes (as in, we’d been behind cover for several minutes and somebody says “dude, you’re bleeding”), and while it’s true he hadn’t been wrestling anybody for an axe, he had something like 40-50 pounds of pack/gear/magazines hanging on him-adrenaline is an interesting thing. Conversely-and I didn’t see this myself but everybody was talking about it after it happened-one guy hit in the hip with some grenade shrapnel who, according to the medic at least (no autopsies are conducted on battlefields) died of shock. Now, that guy could have had a virus, or heart condition, or something else we didn’t know about, but nonetheless a 23/24/25 year old (guessing based on his rank, I knew his name but didn’t know him well) basically dying from the stress/pain of some metal cracking his pelvis. Life is very random and weird. And for that matter, a guy who is depicted as being able to lift Rust with one hand probably should have overpowered a middle aged Marty very quickly, so one could argue the fact that he was struggling to take the axe from him was indicative of wound-driven, rapidly-diminishing strength. But whatever, it’s fiction-enjoy it or don’t, believe it could happen or don’t. I’ve read people in reaction comments argue about the realism of the Black Knight scene from Monty Python…
The news saying that the Tuttle rumors had been dispelled is just saying the coverup continues for those at the top of the pyramid. A second viewing is incredible because you pick up on SO much as you watch. The family connections are explained but it's sorta here and there and can be hard to piece together. Your second time through it all makes more sense.
The scene with Marty in the hospital bed always rips me. Even to the last moment he tries to keep everything inside and put a brave face on. Its a heavy burden to keep feelings like that locked away.
As a father I completely agree. That scene has brought a tear to my eye several times. Marty realizing what he screwed up and it's too late to change it is stout. Acted wonderfully by Woody.
Love the fact the painted house eureka moment was actually foreshadowed in the first 10 minutes of episode 1 when Rust is talking about taking a lot of notes cause you never know which little detail will make you say 'aha' and break a case.
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, Errol Childress calling to Rust. "Come on down here with me. Come on down priest". His voice in his throne room of bones and old clothes. Tied together with branches. It's such a terrifying scene. ------- Hearing Errol Childress is like hearing the Texas Chainsaw killer if he had spoken in that movie. What a terrifying character. And we didn't even need much time with him to feel that chill to the bone.
I think the season concludes with Rust and Marty both in a place of peace. Both alone but at ease. Marty tried to put himself inside a family setting but he wasn´t good for that and hurt the people around him in the process. Rust tried to isolate himself but that wasn´t good for him either. Alone together ended up being what worked best for both of them.
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, I think the beauty of the series is not to explain everything to the audience it's more to see things from Rust and Marty's perspective. We don't know all the dealings of the Tuddle and Childress families in the Louisiana area. -------- The show leaves it open for us to perform our research behind the Yellow King, Carcosa, time as a flat circle. --------- I have tried to point you guys in the right directions as to some of the writings of Thomas Ligotti (Conspiracy Against the Human Race), Ambrose Bierce (Devil's Dictionary) and H.P. Lovecraft. -------- The writers of the show have sprinkled in these ideologies as a introduction for the audience but leave it to us to explore further. --------- This is the point of great art, it exposes us to new perspectives and ideologies we would never touch with a 10 ft pole.
You can interpret "true detective" in multiple ways. Who said its just about the case? I view it like we get to "meet" what being a detective is, understand their lives, their day to day, what they see, what they encounter, what they think, their hardships, their faults, how it changes them, how its reflecting on their lives and what it eventually means to them. And so much more. Its a POV from their shoes but also how others perceive them. And it all happens on so many levels. That's exactly why we spend so much time with these two detectives and their beliefs. And its done so masterfully, it still blows my mind. Cheers !!
Rust has a lot of wicked badass lines this season, but “do I strike you as more of a talker or a doer?” after emptying a clip into the car is the undefeated No. 1.
rust removing a knife from a fatal stab wound that he would obviously know it’s better to leave it in. The man felt he paid his debt. Greatest single season of television ever filmed ❤ it was great watching y’all along this journey
18:17 - A posh English accent coming out of a guy like that in the backwoods of Louisiana would be so out of place that they'd think he was nuts for sure.
Part of the theme of Lovecraftian Horror is making you question things and not giving you all of the answers. Fear of the unknown is a major aspect of Lovecraft so not knowing or not fully explaining manages to add to the fear it instills in you as the audience in this scenario. Not knowing if this cult actually has something supernatural influencing them. Not knowing if what Rust was seeing was the true Carcosa and he had some kind of deeper insight into the world with his visions or if they were just a mundane mental problem he was experiencing.
Great ending to a singular series. I love that Rust finally found a way to challenge his nihilism. Like he wanted *something* to matter, he just needed a reason.
I've seen S1 so many times, after the first watch I also felt like I had questions I wanted answering. Now I see it as more of a character analysis and the case is secondary to that. I focus more on the multi-faceted nature of the characters, the philosophies, personal lives, and the potential to enact "bad" actions in the name of the good, and if those actions are always justified, etc. Without any concrete answers I just assume there was a large pagan (or satanic idk) p***phile ring/cult that included cops, the church etc with their own janky beliefs and philosophies. I also assume Errol Childress (main villain) was the ringleader or close to the top. By getting him it would at least bring the crime rate down because I think around that area he was the one committing most of those murders. He probably committed the murder we see at the beginning of ep1 given the ceremony of it all
So guys, very sorry for this long sheet of a comment, but I hope you find it useful and maybe it will clear a few things up (at least as I have it in my head, after watching the show multiple times). The series has no plot holes. There are indeed unanswered questions, but it's only those that don't really need answering at all, as you pointed out in your reaction as well. For example, what does it matter what exactly was told to the convict in that phone call to have him end himself? Probably a Tuttle lawyer told him that he e-ffed up by telling Rust about the Yellow King and advised him to do it or they'll give him a much more painful death in prison (notice that one of his prison guards is a Childress). It's not that deep, and it's not important. And same goes as to why the series doesn’t answer any questions regrading the Cult's exact beliefs; it's because it simply doesn’t matter. That's not the point of the series. No matter how freaky it might look, the cult's beliefs are not real, that's what the series wants you to take from the show. Sam Tuttle (scarred man's grandfather) was the one who started this cult way back, and based the beliefs of it in fictional mythology by already existing authors (e.g. Lovecraft, Chambers etc) combined with a load of stuff he made up. It was all fake sh*t made up by an evil, degnrate man and his keen (most worked themselves up in higher places, just like in real life, so they could cover up for themselves, while others, like the Ledoux and Childress families, remained low and conveniently invisible) in order to give themselves and whoever fell into their claws a fake justification to commit their horrific crimes and somewhat justify the sickness of their brains. I understand that part of the audience might have been curious as to the exact beliefs and "philosophy" of the cult, but here's the thing. Question: have you ever looked into any real-world cult's beliefs? I guarantee you, it's all vague s*it that make absolutely zero sense to any sane, sober person. Every single time. Why? Because none of it is real! They make it all up based on preexisting works of fiction or religious texts. That's the case in the series as well. The point was exactly what I highlighted above - that there was never anything truly spiritual about it. There are no supernatural forces there. The cult is a fraud, a way for these sick men to justify their desire to s-a and end the lives of children and women. At the end of the day, the only evil out there is inside humans, and this is the only real, absolute cosmic horror. Also, there was nothing unsolved in the mystery - Rust and Marty solved the entire thing. It's just that they didn't manage to get every single person responsible, because the higher-ups (like Eddie Tuttle, the governor - only mentioned in the show) got themselves covered. But I do believe the whole cult basically dies with Betty (the creepy woman in the house). Sam Tuttle (only mentioned) has been long gone, Billy Tuttle (reverent, we saw him twice) was ended by the cult after Rust's break-in, and Billy Childress (sheriff, only mentioned, he's the father of Erroll, the dead man he kept in that creepy barn) is also dead, and now Rust ended Erroll as well. It would be too risky for any remaining members to continue with the cult, as we can assume they will be highly monitored from that point on, and their reputations ruined. I do think you would really enjoy a rewatch and also take a look at some Tuttle family trees, because several of your questions have already been answered throughout the series, but it's just that it's easy to get lost and forget stuff or get confused (for example, the name of the man with the scars, who is Dora Lange's killer, is Erroll, not Billy - Billy was his father, and his grandfather was Sam, also dead) especially if you're only watching once a week. I love this series so much, Rust and Marty are one of my favorite duos ever, and I would definitely enjoy you reacting even in the rewatch as well lol, or even just a conversation with your additional thoughts after your rewatch. You're my favorite reactors out there. Thanks and take care!
The first and third seasons of True Detective derive stylistically from what we call the Southern Gothic genre, which often deals with alienation, poverty and strange characters. When the siblings (?) have that weird sexual interaction in the beginning, she mentions the grandfather abusing her. A horrific fact that would make anyone who's normal alarmed, not aroused, but they get turned on. They have become completely twisted by the normalization of pedophilic practices, both have grown up amidst abuse, pedophilia and bizarre family relations. It's a way of showing that the whole family and who knows who else is involved in this ("We didn't catch them all"), and that evil can fester in unsuspecting parts of the world that otherwise seem normal, which is a very Southern Gothic theme.
Notice the thing with the skulls in the last chamber has yellowish robes. That's the Yellow King, and he was probably revered like a god in their cult. Probably many sacrifices were made to him in that place.
Woody Harrelson’s theory that Matthew McConaughey might be his real life brother made perfect sense to me after seeing them together for this series. I know they’ve known each other for a long time but still the characters as a duo here are perfection
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, since you guys have finished, Carcosa and the Yellow King are based on Lovecraft's writing, that's why it feels as if Carcosa is another realm. On the story of the Yellow King, he would take children and mess with their heads through nightmares very much like the Yellow King does in True Detective, but with LSD.
Just a little note about headbutts -- You don't butt your head into the other guy's head, you do what Rust did: You headbutt the guy in the nose and keep doing it. Your head is harder than the guy's nose and that will get the guy off you.
I too was expecting a crazy twist or something in this finale but on reflection it doesn't need that to be a superb final episode. It's nice Marty explained they couldn't possibly get everyone involved but they got their man, who was definitely the most deranged of the bunch.
I don’t think Rust would have schooled him. Rust is one of my top three favorite tv and movie characters ever. But Childress has a strength and ability gained by the occult practices he conducts. People don’t just drop when they’re shot most of the time. Even with larger rounds than the .38 Marty used. Unless you destroy a vital component. Which Marty did not. But on that same note, again, Childress is not a “normal” guy.
Additional comment, because your reaction to the show really reminded me how very much I have it in my heart. I absolutely adore how character driven the show is. The character work on both Marty and Rust is immaculate. I'm looking at how Marty has grown from a lighthearted, goofy guy who had no self control and was always willing to make all kinds of excuses for his own weaknesses and bad traits to a mature man who knows himself, recognizes his mistakes and accepts and respects other people's limits and privacy (it's also worth noting that Marty's true potential as a detective is only unlocked once he's finally stopped chasing around women half his age and has truly committed to what's really important, giving us the final clue to the killer). And at how Rust finally comes to accept that maybe, just maybe, he doesn't know everything; maybe he's not completely right, maybe there are more things in this world and beyond it that he doesn't know about, and that despite all the ugliness and evil in the world there is still good in it and things worth living for. And I love how their friendship has grown as well, against all odds. I wouldn't be surprised if Marty was the only real friend Rust ever had. I believe that Rust, being so good at reading people so fast, immediately upon meeting Marty realized that he was a simple, genuine person who always spoke exactly what he had in mind and nothing else, and that despite all his many flaws, he didn't have anything truly evil in him. I think he really appreciated that, and that this is what made him always trust Marty (we never saw him truly trusting anyone else). That's why he's so upset at Marty in 2002, when Marty doesn't support him against their boss, and quite obviously disappointed in him when he realizes he's cheating on Maggie once again. We've only seen Rust losing his temper twice in the series; once when he realized they hadn't caught the actual Dora Lange killer, and another time after he had sex with Maggie. The second time he was quite obviously deeply hurt, not just because Maggie knew he had some desire for her and used him regardless, but first and foremost because he thought he lost the only real friend he ever had. On Marty's side, as he says himself, he's always been a people person, always had people around him to hang around and have fun with, but we never really see him having an actual friendship with anyone other than Rust. At first, Marty doesn't get Rust. He's a simple person who doesn't like drifting into deep thoughts, and Rust is way too complicated for him to grasp. But when he finds out about his losses, everything immediately becomes clear to him. This, he can fully understand, and Marty has a whole lot of empathy, if nothing else. It's after that that he starts relaxing around him a little more (I think Pudgey noted in that episode how Marty now seems to even find Rust's jokes funny etc). He's the first one who calls Rust his friend later on (when they head to a bar after Marty made a scene at the hospital). He then trusts Rust of all people to help out in that first big drift with Maggie, and his mind is only put at ease about it when Rust tells him he can see them getting back together in a couple of months - he greatly values his instincts and opinions. Maggie chooses to have sex with Rust rather with anyone else because, as she says herself, this would be the only thing that would truly hurt Marty and would guarantee he'd be out of her life from then on - because she very well knew that Rust is the only person Marty considers as his real friend (if it was anyone else, he'd have forgiven her instantly and would have insisted in 'saving' their marriage etc). During his chat with the new detectives, when he says he hasn't talked to Rust in ten years, he sounds deeply sad about it, despite everything that happened. At the end of it all, Marty has his family by his side (because the fact that the marriage has definitely ended - notice how Maggie is married to a different man in 2012 - doesn't mean the family ends as well) in the hospital. And then you get all sad, because Rust has no one. But immediately, the show tells you with the very next scene that nope, he's not alone; he has Marty. Their friendship is beautiful, the characters are incredible, and I love this show so much.
I really would love it if you guys watched the other seasons too. I know everyone touts this as the best single season of TV, but the other seasons are absolutely amazing too. It’s just a shame because they are different, that this one just overshadows them because people fell in love with this one so much when it aired. Season 2 and 3 and Night Country are very good TV
First, the code switch by the killer is to indicate to the audience that this man is no mere dumb hick, he is in fact extremely intelligent (this is also clued in by the plethora of books scattered around the house) and a formidable adversary for Marty and Rust. 2nd Childress was an absolute unit, having the physical strength to pick up Rust like that, I'm sorry, in a 1 on 1 fight, Rust get rekt by this guy, it would be like me fighting a highly-skilled 6 year old, or an welterweight MMA champ fighting a WSM champ, the size and strength advantage is just too great.
Season 2 is actually brilliant but people "hated" it because everyone expected that S2 will be the same as S1 and that we will continue with Rust and Marty and if not them, there will at least be cults and stuff. But it is new story with new characters, but at the same time it has many great elements from S1 and amazing actors, atmosphere, acting, music, writing. Everyone can have different opinions, but i feel the negative stuff some people say about S2 is simply not fair. S3 was also good but not as good as S1 and S2. The latest S4 felt the most different out of all of them for many reasons and i liked it too, but not as much as the first three.
Watching this show when it aired live weekly was one of the best TV viewing experiences ever. Added to that was some of the crazy theories people were coming up with every week on reddit threads. But that also left the feeling of wanting more when it did end, just like how you felt. We wanted more answers on the bigger picture, taking down the higher ups that were involved etc. But the direction they went in was still good, they got their man and I guess it was an unrealistic expectation for them to solve everything.
To understand all the references about Carcosa, The Yellow King, flat circle, the great whirl in the space you should read all the base of horror literature H.P. Lovecraft, Poe, Ambrose Birse, Stephen King... last vision the spiral is Lovecraft's Depiction of the Hasture (Yellow king) ancient god of evel, Ted Childress is his human avatar in this world, Rust is human avatar of ancient hero priest Mani (ancient religion Manichaeism) , the soul of the hero is stuck in Carcosa, (Ambrose Birse) and could not understand that he already dead, he has to born again and again in eternal reincarnation in human avatar to fight with Hasture in his human avatar, and only after hero priest finishes his mission his soul can escape from Carcosa... only to reincarnate again in other avatar not recalling that he already dead and his soul stuck in Carcosa... again... and again.... ancient fight of the evil god and human priest son of a man...
A masterpiece of a series. Thank you for watching and reacting to this one, I must say you guys were super invested and inquisitive about so much. I love how you both voice your opinions and thoughts, but also share when you don't know exactly what's going on. It'd be easy to pretend you know every little detail but nobody picks everything up in this show first time around. Looking forward to Band of Brothers - I'm planning to watch along as I haven't seen it before!
The part about the stars and the light winning is Rust finally becoming somewhat of an optimist, as he made it clear in episode 1 he thought life was essentially meaningless, he found it in the end.
True Detective S1 is up there with best TV ever made. S2 is a drop in quality (hard to stay at S1 level) but is actually a bit underrated. S3 was very good and deserves a reaction. I couldn't finish S4
If I remember correctly one of the detectives who arrested the guy who killed himself was named Childress. So he would have alerted the powers that be that this guy is talking. I can only assume they threatened to kill the guys family as part of their rituals if he didn't off himself.
It was one of the officers who walked Francis to and from his cell when he got the call from his "lawyer". As Rust is watching the surveillance tape you see the officer lean forward and say something to him as they walk away from his cell. Nobody ever catches that Chilldress connection.
I think you guys should keep going with this series. All the seasons stand alone, though season 4 has a lot of echoes of season 1. Broadly speaking, I think season 2 is least popular, but I still loved it.
you two were perfect companions re-watching this perfect tv series..........don't believe i'll be first (or last) to make this observation: to have the eternal pessimist to deliver the last, optimistic, line of the episode/series was the absolute cherry on top.............thanks so much for sharing.
Okay I just watched all of this reaction now Yes - they only solved one part of the case. This is an intersecting family crime ring that is expansive. There are still cover ups going on and more crime will go on. That’s the point too of the end comment. When they both talk about the dark having more space but then Rust saying once there was only dark - seems to me the light is winning. It’s like the case - they only solved one part BUT they solved that one part.
The problem with seasons with seasons 2, 3 and 4 us that everybody expected thus level od story telling all over agai ! I think 2 and 4 were excellent, 3 was okay. But the leads, Mathew and absolutely matched the level of writing!!! P.s. a rewatch is absolutely nessasary, the rhythm of the spoken language and the pace of the writing match up perfectly!!!! Gotta say b and of brothers is amazing! And Pudgy, you look fantastic!!!!👍👏👏👏🥰
And realistically, no matter how cool a character is, in a "grounded" more reality based narrative a man's journey isn't always winning against a foe. Most time, if you live, you transform from the experience of survival against a foe. That's truly what life is about.
I believe the killer changing accents showed that while we view him as a crazy person (which he was) he was also very clever which is how he got away with it for so long.
The beauty of a well crafted story, it's perfect it's an anthology series. Because how could you write another season of these two taking on another case. One that could possibly match this seasons. You couldn't, it would just diminish the show (as a whole). Like you, I had heard the first season was great, and i loved it when i watched it. I watched the first ep of the second season and it didn't hook me the same way, so it's something I will eventually go back to later. This where I once again plug DARK. Speaking about a well crafted story, 3 seasons, all pre-planned. Its honesty one of the best shows ive ever seen. I just finished the frist season of "The Terror", which is also a 'good' show that is book based and has roots to real world events. And lastly THE LAST KINGDOM, in one of your live streams Spartan mentions he was a big fan of the show "Vikings". IMO TLK is better. Plus there is a movie that ties up the story (movie released in 2023).
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, I hope you're not watching this at night. The lawnmower man gave me nightmares in that final scene. ------- His voice is true terror. He kept calling Rust to come and find him in the backyard/woods. --------- Especially Pudgey, I know your hands were shaking like a branch in a hurricane. Proper metaphor for the amount of anxiety this show gave you at the end.
I think “perfectly imperfect” describes it *perfectly*. :) We don’t get every answer to every mystery, but I feel like that stays true to the nature of the story (and the nature of detective & police work in general; every answer leads to another question)… Anyway, such a great show. Marty & Rust are legends.
There was something magical created here, a one of a kind unique experience, with some insanely good chemistry between this amazing duo, masterclass acting to say the least ! Memorable beyond words in just a span of 8 episodes ! Savor this moment, nothing comes close to this perfection. Its literally the best 1 season show I have ever seen. I can only compare it to Chernobyl which is also absolute perfection. So many years after, nothing diminishes its value. It gets even better on subsequent viewings too. S02 is good for different reasons. And I do recommend it even though its quite different in tone and style. Just don't expect it to be as perfect as this was. Enjoy it for what it is.
I would definitely recommend watching the "Inside the Episode" that plays after each episode with the creator Nic Pizzolatto explaining more details for these questions that you have.
Along the shore the cloud waves break, The twin suns sink behind the lake, The shadows lengthen In Carcosa. Strange is the night where black stars rise, And strange moons circle through the skies, But stranger still is Lost Carcosa. Songs that the Hyades shall sing, Where flap the tatters of the King, Must die unheard in Dim Carcosa. Song of my soul, my voice is dead, Die thou, unsung, as tears unshed Shall dry and die in Lost Carcosa. -"Cassilda's Song" in The King in Yellow Act 1, Scene 2
The first season of this show was spectacular. I also enjoyed the 3rd. While it isn't as good as the first I do think it is underrated. Also, Stephen Dorff and Mahershala Ali were great in it.
That was no Rusts vision.. he saw real Carcosa, surrounded by black stars. And there was no answer toward all that, because you cant have answer to that. its a cosmic horror, its something unfathomable. We just had opportunity to see 1 smallest piece of someone being influenced by the Yellow King, and doing things in his name. But non of it cant be comprehend from human stand point, thats why they respected it(Lovecraft's & Chambers material) by not even going in to it.
@@Corn_Pone_Flicks I don't see why would Rust hallucinate something SO specific, in that moment. In place where they sacrificed people(which means room itself has some great value to the cult). In my opinion it was not a hallucination.. Rust never hallucinated such things, this was not a moving light, this was something complex, something alive. Also I think Rust was a perfect person to actually see Carcosa. His world views are actually perfect for Yellow King to slither his tentacles through dimensions, and poke his mind. I heard people saying "Maybe the killers read King in Yellow and created a cult around it"..and if that was the case, you think Rust would not connect the words Yellow King to Chambers and Lovecraft, and mention them? Fact he didn't, means they do not exist in this universe.. why wouldn't they exist? Because it is Their universe we are in.
@@Corn_Pone_Flicks and yes, that was the whole point.. the show was not about supernatural things. Yet still it was in that universe. That's the whole beauty of it.
Never has a show been so well driven by the main characters and their dynamic. I think many of those terms of time, circle and stars are to do with the cult activities in that chamber with the hole in the ceiling where Rust shot the scarred killer. I suspect the video of the child murders was also filmed there.
End of a journey you two, epic 8 part masterful art. Also i believe childress was calling Rust Little priest due to him being the states best man to get confessions. Like the guy who told Rust The yellow king was still out there he said he had heard of “him”. I can imagine especially after reggie and dewall were dispatched everyone including the yellow king knew who Rust was. Also hope ur bday was dope Spartan 🎉
I hope you guys consider watching season 4, which just recently came out several months ago. I thought it was decent and very weird, like this one. Jodie Foster (Clarice from Silence of the Lambs) stars in it.
Okay, so, regarding the remaining seasons: No, none of them expand on this story...they're all individual cases. Season 2 is very much like a James Ellroy novel (he wrote L.A. Confidential), and it's fairly similar in style to that. It's not at all like this season, but I enjoy it. Season 3 is more similar in terms of the case being stretched over a long time and occurring in multiple time frames, as well as being tonally similar. Season 4 is a mess, and wasn't written by the original showrunner. The final episode is the lowest-ranked episode of any of the four seasons, because its explanation is very unsatisfying, and many things go unexplained-not little things, but major plot points. It would be like if this series never answered who killed Dora Lang.
Ultimately we are just knowing what Marty and Rust know. They got the guy. Why the guy, who they all are cant be answered since we arent seeing the story, we are seeing Marty and Rusts POV only
Wow this episode has us digesting a lot. what a journey we wont soon forget! Stay tuned for band of brothers and haunting of hill house coming soon!
Watch Band of Brothers AND The Haunting of Hill House EARLY & UNCUT over on Patreon! www.patreon.com/spartanandpudgey
35:33 what the series touch on here with the black stars and time is a flat circle and carcosa etc and all the quotes, is taken from books written by robert w. chambers an author that is even older than hp lovecraft and he influenced and inspired lovecraft alot actually. There's themes in the books about Carcosa, a cosmic eldritch city in another dimension, ruled by the King in Yellow named later on as Hastur, basically an alien being of godlike power that influences humanity subtly through literature and writing that when they read or listen to his music, it drives them insane etc
What's great about true detective is that while its an amazing show its also a great nod to all of that wild lore!
Can't wait for haunting of hill house ❤
Detective pudg, careful down the path of this show. The "king in yellow" is a story before Lovecraft that inspired him which he also incorporated. Before that, remember the dinner scene with kids and Rust when they asked if he ever shot someone and how Marty didn't. That Rust would be the one to take the shot that Marty. Consider that the "King in Yellow" is masked as a theater play that drives people towards madness. That the green beard swapped roles and accents like an actor in a play or in a TV show. The world they live in has no Lovecraft so they must live in the same world of those stories. If you enjoy stories like this pudgy you should watch, "MindHunter." But be warned, it didn't get renewed.
Watch 'Surfer, Dude'!!! Great little movie with both of them :) such a vibe ❤ but COMPLETELY different to this 😅
At the end, at the silo, Rust was seeing time in space in a circle. Rust believed in nothing. When he died he felt his daughter and his father and his beliefs changed. There was an end and life on the other side, no matter how dark or innocent your heart is. Marty, who was religious, questions Rust if it's just not one of his stories fulfilling his fantasies...Rust talk. Marty tells him not to change, but Rust changed...Time is no longer a flat circle. See the writer interview.
The magic of this season will never be recaptured.
I agree, it has something more, it's like haunted. The chemistry between the actors, between the characters, the themes, the writing, the landscapes, "the psychosphere"...
the dark is winning
Even the music seems completely charmed and perfectly fit to this show.
I couldn't even finish the last "season" of "True Detective"... it was so badly written and acted, I think only the main actress did well, but the dialogs and story ingeneral were a disaster.
@@Mauro_VelizI have to agree the last season never even explained how the tongue got there in the first place?!?!
the black stars, the flat circle, the yelllow king, carcosa, and all that stuff resonated with fans of cosmic horror (chambers and lovecraft). these are all cosmic horror concepts (even some of rust’s bleak philosophies), so when the show starfs unfolding and revealing the cult stuff all of us cosmic horror fans were like “holy shit! this is lovecraftian!”
In many ways the story also unfolds like a mixture of a story from Chambers' "The King in Yellow" with a classicaly lovecraftian ending of a small victory at most against the cold causality of the universe.
In many ways this really is *the* best Weired Fiction screen version ever done.
Best regards
Raoul G. Kunz
Actually, Lovecraft and Chambers run deep in this trilogy. All 3 seasons of True Detective have underlying tones of Lovecrafts and Chambers work. I would even argue that it's somehow part of one of their universes. Or possibly both lol
Really interesting connections to Lovecraft, which I wasn't aware of. There's also a very strong connection to Southern Gothic literature: obviously the setting, also the cultish elements, the keeping of dead bodies in the home, the incestuous, isolated families/communities, the corrupt reality beneath the surface of society. Interesting to think of this a a blending of Lovecraft and Southern Gothic.
Gnosticism makes lovecraft’s cosmic horror a love story compared to that. This belief could be very real and we’re living in it right now.
Yep, same. Went into it knowing nothing of the Lovecraft connection just that it was a good show. And I started getting a hint after the first spiral “hallucination” of something at least supernatural oh and “yellow king” and thought..s “Hastur”? I know Lovecraft’s mythology is like split in two and his successor connected the two figures to be the same and Lovecraft never really, but it’s a logical one. None the less if not the same, still and cosmic Eldritch figure/god in the show.
The entire mythology of this season is taken from the works of Robert Chambers, a predecessor of Lovecraft. Carcosa is a mystical city under strange alien stars, ruled by a mysterious King in Yellow. In fact, in literature of this kind, the main technique is silence, so this is almost all that we know about Carcosa and the Yellow King. Rust's dark philosophy is based on the pessimistic and anti-natalist views of Thomas Ligotti, in which he substantiates the meaninglessness of existence and human life. The man with scars calls Rust the Priest, apparently because, thanks to his dark philosophy and drug-induced visions, he was the only one who could look into the sick mind of the Yellow King, acting as a kind of prophet.
There will never be such a complete and unique work as the first season, but still, in my opinion, the third season is also good, it has its own philosophy, although it may seem too drawn out and boring.
Yes! So many of the things people say in season 1 are quotes (direct or indirect) from Robert Chambers' "the King in Yellow."
exactly!
I personally love robert chambers' works
season 2 and 3, the characters are boring and the plot; unimaginative.
And, let's give credit where it is due, Ambrose Bierce, who wrote the story "The Inhabitant of Carcosa" in 1886, which inspired Chambers
"Take off your mask!" - This is a nod to a short story called 'The Mask' in Robert W. Chambers' book 'The King In Yellow'. The opening of the story is an excerpt from a fictional play:
Camilla: You, sir, should unmask. Stranger: Indeed? Cassilda: Indeed it’s time. We all have laid aside disguise but you. Stranger: I wear no mask. Camilla: (Terrified, aside to Cassilda.) No mask? No mask!
The catatonic victim in the hospital screams a similar line to Rust when he asks about the scars: "His face? His face!" Masks are featured a lot throughout: the men in the videos wear masks, the children are blindfolded, the dolls in the house are faceless, the bodies in Carcosa have their faces covered, Rust talks about the cartel cutting around the face and ripping the skin down in front of a mirror. Rust was wearing a mask the entire time: the mask of his negativity and nihilism. One he's worn since the death of his daughter, one he uses to keep his focus on his impossible mission to catch all the bad guys, while not allowing his sorrow and pain to catch up with him. Like Marty, he's a delusional man, deeply flawed, and in denial of those flaws. Like Marty says, they suffer from the detective's curse of looking at the wrong thing. In Rust's case, he is trying to rid the world of the filth he envies, the truly detached and evil that are unbothered by the kind of emotional attachment he's worked so hard to lose, instead of finding peace and meaning in life. The little mirror in his apartment that he stares into represents that little glimmer of the truth, the bit of humanity still hidden inside him, beneath all that armour and disinterest. Rust's mask does come off, but it takes dying to do it. When he recovers, he realises that all the shit he spouts about the accidental nature of our humanity in the face of animal urges doesn't insulate him or make him stronger, even if it's true. He removes that mask, and acknowledges that the love he felt for his daughter, and all his previous happiness, are in fact an important part of who is, of what it means to be human. That's my take anyway.
@kylegacy: Wow- thank you!
Beautiful! You have realized ideas I weakly sensed into words of form and gravity.
Wow. Excellent and totally unexpected analysis. Thank you.
Rust was ready to die when he removed the knife from his stomach. He had finished what he came back to do after shooting Childress. This is why he said he shouldn't be here.
Rust was ready to die far before that moment but yeah.
@@mndayman Yeah he alluded that to Marty in the previous episode where he said he came back to "tie off a loose end". Meaning to finish the case and either die in the process or perhaps end his own life. Of course all this changed after his experience of waking up in the hospital.
When Rust talks about when he felt the love of his dead daughter it teared me up because 2 years ago when I died for a few minutes, I felt the same big love from whatever was out there and I would have died in peace... its really weird.
holy...what append ? i hope you are okay now
Yeah, our brain's are wired to activate the portions governing memory recall and emotion during the active dying process. A gift of nature to ease our ending.
That actually makes me fear death a little less. Thank you. :)
glad you are still here
I’ve to say, I’ve seen Spartan tear up twice only and both times he did it watching Matthew McConaughey. Same brother, same. But what a series this was. An absolute Gem and I was super excited to watch it with you guys.
I think leaving so much unexamined was a perfect choice for this series, like what the cult was about and what did they believe and why did they do what they did. People like Marty would say "because they're crazy", and someone like Rust can kind of empathise and get into the head of the killer (what a True Detective does). Rust was a narcotics undercover agent for years so he is familiar with drug induced experiences and mysticism. He obsessed over the mysticism (black stars, the yellow king, time is a flat circle etc). This last episode has him chasing the killer through Carcosa (the fabled place he keeps hearing of), with the symbols and mythos running through his mind. I feel like at the end he sees what the psychotic killer sees, and what maybe his drugged up victims saw (the swirling black hole above them). It's like he's so deep into this case that he can literally see inside the mind of a madman and understand it.
And it plays into the cosmic horror aspect of the show: "we didn't get them all, but we got ours". A human being would never be able to fully grasp the Gods, just like two State Detectives would never be able to take down a sex trafficking ring this big, as it might very well involve senators and whatnot. And maybe there is a supernatural aspect to this, which makes it even more impossible for Rust and Marty to take it down. Still, they did what they could, which is what Absurdism (Rust's philosophy by the end of the show) is about: the universe is vast and uncaring, but we're alive, so we have to believe what we do matter, otherwise we'll go insane.
FYI: I don't know about season 2 but season 3 is also set in Louisiana and DEFINITELY takes place in the same universe as season 1. Beyond that, I won't spoil anything. Season 3 is actually pretty good and is well worth a watch. It's a different story and the biggest complaint that people have with season 3 is that it's not season 1. It's a new story with a new mystery and new characters.
Season 3 is the only worthy follow up to Season 1. 2 and 4 were...oof.
Season 4 tried to connect and steal vibes from Season 1 by putting in Rust's dad and other stuff, but it was just so embarrassing. Horrible season.
S3 is set in Arkansas, not Louisiana.
Still an amazing season though, I love it almost as much as S1
My complain about S3 is (without spoiling) the mystery itself of what happened is not that interesting AND the fact it actually didnt matter whether our protagonists came out of retirement or not. Those who saw it will undertand-
@@arturovandeley Subjective for sure. I found the mystery just as interesting as season 1, the only part that it lacks in comparison in my opinion is that the characters aren't as great. But I liked season 3 a lot. But I also liked season 2 too, but it certainly is the weakest of the three. Haven't even seen the 4th one.
Not dying instantly when shot, especially by a handgun, isn’t as unusual as you think. Guns are not death-rays, you don’t just (always) drop to the ground after being hit. If the central nervous system hasn’t been disrupted, often people can keep fighting/running for a bit. Rust’s final shot to the brain, obviously, disrupted the CNS. The guy with the scars is depicted as being huge (I say depicted because the actor is 6 foot 2 but through clever camera work they gave him a few more inches) and men that size can, with the right mix of adrenaline and don’t-give-a-damn, absorb surprising amounts of damage.
they were hollow point rounds tho, should've caused a lot more damage than they did
@@BornRanger TH-cam removed my comment because, you know, TH-cam, so we'll try again. This is an age-restricted video (going to name it versus link it) of a sheriff's deputy putting (according to the actual news story) nine rounds into the torso of a man who would not stop coming at him with a club. Yes, he does eventually go down, but he sure absorbs hits with very little acknowledgement of them. And yes, I promise you, this law enforcement officer had hollow points. HP rounds are almost exclusively carried by law enforcement and yes, most civilians. Only the military is running around with non-expanding ammo (and citizens of a few restricted states). Handguns are portable, not powerful (in comparison to rifles and shotguns). Plug the title below into your search window and watch a guy walk through hollow points--and he is not a giant bear of a man like the villain in TD is:
"Police: Sheriff’s Deputy Shoots, Kills Laytonsville Man Who Was 'Driving Erratically'"
@@t1mpani they definitely couldn't have put him down immediatelly, but realistically he wouldn't be standing long enough to get on top of Marty, pull out the axe and then try to attack him again.
@@BornRanger Well, you’re saying “couldn’t” in a world of a million variables. In my own deployment, I’ve seen one guy shot in the torso who didn’t even realize he’d been shot for a few minutes (as in, we’d been behind cover for several minutes and somebody says “dude, you’re bleeding”), and while it’s true he hadn’t been wrestling anybody for an axe, he had something like 40-50 pounds of pack/gear/magazines hanging on him-adrenaline is an interesting thing. Conversely-and I didn’t see this myself but everybody was talking about it after it happened-one guy hit in the hip with some grenade shrapnel who, according to the medic at least (no autopsies are conducted on battlefields) died of shock. Now, that guy could have had a virus, or heart condition, or something else we didn’t know about, but nonetheless a 23/24/25 year old (guessing based on his rank, I knew his name but didn’t know him well) basically dying from the stress/pain of some metal cracking his pelvis. Life is very random and weird. And for that matter, a guy who is depicted as being able to lift Rust with one hand probably should have overpowered a middle aged Marty very quickly, so one could argue the fact that he was struggling to take the axe from him was indicative of wound-driven, rapidly-diminishing strength. But whatever, it’s fiction-enjoy it or don’t, believe it could happen or don’t. I’ve read people in reaction comments argue about the realism of the Black Knight scene from Monty Python…
This season is just a masterpiece. It´s a shame the other ones arent as good.
The news saying that the Tuttle rumors had been dispelled is just saying the coverup continues for those at the top of the pyramid. A second viewing is incredible because you pick up on SO much as you watch. The family connections are explained but it's sorta here and there and can be hard to piece together. Your second time through it all makes more sense.
The scene with Marty in the hospital bed always rips me. Even to the last moment he tries to keep everything inside and put a brave face on. Its a heavy burden to keep feelings like that locked away.
As a father I completely agree. That scene has brought a tear to my eye several times. Marty realizing what he screwed up and it's too late to change it is stout. Acted wonderfully by Woody.
Love the fact the painted house eureka moment was actually foreshadowed in the first 10 minutes of episode 1 when Rust is talking about taking a lot of notes cause you never know which little detail will make you say 'aha' and break a case.
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, Errol Childress calling to Rust. "Come on down here with me. Come on down priest". His voice in his throne room of bones and old clothes. Tied together with branches. It's such a terrifying scene. ------- Hearing Errol Childress is like hearing the Texas Chainsaw killer if he had spoken in that movie. What a terrifying character. And we didn't even need much time with him to feel that chill to the bone.
having both of you so invested in this story was fantastic. love you two!
I think the season concludes with Rust and Marty both in a place of peace. Both alone but at ease. Marty tried to put himself inside a family setting but he wasn´t good for that and hurt the people around him in the process. Rust tried to isolate himself but that wasn´t good for him either. Alone together ended up being what worked best for both of them.
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, I think the beauty of the series is not to explain everything to the audience it's more to see things from Rust and Marty's perspective. We don't know all the dealings of the Tuddle and Childress families in the Louisiana area. -------- The show leaves it open for us to perform our research behind the Yellow King, Carcosa, time as a flat circle. --------- I have tried to point you guys in the right directions as to some of the writings of Thomas Ligotti (Conspiracy Against the Human Race), Ambrose Bierce (Devil's Dictionary) and H.P. Lovecraft. -------- The writers of the show have sprinkled in these ideologies as a introduction for the audience but leave it to us to explore further. --------- This is the point of great art, it exposes us to new perspectives and ideologies we would never touch with a 10 ft pole.
You can interpret "true detective" in multiple ways. Who said its just about the case? I view it like we get to "meet" what being a detective is, understand their lives, their day to day, what they see, what they encounter, what they think, their hardships, their faults, how it changes them, how its reflecting on their lives and what it eventually means to them. And so much more. Its a POV from their shoes but also how others perceive them. And it all happens on so many levels. That's exactly why we spend so much time with these two detectives and their beliefs. And its done so masterfully, it still blows my mind. Cheers !!
Any questions? Cosmic horror, period. Lovecraft.
Rust has a lot of wicked badass lines this season, but “do I strike you as more of a talker or a doer?” after emptying a clip into the car is the undefeated No. 1.
Yep. Nobody ever quotes that one but it's great. And Rust ain't lying.
rust removing a knife from a fatal stab wound that he would obviously know it’s better to leave it in. The man felt he paid his debt.
Greatest single season of television ever filmed ❤ it was great watching y’all along this journey
18:17 - A posh English accent coming out of a guy like that in the backwoods of Louisiana would be so out of place that they'd think he was nuts for sure.
He sounded exactly like James Mason when doing that accent.
Part of the theme of Lovecraftian Horror is making you question things and not giving you all of the answers. Fear of the unknown is a major aspect of Lovecraft so not knowing or not fully explaining manages to add to the fear it instills in you as the audience in this scenario. Not knowing if this cult actually has something supernatural influencing them. Not knowing if what Rust was seeing was the true Carcosa and he had some kind of deeper insight into the world with his visions or if they were just a mundane mental problem he was experiencing.
Great ending to a singular series. I love that Rust finally found a way to challenge his nihilism. Like he wanted *something* to matter, he just needed a reason.
I've seen S1 so many times, after the first watch I also felt like I had questions I wanted answering. Now I see it as more of a character analysis and the case is secondary to that. I focus more on the multi-faceted nature of the characters, the philosophies, personal lives, and the potential to enact "bad" actions in the name of the good, and if those actions are always justified, etc.
Without any concrete answers I just assume there was a large pagan (or satanic idk) p***phile ring/cult that included cops, the church etc with their own janky beliefs and philosophies. I also assume Errol Childress (main villain) was the ringleader or close to the top. By getting him it would at least bring the crime rate down because I think around that area he was the one committing most of those murders. He probably committed the murder we see at the beginning of ep1 given the ceremony of it all
I think he was an off-shoot, not highly placed within the main cult.
So guys, very sorry for this long sheet of a comment, but I hope you find it useful and maybe it will clear a few things up (at least as I have it in my head, after watching the show multiple times).
The series has no plot holes. There are indeed unanswered questions, but it's only those that don't really need answering at all, as you pointed out in your reaction as well. For example, what does it matter what exactly was told to the convict in that phone call to have him end himself? Probably a Tuttle lawyer told him that he e-ffed up by telling Rust about the Yellow King and advised him to do it or they'll give him a much more painful death in prison (notice that one of his prison guards is a Childress). It's not that deep, and it's not important. And same goes as to why the series doesn’t answer any questions regrading the Cult's exact beliefs; it's because it simply doesn’t matter. That's not the point of the series. No matter how freaky it might look, the cult's beliefs are not real, that's what the series wants you to take from the show. Sam Tuttle (scarred man's grandfather) was the one who started this cult way back, and based the beliefs of it in fictional mythology by already existing authors (e.g. Lovecraft, Chambers etc) combined with a load of stuff he made up. It was all fake sh*t made up by an evil, degnrate man and his keen (most worked themselves up in higher places, just like in real life, so they could cover up for themselves, while others, like the Ledoux and Childress families, remained low and conveniently invisible) in order to give themselves and whoever fell into their claws a fake justification to commit their horrific crimes and somewhat justify the sickness of their brains.
I understand that part of the audience might have been curious as to the exact beliefs and "philosophy" of the cult, but here's the thing. Question: have you ever looked into any real-world cult's beliefs? I guarantee you, it's all vague s*it that make absolutely zero sense to any sane, sober person. Every single time. Why? Because none of it is real! They make it all up based on preexisting works of fiction or religious texts. That's the case in the series as well.
The point was exactly what I highlighted above - that there was never anything truly spiritual about it. There are no supernatural forces there. The cult is a fraud, a way for these sick men to justify their desire to s-a and end the lives of children and women. At the end of the day, the only evil out there is inside humans, and this is the only real, absolute cosmic horror.
Also, there was nothing unsolved in the mystery - Rust and Marty solved the entire thing. It's just that they didn't manage to get every single person responsible, because the higher-ups (like Eddie Tuttle, the governor - only mentioned in the show) got themselves covered. But I do believe the whole cult basically dies with Betty (the creepy woman in the house). Sam Tuttle (only mentioned) has been long gone, Billy Tuttle (reverent, we saw him twice) was ended by the cult after Rust's break-in, and Billy Childress (sheriff, only mentioned, he's the father of Erroll, the dead man he kept in that creepy barn) is also dead, and now Rust ended Erroll as well. It would be too risky for any remaining members to continue with the cult, as we can assume they will be highly monitored from that point on, and their reputations ruined.
I do think you would really enjoy a rewatch and also take a look at some Tuttle family trees, because several of your questions have already been answered throughout the series, but it's just that it's easy to get lost and forget stuff or get confused (for example, the name of the man with the scars, who is Dora Lange's killer, is Erroll, not Billy - Billy was his father, and his grandfather was Sam, also dead) especially if you're only watching once a week. I love this series so much, Rust and Marty are one of my favorite duos ever, and I would definitely enjoy you reacting even in the rewatch as well lol, or even just a conversation with your additional thoughts after your rewatch. You're my favorite reactors out there. Thanks and take care!
Perfect analysis 🔥 this is definitely a series that is worth several rewatches. I must have watched it 10+ times and I find something new every time.
No ending to a show or movie has ever made me cry harder than True Detective season 1.
The guy at the bar that had their back with the rifle is a real one. Someone that will have your back no matter what🙏 he been through enough
The first and third seasons of True Detective derive stylistically from what we call the Southern Gothic genre, which often deals with alienation, poverty and strange characters. When the siblings (?) have that weird sexual interaction in the beginning, she mentions the grandfather abusing her. A horrific fact that would make anyone who's normal alarmed, not aroused, but they get turned on. They have become completely twisted by the normalization of pedophilic practices, both have grown up amidst abuse, pedophilia and bizarre family relations. It's a way of showing that the whole family and who knows who else is involved in this ("We didn't catch them all"), and that evil can fester in unsuspecting parts of the world that otherwise seem normal, which is a very Southern Gothic theme.
Notice the thing with the skulls in the last chamber has yellowish robes. That's the Yellow King, and he was probably revered like a god in their cult. Probably many sacrifices were made to him in that place.
Woody Harrelson’s theory that Matthew McConaughey might be his real life brother made perfect sense to me after seeing them together for this series. I know they’ve known each other for a long time but still the characters as a duo here are perfection
Once there was only dark. The lights winning.
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, since you guys have finished, Carcosa and the Yellow King are based on Lovecraft's writing, that's why it feels as if Carcosa is another realm. On the story of the Yellow King, he would take children and mess with their heads through nightmares very much like the Yellow King does in True Detective, but with LSD.
Just a little note about headbutts --
You don't butt your head into the other guy's head, you do what Rust did: You headbutt the guy in the nose and keep doing it. Your head is harder than the guy's nose and that will get the guy off you.
I too was expecting a crazy twist or something in this finale but on reflection it doesn't need that to be a superb final episode. It's nice Marty explained they couldn't possibly get everyone involved but they got their man, who was definitely the most deranged of the bunch.
I don’t think Rust would have schooled him. Rust is one of my top three favorite tv and movie characters ever. But Childress has a strength and ability gained by the occult practices he conducts. People don’t just drop when they’re shot most of the time. Even with larger rounds than the .38 Marty used. Unless you destroy a vital component. Which Marty did not. But on that same note, again, Childress is not a “normal” guy.
Love. Love. Love! I totally agree with @menolikey's statement, "The magic of this season will never be recaptured." ♥
This is maybe the best season of a TV show ever. Perfect writing, directing and acting.
Probably one of the single best seasons of any television show ever. It's definitely gotta be a short list, too.
Additional comment, because your reaction to the show really reminded me how very much I have it in my heart. I absolutely adore how character driven the show is. The character work on both Marty and Rust is immaculate. I'm looking at how Marty has grown from a lighthearted, goofy guy who had no self control and was always willing to make all kinds of excuses for his own weaknesses and bad traits to a mature man who knows himself, recognizes his mistakes and accepts and respects other people's limits and privacy (it's also worth noting that Marty's true potential as a detective is only unlocked once he's finally stopped chasing around women half his age and has truly committed to what's really important, giving us the final clue to the killer). And at how Rust finally comes to accept that maybe, just maybe, he doesn't know everything; maybe he's not completely right, maybe there are more things in this world and beyond it that he doesn't know about, and that despite all the ugliness and evil in the world there is still good in it and things worth living for.
And I love how their friendship has grown as well, against all odds. I wouldn't be surprised if Marty was the only real friend Rust ever had. I believe that Rust, being so good at reading people so fast, immediately upon meeting Marty realized that he was a simple, genuine person who always spoke exactly what he had in mind and nothing else, and that despite all his many flaws, he didn't have anything truly evil in him. I think he really appreciated that, and that this is what made him always trust Marty (we never saw him truly trusting anyone else). That's why he's so upset at Marty in 2002, when Marty doesn't support him against their boss, and quite obviously disappointed in him when he realizes he's cheating on Maggie once again. We've only seen Rust losing his temper twice in the series; once when he realized they hadn't caught the actual Dora Lange killer, and another time after he had sex with Maggie. The second time he was quite obviously deeply hurt, not just because Maggie knew he had some desire for her and used him regardless, but first and foremost because he thought he lost the only real friend he ever had.
On Marty's side, as he says himself, he's always been a people person, always had people around him to hang around and have fun with, but we never really see him having an actual friendship with anyone other than Rust. At first, Marty doesn't get Rust. He's a simple person who doesn't like drifting into deep thoughts, and Rust is way too complicated for him to grasp. But when he finds out about his losses, everything immediately becomes clear to him. This, he can fully understand, and Marty has a whole lot of empathy, if nothing else. It's after that that he starts relaxing around him a little more (I think Pudgey noted in that episode how Marty now seems to even find Rust's jokes funny etc). He's the first one who calls Rust his friend later on (when they head to a bar after Marty made a scene at the hospital). He then trusts Rust of all people to help out in that first big drift with Maggie, and his mind is only put at ease about it when Rust tells him he can see them getting back together in a couple of months - he greatly values his instincts and opinions. Maggie chooses to have sex with Rust rather with anyone else because, as she says herself, this would be the only thing that would truly hurt Marty and would guarantee he'd be out of her life from then on - because she very well knew that Rust is the only person Marty considers as his real friend (if it was anyone else, he'd have forgiven her instantly and would have insisted in 'saving' their marriage etc). During his chat with the new detectives, when he says he hasn't talked to Rust in ten years, he sounds deeply sad about it, despite everything that happened.
At the end of it all, Marty has his family by his side (because the fact that the marriage has definitely ended - notice how Maggie is married to a different man in 2012 - doesn't mean the family ends as well) in the hospital. And then you get all sad, because Rust has no one. But immediately, the show tells you with the very next scene that nope, he's not alone; he has Marty.
Their friendship is beautiful, the characters are incredible, and I love this show so much.
I really would love it if you guys watched the other seasons too. I know everyone touts this as the best single season of TV, but the other seasons are absolutely amazing too. It’s just a shame because they are different, that this one just overshadows them because people fell in love with this one so much when it aired. Season 2 and 3 and Night Country are very good TV
First, the code switch by the killer is to indicate to the audience that this man is no mere dumb hick, he is in fact extremely intelligent (this is also clued in by the plethora of books scattered around the house) and a formidable adversary for Marty and Rust. 2nd Childress was an absolute unit, having the physical strength to pick up Rust like that, I'm sorry, in a 1 on 1 fight, Rust get rekt by this guy, it would be like me fighting a highly-skilled 6 year old, or an welterweight MMA champ fighting a WSM champ, the size and strength advantage is just too great.
👍👍💯💯✌✌
Season 2 is actually brilliant but people "hated" it because everyone expected that S2 will be the same as S1 and that we will continue with Rust and Marty and if not them, there will at least be cults and stuff. But it is new story with new characters, but at the same time it has many great elements from S1 and amazing actors, atmosphere, acting, music, writing. Everyone can have different opinions, but i feel the negative stuff some people say about S2 is simply not fair. S3 was also good but not as good as S1 and S2. The latest S4 felt the most different out of all of them for many reasons and i liked it too, but not as much as the first three.
10:00 The girls doing circles...You find details like this all over the season on a 2nd or 3rd watch.
Watching this show when it aired live weekly was one of the best TV viewing experiences ever. Added to that was some of the crazy theories people were coming up with every week on reddit threads. But that also left the feeling of wanting more when it did end, just like how you felt. We wanted more answers on the bigger picture, taking down the higher ups that were involved etc. But the direction they went in was still good, they got their man and I guess it was an unrealistic expectation for them to solve everything.
To understand all the references about Carcosa, The Yellow King, flat circle, the great whirl in the space you should read all the base of horror literature H.P. Lovecraft, Poe, Ambrose Birse, Stephen King... last vision the spiral is Lovecraft's Depiction of the Hasture (Yellow king) ancient god of evel, Ted Childress is his human avatar in this world, Rust is human avatar of ancient hero priest Mani (ancient religion Manichaeism) , the soul of the hero is stuck in Carcosa, (Ambrose Birse) and could not understand that he already dead, he has to born again and again in eternal reincarnation in human avatar to fight with Hasture in his human avatar, and only after hero priest finishes his mission his soul can escape from Carcosa... only to reincarnate again in other avatar not recalling that he already dead and his soul stuck in Carcosa... again... and again.... ancient fight of the evil god and human priest son of a man...
A masterpiece of a series. Thank you for watching and reacting to this one, I must say you guys were super invested and inquisitive about so much. I love how you both voice your opinions and thoughts, but also share when you don't know exactly what's going on. It'd be easy to pretend you know every little detail but nobody picks everything up in this show first time around. Looking forward to Band of Brothers - I'm planning to watch along as I haven't seen it before!
Amazing how Matthew McConaughey went from Rom Coms to that final scene.
After watching you guys react to this, I'm convinced it's the best season of television ever.
24:40 The Yellow King
31:58 It wasn't a storm. It was the cosmos.
The part about the stars and the light winning is Rust finally becoming somewhat of an optimist, as he made it clear in episode 1 he thought life was essentially meaningless, he found it in the end.
I'd recommend watching the later seasons even if they are unrelated and not as good. Still worth a watch at some point.
True Detective S1 is up there with best TV ever made. S2 is a drop in quality (hard to stay at S1 level) but is actually a bit underrated. S3 was very good and deserves a reaction. I couldn't finish S4
If I remember correctly one of the detectives who arrested the guy who killed himself was named Childress. So he would have alerted the powers that be that this guy is talking. I can only assume they threatened to kill the guys family as part of their rituals if he didn't off himself.
It was one of the officers who walked Francis to and from his cell when he got the call from his "lawyer". As Rust is watching the surveillance tape you see the officer lean forward and say something to him as they walk away from his cell. Nobody ever catches that Chilldress connection.
I think you guys should keep going with this series. All the seasons stand alone, though season 4 has a lot of echoes of season 1. Broadly speaking, I think season 2 is least popular, but I still loved it.
you two were perfect companions re-watching this perfect tv series..........don't believe i'll be first (or last) to make this observation: to have the eternal pessimist to deliver the last, optimistic, line of the episode/series was the absolute cherry on top.............thanks so much for sharing.
Okay I just watched all of this reaction now
Yes - they only solved one part of the case. This is an intersecting family crime ring that is expansive. There are still cover ups going on and more crime will go on. That’s the point too of the end comment. When they both talk about the dark having more space but then Rust saying once there was only dark - seems to me the light is winning. It’s like the case - they only solved one part BUT they solved that one part.
Easily one of the best single seasons of TV, glad you and enjoyed it and thank you for sharing your reactions.
Pretty sure you do NOT want to understand the philosophy of the cult - nothing about it will be anything except revolting.
The problem with seasons with seasons 2, 3 and 4 us that everybody expected thus level od story telling all over agai ! I think 2 and 4 were excellent, 3 was okay. But the leads, Mathew and absolutely matched the level of writing!!! P.s. a rewatch is absolutely nessasary, the rhythm of the spoken language and the pace of the writing match up perfectly!!!! Gotta say b and of brothers is amazing! And Pudgy, you look fantastic!!!!👍👏👏👏🥰
Truly a great story! It really seems like the two main actors/producers (Harrison and Matthew) really were passionate about the project.
”Once there was only dark…”
Just as powerful every time.
Season 2 is worth a watch. Different but good.
Best Lovecraft-ian show ever.. flat circle, light versus dark
Awesome reaction guys!!! That last scene always gets me😢
Nobody ever gets all the bad guys. They did the best they could and got Childress. This was worth the years of pain.
And realistically, no matter how cool a character is, in a "grounded" more reality based narrative a man's journey isn't always winning against a foe. Most time, if you live, you transform from the experience of survival against a foe. That's truly what life is about.
This season will go through generations
I believe the killer changing accents showed that while we view him as a crazy person (which he was) he was also very clever which is how he got away with it for so long.
The beauty of a well crafted story, it's perfect it's an anthology series. Because how could you write another season of these two taking on another case. One that could possibly match this seasons. You couldn't, it would just diminish the show (as a whole). Like you, I had heard the first season was great, and i loved it when i watched it. I watched the first ep of the second season and it didn't hook me the same way, so it's something I will eventually go back to later. This where I once again plug DARK. Speaking about a well crafted story, 3 seasons, all pre-planned. Its honesty one of the best shows ive ever seen. I just finished the frist season of "The Terror", which is also a 'good' show that is book based and has roots to real world events. And lastly THE LAST KINGDOM, in one of your live streams Spartan mentions he was a big fan of the show "Vikings". IMO TLK is better. Plus there is a movie that ties up the story (movie released in 2023).
Hey Spartan and Pudgey, I hope you're not watching this at night. The lawnmower man gave me nightmares in that final scene. ------- His voice is true terror. He kept calling Rust to come and find him in the backyard/woods. --------- Especially Pudgey, I know your hands were shaking like a branch in a hurricane. Proper metaphor for the amount of anxiety this show gave you at the end.
I think “perfectly imperfect” describes it *perfectly*. :) We don’t get every answer to every mystery, but I feel like that stays true to the nature of the story (and the nature of detective & police work in general; every answer leads to another question)… Anyway, such a great show. Marty & Rust are legends.
There was something magical created here, a one of a kind unique experience, with some insanely good chemistry between this amazing duo, masterclass acting to say the least ! Memorable beyond words in just a span of 8 episodes ! Savor this moment, nothing comes close to this perfection. Its literally the best 1 season show I have ever seen. I can only compare it to Chernobyl which is also absolute perfection. So many years after, nothing diminishes its value. It gets even better on subsequent viewings too.
S02 is good for different reasons. And I do recommend it even though its quite different in tone and style.
Just don't expect it to be as perfect as this was. Enjoy it for what it is.
One of the best if not the best Series ever
I would definitely recommend watching the "Inside the Episode" that plays after each episode with the creator Nic Pizzolatto explaining more details for these questions that you have.
First season is absolutely incredible.
BUT season 2 is too in its own way, if you come to it open minded, you will love it.
Its so unfairly ovehated.
The story sucks, the dialogue is cringe and there are too many characters to care about. It’s very fairly maligned.
Along the shore the cloud waves break,
The twin suns sink behind the lake,
The shadows lengthen
In Carcosa.
Strange is the night where black stars rise,
And strange moons circle through the skies,
But stranger still is
Lost Carcosa.
Songs that the Hyades shall sing,
Where flap the tatters of the King,
Must die unheard in
Dim Carcosa.
Song of my soul, my voice is dead,
Die thou, unsung, as tears unshed
Shall dry and die in
Lost Carcosa.
-"Cassilda's Song" in The King in Yellow Act 1, Scene 2
Love the two sides of Childress and how despite being a savage psychopath murderer and degenerate he clearly extremely intelligent and perceptive.
The first season of this show was spectacular. I also enjoyed the 3rd. While it isn't as good as the first I do think it is underrated. Also, Stephen Dorff and Mahershala Ali were great in it.
You guys absolutely need to do the Leftovers. Three seasons like nothing you’ve seen before. And the finish is muah chef’s kiss
Once there was only Spartan. Now I think the Pudgey is winning...
🤣
This series works great because of the characters!!!
Matthew Mcconaughey and Woody Harrelson rock togheter. Perfect duo
The storm he saw was the swirl symbol that kept showing up in the show
Wild ride folks!!! Now time for another!!! Get on that Banshee… no one has done it yet… be the first… you won’t be disappointed…
That was no Rusts vision.. he saw real Carcosa, surrounded by black stars.
And there was no answer toward all that, because you cant have answer to that. its a cosmic horror, its something unfathomable. We just had opportunity to see 1 smallest piece of someone being influenced by the Yellow King, and doing things in his name. But non of it cant be comprehend from human stand point, thats why they respected it(Lovecraft's & Chambers material) by not even going in to it.
Or it was a hallucination. Nothing else in the show requires anything supernatural.
@@Corn_Pone_Flicks I don't see why would Rust hallucinate something SO specific, in that moment. In place where they sacrificed people(which means room itself has some great value to the cult).
In my opinion it was not a hallucination.. Rust never hallucinated such things, this was not a moving light, this was something complex, something alive.
Also I think Rust was a perfect person to actually see Carcosa. His world views are actually perfect for Yellow King to slither his tentacles through dimensions, and poke his mind.
I heard people saying "Maybe the killers read King in Yellow and created a cult around it"..and if that was the case, you think Rust would not connect the words Yellow King to Chambers and Lovecraft, and mention them? Fact he didn't, means they do not exist in this universe.. why wouldn't they exist? Because it is Their universe we are in.
@@Corn_Pone_Flicks and yes, that was the whole point.. the show was not about supernatural things. Yet still it was in that universe. That's the whole beauty of it.
You will find more answers if you watch the season again.
FYI- Matthew & Woody have came out and said they could be brothers. Related through their dad!
Those were siblings 🫢🫢
Yeah half sister and brother
God, the actress that payed starlight used to be sooo beautiful. Its so sad that she was bullied and shamed into surgery by trolls. . .
The Diet Jesus girls hated Marty so much they thought Maggie had gotten remarried at the end 😂😂😂 they DID NOT want him happy 😂😂
Thank yoi for the journey! One of the best series I've ever seen
Rust and Marty did a movie together in the 90's called EdTV
1:00 I think they're very close and good friends in real life, so that explains the great chemistry.
Probably the best single season of television ever made.
Never has a show been so well driven by the main characters and their dynamic. I think many of those terms of time, circle and stars are to do with the cult activities in that chamber with the hole in the ceiling where Rust shot the scarred killer. I suspect the video of the child murders was also filmed there.
End of a journey you two, epic 8 part masterful art. Also i believe childress was calling Rust
Little priest due to him being the states best man to get confessions. Like the guy who told Rust The yellow king was still out there he said he had heard of “him”. I can imagine especially after reggie and dewall were dispatched everyone including the yellow king knew who Rust was. Also hope ur bday was dope Spartan 🎉
I hope you guys consider watching season 4, which just recently came out several months ago. I thought it was decent and very weird, like this one. Jodie Foster (Clarice from Silence of the Lambs) stars in it.
Okay, so, regarding the remaining seasons: No, none of them expand on this story...they're all individual cases. Season 2 is very much like a James Ellroy novel (he wrote L.A. Confidential), and it's fairly similar in style to that. It's not at all like this season, but I enjoy it. Season 3 is more similar in terms of the case being stretched over a long time and occurring in multiple time frames, as well as being tonally similar. Season 4 is a mess, and wasn't written by the original showrunner. The final episode is the lowest-ranked episode of any of the four seasons, because its explanation is very unsatisfying, and many things go unexplained-not little things, but major plot points. It would be like if this series never answered who killed Dora Lang.
Ultimately we are just knowing what Marty and Rust know. They got the guy. Why the guy, who they all are cant be answered since we arent seeing the story, we are seeing Marty and Rusts POV only
its perfect 8 episodes,i suggest to every friend i have to watch it even before GOT and BB