Music Chat: Yet Another Attempt To Give Spohr's Symphonies A Chance
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ธ.ค. 2023
- Will the fiftieth or sixtieth listening prove to be the charm for this hapless cycle of ten formerly popular (at least some of them were) symphonies? Or is life simply too short?
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I see what you are doing here. When you start the year with Spohr; it can only get better from there.
As the saying goes: Let a hundred flowers bloom. When you're sitting in the morning, stretching your legs with a cup of coffee and your paper - Spohr is an excellent choice. Besides, my wife forbids me to turn on Beethoven or Brahms in our car. You will kill us all, she says. So, I always have for family trips my Hummel, my Ries, my Spohr.
Happy New Year, Dave, and all who will watch this. I hope this year is fruitful. Take courage, everyone.
Happy NewYear. Surprise, I was listening today to Louis Spohr sinfonies 1& 6. Not all composers can be a genius. And this reminds us what makesmozart and Beethoven great!
You are an inspiration! I love Spohr's music very much (even listening to the worst one, it gives me a feeling of being at home) and I really appreciate that you are always trying with him. Maybe I should do the same with Berlioz... which I find generally untalented, effect-based and dull. I avoid his music as much as I can, but maybe I should be as brave as you are with Spohr!
Perhaps a video on Spohr's great violin duos or his nonet and octet or other worthy chamber music would be merited.
Dave best wishes for 2024 and keep up the good work!
I sort of like Spohr. Another one like him is Pleyel. I know people scoff, and there are plenty of better composers; but I think, after you have heard lots of the stuff you're supposed to hear, it's fun to see who else was around. You get a sense of the spirit of the Age, and some of the music is quite nice, even if it is not groundbreaking.
Spohr's music is the very essence of an "acquired taste," which one has to work very hard to acquire. It requires context, and I think the best context is that of the Biedermeier, with its elevated valuation of craftsmanship and middle-class taste. So you wind up listening to the musical equivalent of well-made furniture. Interestingly, it is probably no coincidence that the literature of this period winds up in the same basket as the music. BTW, he wasn't alone in his distaste for Beethoven; Weber actually shared his feelings.
Lots of people disliked Beethoven. Many still do.
I know a few, and they're musicologists. Fortunately, the ones I know don't try to destroy Beethoven through performance
About all I know about Spohr was from a review in the March-April 1984 Fanfare by the late William Younger of a recording of his oratorio "Die Letzten Dinge" (based on the Book of Revelation and its depiction of the end of the world). He wrote that Spohr is regarded as an influence on Wagner in general and "Tristan und Isolde" in particular, and then goes on to make some of the same comments about Spohr that you did: "What was remarkable, though, was the almost absolutely unbroken, untroubled surface of the music, which depicts, from first to last, placid, earnest, featureless blessedness. Not even a line like 'Er kommt, der Tag der Schrecken kommt' rouses Spohr to produce a dramatic event. And the most famous (if that's the word) section, the double-quartet 'Selig sind die Toten' that comes near the end, sounded for all the world like one of those college songs that seniors join hands to sing on the night before graduation ('Strangers once, we came to dwell together, born of a mother wise and true' - so runs the one from my college: you get the idea.)
"But what puzzles and fascinates me is that the experience of listening to 'Die Letzten Dinge,' though in no way an interesting experience, was not in the least irritating. Nor was it precisely a musical experience - more like a long hot bath or other muscle relaxant. It's impossible to be irritated by such unrelieved sweetness and generosity of nature as Spohr displays (and goes on and on displaying) in this work. There might just possibly be something very interesting going on here in the way that Spohr fills up his immense stretches of musical time, something that Wagner's genius responded to. But to determine that, one would have to put in more study of 'Die Letzten Dinge' than I plan to do just now."
I definitely get what you're saying. I find the most listenable (and actually quite good) music by Spohr is his later chamber music, like the piano trios; that said, his early nonet actually set a genre in motion, and definitely has legs. His piano quintet was a quite successful grappling with what Schumann had done, probably the first "name" composer to have picked up on the new genre, with only occasional lapses into classical-style formula. Worth a listen!
There are other composers more deserving of a re-evaluation of their work than Spohr's. I have his complete piano trios, which I like, but much of his symphonies are just consisting of endless repetition of motifs. Well-crafted but not special enough to make for highly engaged listening.
Another composer I would like to see renewed interest in is Christian Sinding. Haven't heard a single work of his which I don't like - and when I say 'like' I mean not just 'it's alright' but I mean liking enthousiastically, yet, and heard almost every single work of his that has been commercially recorded. His piano quintet for instance is one of my favourite works in the genre and each of his 4 symphonies are an absolute delight to listen to and haven't left my phone after I downloaded all of them via a TH-cam to mp3 website. He was a great writer of memorable tunes and a good orchestrator, but also a master of form and perhaps most importantly, his music is full of energy and makes very engaging listening material.
He wrote some pretty uninteresting symphonies.
Happy New Year, dear mr. Hurwitz! Thank you for all the great videos. And a Happy New Year to all your listeners out there!
Spohr's chamber music is wonderful and his 'Die Letzten Dinge' is a masterpiece, in my humble opinion. Must confess I haven't listened closely to this symphonies, but I'd probably enjoy them too. Of 19th century no-longer-popular composers, he's up there with Raff and Lekeu (who died very young but whose 'Andromede' I listen to regularly).
You've just reminded me of an article I read in the erstwhile "Radio 3 Magazine" of April 1984, entitled "Consistent and Forgotten" Lionel Salter considers the music of Louis Spohr.
I have been really enjoying listening to all his symphonies, thanks very much for the video.
Spohr in '24!
Spohr seems to be stronger in shorter forms. I agree the symphonies are hit or miss. However, his overtures are something I return to often. The CPO release of his overtures is a must have. The Achylmist being my favorite.
Can't really disagree with your overall assessment, but I'm glad that you revisit the music and urge others to give it a try. An open mind is important, lest too much of a "pile-on" mentality takes over here. HOWEVER...Spohr's Concerto for String Quartet and Orchestra, op. 131 is a masterpiece, and I don't feel I'm overstating it. Anyone who wants at least ONE Spohr work in their collection should look for the recording conducted by Sebastian Weigel on the MDG label. Owning this work will assuage any guilt, since you can always say "See.. I have ONE work by Spohr that's good." LR
Spohr isn't annoying like Wagner, he's just boring. Perhaps Stokowski should have recorded some of Spohr's symphonies.
It seems to me that Raff is a much better bet to spend a few hours on.
Ok, I am not listening the symphonies, but Clarinet Concerto no. 1 in Naxos' recording with Ernst Ottensamer. A good piece of music, very nice recorded and a cheap price. So, I will try the symphonies in the future.
Happy new year David!
Happy New Year and fine listenings! I started this 2024 with "Candide" and "Sir John in Love", which both surely give more pleasure than Spohr. But what do you think about "Jessonda"? In my view - well, it's not a great masterpiece, but much more interesting than the symphonies and a romantic opera which seems to have enjoyed young Wagner. (Although I admit that the "Faust" is boring beyond belief!)
I was always most impressed that Spohr wrote a concerto for string quartet and orchestra, something nobody else did. Nowadays, nobody even seems to perform the Gesangszene concerto, which was once very popular, especially when Heifetz promoted it.
I was at a performance of the quartet concerto once by the St. Louis Symphony, and the audience was so audibly bored and even angry that they had to sit through it, it's made me scared of Spohr from then on.
This makes me think of the Salieri character in "Amadeus." He KNEW, even if his admirers did not.
I am not *that* familiar with Spohr - I think that I maybe have his Nonet Opus 31 somewhere, maybe hidden away on an anthology CD. 🙂
But I admire your repeated attempts to get to like Spohr's symphonic output. And then I also can't help thinking of W.C. Fields: "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again. Then quit. There's no point in being a damn fool about it". 😉
Happy Spohr Year, Dave.
Cheers!
UPDATE: I purchased a few of the Spohr cycle CD's (couldn't see paying $56 for the whole set). From one of the reviews on Amazon, a Berlin publisher is coming out with a critical edition of these works. Dave, could you confirm this rumor. If true, is there a Spohr cult behind it.
Well at least this video will make the random reviews in reverse alphabetical order move a little quicker. Spohr would be around the corner. Can’t wait for the P’s, late R’a and early S’s
Enlightening! I've heard Spohr only by chance and courtesy of my car radio, and it always seems to be the same piece. The theme is an obvious rip-off of the final movement of Beethoven's Symphony 2, with all its rambunctiousness eliminated. A style consisting "almost entirely of inhibitions" would certainly account for that. Anyone here know what that piece is? I'm just barely curious.
After listening to his clarinet concerti I have found that Spohr was a better composer for chamber music than symphonies. A bit more (?) passion than in the symphonies
Ahahah..very funny
How do you know so much recording and...music?
I listen a lot.
I do the same exercise every year with Messiaen's Turangalîla-Symphonie, and every year I just end up irritated and cranky. Your description of Spohr's music reminds me of another critic's summation of the work of Hans Pfitzner, "the musical equivalent of erectile dysfunction." I suppose I could give it a try.
Spohr or erectile dysfunction?
@@DavesClassicalGuide Whichever is easiest.
I tried a set of his very first movement loaded double string quartets. Just not very interesting.
Dave, are you into progressive rock music?
I used to be.
@@DavesClassicalGuide What bands were you into?
I also feel guilty about not liking Spohr enough. Thematically uninteresting and, as Dave says, lack of impulse to the argument. However, I often find his orchestration ingenious. I also prefer his chamber music.
I’m here to represent the cohort that feels not the slightest pang of guilt over a lack of interest or appreciation in the music of Louis Spohr.
I can understand that. It's just that his contemporaries liked his music and there are certain interesting features. I'm just not sure I get it enough to dismiss it. On the other hand, I'm not as diligent as Dave. I haven't listened to Spohr in years.
Both Spohr and Beethoven were natural outgrowths from the classical period, each going down a different road of musical exploration. But history made its decision, and Spohr's road became a dead-end. But it's a fascinating detour, because as uninteresting as he is, his music is very much his own at a time when Kalkbrenner, Pixis, Czerny and Reis were pretty much interchangeable.
But no one needs a box of this stuff. I am fond of Symphony no. 2, or at least the final 3 moements. The first movement is unbearable, repeating the same theme over and over until you want to defenstrate your speakers. But the rest of the symphony is very enjoyable light music of the crowd-pleasing variety.
In ten years, it's the 250th anniversary of Spohr's birth. See you in 2034! (Meanwhile, Bruckner ... 🐴)
I've found his music pleasant and sometimes interesting, causing my ears to perk up from time to time, but so far, never moving or memorable, alas.
If at first you don't succeed, try, try again! Thanks.
Sad to say, the old comment on Wagner, Spohr's has great moments but terrible quarters of an hour (IMHO boring)...
My God Spohr is boring... I mean nothing really stays with you, not the music, not the instrumentation, nothing! His contemporary Ferdinand Ries is certainly a bit more interesting, he also had the good fortune of studying with Beethoven, I like his symphony nº 7 quite a bit!
Spohr is a bore. It's that simple. His music will never have an appreciable audience, there's so much very finer music to explore.