Expensive and a lot of the battery storage area is inverters and the inverter computers use a lot of the stored battery power to run the computers in the system and the system goes from DC to AC to DC at least 3 or 4 times and each time you lose electricity due to heat created. If you have a small number of solar panels (limited solar panels) there are better options.
Joe said at the start of the video he was not going to cover (battery only systems) which is what an EG4 is, this was his 2024 whole (all in one) system review.
If you get the Flexboss/Gridboss combination, it has time of use settings. Also has four smart breakers for load control and main breaker for a backup panel. With the 14.3 power pro batteries, it is an awesome system and less expensive than any of the systems in this video.
Why no mention of MidNite Solar's PowerFlo 16 battery? Seems to top all reviewed here. This LFP battery has 16 kW of storage, comes with a 15 yr warranty, and is half the price of Powerwall 3.
5. SolarEdge batteries and products are made in the United States and South Korea. 4. Enphase batteries and products are now made in the US (South Carolina), they used to be made in China but moved to the USA. 3. Point Guard batteries and products are made in the USA, made in the Sacramento California area. 2. Tesla Powerwall 3s are manufactured in Sparks, Nevada at Tesla's Gigafactory 1. Franklin Whole Home (FranklinWH) batteries and parts are manufactured in Shenzhen, China.
@@bernielennox1031 - It could very easily matter if you are trying to get the US tax rebates and i'll take American made quality every day of the week over Chinese made!
@@bernielennox1031 It could very easily matter a whole lot if you are trying to get the US tax rebates and I will take USA made over Chinese made every day of the week.
@@Bowhunters6go8xz6x most of the best renewable tech is made in China. It's unfortunate, but China is dominating the sector largely because of the lack of consistent US policy. It's cheaper and better in most cases and where things are comparable for capability it isn't comparable for price. They produce more than 10x what the US does for global export and we just can't match the economies of scale necessary to compete on price at this point. I'm all for supporting US products, but only if quality, price, and customer support are good.
Joe, very informative presentation per usual! A few questions and points for further discussion: 1. Battery and inverter manufacturers are still thinking way too small! Silicon/perovskite panels will hit the market soon with efficiencies pushing 30%, 10% higher than the average silicon panel. Also, global warming is causing more frequent outages and higher utility monopoly prices (from higher liability, fire clearing, line damage,,etc.). Add decreasing battery prices and it make more sense for most home and small business owners to aim for going completely or mostly off grid. The typical house will need only 50 kWhs of storage and 15 kWs of panels to take the typical 3 bedroom home off grid across most of the US! This includes charging an EV or two! We are at a disruption point where residential electricity monopolies now face their biggest competition from their own customers! We can now produce and store all or most of the electricity needed to power our homes and cars. This will be a goldmine for the company that can make an affordable 50 kWh battery/inverter/controller! Putting solar on rooftops and in backyards and batteries in garages will make the entire electric grid more efficient and resistant to outages. And, it’ll save us trillions in power line construction! 2. It seems like heat pump water heaters and heating and cooling systems, microwaves, clothes washers, as well as home lighting and induction stoves should be DC going forward. It doesn’t make sense to have to convert from DC solar panels to AC for running big stuff in our homes. Too inefficient! And, microinverters don’t make sense anymore! Run the panels with different orientations on different strings! Charge your car directly from your panels or home battery, and vice versa with out switching back and forth from DC to AC. 3. Enphase and even Tesla batteries are laughably small! Talk about the home energy equivalent of range anxiety! Instead of making 5 and 8 and 13 kWh batteries, the primary sizes should be 50 and 10 kWh! 4. PointGuard’s modular architecture is the most efficient, easy to install, and easy to expand! Though their batteries should come as 50 kWh and 10 kWh modules. Or perhaps 10 and 20 to keep weight down? And, having the car charger integrity the battery, inverter and controller is brilliant!
Tesla needs BOTH generator and Span load control. I would like to think that the Gateway could be modified to include a generator input that could recharge the battery. It could not be that hard, right? Franklin figured it out. In fact, why not integrate Span load control and generator support? While they’re at it, make the PW3 inverter field replaceable and include battery expansion for slave PW3s?
What about EP Cube?They are very cost effective, ac/dc coupled, generator input, etc. DYI friendly and have a great support team that answers the phone when you call. ??
You forgot to include LG RESU10H Prime batteries coupled with SolarEdge inverters. Best bang for the bucks and highest current draw compared to the SolarEdge Battery Bank.
I'm a little surprised by some of the picks over something like the Anker Solid X1 or RoyPow. Both seem better than a few of your picks. A lot of good options these days.
Great video! Thanks for the summary. I think another great video similar to this approach would be non standalone systems like Sol Ark or EG4 and paired batteries. Little more complex video, but in many ways those are superior builds for the user that doesn't need everything in one app which isn't always useful. As a Span panel user, I haven't found any videos that explain how things work when you don't pair with a recommended battery which might also make a good video. Battery is next years objective 🙂
@Scott-sm9nm that is the combo I'm looking at. I have also been considering the EG4 18 with EG4 batteries. The price is a lot lower, but I think the Sol Ark is a better fit for my setup. I like the EG4 battery 6 battery rack and overall price. My gut keeps saying Sol Ark, though. I wish Sol Ark paired with EG4 batteries was UL. I don't think it will pass inspection in my area. A little odd that Sol Ark and EG4 batteries haven't gotten certified together yet.
Enphase really need to introduce their 4th gen battery fast!!
Think I read early first quarter. Lets hope.
Enphase batteries with the matching enphase system is hard to beat. Expensive yes.
Expensive and a lot of the battery storage area is inverters and the inverter computers use a lot of the stored battery power to run the computers in the system and the system goes from DC to AC to DC at least 3 or 4 times and each time you lose electricity due to heat created. If you have a small number of solar panels (limited solar panels) there are better options.
Great education. Technology changing at lightning speed. Thanks Joe.
What about EP cube battery
Diy. 1/3 the price not in an inclosure. 1/2 price if in an inclosure.
What abot EG4?
Joe said at the start of the video he was not going to cover (battery only systems) which is what an EG4 is, this was his 2024 whole (all in one) system review.
Eg4 has there own inverter
Lot of great information thank you Joe.
Eg4 believer here
I am looking to buy one but am concerned about time of use control. Do you have experience with flexboss?
@lancejensen1063 Not yet
I'm surprised he didn't mention that battery...
If you get the Flexboss/Gridboss combination, it has time of use settings.
Also has four smart breakers for load control and main breaker for a backup panel. With the 14.3 power pro batteries, it is an awesome system and less expensive than any of the systems in this video.
@@randya9143 it seems like it had the capabilities but I was just a little unclear
What about the Anker Solix X1 battery system?
Good info Than you
Merry Christmas!
Thanks you for your videos!
In Australia we have Fonius solar with BYD inter-connected batteries
Why no mention of MidNite Solar's PowerFlo 16 battery? Seems to top all reviewed here. This LFP battery has 16 kW of storage, comes with a 15 yr warranty, and is half the price of Powerwall 3.
5. SolarEdge batteries and products are made in the United States and South Korea.
4. Enphase batteries and products are now made in the US (South Carolina), they used to be made in China but moved to the USA.
3. Point Guard batteries and products are made in the USA, made in the Sacramento California area.
2. Tesla Powerwall 3s are manufactured in Sparks, Nevada at Tesla's Gigafactory
1. Franklin Whole Home (FranklinWH) batteries and parts are manufactured in Shenzhen, China.
If it's better it doesn't matter were it's made
@@bernielennox1031 - It could very easily matter if you are trying to get the US tax rebates and i'll take American made quality every day of the week over Chinese made!
@@bernielennox1031 It could very easily matter a whole lot if you are trying to get the US tax rebates and I will take USA made over Chinese made every day of the week.
@@Bowhunters6go8xz6x most of the best renewable tech is made in China. It's unfortunate, but China is dominating the sector largely because of the lack of consistent US policy. It's cheaper and better in most cases and where things are comparable for capability it isn't comparable for price. They produce more than 10x what the US does for global export and we just can't match the economies of scale necessary to compete on price at this point. I'm all for supporting US products, but only if quality, price, and customer support are good.
You didn't note the Tesla Powerwall is Lithium Ion, not LIFEPO4.
Generation 3 Powerwalls finally switched to LFP
Joe, very informative presentation per usual! A few questions and points for further discussion:
1. Battery and inverter manufacturers are still thinking way too small! Silicon/perovskite panels will hit the market soon with efficiencies pushing 30%, 10% higher than the average silicon panel. Also, global warming is causing more frequent outages and higher utility monopoly prices (from higher liability, fire clearing, line damage,,etc.). Add decreasing battery prices and it make more sense for most home and small business owners to aim for going completely or mostly off grid. The typical house will need only 50 kWhs of storage and 15 kWs of panels to take the typical 3 bedroom home off grid across most of the US! This includes charging an EV or two! We are at a disruption point where residential electricity monopolies now face their biggest competition from their own customers! We can now produce and store all or most of the electricity needed to power our homes and cars. This will be a goldmine for the company that can make an affordable 50 kWh battery/inverter/controller!
Putting solar on rooftops and in backyards and batteries in garages will make the entire electric grid more efficient and resistant to outages. And, it’ll save us trillions in power line construction!
2. It seems like heat pump water heaters and heating and cooling systems, microwaves, clothes washers, as well as home lighting and induction stoves should be DC going forward. It doesn’t make sense to have to convert from DC solar panels to AC for running big stuff in our homes. Too inefficient! And, microinverters don’t make sense anymore! Run the panels with different orientations on different strings! Charge your car directly from your panels or home battery, and vice versa with out switching back and forth from DC to AC.
3. Enphase and even Tesla batteries are laughably small! Talk about the home energy equivalent of range anxiety! Instead of making 5 and 8 and 13 kWh batteries, the primary sizes should be 50 and 10 kWh!
4. PointGuard’s modular architecture is the most efficient, easy to install, and easy to expand! Though their batteries should come as 50 kWh and 10 kWh modules. Or perhaps 10 and 20 to keep weight down? And, having the car charger integrity the battery, inverter and controller is brilliant!
Tesla needs BOTH generator and Span load control. I would like to think that the Gateway could be modified to include a generator input that could recharge the battery. It could not be that hard, right? Franklin figured it out. In fact, why not integrate Span load control and generator support? While they’re at it, make the PW3 inverter field replaceable and include battery expansion for slave PW3s?
What about EP Cube?They are very cost effective, ac/dc coupled, generator input, etc. DYI friendly and have a great support team that answers the phone when you call. ??
My recommendation is to check what can make it into your utility vpp program and fo for it. A good part of the value is recouped that way.
best BANG for the buck battery 2025 EG4 LL
You forgot to include LG RESU10H Prime batteries coupled with SolarEdge inverters. Best bang for the bucks and highest current draw compared to the SolarEdge Battery Bank.
I'm a little surprised by some of the picks over something like the Anker Solid X1 or RoyPow. Both seem better than a few of your picks. A lot of good options these days.
Franklin new battery coming out 1st of 2025 will be little better than Tesla I think based on my contact.
Know one taking Franklin serious
There's just too many better options out there than these that you listed.
Tesla has 1/3rd of the footprint.
Hoymiles is better than any of them and you never mention them.
Great video! Thanks for the summary. I think another great video similar to this approach would be non standalone systems like Sol Ark or EG4 and paired batteries. Little more complex video, but in many ways those are superior builds for the user that doesn't need everything in one app which isn't always useful. As a Span panel user, I haven't found any videos that explain how things work when you don't pair with a recommended battery which might also make a good video. Battery is next years objective 🙂
Sol-Ark and Pytes paired as they are tightly integrated.
@Scott-sm9nm that is the combo I'm looking at. I have also been considering the EG4 18 with EG4 batteries. The price is a lot lower, but I think the Sol Ark is a better fit for my setup. I like the EG4 battery 6 battery rack and overall price. My gut keeps saying Sol Ark, though. I wish Sol Ark paired with EG4 batteries was UL. I don't think it will pass inspection in my area. A little odd that Sol Ark and EG4 batteries haven't gotten certified together yet.
I won't buy anything from Tesla or related to Musk so thanks for showing us the alternatives as well.