In this video, I demonstrate and explain how Topaz Labs fixed the issue where you would lose your photo's raw format when using Photo AI as a Lightroom plugin. However, there is one caveat. Note: Version 3.0.2 of Photo AI has the "fix." Subscribe to my Newsletter here: anthonymorganti.substack.com/ *All subscribers, Free and Paid, will save on my Photo AI training when it is released. Check out the Topaz Labs Photo AI here: bit.ly/44VxLrq Currently, I do not have a current discount code. FREE DOWNLOAD - Printable Keyboard Shortcut PDFs for Lightroom Classic, Photoshop, On1 Photo Raw 2024, and Luminar Neo: www.anthonymorganti.com/ I am an affiliate of Topaz Labs and will benefit financially if you purchase their product using the above link. Please read my Code of Ethics Statement: onlinephotographytraining.com/code-of-ethics/
Find it working perfect to a point.. if you made changes to LR exposure etc as well as doing a crop, then send it to PhotoAI, let AI do its thing, but exporting back to AI as DNG, the file settings is applied but NOT the crop. You still get back full picture, with at the LR adjustments in LR, but you have to apply crop again on DNG file. (Crop do not come back and auto re-apply it as per NEF file with adjustments. I would love to have apply the crop ratio also back into the DNG file. Yes I am optimistic :)
Even after all this time, this program is nowhere near as good as the original denoise and sharpen standalone apps. The results in photo ai continue to get worse with time imo.
I agree. The Photo version gives various results. You never know what auto pilot comes up with. Sometimes I send a photo that needs some denoise and it only sharpens the photo.
Anthony, is there a way to view the before and after changes of each enhancement ? IE: if I make both Denoise and Sharpen enhancements is there a way to temporarily turn off and on the Sharpen changes and just see the Denoise and vice/versa ? This way I could easily compare each change and how it affects the others.
I have version 3.0.4 of Topaz Photo AI and all my raw and DNG images are returning to Lightroom, but the Lightroom edited settings are not applied to them. Any help would be appreciated.
I am no longer using Topaz AI it causes a color shift with my Nikon Z8 files. I am not able to correct the color. My files from my D850 work fine. other people have had the same issue. Someone said AI may be using the wron camera profile. what do you think?
Version 3.0.2 crashes when use the remove feature. In my opinion version 2.4.2 was the last stable build of this program. I am giving up on Topaz labs. DXO Pure Raw plus Photoshop beta do everything I need.
I am using it right now and it is sending it back as a TIFF. I uninstalled Topaz Photo AI and reinstalled it and it is still outputting it back to Lightroom as a TIFF file. This is, as of (3:03pm on 26 May 2024). I did no enhancements. I just let it do its auto work. Am I doing something wrong?
I totally missed noticing this problem. Clearly I don’t use Photo AI enough. I hsve, for MY tastes, found it over does sharpening, when left to its own devices, and often makes overdone decisions in complex, mottled areas, like your eagle’s eye. I am not immune from pixel peeping, but try to aim myself at looking at an image without a microscope. Maybe the eagle’s eye really looks like that when you are inches away. I am not that accomplished as a wildlife photog.
I wish someone will tell Topaz That Photo AI adds color noise thus I don’t use it anymore but use old DeNoise AI which has manual color noise adjustment bar.
The gridding problem makes it unusable (Topaz claims it's a MacOS/M2 issue and one has to wait for Apple to fix the problem); FWIW I demo'd On1 and it works without gridding.
It doesn’t work for Capture One. They still break more than they fix on a regular basis. It seems like an extended beta test for which buyers pay for participation.
I have a problem with Adobe Bridge. Adobe Bridge downloader does not recognize a CF EXPRESS CARD, it will recognize an Extreme pro SD card. Maybe you can talk some sense in Adobe to fix this. This problem Has been going on for a long time. Thank you for your time
Thanks for the update. After updating to 3.2. when the file comes back to Lightroom it adjusts the original file without making a copy. I have looked at settings and do not know how to fix this. I can start with a virtual copy and just change that but that is not as good as the old action. Any ideas?
Did you right click and edit in Topaz AI as this will edit original, but if you go to File - Plug In Extras - Process in Photo AI it will create a new dng file.
@@tonynicolaci3244 I did it as you suggested, just like I usually do and it just makes changes to original and not creating a copy. Thanks for your help and reply.
Anthony . Thanks . A question please . Take a raw image in LR Classic Apply a Black and White profile Choose edit with TPai When it returns to LR Classic LRc states that the file is damaged or unsupported. Why does that happen please ? Thanks and best regards
While you ask Anthony and I'm not Anthony, nevertheless a response. Your display/monitor only "knows" RGB and so it needs RGB values. Now there are two approaches to B&W: representation as RGB where all values R=G=B, or reduction to pure gray-scale. Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) converts your 14-bits deep monochrome raw data elements into 16-bits-per-channel (14 becomes 48) in a ProPhoto colour space. How ACR does the conversion to B&W internally between it and Lightroom Classic (LrC - ACR == the Develop Tab in LrC) is a question mark. And, if you shoot raw with your digital colour camera, you still have the Bayer raw file of monochrome data elements, however in the Bayer RGBG pattern of 2*2 sensor photosites. Today, the simple approach would be, IMO, to do all your edits in LrC, in colour, and then convert to B&W. If you shoot Nikon [1]. And, as Anthony pointed to the raw bug in TPAI, you may actually suffer from that bug, rather than a B&W conversion issue? As there are, depending on the subject/feature, subtle or not so subtle differences in results, have you tried rather than Topaz's Photo AI, their DeNoise AI, Sharpen AI, and/or Gigapixel AI, in order to try to get what you want? Notes & Asides Monochromatic - mono=single, one; chromatic=colour. Orthochromatic - orthos=correct. Panchromatic = pan=all. The Bayer sensor has analogue photocells, each with analogue exposure store, and the combination is a photosite - there are no "pixels" (PICture ELementS) at this level. The photocells are panchromatic in that they see the entire humanly visible spectrum (more actually) and calling this panchromatic in a B&W context is justified as this was done to 3rd generation B&W film in the past. 2nd generation B&W film was called orthochromatic, and it started with monochromatic emulsions. Today, all cameras have a Bayer sensor, except the Fuji X-trans and all software was optimised in the first place for Bayer raw images. The reason we often call B&W monochromatic is because B&W print emulsions are that. There is zero colour in black, grey, and white, so from that perspective, monochromatic is a misnomer because mono=1 and the result has 0 colour. And, calling a Leica camera Monochrom is also a misnomer as its sensor is panchromatic. In colour theory there are no "blacks"and no "whites". Real black has 0% reflectance so it cannot have a colour. "White" has 100% reflectance, and doesn't add or subtract colour - shine pink light on it and that's what you see. The Mudbricks and Fluencers - honeybadger don't care - and followers make a mess of all this. From a purist's point of view "B&W" implies a single bit depth. In the film days, analogue meant we had grey-wedge (continuum) B&W images, in digital we have grey-scale (distinct values). In the B&W territory, we had brownish dark greys versus blueish dark greys - the brownish effect could be applied in post with a sepia toner. But then we also had "chamois" paper where the paper itself is an off-white creamy colour. You can get this by representing your grey-scale digital photos in RGB and applying the colour cast. [1] Nikon has the "free" raw processor NX Studio as alternative to ACR. It is not significantly better or worse and has a different UI. What it can do, however, is apply picture profiles that you would find in camera - it has some of these already installed by default. You can export these profiles to file/card and install these in camera, or vice versa, save the picture control profiles in camera to card and import them in NX studio. In both camera and NX Studio, you can create variants or new picture controls and save these under a new name. I saw a photographer in TH-cam comparing his Kodak Tri-X images from his Mamiya 7 (120 film - Tri-X on 120 is different than on 135 confection) to B&W shots from ithe same shots with his Nikon Z fx, in camera processed as Deep Tone Monochrome and these are very similar in gradation - look and feel. When you blow each up, then they will differ in "grain" and how contrast, saturation, gradation get watered down in the film case.
@@jpdj2715 The bug mentioned above to do with BW profiles is nothing to do with the RAW bug in this AM video - you suggest that it could be a version of the same. It seems to be down to TPAi not handling the BW profiles applied in LR, which I find perplexing due to the fact that LR converts the RAW to a TIF before handing off to TPAi (so definitely not a RAW file now and also the profile is now baked in as part of a "normal" TIF image, not a LR catalogue entry linked to the edit if a RAW)... it is this TIF file that seems to edit ok within TPAi but on saving at the end of that edit, is writing to disc in a format that LR can no longer read. This seems to be a known bug as I have seen it reported in support pages for Topaz. Reported in December with version 2.1.4. Topaz dont seem to have done anything about it because a workaround exists ie and eg do the TPAi bit before you apply a BW profile in LR. However for me, coming from a coding and software background, that is pants and brushing things under the carpet.... are Topaz really, really, saying in that, that they don't mind if their flagship product that can can work integrated in Adobe products and denoises, colours, sharpens, upscales, etc, can't handle an Adobe BM profile? Sorry for the rant, this is a bug bear of mine (no pun intended) as we pay good money to these large software houses and should expect basic functions to work. I have long been of the opinion that Topaz push their software out too quickly and rely on bugs reported to improve rather than be more rigorous with in house testing.
@@MarkAHunter - thanks for the rant - actually appreciated. Today's dominant software development methodology is called "Agile". It protects the developers against the whims of clients/users (in corporate business). And one thing it will do is develop what is called a "Minimum Viable Product" (MVP). The idea then is that future improvements are developed at additional costs. In your and my case against Topaz, what they release to market as MVP may meet minimal requirements, but is not good enough. They should define requirements a bit higher than so far when setting the bar for minimal. If you are familiar with "Just In Time" production, then you will have thought that it actually means "Just Too Late". And that's how MVP often is not good enough.
@@jpdj2715 Agile, Just in Time, "Descoping", I have been through them all.... I swear on one software drop it was incrementally descoped so many times during the test cycle, that at the end of the day all that was released was a version number :-) Yet the consultants still got paid !
Hi Anthony, Wow, the update added support for DNG, but if I open a Photo as you suggested, when the photo opens in Topaz, it takes the original and overexposes it by about 2 stops. It works fine just opening in by right-clicking and choosing Tiff. I even tried opening the Raw outside of Lightroom and it still just about blows the whole photo out. What a waste of upgrade money. I'm done with Topaz. I'm going to ask for a refund! I sent the Topaz support team my problem with examples.
Right 👍 I too use only the older model, Topaz Denoise AI.... But it seems that as this software has stopped receiving any updates, it doesn't recognise Nikon Z9 RAW profile and although it does a good job in reducing noise but if Colour noise and Details slider is applied above 5 or 10, the processed image file shows all green cast in several parts of the image. If colour noise and details aren't applied then the result is ok.
Not related to the video, but, I would like to know if you can provide information or even make a video about an aspect that I think is simple, but I can't easily find it on the internet, or even here on TH-cam. I would like to know if there is a PC program or a website that allows you to read the metadata of a photograph and inform the aperture, speed and iso, among other relevant aspects. I know that Lightroom allows you to see this information, but what I want is to copy it and paste it either into a word file or insert it into the photo itself. I've seen several places on the internet and TH-camrs, which show the properties of photography, even with the respective icons that relate to it, but I can't find anything that allows you to do this, is it only possible to do this manually?
In this video, I demonstrate and explain how Topaz Labs fixed the issue where you would lose your photo's raw format when using Photo AI as a Lightroom plugin. However, there is one caveat.
Note: Version 3.0.2 of Photo AI has the "fix."
Subscribe to my Newsletter here:
anthonymorganti.substack.com/
*All subscribers, Free and Paid, will save on my Photo AI training when it is released.
Check out the Topaz Labs Photo AI here:
bit.ly/44VxLrq
Currently, I do not have a current discount code.
FREE DOWNLOAD - Printable Keyboard Shortcut PDFs for Lightroom Classic, Photoshop, On1 Photo Raw 2024, and Luminar Neo:
www.anthonymorganti.com/
I am an affiliate of Topaz Labs and will benefit financially if you purchase their product using the above link.
Please read my Code of Ethics Statement:
onlinephotographytraining.com/code-of-ethics/
Another gift from Anthony Morganti! Thank you....again!
As always excellent video. Loved the little known tip in this one that would have driven most of us crazy trying to searching YT for a solution
Find it working perfect to a point.. if you made changes to LR exposure etc as well as doing a crop, then send it to PhotoAI, let AI do its thing, but exporting back to AI as DNG, the file settings is applied but NOT the crop. You still get back full picture, with at the LR adjustments in LR, but you have to apply crop again on DNG file. (Crop do not come back and auto re-apply it as per NEF file with adjustments. I would love to have apply the crop ratio also back into the DNG file. Yes I am optimistic :)
Anthony , do you keep both the edited file and original from Topaz? Any reason to keep both? Thanks. Love your videos.
Even after all this time, this program is nowhere near as good as the original denoise and sharpen standalone apps. The results in photo ai continue to get worse with time imo.
I agree. The Photo version gives various results. You never know what auto pilot comes up with. Sometimes I send a photo that needs some denoise and it only sharpens the photo.
Which do you think was the last truly good version of Photo AI?
@@markcasebeer8273 it seems like the further they go the worse it gets.
@@MrX-zz2vk I think in the beginning it was better. I prefer they leave them separate honestly.
@@MrX-zz2vk v2.4.2
Anthony, is there a way to view the before and after changes of each enhancement ? IE: if I make both Denoise and Sharpen enhancements is there a way to temporarily turn off and on the Sharpen changes and just see the Denoise and vice/versa ? This way I could easily compare each change and how it affects the others.
I have version 3.0.4 of Topaz Photo AI and all my raw and DNG images are returning to Lightroom, but the Lightroom edited settings are not applied to them. Any help would be appreciated.
Will this version work with iPhone files?
Now Topaz needs to have a price reduction BF special.
I am no longer using Topaz AI it causes a color shift with my Nikon Z8 files. I am not able to correct the color. My files from my D850 work fine. other people have had the same issue. Someone said AI may be using the wron camera profile. what do you think?
Version 3.0.2 crashes when use the remove feature. In my opinion version 2.4.2 was the last stable build of this program. I am giving up on Topaz labs. DXO Pure Raw plus Photoshop beta do everything I need.
I am using it right now and it is sending it back as a TIFF. I uninstalled Topaz Photo AI and reinstalled it and it is still outputting it back to Lightroom as a TIFF file. This is, as of (3:03pm on 26 May 2024). I did no enhancements. I just let it do its auto work. Am I doing something wrong?
I totally missed noticing this problem. Clearly I don’t use Photo AI enough. I hsve, for MY tastes, found it over does sharpening, when left to its own devices, and often makes overdone decisions in complex, mottled areas, like your eagle’s eye. I am not immune from pixel peeping, but try to aim myself at looking at an image without a microscope. Maybe the eagle’s eye really looks like that when you are inches away. I am not that accomplished as a wildlife photog.
I wish someone will tell Topaz That Photo AI adds color noise thus I don’t use it anymore but use old DeNoise AI which has manual color noise adjustment bar.
Topaz has been very responsive to user feedback on Photo AI.
Their is still a griding problem when processing some dark areas and sky
The gridding problem makes it unusable (Topaz claims it's a MacOS/M2 issue and one has to wait for Apple to fix the problem); FWIW I demo'd On1 and it works without gridding.
They also fixed Photo AI Photoshop plugin so it works again on a Windows PC in rel. 3.0.2 (it didn't in 3.0.1).
It doesn’t work for Capture One. They still break more than they fix on a regular basis. It seems like an extended beta test for which buyers pay for participation.
I have a problem with Adobe Bridge. Adobe Bridge downloader does not recognize a CF EXPRESS CARD, it will recognize an Extreme pro SD card. Maybe you can talk some sense in Adobe to fix this. This problem Has been going on for a long time. Thank you for your time
Thanks for the update. After updating to 3.2. when the file comes back to Lightroom
it adjusts the original file without making a copy. I have looked at settings and do not know how to fix this. I can start with a virtual copy and just change that but that is not as good as the old action. Any ideas?
Did you right click and edit in Topaz AI as this will edit original, but if you go to File - Plug In Extras - Process in Photo AI it will create a new dng file.
@@tonynicolaci3244 I did it as you suggested, just like I usually do and it just makes changes to original and not creating a copy. Thanks for your help and reply.
Anthony . Thanks . A question please .
Take a raw image in LR Classic
Apply a Black and White profile
Choose edit with TPai
When it returns to LR Classic LRc states that the file is damaged or unsupported.
Why does that happen please ?
Thanks and best regards
While you ask Anthony and I'm not Anthony, nevertheless a response. Your display/monitor only "knows" RGB and so it needs RGB values. Now there are two approaches to B&W: representation as RGB where all values R=G=B, or reduction to pure gray-scale. Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) converts your 14-bits deep monochrome raw data elements into 16-bits-per-channel (14 becomes 48) in a ProPhoto colour space. How ACR does the conversion to B&W internally between it and Lightroom Classic (LrC - ACR == the Develop Tab in LrC) is a question mark. And, if you shoot raw with your digital colour camera, you still have the Bayer raw file of monochrome data elements, however in the Bayer RGBG pattern of 2*2 sensor photosites.
Today, the simple approach would be, IMO, to do all your edits in LrC, in colour, and then convert to B&W. If you shoot Nikon [1].
And, as Anthony pointed to the raw bug in TPAI, you may actually suffer from that bug, rather than a B&W conversion issue?
As there are, depending on the subject/feature, subtle or not so subtle differences in results, have you tried rather than Topaz's Photo AI, their DeNoise AI, Sharpen AI, and/or Gigapixel AI, in order to try to get what you want?
Notes & Asides
Monochromatic - mono=single, one; chromatic=colour.
Orthochromatic - orthos=correct.
Panchromatic = pan=all.
The Bayer sensor has analogue photocells, each with analogue exposure store, and the combination is a photosite - there are no "pixels" (PICture ELementS) at this level. The photocells are panchromatic in that they see the entire humanly visible spectrum (more actually) and calling this panchromatic in a B&W context is justified as this was done to 3rd generation B&W film in the past. 2nd generation B&W film was called orthochromatic, and it started with monochromatic emulsions.
Today, all cameras have a Bayer sensor, except the Fuji X-trans and all software was optimised in the first place for Bayer raw images.
The reason we often call B&W monochromatic is because B&W print emulsions are that. There is zero colour in black, grey, and white, so from that perspective, monochromatic is a misnomer because mono=1 and the result has 0 colour.
And, calling a Leica camera Monochrom is also a misnomer as its sensor is panchromatic. In colour theory there are no "blacks"and no "whites". Real black has 0% reflectance so it cannot have a colour. "White" has 100% reflectance, and doesn't add or subtract colour - shine pink light on it and that's what you see.
The Mudbricks and Fluencers - honeybadger don't care - and followers make a mess of all this.
From a purist's point of view "B&W" implies a single bit depth. In the film days, analogue meant we had grey-wedge (continuum) B&W images, in digital we have grey-scale (distinct values).
In the B&W territory, we had brownish dark greys versus blueish dark greys - the brownish effect could be applied in post with a sepia toner. But then we also had "chamois" paper where the paper itself is an off-white creamy colour. You can get this by representing your grey-scale digital photos in RGB and applying the colour cast.
[1] Nikon has the "free" raw processor NX Studio as alternative to ACR. It is not significantly better or worse and has a different UI. What it can do, however, is apply picture profiles that you would find in camera - it has some of these already installed by default. You can export these profiles to file/card and install these in camera, or vice versa, save the picture control profiles in camera to card and import them in NX studio. In both camera and NX Studio, you can create variants or new picture controls and save these under a new name. I saw a photographer in TH-cam comparing his Kodak Tri-X images from his Mamiya 7 (120 film - Tri-X on 120 is different than on 135 confection) to B&W shots from ithe same shots with his Nikon Z fx, in camera processed as Deep Tone Monochrome and these are very similar in gradation - look and feel. When you blow each up, then they will differ in "grain" and how contrast, saturation, gradation get watered down in the film case.
@@jpdj2715 The bug mentioned above to do with BW profiles is nothing to do with the RAW bug in this AM video - you suggest that it could be a version of the same. It seems to be down to TPAi not handling the BW profiles applied in LR, which I find perplexing due to the fact that LR converts the RAW to a TIF before handing off to TPAi (so definitely not a RAW file now and also the profile is now baked in as part of a "normal" TIF image, not a LR catalogue entry linked to the edit if a RAW)... it is this TIF file that seems to edit ok within TPAi but on saving at the end of that edit, is writing to disc in a format that LR can no longer read.
This seems to be a known bug as I have seen it reported in support pages for Topaz. Reported in December with version 2.1.4.
Topaz dont seem to have done anything about it because a workaround exists ie and eg do the TPAi bit before you apply a BW profile in LR. However for me, coming from a coding and software background, that is pants and brushing things under the carpet.... are Topaz really, really, saying in that, that they don't mind if their flagship product that can can work integrated in Adobe products and denoises, colours, sharpens, upscales, etc, can't handle an Adobe BM profile?
Sorry for the rant, this is a bug bear of mine (no pun intended) as we pay good money to these large software houses and should expect basic functions to work.
I have long been of the opinion that Topaz push their software out too quickly and rely on bugs reported to improve rather than be more rigorous with in house testing.
@@MarkAHunter - thanks for the rant - actually appreciated. Today's dominant software development methodology is called "Agile". It protects the developers against the whims of clients/users (in corporate business). And one thing it will do is develop what is called a "Minimum Viable Product" (MVP). The idea then is that future improvements are developed at additional costs. In your and my case against Topaz, what they release to market as MVP may meet minimal requirements, but is not good enough. They should define requirements a bit higher than so far when setting the bar for minimal.
If you are familiar with "Just In Time" production, then you will have thought that it actually means "Just Too Late". And that's how MVP often is not good enough.
@@jpdj2715 Agile, Just in Time, "Descoping", I have been through them all....
I swear on one software drop it was incrementally descoped so many times during the test cycle, that at the end of the day all that was released was a version number :-)
Yet the consultants still got paid !
It does not preserve crop information
Hi Anthony, Wow, the update added support for DNG, but if I open a Photo as you suggested, when the photo opens in Topaz, it takes the original and overexposes it by about 2 stops. It works fine just opening in by right-clicking and choosing Tiff. I even tried opening the Raw outside of Lightroom and it still just about blows the whole photo out. What a waste of upgrade money. I'm done with Topaz. I'm going to ask for a refund! I sent the Topaz support team my problem with examples.
I’ve sent both the Raw and Overexposed photo to Topaz support. They had the same results and are working on a fix.
I believe that Topaz AI will be in my Future 🤔
Yesssss
I refuse to use AI because my images looks plasticy. . Its rubbish. The only one i use is Denoise
Right 👍 I too use only the older model, Topaz Denoise AI.... But it seems that as this software has stopped receiving any updates, it doesn't recognise Nikon Z9 RAW profile and although it does a good job in reducing noise but if Colour noise and Details slider is applied above 5 or 10, the processed image file shows all green cast in several parts of the image. If colour noise and details aren't applied then the result is ok.
Is there really such a thing as "AI" ? They are just clever computer programs.
Not related to the video, but, I would like to know if you can provide information or even make a video about an aspect that I think is simple, but I can't easily find it on the internet, or even here on TH-cam.
I would like to know if there is a PC program or a website that allows you to read the metadata of a photograph and inform the aperture, speed and iso, among other relevant aspects.
I know that Lightroom allows you to see this information, but what I want is to copy it and paste it either into a word file or insert it into the photo itself.
I've seen several places on the internet and TH-camrs, which show the properties of photography, even with the respective icons that relate to it, but I can't find anything that allows you to do this, is it only possible to do this manually?