If you hadn't said it, I wouldn't have realized it. That info should be in the title, otherwise he just seems like nothing more than a random person talking about a random programming language.
@@doublewhopper67 Your lack of reading comprehension skills isn't my problem, @doublewhopper. Try understanding what I wrote before wasting everybody's time.
13:15 "An interesting thing about trying to hire people is, you look at ten thousands resumes over the course of the decade and you find that If certain skills are widely distributed in the population they become completely meaningless. So the fact that someone has C# in his resume, it is doesn't tell me anything, it is like claiming that the programmer has a head, it is widespread characteristic in the population, and the possession of a head is certainly a prerequisite to be able to do your job, but it doesn't necessarily tell me if he will do it well. I'm not claiming knowing Erlang or Haskell means you are good programmer, but at least it allows me to filter efficiently".
I was browsing the comments on this video and your name called my attention. Fonseca is a traditional name in Portugal and Brazil (two presidents had this family name). OK then.
36:45 That is a great way to encourage developers to correctly type all constants. If you make a type error, it deletes all your source code. So you better make damn sure you get it right. Haskell isn't playing games. If you mess with GHC, GHC will mess with you
I know nothing about Haskell and have never heard of Bryan O'Sullivan and yet I watched this video until the end. Interestingly I'm a seasoned C# guy who has been looking at functional programming which is how I found this video. I thought it was very entertaining - Bryan O'Sullivan is a really good speaker who has the right level of humour (he doesn't laugh at his own jokes - plus his jokes are funny). Thanks :-)
Hey dude, if you're looking to get into Haskell a bit more have a look at 'learn you a Haskell for great good'. Its free (donations are greatly accepted) and I'll be working through it soon. Lots of cross over between Scala and f# and probably the fp parts of c#
Thanks dude - although one reason for looking at Haskell is to get out my comfort zone. With F# I thought I'd be too familiar with .NET libraries to struggle with things and Scala has similarities with C# and isn't purely functional. I work only on *nix based systems now (including all my C# stuff) - I'm a polyglot these days but am missing "functional" from my arsenal!
LINQ is Mircosoft C# way of doing monads. the books sponsored by microsoft never admits that and most of the design principles of C# is from functional programming. That fills in one more piece of puzzle.
Nothing has changed. The tenacity and "library science skills" are still quintessential. I find it even more important because there's an insane amount of monolithic books that take various different approaches to teaching, competing publishers, and even more VERY valuable information scattered in even WEIRDER places. Much of that information is still stored in resources without much linkage to the "front-end" of the web. Couple that with the onslaught of advertisements, guides and gurus that you have to face a day, it's a lovely challenge to learn anything.
@@trejohnson7677 "...Much of that information is still stored in resources without much linkage to the "front-end" of the web." I am actually agreeing with you that we should be able to access absolutely everything that was ever written by any man, woman, child or alien on this planet on the internet, but copyright law simply doesn't allow for it.
That's not a very nice comment. Haskell does legitimately have a really crazy learning curve. I can totally see why someone who used it casually would think its insanely hard.
Thank god finally someone who doesn't have that effeminate socal accent. I listen to those guys because I want the information but it's like nails on a chalkboard.
I find Haskell is in fact very easy. There's a few concept you have to master and combine...compare that to learning about classes, inheritance, overriding functions, loops, enumerators, generics, interfaces. Object oriented programming is actually huge compared to FP. FP is basically currying, pattern matching and recursion.
On the other hand, imperative programming languages I feel are more intuitive by design. It's very easy to reason in the mindset of "do this then do that". Functional programming has a few good properties, but I wouldn't say easiness is one of them.
Are you sarcastic? When you master something you become blind to the problems faced by the noobs. And object-oriented programming is not only about Java.
@@jacekjacenty I'm just saying it's not really more difficult it's just difficult to change your mindset when you already know a different paradigm. If you started out with Haskell instead of Java for example do you think it would be more difficult?
For some reason this looked really bad on the iPhone 3GS TH-cam app (but okay in its browser). Dunno. Great contents - too bad Facebook has swallowed Bryan and his company (would be interesting to see another video on that background).
Depends on what assembly you use, like ARM is quite easy to use, but something like X86 is a different story. It’s imperative so perhaps the functional paradigm just doesn’t make too much sense, which means you should probably learn how to use it
"Has multiple backends" ...and each of them has a different subset of functionality. One can do FTS but doesn't do transactions. Another does transactions but doesn't support FTS. I mean, who came up with this crap? Have you seen any other RDBMS whose authors were unable to write a proper backend and were shopping for a third party one for years? Because that's what MySQL is. Thank you very much, do not want.
Cool language but the people who love it tend to be elitist snobs, at least at my university. It really ruined the course that I followed on it. There's nothing wrong with loving both Java and Haskell.
First: I an not in the Haskell community Second: I am not a ssshole Third: Java still needs to die Fourth: Being one the most use language is not a reason to not hate it, have you seen the Javascript Cummunity or PHP one. Fifth: There are way better alternative to work in the JVM than Java (Clojure, Scala,, Groovy). Sixthl: If you feel unwelcome in the haskell cummunity, is not cuz there are assholes but cuz is just not for you .
This guy wrote "Real World Haskell". Really inspiring to hear about all the stuff he did over time.
aditya menon i enoyed that book
aditya menon Yeah. That should be in the title. He's not just some random startup guy
If you hadn't said it, I wouldn't have realized it. That info should be in the title, otherwise he just seems like nothing more than a random person talking about a random programming language.
Hmm and all I could do till Today is a "Hello World"
@@doublewhopper67 Your lack of reading comprehension skills isn't my problem, @doublewhopper. Try understanding what I wrote before wasting everybody's time.
This is honestly one of the best technical presentations I've ever seen.
13:15 "An interesting thing about trying to hire people is, you look at ten thousands resumes over the course of the decade and you find that If certain skills are widely distributed in the population they become completely meaningless. So the fact that someone has C# in his resume, it is doesn't tell me anything, it is like claiming that the programmer has a head, it is widespread characteristic in the population, and the possession of a head is certainly a prerequisite to be able to do your job, but it doesn't necessarily tell me if he will do it well. I'm not claiming knowing Erlang or Haskell means you are good programmer, but at least it allows me to filter efficiently".
But you can't really give interviews to 100 programmers and test them without losing money.
Are you "Oscarzinho" son of Oscar Fonseca? If so I am your cousin. Happy birthday by the way.
Unfortunately, I'm not that Oscar. I'm probably part of the other Fonsecas who speak Spanish instead.
I was browsing the comments on this video and your name called my attention. Fonseca is a traditional name in Portugal and Brazil (two presidents had this family name). OK then.
@@agranero6 I've never seen such kind of conversations anywhere before
This guy went on to become the Vice President of Engineering at Facebook. I think he's qualified to talk on these subjects, to say the least.
"stick with something that works until you have proven the other parts of your business model"
"running a startup on Haskell"
VS code has Haskell language support now, no longer the dark ages.
36:45 That is a great way to encourage developers to correctly type all constants. If you make a type error, it deletes all your source code. So you better make damn sure you get it right. Haskell isn't playing games. If you mess with GHC, GHC will mess with you
Really interesting. I'm currently learning Haskell having done a lot of C#. I thought his appraisal was rather sympathetic and fairly accurate.
I know nothing about Haskell and have never heard of Bryan O'Sullivan and yet I watched this video until the end. Interestingly I'm a seasoned C# guy who has been looking at functional programming which is how I found this video. I thought it was very entertaining - Bryan O'Sullivan is a really good speaker who has the right level of humour (he doesn't laugh at his own jokes - plus his jokes are funny). Thanks :-)
Hey dude, if you're looking to get into Haskell a bit more have a look at 'learn you a Haskell for great good'. Its free (donations are greatly accepted) and I'll be working through it soon. Lots of cross over between Scala and f# and probably the fp parts of c#
Thanks dude - although one reason for looking at Haskell is to get out my comfort zone. With F# I thought I'd be too familiar with .NET libraries to struggle with things and Scala has similarities with C# and isn't purely functional. I work only on *nix based systems now (including all my C# stuff) - I'm a polyglot these days but am missing "functional" from my arsenal!
good plan. so, lyahfgg should more than do the trick. you can look at the coursera free courses on scala too. there's two.
Scala's awesome. I did lyahfgg already and I still think it's awesome. So, respectfully, I disagree
Why that book rather than lyahfgg?
A really great presentation. Don't avoid it just because it's 10 years old.
He looks like the type of guy who would use haskell
thank you for uploading this jason!
Great stuff, proud to be irish - I will model my presentations going forward on your style.
Informative, interesting, delightful, and refreshing. Oh, and now I can use 'pronk' in a sentence!
LINQ is Mircosoft C# way of doing monads. the books sponsored by microsoft never admits that and most of the design principles of C# is from functional programming. That fills in one more piece of puzzle.
Very pleasant to listen to.
Nothing has changed. The tenacity and "library science skills" are still quintessential. I find it even more important because there's an insane amount of monolithic books that take various different approaches to teaching, competing publishers, and even more VERY valuable information scattered in even WEIRDER places. Much of that information is still stored in resources without much linkage to the "front-end" of the web. Couple that with the onslaught of advertisements, guides and gurus that you have to face a day, it's a lovely challenge to learn anything.
You can't just put copyrighted books on the web without the license from the publisher/copyright owner.
@@lepidoptera9337 what exactly is your point
@@trejohnson7677 "...Much of that information is still stored in resources without much linkage to the "front-end" of the web."
I am actually agreeing with you that we should be able to access absolutely everything that was ever written by any man, woman, child or alien on this planet on the internet, but copyright law simply doesn't allow for it.
very insightful, especially the intel at 14:00 as an indicator of competence
That's not a very nice comment. Haskell does legitimately have a really crazy learning curve. I can totally see why someone who used it casually would think its insanely hard.
How would you describe Haskell's curve?
it seems they've shut the company and moved to facebook.
Interesting.
Amazing talk. Inspirational indeed!
Can you posts the slides to youtube?
Why MySQL over Postgres? I'm so curious !
OMG, a whole company. I can hardly run Hello World on Haskell. 😶
I'm mostly curious why C# over f# if they're using haskell on the serverside?
That was uncalled for
Thank god finally someone who doesn't have that effeminate socal accent. I listen to those guys because I want the information but it's like nails on a chalkboard.
already ordered the book from Amazon sometime ago...now, at least i know who the author is...Haskell makes a ton of sense - programming wise!
I find Haskell is in fact very easy. There's a few concept you have to master and combine...compare that to learning about classes, inheritance, overriding functions, loops, enumerators, generics, interfaces. Object oriented programming is actually huge compared to FP. FP is basically currying, pattern matching and recursion.
On the other hand, imperative programming languages I feel are more intuitive by design. It's very easy to reason in the mindset of "do this then do that". Functional programming has a few good properties, but I wouldn't say easiness is one of them.
Are you sarcastic? When you master something you become blind to the problems faced by the noobs. And object-oriented programming is not only about Java.
correction: Haskell is basically currying, pattern matching, recursion, types, lambdas, folds, list comprehensions, functors, applicatives, monads, lenses, non-intuitive order of evaluation, cryptic error messages
@@jacekjacenty would say lenses is not really part of the language itself
@@jacekjacenty I'm just saying it's not really more difficult it's just difficult to change your mindset when you already know a different paradigm. If you started out with Haskell instead of Java for example do you think it would be more difficult?
great talk!!
Brilliant!
I think the TV show silicon valley could be inspired on this guy or at least Richard... They move in the same way
For some reason this looked really bad on the iPhone 3GS TH-cam app (but okay in its browser). Dunno. Great contents - too bad Facebook has swallowed Bryan and his company (would be interesting to see another video on that background).
amazing
Mailrank is dead and he and his co-founder went to work for Facebook. All you need to know. :-)
It got acquired by facebook lolol
property based testing. i must learn :)
"quickcheck"
I find assembly easier to write than haskell seriously.
Depends on what assembly you use, like ARM is quite easy to use, but something like X86 is a different story. It’s imperative so perhaps the functional paradigm just doesn’t make too much sense, which means you should probably learn how to use it
14:26 well 7 years latter people have a different stance on rails
resume at 40:07
what is the address of slides?
Soheil Roshankish www.infoq.com/presentations/Running-a-Startup-on-Haskell
Wasim Akram I failed the course, but thanx
Soheil Roshankish Functional Systems in Haskell ? I really wish i could see the lectures ...
You might as well stack the money into a heap and set it on fire.
Running a startup on Haskell = suicide
bruh that video quality
La falta de argumentos se suple con insultos.
Maybe for speed...
ok.
14:00 .. ok i'll keep going with Rust ..
"Has multiple backends"
...and each of them has a different subset of functionality. One can do FTS but doesn't do transactions. Another does transactions but doesn't support FTS. I mean, who came up with this crap? Have you seen any other RDBMS whose authors were unable to write a proper backend and were shopping for a third party one for years? Because that's what MySQL is. Thank you very much, do not want.
Y yo insulte a alguien acaso?
Cool language but the people who love it tend to be elitist snobs, at least at my university. It really ruined the course that I followed on it.
There's nothing wrong with loving both Java and Haskell.
First: I an not in the Haskell community
Second: I am not a ssshole
Third: Java still needs to die
Fourth: Being one the most use language is not a reason to not hate it, have you seen the Javascript Cummunity or PHP one.
Fifth: There are way better alternative to work in the JVM than Java (Clojure, Scala,, Groovy).
Sixthl: If you feel unwelcome in the haskell cummunity, is not cuz there are assholes but cuz is just not for you .
haskell is for geniuses
+LUTCHMAN Nicolas I beg to differ. I am no genius.
I am not can you explainl please, shame on me?