STROPS FROM SCRATCH #6: Tanning the Deer Skin in Oak Bark, Solution, Layering, Leather
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 ธ.ค. 2016
- Tanning the deer skin into leather in oak bark. The skin is soaked in a solution of bark and then laid away in layers of chopped oak bark for 6 to 8 weeks or more.
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Vegetable tanning uses tannic acid from roots barks leaves and other plant materials to preserve skins and make them into leather. The tannic acid tans the hide by cross linking the collagen fibers permanently changing the way the behave when exposed to water. Tanned hides are rot resistant and retain most of their softness after wetting and drying. In this video we use oak bark in a solution to start the skin, and then lay the skin away in layers of chipped bark to finish tanning. Once the skin is penetrated all the way through, it is tanned, but leaving it for a longer period allows it to soak up more tannin and become more thoroughly tanned. This is a deer skin, but other skins can be tanned at home by roughly the same process. Learning home tanning is a process, but it is not that hard and it's very rewarding. This series shows how to tan a deer skin with oak bark and lime.
Traditional vegetable tanned leather not only lasts longer but can handle getting wet better and it ages so much better and gets more supple and gets that lovely patina, it's also worth so much more
Yeah, I love the stuff. Hope we see more of a revival.
We all die poor. It's important to get poor doing what you enjoy. Thanks for another great lesson.
Yeah, get to work on that buddy. You have all kinds of money not to make ahead of you :)
Lol That's the very definition of a professional hobby: Something you enjoy too much to get rich at, even if it does make you enough money to live on. But spending too much time, and money on equipment, etc., usually turns it into just another job.
Another really great video. So much quality information packed into it. Thanks for taking the time to share this with us!
I have been watching your entire series in preparation to tan my first deer hide of the first deer that I have shot. It has been tremendously helpful, and I am feeling pretty confident. I have the hide salted in a bucket right now and am going to a local saw mill this week to get some bark. I agree a lot with your philosophy that you gave at the end and think you made some really good points. I was really surprised that of everyone that I know who hunts, none of them even keep the hides to me and they all just use the antlers for racks. To me I wanted to hunt almost more so I could do these projects that I had always wanted to. Anyways thanks a lot for your help I am going to email you my results
That's great to hear. Read my article online on common barktanning mistakes. I should really make a video out of that actually. I was sort of starting a series, but didn't follow through with it. There is a lot of good tanning info in my tanning playlist too. It's a lot of material to sort through, but time invested now will probably pay off in better results. I really would suggest cutting off the legs and other tag ends and go through th process with them before dong the main hide. Then you'll understand everything better and you can test materials easily, all with very little effort.
@@SkillCult Hey I followed your advice and have done the process with some test pieces. Two things have come up that I was hoping you could answer. When fleshing no matter how much I scraped it, there was this kind of slimy layer that was left I think people call it the membrane. I tanned it for a day in a full strength solution and it started to kind of be able to scrape off, it became kind of fuzzy almost like felt but with longer strands. but in scraping this I think I may have damaged the skin a bit. My question is do you need to get all of that stuff off or can you leave it on, and if you do need to what is a good way to get it all of. Also I am a bit worried that I case hardened it because it did not penetrate very deep and is still very stretchy but was already a very dark color is there anything to do for that?
Very cool video, I enjoyed watching it. I do think that more and more there is increasing demand for quality goods that craftsman and local farmers could fill.
As a side note my last name translates directly to "tanner" where my family is from in Europe. This type of work was a way of life and a means to make bread for many people.
With Stellar Jays keeping you company
I think of them more as bad neighbors :)
loving your videos! Thank you for your knowledge and way of communication.
I don't think I'll ever tan my own leather, but it seems like you can make anything interesting. Your patience and nerdery are yielding results, for sure.
Thank you so much for sharing this process with us. I find it incredibly fascinating.
Steve
Thank you. It's going to get real interesting when we take the skin out in a few weeks.
SkillCult how did the skins turn out after tanning? No updates on this yet?
Thanks for sharing your knowledge. I will put them into practice with canelo and luma trees from the native forest. Greetings from Santiago de Chile!!
It's so rare yet so entertaining to watch someone make something as small and simple as a leather strop.
You going to try some tanning over there? Its pretty fun.
SkillCult I would if i had raw leather.
can you trap there? squirrels maybe?
I have tanned Buck skin with Black Walnut hulls and they were easy to process in order to extract the tannins.
I am fortunate enough to own a small engine powered cement mixer. I just threw the whole nuts as they fell from the tree into the mixer with several medium to large round stones and a gallon or two of water then,
“Let Her Rip” for about twenty minutes.
The resulting Ooz was then ready to use.
It makes a nice leather which I processed into a soft but tough skin.
Water Oak acorns work as well.
Thanks for the talk. totally agree ; )
Thanks for the great video. Very interesting and I totally agree with your attitude towards quality rather than profit
Try finding oak bark tanned leather in the UK. There's only one tannery that still does it but you really struggle to buy it unless you are buying in bulk.
I believe the word you were looking for is sleet :)
Anyway, I'm loving all of these videos! I'm learning so much! Between axe processing wood, tanning, etc. I also have a goal to make a jacket someday. Like a frock or robe style.
Yeah, I know, but snail is way funner :)
@@SkillCult Haha you're absolutely right!
Really I like the work there I too am a Tanner
great, nice to meet you. I love tanning leather. It is a magical process.
You need a bark chopping assistant! Through if you have a chainsaw there are debarking chipper attachments that would fill a 55 gal drum with bark in 30 minutes.
I didin't know about those. I like taht idea. For that matter, you could just use a chain saw to take 1/4 inch slices. Half the bark would end up very fine and the rest would be chips that break up easily. I still need a chipper or something eventually though.
Great vids man, Ive watched them all a couple of times and really appreciate the time it took you to make them for us to learn, your a great teacher. Will you ever right a book on bark tanning?? Im looking forward to seeing your experiments on the different tannis and how this strop comes out. I am going to go buy your 1st book on buckskins the minute I finish this comment.Thanks again
Thanks. I have the barktan book mostly written, but finishing it is a huge job and probably won't happen till I have some help with that sort of thing.
anything I can do to help??
Probably not. Thanks though. I need to work closely with someone and probably would have to take a sabbatical from making video content.
Hi, I'm Ousmane, I'm Togolese.
Nice to meet you.
let's call it "shail" to further confuse the meteorological crystallography. I'm the guy who saunters into the Tandy leather store to smell the wares. You're right: rolls and rolls of crappy stuff that passes for leather. occasionally I'll come across a high-end leather good, almost always Italian, in a leather that reminds of what expertly tanned leather really is. They invariably have an Old World look and feel. Fascinating video. Are tannins tannins, in leather as in wine?
There are various tannins, but a lot of the ones we eat are the same or similar to what is used in tanning as far as I know. They are very common and important food flavor components in moderation. a good dessert apple has tannins in measured quantities. I don't know a lot about the chemistry though... or any chemistry.
I believe Horween still put tans the shell cordovan
Very Cool! I Live in South Carolina were there are Black Water Rivers are very common. Black Water is created from flooded forest that makes the water very dark due to the tanning from trees. I wonder if ancient man discovered how tanning preserves leather by finding animals that where preserved from these type of waters. Just food for thought.
I've seen those in florida. I doubt there is enough concentration to tan a hide, but maybe. It would certainly dye a skin at the very least. where there might be more is peat bogs though. You probably know about the bog people, murdered and executed, who were basically tanned whole after being tossed in the bog.
This is an outstanding video. I've done tons of brain tanning but I've never had any luck bark tanning nor have I seen any great videos explaining until now. How do you suppose people vegetable tanned before metal? Particularly what sort of vessel would have been used? Wood containers would absorb the liquor unless sealed w something like pitch. Perhaps a large clay vessel? Natural stone troughs? Keep up the amazing work!
I have a lot of content on bark tanning. Look at my playlists on the channel. Wood is fine, but more commonly masonry. Also, especially in primitive conditions, hides are sometimes used. One guy told me about seeing a set up in Mexico, where they suspend a cattle hide, something like an aboveground swimming pool, and tan inside that. Eventually the make leather with the cattle hide too. One of the reasons that full on bark tanning may have been less common in North America is containers among more nomadic and semi nomadic groups. Also, it does take longer and it's harder to start and stop than braintanning. I think here it was more common as a partial tan in combination with other things like smoke and braintanning.
just got to this step in the tanning process. This is like the moment I have been patiently waiting for, lol! I find the tanning proces incredibly fascinating, with the tannins adsorping to the hide changing the whole character and appearence of the material. But dammit, when watching this video for instructions just after I put it in the tanning solution I realized I forgot the step with the acidic solution, hopefully it's not a a big deal
Alright, congrats. You're okay as long as you rinsed and scudded a lot to get the hide floppy and loose again, or maybe a better way to think of it is getting the rubber out after liming. You don't need to acidify or neutralize necessarily. Even if you tanned it fully rubbery, I think you'd still end up with something useful.
@@SkillCult ok, Yeah I assume that almost all the base from the lime has been removed in the scudding and soaking process. It was nice and floppy when I put it in the liquor.
@@SkillCultthis Sitka spruce bark I used seems to be a pretty good tanning material. It has a very nice color and generally seems very rich in tannins. Right now, just after 10 hour of tanning the hide resembles finished leather and is much more firm
@@somatder yes, if the tan is strong enough and kept strong, that is quite normal. What I really want people to notice is how fast the tannin is stripped from the water. In 10 hours you could have very little tannin left, depending of course on a multitude of factors. As tanning progresses, you'll see that weakening effect slow way down and you can bump up the strength and leave it for longer.
How about cheap and easy. Paint sticks and an old belt. Sometimes I use two sticks glued together. Real leather only.
Thanks for such a great series of videos about tanning! I am excited to report that I attempted this project with a fresh deer hide. I used a local variety of oak, "live oak", common to Deep South Texas. I tanned the skin only for about 3 months because white tail deer skin is very thin. I think it worked but was wondering if there was an update to the series or a "results" video of the skin being tanned in the series. I want to compare my results to the model skin as a reference point.
That's awesome. You rock. 3 months is more than enough to finish any deer skin and you can do it much faster if you want to. I've been really wanting to get that skin out of the layer and work on it soon, so it's coming. In the mean time, hang tight. You have some options that I'll discuss to some extent. hopefully this year will also see a video on graining boards and their use. Good on you, make yourself a hide shaped merit badge from that thing! :)
BTW, I've used quite a bit of live oak for tanning out here. we have several species, but all in the black or red group, which yours probably is as well.
SkillCult thanks for such a quick response. I do feel like I earned a merit badge! I can't wait for the follow up vids!
I'm just always happy when there's another person in the world that understands how amazing the process is. Not a lot of people have that in common, especially when it comes to bark tan. So cool.
Man, I'm really enjoying your videos. Thank you.
First of all, sorry for my english, writing is not my best side.
I had question, after deliming, is the any way I can preserve hide several days or weeks in that state and continue work after that?
Thanks again for your videos. Salute from Serbia
They actually take many days to delime. If you can work on it during that time to get the lime out, that is the best thing to do anyway. If you have to leave, put it in fresh water in the coolest place you can until you can get back to it. But usually you need to scud and rinse for several days anway. If you really have to slow it down, I'd put it in several bags and refrigerate.
Thanks. You helped a lot.
can you do a video of bark tanned with hair on?
How would you do a bark tan with the hair on?
did you know there were rivers that contain tannin in tasmania and also Tahquamenon in the u.s.?
I've been to. one in Florida, but don't remember which. That would be really cool to tan hides in a river, or maybe concentrate the water a little if necessary.
Bring us the Leather Renaissance!
I'd like to!
@@SkillCult I've started to get into bark tanning here in Tasmania. Lots of Wallaby and it costs $25 a square foot to buy in the shop. Should be able to save heaps, thanks for the info!
@@Hitthatvape Yeah, and yours will eventually probably be better if you aim for quality. I’ve had some people send me pics of very nice leather they made from following my videos. I know it's a lot of unorganized material, but it will pay off to go through most of my tanning videos playlist. th-cam.com/play/PL60FnyEY-eJChUzoIGCqYE20rpjbfOgfc.html and read this for sure! skillcult.com/blog/2013/04/14/the-most-common-bark-tanning-mistakes-pitfalls-to-avoid-on-your-way-to-beautiful-leather
In high school the AG class made a composter out of some of those big blue plastic barrels with a hand crank to agitate. I wonder if one of those set ups would make a good DIY tannery.
Also a question, how long does tanning solution keep? can you pre-cook large quantities and keep it stored in buckets somewhere or will it go bad?
I'm sure you could. There are also washing machines, which are pretty easy to come by. I always thought it would be cool to build something wind powered to agitate lightly.
It will ferment. I"m not sure what really happens to it that is either good or bad. Certainly the fermentation of solutions, which happens during tanning as well, has some effect though and some of it positive. I can't say a lot else, but I avoid making solutions way ahead and try to cook it up as needed.
I tanned a hide not amazing but it's oak with a load of oak leaves that I got the tannings out off
That's really cool. Try oak bark next time if you can get it, or sumach leaves if you have them. Better yet, prepare your hide, cut it into pieces and test whatever different materials you have around. Where do you live?
SkillCult uk and thanks mate
Couple questions so do you have any videos to tan with fur on? And then what do you do with your lime and your liquors after you done just dump in the grass? Does it hurt the ground?
I don't yet have any fur tanning videos. the lime is actually a valuable fertiziler in most places, unless the soil is already a high ph. My soil is very acid, so it's great, not just lime, which farmers add all the time for calcium and to raise soil ph, but it is also, as you can imagine, charged with all kinds of nutrients that plants need and lots of nitrogen from dissolved and broken down proteins. but it should be dilute enough and spread out or it can have a negative effect.
Why is freezing a problem? I assumed it would just put things on pause for awhile, but I have some hides that I was working on outside and they are all currently frozen (they are all fleshed, mostly grained, and rinsed). Felt like it was a nice pause button until things warm up a bit, anything I should be aware of? Can't begin to express how much I appreciate these videos, I'm following along as best I can doing my first hides, wouldn't be doing it without your channel.
It's not the hides, it the tannin bath. I can't remember for sure because it's not something I deal with a lot, but I remember reading that the solution shouldn't freeze. If the hides freeze, it can supposedly expand the hide fiber, softening the skins. Could be good could be bad depending on what you are after I suppose. Freezing is used to advantage in the far north to soften hides and make them easier to brain. You don't see a lot about it in old literature though.
I'm glad you're going for it. I generally suggest starting small though. You learn just as much and mistakes are bound to be made.
I live where there is essentially no trees. So no bark. There is wild poplar- which no one recommends.
There is wild willow here that is red. I bought leave shredder that i may shred some willow sticks.
We do have bark at stores for landscaping. Thoughts on them bags ?
The bagged bark is probably pretty leached out. Willow might work. Do you have uva ursi (bear berry)? Check out my video and huge website post on vegetable tanning materials. There is probably something. Willow at the least. I think you can use some poplars too. Also, alder, which usually grows with willows and poplars in the far north, if that is where you are.
Amazing videos thanks. What type og tanning material would you suggest to get a light colored end result ?
Bakers ind The UK and Rendenbach GmbH & Co. KG in germany are the only ones i know of, who still do the pit tanning :)
Sumac grows in many parts of the world and is light colored generally. It has to be cooked on very low heat, like 120 f or less. At least some barks give a lighter colored tan too if not cooked too hot. otherwise, I'm not really sure. You might have to experiment.
More great content Brother! Would it be beneficial to use spent liquor to cook new batches? I appreciate Your efforts and dedication towards our improved knowledge! Thanks Once Again!
You could do that. If it it really spent that is not much point, but if it has quite a bit left it makes more sense. Then again, you can just start new hides in the old weak liquor to use up the tannin and then move on to new batches. that used to be done a lot.
@@SkillCult Thank You!
I've got access to a lot of eucalyptus bark down here in SoCal...any experience or knowledge relating to using it for tanning?
In all likelihood. I would think you have mostly blue gum. Here is the little I have on eucalyptus, but I know other species do contain a lot of tannin and would probably work. I collected some of the dry shreds of bark to try and one of my blog followers in Israel uses that stuff for tanning. I'd definitely try it. They more of them you kill the better, ha ha. They make nice bark containers to, like the traditional berry bucket type.
Eucalyptus: Eucalyptus species.
Mallet bark Eucalyptus. astringens aka E. occidentalis var. astringens 40 to 55% tannin. Leaches easily with cold water. orange to red. Mixed with other materials or acids to improve plumping.
Mugga or Red Ironbark, 30-45% tannin, tanning slow, usually mixed with other materials.
Wandoo and Edunca: both commercial sources of tannin.
Was wondering if you just layed the hide out flat on a tarp, covered one layer of bark, folded it while it is on the tarp, covering each layer, then put the folded hide into the bucket with a layer on the bottom, and cover the top. It looked very time consuming to try to stuff the bark in areas not covered and may have been able to save some of the bark? I have never done this, but if you told me to cover a hide making sure all surfaces are covered, it seams it would be covered better that way. Thanks for taking the time to show this. Very interesting. Peace
It might work. as long as there is bark between every layer and fold.Larger containers make a big difference.
Will walnut bark, or even nut husk work? I am sure it would give some very dark leather. I have a lot of want trees I can have all I want in a given season. Thanks!
I have to wonder towards the end of the video, if the leather tanning method, was different from the cut of leather... Some think cordovan leather is so good, but then a nice tanned and smoked buckskin, done traditionally is very nice also. Some food for thought :)
It will work from what I hear from others, but it takes a lot and there are certainly better things to use.
Did you ever finish a book on tanning?
No. I have an old one, we are trying to reprint now, but it's on braintanning.
8:45 to avoid folds, can you put it in washing machine set to low speed?
Yes, most large tanneries use big spinning drums for this process now. I would maybe pick a vertical tub machine if one was available. A better system would be something that just turns once in a while, like a presoak cycle. Some machines will turn a little, then stop and do that a few times. but they will tan faster and more evenly if moved a lot and a washing machine should work.
Working on getting some liquor made up. Thinking after hand processing 10 gallons of bark that I'll borrow a wood chipper. Any reason you can think of not to use the chipper? Thanks.
Only rust. If it is very rusty, it doesn't take much to contaminate and darken the color. I would run a bunch of brush through it first to and knock off the loose stuff.
Today's people think the old ways are gross. They want new every day. To wear the same thing day after day they don't get it. We use to make things to last we did not want to have to do it every day. We had to provide to survive.
How long is the bark liquor good for? I mean can you tan multiple skins in same solution over multiple weeks? At what time frame do tannins in liquor diminish to the point of not working to tan leather or skins?
There are a whole lot of factors involved. How strong the liquor is to start, how far along the skin is in tanning, temperature, tanning materials, what stuff starts growing in there, how long the skin is left. Traditional tanning is much more of an art than a science. There are useful substances that develop during fermentation, acids and such. It used to be common to utilize spent or old liquors to start the new batch of hides and move them into stronger and newer solutions gradually. For sure though, the liqour loses it's preservative power when it gets very weak. If the skin is well along in tanning it is much less vulnerable. A good basic approach is add concentrate frequently in the early stages and make sure that the hide is never sitting in a solution that is basically stripped of tannin power.
I heard hemp bark is the best tanning material going round, you should give it a whirl?
You're kidding right?
@@SkillCult ofcourse😉
Steven, do you have any idea or experience with long term storage of the bark solution, i.e. months or even years? I just find it convenient to be able to make the bark solution beforehand to have it ready once a hide is ready for tanning, if I am in a busy period when I am tanning it would just be a nice relief from the labour if the bark solution is already made and ready to go.
I have done it and it seems to work okay. But the chemistry will change, for better or worse. It used to be common to make strong extracts up here in tan oak country. There were bark mills that just did that and shipped it to the tanneries by ship in barrels. I assume it was liquid, but some extracts, like quebracho commonly in use now, are solid and look like rosin or plastic.I'd say go ahead and experiment, but cautiously. It makes more sense to me to shred the bark and store it. That is most of the work and you just need some time to cook it.
@@SkillCult Update on using stored bark liquor - Hint - I didn't work so well... :) I was bark tanning a fur on lambskin, which I have done before succesfully. After washing and intial fleshing it went in a spruce bark solution and seemed to do allright. However, by inspection later it didn't have the usual pleasent, sort of fermented bark liqour smell, but more like that of a beginning rot. But I have I am like, oh, no big problem, Bark tanning will solve everything as Steven says and now it's just a matter of strengtening the solution to supress the rot :) As I am also tanning a cattle hide I am kind of low on bark I figured it's about time to put the stored bark liquour into use which I boiled 3 years ago and has been sitting in a dark, cool barn since. By inspection I didn't look like what it's supposed to be - a rich and strong 1. and 2. boil. It didn't have that reddish brown shiny colour as usual but more of a pale brown colour.
But I proceed to adding the liquor to the lamb hide give it a stir and let it sit. A week later I go and give a fleshing but here thing start to go south. I poke a hole in the skin to my surprise and I get a little suspicous as it took very little effort to make a hole with the fleshing considering that it is a bark tanned hide and overall it feels kind of weird and weak. And it still has this sort of nasty smell. I try and pull the hair and it slips easily - GAME OVER, haha. You can't win everytime. Appearently, the stored solution didn't do much to strengthen the solution and the skin just kept rotting. So I have learned my lesson and next time I will not store the solution but the chopped bark just as you suggest.
However I have been wondering if it could have started rotting because the leftover hypodermis was keeping the bark liqour from entering the skin. It was pretty pale under some of the bigger patches of hypodermis that came of in the second fleshing, so maybe next time I will have to flesh it much sooner in the tanning process
So you mentioned Oak and Hemlock were good for tanning, what other barks are out there with good tannin levels?
I have a video on that! th-cam.com/video/gbD2h3g0_Nc/w-d-xo.html
I've used walnut bark and walnut husks , which are easier to come by. Keep the barrel covered if you don't husk em. You'll have dead squirells.
We have a White Fir growing in north Florida. I got some bark from a fallen tree, and it came out very dark brown almost black on the first boil and second boil, but the PH is at 8. This surprised me a lot. I used rain water and thought dark liquor = low PH, it doesn't, so where to go from here?
Can I add Aluminum Sulfate to it to get the PH right? Can Alum mess up bark tanning, or is there another acid that is safer? I have Muriatic Acid, it worked good on lowering my fish aquarium PH, and never bothered the fish any. In fact they perked up when the PH was 7.2. What say you???😂
Did you use an iron pot? If so, the iron would bind all the tannins and turn them black and probably change the chemistry. Should be acid I would think.
I am using red oak liquor and I have 4 whitetail hides. I have been boiling oak bark for weeks and have went through 40 gallons of bark. i broke it as small as i could but i didn't chop it up into fine pieces. I feel i am getting good tannin since i have been boiling it for 24-48 hours per 5 gallon batch i then and let it sit with in the liquor for 24-48 hours then again and again. the solution still gets less clear now kind of light milky brown. How do I know when I am done? Thank you in advance
I don't usually cook it so long, but I do chop it up pretty small. If it's in chunks, it will take a lot longer to get the stuff out. I probably cook for up to 8 hours the first time, then maybe again, probably more like 6 hours. If you don't have a lot of material, you may need to make the most of it. I think you would find though that those later cooks have very little actual tanning power. I rarely even do a third cook anymore. Also, you can' just mix them all together, because you'll end up with too much water and not enough tannin, once the skins starts taking stuff out of the solution. Solutions have to be managed to keep the strength up. YOu could start with the really weak ones, then dump the solution out, start with next strongest one and then start adding the strongest one to bring up the strength and keep it up.
Hi again! I am experimenting with a small piece of fox skinn which lost hair anyway, to tann it. (I did braintanning hair-on for the rest of the fox hide). How long, do you think, I shoud keep it in a tanning (bark) solution? It is really thin and nothing to be seen on a cut.
I would take it out and just work it open gently a little, then put it back for a few days. If the solution is strong, it should tan very fast, so it's probably done. I would use a fatliquor of egg yolks and oil, like olive oil to wash the skin in to condition the fibers. You can also just apply to the flesh side, or you can dip the whole skin when in a damp, but not wet state, then rinse the hair clean in clean water, stretch it to dry and apply more to the flesh side as it dries. Then get a damp towel, not sopping wet, just very damp, and lay the flesh side on that and roll it up over night in a cool place so the skin becomes damp, but not soggy and break it as it dries.
@@SkillCult Thanks for the tip! :)
I’m planning on trying to tan my first deer hide this year. I don’t have access to large quantities of oak bark but I do have access to black walnuts and from my research their hulls are very high tannin. Do you have any suggestions for using them and if them being too high in tannin will damage the hide at all?
It shouldn't damage. I've heard more that it takes a ton of them to do a hide. I'm not sure on the numbers. I'll be publishing a huge list of tanning materials soon with stuff from all over the country. Anyway, they can work if you get enough of them.
SkillCult I was able to get about 40lbs of black walnuts over the weekend, and I if I end up needing more I know plenty of people who have the trees and don’t mind me cleaning them up form their yards for them. I started to put them in hot water and get the tannin liquor from them and have been putting it in jars to keep on hand for when I get the hide. So far I’ve used very little of the walnuts and they have still been producing a very dark liquor. I plan on posting some videos and pictures to my channel when I start the whole tanning process. I plan to use the same process you use in your bark tanning videos. If you have any suggestions that would be helpful please let me know. Thanks!
My wife and i restore antique furniture and for most of our leather we have to order from a small group of Austrian craftsmen in the alps that have one way of tanning. We support this because of the quality and consistency even though they only tan still born calf skins and sell during one two week period per year. One skin is about 7-11 square feet and costs about $1000 each. We can never get more than four because of the demand but we are always one the phone the moment it is available each year. Those unwilling to pay for this quality in repairs are informed that the standard quality leather just doesn’t last as long. Spanish, Indian (from India) Chinese and most American leather is veg tanned then vat dyed to cover the fact it is not tanned all the way through. If not saturated in preservatives routinely it rots.
Very interesting. Reading the history of this art, you can really see very plainly how leather chemists pushed faster and more material efficient methods. Eventually that lead to pretreatments and tanning techniques that matched the new quick and cheap society resulting in a lot of crappy leather. There is definitely a difference between just tanned through a little and well filled with tannin. I keep telling people that there is a market for leather that is traditionally produced with 100% natural materials. I'd like to see a microtannery movement with a certification for fully traditional and no chem leather. A further certification could include only locally sourced materials, say within 200 miles or something. I'd also like to see leather workers start becoming tanners. Think of the marketing value of a craftsman that produces their own leather 100% by traditional means from local materials only and then makes that into something amazing. Part of my mission with leather vids here eventually is to foster leather workers in that direction.
SkillCult That sounds so cool. Thanks for the informative videos
Just found your channel.. Great info I havent found on other channels.. One question.. Does it make a difference if the concentrate is cold, warm or hot? On the first soak... Will it soak up more or less tan depending on the temp of the concentrate? Thanks
I think it works faster when warm, as long as it's not hot enough to cook the skin. But keeping it warm is a challenge and you don't want it warm with the hide in there for a long period of time. So it would only be useful for the initial dunk, where it really doesn't gain you that much unless you're in a super big hurry, or for quick tanning methods. I read about one in Morocco where they sewed two goat skins into a bag, put some liquor in the bag, blew it up like a balloon and floated it around with sticks in a big vat of warm liquor so that it was done in a matter of hours. But that sort of thing is very unusual. If you kept it warm for weeks, I think you would have problems with damaging the untanned parts of the hide.
And thanks, and welcome to the channel :)
@@SkillCult awesome thanks for that info.. So I live in new Zealand and we have a problem with possums over here and plan on a trapping trip.. Do you know much or have much experience about brain and or bark tanning possum skins? And would you have any info of what bark to use? The only info I can find uses chemicals.also tried to order your book but the email link wouldn't work. Thanks much appreciated
@@unlearnthesystem6469 We only have one native possum, which I haven't tanned a lot. I'm not sure what it there that is not imported, but no doubt there are plenty of plants with high tannin. They seem to be everywhere. Can't recall anything specific. If you have Australian imports, wattle and eucalypts. Euro imports and others might be listed in my blog post on tanning materials. th-cam.com/video/gbD2h3g0_Nc/w-d-xo.html
@@SkillCult excellent.. Thanks... Had a bit of a look on nz tannin tress found a few.. One called kamahi with 10-13% tannin and the rata tree related to the Myrtle family which are native to new Zealand... What would you recommend for fur on skins?. Bark tanning or brain tanning? Thanks again for your time
How would you use bark tanning and make a more pliable leather ? Also could you use leaves if they haven't been rained on and had the tannins leached out?
I think you could use leaves, definitely before they are rained on. But you have to ask how much leaves and how much work and you will probably be better off gathering some kind of bark or a certain leaf like sumach. if you have sumach, gather those before they fall. Softer more pliable leather is made by chosing the right skin (i.e. deer softer than goat and buffalo softer than cow.) how it's treated before being tanned in the liquor and to an extent how it's tanned and as well as in what material.
SkillCult thanks for the info. I shredded the leaves and it's a 50lb feed bag full of shredded red oak leaves. I don't know how much bark or any material it takes for enough tannin. What kind of step before starting would soften a deer hide?
Follow this basic process in the vids, lime for 4 to 6 weeks, Keep the solution strength up enough. A little color doesn't mean there is tannin left in the solution. Keep your eye's peeled everywhere for recently fallen oak trees or firewood that you can scrounge some bark off. Dried is okay, but rained on for a winter is not. When the skin is done, treat it in a fat liqour (vid on that already) and work it as it dries. I'll do a vid on that sometime. It's just a lot to cover and a lot of ways to go wrong for someone new to tanning. Can't do that in this format.
Honestly, no one listens to me when I say this, but freeze or salt the deer and tan a few squirrels. They're all over the roads at this time of year, very nice skins and perfect to learn the ropes. Trust me :)
SkillCult thanks again I was just curious. I've brain tanned some deer and was wanting to try bark tan but was surprised at how there seem to be less info on it than brain tanning. I understand it's not something that can be explained in a couple of sentences. Thanks for the info and video
Hi again! :) I may need your advice here: I am working on a very thin skin which was flashed, unhaired, neutralized, washed, tanned and scraped (membraned) many times..
It was in a strong bark solution for about 10 days, and I would really like to finish it, but when I scrape it I still see a milky water is coming in some places... leather is ready done, I checked on the neck - it is fully tanned, and there is almost nothing more to scrape, but this milky (fat?) water some places... What would you recommend? Scrape it more and more, or wash with a soap again? I still keep it in a strong bark solution.
Thanks!
If you didn't scud out all the lime before tanning that could be it. It might just be dissolved proteins, fats, soaps formed between lime and fat, etc. Don't worry too much. Eventually it should run more or less clear when scudded out in clean water, but if most of it is out that's probably good enough.
It was washed in a clean water few times after liming. And I changed tanning solution every second day. This milky water is not very thick, mostly transparent a bit white water.
OK, so I will wash it out in a clean water (without soap) , work it one more time and... ready?
Dry it, and apply some good olive oil on it, as I remember you recommended. :)
No soap. throw one egg yolk in a blender, add about 1/8 cup of olive oil, then some warm (not hot) water, dilute in a bucket with warm water til the hide will fit in, then dry flat and maybe put a little oil on the grain if it seems like it needs it. If you want it really soft, work it as it dries. There are other way to approach oiling and finishing, but I haven't really covered those yet.
Thanks Steven!
Watched some of your de-hairing videos again, now I know what is "scud out" lime, hehe... stupid me.
Do you think it is more difficult to scud out lime from ready tanned skin?
I did the tanning process, but the problem is that the skin has become hard after drying, so what is the solution?
Watch this video. This is almost certainly the problem. It looks colored, but it is probably actually not tanned, so it dries hard like rawhide. th-cam.com/video/jjkm_uK0x_k/w-d-xo.html
Can we use bark tanning if we want to keep the haire of the animal? Let’s say I’d like to bark tan a sheep skin with its hair, could you make a video on this types of skins?
Some do yeah. It can actually set the hair in place by shrinking the hide.
@@SkillCult thank you!
@@SkillCult is there any natural tanning method apart from brain tanning or using alum?
@@jozsefkun8785 this one, tannin, smoke, oxidized oils known as oil tanning.
Could one use acorns?
Certainly possible, though not likely very practical in most cases. I'm going to try it once I get back to testing tanning materials.
Do you use letric acid
You probably mean lactic acid. I do, but only in fermented bran, not out of a bottle. It is used to neutralize and remove the last remaining lime.
If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself.
why not use a bigger tub?
I would have used a little bit larger tub, but I didn't have one available. I've never actually tested it carefully, but it seems like if you flatten it way out you end up needing more liquid, like if the skin were completely flat. I should test that sometime to see if it's really true. If tanning a lot of skins I'd want something large enough to lay the skins out flat. This should work okay though.
would coffee work
I've seen some coffee tanned hides. Nothing I've been impressed with. I"ll have to try it this year.
Kinda like leather from India. Total dry junk. Any way what does veggie tan mean. ?I am a total novice in the leather dept.
It just means tanned with tannic acid from plants. Vegetable used to be used more as a broad term for plants than just edible plants like now.
I'm sure you like practicing your axe work but to crush that bark fast, wrap it in that white sheet you had and just drive over it a few times.
Is that how you do it?
That's how I've done shells and crunchy materials for the garden or compost pile.
Spikin Russin
Have you ever made handcrafted leather boots? Its a dream of mine to make some western boots from scratch all the way back from killing the animal.
You can totally do that as far as the leather making goes. I haven't made any real shoes, just moccasins, but I've always thought about it too.
SkillCult issue is I dont hunt deer yet, only rabbit and squirrel, id have to get some big ass rabbits to make boots haha. Ill probs practice tanning with them so when i do eventually get a deer Ill be ready
Deer skin is probably not what you want. It is very soft and supple, which is why it may not even work out that well for this project. Moose, buffalo and elk are also relatively soft and coarse fibered. Cattle hide is very dense, in the best parts at least, and so is less prone to stretching. Horse I think of as in between. Not that you couldn't make shoes from the others, but you might need to adapt the style. There is only so much you can do to make a hide turn out a certain way. The hide's nature itself is a major factor.
SkillCult Ya not even sure where I would get a cow hide. Im surprised bison and cow aren't both dense considering they are both very closely related and can interbreed. I work at a horse barn and within the last year 3 old horses had to be killed and another one will probs be going come spring. Don't think the owner would be to receptive to the idea of skinning it and making boots from it, knowing how most americans are with their pets..... hell if it was my horse I would be all about carving my old dead horse up. I dont get people how they just waist resources. thanks for the info!
Travis Hoeffel
If you still want to find a cow hide, just call nearest slaughterhouse and ask them to hold it next time they have a cow to process. You'll probably have to pay for it, but I have no idea how much
What difference have you found between brain tanned and oak tanned deerskin?
Stretchiness is the main difference. Bark tan is tanned very thoroughly through and the cross linking of the skin fibers by the tannin sets the hide into shape somewhat. With careful pre-treatment and a lot of working, bark tan can be somewhat stretchy, but you can actually firm up braintan a little by overtanning it after it's done with tannins. The grain is also usually left on barktan and usually taken off of braintan (though not always) and the grain prevents strecth to some extent. Stretch is braintans strength and it's weakness.
Like making lasagna ad running out of cheese.
薬液の木の種類が知りたいです
それは黄褐色の樹皮、Notholithocarpus densifloraです。それは日本の石のオークと非常によく似ています。イチジク（Lithocarpus Edulis）
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithocarpus_edulis
What about smoking the hide
smoking does something similar to what tanning in the bark does. To do both is probably kind of redundant. smoke is most commonly used on some skins after softening that are not tanned with tannic acid.
I will always take the opposite position to someone who tries to keep knowledge from the rest of humanity.
Dayum last time I was this early....
If you are trying to make money then you need to use modern methods. I do brain tanning and tried to sell it at raundevue. I could not compete with chemically tanned cow hide.
Bark tanning is probably much more doable. I did braintan for money for years too. With good marketing and developing efficient practice, a microtannery doing veg tan might work. Also, better developed braintanning methods could at least be more doable than what most of us do. But it would involve some power tools.
Scientists did the same thing with food and drugs and clothes and water and ......
First! Hahahahah! I win! Give me a medal? I'll settle for a national holiday in my honor. Or a cookie. Perhaps an axe? No? Ok.
Being first is reward enough!
The Bible is clear and settles it for me.....oppositions of science falsely so called. I'm always rooting for the old ways are the best.