Here's your idea for an episode: why glass headlights aren't produced anymore? (btw plastic headlights SUCK)! (Unsafe when scratched and get ugly for the same reason)
I never liked the "they break arguement", newer cars have a ton of elements that leave you stranded/in dangerous situation but they dont phase them out because of profits etc... and I've seen plastic engine components break more often than popups.
Most of the time it was just the rods that would break in them no the motors(some ran on vacuum) I always kept spare rods in the glove box in case one broke you could do it on the side of the road, and they were relatively cheap
I'd say a modern led adaptive headlight have as much tech or more than a popup headlight from the 1980's that can render the light non-functional so yeah, it's a bad argument.
Interesting. But you missed the biggest reason they went away. The removal of the requirement for Sealed Beam Headlights and mandated headlight sizes. After that change in the late 80's car manufacturers were able to vary the size and shape of the reflector and lens assembly to blend into the aerodynamics without needing pop ups.
Correct, and they get uglier and more bizarre shapes year on year. I hate the things. Plus they are plastic, and go cloudy. The main reason for me, modern cars are so ugly is the lights.
Older headlights could only recess at about 35 degrees. They could get the headlight recesses in a low wedge angle. I think it was Toyota that came up with the solution. They uses 'projector bulbs'. They they could make the cover at a lower angle. Thus pop up become redundant.
@@apreviousseagle836 Yeah I don't like some of the headlight designs. They look stupid AF. Honda Headlights don't look that bad though. (The civic. ). The rear is questionable tho
@@bikerpeople548 Also horribly overstyled front ends and apparently random creases in the sheetmetal. Some of today's cars look like they've been in an accident even before they leave the factory.
The "garage door" light covers did serve a similar purpose to pop up headlights. In the fact that while not in use, they shielded the headlight glass from potential rocks when not in use.
The Porsche 928 had very unique looking pop-up headlights. The headlights laid flat and exposed on top of the fenders, and popped up when turned on. The headlights also had built-in washers (squirters). The headlights, along with the rounded rear-end, gave the Porsche 928 a very exotic look. 👍👍
I don't know why the squirters even though my Supers *cough Supras* featured the same on some. Aren't all fliplights the superior glass design so impossible to dirty?
Having worked as an engineer on pedestrian safety, I can vouch that pedestrian safety regulations did in fact mark the end of pop-ups. Even for regular headlights there is a lot of work done to move them out of the hit area specified in the regulations, because it's extremely difficult to achieve good results when your head can hit a 3 - 4 kg mass of plastic and metal. That's why sometimes we get weird design or location for headlights, that never look like those cool concepts we see at car shows.
didn't know headlights were still a problem for safety, I always thought it was just because it stuck out so much that it would be a lot worse than spreading the force out across a wider area
Now headlights usually hidden away from sunlight and other damaging elements to plastic are out all the time and instead of replacing $15 bulbs we have to replace $300 per headlight assemblies.
I used to borrow an old 80's MR2 from a friend. One of the popup lights was stuck in the open position. Meaning that if I turned the lights of and on, the car would "wink". I used to do it at people at gas stations and such all the time, and it often brought a smile to peoples faces. Damn, I miss that car, it was a joy to ride!
My mother had a Corvette C5. I loved the pop-up lights and I didn't realize that they were actually on so many cars from previous decades. I was disappointed when she got a new Corvette a couple years ago without the pop-up lights. I also remember that she had to take the car into service a lot due to failure of the headlight motors; quite often the car would be parked "winking" with one of the lights stuck up.
In the late 80's, early 90's basically every japanese car had popup headlights, that was at least a bit sporty (MR2, Supra, Celica, Starion, NSX, RX7, etcetc) even BMW did it once, and it is still my favourite BMW, the 850csi
I think that generation of the Celica and Miata are the poster children of pop-up headlights, though the RX-7 FC and FD definitely deserve honorary mentions. There's also the 1st gen NSX which was one of the more linear car designs that pulled off pop-up headlights exceptionally well. Also, once they moved to electric solenoids instead of vacuum lines and baffles to actuate the headlamps, the rate of failure dropped a lot. Many popular cars with pop-up headlights have conversion kits for them too, so you can enjoy your pedestrian-eviscerating and aesthetically pleasing pop-up headlights without much concern for reliability.
@@Inferiis I can understand this preference, but I personally love the pop-up headlight aesthetic. It might not be great for drag when you have to use them, but that's not a huge concern for me (because I'll probably never be able to afford one anyway, even if I am okay with an automatic). I just think that the NSX with the pop-up headlights down is one of the most striking bits of automotive design work. Sharp, straight lines, gently bulging fenders, low raked hood, continuously flowing and well integrated body lines. It's just amazing. The back isn't necessarily my favorite design ever, but it is certainly iconic. Particularly since almost every 90's kid has some memory of getting absolutely destroyed by that car in Gran Turismo 3.
@@Inferiis So do car designers. Pop-ups were always regarded as something of a necessary evil. The sleek "wedge" effect would be spoiled to some extent when the lights are on, so when the regulations began to permit lower-profile headlamp shapes, the designers were quick to run with it. Rear-view side mirrors are another thing stylists dislike. Perhaps in 2050, this channel will explore what life was like before rear-view cameras became standard.
Didn't realize most pop-up headlights had manual overrides in the event of failure. I like the mechanisms of the '70s hideaway headlights because their "natural" state is actually open. They're held shut by a vacuum system which, when it fails, means the headlights just open and stay open without owner intervention.
If they had manual override, none of my mechanics were aware of that. All of them insisted that the motors on my Ford Probe would have to be replaced and the cost would be prohibitive.
I actually own a 2004 c5 corvette, my parents bought it brand new back in the day, so I legitimately grew up with this car and it has almost 200k miles on it. The pop ups have never broken once, sure a light bulb have have need replacing, but the actual pop ups themselves never.
That’s crazy because those gears are made of plastic that I’m sure they’re pretty brittle now some 18 years later. I had a 2000 C5 and had to replace the gears with some beefy aluminum ones. Miss that car
I have to disagree on the "No longer cool." I daily drive a restored Mark III Supra and people love it when I flash the brights and make them pop-up. It is "vintage cool" now, but cool none the less. My next project car will be a Porsche 944, also with pop-up headlights.
@@Saucy-ws6jc Don’t be that guy lol… nothing wrong with being passionate about an era of manufacturing, but doesn’t mean you have to shit on other categories.
The 80s (1983 to be exact) was when aerodynamic flush headlights in non-standard shapes were permitted in the US. If carmakers hadn't been permitted to style lights to fit the car and were required to still use the approved sealed beams pop-up headlights would probably have continued on longer. As aerodynamics became more important and cars became smoother pop-ups and hidden headlights would have become even more prevalent to keep the aerodynamic shape. Have you ever seen an Opel GT? It looks like a miniature C3 Corvette. The headlights are manually cranked and roll over sideways. The C4 Corvette's headlights tumble backwards almost 180 degrees. The Porsche 928 has those funny frog-eye headlights that pop up. I wish glass headlights would come back. Not sealed beams, but replaceable glass covers. I think Volvo in the 90s had those in some markets. Plastic yellows and hazes but glass lasts forever.
glass won't come back. 1. plastic is cheaper for the car makers. 2. plastic can be shaped more freely, comepare to glass 3. yellow haze after many years, means more sales of replacement parts for the auto maker. screws the costomer.
@@davidjacobs8558 If the headlights are hidden when driving during the day (down) then they avoid UV rays and when used at night when there is no sun. They won’t ever turn yellow. Plastic would be fine.
@@davidjacobs8558 None of these are the primary reason. The primary reason is pedestrian safety and general safety. Can you imagine getting hit by a car and having shards of glass forced into your legs? Also, being glass means it would be more likely for a rock to hit it and break it. Sure, it could be laminated like windshields, but then that's getting pretty expensive. Plastic headlights also aren't that hard to refinish, the Cerakote kit does a great job of taking off the oxidized outer layer and making them look good again.
@@nunyabusiness896 the chance of headlamp glass injuring the pedestrian is pretty low. minor consideration compare to the blunt trauma itself. I would bet if a vehicle hit a pedestrian, there is very little chance the thick glass headlamp would shatter.
@@destruxandexploze2552 as I wrote before, the car makers WANT the plastic headlamp to TURN yellow. It's part of their planned obsolescence. They don't want things to last and last. They only want things to last just beyond the warantee period.
I think you may have missed a major reason for pop-up headlights and their demise. There were, at the time, two standardized "sealed beam" headlights manufactures could use, the traditional round ones, or the newer square shapes. So they hide these monstrosities behind doors and in pop-ups. Now with halogen bulbs and LEDs headlights can be almost any shape the designers want.
I was going to say, "hello, fellow Technology Connections" fan, but your comment is older than this TC video from 6 months later about headlights, which goes into considerable depth about sealed beam headlamps and the design solutions that resulted from them: th-cam.com/video/c2J91UG6Fn8/w-d-xo.html
Most my cars have been 80s cars for the fact being there easy to work on looks amazing and used to be able to get for cheap not anymore tho. My first being a 85 mr2 my 88 z31 and 90 maita and my 2 volvo 240s that I daily to this day.
I once owned a luscious red 1988 Honda Integra 1.6 EX16 (the 'Type R' of its day), and LOVED the pop up headlights on it. I mounted a push button on the dash and hooked it up to the left (near side) pop up motor, so that with a little 'Beep' of the horn to attract the tidy ladies in shorts/short skirts/summer dresses in the heat of summer, as I drove by, I could push the wink button and 'Wink at them', must admit, got a good few giggles and waves back! I LOVE cars with pop up headlights like the old Integra and Prelude... 🤔😏 😎🇬🇧
For many countries, "safety" was the catch phrase used to have pop up headlights banned. As with many things "safety" or "environment" was used to sway people and still is. Yet all the while, cars are getting taller, SUV's getting heavier and their frontal area worse at knocking down a pedestrian rather than having pedestrians deflect off the front of the lower bonnets/hoods of older cars all without being cancelled under "safety". At the end it didn't come down to objectivity for the demise of the pop up headlights.
Yeah, and if headlights have a "sharp" front, the weight and speed of the car is going to kill you before the headlights do. The word safety should be in the dictionary as "A word that is commonly used as an excuse to ban something"
For those asking why I left out some cars - I don’t own footage of them! No hate or disregard for those cars, I love them all! I just haven’t reviewed one of filmed the headlights specifically so I didn’t have footage of them to use!
Yeah, you missed 3 generations of Corvette hidden, or pop up to use your seemingly favorite term, headlights. The C 2 Corvette used electric motors and just rotated into the exposed position, they didn’t really pop up. The third generation, C3 used vacuum actuation, and rose slowly. The headlight units were smaller diameter than the big 5” units so. Didn’t pop up very far. The C4 Corvette again used electric activation. In the down position they were upside down, and the lights pointed toward the firewall. When turned on, they rotated approximately 180* and unobtrusively rose up. They didn’t pop up. Now that there is very little regulation of headlight size and shape, the headlights can be interrogated into the design of the front fascia. There is no need for pop up headlights.
The C4 Corvette headlights flipped completely over. Lift the hood and they were aimed to the rear. When flipped forward the housings had no hard edges or points. The Opel GT (which looked like a mini 1970's Corvette) had headlamps that rotated *sideways*, actuated with a mechanical lever.
Getting in a car at night with pop up headlights was so cool. It was like the machine was coming to life. New cars don’t have that, they seem artificial and robotic.
All that statement is self contradiction of logic and reason. Robot and semi analogue machine isn't any different but just functional complexity variation. But then people who associate cars like living things then go on to quack about robotics on cars isn't showing much brain complexity either.
@@changsangma1915 Damn, you obviously dont care about cars. Some do feel more organic than others, specially how responsive they are at the wheel. Subhuman? Go join the Azov batallion, they would like neonazis like you
They do break. However, usually they're stuck in the open position. I bought a Porsche 944 new, and TBH I was never that crazy about it. Today, LED's are so tiny and so powerful it's no longer necessary for aerodynamics. You can literally stick LED's into almost any car that had popups - without the headlights needing to pop up. Reason number 4, they go out of alignment.
I found they broke either way about as often but most people either never fixed them or got tired of fixing them and left them open all the time. They also tended to freeze shut in winter in colder climates.
No you can just stick LEDs into old headlight housings that are not designed for them. They will have light scatter that can blind other drivers and also not project as well as normal lights. Also putting an LED or HID in a reflector housing is really shitty as it tends to blind other road users they work far better in projector housings which weren't present on pop up headlights.
Headlight technology advanced to the point where popups were no longer needed. Instead of having to use those bigass lights we got the small bulbs so they could keep the sleek front end without having to hide the giant lights. Popups were cool and I really enjoyed them when I had them for the novelty factor but If you think about it they add a ton of drag when they are up.
Ah yes, let's make a giant block of SUV then, but most importantly keep the headlights sleek and aero XD I guarantee that literally any old car with popped open headlights is more aero than a modern SUV. Not in terms of c_d number necessarily, but overall aero, with cross section included.
I would be enthralled to see a car manufacturer’s modern form of pop up headlights, like what kind of creative way they could add them to cars to fit the current style.
Considering the current style is " the most aerodynamic and politically pleasing shape" I am sure it would end up being a small strip of LED's that move inside of a housing.. Oh wait, I think I actually saw that on some Audi the other day, the owner had no idea the car did it becaue you can't even see the hood, let alone lights, let alone let alone lights in an enclosed housing. Modern cars really are bland.
@@tedwojtasik8781 be that as it may, today a nice C5 sells for 20k while a nice Esprit can go up to 90k. I'd rather be waiting for road assistance in my Esprit than getting there on time in just another C5.
@@tedwojtasik8781 Do you also murder people for owning a Lotus or any car you do like? Also how would you feel if someone say that your car is garbage in front of your face?
@@tedwojtasik8781 Esprits were actually their most reliable and best model offered. Stateside it's just hard to find parts and resources. UK on the other hand, every briton knows how to magically repair one.
Awesome video. I love pop up headlights! Love the way the look from inside the car when they are up. My first car was a 1994 Miata and I loved the pop up headlights !
Good points, though the reliability of the headlight mechanisms definitely varied by manufacturer. My primary experiences with pop-ups are with Toyota, who seems to have the most robust motors and mechanisms. In order of age I have a 1985 AE86(140K), a 1988 Celica Alltrac(58K), and a 1992 SW20 MR2(166K). I haven't had any headlight issues with any of these cars; they've worked every time I've turned them on. The same is true with any other car I've had in the past with pop-ups, though I've only owned one non-Toyota car with pop-ups(an '88 third-gen Accord). Even the pop-ups on my ill-fated project A70 Supra worked flawlessly the first time I tried them; the car had been sitting outside with a bad engine since 2006(this was in 2021). I literally hooked up a battery and turned the headlights on. Zero fuss.
I have a 1992 Celica GT-Four. The pop up headlights are a key style component to this classic car. There is no better stylistic element to really signify a car as an 80s car, unless you decide that the angular body styling is a more important style element.
@@MrEMVme Yeah. The fifth gen Celica such a good looking car and the pop up headlights are a huge part of it. The sixth gen with the bug eyes and the rounded nose lost me. My GT-Four is Black! I wanted Super Red but the black has grown on me, and Mrs. Mack digs it, so black it is.
@@mackchannel6348 if it makes you feel any better I have a 90’ super red ST184 and it is a nightmare keeping the paint from fading. They shine up well but after a year it starts to turn to a matte red. comes with the age I guess. 6th gen gt4 does win for only coming with a CS hood though.
@@MrEMVme That makes sense. Red doesn't surprise me as a difficult color to maintain. The 6th gen WRC hood is sharper than the bulbous nose of the normal 6th gen for sure. But no pop ups. And so...inferior, I am beholden to say in this replies section of a pop up headlights video. : )
I had a 1987 Celica, i was always glad that i owned at least one car with pop up headlights. I miss that car actually. One of my favorite things about cars back in the 80s and 90s, was how much variety was offered, they just don't sell cars like they did then. I mean like affordable mid-engine cars, or things like the Suzuki Jimny (as it WAS). SUVs back then were actually made for going off road. Now all you see is "SUVs", most which are really more like a minivan and a station wagon mixed together than a off-road vehicle. I had this rental car a couple years ago. It was a 2 wheel drive "jeep". Makes no sense to me
Heck yeah bless the algorithm for showing me this video. I love pop up headlights soooo much and many a time I too raise my eyebrows in joy when I see a car with em >:) nice job with the documentary bud
I had my 1986 IROC Z Fitted with custom "Pop Down" headlight covers... During the day it was aerodynamic & at night they went down when the light switch was activated...very cool California feature
Had a 93 Celica turbo alltrac, my favorite car I’ve ever owned. Loved the pop up lights and never had a problem with them. They looked awesome with the hood vents.
I owned two older cars with those, both Pontiacs. The mechanisms were problematic, but fixable if you could find the parts .. I recall a kit from eBay that allowed replacement of plastic gears with brass ones.
I love the sleek look of the front of my 96 WS6. It's the 8th Trans Am I've owned with pop up lights ranging from a 1985 to a 2000. Only 2 had pop up light issues, a 98 WS6 and a 2000 WS6.
One of my favorite cars with pop-ups is the '66 Olds Toronado. It was actually considered a "tribute car" to the '36 Cord 810 you mentioned earlier in the video. The design referenced the grill, fenders, wheels, was front-wheel drive and of course, had pop-up head lights. Those headlights were pretty neat and we most likely won't see anymore, but with how "interesting" some newer EV vehicles are looking, I'm sure we might see something similar here soon! Maybe...
I was lucky enough to have had at least one car with pop up headlights. I had a 1987 Celica, great car for it's time, for what it was. Very reliable. I always wanted to wire it up so i could push a button, and have it close one side like it was blinking, while the horn 'whistles'. For when i drove past women. Back then i suppose people would have gotten that i was just messing around not being serious. These days I'd probably be put in jail for that. I miss the good old days.
@@derealized797 Regardless, if I had seen that out in public, it would have made my year. I would have laughed my ass off! And yeah, those sure were the days, can't argue with that.
The Toronado came about due to a radical new "drive unit" GM had designed - without having any car design in mind before development started on the front drive system. Their styling studio was always noodling around with concepts and they'd done a side view which had been named the Flame Red Car. So someone suggested why not the Flame Red Car? The painting was large and had been hanging on a wall for a while. So that painting became the starting point for the Toronado and unlike how most production models end up quite a lot different from the concept, the Toronado side view was very close to the Flame Red painting. I used to have an old magazine from the 1960's that had a page of short information notes about the upcoming cars. Someone had leaked that GM's test drivers complained the Toronado headlight doors wouldn't close until they got *below 120 miles per hour*.
@@greggv8 I remember hearing certain aspects of what you've said when Jay Leno built his own Toronado in "Jay Leno's Garage" and brought on David North, the guy who drew the Flame Red Car. I don't doubt what you read in the magazine either, it was a fast production car for it's time, pretty funny stuff! Those really were different times.
Thanks for mentioning the Honda Accord, but I was on the edge of my seat for an image/video footage of a ‘86-‘89 Honda Accord! The pop up lights on mine never failed to pop up for 17 years and 250,000 + miles. When the lights are up, they help the driver gauge where the car is in the lane - just put the top of the pop up light over the yellow line (driving on the right side). I’d wager a guess that cars with pop up lights help drivers keep their car more consistently in-lane.
A fourth reason pop-up headlights fell out of favor: They were hard to keep clean. Using pop-ups during wet weather will, of course, coat the headlights with road spray dirt. If you ran a car with pop-ups through the car wash the lights would likely be off and closed; if you tried to run it through the wash with the lights up you ran the risk of the lights being damaged by the car wash brushes. Over time, many pop-ups (and other covered headlights) would become almost opaque, creating a safety hazard for all concerned. Yes, you could take the effort to turn on the lights and clean them like your windshield, but many found that an irritant.
Which means they would be good fits for higher end sports cars, since the people owning those would be more likely to be interested in spending the time keeping everything clean, but it doesn't help for everyday drivers who just want a go that gets them to work and back.
@@cheesecurd100s Yeah, I saw that. Truth is, those squirters are close to being completely worthless, even if the grime is still damp. If the grime has dried, forget it.
I had a 1987 Honda Prelude Si that had the pop up lights. They were really great and never an issue. I drove it through Pennsylvania winters. Yeah dirty lights was an issue sometimes but the Honda had a special button on the dash to raise the lights with out turning on the lamps. I would just do that in the winter when I washed it. We never used the automatic washes then.
In 1998 my grandfather bought me a 1988 Ford Probe, black with a red interior. It had the pop up headlights. I freaking loved that car. It died almost a year after I got it lol but I had fun driving it. Especially at night. I loved watching the lights pop up. Oh and my friend had a Toyota Celica with the pop up headlights. We would switch cars all the time. great vid.
The Probe was the most fun I've ever had with any of my cars. Great for driving on narrow, curvy country roads. Easily the best handling car I ever had.
You already got the big one (pedestrian safety) but on a practical standpoint, they're really only aerodynamic when they're down (adding 6% or more of drag when open), which is kind of a big deal on cars with a focus on low cD as a selling point.
@@sydakk A good number of these cars are becoming garage queens and/or are turned into drift missiles at this point so it's true they probably don't ever have the lights up (except in sleepy-eye mods), but for daily driving they aren't that great. Not everyone lives in SoCal: in many places, you need lights on in the rain and/or the extended hours of darkness in winter mean lights are up more often than not, especially in cold places where they risk freezing closed otherwise. And that's if they even still work properly; plenty of them are just left up because they don't function anymore.
Even as a little kid at the time I always thought of that, especially when comparing them to the models that tried to incorporate fixed headlights into some attempt at greater aerodynamism (or at least the cosmetic appearance of it) which increased throughout the 1990s. One thing I thought was going to be mentioned (but probably is hard to get data on) is that motorists were almost certainly putting their headlights on more often as the 1990s progressed. From something you put on "at night," awareness seemed to be pushed really heavy as something that should be put on whenever there was a doubt. Dusk, overcast weather, etc. In fact legally, where many other countries came to implement manufacturer regulations requiring Daytime Running Lamps, the USA has instead implemented strengthened local driver regulations on actual headlight use that are not fulfilled by DRLs.
I've never bought a car because of it's efficiency, because of it's drag rating, because of it's virtue points, I have bought it because 1, does it look good, pleasing, designed by a car guy not a politcian. 2, does it sound good, as in, loud when I went to have fun but can be quiet enough to trundled through the neighbourhood. 3. Simple and fun to drive, no auto shifters, no touch screens, no needless safety features bing bonging away. Since the average speed of my car is around 35 to 40MPH with the most being a few hours at 70, the aerodynamics play a very small part in real life usage. If I was on the motorways all day every day, I might consider something more wedge shaped but as it is, my popups literally make no difference to my over all fuel usage in a real life setting, the obsession with fractions of percent has turned all cars and brands into the same basic model.
I found myself thinking how useful pop up headlights are - had them on my 87 Dodge Daytona, seems like this is a great way to keep headlights cleaner, and protect them when not in use.
I had an 87' Daytona as well, loved that car, drove like a dream and was quite fast for a 4 banger though mine was turbo-charged. Never had a problem with that car, super reliable. One time the damn thing would not start so I took it to my local mechanic. Jerkoff calls me about an hour after drop off and tells me the Hall Effect was bad and needed replacement...cost to fix was $375. As I was trained as a mechanic but no longer had my tools as I sold them, I knew what a Hall Effect was (it's Dodge's updated version of points). So I went to the local Checker Auto Parts, paid the $15 for a new Hall Effect and drove to the mechanics. Told him I was there to pick up the car and he laughed and said, "good luck as it does not run." I smiled, took the key, popped the hood, removed the old Hall Effect (it is right under the distributor cap, front and center, super easy access), put the new one in, started her up and drove off. The mechanic was throwing daggers with his eyes as I smiled and waived goodbye :-)
I have memories of driving a car with headlights like these back in the 90s so its kinda blury. I remember hating the fact that lights i need to see in the dark to drive with breaking and in Chicago during winter they'd get frozen and not popup. The extra chore of cleaning and heating them so they don't get stuck during the winter added some extra pain to the cool factor.
As an old dude I was driving my 93 C4 vette in the neighborhood at dusk when I popped the headlights. Some teen boys on the side of the street saw it and thought it was super cool. Maybe reason #1 is toast. Pop ups are cool every thirty years or so. Old dudes and teens will set the trend! Pop ups rule. Teens are loving the affordable C4s with them pop ups!
All kids think the pop ups are cool as hell. If for no reason other than no cars have them, it's stunning. Never met a person that didn't love them on my Supra.
Your reason #2 is irrelevant... Each one of em uses mechanism simular to the wiper motors, and they don't break at all... The machanisms are simple and cheap to repair, and if someone doesn't tamper with em, they las a looong time. Another fact, they are 30+ years old, so some wear and tear is expected. Other than that, great video. 👍🏼
Yeah, most get damaged in fender bender wrecks and never put back right. If you get an accident free car the pop ups will almost always work perfectly.
The other thing about pop-ups is that the aerodynamic advantage you get when they're closed goes away when they're open. If you can design the headlight enclosure so that you get lower drag all the time, that's a win. Requirements for daytime running lights and for headlights to be on in various daytime situations also reduced the degree to which you were even allowed to run with no lights at all.
Honestly that's only a problem with EV's right now. People only cared about the aerodynamics if it was a sport car, that's why so many of the cars on the road look like bricks. They know that since the car isn't a sports car and that you can fill up your car in a few minutes then efficiency doesn't matter.
@@Sam-gf1eb aerodynamics matter even for the commuter, driving above 20mph results in a huge amount of drag which uses fuel and drag represents around 75% of resistance on the vehicle. Minor changes can result in massive savings of fuel.
I loved my '94 Ford Probe's pop-up lights. After flipping the switch a couple times, and by timing it just right, I could repeatedly make one light go up while the other went down, to make it look like they were dancing.
I too had a Probe. One night the lights made a big noise, they went down inside (while I was driving), and they came up again -- never to go down any more. All mechanics told me the motor would have to be replaced and it would cost a fortune. I'm wondering after reading this whether it might have been that they just didn't know how to make the repair.
I thought the reason pop-ups disapeared was because NTSB or IIHS requirement for sealed-beam headlights was lifted in the late 80's. This meant car manufacturers could achieve the wedge shape or aerodynamic design with composite headlights (think 1987 Ford Taurus).
"aerodynamic design" Another drawback is that the sleek aerodynamic performance of the front end is basically ruined at nighttime when the pop-up headlights are actually up!
Well done! Thank you! BTW with the drive to electrify everything on 4 wheels, one thing you can't do in an EV is row your own gears. I would love to see a similar doc on the manual transmission. Again, much respect to the modern car manufacturers that are keeping the manual alive. One of the reasons I have my Honda FK8 Civic Type R is because of that sweet shifting, Honda 6-speed manual. Now there is official word that Toyota is finally releasing their Supra in a 6-speed manual just in time to go head to head with the manual in the new Nissan Z. Definitely great news in a time when many other sports car and supercar manufacturers are going dual-clutch. BTW I also cannot forget to give Toyota props for their other manual offerings like the GR 86 and the upcoming GR Corolla which comes exclusively in a 6-speed manual.
I loved the headlight covers that were popular in the early 70's. They were very stylish and would be a cool novelty on a newer car. Even though they do have thin LED lights now.
Fantastic narration! "Screw your aero and dynamics" LOL Seriously great job on the history, the content in general and the presentation! TH-camrs take note of how to do it the right way.
Glad to see the fb back on the road. Fun fact about the cord body. Hupmobile bought unused body's to produce the 41 skylark. My father had one. He ended up selling but still has his 39 Hupmobile. The skylark was a last ditch attempt to save the company but when ww2 happened the couldn't afford to convert their factory to help with the war effort and died off.
Another reason they went away was the ability of auto-makers to build custom composite headlights for each car. The sealed beam "standard" headlights of the time were required by law. And being so ugly, making them hide away was the only option to a cool look. Great video though! Also I think the Mazda Miata used pop-up through the 97 model year.
Loved all the different styles and pop up methods from all the different manufacturers. 1st Gen RX7s stuck up really high and looked very ominous from inside the car. Corvettes and 928 Porsches had the coolest mechanisms though with the former rotating all the way around backwards, and the latter popping up and rotating sideways. Not to mention some of the 60s and 70s sedans and muscle cars that had hideaway grill headlights. The ones in my MR2 were lightning fast. Used to wink at other drivers by pressing the button.
I remember when pop up headlights came out and I’ve never really liked them, but I must admit it is a cool feature and I think over the years they could have improved the technology and look. The biggest problem was that the headlight pop up motor failed frequently so it was a hassle for drivers.
you forgot to mention the #1 reason popups are gone- the introduction of the European style composite aerodynamic headlights all cars have today. Also, another disadvantage of pops ups if you live in the snowbelt /northern states is they can freeze shut during a snow or ice storm.
Chevy Corvette did it best with the vacuum advance system using vacuum from the engine combined with Bellows to move the lights up and down they did fail but they lasted a lot longer than the mechanical ones The best pop-up light was in the 1960s one Corvette model the lights didn’t just pop up they made a full rotation from the back to the front wicked crazy stuff
Vacuum motor headlights are fun but sadly they're very difficult to find replacements for. I daily a 78 LTD with vacuum headlights and I'm just thankful mine haven't sprung any bad leaks yet. So unless you're able to repair them yourself, they're rare (and expensive) at least last I looked. That being said, they're absolutely a fun statement and I would be sad to have to run without them!
The vacuum headlights are FAR more unreliable than the motor driven ones. Vacuum leaks are always a constant problem for any car system. Most motor-driven pop ups were damaged from idiots trying to pop them up when there was ice on the car that prevented them from moving, or from dumbasses sitting on the car or leaning on them, etc. If left alone and the owner doesn't do anything dumb, motor driven pop ups can last for decades without any major repair.
Owned RX7 SA ( 1979 ) from 1985 until 1991, FC Turbo ( 1988 ) from 1991 until 1996, MX 5 NA ( 1989 ) from 1996 until 2000. Bought my FC back in 2016 and still have it. Number of headlight pop not up - issues 0. Some blown cheap H4 bulbs but easy ( ! ) to replace even @ the complicated not go out of alignement- design of the FC ones.
Modern headlights can be much narrower, fitting into smaller front ends. My friend had an early 1970s Opel GT, which had headlights that didn’t pop up, but “rolled over, from left to right, and were completely manual, incorporating a large lever in the car’s interior.
In addition to the reasons you gave, I figured another major one is they are not aerodynamic when up. Sure a lot of people wouldn’t care, but others would on a performance car, or on a hybrid or ev that wants to be fuel efficient as possible. And I love pop up lights too! Nice vid!
Exactly! In places where you're required to have your headlights turned on at ALL TIMES (like here), there's zero point to pop up headlights. They look ugly as hell, make the car slower and make you visit the pump more often. I was so glad they went out of fashion. They only make sense in those places where you only use them at night.
The whole reason for popups was to allow a low, streamlined nose. Meaning that, like space-saver spare tyres, popup headlights defeat their purpose when you are required to use them.
I had an 87 MR2 and kept the lights up full time. I just thought it made the front end look better and I also appreciated the crosshair-like target effect to enhance precision when driving way too fast as a reckless kid.
I recently modded away the pop ups on my '66 Lotus Elan. I got sick of chasing air leaks (it was a vacuum operated system), and the fact that if they failed you could be completely blacked out in the dark. I know I could've spent a bunch of time fail proofing the system but the other option of removing a bunch of parts, simplifying and adding lightness to a Lotus seemed like the right thing to do. Plus i get to have really cool perspex headlight covers like a 240z now.
I understand your logic here. I have converted many vacuum operated retractable headlamps on Lotus cars to Electric motors. The vacuum systems where never great even when the cars where new. In the US they required them to be up when there is no vacuum so if you parked your car with the lamps down and came back after an hour or so you would find it looking sort of drunk with one lamp halfway up.
Never seen one broken. I still have an 87 Fiero with working pop ups, and those cars were reliabilty nightmares. None of my Celicas or Supras ever had and issue. It's just cheaper to manufacture a cheap plastic headlight. This is why they went away. Newer swooping design headlights came later as a result of pop ups being already gone from the scene, so it was not a design choice.
Thanks for the info - I had 2 early RX-7’s the actuators never broke but never knew about the manual knobs. Remember girls liked to watch the lights flip up and down.
they can still make pop-ups in the US but need a emergency puller in the cabin, other reason is that the EU banned pop-ups for pedestrian safety so if you want someone to point your finger, point at Europe for killing popups
I haven't watched your channel in so long. I remember watching you a little bit back when Gingium had his FC RX7... But none since then. This was recommended to me, even though I'm not subscribed. It's hit the algorithm! On another note, this was extremely well put together. Microphone sounds good, editing and music fit the theme, you're straight to the point, with delivery that makes it interesting to listen to, and the topic as a whole was fun. I'd love to see more content like this.
Great vid but I can’t believe you didn’t show the super cool forward flip of the 4th Gen Corvette. Re: manual openers, I had to use that on my ‘84 fiero in highschool. A rebuilt replacement was almost $400, so I lived with it. They’d both lift, but one didn’t retract. I’d crank that one down at home by hand so I’d look cool during the day 😂
I feel like they will make a comeback as a vintage trend. With new advancements in technology, we could make sleek cars with even a popup headlight for every type of light (indicator, street, road lights...)
For retro designs to come back, you have to get rid of the prohibitive politics like anti Co2 policies and over bearing safety policies and move back to a middle ground, then you have to get rid of politics that's causing everyone to be poor, which are largely related to the above, so that if someone released a retro model that got slightly less gas mileage, cost slightly more to maintain, people would willingly buy it over the Blandomatic5000's we have now. It's entirely possible but we have to understand the prohibitive nature of political progress vs what's actual realistic and desirable.
CARS WERE BETTER IN THE 80’s STICKER NOW AVAILABLE!
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Circa mid 90's, regulation were put in place which require (paraphrased)
'all production car headlights must be rigidly attached to the body.'
Want to know about LES DRLs.
Here's your idea for an episode: why glass headlights aren't produced anymore? (btw plastic headlights SUCK)! (Unsafe when scratched and get ugly for the same reason)
70's
@shooting cars can you make one about the Corolla Toyota 2009 Silver one X- large car interior size and even? Just one video and history
I never liked the "they break arguement", newer cars have a ton of elements that leave you stranded/in dangerous situation but they dont phase them out because of profits etc... and I've seen plastic engine components break more often than popups.
I absolutely agree, and also I would like to mention that I never had any issue with them. I got a '94 MX-5
@@tomashosektouge Same '95 MX-5
Most of the time it was just the rods that would break in them no the motors(some ran on vacuum) I always kept spare rods in the glove box in case one broke you could do it on the side of the road, and they were relatively cheap
I'd say a modern led adaptive headlight have as much tech or more than a popup headlight from the 1980's that can render the light non-functional so yeah, it's a bad argument.
Even the breaking argument is invalid. There's a pressure release that leaves them stuck up if they are stuck down.
Interesting. But you missed the biggest reason they went away. The removal of the requirement for Sealed Beam Headlights and mandated headlight sizes. After that change in the late 80's car manufacturers were able to vary the size and shape of the reflector and lens assembly to blend into the aerodynamics without needing pop ups.
Correct, and they get uglier and more bizarre shapes year on year. I hate the things. Plus they are plastic, and go cloudy. The main reason for me, modern cars are so ugly is the lights.
Older headlights could only recess at about 35 degrees. They could get the headlight recesses in a low wedge angle. I think it was Toyota that came up with the solution. They uses 'projector bulbs'. They they could make the cover at a lower angle. Thus pop up become redundant.
@@bikerpeople548 Yeah all the newer cars want to be this bubbly looking thing with insect like headlights. I hate that look.
@@apreviousseagle836 Yeah I don't like some of the headlight designs. They look stupid AF. Honda Headlights don't look that bad though. (The civic. ). The rear is questionable tho
@@bikerpeople548 Also horribly overstyled front ends and apparently random creases in the sheetmetal. Some of today's cars look like they've been in an accident even before they leave the factory.
The "garage door" light covers did serve a similar purpose to pop up headlights. In the fact that while not in use, they shielded the headlight glass from potential rocks when not in use.
The Porsche 928 had very unique looking pop-up headlights. The headlights laid flat and exposed on top of the fenders, and popped up when turned on. The headlights also had built-in washers (squirters). The headlights, along with the rounded rear-end, gave the Porsche 928 a very exotic look. 👍👍
C4 corvette was unique aswell it turned 3 times
I don't know why the squirters even though my Supers *cough Supras* featured the same on some. Aren't all fliplights the superior glass design so impossible to dirty?
Having worked as an engineer on pedestrian safety, I can vouch that pedestrian safety regulations did in fact mark the end of pop-ups. Even for regular headlights there is a lot of work done to move them out of the hit area specified in the regulations, because it's extremely difficult to achieve good results when your head can hit a 3 - 4 kg mass of plastic and metal. That's why sometimes we get weird design or location for headlights, that never look like those cool concepts we see at car shows.
Underrated comment.
Screw the idiots that walk in front of a moving car. They ruin everything. Hey let's make cars out of bubble wrap and Nerf! Bring back pop ups!!
didn't know headlights were still a problem for safety, I always thought it was just because it stuck out so much that it would be a lot worse than spreading the force out across a wider area
Now headlights usually hidden away from sunlight and other damaging elements to plastic are out all the time and instead of replacing $15 bulbs we have to replace $300 per headlight assemblies.
then flat faced utes got popular anyway
I used to borrow an old 80's MR2 from a friend. One of the popup lights was stuck in the open position.
Meaning that if I turned the lights of and on, the car would "wink". I used to do it at people at gas stations and such all the time, and it often brought a smile to peoples faces. Damn, I miss that car, it was a joy to ride!
My mother had a Corvette C5. I loved the pop-up lights and I didn't realize that they were actually on so many cars from previous decades. I was disappointed when she got a new Corvette a couple years ago without the pop-up lights. I also remember that she had to take the car into service a lot due to failure of the headlight motors; quite often the car would be parked "winking" with one of the lights stuck up.
In the late 80's, early 90's basically every japanese car had popup headlights, that was at least a bit sporty (MR2, Supra, Celica, Starion, NSX, RX7, etcetc) even BMW did it once, and it is still my favourite BMW, the 850csi
I think that generation of the Celica and Miata are the poster children of pop-up headlights, though the RX-7 FC and FD definitely deserve honorary mentions. There's also the 1st gen NSX which was one of the more linear car designs that pulled off pop-up headlights exceptionally well. Also, once they moved to electric solenoids instead of vacuum lines and baffles to actuate the headlamps, the rate of failure dropped a lot. Many popular cars with pop-up headlights have conversion kits for them too, so you can enjoy your pedestrian-eviscerating and aesthetically pleasing pop-up headlights without much concern for reliability.
might be me only, but I prefer the later, cleaner version of the NSX, with the "normal' headlights
@@Inferiis I can understand this preference, but I personally love the pop-up headlight aesthetic. It might not be great for drag when you have to use them, but that's not a huge concern for me (because I'll probably never be able to afford one anyway, even if I am okay with an automatic). I just think that the NSX with the pop-up headlights down is one of the most striking bits of automotive design work. Sharp, straight lines, gently bulging fenders, low raked hood, continuously flowing and well integrated body lines. It's just amazing. The back isn't necessarily my favorite design ever, but it is certainly iconic. Particularly since almost every 90's kid has some memory of getting absolutely destroyed by that car in Gran Turismo 3.
@@Inferiisto each there own and all but the pop up gods are angry and will be punishing you soon for your transgressions
@@Inferiis So do car designers. Pop-ups were always regarded as something of a necessary evil. The sleek "wedge" effect would be spoiled to some extent when the lights are on, so when the regulations began to permit lower-profile headlamp shapes, the designers were quick to run with it.
Rear-view side mirrors are another thing stylists dislike. Perhaps in 2050, this channel will explore what life was like before rear-view cameras became standard.
Now how about the german-Corvette AKA the Opel GT? th-cam.com/video/dh4oBIIFB6A/w-d-xo.html @ 6:30
Didn't realize most pop-up headlights had manual overrides in the event of failure. I like the mechanisms of the '70s hideaway headlights because their "natural" state is actually open. They're held shut by a vacuum system which, when it fails, means the headlights just open and stay open without owner intervention.
Not really. They are just closed and can be manually opened. Motive force to either open or closed is NOT applied when the headlights are off.
If they had manual override, none of my mechanics were aware of that. All of them insisted that the motors on my Ford Probe would have to be replaced and the cost would be prohibitive.
I actually own a 2004 c5 corvette, my parents bought it brand new back in the day, so I legitimately grew up with this car and it has almost 200k miles on it. The pop ups have never broken once, sure a light bulb have have need replacing, but the actual pop ups themselves never.
such a beautiful car...
That’s crazy because those gears are made of plastic that I’m sure they’re pretty brittle now some 18 years later. I had a 2000 C5 and had to replace the gears with some beefy aluminum ones. Miss that car
Same with my 1988 Toyota Corolla GTS.
The Corvette used the system of vacuum and if the vacuum lines broke the Corvette headlight would stay up
I myself bought a 2001 c5 6 days ago! I love the pop ups but i hope they dont break!
I just LOVE how popup lights look in every way
Former 13-year original owner of a 1984 Honda Prelude here, I loved those pop-up lights. Thanks for the history lesson.
I have to disagree on the "No longer cool." I daily drive a restored Mark III Supra and people love it when I flash the brights and make them pop-up. It is "vintage cool" now, but cool none the less. My next project car will be a Porsche 944, also with pop-up headlights.
That part is nonsense. Any 80s car looks better than new
@@Saucy-ws6jc Don’t be that guy lol… nothing wrong with being passionate about an era of manufacturing, but doesn’t mean you have to shit on other categories.
@@justabearbrowsingyoutube4968 He is right. Cars back then were designed by engineers, now they are designed by accountants.
i actually had that same proyect 10 years ago, and my 944 is as good as new XD
What you mean vintage cool?
They're just cool, period.
The 80s (1983 to be exact) was when aerodynamic flush headlights in non-standard shapes were permitted in the US. If carmakers hadn't been permitted to style lights to fit the car and were required to still use the approved sealed beams pop-up headlights would probably have continued on longer. As aerodynamics became more important and cars became smoother pop-ups and hidden headlights would have become even more prevalent to keep the aerodynamic shape.
Have you ever seen an Opel GT? It looks like a miniature C3 Corvette. The headlights are manually cranked and roll over sideways. The C4 Corvette's headlights tumble backwards almost 180 degrees. The Porsche 928 has those funny frog-eye headlights that pop up.
I wish glass headlights would come back. Not sealed beams, but replaceable glass covers. I think Volvo in the 90s had those in some markets. Plastic yellows and hazes but glass lasts forever.
glass won't come back.
1. plastic is cheaper for the car makers.
2. plastic can be shaped more freely, comepare to glass
3. yellow haze after many years, means more sales of replacement parts for the auto maker. screws the costomer.
@@davidjacobs8558 If the headlights are hidden when driving during the day (down) then they avoid UV rays and when used at night when there is no sun. They won’t ever turn yellow. Plastic would be fine.
@@davidjacobs8558 None of these are the primary reason. The primary reason is pedestrian safety and general safety. Can you imagine getting hit by a car and having shards of glass forced into your legs? Also, being glass means it would be more likely for a rock to hit it and break it. Sure, it could be laminated like windshields, but then that's getting pretty expensive.
Plastic headlights also aren't that hard to refinish, the Cerakote kit does a great job of taking off the oxidized outer layer and making them look good again.
@@nunyabusiness896 the chance of headlamp glass injuring the pedestrian is pretty low.
minor consideration compare to the blunt trauma itself. I would bet if a vehicle hit a pedestrian, there is very little chance the thick glass headlamp would shatter.
@@destruxandexploze2552 as I wrote before, the car makers WANT the plastic headlamp to TURN yellow. It's part of their planned obsolescence. They don't want things to last and last. They only want things to last just beyond the warantee period.
One of the most underrated car-dedicated channels to date!! Love that speech and editing!!
I think you may have missed a major reason for pop-up headlights and their demise. There were, at the time, two standardized "sealed beam" headlights manufactures could use, the traditional round ones, or the newer square shapes. So they hide these monstrosities behind doors and in pop-ups. Now with halogen bulbs and LEDs headlights can be almost any shape the designers want.
I was going to say, "hello, fellow Technology Connections" fan, but your comment is older than this TC video from 6 months later about headlights, which goes into considerable depth about sealed beam headlamps and the design solutions that resulted from them: th-cam.com/video/c2J91UG6Fn8/w-d-xo.html
Most my cars have been 80s cars for the fact being there easy to work on looks amazing and used to be able to get for cheap not anymore tho. My first being a 85 mr2 my 88 z31 and 90 maita and my 2 volvo 240s that I daily to this day.
I once owned a luscious red 1988 Honda Integra 1.6 EX16 (the 'Type R' of its day), and LOVED the pop up headlights on it. I mounted a push button on the dash and hooked it up to the left (near side) pop up motor, so that with a little 'Beep' of the horn to attract the tidy ladies in shorts/short skirts/summer dresses in the heat of summer, as I drove by, I could push the wink button and 'Wink at them', must admit, got a good few giggles and waves back! I LOVE cars with pop up headlights like the old Integra and Prelude... 🤔😏
😎🇬🇧
For many countries, "safety" was the catch phrase used to have pop up headlights banned.
As with many things "safety" or "environment" was used to sway people and still is.
Yet all the while, cars are getting taller, SUV's getting heavier and their frontal area worse at knocking down a pedestrian rather than having pedestrians deflect off the front of the lower bonnets/hoods of older cars all without being cancelled under "safety".
At the end it didn't come down to objectivity for the demise of the pop up headlights.
Yeah, and if headlights have a "sharp" front, the weight and speed of the car is going to kill you before the headlights do. The word safety should be in the dictionary as "A word that is commonly used as an excuse to ban something"
@@Sam-gf1eb Do note that pop up headlights were never banned, as stated in the video.
For those asking why I left out some cars - I don’t own footage of them! No hate or disregard for those cars, I love them all! I just haven’t reviewed one of filmed the headlights specifically so I didn’t have footage of them to use!
The AE86 is going to find you and your mother.
Yeah, you missed 3 generations of Corvette hidden, or pop up to use your seemingly favorite term, headlights. The C 2 Corvette used electric motors and just rotated into the exposed position, they didn’t really pop up. The third generation, C3 used vacuum actuation, and rose slowly. The headlight units were smaller diameter than the big 5” units so. Didn’t pop up very far. The C4 Corvette again used electric activation. In the down position they were upside down, and the lights pointed toward the firewall. When turned on, they rotated approximately 180* and unobtrusively rose up. They didn’t pop up.
Now that there is very little regulation of headlight size and shape, the headlights can be interrogated into the design of the front fascia. There is no need for pop up headlights.
there was at lesat one z31 clip I still love you
The C4 Corvette headlights flipped completely over. Lift the hood and they were aimed to the rear. When flipped forward the housings had no hard edges or points. The Opel GT (which looked like a mini 1970's Corvette) had headlamps that rotated *sideways*, actuated with a mechanical lever.
I think these headlights were ahead of their time
They were great; used easy to replace standard glass and could never yellow and fade. Loved them on my RX7.
Subscribed because of these documentaries. Keep em coming. They are amazing !
Crazy how just yesterday I was just thinking about this in my head, and here I am thanks to algorithm.
Getting in a car at night with pop up headlights was so cool. It was like the machine was coming to life. New cars don’t have that, they seem artificial and robotic.
All that statement is self contradiction of logic and reason. Robot and semi analogue machine isn't any different but just functional complexity variation. But then people who associate cars like living things then go on to quack about robotics on cars isn't showing much brain complexity either.
@@changsangma1915 I am very smart!! Cool story.
@@BrianBourgeois- ......i dont think so, but what could i expect from some entitled sub human species lol.
@@changsangma1915 Damn, you obviously dont care about cars. Some do feel more organic than others, specially how responsive they are at the wheel.
Subhuman? Go join the Azov batallion, they would like neonazis like you
oh the irony in the replies
I hope you all are enjoying my 80s cars video essays! The next one will be released on May 20th- Automatic Seatbelts!
Pop headlights there's last modern car ares design panther 2019
I loved my 90 laser rs turbo automatic seat belts. Wish my fc had them but it's an s4.
I love your videos, they are thoughtful, entertaining, informative and a lot of fun!
I love these types of videos interesting to watch, addictive, and informative.
They do break. However, usually they're stuck in the open position. I bought a Porsche 944 new, and TBH I was never that crazy about it. Today, LED's are so tiny and so powerful it's no longer necessary for aerodynamics. You can literally stick LED's into almost any car that had popups - without the headlights needing to pop up. Reason number 4, they go out of alignment.
That alignement issue can be solved. Look @ the design of the RX 7 FC`ones .
I found they broke either way about as often but most people either never fixed them or got tired of fixing them and left them open all the time. They also tended to freeze shut in winter in colder climates.
Bingo. They simply are no longer needed! Good points.
But LEDs are boring and soulless, so stfu
No you can just stick LEDs into old headlight housings that are not designed for them. They will have light scatter that can blind other drivers and also not project as well as normal lights. Also putting an LED or HID in a reflector housing is really shitty as it tends to blind other road users they work far better in projector housings which weren't present on pop up headlights.
Headlight technology advanced to the point where popups were no longer needed. Instead of having to use those bigass lights we got the small bulbs so they could keep the sleek front end without having to hide the giant lights.
Popups were cool and I really enjoyed them when I had them for the novelty factor but If you think about it they add a ton of drag when they are up.
furthermore, at highway speeds you want to reduce the tubulence at the back of the car more than making a sleek front. Like a goldfish shape.
Ah yes, let's make a giant block of SUV then, but most importantly keep the headlights sleek and aero XD I guarantee that literally any old car with popped open headlights is more aero than a modern SUV. Not in terms of c_d number necessarily, but overall aero, with cross section included.
we have 5 cars in the family with pop up headlights. 76, 91, 94 and 03 corvettes, and a 91 miata. I love seeing them work!
I would be enthralled to see a car manufacturer’s modern form of pop up headlights, like what kind of creative way they could add them to cars to fit the current style.
Considering the current style is " the most aerodynamic and politically pleasing shape" I am sure it would end up being a small strip of LED's that move inside of a housing.. Oh wait, I think I actually saw that on some Audi the other day, the owner had no idea the car did it becaue you can't even see the hood, let alone lights, let alone let alone lights in an enclosed housing. Modern cars really are bland.
In 2004, the Lotus Esprit was the last car with pop-up lights as well. Not just the C5.
Great video!
Yeah but it's a Lotus. Those are the absolute worse cars, especially for the price. Total garbage.
@@tedwojtasik8781 be that as it may, today a nice C5 sells for 20k while a nice Esprit can go up to 90k.
I'd rather be waiting for road assistance in my Esprit than getting there on time in just another C5.
@@tedwojtasik8781 Do you also murder people for owning a Lotus or any car you do like?
Also how would you feel if someone say that your car is garbage in front of your face?
@@tedwojtasik8781 utter bollocks.
@@tedwojtasik8781 Esprits were actually their most reliable and best model offered. Stateside it's just hard to find parts and resources. UK on the other hand, every briton knows how to magically repair one.
Awesome video. I love pop up headlights!
Love the way the look from inside the car when they are up. My first car was a 1994 Miata and I loved the pop up headlights !
i wish this can be my first car
Pop pop up pop up and down headlights
damm my dream car xd
Well done! I really enjoyed this. thank you for making this video.
Zack, thank you for a great documentary. Such a pleasure to watch and so informative. Keep up the great work.👍🏻🚙☁️☁️☁️☁️☁️
Good points, though the reliability of the headlight mechanisms definitely varied by manufacturer. My primary experiences with pop-ups are with Toyota, who seems to have the most robust motors and mechanisms. In order of age I have a 1985 AE86(140K), a 1988 Celica Alltrac(58K), and a 1992 SW20 MR2(166K). I haven't had any headlight issues with any of these cars; they've worked every time I've turned them on. The same is true with any other car I've had in the past with pop-ups, though I've only owned one non-Toyota car with pop-ups(an '88 third-gen Accord).
Even the pop-ups on my ill-fated project A70 Supra worked flawlessly the first time I tried them; the car had been sitting outside with a bad engine since 2006(this was in 2021). I literally hooked up a battery and turned the headlights on. Zero fuss.
I have a 1992 Celica GT-Four. The pop up headlights are a key style component to this classic car. There is no better stylistic element to really signify a car as an 80s car, unless you decide that the angular body styling is a more important style element.
I was looking for this type of comment. :) What colour?(mine is white, also a 92')
@@MrEMVme Yeah. The fifth gen Celica such a good looking car and the pop up headlights are a huge part of it. The sixth gen with the bug eyes and the rounded nose lost me. My GT-Four is Black! I wanted Super Red but the black has grown on me, and Mrs. Mack digs it, so black it is.
@@mackchannel6348 if it makes you feel any better I have a 90’ super red ST184 and it is a nightmare keeping the paint from fading. They shine up well but after a year it starts to turn to a matte red. comes with the age I guess.
6th gen gt4 does win for only coming with a CS hood though.
@@MrEMVme That makes sense. Red doesn't surprise me as a difficult color to maintain. The 6th gen WRC hood is sharper than the bulbous nose of the normal 6th gen for sure. But no pop ups. And so...inferior, I am beholden to say in this replies section of a pop up headlights video. : )
I had a 1987 Celica, i was always glad that i owned at least one car with pop up headlights. I miss that car actually.
One of my favorite things about cars back in the 80s and 90s, was how much variety was offered, they just don't sell cars like they did then. I mean like affordable mid-engine cars, or things like the Suzuki Jimny (as it WAS). SUVs back then were actually made for going off road. Now all you see is "SUVs", most which are really more like a minivan and a station wagon mixed together than a off-road vehicle.
I had this rental car a couple years ago. It was a 2 wheel drive "jeep". Makes no sense to me
Heck yeah bless the algorithm for showing me this video. I love pop up headlights soooo much and many a time I too raise my eyebrows in joy when I see a car with em >:)
nice job with the documentary bud
This was very enlightening and a great explanation!
I had my 1986 IROC Z Fitted with custom "Pop Down" headlight covers... During the day it was aerodynamic & at night they went down when the light switch was activated...very cool California feature
I had an 88 Integra hatch, had pop ups. I had always wanted a car with pop-ups, and it was an awesome little car, for what it was. 🤘
Loved the pop up lights on my 02 Firebird WS6. So cool
Had a 93 Celica turbo alltrac, my favorite car I’ve ever owned. Loved the pop up lights and never had a problem with them. They looked awesome with the hood vents.
I owned two older cars with those, both Pontiacs. The mechanisms were problematic, but fixable if you could find the parts .. I recall a kit from eBay that allowed replacement of plastic gears with brass ones.
Own a 1984 Pontiac Trans Am and finding the motors for them is problematic
My favorite part of my 93 Miata.
Mine too! The Miata nailed the pop up design.
I love the sleek look of the front of my 96 WS6. It's the 8th Trans Am I've owned with pop up lights ranging from a 1985 to a 2000. Only 2 had pop up light issues, a 98 WS6 and a 2000 WS6.
Pop up headlights would be so cool today, like having the "Eyelid" being LED strips for possitioning and then opening up fully
One of my favorite cars with pop-ups is the '66 Olds Toronado. It was actually considered a "tribute car" to the '36 Cord 810 you mentioned earlier in the video. The design referenced the grill, fenders, wheels, was front-wheel drive and of course, had pop-up head lights. Those headlights were pretty neat and we most likely won't see anymore, but with how "interesting" some newer EV vehicles are looking, I'm sure we might see something similar here soon! Maybe...
I was lucky enough to have had at least one car with pop up headlights. I had a 1987 Celica, great car for it's time, for what it was. Very reliable. I always wanted to wire it up so i could push a button, and have it close one side like it was blinking, while the horn 'whistles'. For when i drove past women.
Back then i suppose people would have gotten that i was just messing around not being serious. These days I'd probably be put in jail for that. I miss the good old days.
@@derealized797 Regardless, if I had seen that out in public, it would have made my year. I would have laughed my ass off! And yeah, those sure were the days, can't argue with that.
The Toronado came about due to a radical new "drive unit" GM had designed - without having any car design in mind before development started on the front drive system. Their styling studio was always noodling around with concepts and they'd done a side view which had been named the Flame Red Car. So someone suggested why not the Flame Red Car? The painting was large and had been hanging on a wall for a while. So that painting became the starting point for the Toronado and unlike how most production models end up quite a lot different from the concept, the Toronado side view was very close to the Flame Red painting.
I used to have an old magazine from the 1960's that had a page of short information notes about the upcoming cars. Someone had leaked that GM's test drivers complained the Toronado headlight doors wouldn't close until they got *below 120 miles per hour*.
@@greggv8 I remember hearing certain aspects of what you've said when Jay Leno built his own Toronado in "Jay Leno's Garage" and brought on David North, the guy who drew the Flame Red Car. I don't doubt what you read in the magazine either, it was a fast production car for it's time, pretty funny stuff! Those really were different times.
"actually"
I love the sight and sound of the opening. I own a 1985 MR2 that very same color I bought in 1986. Still the best car I've ever driven.
Thanks for mentioning the Honda Accord, but I was on the edge of my seat for an image/video footage of a ‘86-‘89 Honda Accord! The pop up lights on mine never failed to pop up for 17 years and 250,000 + miles. When the lights are up, they help the driver gauge where the car is in the lane - just put the top of the pop up light over the yellow line (driving on the right side). I’d wager a guess that cars with pop up lights help drivers keep their car more consistently in-lane.
A fourth reason pop-up headlights fell out of favor: They were hard to keep clean. Using pop-ups during wet weather will, of course, coat the headlights with road spray dirt. If you ran a car with pop-ups through the car wash the lights would likely be off and closed; if you tried to run it through the wash with the lights up you ran the risk of the lights being damaged by the car wash brushes. Over time, many pop-ups (and other covered headlights) would become almost opaque, creating a safety hazard for all concerned. Yes, you could take the effort to turn on the lights and clean them like your windshield, but many found that an irritant.
Which means they would be good fits for higher end sports cars, since the people owning those would be more likely to be interested in spending the time keeping everything clean, but it doesn't help for everyday drivers who just want a go that gets them to work and back.
He literally showed a car with headlight squirters
@@cheesecurd100s Yeah, I saw that. Truth is, those squirters are close to being completely worthless, even if the grime is still damp. If the grime has dried, forget it.
I had a 1987 Honda Prelude Si that had the pop up lights. They were really great and never an issue. I drove it through Pennsylvania winters. Yeah dirty lights was an issue sometimes but the Honda had a special button on the dash to raise the lights with out turning on the lamps. I would just do that in the winter when I washed it. We never used the automatic washes then.
Is it that common to use those automatic car wash things in the US? The UK often just has people with pressure washers and do it for quite cheap.
Pop-up headlights ride eternal. As long as there are those of us who love them, they will remain.
In 1998 my grandfather bought me a 1988 Ford Probe, black with a red interior. It had the pop up headlights. I freaking loved that car. It died almost a year after I got it lol but I had fun driving it. Especially at night. I loved watching the lights pop up. Oh and my friend had a Toyota Celica with the pop up headlights. We would switch cars all the time. great vid.
The Probe was the most fun I've ever had with any of my cars. Great for driving on narrow, curvy country roads. Easily the best handling car I ever had.
I had an 85 Honda Prelude in 2004 when I was in high school and I loved the pop up headlights!
You already got the big one (pedestrian safety) but on a practical standpoint, they're really only aerodynamic when they're down (adding 6% or more of drag when open), which is kind of a big deal on cars with a focus on low cD as a selling point.
Yes but most of the time they would be down
@@sydakk A good number of these cars are becoming garage queens and/or are turned into drift missiles at this point so it's true they probably don't ever have the lights up (except in sleepy-eye mods), but for daily driving they aren't that great. Not everyone lives in SoCal: in many places, you need lights on in the rain and/or the extended hours of darkness in winter mean lights are up more often than not, especially in cold places where they risk freezing closed otherwise. And that's if they even still work properly; plenty of them are just left up because they don't function anymore.
Even as a little kid at the time I always thought of that, especially when comparing them to the models that tried to incorporate fixed headlights into some attempt at greater aerodynamism (or at least the cosmetic appearance of it) which increased throughout the 1990s. One thing I thought was going to be mentioned (but probably is hard to get data on) is that motorists were almost certainly putting their headlights on more often as the 1990s progressed. From something you put on "at night," awareness seemed to be pushed really heavy as something that should be put on whenever there was a doubt. Dusk, overcast weather, etc. In fact legally, where many other countries came to implement manufacturer regulations requiring Daytime Running Lamps, the USA has instead implemented strengthened local driver regulations on actual headlight use that are not fulfilled by DRLs.
I've never bought a car because of it's efficiency, because of it's drag rating, because of it's virtue points, I have bought it because 1, does it look good, pleasing, designed by a car guy not a politcian. 2, does it sound good, as in, loud when I went to have fun but can be quiet enough to trundled through the neighbourhood. 3. Simple and fun to drive, no auto shifters, no touch screens, no needless safety features bing bonging away. Since the average speed of my car is around 35 to 40MPH with the most being a few hours at 70, the aerodynamics play a very small part in real life usage. If I was on the motorways all day every day, I might consider something more wedge shaped but as it is, my popups literally make no difference to my over all fuel usage in a real life setting, the obsession with fractions of percent has turned all cars and brands into the same basic model.
@@fsfs555It's super easy to just replace the headlight motor. Or more often than now the plastic gear in the motor assembly.
I found myself thinking how useful pop up headlights are - had them on my 87 Dodge Daytona, seems like this is a great way to keep headlights cleaner, and protect them when not in use.
I had an 87' Daytona as well, loved that car, drove like a dream and was quite fast for a 4 banger though mine was turbo-charged. Never had a problem with that car, super reliable. One time the damn thing would not start so I took it to my local mechanic. Jerkoff calls me about an hour after drop off and tells me the Hall Effect was bad and needed replacement...cost to fix was $375. As I was trained as a mechanic but no longer had my tools as I sold them, I knew what a Hall Effect was (it's Dodge's updated version of points). So I went to the local Checker Auto Parts, paid the $15 for a new Hall Effect and drove to the mechanics. Told him I was there to pick up the car and he laughed and said, "good luck as it does not run." I smiled, took the key, popped the hood, removed the old Hall Effect (it is right under the distributor cap, front and center, super easy access), put the new one in, started her up and drove off. The mechanic was throwing daggers with his eyes as I smiled and waived goodbye :-)
My neighbor had one
I have memories of driving a car with headlights like these back in the 90s so its kinda blury. I remember hating the fact that lights i need to see in the dark to drive with breaking and in Chicago during winter they'd get frozen and not popup. The extra chore of cleaning and heating them so they don't get stuck during the winter added some extra pain to the cool factor.
Watching this while munching in my 5th gen celica great vid keep it up
As an old dude I was driving my 93 C4 vette in the neighborhood at dusk when I popped the headlights. Some teen boys on the side of the street saw it and thought it was super cool. Maybe reason #1 is toast. Pop ups are cool every thirty years or so. Old dudes and teens will set the trend! Pop ups rule. Teens are loving the affordable C4s with them pop ups!
Got myself a 1988 C4 Corvette about a month ago. Didn’t get it for the pop ups but the 180 degree spin is pretty cool. I’m 19 as well.
@@destruxandexploze2552 that’s sick
All kids think the pop ups are cool as hell. If for no reason other than no cars have them, it's stunning. Never met a person that didn't love them on my Supra.
I Wish C4s were affordable in Germany too, i love them so much
Your reason #2 is irrelevant...
Each one of em uses mechanism simular to the wiper motors, and they don't break at all... The machanisms are simple and cheap to repair, and if someone doesn't tamper with em, they las a looong time. Another fact, they are 30+ years old, so some wear and tear is expected. Other than that, great video. 👍🏼
his rx7 litteraly has ONE motor lol
Yeah, most get damaged in fender bender wrecks and never put back right. If you get an accident free car the pop ups will almost always work perfectly.
I have a 93 Eclipse and the pop ups work like the first day, fast and in absolute sync.
They break all the time.
@@jhoughjr1 mine are 42 years old , one broke after 39 years due to getting soaked in water. So no, they don't .
My mom had an 86 accord. Pop up headlights on it and the wedge design. Loved that car.
The other thing about pop-ups is that the aerodynamic advantage you get when they're closed goes away when they're open. If you can design the headlight enclosure so that you get lower drag all the time, that's a win. Requirements for daytime running lights and for headlights to be on in various daytime situations also reduced the degree to which you were even allowed to run with no lights at all.
Honestly that's only a problem with EV's right now. People only cared about the aerodynamics if it was a sport car, that's why so many of the cars on the road look like bricks. They know that since the car isn't a sports car and that you can fill up your car in a few minutes then efficiency doesn't matter.
@@Sam-gf1eb aerodynamics matter even for the commuter, driving above 20mph results in a huge amount of drag which uses fuel and drag represents around 75% of resistance on the vehicle. Minor changes can result in massive savings of fuel.
@Dan Nguyen true
They dont break on japanese cars in my experience, still have a 91 Corolla going strong!
I loved my '94 Ford Probe's pop-up lights. After flipping the switch a couple times, and by timing it just right, I could repeatedly make one light go up while the other went down, to make it look like they were dancing.
I too had a Probe. One night the lights made a big noise, they went down inside (while I was driving), and they came up again -- never to go down any more. All mechanics told me the motor would have to be replaced and it would cost a fortune. I'm wondering after reading this whether it might have been that they just didn't know how to make the repair.
I thought the reason pop-ups disapeared was because NTSB or IIHS requirement for sealed-beam headlights was lifted in the late 80's. This meant car manufacturers could achieve the wedge shape or aerodynamic design with composite headlights (think 1987 Ford Taurus).
"aerodynamic design" Another drawback is that the sleek aerodynamic performance of the front end is basically ruined at nighttime when the pop-up headlights are actually up!
Great work!
Well done! Thank you! BTW with the drive to electrify everything on 4 wheels, one thing you can't do in an EV is row your own gears. I would love to see a similar doc on the manual transmission. Again, much respect to the modern car manufacturers that are keeping the manual alive. One of the reasons I have my Honda FK8 Civic Type R is because of that sweet shifting, Honda 6-speed manual. Now there is official word that Toyota is finally releasing their Supra in a 6-speed manual just in time to go head to head with the manual in the new Nissan Z. Definitely great news in a time when many other sports car and supercar manufacturers are going dual-clutch. BTW I also cannot forget to give Toyota props for their other manual offerings like the GR 86 and the upcoming GR Corolla which comes exclusively in a 6-speed manual.
I loved the headlight covers that were popular in the early 70's. They were very stylish and would be a cool novelty on a newer car. Even though they do have thin LED lights now.
Fantastic narration! "Screw your aero and dynamics" LOL Seriously great job on the history, the content in general and the presentation! TH-camrs take note of how to do it the right way.
Love u mannnnn.keep it going 😊
Glad to see the fb back on the road. Fun fact about the cord body. Hupmobile bought unused body's to produce the 41 skylark. My father had one. He ended up selling but still has his 39 Hupmobile. The skylark was a last ditch attempt to save the company but when ww2 happened the couldn't afford to convert their factory to help with the war effort and died off.
Another reason they went away was the ability of auto-makers to build custom composite headlights for each car. The sealed beam "standard" headlights of the time were required by law. And being so ugly, making them hide away was the only option to a cool look. Great video though!
Also I think the Mazda Miata used pop-up through the 97 model year.
We need more of this kind of lights!
My Ford Probe GT had pop-up lights! Loved the car and the lights :)
Loved all the different styles and pop up methods from all the different manufacturers. 1st Gen RX7s stuck up really high and looked very ominous from inside the car. Corvettes and 928 Porsches had the coolest mechanisms though with the former rotating all the way around backwards, and the latter popping up and rotating sideways. Not to mention some of the 60s and 70s sedans and muscle cars that had hideaway grill headlights. The ones in my MR2 were lightning fast. Used to wink at other drivers by pressing the button.
I remember when pop up headlights came out and I’ve never really liked them, but I must admit it is a cool feature and I think over the years they could have improved the technology and look. The biggest problem was that the headlight pop up motor failed frequently so it was a hassle for drivers.
My first car was a 1998 Ford Probe. I had so much fun driving it. Each ride was a pleasure. I miss it dearly.
really miss those pop ups .. they were literally so cool seeing em in my childhood
you forgot to mention the #1 reason popups are gone- the introduction of the European style composite aerodynamic headlights all cars have today. Also, another disadvantage of pops ups if you live in the snowbelt /northern states is they can freeze shut during a snow or ice storm.
Chevy Corvette did it best with the vacuum advance system using vacuum from the engine combined with Bellows to move the lights up and down they did fail but they lasted a lot longer than the mechanical ones The best pop-up light was in the 1960s one Corvette model the lights didn’t just pop up they made a full rotation from the back to the front wicked crazy stuff
Vacuum motor headlights are fun but sadly they're very difficult to find replacements for. I daily a 78 LTD with vacuum headlights and I'm just thankful mine haven't sprung any bad leaks yet. So unless you're able to repair them yourself, they're rare (and expensive) at least last I looked. That being said, they're absolutely a fun statement and I would be sad to have to run without them!
The vacuum headlights are FAR more unreliable than the motor driven ones. Vacuum leaks are always a constant problem for any car system. Most motor-driven pop ups were damaged from idiots trying to pop them up when there was ice on the car that prevented them from moving, or from dumbasses sitting on the car or leaning on them, etc. If left alone and the owner doesn't do anything dumb, motor driven pop ups can last for decades without any major repair.
Vacuum headlights being more reliable is possibly one of the biggest lies ever told on here.
Owned RX7 SA ( 1979 ) from 1985 until 1991, FC Turbo ( 1988 ) from 1991 until 1996, MX 5 NA ( 1989 ) from 1996 until 2000. Bought my FC back in 2016 and still have it. Number of headlight pop not up - issues 0. Some blown cheap H4 bulbs but easy ( ! ) to replace even @ the complicated not go out of alignement- design of the FC ones.
RIP pop-up headlight cars they looked really cool we will miss them
im not sure im somehow oldschool without really experiencing this era. But the pop-up lights is awesome!
Modern headlights can be much narrower, fitting into smaller front ends.
My friend had an early 1970s Opel GT, which had headlights that didn’t pop up, but “rolled over, from left to right, and were completely manual, incorporating a large lever in the car’s interior.
In addition to the reasons you gave, I figured another major one is they are not aerodynamic when up.
Sure a lot of people wouldn’t care, but others would on a performance car, or on a hybrid or ev that wants to be fuel efficient as possible.
And I love pop up lights too! Nice vid!
Exactly! In places where you're required to have your headlights turned on at ALL TIMES (like here), there's zero point to pop up headlights. They look ugly as hell, make the car slower and make you visit the pump more often. I was so glad they went out of fashion. They only make sense in those places where you only use them at night.
perfect way to start a video god i love the sound of rotaries
Got a ‘92 Firebird.
Can definitely relate to the hype of flipping your lights up and just giggling when you see the ‘eyes’ open!
The whole reason for popups was to allow a low, streamlined nose. Meaning that, like space-saver spare tyres, popup headlights defeat their purpose when you are required to use them.
I had an 87 MR2 and kept the lights up full time. I just thought it made the front end look better and I also appreciated the crosshair-like target effect to enhance precision when driving way too fast as a reckless kid.
If you are looking down at your headlights while driving fast, you are a horrible, horrible driver.
I bought my 1992 Celica 16 years ago and the headlights popping up still make me smile to this day!
Nice topic! I have an 86 accord hatchback and I love the 3rd gens of Hondas for that :)
I recently modded away the pop ups on my '66 Lotus Elan. I got sick of chasing air leaks (it was a vacuum operated system), and the fact that if they failed you could be completely blacked out in the dark. I know I could've spent a bunch of time fail proofing the system but the other option of removing a bunch of parts, simplifying and adding lightness to a Lotus seemed like the right thing to do. Plus i get to have really cool perspex headlight covers like a 240z now.
I understand your logic here. I have converted many vacuum operated retractable headlamps on Lotus cars to Electric motors. The vacuum systems where never great even when the cars where new. In the US they required them to be up when there is no vacuum so if you parked your car with the lamps down and came back after an hour or so you would find it looking sort of drunk with one lamp halfway up.
You have an elan?
no :(
@@jimpatterson7954 Wait what then why did u comment the-
Never seen one broken. I still have an 87 Fiero with working pop ups, and those cars were reliabilty nightmares. None of my Celicas or Supras ever had and issue. It's just cheaper to manufacture a cheap plastic headlight. This is why they went away. Newer swooping design headlights came later as a result of pop ups being already gone from the scene, so it was not a design choice.
I have seen some
Thanks for the info - I had 2 early RX-7’s the actuators never broke but never knew about the manual knobs. Remember girls liked to watch the lights flip up and down.
I love pop up headlights when they close up loose like the car is sleeping 👌🏽
they can still make pop-ups in the US but need a emergency puller in the cabin, other reason is that the EU banned pop-ups for pedestrian safety
so if you want someone to point your finger, point at Europe for killing popups
I haven't watched your channel in so long. I remember watching you a little bit back when Gingium had his FC RX7... But none since then. This was recommended to me, even though I'm not subscribed. It's hit the algorithm!
On another note, this was extremely well put together. Microphone sounds good, editing and music fit the theme, you're straight to the point, with delivery that makes it interesting to listen to, and the topic as a whole was fun. I'd love to see more content like this.
Wait this is ZACK?!
whats up dude, you were always such a good influence to Calebs vids
@@Pheatan Yeah, the funny guy. I honestly miss having his humor around in the videos.
Great vid but I can’t believe you didn’t show the super cool forward flip of the 4th Gen Corvette. Re: manual openers, I had to use that on my ‘84 fiero in highschool. A rebuilt replacement was almost $400, so I lived with it. They’d both lift, but one didn’t retract. I’d crank that one down at home by hand so I’d look cool during the day 😂
I just saw a super clean Corolla sr-5 the other day and it made me nostalgic for my rx7 with pop ups. They're the best.
I feel like they will make a comeback as a vintage trend. With new advancements in technology, we could make sleek cars with even a popup headlight for every type of light (indicator, street, road lights...)
For retro designs to come back, you have to get rid of the prohibitive politics like anti Co2 policies and over bearing safety policies and move back to a middle ground, then you have to get rid of politics that's causing everyone to be poor, which are largely related to the above, so that if someone released a retro model that got slightly less gas mileage, cost slightly more to maintain, people would willingly buy it over the Blandomatic5000's we have now. It's entirely possible but we have to understand the prohibitive nature of political progress vs what's actual realistic and desirable.