Hey everyone, So this was one of my first history videos and I'm well aware of the issue with the background music. I've heard you're complaints and I'm going to fix it. Appreciate the feed back. Here's the re released version with improved audio! th-cam.com/video/eh6oWcdEWLQ/w-d-xo.html
Long, long time ago I heard there was a few engines were built on the ball stud Hemi and for some reason there is only the one left. I wish someone in Chrysler / Dodge / Stellantis would build a new 4th Gen ball stud Hemi, it would be one bad-ass engine.
This helps explain why the standard Wedge 400 block was cast with thicker webbing for the mains, they cast it for the ball stud HEMI and never changed the casting. It's considered to be the strongest block of the B/RB series. Too bad so many consider it a smogger engine, it has so much potential.
Fantastic , learned more about Hemi s in 12 minutes than in my 63 years.Just bought a 69 police 383, 3 speed manual with overdrive.Very rare, and is going in a 73 4 door Dart .I love sleepers. Subbed and shared .Kudos my man, respect from Canada...
@@VicsGarage71 All the more Awesome , We are a small population, big country , car crazy fanatics with Killer muscle cars .That is what freezing winter does to you, dream and build . In southern Quebec Cheers...
I knew of this motor back in 1987 and found out Dick Landy had acquired it through some news .,which Herb Mccanless told me when I was into racing mopars and I use to talk& purchase racing parts from him ,when he had his race shop in the north Carolina. Back then everyone had called it the mystery Hemi ,later was the Chevy- Hemi do to the ball & stud configuration . How ironic a mystery motor is now famous.
F.Y.I. I have a Peterson publishing book from the early "70's ? It says re : Carter Carbs ALL 360's came with 850 C.F.M. carbs. ALL 400 and 440's came with 1000 C.F.M. carbs.
I never heard about that mill, I thought I was a Mopar man, hats off , I also don't know anything about any of the new ones, I had an oldskool 354 ci with a brown full race cam , and four dudes 97s , a 68 383 mag, 340 mag , 400 4 barrel , the duster 340 was the quickest of the lot ! Thnx four the info Friend !
Fair enough, But what about Dick Landy who swapped cams and did some other mods? We were never going to know what it was like stock after Landy had it.
@@VicsGarage71 That wasn’t good either, but 1, it was done far longer ago... makes it a tad more excusable. And 2, Landy put a red dress on the Mona Lisa. Arruzza gave her plastic surgery. His work was irreversible. Landy’s wasn’t if he still had the parts. Ultimately, we can never know what that engine actually sounded or ran like. It’s a shame.
It would be cool if someone could re cast those heads in aluminum along with developing a intake or two plus valve train components & valve cover pkg for the 440! Probably would be even more costly than the stage v experiment of previous years though…
You are correct, just build a stage V. Then you have the ADVANTAGES of shaft mounted rockers, aftermarket support, and a REAL hemi. The ball stud was a completely low cost compromise engine that any modern aluminum wedge head could surpass. Modern wedge heads and stroker kits can all too easily over power a stock 440 block and crack the main webs. That's why a hemi block is heavier and has 4 bolt mains. The original 1964 prototype hemis all cracked their 426 wedge based blocks.
I read about these engines in the mid 1980's. You see some strange stuff in the muscle car world. My uncle had a 1970 Roadrunner, that had some strange anomalies. Had stainless steel A pillar covers, a 440/HEMI suspension, etc...In the trunk it looked as is brackets had been mounted on the underside of the rear quarter panels. I truly think it was a Superbird converted to a Roadrunner to sell, this is a documented happening as Superbirds were very poor sellers. Or it had been in an accident and converted back due to parts availability. Regardless, I have worked with MOPARS for many decades and have never seen anything like that.
My uncle worked as a shop foreman in the late sixties and seventies at a Plymouth dealership in Atlanta he told me that they had taken the wings off a couple of cars because they could not sell them. People thought they were ugly. With the A pillars you describe and the inside trunk at the quarters I am willing to bet that’s what he had.
Yes it was a superbird but what was the vin and how was it registered as also the nose one was removed and a regular roadrunner bummer grille was used. Common practice in the day
I, too, had trouble getting the tuning correct on the Thermo-Quad. My go-go carbs were always the AFB and, sometimes, the AVS. I could easily tune them to whatever I wanted with the Carter rod/springs/jet kits.....and, a bit of distributor recurve. When Edelbrock came out with the 800 cfm Carter copy I no longer yearned for the airflow of the Thermo-Quad and the Quadrajet and lived happily ever after. Right now I've got about 15+ Holley's sitting on the shelves of my garage right now. Still prefer the AFB's. Good upload.
Wow Vic, good detective work. Interesting story, makes you wonder what could have been, but by the time I bought my 74 charger, the gas crisis and insurance companies had killed the muscle era. Your 71 was truly the last of muscle era. Also quality on these cars really suffered by 74. I remember multiple issues with my 318 in the first two years of ownership.but we are back in a second muscle era one that I thought we would never see.
@@VicsGarage71 yes please to scanning the ball-stud and doom's day hemi's probably best in aluminium castings ( but wouldn't mind iron but im probably in the minority of buyer's for it ) as it probably fits the RB/440/383 light weight vibe better on mine i didn't get a pick it was 906 vs D-8 hemi castings both in iron as i don't have a full aluminium setup and its setup for gob's of low-end cruiseing torque and aluminium wouldn't take the abusece/high boost as i probably would Window it or lift a head gasket
@@VicsGarage71 O BTW Plymouth did do a pilot run of car's don't know if any B-body's with it survived or not but i do know a junkyard/person in the Atlanta GA 🇺🇸 had a coronet 1968-72 that was one and it is a automatic transmission 8-3/4 or dana 60 sorry been awhile i remember it as i was shopping for my charger ( 90's to 2014 ) at the time not sure if it survived in 2022 or got crushed/rustic or not and i 🤔think a magazine article was written about it and at the time was for sale being not a charger i wasn't into it ish and 2 it wasn't a running car/it was ruff and might have missing parts that i couldn't afford or buy at any price point as technically it was a factory prototype
G’day mate I don’t think our 🇦🇺 Hemi sixes had canted valves! So, the combustion chamber may have a hemispheric profile the inlet and outlet ports are on the same side of the head! Not taking anything away from the old girls they are a screamer! Our versions of (in particular) ‘71 ‘72 R/T Chargers and Pacers came with 3 off Webber carbs (6 Pack)! Good for 302hp, and low 14second quarter mile times! Not bad hey. Yeah! More of a marketing gimmick with high impact colours to stay in key with you guys. 👍🇦🇺
I first read about this engine many years ago, in a car magazine article that I THINK was written by "Uncle Tony," in his mag writing days. I thought the ball stud engine sounded like a really good design that would have solved a variety of issues with Chrysler's big-block engines. Unfortunately, Chrysler couldn't get it into production soon enough.
I'd of left it original too, but its done now, alot work done to an engine to make more power only to have sit in a museum anyway, still cool story tho.
Really good video and informative! Suggestion, the background music volume is a little loud (at least for me trying to listen to the dialog as working). Just a suggestion, otherwise awesome!
Enjoyed this video a lot. Would have been cool to see what it would have done had it been used in production. I would love to hear a thermoquad someday. I imagine it sounded similar to when a quadrajet kicked down and the big secondaries opened up. Awesome sound. When I get my next Pontiac I want to run one again.
Yeah, this is a Hemi that nobody seems to know about. The Quadrajet came up with the small primaries and large secondaries back in the 60s, so Carter wasn't unique at all. Either way, a Holley was a much better option and screw the gas mileage.
Stage 5 engineering used to make a hemi head for rb blocks. But since stopped producing them. I think someone could recast the block if they wanted. But likely not enough profit.
As a Mopar enthusiast for most of my life , for some reason this story doesn't really bother me ( regarding the history of a cost saving design being molested ). The same bean counters that initiated this design were probably the same ones that cancelled the original FirePower series ( they seemed to hate shaft mounted forged rocker assemblies ). Had they went with a single rocker shaft on this canted valve thing they would have gone full circle in bringing back all of the cancelled 1950's designs .
Very well done video, as well as informative! I'm actually doing a video on the 2nd Gen Hemi and, if you don't mind, I'll be posting a link to this video to show my research! Great video!!
@@VicsGarage71 then why were you bad mouthing the TQ's in the video? I have NEVER seen a TQ float bowl warp, and I have owned literally hundreds of them. Though I will allow it maybe could happen if someone didn't torque the bowl cover on properly. Mostly, the TQ was a victim of ham-handed shade tree mechanics who'd be hard pressed to properly disassemble and reassemble a Holley 1-bbl. The TQ, especially the 72-78 non lean burn carbs are a superior performance carb with decent economy, and emissions-friendly features. It's VERY tuneable. Unfortunately, parts are becoming scarce.
@@budlanctot3060 I don’t think it’s bad mouthing to point out a issue with it. And it’s not just me, tons of people have reported issues the bowls warping or cracking. www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/threads/warped-thermoquad.96869/ www.hotrodders.com/threads/thermoquad-vs-quadrajet.524145/ www.carburetor-blog.com/knowledge-base/carter-thermoquad-troubleshooting/ Despite that, it’s still a great carb. As with most things, it’s not black and white, but nuanced. I had a great run with it & it served me well. If I wasn’t planning on going to EFI I’d probably go back to it.
@@VicsGarage71 after reading a bunch of anecdotal heresay in the links provided I remain unconvinced. The one about replacing the bowl for every tuneup is just flat stupid. The only bowls I've ever seen go bad are the ones broken by abuse, by tanking them within an inch of their lives until the glue disolves on the main jet well caps, somebody overtightening the main jets, not lining up the locating pins and/or checking on the float pins before they start cranking down the cover screws. There are 4 external links on the TQ. I once bought a TQ at a swap meet which had EVERY link in the wrong location. That was the biggest drawback to TQ's....meathead mechanics.
Thanks, history is important even if it grinds our gut a little.....That head design and those modifications that followed, though regrettable, show a design that is smaller and weighs, less and just as powerful, that could be of use to MOPAR fans for some one to resurrect a replacement head that could sell to market......Maybe, just maybe, Chrysler could get NASCAR approval for Dodge to run it in competition.....
Its amazing what mopar will call a "hemi" this one's close, closer than a gen3 and MUCH closer than the Aussie 6! If you want a true hemi six look at a 1964 overhead cam Jeep Tornado 230! Shaft mounted, shaft oiling rockers are a Godsend to a performance engine. No heavy-duty gas engines ever used ball studs. They are the most problematic part of a high-performance engine build. All kinds of band aids are used to fix issues with them in Chevies I always scratched my head at their leaking valve covers from oil drain back issues, oil deflectors, and pushrod guide plates, factory press in studs, aftermarket screw in studs, and stud girdles, and eventually ending up with shafts just to go from 68lb stock to run 320 lb springs like a 440 6 pack had stock.I always thought the mopar big block should have been designed as a polysphere. They are superior to a wedge and use the same block and intake as a Hemi. Making swaps easy. However, they are wider and have two axes to machine valves on. Carroll Shelby once said that thermoquad was the best single 4bbl carb ever made for superstock racing. He was right! I have run 17 of them on my own stuff, tuned many others, and ran them on dual quad set-ups. They are the most economical, tuneable carb available. They are confusing if you dont know your way around one. I have only seen 1 cracked or leaking plastic bowl, and that was damaged by an idiot being a gorilla with a wrench or screwdriver. Almost all of them are warped, but it DOESN'T MATTER if you keep the top and bowl together, I don't even check them. They warped to match each other! Never had to scrap or straighten one because of leaks if I did that. I have a Thermoquad that came off of a burnt out police car. The aluminum top melted into the plastic bowl, and the bowl is fine! The major warped ones came from some of them having the rear mounting bolt run thru the top cover. The competition TQ is 1,000+ cfm. They are variable cfm and mopar put 850 cfm ones on police 318's. The fuel stays 26 deg cooler in the plastic bowl. I can make one sing and dance at every rpm range or driving condition on any engine after getting the jets ballpark close without ever breaking it open.
It is sad how this rare engine was modified... But what is even more sad is how government regulations literally put it out of existence with only 2, maybe 3 examples being produced.... The regulations and those ideas that created the ridiculous regulations, should be on the list of extinct items that are detrimental to our country... Not engines like these....
Hey man. Thanks for the feedback. I think I’m gonna remaster some of my older videos and re record some of the audio and stuff. Hope u stick around for the new versions
I was street racing for about 10 years or more, from 65 on ran 2 street hemis with small block chevys i`m not pro chevy, they were the cheapest thing to run a 327 and a 350 they were not any near stock and i ran 488 rears i never had any trouble walking away from any street hemi, i don`t think they were anywhere near 425 horse, i think they were super detuned, as as i remember they were solid cams and you could realy here it
The gas crisis of 1974 would have taken its toll on this engine, unfortunately. I bet Jensen might have used these instead of the 440s for its Interceptor, and Monteverdi for the various cars he dropped in 440s or 426 Hemis.
I just put a newer Demon on my 350 in my 67 camaro.The Minute I took it out of the box the first thing I thought was,I just bought a ThermoQuad.I have to admit though it stopped my vapor lock,and it increased my ponies a noticeable bit.I am new but love your channel.
Right, Vic. Thermoquads on 4 bbl equipped Chrysler products after '72. They DID put some Quadrajets on vehicles when the Carter cupboard was bare, though.
Vic's Garage, while i appreciate your mostly accurate vid on this EXTREMELY rare piece of automotive history, i do not, your condescending attempts, beginning @9:18 at "defending" the MUTILATING automotive history. Yours is the typical attitude of.."Well, it's old & i don't understand it,nor appreciate it (like your Thermoquad) so it's just worthless junk."
Well first off I love my thermoquad. Not sure what I said that was condescending. I think my points are legit. What did Aruza do that would really prevent anyone from spending the money to recast that block or replicating it? The block likely would’ve ended up in the Garbage somewhere like the rest of them if he didn’t make it serviceable.
@@VicsGarage71 Do you have any idea what you're asking when you say "re-cast It" ? You are talking about starting with original blueprints. Starting from scratch ! So, to answer your question.."What would prevent someone...?" The answer is A helluva LOT of $$$. That's what. That thought should have stopped Aruza,imo.
@@shanew.williams No doubt. But as I said, the block was bored .30 over and the heads were ported. The biggest issue was the intake being modified. It's really not that different besides the intake. People look back from today and say wow that is one collectable item! But every thing collectable was really just a piece of trash and some point. Hindsight is 20/20. Dick Landy could also take blame here but seems to escape it for some reasons. He could've given it to the museum. But he decided to profit off it while having a questionable ownership claim. He also chucked the cam and modified it as well.
I don’t get why that dude had to have that rare engine if he wanted to do all that work to it? He could’ve did that to something else that wasn’t so rare…. Should’ve blueprinted it first.
Hey Rich, Appreciate the feed back. I'm re releasing this video soon, maybe this weekend with improved audio. So Hopefully you subscribe and hit that notification button and give it another go!
FACT : Cubic inch inches ARE NOT gained from boring . Cubic inches ARE gained from STROKER CRANKS ! Boreing would gain a max. of 5 CUBIC INCHES . ALL Engines burn fuel to make power . ALL motors use electricity to make power .
Well to be technical, cubic inches are a combination of length, width, and height (the three dimensions of a cube). Changing any one of them will increase cubic inches, including making cylinders bigger by boring them out.
@@VicsGarage71 Like I said previously , 5 cubic inches max. gained by boring a large displacement engine 440 , 454 , 460 , ect. = a hotter running engine ( that needs better cooling . )
@@keithpearson7059 Well I don't want to beat a dead horse, but you said they are not gained originally before the edit. Not you gain minimal amount. My point is cubic inches are a combination of length, width and height. By nature of the way a engine block is made, you can't modify the circumference of cylinders much, I agree. The most effective way to gain or lose cubic inches is by changing the stroke of the crank. I doubt the boring of a cylinder .30/.40 over will change cooling requirements much. I punched my 440 .30 over and the stock cooling system was more than adequate. That's my experience anyways. I've never stroked out a block before so as far as its ramifications on cooling, I can't speak to that.
www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/us/definition/english/motor_1?q=motor a device that uses electricity, PETROL, etc. to produce movement and makes a machine, a vehicle, a boat, etc. work www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/us/definition/english/engine?q=engine the part of a vehicle that produces power to make the vehicle move They're interchangable
FACT : " motors " use electricity to make power , " engines burn fuel to make power , no " interchange " with electricity and fuel ( pump fuel in a " motor " = no power ! , wire " electricity " to an engine = no power ! )
How 'bout "mill", or "bullet"..., feel the need to define what powers them, too? Whether it's accurate or slang matters not. Anyone with common sense understands just fine, professors. School's out.👋
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Hey everyone,
So this was one of my first history videos and I'm well aware of the issue with the background music. I've heard you're complaints and I'm going to fix it. Appreciate the feed back. Here's the re released version with improved audio! th-cam.com/video/eh6oWcdEWLQ/w-d-xo.html
Long, long time ago I heard there was a few engines were built on the ball stud Hemi and for some reason there is only the one left. I wish someone in Chrysler / Dodge / Stellantis would build a new 4th Gen ball stud Hemi, it would be one bad-ass engine.
This helps explain why the standard Wedge 400 block was cast with thicker webbing for the mains, they cast it for the ball stud HEMI and never changed the casting. It's considered to be the strongest block of the B/RB series. Too bad so many consider it a smogger engine, it has so much potential.
400 blocks make a great engine stroke them out to 451 cubes or make a quick revering big block!
The guy that modified the original could be compared to someone painting a mustache on the Mona Lisa
Fantastic , learned more about Hemi s in 12 minutes than in my 63 years.Just bought a 69 police 383, 3 speed manual with overdrive.Very rare, and is going in a 73 4 door Dart .I love sleepers. Subbed and shared .Kudos my man, respect from Canada...
Nice power train for a small car! Should be a rocket. I’m Canadian too🙌
@@VicsGarage71 All the more Awesome , We are a small population, big country , car crazy fanatics with Killer muscle cars .That is what freezing winter does to you, dream and build . In southern Quebec Cheers...
I knew of this motor back in 1987 and found out Dick Landy had acquired it through some news .,which Herb Mccanless told me when I was into racing mopars and I use to talk& purchase racing parts from him ,when he had his race shop in the north Carolina. Back then everyone had called it the mystery Hemi ,later was the Chevy- Hemi do to the ball & stud configuration . How ironic a mystery motor is now famous.
Yeah funny isn't it? I think its the thought of what it could've been.
In the early 70s we called the small primarys on that design spread bore !
F.Y.I. I have a Peterson publishing book from the early "70's ? It says re : Carter Carbs ALL 360's came with 850 C.F.M. carbs. ALL 400 and 440's came with 1000 C.F.M. carbs.
I never heard about that mill, I thought I was a Mopar man, hats off , I also don't know anything about any of the new ones, I had an oldskool 354 ci with a brown full race cam , and four dudes 97s , a 68 383 mag, 340 mag , 400 4 barrel , the duster 340 was the quickest of the lot ! Thnx four the info Friend !
Thanks for watching man! Hope u subscribe and check out some of the other videos
You didn't mention that Sox and Martin has one or did have one in their 69 Cuda. It's on display somewhere.
Nice a very well detailed analyzis. I barely hear about this type of hemi nor the slant six hemi as well. Thanx for the explanation and keep it up👍.
What Arruzza did was unforgivable. Period.
Fair enough, But what about Dick Landy who swapped cams and did some other mods? We were never going to know what it was like stock after Landy had it.
@@VicsGarage71 That wasn’t good either, but 1, it was done far longer ago... makes it a tad more excusable. And 2, Landy put a red dress on the Mona Lisa. Arruzza gave her plastic surgery. His work was irreversible. Landy’s wasn’t if he still had the parts. Ultimately, we can never know what that engine actually sounded or ran like. It’s a shame.
@@VicsGarage71 Great work on the video!
It would be cool if someone could re cast those heads in aluminum along with developing a intake or two plus valve train components & valve cover pkg for the 440! Probably would be even more costly than the stage v experiment of previous years though…
You are correct, just build a stage V. Then you have the ADVANTAGES of shaft mounted rockers, aftermarket support, and a REAL hemi. The ball stud was a completely low cost compromise engine that any modern aluminum wedge head could surpass. Modern wedge heads and stroker kits can all too easily over power a stock 440 block and crack the main webs. That's why a hemi block is heavier and has 4 bolt mains. The original 1964 prototype hemis all cracked their 426 wedge based blocks.
Good history and review. All mopar history is great.
Thanks bud. Please share and subscribe
How cool! I never heard of it, thanks for the video and history of this engine!
Np. Thanks for the support and sticking around as my video quality improves slowly lol
@@VicsGarage71 i thought the video was just fine! Great job!
I read about these engines in the mid 1980's. You see some strange stuff in the muscle car world. My uncle had a 1970 Roadrunner, that had some strange anomalies. Had stainless steel A pillar covers, a 440/HEMI suspension, etc...In the trunk it looked as is brackets had been mounted on the underside of the rear quarter panels. I truly think it was a Superbird converted to a Roadrunner to sell, this is a documented happening as Superbirds were very poor sellers. Or it had been in an accident and converted back due to parts availability. Regardless, I have worked with MOPARS for many decades and have never seen anything like that.
That is real odd
My uncle worked as a shop foreman in the late sixties and seventies at a Plymouth dealership in Atlanta he told me that they had taken the wings off a couple of cars because they could not sell them. People thought they were ugly. With the A pillars you describe and the inside trunk at the quarters I am willing to bet that’s what he had.
Yes it was a superbird but what was the vin and how was it registered as also the nose one was removed and a regular roadrunner bummer grille was used. Common practice in the day
I, too, had trouble getting the tuning correct on the Thermo-Quad. My go-go carbs were always the AFB and, sometimes, the AVS. I could easily tune them to whatever I wanted with the Carter rod/springs/jet kits.....and, a bit of distributor recurve. When Edelbrock came out with the 800 cfm Carter copy I no longer yearned for the airflow of the Thermo-Quad and the Quadrajet and lived happily ever after. Right now I've got about 15+ Holley's sitting on the shelves of my garage right now. Still prefer the AFB's. Good upload.
This is some good info man. Good to know !!
Wow Vic, good detective work. Interesting story, makes you wonder what could have been, but by the time I bought my 74 charger, the gas crisis and insurance companies had killed the muscle era. Your 71 was truly the last of muscle era. Also quality on these cars really suffered by 74. I remember multiple issues with my 318 in the first two years of ownership.but we are back in a second muscle era one that I thought we would never see.
Yeah to bad. A few more years and we could’ve had a ton of other motor options
@@VicsGarage71 yes please to scanning the ball-stud and doom's day hemi's probably best in aluminium castings ( but wouldn't mind iron but im probably in the minority of buyer's for it ) as it probably fits the RB/440/383 light weight vibe better
on mine i didn't get a pick it was 906 vs D-8 hemi castings both in iron as i don't have a full aluminium setup and its setup for gob's of low-end cruiseing torque and aluminium wouldn't take the abusece/high boost as i probably would Window it or lift a head gasket
@@VicsGarage71 still in my mind plausible that dodge copied the others homework or hired someone from brand-X that did have intel on the design ect.
@@VicsGarage71 O BTW Plymouth did do a pilot run of car's don't know if any B-body's with it survived or not but i do know a junkyard/person in the Atlanta GA 🇺🇸 had a coronet 1968-72 that was one and it is a automatic transmission 8-3/4 or dana 60 sorry been awhile i remember it as i was shopping for my charger ( 90's to 2014 ) at the time not sure if it survived in 2022 or got crushed/rustic or not and i 🤔think a magazine article was written about it and at the time was for sale being not a charger i wasn't into it ish and 2 it wasn't a running car/it was ruff and might have missing parts that i couldn't afford or buy at any price point as technically it was a factory prototype
@@richardprice5978 that would be amazing
I love a good mystery. The white board is an amazing touch.
G’day mate
I don’t think our 🇦🇺 Hemi sixes had canted valves! So, the combustion chamber may have a hemispheric profile the inlet and outlet ports are on the same side of the head! Not taking anything away from the old girls they are a screamer! Our versions of (in particular) ‘71 ‘72 R/T Chargers and Pacers came with 3 off Webber carbs (6 Pack)! Good for 302hp, and low 14second quarter mile times! Not bad hey. Yeah! More of a marketing gimmick with high impact colours to stay in key with you guys.
👍🇦🇺
I first read about this engine many years ago, in a car magazine article that I THINK was written by "Uncle Tony," in his mag writing days. I thought the ball stud engine sounded like a really good design that would have solved a variety of issues with Chrysler's big-block engines. Unfortunately, Chrysler couldn't get it into production soon enough.
Yup. Right engine at wrong time unfortunately.
@@VicsGarage71 Exactly.
I'd of left it original too, but its done now, alot work done to an engine to make more power only to have sit in a museum anyway, still cool story tho.
The begging old radio add sold
Me I want one
Nothing new here. Car Craft did a big article/interview with Dick Landy in 86.
Really good video and informative! Suggestion, the background music volume is a little loud (at least for me trying to listen to the dialog as working). Just a suggestion, otherwise awesome!
Thanks for the suggestion
I agree, music is too loud and not needed imo
I agree, very interesting info. Couldn’t make to the end because of low volume
I love Thermoqauds.Running a
internally modified one on my 65 273 Dart GT.
Enjoyed this video a lot. Would have been cool to see what it would have done had it been used in production. I would love to hear a thermoquad someday. I imagine it sounded similar to when a quadrajet kicked down and the big secondaries opened up. Awesome sound. When I get my next Pontiac I want to run one again.
I’ve heard they do. I’m trying to remember how it sounded but it’s been so long. I don’t remember.
Yeah, this is a Hemi that nobody seems to know about. The Quadrajet came up with the small primaries and large secondaries back in the 60s, so Carter wasn't unique at all. Either way, a Holley was a much better option and screw the gas mileage.
And I am a Ford guy because I love simplicity
Great story thanks brother
Thanks Vic.
Thanks for watching! Hope you check out the other history videos.
You know you got me hooked!
Make sets of ball stud hemi heads and seller to put on RB BLOCK AND B BLOCKS .
But how to get around the bolts to the heads inside the lifter gallery.
Stage 5 engineering used to make a hemi head for rb blocks. But since stopped producing them.
I think someone could recast the block if they wanted. But likely not enough profit.
Sounds like Indy Cylinder Head needs to spend a week or two with it, if it's really all that.
As a Mopar enthusiast for most of my life , for some reason this story doesn't really bother me ( regarding the history of a cost saving design being molested ). The same bean counters that initiated this design were probably the same ones that cancelled the original FirePower series ( they seemed to hate shaft mounted forged rocker assemblies ). Had they went with a single rocker shaft on this canted valve thing they would have gone full circle in bringing back all of the cancelled 1950's designs .
If it doesnt excite you better check your pulse for sure.
Thank you.
Thanks for watching. Working on the history of the Edsel brand so hope you subscribe and check it out!
Very well done video, as well as informative! I'm actually doing a video on the 2nd Gen Hemi and, if you don't mind, I'll be posting a link to this video to show my research! Great video!!
Thanks it’s a privilege to have people cite my work. Good luck. Keep me updated on your video!
@@VicsGarage71 Will do! Thank you so much!
Hey! It took me long enough, but the video is up! Thanks again for the wealth of info!
And the themaquad would roar as it opens those secondaries
Lol yup. Love that carb!
@@VicsGarage71 then why were you bad mouthing the TQ's in the video? I have NEVER seen a TQ float bowl warp, and I have owned literally hundreds of them. Though I will allow it maybe could happen if someone didn't torque the bowl cover on properly. Mostly, the TQ was a victim of ham-handed shade tree mechanics who'd be hard pressed to properly disassemble and reassemble a Holley 1-bbl. The TQ, especially the 72-78 non lean burn carbs are a superior performance carb with decent economy, and emissions-friendly features. It's VERY tuneable. Unfortunately, parts are becoming scarce.
@@budlanctot3060 I don’t think it’s bad mouthing to point out a issue with it. And it’s not just me, tons of people have reported issues the bowls warping or cracking.
www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/threads/warped-thermoquad.96869/
www.hotrodders.com/threads/thermoquad-vs-quadrajet.524145/
www.carburetor-blog.com/knowledge-base/carter-thermoquad-troubleshooting/
Despite that, it’s still a great carb. As with most things, it’s not black and white, but nuanced. I had a great run with it & it served me well. If I wasn’t planning on going to EFI I’d probably go back to it.
@@VicsGarage71 after reading a bunch of anecdotal heresay in the links provided I remain unconvinced. The one about replacing the bowl for every tuneup is just flat stupid. The only bowls I've ever seen go bad are the ones broken by abuse, by tanking them within an inch of their lives until the glue disolves on the main jet well caps, somebody overtightening the main jets, not lining up the locating pins and/or checking on the float pins before they start cranking down the cover screws.
There are 4 external links on the TQ. I once bought a TQ at a swap meet which had EVERY link in the wrong location. That was the biggest drawback to TQ's....meathead mechanics.
Thanks, history is important even if it grinds our gut a little.....That head design and
those modifications that followed, though regrettable, show a design that is smaller and weighs, less and just as powerful, that could be of use to MOPAR fans for some one to resurrect a replacement head that could sell to market......Maybe, just maybe, Chrysler could get NASCAR approval for Dodge to run it in competition.....
With the cost of a hemi, it would be nice if someone brought back the likes of stage 5 or something.
Its amazing what mopar will call a "hemi" this one's close, closer than a gen3 and MUCH closer than the Aussie 6! If you want a true hemi six look at a 1964 overhead cam Jeep Tornado 230! Shaft mounted, shaft oiling rockers are a Godsend to a performance engine. No heavy-duty gas engines ever used ball studs. They are the most problematic part of a high-performance engine build. All kinds of band aids are used to fix issues with them in Chevies I always scratched my head at their leaking valve covers from oil drain back issues, oil deflectors, and pushrod guide plates, factory press in studs, aftermarket screw in studs, and stud girdles, and eventually ending up with shafts just to go from 68lb stock to run 320 lb springs like a 440 6 pack had stock.I always thought the mopar big block should have been designed as a polysphere. They are superior to a wedge and use the same block and intake as a Hemi. Making swaps easy. However, they are wider and have two axes to machine valves on. Carroll Shelby once said that thermoquad was the best single 4bbl carb ever made for superstock racing. He was right! I have run 17 of them on my own stuff, tuned many others, and ran them on dual quad set-ups. They are the most economical, tuneable carb available. They are confusing if you dont know your way around one. I have only seen 1 cracked or leaking plastic bowl, and that was damaged by an idiot being a gorilla with a wrench or screwdriver. Almost all of them are warped, but it DOESN'T MATTER if you keep the top and bowl together, I don't even check them. They warped to match each other! Never had to scrap or straighten one because of leaks if I did that. I have a Thermoquad that came off of a burnt out police car. The aluminum top melted into the plastic bowl, and the bowl is fine! The major warped ones came from some of them having the rear mounting bolt run thru the top cover. The competition TQ is 1,000+ cfm. They are variable cfm and mopar put 850 cfm ones on police 318's. The fuel stays 26 deg cooler in the plastic bowl. I can make one sing and dance at every rpm range or driving condition on any engine after getting the jets ballpark close without ever breaking it open.
It is sad how this rare engine was modified... But what is even more sad is how government regulations literally put it out of existence with only 2, maybe 3 examples being produced.... The regulations and those ideas that created the ridiculous regulations, should be on the list of extinct items that are detrimental to our country... Not engines like these....
I just did a version with better audio. Link is below. Check it out.
Talk to Tony Delisio uncle Tony’s garage you might learn something!
Just came across this video. I know the video is two years old. Sox and Martin believed to have one in a car
I just did a version with better audio. Link is below. Check it out.
Similarities to the canted valves on the Poly range of motors. That was another big miss for Chrysler. Think about a canted valve 340.
Music is way too loud. Can’t hardly hear the man talk. What the hell
Hey man. Thanks for the feedback. I think I’m gonna remaster some of my older videos and re record some of the audio and stuff. Hope u stick around for the new versions
I was street racing for about 10 years or more, from 65 on ran 2 street hemis with small block chevys i`m not pro chevy, they were the cheapest thing to run a 327 and a 350 they were not any near stock and i ran 488 rears i never had any trouble walking away from any street hemi, i don`t think they were anywhere near 425 horse, i think they were super detuned, as as i remember they were solid cams and you could realy here it
Well 4:88 gears will get anything moving quickly
Ditch the annoying background music, you don’t need it.
yeah this was my first video in this format and the background music was a bit loud.
The "Ball Stud Hemi" should have been put into production!! To hell with the "Tree Humpers"!!
Yeah I wish it would’ve
Music is too loud, and it makes it hard to understand what you are saying
Thanks man. I’m going to re release this video with improved audio soon. Thanks for the feedback!
Wy the music
Thanks for the feedback.
Now that I have a better microphone I’m debating re recording the audio on it and re releasing it.
Spark plugs location looks like Oldsmobile.....so not a hemi
Background music needs to go
Yeah I’m probably gonna rerelease my older ones with improved audio.
Thanks
So it was mopars version of the BBC
Just a myth pal just a myth. 426 hemi was the only one.
No they built a bunch of them. Just never went to production
3 built 1 survive
The gas crisis of 1974 would have taken its toll on this engine, unfortunately. I bet Jensen might have used these instead of the 440s for its Interceptor, and Monteverdi for the various cars he dropped in 440s or 426 Hemis.
AKA BS Hemi
I've only seen those thermo-quads on rv's
I think they started using them on their cars with a 340 in 1972.
I just put a newer Demon on my 350 in my 67 camaro.The Minute I took it out of the box the first thing I thought was,I just bought a ThermoQuad.I have to admit though it stopped my vapor lock,and it increased my ponies a noticeable bit.I am new but love your channel.
FACT : Thermo Quads came stock on mopar B , E. bodies , some pick ups and also r.v. 's and more .
Right, Vic. Thermoquads on 4 bbl equipped Chrysler products after '72. They DID put some Quadrajets on vehicles when the Carter cupboard was bare, though.
Vic's Garage, while i appreciate your mostly accurate vid on this EXTREMELY rare piece of automotive history, i do not, your condescending attempts, beginning @9:18 at "defending" the MUTILATING automotive history. Yours is the typical attitude of.."Well, it's old & i don't understand it,nor appreciate it (like your Thermoquad) so it's just worthless junk."
Well first off I love my thermoquad. Not sure what I said that was condescending. I think my points are legit. What did Aruza do that would really prevent anyone from spending the money to recast that block or replicating it?
The block likely would’ve ended up in the Garbage somewhere like the rest of them if he didn’t make it serviceable.
@@VicsGarage71 Do you have any idea what you're asking when you say "re-cast It" ? You are talking about starting with original blueprints. Starting from scratch ! So, to answer your question.."What would prevent someone...?" The answer is A helluva LOT of $$$. That's what. That thought should have stopped Aruza,imo.
@@shanew.williams No doubt. But as I said, the block was bored .30 over and the heads were ported. The biggest issue was the intake being modified. It's really not that different besides the intake.
People look back from today and say wow that is one collectable item! But every thing collectable was really just a piece of trash and some point. Hindsight is 20/20.
Dick Landy could also take blame here but seems to escape it for some reasons. He could've given it to the museum. But he decided to profit off it while having a questionable ownership claim. He also chucked the cam and modified it as well.
I don’t get why that dude had to have that rare engine if he wanted to do all that work to it? He could’ve did that to something else that wasn’t so rare…. Should’ve blueprinted it first.
Background music should be just that !
Could not hear narration because of annoying music. Gave up at 3 min
Hey Rich,
Appreciate the feed back. I'm re releasing this video soon, maybe this weekend with improved audio. So Hopefully you subscribe and hit that notification button and give it another go!
FACT : Cubic inch inches ARE NOT gained from boring . Cubic inches ARE gained from STROKER CRANKS ! Boreing would gain a max. of 5 CUBIC INCHES . ALL Engines burn fuel to make power . ALL motors use electricity to make power .
Well to be technical, cubic inches are a combination of length, width, and height (the three dimensions of a cube). Changing any one of them will increase cubic inches, including making cylinders bigger by boring them out.
@@VicsGarage71 Very little cubic inches are gained by boring only .
@@keithpearson7059yes. But you do gain them. Not much. But you do.
@@VicsGarage71 Like I said previously , 5 cubic inches max. gained by boring a large displacement engine 440 , 454 , 460 , ect. = a hotter running engine ( that needs better cooling . )
@@keithpearson7059 Well I don't want to beat a dead horse, but you said they are not gained originally before the edit. Not you gain minimal amount. My point is cubic inches are a combination of length, width and height. By nature of the way a engine block is made, you can't modify the circumference of cylinders much, I agree. The most effective way to gain or lose cubic inches is by changing the stroke of the crank.
I doubt the boring of a cylinder .30/.40 over will change cooling requirements much. I punched my 440 .30 over and the stock cooling system was more than adequate. That's my experience anyways. I've never stroked out a block before so as far as its ramifications on cooling, I can't speak to that.
Please please lose the damn music.
New video up with better audio and reduced background music. Hope you enjoy.
It’s an engine, not a “motor”. Motors run on electricity……..carry on.
www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/us/definition/english/motor_1?q=motor
a device that uses electricity, PETROL, etc. to produce movement and makes a machine, a vehicle, a boat, etc. work
www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/us/definition/english/engine?q=engine
the part of a vehicle that produces power to make the vehicle move
They're interchangable
FACT : " motors " use electricity to make power , " engines burn fuel to make power , no " interchange " with electricity and fuel ( pump fuel in a " motor " = no power ! , wire " electricity " to an engine = no power ! )
How 'bout "mill", or "bullet"..., feel the need to define what powers them, too? Whether it's accurate or slang matters not. Anyone with common sense understands just fine, professors. School's out.👋
not stolen fron gm ma @$$ canted and ball stud well before bsh..
Bad lighting and audio. Sheesh. Just put a modicum of effort in dude
Blah blah blah, Its a real damn garage. Just the facts , no fluff...