Flight Attendants are trained to evaluate the evacuation. Flight deck crews have been known to give wrong side information. Specifying which side has been obsolete for over 10 years. Capt A320
I think it doesn't matter because the engine is already damaged. Even if the reverser thrust isn't as high as in the other engine there are stil those flaps that open and create drag. And the engine is stil rotating the fan, so it stil creates some thrust. AND its much easier just to reverse both engines. You don't have the time to check which engine is on fire if you just hear the sound of the engine fire warning.
Thank you, I guess it was a given. I thought they were being tested I was a bit confused. "every routine sixth monthly check" do you mean tested monthly?
Daniel Guenther Every airline pilot is checked on his proficiency every sixth month simulated engine failure is always checked at least once each check
I'm sure that by that point, the cabin crew has seen the flames and has made the independent decision not to use the exits on the right hand side of the aircraft.
Very interesting stuff, flying is so fascinating. I like the disclaimer "not for use in training". Haha. I would be worried if my first day on the job as a pilot they make you watch a youtube video. HAHA.
fire takes a while to destroy an engine, it will still work with less power in the seconds after the alarm goes off. and you want every little bit of breaking power you can muster during a rejected takeoff.
What's the problem? Engine is on fire but it's working. Your job at that moment is to stop the aircraft not to take care of an already messed up engine
Off the get-go: the fire is not "out" until it is visually confirmed by either the fire marshal or the tower. Also, the use of above idle Reverse Thrust is not a good idea with a suspected engine fire, especially at low speeds , and the aircraft will stop on the remaining runway without its use (Brakes only). And last but not least, in Scenario 1, sitting on the runway attacking subsequential ECAMs makes very little sense and is a waste of time...
Ok, I know it says not to use for training purposes but it is good guidance on how to handle the situation calmly and what precautions to take. Whether you like it or not, I’m learning
Great stuff guys! You do the best cockpit videos on TH-cam. You should have way more views. I am going to see what I can do about that. Don't be surprised if your views jump in the next couple of days.
True, depending on the aircraft, they either light up automatically, or they are activated by the crew. If it is automatic, it'll be programmed to run off of standby power from a power source such as a battery anyway, if not, the crew will have to switch them on.
It's just two separate extinguisher bottles. With a fire, you just want all in. In flight, if I remember correctly, you release them with time in between so that the second one finishes off what might have relighted. You only release one for damage to be sure. And if you actually still need it, there is one left for later on. But the less precautionary extinguisher you discharge the more thankful the ground crew will be as it created a mess! :D
Airbus changed the procedure because a plane landed with only 1 reverser working. Then it skidded of the runway and nearly killed all the passenger on board. The old procedure was to only pull the reverser back that is working but after the crash airbus changed the procedure to prevent this from ever happening again.
Make sure the aircraft has come to a complete halt, set the parking brake, priority is to keep the aircraft under control. Then communicate, attention cabin crew at stations. You want to make sure the aircraft is not moving when you release the crew to carry out their duties rather than risk injury.....;-)
During your procedures you are not verify with the guy next to you when you starting pressing switches? You just extinguishing right away with out a confirmation? Why ?
+fotisaiki For a fire on the ground there is no requirement to confirm selection of guarded switches, the priority in this case is getting the aircraft safe. In the air clearly shutting down the wrong engine can be catastrophic so guarded switches are all confirmed before action...
+fotisaiki Some airlines may perhaps differ but the Airbus way is as I stated - www.pprune.org/tech-log/544754-airbus-ecam-actions-ground.html A330 FCTM - AO-020 TASKSHARING IN CASE OF EMERGENCY EVACUATION - 'When applying the EMERGENCY EVACUATION procedure, the F/O can select the engine master OFF and push the fire pb, without any confirmation from the Captain'
first agent discharged immedialty..i get it...but second ? it's there in case you still have a fire after 30s usually ? why is the Sop this way ? any logical factors involved in this ?
You’d want to pop both bottles right away to maximize the amount of halon in the cowling. The ECAM does direct you to wait 30sec before discharging bottle 2 if in flight, however. But there’s little to no airflow in the cowling when stopped on the runway.
can I ask? is it possible to restart the engine in flight if the two agent has been discharge? what are the logic of the engine in cfm after engine fire?
well, the 737 doesn't have the ECAM, so you have to refer to the Quick Reference Handbook for checklist. After that, everything is the same; with a different presentation.
If there's engine fire on both sides. Which slides would be preferred for evacuation? Do we look at the wind direction as well and use the exit on the windward side?
depends on the aircraft, but yeah look at the wind, and because most aircraft have one engine under each wing, and most flight depart into the wind, that would push the fire and smoke towards the back, meaning no fire at the front two exits. It would be the same with a crosswind, it just pushes the fire and smoke towards the sides. For example, if you were to be departing on a runway with heading 270, and the wind is coming from 181, you'd still use the front two exits, as the smoke and flames would go slightly more towards the back, even though the difference between using the front two exits and back two exits is just 2 degrees.
well its just because i've worked as a student of airplane maintenance and i had to inspect the batteries who supplied the emergency lights but that was on a BAE 146
Labai noreciau, kad susuktumete koki video apie neuzgestanti variklio gaisra ore. Be to butu smagu pamatyti veiksmus neissiskleidus vaziuoklei arba, kaip buvo ivyke kazkada realiame gyvenime, kai kreisiariniame aukstyje dingsta elektra visame laktuve. Zinau, kad pats susivelciau juodai tokiose situacijose is vietoj gelbejimosi liemenes tureciau parasiuta, bet idomu, kai gali patyre zmones padaryti tokiose situacijose. Dekui
yes, i am referring to the Engine Fire procedure. it's the same thing, but instead of ECAM actions, 737 pilots have to refer to the QRH for abnormal procedures checklist.
Ideally, reverse thrust shouldn't be used at all under abnormal engine conditions, as if the engine fails while thrust is reversed the aircraft is at risk of veering off the runway.
Turning off the batteries entirely would prevent the function of systems that aid in the evacuation process, such as emergency strip floor lighting. The batteries don't present as a hazard, APUs and engines are usually shut down, but batteries are left running. (well, unless it's a 7late7 nightmareliner) ;)
Using thrust reversers during an engine fire is risky and should not be done. It can cause a deflection of fire from the engines in the direction of the wings and fuselage. It can make the situation much worse and impede safe evacuation of passengers. this also depends on the wind direction but it's too risky to do, so yes, it is bad. That said, thrust reversers don't need to be used. When calculating stopping distance on a runway, it isn't usually factored in. :)
Thank you for all the answer, but the agent is not inside the core its in outside of the core when it is discharge so when you disconnect the auto pilot is it possible to restart the engine? if you know that the fire is distinguish?
Correct, which is exactly what should be done. Passengers need to evacuate the opposing side of danger. The BA crew on the recent incident involving their Airbus A319 with an engine fire put the passengers out of any risk, they evacuated the opposite side to the engine fire. I should know, I was there and saw it land at Heathrow.
captmiller22 He's saying 50% N1. N1 is the status of the large engine fan. You can see on the display at the top between the engine indicators it says 'N1' with a '%' symbol underneath
He says 50% N1 when both engines are set at that thrust setting. It is recommended that the power is set at 50% and stabilized before advancing them to take off power as this ensures that there is no asymmetric thrust - hence easier to stay straight on the runway.
It certainly can contribute to the increased likelihood of the second situation occurring and/ or damage, so using reversers on the unaffected engine only is a good safety-first approach on some runways with some aircraft - watch brake use. The point is to stop the plane ASAP and evacuate if the engine cannot be extinguished.
I heard somebody say that when travelling at that speed, rather than assessing which lever to pull, it’s safer to use all potential reverser power and stop as soon as possible (It was an A330 in that context but i believe the same applies)
No time to make that assessment, the engine is f-cked anyway. Also, if that reverser doesn't work it's not a biggy anyway, and if it does work you get some extra stopping power.
Are there any circumstances where a large passenger aircraft (eg B777 or A330) about two thirds full of passengers, can take off with no flaps, no leading edge slats extended..a completely clean wing?
Obviously, but they will need to achieve a higher speed a takeoff which means they need a longer runway. The assimetrical airfoil on the wing makes it possible for at a completely level flight certain amount of lift to be produced by the formula (L=1/2 P V^2 S C^L).
2015newyear Cheers, the reason I ask is because I was on an A330 and was watching for the slats/leading edge to come out, but they never did. My palms were sweating as the pilot applied full thrust..
+Elias Gergi yah I'm pretty sure that's the only way to extinguish the fire. If it fails then they accept it. The engines are meant to contain the fire in one place though.
I love how he say 'We are here today to burn an engine' haha...
1:06 "We won, we rotate, we too". - Pilots mantra. :)
Hahhahahahaha
lol wewewewewee
LOL
Flight Attendants are trained to evaluate the evacuation. Flight deck crews have been known to give wrong side information. Specifying which side has been obsolete for over 10 years. Capt A320
I was wondering about that ;-)
@@davidrose1993 qpoxlxkxkkz,-s
M
A320 has slides on the wing exits, full flaps aren't required
Are you type rated on an A320?
I think it doesn't matter because the engine is already damaged. Even if the reverser thrust isn't as high as in the other engine there are stil those flaps that open and create drag. And the engine is stil rotating the fan, so it stil creates some thrust.
AND its much easier just to reverse both engines. You don't have the time to check which engine is on fire if you just hear the sound of the engine fire warning.
Very useful. Spirit Airlines just had exactly the second scenario due to a bird strike.
Finally a co-pilot that has good english skills. Nice video! :D
Have you ever done a simulation flight without being told of the emergency?
On every routine sixth monthly check, little point otherwise
Thank you, I guess it was a given. I thought they were being tested I was a bit confused. "every routine sixth monthly check" do you mean tested monthly?
Daniel Guenther Every airline pilot is checked on his proficiency every sixth month simulated engine failure is always checked at least once each check
It’s a standard procedure in training and checkups, to test you know how to diagnose any problem, you won’t get a warning in real life
pranas is a great pilot
is it possible for students pilots who study at BAA to reach their 1500HRS by type rating ( after took their ATPL ) ?
is there no need to tell the crew NOT to use the overwing exit on the right hand side? engine is still burning...
I'm sure that by that point, the cabin crew has seen the flames and has made the independent decision not to use the exits on the right hand side of the aircraft.
Very interesting stuff, flying is so fascinating. I like the disclaimer "not for use in training". Haha. I would be worried if my first day on the job as a pilot they make you watch a youtube video. HAHA.
JUST ONE QUESTION
HOW CAN JUST YOU PUT THE AFFECTED ENGINE 2 ON REVERSE?
fire takes a while to destroy an engine, it will still work with less power in the seconds after the alarm goes off. and you want every little bit of breaking power you can muster during a rejected takeoff.
The Boeing Procedures are a lot different than the ones showed here. Isn't it, BAA??
What's the problem? Engine is on fire but it's working. Your job at that moment is to stop the aircraft not to take care of an already messed up engine
Eduardo Ocampo It’s a sim
In case of engine fire, can't they have a button that reads: Press in case of engine fire..
Better create button Fly to DST point
The big red FIRE button is exactly that.
Off the get-go: the fire is not "out" until it is visually confirmed by either the fire marshal or the tower. Also, the use of above idle Reverse Thrust is not a good idea with a suspected engine fire, especially at low speeds , and the aircraft will stop on the remaining runway without its use (Brakes only). And last but not least, in Scenario 1, sitting on the runway attacking subsequential ECAMs makes very little sense and is a waste of time...
Always nice to hear utter nonsense from a know nothing. Thanks.
Ok, I know it says not to use for training purposes but it is good guidance on how to handle the situation calmly and what precautions to take. Whether you like it or not, I’m learning
Cool video...hey do you guys have any training videos on landing for the A320
Great stuff guys! You do the best cockpit videos on TH-cam. You should have way more views. I am going to see what I can do about that. Don't be surprised if your views jump in the next couple of days.
True, depending on the aircraft, they either light up automatically, or they are activated by the crew. If it is automatic, it'll be programmed to run off of standby power from a power source such as a battery anyway, if not, the crew will have to switch them on.
EXCELLENT GUYS !! (AGAIN!) Nice production and execution ! Ochen
Horosho!
What’s the difference between Agent 1 and Agent 2? Isn’t 1 and 2 during a fire? And agent 2 Is only for when the engine is damage?
It's just two separate extinguisher bottles. With a fire, you just want all in. In flight, if I remember correctly, you release them with time in between so that the second one finishes off what might have relighted. You only release one for damage to be sure. And if you actually still need it, there is one left for later on. But the less precautionary extinguisher you discharge the more thankful the ground crew will be as it created a mess! :D
Airbus changed the procedure because a plane landed with only 1 reverser working. Then it skidded of the runway and nearly killed all the passenger on board. The old procedure was to only pull the reverser back that is working but after the crash airbus changed the procedure to prevent this from ever happening again.
Captain evacuated before his first officer. Fail!
almost always that Pranas take control of an a320 or 737. Theres an emergency XD.
Comment 200
I think Airbus has a "protection". In that case "reverse are green" so I think it's ok to use
Make sure the aircraft has come to a complete halt, set the parking brake, priority is to keep the aircraft under control. Then communicate, attention cabin crew at stations. You want to make sure the aircraft is not moving when you release the crew to carry out their duties rather than risk injury.....;-)
Why do you discharge both agents at the same time and don't allow only one to do the job? you may be wasting one bottle and they are not cheap.
Doesn't hurt to make sure.
Co pilot head is quite big must be very smart. He actually has long legs and his seat is moved back so his head is closer to camera
During your procedures you are not verify with the guy next to you when you starting pressing switches? You just extinguishing right away with out a confirmation? Why ?
+fotisaiki For a fire on the ground there is no requirement to confirm selection of guarded switches, the priority in this case is getting the aircraft safe. In the air clearly shutting down the wrong engine can be catastrophic so guarded switches are all confirmed before action...
***** All right thanks. Every aircraft and company has their own policy I guess...Fly safe :)
+fotisaiki Some airlines may perhaps differ but the Airbus way is as I stated - www.pprune.org/tech-log/544754-airbus-ecam-actions-ground.html
A330 FCTM - AO-020 TASKSHARING IN CASE OF EMERGENCY EVACUATION - 'When applying the EMERGENCY EVACUATION procedure, the F/O can select the engine master OFF and push the fire pb, without any confirmation from the Captain'
I was just curious. I am an Embraer guy my self :) Thanks for the reply though !!! Happy landings, safe flights !!
Fire still burning starboard side and you didn't even tell cabin which exists to use lol
Great video! I like how Pranas was the first out haha.
first agent discharged immedialty..i get it...but second ? it's there in case you still have a fire after 30s usually ? why is the Sop this way ? any logical factors involved in this ?
You’d want to pop both bottles right away to maximize the amount of halon in the cowling. The ECAM does direct you to wait 30sec before discharging bottle 2 if in flight, however. But there’s little to no airflow in the cowling when stopped on the runway.
can I ask? is it possible to restart the engine in flight if the two agent has been discharge? what are the logic of the engine in cfm after engine fire?
well, the 737 doesn't have the ECAM, so you have to refer to the Quick Reference Handbook for checklist. After that, everything is the same; with a different presentation.
If there's engine fire on both sides. Which slides would be preferred for evacuation? Do we look at the wind direction as well and use the exit on the windward side?
depends on the aircraft, but yeah look at the wind, and because most aircraft have one engine under each wing, and most flight depart into the wind, that would push the fire and smoke towards the back, meaning no fire at the front two exits. It would be the same with a crosswind, it just pushes the fire and smoke towards the sides. For example, if you were to be departing on a runway with heading 270, and the wind is coming from 181, you'd still use the front two exits, as the smoke and flames would go slightly more towards the back, even though the difference between using the front two exits and back two exits is just 2 degrees.
That's the airbus procedure. IF one reverser does not work. Then you still pull both the reverse thrust levers.
Very good! Very professional!
Maybe stupid question, but why evacuate on both sides? Isnt the left side best if there is a fire on the right?
R3D the cabin crew will control the evacuation procedure and would have prevented people using the right hand side in a real life situation
i think that the emergency lights have there own sorce of energy and are not fed from the batteries but its possible.
well its just because i've worked as a student of airplane maintenance and i had to inspect the batteries who supplied the emergency lights but that was on a BAE 146
Labai noreciau, kad susuktumete koki video apie neuzgestanti variklio gaisra ore. Be to butu smagu pamatyti veiksmus neissiskleidus vaziuoklei arba, kaip buvo ivyke kazkada realiame gyvenime, kai kreisiariniame aukstyje dingsta elektra visame laktuve. Zinau, kad pats susivelciau juodai tokiose situacijose is vietoj gelbejimosi liemenes tureciau parasiuta, bet idomu, kai gali patyre zmones padaryti tokiose situacijose. Dekui
flaps full down before evac?
evac out the left side - fire in engine 2.
It's due to the fact that there's not enough time to check which one's on fire and then correct for it (it's easy to choose the wrong one!).
yes, i am referring to the Engine Fire procedure. it's the same thing, but instead of ECAM actions, 737 pilots have to refer to the QRH for abnormal procedures checklist.
No wonder 55 died at Manchester
Ideally, reverse thrust shouldn't be used at all under abnormal engine conditions, as if the engine fails while thrust is reversed the aircraft is at risk of veering off the runway.
Well thought the Aircrafts wing is protected against fire for a short time so ther is no major problem.
U need to study guys!
Cool video! I'm looking forward to using this for training purposes.
It clearly says not to use this for training purposes.
@@Jusiun oh no. It's too late.
@@Jusiun r/wooosh
@@spyjams08therobloxian66 why?
@@Jusiun Forgot a question mark, it appeared as if c21feelchannel was joking about using it for training purposes, however, he could be sincere.
Pranas you would be a god pilot
Pranas, your haircut should be copyrighted.
Turning off the batteries entirely would prevent the function of systems that aid in the evacuation process, such as emergency strip floor lighting. The batteries don't present as a hazard, APUs and engines are usually shut down, but batteries are left running. (well, unless it's a 7late7 nightmareliner) ;)
Using thrust reversers during an engine fire is risky and should not be done. It can cause a deflection of fire from the engines in the direction of the wings and fuselage. It can make the situation much worse and impede safe evacuation of passengers. this also depends on the wind direction but it's too risky to do, so yes, it is bad. That said, thrust reversers don't need to be used. When calculating stopping distance on a runway, it isn't usually factored in. :)
I have no idea why i watched this. I now know what happens if a fire occurs before V1.
Nice! Gonna try this scenario in flight in FS2020.
Thank you for all the answer, but the agent is not inside the core its in outside of the core when it is discharge so when you disconnect the auto pilot is it possible to restart the engine? if you know that the fire is distinguish?
Pretty great example of how it's not done properly 😄👍
Before turning the engine master, the thrust lever should be turned to idle right?
Yep, otherwise the plane would move forward automatically
Correct, which is exactly what should be done. Passengers need to evacuate the opposing side of danger. The BA crew on the recent incident involving their Airbus A319 with an engine fire put the passengers out of any risk, they evacuated the opposite side to the engine fire. I should know, I was there and saw it land at Heathrow.
Wow, that's so much fun to watch, thumbs up for you
I'm gonna use this video for training purposes
It clearly says not to use this for training purposes.
@@Jusiun that's the joke
@@henrywallace3563 ok
Bolek and Lolek !
Hi, I've got a stupid question.
What does this mean: "50 percent and one"? (01:46)
It appears in this video but also in FSX e.g..
thanks so far.
captmiller22 He's saying 50% N1. N1 is the status of the large engine fan. You can see on the display at the top between the engine indicators it says 'N1' with a '%' symbol underneath
ryanch94
Now it's clear to me - big thx.
He says 50% N1 when both engines are set at that thrust setting. It is recommended that the power is set at 50% and stabilized before advancing them to take off power as this ensures that there is no asymmetric thrust - hence easier to stay straight on the runway.
If is possible we evaluate from the left side?! 6:25
Reverse when engine fire?!
It certainly can contribute to the increased likelihood of the second situation occurring and/ or damage, so using reversers on the unaffected engine only is a good safety-first approach on some runways with some aircraft - watch brake use.
The point is to stop the plane ASAP and evacuate if the engine cannot be extinguished.
I heard somebody say that when travelling at that speed, rather than assessing which lever to pull, it’s safer to use all potential reverser power and stop as soon as possible (It was an A330 in that context but i believe the same applies)
This is the very great video and the all procedure are respected !!! thanks so much for this good jobs :) Continuous
Can you do the same video with a 737?
This is very good well done
Why wait 30 seconds... FCOM says this?
No time to make that assessment, the engine is f-cked anyway. Also, if that reverser doesn't work it's not a biggy anyway, and if it does work you get some extra stopping power.
They used it on the engine that wasn't on fire.
Great...
Apply reverse on engine Fire? In afected engine? Hummm
Do not boast !
I know man!! I meant so the same engine fires thing on the 737
I love your videos. Thank you!!
what´s the function of the PA button? in 2:25?
+Pedro Picon Barriel to notify the crew to proceed to their assigned stations in case of an emergency
+Pedro Picon Barriel PA stands for Public Address,a way to send voices over Loud Speaker
+Gio Sauquillo also tells the crew the flight deck is aware of the situation and are dealing with it
aaaa, thanks!
It's actually Public Address.
We won, we rotate? We too?
Hola ¿qué significa flota ART?
You dont have to know that ur going to have an engine fire. No one is going to tell u that ur going to have an engine fire in real life.
Thats not the point, its to know how to solve an engine fire.
Are there any circumstances where a large passenger aircraft (eg B777 or A330) about two thirds full of passengers, can take off with no flaps, no leading edge slats extended..a completely clean wing?
Obviously, but they will need to achieve a higher speed a takeoff which means they need a longer runway. The assimetrical airfoil on the wing makes it possible for at a completely level flight certain amount of lift to be produced by the formula (L=1/2 P V^2 S C^L).
2015newyear Cheers, the reason I ask is because I was on an A330 and was watching for the slats/leading edge to come out, but they never did. My palms were sweating as the pilot applied full thrust..
+John Smith I think the slats were lowered, you just did not see
Speedbird Trust me I was looking, and listening. That sound is very distinctive..
Well in that case you are typing this from heaven :P (I don't think hell has wifi...)
This is emergency EVACUATE EVACUATE EVACUATE
you seems to be very quite while your plane is burning!!!
is it lightning or
Fire one engine fire 2 engine fire tree engine
But if you press in the Fire agent or put back the press to discharge the agent... all valve will be operative again...
wrong procedures
Enlighten us.
Share your knowledge, wise one. What do you know that aviation college students don't?
I'm only single engine certified, the only thing is they should have been in communication with air control. Of course this is a sim.
+Jon Schuck - 4:57 he speaks to tower after DECEL, REV GREEN
u forgot to turn off the batt before evacuating :p
What happens if the engine catches fire after V1 or V2
+Elias Gergi The aircraft will continue in the air and the pilots will extinguish the fire if needed and then necessary action is taken :)
If the extinguish fails is it time to accept fate or are there any other actions to take
+Elias Gergi yah I'm pretty sure that's the only way to extinguish the fire. If it fails then they accept it. The engines are meant to contain the fire in one place though.
Ok thank you for the replies :)
late reply I apologise but v1 is seen as the point of no return. As soon as you hit V1 you're committed to going airborne
Hello everybody this is FPS Russia...wrong show?
Thank you for vatching and have good day!
small head big head
just russian things xD
There is now other Chance to stop the plane at this Speed. But of course it is bad.
using reverse thrust on a engine that is on fire??? isnt hat bad?
You should never restart a demaged engine.
You should delete this video.
Thanks. 🙏
"We one. We are. We two." :D
Boeing 737-800 MAX V1 VR and V2.
Hhaahahha ;) nice one