One of my favorite characters was Principal Franklin from Icarly. He wasn't a stereotype. They never brought up his skin color. He wasn't a black principal, he was a principal that happened to be black. He was a great character and deeply cared about the students and school
Josie Parker I could never understand as to why his boss fired him for being on iCarly. He clearly stated on there that he wanted to be on the show for his daughter because she loved the show and wanted to give her a great surprise for her birthday. It just seems so heartless of his boss to have fired him over doing something fun and heartwarming for his daughter and it wasn’t like he said or did anything inappropriate on the webshow.
I feel like one of the most disgusting things about Andre is that his actor (Leon Thomas III) written some of the music for the episodes like “Song 2 You” and wasn’t even credited which is so sad because songs like that are still memorable 10 years later.
I had heard that Leon Thomas the 3rd wrote on Ariana Grande's 1st cd. he produced or something. I remember ina clip she was thanking him for helping her cd.
Honestly Andre was the only one in that group that was good boyfriend material but they never put him together with any of the girls in the group. Lost potential 😑
@@patrickmicah5913 😭 idk y but I can’t really see him with Tori, I ship him with Jade and imagine that in the end Jade and Beck would’ve thankfully broke up for good and she went and got with Andre after all, they would make such a perfect couple so long as Jade Mellows out more and Andre learns to stop being scared of her and idk maybe Beck and Tori could’ve gotten together but that prolly wouldn’t happen so long as Tori asks Jade first and Jade approves since Tori didn’t want to do that to at least a half friend
I always assumed Andre’s parents were dead because he always seemed like the most mature character. Like he had to grow up fast. But the show should’ve clarified to better flesh out his character.
@@eph_loves_80s74 he's the most sensible in all of the group. Lot of the character in victorious do dumb things and sorta unlikable at times, but andre was always smart about everything
@@eph_loves_80s74 When has Andre had anger issues and threatened poeple? Just asking. Because I always remembered him as the most laidback and sensible one of the group. Can you name instances?
@@eph_loves_80s74 dude I think you just hate andre and beck because nobody even likes beck, and andre has just started getting popular. You're taking this way too seriously too.
I'm black, I remember growing up and lots of people would tell me I'm acting "white" because I was never aggressive or mean. I was always friendly and social.
Same I’m black pretty smart I would say and always quiet unless I know you . Also I talk pretty properly compres to people my age . So people always called me preppy /act white . Like my friends literally made fun of me for going to college and being smart .😂😂
@@ChefDeeRock i don't really talk preppy but i remember a white dude said I was actin white and i said why cause i don't do illegal shit and sag my pants and he said yea
they’d tell me that i’ve been “whitewashed” or that i sound and act white. what does that mean? i’m black and have always been black, am i less of a black woman because i’m not loud, aggressive, and “ghetto” like the stereotypes they portray us as?
Everyone talks about how Jade and Cat were the best on Victorious but honestly, Andre was amazing. He was cool, funny, and literally the best friend you could ever have. He wrote Make it Shine for Trina but actually Tori, he helped her get into Hollywood Arts, and was hardly ever mean unless he needed to be. His grandma was funny as well. You can tell me whatever, but in the end, Andre was the best to me.
it always annoyed me how the friend group would always date each other but the black character was always excluded from that? like, it's already bad enough that there was only one main black character but the fact that they were never involved in the romantic plotlines? as if they weren't dateable or couldn't date people who aren't black? also I always felt they were somehow plotting for Andre to get with Tori but no matter how much they connected is like they couldn't get together? and that she got with Beck on that half-assed poorly done arc
I heard they were going to do an Andre and Tori relationship had they had another season but they decided against it because it had a multi episode arch and they didn't have time for that so they stuck to the one episode arch's
I think Tori and Andre never dated because of the racism the show had. But thank God they didn't! I didn't like Tori's character and I don't think it might have worked. Andre was too good for her
Diversity doesn't count if the characters are still being portrayed as stereotypes or tropes!! Thank you for saying that, I feel like people who aren't part of a minority group don't realize this. You need to have diversity on a show AND have your diverse characters be multi-dimensional people and not just toss them in the background of a show. I feel like a lot of people in the comments aren't really getting the point, because you're criticizing their favorite childhood shows. When I watched these shows when I was younger, most of the points you mentioned went over my head. But now that I've been exposed to different tropes/stereotypes of black people through educating myself and am older, it's very obvious to me that most of these shows are very negative in their depictions of black people
Hello im not black but im half white Caucasian and everybodys portraits Caucasians basically as a Russian stareotype if they are ever shown most of em are just sit atill look pretty
I very much agree with you here. I'm not a person of color, but I'm part of the LGBTQ community and I'm neurodiverse (ADHD and autistic). Basically, any character that doesn't fit the, white, straight, cisgender, neurotypical... box is either created to, "make a statement," earn brownie points, or be a caricature of a minority group (usually as the butt of the joke, or as the, "wacky sidekick!" character). Like... if these people can't write someone different from themselves in a respectful and educated way, then they need to just not try and let someone else take over.
Andre was CRIMINALLY underappreciated in Victorious... He sang, wrote, played and acted well, was funny, kind, smart, reasonable and caring. And gorgeous. I absolutely hated "Andre's Horrible Girlfriend" because him dating a girl to get a record deal from her dad just didn't seem like him. Sure, everybody does bad stuff and is an asshole sometimes, but it was so OOC for him to do that, which is a shame because I thought I would love an episode centered around him. Also as soon as you mentioned the representation of Asians in his shows I thought of the owner of Wok Star (the Chinese restaurant) and Nozu (the sushi place). Also she had "broken" english which could be fine but in the context of the show it was always used to get the audience to laugh at her expense, never with her. I can't remember her having an actual funny line, she was always the butt of the joke. Andre and Michael being the only black main characters on their respective shows always rubbed me the wrong way but I could never further elaborate on that. I'm so glad you made this to point everything out.
In the episode about his girlfriend, besides the fact he uses her cause of her father, he LAUGHS when something falls on her head at the end of the episode.
I like the concept of having a black friend as a best friend, or someone close to the main character, or the actual main character, but I hate it with a burning passion when they're usually just there . . to fill out the "black person." bUt the character ends up being some static character that we barely get to know and connect to. They're just there for the sake of "diversity."
Yeah she's reaching in this video it seems. She also talked about black men on the show acting child like but what grown men on the show didn't act child like? Spencer was child like and so was the front desk man at their apartment. Lol.
Also most of the parents don't appear on the show. Tori's mom is apparently is cheating on her dad, Beck lives in a trailer to not follow his parents rules, Jade is estranged from her dad, Cat's parents are speculated to ignore her to focus on her insane brother and Robbie's parents are as far as i know never mentioned. I think he also lives with is grandma
Dan Schnider said that he doesn't want to focus on adults and wants to focus on the kids. Kids seemingly being in control of their lives is kinda like wishfuffilment when you are watching as a kid.
@@chasityslocum4032 yea lets body-shame, cuz thats fun too😑. Also at least Shane apologized for ALL of the bad things he did when he was younger. He grew up, he changed, he def learned his lesson and apologized; opposed to ppl who do this kind of stuff and have NEVER mentioned it, nor apologized. Also, the bad things that Shane had done was from YEARS ago and was randomly brought up (most likely for clout) so in the timespan of 2008-2020, isn't it possible for someone to change? Anyways my point is that at least Shane addressed the problems and said he's sorry ; unlike Dan who (as far as i remember) never did.
@я хорни lol imagine not having a heart🤭😂🤭😂🤭. imagine having mistakes you've made years ago, pulled up again just so ppl can have something to talk about😂😂🤭. imagine having to apologize for them countless of times because they keep getting dug up for clout🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭. Imagine not forgiving somebody for mistakes they've made from 12 years ago, tho they've apologized and grown from them😂😂😂😂. For me, i forgive him because he admitted to those mistakes, apologized for them (plenty of times), and i can tell he learned and grown from those mistakes. That's enough for me. Idk what more y'all want from him jeez. Plus i was 8 when that one situation happened and i am 20 now😑 proves how old this situation is.
Well I think its conicedence. I mean you need to have sassy characters because they are funny or it would be too sanitized and white people are sassy too. Then again It would be pretty racist to say only light skined people can be jerks. I think its best to stop spliting hairs and enjoy the show.
@@icecreamhero2375 It's kinda hard to brush it off as a coincidence when literally the only representation of black women in a show with very few black women in it always has a pattern of being sassy, mean, rude and aggressive...
The thing about KC Undercover is that Zendaya had to fight to even get the show to center on a family of color, anyway. I really liked Judy because she still had a soft side to her, as did KC (and KC was sassy...? Just not as much)
I feel some characters like andre were well grounded even though he was only there to be the black best friend of tori. And Andres grandma was a schizophrenic so that was why she was always screaming and paranoid. But andres girlfriends were horrible ill give you that
@@AtlanticGiantPumpkin THANK YOU IM TIRED OF SEEING THINGS LIKE THAT. I know kids won't really understand that what they're laughing at is wrong but it's ADULTS that right them as jokes.
One black character that was VERY well written and that i love is "cookie" from neds declassified school survival guide. :) Hes one of the 3 mains, intelligent/ nerdy, good hearted, funny character. Hes different from others thats why i like him! :D hes a good representation! I felt hes more of the star of the show, and the show itself is sooo good! But its sad hes like the only good big representation.. :(
@@harriyanna ik but its nickoldean so i thought id bring it up though, good show and decent written characters in the show. Plus cookie is so underrated.
I remember really being really bothered by how André was not any kind of romantic interest for any of the female main characters when he was probably the closest to Tori and trusted by all of them. It was all about Beck and even Robbie (the “nerd”) of the group being potential romantic partners. But they couldn’t even joke about André possibly liking one of the girls, especially Tori. Hmmmm..... wonder why that is....
Isaiah Gonzales oh you are correct! I totally forgot about that. I suppose looking back it was annoying that it was a bit of a one-off, never mentioned again which would still support my point. But, you’re right and that honestly IS a better look for the show
Morgan McCall they said it was supposed to be a one off episode tho. like they had no intention of continuing said André x Jade because the show was already ending and they just did it for fun.
I hard that Sam from ICarly was originally gonna be a black girl until they realized that it would be very problematic for the black girl to be in and out of prison
@@ihonestlydontevenknow4359 Yeah, in hindsight I should be realized Sam was a black stereotype, but I just saw her as a rebellious misbehaving character. God, I gave Sam a pass since she was a white blonde girl, didn't I?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in the first season of iCarly, wasn't there this one lil black boy in their class whose one joke was to make beatboxing noises?
@@origamishadow2655 knew I wasn't tripping lol. I only watched Dan Schneider shows when I was young, but seeing all this evidence next to each other is wild af... Can't believe this agenda being pushed onto kids smh
@@janaekelis I see it as It does fit in some Shows that dosen't make it right but I do agree its like that but yet any character can be given a stereotype that might cause problems thats my opinion Zuri Sassy Character fitted the show to me
I honestly don’t even think that’s much better cause like 50% of the time when they make a character that happens to be black, they end up with no arcs or care put into them bc the writers just have no idea what to do with the characters and they’re afraid of falling into stereotypes I.e Andre from Victorious and Nicole Beharie in Sleepy Hollow. I think what they need to do is hire more black writers, so ppl have a better template and range for good black characters.
There's also the one Victorious episode where she becomes the principal of the school, and she makes some comments about Beck being attractive, I think. There was actually a lot of instances of older women making comments about Beck, asking him if he was single, etc. Even once where a paramedic stops in the middle of taking Beck's dad to the hospital, to ask Beck 'Are you in college yet?' WHILE TOUCHING HIM. Really icky stuff. If it was grown men asking one of the female characters that, it would never make it past the censors.
I'm 29, so I'm not the audience for Henry Danger. However, I watched some episodes and Charlotte was the only good character. I thought she was adorable and funny and smart. I agree that she's a good role model for girls. Also, as a kid I knew that the bailiff character was off. I definitely think he gave off minstrel show vibes.
Wait so ur telling me if your 29 then you watched victorious at 19? Thats weird... When u were in college? And ur older than the whole!e victorious cast too.
The be fair almost every adult in Dan Schneider shows is an irresponsable/immature and/or a manchild. And in the Amanda Show skit all the girls are stereotypes
Yea what this girl is saying is so inaccurate. EVERYONE was a wacko! Its comedy! Clearly this girl in the video cant take a joke.I dont know where her head is at. Hardly anyone is portrayed as so clipped, proper, and well mannered. White or black if you cant take a joke and put on a goofy act you aren’t a match for comedy world plain and simple.
I agree literally every character is crazy in their own way. Andre from Victorious is probably the most reasonable, cool, and normal character yet he still was a GREAT character.
@Mikayla W they never said Indigenous people and Black people are the same? POC gotta stick together that's all, we consider fellow POC to be our brothers and sisters
Why is every black character LOUD? I noticed problems with Helen and some others when I was a little younger but I didn’t know if I was just reading into it too much. Sad this sticks with children and they don’t even realize it for years
Remember that time Sam hired a personal chef, and like, the actress was clearly Asian, but her name was Sonja (which sounds more Russian/Eastern European to me) and she pronounced blueberry muffins as "blubbery moofins" which just... isn't ANY accent at all, that I'm aware of? There's just no sensitivity at all, everyone in the Shneiderverse who isn't both white and American just gets painted with the same "inexplicably weird and foreign" brush
(this is just my opinion but) Yeah i’ve noticed that in a lot of Nick shows there’s only like 1 black person in the cast: Icarly: T Bo Victorious: Andre Drake & Josh: Helen Zoey101: Michael Big Time Rush: Kelly etc.
What about neds declassified school survival guide, "cookie" is one of the three main and he had awesome character development and was different from others :) (He was my fav too btw!) 😊
one day i realized, "wait: so *another* darkskinned girl obsesses over orlando brown in a disney channel show?" 🥴 i mean, i still think she's funny, but that was *real* sus :(
@@MelisaSmileyFace Again she is the aggressive one. I'm a dude and honestly I love a girl with a little kick. They did make her though a little too aggressive lol
Not trying to be a downer but what Sam said in iChristmas was... Sam: ‘what’s my favorite color?’ Carly: ‘brown’ Sam: ‘why?’ Carly: ‘it’s the color of gravy’ 😂😂 Which makes way more sense btw!
since this video is a bit lengthy, i will post the timestamps of what is discussed at different points in the video. racist comments said in his shows 4:50 the token black friend 6:32 black woman portrayal 9:44 black men portrayal 26:33 asian and latinx portrayal 35:35
This is an excellent analysis! Growing up as a white kid in a suburban town, it was easy to just turn a blind eye to how Schneider played up to black stereotypes and caricatures. Looking back at these shows, it’s especially true what you said about the black male best friend characters: they’re pretty much the same archetype. Granted, I always liked Michael from Zoey 101 and he was my favorite character on that show, but the writing itself for that character conformed to a lot of the same cliches that we see in another black male characters
harriyanna hook out of curiosity, would putting them word “racism” in the title of this video without using that @ symbol put it in jeopardy of being taken down? If so, that implies some very unsettling things about where TH-cam’s mindset is
@@somegurl8488 i get it, but why it had to be the black only adult who had to be soo off. Like she really was off off,I seen a couple episodes with my ex daughter n I was like wow....
disney channel has done the same thing , zuri from Jessie was overly sassy and her friend that starred on the show that one Michelle Obama episode wasn’t and she was light skinned . Nia on ravens home (lightskinned) is hella proper compared to the darkier skinned girls in the school or dance episodes . there’s also sooo many examples of that one “black friend” that Disney and Nickelodeon have both tried to throw in there shows and call it “diversity “ when each of the black friends have this rude , mean , personality like a stereotype
honestly i feel like it’s difficult to portray black people to black people. essentially we’re normal people and can be written like any other character. and i see andres grandma as crazy and black not crazy because she’s black. however i agree with you on andres girlfriends. and just about everything else. i just feel sometimes a character has a trope and happens to be black instead of being that way because their black.
I think it’s really difficult to write black characters as someone who isn’t black. If you write a black character the same way you would write a white character everyone says the character is unrealistic and isn’t relatable because they don’t deal with black struggles. If you write a black character who does deal with black struggles then everyone says the character is a stereotype and that not all black people are like that. I think for white writers it’s very hard to find a balance between the two and unfortunately that is what prevents them from including more black people in their shows and movies.
@@rayanneflorence1830 That unless you're black then its easier to write a black character I never thinking of what a black would act even tho I'm black myself I'm used to the stereotypes
I agree in the sense that, for example, Cat was also kinda "crazy" and so was her brother (who we never seen but I'm going to assume is white as her). The problem, I think, is when *every single Black female character* is crazy, or aggressive or hyper-s*xual, or generally portrayed in a negative manner. That's what I got from this video, at least.
There’s a difference between reaching and not getting facts straight. But I do agree with the overlooking thing, because everyone makes mistakes and they shouldn’t distract from the main points
Because the only real valid point here is that there should be more shows with black leads and main characters that actually have character development. I agree with that. But that could have been a 2 minute video. Literally every other point she made was either wrong, an opinion, or a reach.
TheFirstHurrah what? did we watch the same video? she made several good point here, like every black character is a harmful stereotype, you are saying way too much about how wrong she is but not giving any insight? like idk if you never faced seeing your race being portrayed as a mocking stereotype or what
@@sugarqcoat *Every* character in any of these shows can be considered some form of harmful stereotype if you reach hard enough. (Besides the main ones like Carly or Tori who have no personalities and are just there so the show can revolve around them.) These shows were about 'wacky' characters doing 'wacky' things, nothing more. These were not the shows to go to to find role models. And her acting as if they somehow should have been, is why I can't take any of her arguments seriously. Again, should there have been and be more shows featuring black leads? Sure. But acting like the shows that did exist (the *comedy* shows at that) are 'racist' every time a black character wasn't portrayed as a perfect being is a bit much, and a bit unproductive.
@@TheFirstHurrah I disagree with the "these were not shows to find role models" because icarly, victorious, sam & cat, etc are mostly watched by kids that don't even know what racism is. racism and stereotypes shouldn't be in kids shows, because these are the shows many children grew up with so they're basically teaching young children it's a normal thing and not something thats bad.
Everyone in this comment section go watch Taina. Beautiful, intelligent fun show with well rounded POC main characters. It absolutely blows that it was cancelled after 1 year. It's so weird to think that Nickelodeon had that in the early 2000s....but then went into a decline.
I'm surprised that you didn't mention the "Inconvenience Store" sketch from All That was Nick Cannon & Kenan Thomspon was in drag dress as "ghetto girls" with big weaves and acrylic nails.
I agree with everything you said except the Ed thing in Good Burger. I always say him as a black surfer dude. If you ever saw fast times at at ridgemont high school he's like the surfer character that was in that movie. But you might have a point that I'm not picking up on.
Can we also talk about the Asian racism with the sushi restaurant in Victorious. They literally have a scene where the owner makes Tori chop squid while singing a song about disappointing fathers. And the owner character is just an awful Asian stereotype.
i'm wondering if any of the black extras or actors/actresses will speak up if he was ever antiblack to them? And *that* could lead into *certain* actresses to expose for things that he most likely had done to them... 👀
@@harriyanna The actor, who played Burf on Victorious, Darsan Soloman came out and said earlier this month, he had experienced racism on set Here's the instagram link: instagram.com/p/CBBsxHnpmUY/?igshid=yb9hcbh9aks6
And all the Japanese characters who weren't evil were dumb, like the security guards and the front desk lady who was convinced that Carly and Freddie were a honeymooning couple (because... they were a boy and a girl and they approached the desk at the same time, I guess? Nevermind the fact that they're obviously 15. And the reservation they were asking about included two separate rooms.)
i didn't notice it before but a lot of black girl/women characters in tween tv shows are often made out to be sassy and aggresive, especially as side characters/cameos. writers might think it's a great idea for comedic purposes but a simple thing like that can cause impressionable children to have harmful perception of black women.
Couple of notes at the beginning of the video. 1. I wholeheartedly agree with the underlying racism in Dans shows. Andre on Victorious was the most talented one of the group. (He could sing, write, dance, play multiple instruments, and produce.) and he was always relegated to back up for everyone else save Beck... but Beck didn’t sing. 2. The iCarly Christmas thing is, unfortunately, wrong. Carly says it’s the color of ‘Gravy’ not ‘Crazy.’ Because Sam is obsessed with food. 3. The next point was about Yakama (pardon my misspelling), and they were only mocking it because the context of the episode was that of their Grandfather, who was from said town, wanting to take Carly from her friends and brother to live there. It was mostly said because Carly didn’t want to go, and she said it in a fit.
Yeah, I don't think they were making fun of the Indian Reservation. Living in Washington, and iCarly being set in Seattle, I bet they were talking about the city of Yakima not the Indian Reservation :)
i remember being little and watching Victorious when it first came out and thinking Andre was gonna be Tori’s love interest, like a best-friends-to-lovers kind of thing. don’t get me wrong, Andre deserves a LOT better than Tori, but in my little kid mind i thought “oh there’s two cute boys (Andre and Beck) and Beck already has a love interest, and Andre and Tori clearly have chemistry, this is gonna be so cute i can’t wait!” and then not understanding why it didn’t happen. and welp only in the last few years has it clicked that it’s probably bc it would’ve been ~controversial~ for a kid’s network to pair up the main girl with ‘the black friend’, bc i can’t rlly think of that many interracial couples in tv shows growing up, at least not pairing up black men with white women
this is disney, but the way leo from lab rats was treated in later seasons...and the way both he and his mom are treated to the annoying/useless eddy smart home system sucked :/ also, if you ever watched hannah montana, jackson had a snarky black guy friend...for like one or two seasons. And Miley's sassy black woman bodyguard who disappeared in season 3 or 4. 🥴
I remember the fact that they made the black character on The Amanda Show so aggressive made me uncomfortable. I’m white and I’ve had more experiences with aggressive white men than I’ve had with aggressive black women. Interesting.
Im not sure if anyone mentioned this already, but in iCarly when Sam's favorite color is brown, she says "because it's the color of *gravy*", not crazy. Not that this negates any of the other things Dan Schneider has done in his shows, but that joke was about Sam loving meat/food , not about poc being crazy. I hope this doesn't come off as rude or insensitive, i just noticed the line was misheard/misquoted and wanted to point it out
I was so naive as a kid, I mainly thought that the “sassy” characters were just an American thing With Sheila in the girls room I thought she was the tough one because she was a tomboy because of the way she dressed and her hair was alternative and punky And I thought Helen was mean because she hates her job as she used to be a famous actress and now she works in a movie theatre And I thought Andre was stereotypically “black” because he was chill and smooth and I guess that’s why they made him have a crazy grandma because it’s was a polar opposite to him and shows how chill and calm he can be even with all that going on
I thought exactly the same, but now I can realize that maybe it was racist purposely (but children will not see if they're not part of the black community)
"Hit it white girl" "I'm actually half latina" "Then Hit it Moo Cha Cha" Why did dan schneider have to bring up that the fact that the character tori is half latina and why didn't andre just say "Hit it tori" idk I just didn't like that
As a white person who grew up watching nickelodeon almost exclusively, I appreciate your analysis here and pointing out things I didn't notice growing up/was conditioned to think were normal. I do have a comment about Good Burger, though. I've read a few different analyses about Ed's character & looked into it myself extensively (but through a white lens, which is why I'm curious what your thoughts are), and it's been said that he's heavily coded to have autism (taking things literally all the time, childlike behavior, etc & later being shown at the end to have been intelligent the whole time/coming up with the whole plan that saves the day- and also being a really good friend to Dexter but that's probably not related). As someone with autism, I've looked to him for so many years as representation because seeing the way he actually saves the day in the end makes me so happy (and the movie itself is my go-to when I'm in a depressive episode- not so much a guilty pleasure cuz I'll shamelessly tell my roommates "ok we're watching this tonight" but I definitely feel you on that one). Oh, I know this is already long but I'm also curious about your thoughts on Monique because I've loved her & how she calls Dexter out on his bs the whole movie, especially with the contract & how she stands up for Ed and isn't actually shown forgiving Dexter in the end/needing a man. That's how I've seen her (through the white lens) so I'm curious what your thoughts are. Sorry this is so long, there are few things in life I love as much as this movie lol and ever since finding out about the "main" Dan Schneider scandal so to speak, I'm always trying to be a little more informed about it so I can enjoy it while still being critical.
hey I just wanted to say, if you haven't seen it, the Netflix show She-Ra has a really well-written canon autistic character named Entrapta (she's the character in my pfp). I really like her because she's smart and analytical, despite being autistic :)
i’m not black, but i am a minority. and i’m appalled by everything that just flew over my head. talk about underlying racism... i wish there was more content on yt like this. keep doing what you’re doing❤️
I remember one iCarly episode when Sam was insulting Freddy and she said "if you were a country, you would be El Salvador" (a country in Latin America) I mean... Was that necesary? Like they never stop throwing shit... I grew up watching that and I didn't realize either but as you do still like these programs (not as much as you do but still part of my childhood)
I never realized that; I guess I assumed they were Italian or Spanish. It's weird how half latinx characters were portrayed by white actors though. That was probably the cause of young me's lack of realization.
I'm not big into Schneider's work, for the most part, but this is such a great highlight of those little aggressions and how to pick them out in other works too. I appreciate all the work that went into this.
The fact that they made Trina(who is half latina) try to out scream Andre’s grandma is also annoying bc it feeds into that whole Latinos are loud and obnoxious stereotype
But you’re wrong about that, although Toris families heritage isn’t clear, their characters have no Hispanic heritage showing. So they’re not meant to portray any specific person, except a Californian.
Litterly I am not surprised I remember on that so Raven they make one of the bullies dark skin tall and aggressive and it wasn't cute it was actually offensive because she was the only dark skin in the group and they made her soo aggressive.
black beautiful Queen The whole bully group of that show were stereotypes that have been done millions of times before. The ditzy, vanilla blonde, bitchy chick and then the bitchy Latina. They were two basic bitches, with the one tough one. At least the black girl was different than the other two.
I don't think that was racism tho... That's so Raven even had a very eye opening episode on racism against black people. I actually thank that's so Raven because it educated me on black history month
@@nydiahendrixxx I get what your saying but it just annoying to see someone your skin tone to be pre trade as aggressive and loud I would say it was more of a stereotype than anything, and I do feel like that's so Raven did a good job on talking about Racism.
My sister and I used to discuss Tebo a lot. The actor is talented, but we also knew Tebo was very stereotypical. Especially considering he was the only main black character. They had a black principal for a bit, but he wasn't used as much. I don't think Tebo would have bothered me as much if the principal had shown up more. I know a lot of the shows had racist things, but for some reason iCarly always seemed to take it even further.
I get your point. Just wanted to add that Principal Franklin was not there "for a bit" he is literally the principal until the last season and makes appearances recurrently
@@unknownuser9909 He's not featured as much as Teb though. I think somehow they should have had a connection. Like Tebo could have been the principal's nephew.
@@unknownuser9909 To add to my comment. If they had both been featured equally it would have balanced things out. As for my family tie idea. Since the cast is small I thought it would be a good idea. To keep things together.
I don’t know, the main black characters in these shows are usually fan favorites. Yeah they usually had some token features, and sometimes shit was outright like “wow” looking back-but I can’t name one person I know who didn’t love Helen, T Bone, or especially Andre.
I think most people like them bc their black characters and you don’t really see them often in nick shows. So we take what we can get whether it’s stereotypical or not.
@@nylahearl5003 lmao that's so not true and such a weird thing to say. Isn't saying that people like them just because they are black characters basically stating that that their whole character trait is their blackness? Wtf. Like no, I think people like them because they are interesting and cool.
Helen was actually my favorite character on drake and josh and I feel like she’s the only middle aged black woman I can think of on nick/disney sitcoms. Andre’s grandma was only funny for like 2 episodes and then it got old fast. There’s something very dark sided about Dan Schneider shows, at least in hindsight. I wasn’t actually allowed to watch icarly as a kid because of how rude and disrespectful they were (but I did anyway 🤫)
Crazy all these flew way past my head when I was such a kid. Andre was a more unique character than Beck and Robbie sucks he wasn’t as utilize as good as he should have been.
To be fair on iCarly all the grown men on that show acted like a child. Spencer acted like a child. You had the weird guy front desk guy at their apartment who acted weird and if not acting like a child he certainly wasn't acting like an adult. That's just kind of how their show was regardless for laughs. If it was any other show I'd agree with you on that. But not on iCarly where adults acted child like a lot. Lol.
I’m pretty sure that in the iCarly episode, Carly says that Sam’s favorite color was brown because “It’s the color of gravy.” But yeah, these shows are not great at representing people of color.
Just to play devils advocate, andres girlfriend’s personality is also portrayed my white women even more (the rich mean girl (I.e Regina George, sharpay evans) but you’re right that black women should not always have to play agressive or catty characters and should be allowed development and variety
I think the problem is that out of all the main or side characters they had on the show, they thought a black actress was the best option to cast in that role.
Sam said "because it's the color of gravy" not "crazy." But yeah it's insane looking back on these shows seeing the racist tendencies I didn't pick up on as a kid.
I'm so glad you're talking about this. This topic covers a lot of ground: stereotypes (and several different ones), representation, bad writing, and so on. I had noticed a few years back, when I was thinking about The Girls Room, "hang on... Sheila's that Sassy Black Woman stereotype! That's lame." After seeing the clips of her and the Baliff you included in your video, I couldn't help noticing that both characters are "Amanda's character's designated Black "muscle" minion who roughhouses people she doesn't like so she as a tiny White girl isn't portrayed as getting her hands dirty." (I'm blaming the writers for this, not Amanda. She was little back then. She had no control over the material.) Thank you for talking about the dearth of Asian and Latinx representation. As soon as you brought it up, I immediately thought, "Hang on, all the Asian people work in food service, and they're always from the same three countries that exist in Hollywood Asia." I don't know how you would comment on Dana Cruz and Lola Martinez as Latina representation, especially since Dana was on Zoey 101 for only one season. If I recall correctly, she was the most athletic and most aggressive of the girls, which carries echoes of the "brown girls are more aggressive than white girls" stereotype. As far as I know, Lola's portrayal was fine (if bare because if you didn't know her last name you couldn't be sure if she was Latina), but I welcome discussion on that! By the way, were Tori and Trina Vega supposed to be Latina? I don't know because I never watched "Victorious."
i felt like with Andre, someone set him up as a cool, great, kind character, but someone just didn't want him to be too successful. they didn't want him to outshine anybody. also the episode with the asian restaurant owner was just uncomfortable for me. the whole thing was like a modern day racist caricature.
I heard a rumor that Sam had a rough home life because originally, her character was supposed to be black before McCurdy was cast. On top of that, I have to give Butch Hartman the side eye for (as well as several other reasons) making Tucker's color scheme based off the Jamacian flag. And as much as I love Valerie for having the best character development and being a total badass, I (as a white person) feel like she was probably portrayed with the "angry, loud black woman" stereotype, and it doesn't help the fact that she and Tucker were the only black characters with any story significance. I can't say for sure because it's not my place to, but at the very least, it's sketchy to me for sure. Edit: Oh yeah, I also forgot to mention the way they colored background/minor asian characters in DP was definitely racist. There was a girl in the beginning of "13" going on a date(?) with Tucker, and her skin is straight up yellow. There was also a boy and another girl character around 35:23 of "The Ultimate Enemy". The boy isn't as much of a caricature, though he is also yellow. But the girl is probably the worst I've seen. As well as yellow skin, she had sideways lines for eyes.
I definitely have to disagree with you about Ed. His character was actually unique... How many black dumb surfer dude characters do you know? Typically they are all white. I feel like his character is similar to Urkel or Carlton... A universal character type that was not previously portrayed as being black before the 90's. The character's color actually didn't matter because anyone could play that role. His character is not based on an black stereotypes or essentially based on the skin color of the actor. He's just... Him, Ed. It's true color blind casting. There was some good points here but others I feel like were reaching, the modern sjw culture now is making sure we're offended by like everything especially trivial stuff that doesn't affect true injustice and I can't stand it and I'm a black woman. There's sooo much racism behind and in front of the camera and Dan is overall scummy and sucked at writing black characters but honestly I'm more offended by how our own people are portraying ourselves in rap and other ways rn (WAP as a representation of black women as an example). We gotta stop with this victim complex and invest in black media or work towards doing more in entertainment instead of complaining and looking for grievances. Edit: here's a video on why dumb characters exist since they're apparently offensive now in any context (on black shows by a black channel) th-cam.com/video/8mYuUyxI5ME/w-d-xo.html
I agree with you for the most part, but I disagree that WAP is a 'representation of black women' bc its not, it can pertain to any woman. And while I agree not everything is meant to be taken offensively, it is not a 'victim complex' bc as a black woman you should know there are real injustices, as you mentioned, in the media & everyday life. We can create more outlets for ourselves while also calling out certain injustices as well
This is the video I needed!!! Looking back on these shows they did and still do us dirty. I'm starting to do more calling out of those in the industry on my channel as well and girl if you are ever in Chicago I'll hire you to act in a heartbeat 💜
@@harriyanna it really is and they don't care, I have a video coming out later today about how they treated the black Frozen Broadway actors and how they felt so discriminated against they started a hastag called #TheaterInColor so black people and poc can tell their stories about how they've been treated less than. We have to keep calling them out.
![[안방1열 직캠4K] 베이비몬스터 치키타 'DRIP' (BABYMONSTER CHIQUITA FanCam) @SBS Inkigayo 241110](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tnlxo79cAqY/mqdefault.jpg)
One of my favorite characters was Principal Franklin from Icarly. He wasn't a stereotype. They never brought up his skin color. He wasn't a black principal, he was a principal that happened to be black. He was a great character and deeply cared about the students and school
Same. I found him to be a very likable character.
So sad that the teachers belittled him
Josie Parker I could never understand as to why his boss fired him for being on iCarly. He clearly stated on there that he wanted to be on the show for his daughter because she loved the show and wanted to give her a great surprise for her birthday. It just seems so heartless of his boss to have fired him over doing something fun and heartwarming for his daughter and it wasn’t like he said or did anything inappropriate on the webshow.
principal franklin is a KING
he always gave me Barack Obama tease... like he had his EXACT personality and respectable fun nature
I feel like one of the most disgusting things about Andre is that his actor (Leon Thomas III) written some of the music for the episodes like “Song 2 You” and wasn’t even credited which is so sad because songs like that are still memorable 10 years later.
Woooow 😮 I didn’t even know that
Shelby me either until recently when I looked at the comment section of “Song 2 You” and people were saying it. It’s just really sad.
do u know which other songs he wrote for the show?? if he isn't credited anywhere else id love to at least know which ones were his
I had heard that Leon Thomas the 3rd wrote on Ariana Grande's 1st cd. he produced or something. I remember ina clip she was thanking him for helping her cd.
He’s so talented too
Honestly Andre was the only one in that group that was good boyfriend material but they never put him together with any of the girls in the group. Lost potential 😑
Yeah wish I could get a guy like Andre he’s so chill
They didn’t and they should have. They wasted the show.
Prob bc he was black sadly. It makes me mad
I feel like if the show wasn't cancelled he probably would've ended up with tori
@@patrickmicah5913 😭 idk y but I can’t really see him with Tori, I ship him with Jade and imagine that in the end Jade and Beck would’ve thankfully broke up for good and she went and got with Andre after all, they would make such a perfect couple so long as Jade Mellows out more and Andre learns to stop being scared of her and idk maybe Beck and Tori could’ve gotten together but that prolly wouldn’t happen so long as Tori asks Jade first and Jade approves since Tori didn’t want to do that to at least a half friend
I always assumed Andre’s parents were dead because he always seemed like the most mature character. Like he had to grow up fast. But the show should’ve clarified to better flesh out his character.
@@eph_loves_80s74 he's the most sensible in all of the group. Lot of the character in victorious do dumb things and sorta unlikable at times, but andre was always smart about everything
@@eph_loves_80s74 When has Andre had anger issues and threatened poeple? Just asking. Because I always remembered him as the most laidback and sensible one of the group. Can you name instances?
Ephraim Nana Antwi he does not have anger issues lol. If anyone does, it’s jade
@@insearchofthemoon Lmao that's what I was thinking. He's just describing Jade.
@@eph_loves_80s74 dude I think you just hate andre and beck because nobody even likes beck, and andre has just started getting popular. You're taking this way too seriously too.
True Jackson VP was the best show Nickelodeon ever made. That’s how a black woman should be represented
Too bad it was boring😴
if only they did reruns smh
The idea and actors were great, but they managed to make none of the situations memorable.
Exactly
Acey Michaelis they acually to reruns of true Jackson vp on Teennick but it’s usally at night
I'm black, I remember growing up and lots of people would tell me I'm acting "white" because I was never aggressive or mean. I was always friendly and social.
I'm black too and go threw the same thing and it was always white people that told me that
Same I’m black pretty smart I would say and always quiet unless I know you . Also I talk pretty properly compres to people my age . So people always called me preppy /act white . Like my friends literally made fun of me for going to college and being smart .😂😂
@@ChefDeeRock i don't really talk preppy but i remember a white dude said I was actin white and i said why cause i don't do illegal shit and sag my pants and he said yea
I’m black too and I have been told that I act white or I’m white washed and it’s always the white people in my school who say that
they’d tell me that i’ve been “whitewashed” or that i sound and act white. what does that mean? i’m black and have always been black, am i less of a black woman because i’m not loud, aggressive, and “ghetto” like the stereotypes they portray us as?
Everyone talks about how Jade and Cat were the best on Victorious but honestly, Andre was amazing. He was cool, funny, and literally the best friend you could ever have. He wrote Make it Shine for Trina but actually Tori, he helped her get into Hollywood Arts, and was hardly ever mean unless he needed to be. His grandma was funny as well. You can tell me whatever, but in the end, Andre was the best to me.
People only say Cat and Jade cause they hate Tori or like those characters better tbh
De'lahn Day exactly!!
How is Cat the best character? She’s a dumb girl. She was MUCH better in season 1
Facts
slondey omg you’re my long lost twin
it always annoyed me how the friend group would always date each other but the black character was always excluded from that? like, it's already bad enough that there was only one main black character but the fact that they were never involved in the romantic plotlines? as if they weren't dateable or couldn't date people who aren't black? also I always felt they were somehow plotting for Andre to get with Tori but no matter how much they connected is like they couldn't get together? and that she got with Beck on that half-assed poorly done arc
I heard they were going to do an Andre and Tori relationship had they had another season but they decided against it because it had a multi episode arch and they didn't have time for that so they stuck to the one episode arch's
Cuddle Bunny o wow I could definitely tell that they would’ve been a couple or at least kissed
I think Tori and Andre never dated because of the racism the show had. But thank God they didn't! I didn't like Tori's character and I don't think it might have worked. Andre was too good for her
Then they are not friends.
You hit the nail on the head tbh.
y’all just need to understand that diversity isn’t
👩🏼👩🏼🧑🏻🧑🏼🧑🏽🦱
it’s more like
👩🏼🧑🏽🧑🏿🦱👩🏻🦰🧕🏽
TY!
Why can't y'all just leave producers have control of what they want in THEIR show?
@@connor_1x1x1x1 Everyone has the right to critique media, especially when it pushes harmful narratives and exclusion.
@@francesmiklovic5624 very well said!
Diversity doesn't count if the characters are still being portrayed as stereotypes or tropes!! Thank you for saying that, I feel like people who aren't part of a minority group don't realize this. You need to have diversity on a show AND have your diverse characters be multi-dimensional people and not just toss them in the background of a show.
I feel like a lot of people in the comments aren't really getting the point, because you're criticizing their favorite childhood shows. When I watched these shows when I was younger, most of the points you mentioned went over my head. But now that I've been exposed to different tropes/stereotypes of black people through educating myself and am older, it's very obvious to me that most of these shows are very negative in their depictions of black people
Hello im not black but im half white Caucasian and everybodys portraits Caucasians basically as a Russian stareotype if they are ever shown most of em are just sit atill look pretty
I very much agree with you here. I'm not a person of color, but I'm part of the LGBTQ community and I'm neurodiverse (ADHD and autistic).
Basically, any character that doesn't fit the, white, straight, cisgender, neurotypical... box is either created to, "make a statement," earn brownie points, or be a caricature of a minority group (usually as the butt of the joke, or as the, "wacky sidekick!" character).
Like... if these people can't write someone different from themselves in a respectful and educated way, then they need to just not try and let someone else take over.
Yeah someone upthread described Principal Franklin as being like Obama "fun and respectable" and that could rub someone the wrong way.
Why should creators care about diversity?
Imma need for them to realize being black is not a personality trait
To many people being black is their personality
@@jsorn433soriano2 identity and personality are not the same thing.
Jsorn433 Soriano so true, most black girls in my Highschool act like being black is their whole personality, and put me down for not “acting” black
@@jillmont3342 me too and then i feel like i don't belong anywhere because i don't "act black" but i'm also not white :(
@@jillmont3342 she said BEING BLACK not ACTING BLACK
Andre was CRIMINALLY underappreciated in Victorious... He sang, wrote, played and acted well, was funny, kind, smart, reasonable and caring. And gorgeous. I absolutely hated "Andre's Horrible Girlfriend" because him dating a girl to get a record deal from her dad just didn't seem like him. Sure, everybody does bad stuff and is an asshole sometimes, but it was so OOC for him to do that, which is a shame because I thought I would love an episode centered around him.
Also as soon as you mentioned the representation of Asians in his shows I thought of the owner of Wok Star (the Chinese restaurant) and Nozu (the sushi place). Also she had "broken" english which could be fine but in the context of the show it was always used to get the audience to laugh at her expense, never with her. I can't remember her having an actual funny line, she was always the butt of the joke.
Andre and Michael being the only black main characters on their respective shows always rubbed me the wrong way but I could never further elaborate on that. I'm so glad you made this to point everything out.
Yeah
About asians, the whole episode of Icarly in Japan is a disgusting stereotype of yellow peril yikes
In the episode about his girlfriend, besides the fact he uses her cause of her father, he LAUGHS when something falls on her head at the end of the episode.
i hate the whole “that one black friend” concept... it’s so dumb and unnecessary wtf
SAME
YES!! The same goes with the "gay best friend" concept.
@@dizzifulclown_ YES! And then they make them so stereotypical like the black character will always be sassy, or the gay one will always be feminine
I like the concept of having a black friend as a best friend, or someone close to the main character, or the actual main character, but I hate it with a burning passion when they're usually just there . . to fill out the "black person." bUt the character ends up being some static character that we barely get to know and connect to. They're just there for the sake of "diversity."
for example: Andre. He's such a good character. That's how you do it.
If I remember correctly I think Carly said ‘brown is the colour of gravy’ not crazy
Yes, that's correct. Gravy not crazy
Yeah she's reaching in this video it seems. She also talked about black men on the show acting child like but what grown men on the show didn't act child like? Spencer was child like and so was the front desk man at their apartment. Lol.
I misheard. i always thought that's what she said. thank you for correcting me. i put a note the des box about it.
I love me some gravy
@@jessicamargadeleon2277 same
and don't forget that black boy in icarly whose only dialogue was beatboxing??? he didn't even have a memorable name 😭
Andre was the star of the show he deserved more
To be honest i would have love to see the development of the relationship between andre and jade
Because personality wise they seem to click.
Andre had hella potential but sadly arianna was the star.
I agree. Loved André he’s such a cutie❤️❤️❤️😭
Only real one
only one who could sing and write good music.
Also most of the parents don't appear on the show. Tori's mom is apparently is cheating on her dad, Beck lives in a trailer to not follow his parents rules, Jade is estranged from her dad, Cat's parents are speculated to ignore her to focus on her insane brother and Robbie's parents are as far as i know never mentioned. I think he also lives with is grandma
Yea they don’t have good adult role models has nothing to do with race lol
And if the parents are shown there made to seem dumb
Dan Schnider said that he doesn't want to focus on adults and wants to focus on the kids. Kids seemingly being in control of their lives is kinda like wishfuffilment when you are watching as a kid.
They all had broken homes it seems. Andre’s gma was the most stable parent compared to them all.
Cat's family situation was just so sad...
He's like Shane Dawson except he makes tv shows instead of youtube videos.
and he's F A T
@@nachelle_h9767 Shane used to be F A T to lol.
@@chasityslocum4032 yea lets body-shame, cuz thats fun too😑. Also at least Shane apologized for ALL of the bad things he did when he was younger. He grew up, he changed, he def learned his lesson and apologized; opposed to ppl who do this kind of stuff and have NEVER mentioned it, nor apologized. Also, the bad things that Shane had done was from YEARS ago and was randomly brought up (most likely for clout) so in the timespan of 2008-2020, isn't it possible for someone to change? Anyways my point is that at least Shane addressed the problems and said he's sorry ; unlike Dan who (as far as i remember) never did.
@я хорни lol imagine not having a heart🤭😂🤭😂🤭. imagine having mistakes you've made years ago, pulled up again just so ppl can have something to talk about😂😂🤭. imagine having to apologize for them countless of times because they keep getting dug up for clout🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭. Imagine not forgiving somebody for mistakes they've made from 12 years ago, tho they've apologized and grown from them😂😂😂😂. For me, i forgive him because he admitted to those mistakes, apologized for them (plenty of times), and i can tell he learned and grown from those mistakes. That's enough for me. Idk what more y'all want from him jeez. Plus i was 8 when that one situation happened and i am 20 now😑 proves how old this situation is.
@я хорни lol wow ok😂😂😂
K.C undercover they made the little sister sassy. K.C wasn't really sassy. Disney really only did it to Dark skin women
Zendaya was the second hand producer of that show-
That was the media in general.
Well I think its conicedence. I mean you need to have sassy characters because they are funny or it would be too sanitized and white people are sassy too. Then again It would be pretty racist to say only light skined people can be jerks. I think its best to stop spliting hairs and enjoy the show.
@@icecreamhero2375
It's kinda hard to brush it off as a coincidence when literally the only representation of black women in a show with very few black women in it always has a pattern of being sassy, mean, rude and aggressive...
The thing about KC Undercover is that Zendaya had to fight to even get the show to center on a family of color, anyway. I really liked Judy because she still had a soft side to her, as did KC (and KC was sassy...? Just not as much)
I feel some characters like andre were well grounded even though he was only there to be the black best friend of tori. And Andres grandma was a schizophrenic so that was why she was always screaming and paranoid.
But andres girlfriends were horrible ill give you that
Well then we add in the ableist aspect of "mentally ill people shouldn't be the punchline"
@@AtlanticGiantPumpkin THANK YOU IM TIRED OF SEEING THINGS LIKE THAT. I know kids won't really understand that what they're laughing at is wrong but it's ADULTS that right them as jokes.
@@AtlanticGiantPumpkin on TOP of ablelism they always make black ppl crazy in tv shows
@@AtlanticGiantPumpkin
every single character had mental issues in this show
I think his grandmother has PTS
One black character that was VERY well written and that i love is "cookie" from neds declassified school survival guide. :)
Hes one of the 3 mains, intelligent/ nerdy, good hearted, funny character.
Hes different from others thats why i like him! :D hes a good representation! I felt hes more of the star of the show, and the show itself is sooo good! But its sad hes like the only good big representation..
:(
dan didn't make ned's declassifed.
@@harriyanna ik but its nickoldean so i thought id bring it up though, good show and decent written characters in the show.
Plus cookie is so underrated.
@@harriyanna 23:00. Danger force got two black character
@@harriyanna that explains why it was actually good 🤷🏽♀️
@@harriyanna thank god he didn't. at the least one unproblematic nickelondeon tv show.
I remember really being really bothered by how André was not any kind of romantic interest for any of the female main characters when he was probably the closest to Tori and trusted by all of them. It was all about Beck and even Robbie (the “nerd”) of the group being potential romantic partners. But they couldn’t even joke about André possibly liking one of the girls, especially Tori. Hmmmm..... wonder why that is....
They had an entire episode about Andre liking Jade tho
Isaiah Gonzales oh you are correct! I totally forgot about that. I suppose looking back it was annoying that it was a bit of a one-off, never mentioned again which would still support my point. But, you’re right and that honestly IS a better look for the show
Morgan McCall they said it was supposed to be a one off episode tho. like they had no intention of continuing said André x Jade because the show was already ending and they just did it for fun.
@@morganmccall4357 it was mentioned again though
They have an unaired and undubed clip of Andre and Jade arguing thenn kiss.
i always thought Andre and Tori would be so good together lol
haha i still ship them
I always and still ship them haha
RIGHT WHY DIDNT THAT HAPPEN.
Lindsey Kindsey they were probably afraid of being looked down on for making an interracial couple.
No Jade and Andre
I hard that Sam from ICarly was originally gonna be a black girl until they realized that it would be very problematic for the black girl to be in and out of prison
They could have rewrote the script in that case
@@blessedwithpink1440 true.
No way 🙎🏾♀️
No fucking way… I knew she was a stereotypical black character in a way, but holy shit.
@@ihonestlydontevenknow4359 Yeah, in hindsight I should be realized Sam was a black stereotype, but I just saw her as a rebellious misbehaving character. God, I gave Sam a pass since she was a white blonde girl, didn't I?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in the first season of iCarly, wasn't there this one lil black boy in their class whose one joke was to make beatboxing noises?
1KGLOMAR yes
@@origamishadow2655 knew I wasn't tripping lol. I only watched Dan Schneider shows when I was young, but seeing all this evidence next to each other is wild af... Can't believe this agenda being pushed onto kids smh
i remember that!
and then they actually used him as a distraction in i get detention? oh yeah, i remember that
YES
on Jessie they made Zuri very sassy
I didn't really see a problem with that
jessie wasn't made by dan schneider lmao?
Yeah bc black women being sassy is a basic stereotype
@@xskelux1600 its an issue bc it shows no matter how old, those producers will see black folk as "funny" stereotypes
@@janaekelis I see it as It does fit in some Shows that dosen't make it right but I do agree its like that but yet any character can be given a stereotype that might cause problems thats my opinion Zuri Sassy Character fitted the show to me
If there was more positive portrayals of black people then the negative ones wouldn’t matter as much. That’s the issue.
Yes!
I get u.
true
But his foot fetishes and recent scandals.
Make a character that happens to be black, not a black character.
SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PRODUCERS IN THE BACK🙈
I honestly don’t even think that’s much better cause like 50% of the time when they make a character that happens to be black, they end up with no arcs or care put into them bc the writers just have no idea what to do with the characters and they’re afraid of falling into stereotypes I.e Andre from Victorious and Nicole Beharie in Sleepy Hollow.
I think what they need to do is hire more black writers, so ppl have a better template and range for good black characters.
THIS.
FACTS
@@sigh824 or, treat them the same as white people. write a role and have them fill it instead of writting the role based on them.
For the brown comment in icarly she says it’s the color of gravy not crazy.
lol yeah xd
shine she addressed it in the description
Did you ever notice that Helen came across as having the hots for Drake Bell? He was a teenage boy at the time.
He was like 18 or so tho lol by the time Helen came into the show so it don’t count as nun bad
There's also the one Victorious episode where she becomes the principal of the school, and she makes some comments about Beck being attractive, I think. There was actually a lot of instances of older women making comments about Beck, asking him if he was single, etc. Even once where a paramedic stops in the middle of taking Beck's dad to the hospital, to ask Beck 'Are you in college yet?' WHILE TOUCHING HIM. Really icky stuff. If it was grown men asking one of the female characters that, it would never make it past the censors.
@@quentinflacko24 where did you hear that from?
@@hypnosia1851 i just looked it up. Drake was 16 in seasons 1 and 2, 17 in season 3, 18 in season 4 and 20 in the Christmas special.
@@cherishxoxo2738 I'm curious too
I'm 29, so I'm not the audience for Henry Danger. However, I watched some episodes and Charlotte was the only good character. I thought she was adorable and funny and smart. I agree that she's a good role model for girls. Also, as a kid I knew that the bailiff character was off. I definitely think he gave off minstrel show vibes.
Same Im 24 and Henry Danger is after my time.
Wait so ur telling me if your 29 then you watched victorious at 19? Thats weird... When u were in college? And ur older than the whole!e victorious cast too.
@@helpmegetto10kwithnovideos81 Is this supposed to be a problem?
@@helpmegetto10kwithnovideos81 how that weird?
I like Charlotte too but they never listen to her and that makes me mas
The be fair almost every adult in Dan Schneider shows is an irresponsable/immature and/or a manchild. And in the Amanda Show skit all the girls are stereotypes
True 🤔
The one special ed girl. I like eggs.
Spencer was dumb and acted like a child as well, so did lewbert, the teachers... yeah everyone. Calling T bo out for it was kinda weird
Yea what this girl is saying is so inaccurate. EVERYONE was a wacko! Its comedy! Clearly this girl in the video cant take a joke.I dont know where her head is at. Hardly anyone is portrayed as so clipped, proper, and well mannered. White or black if you cant take a joke and put on a goofy act you aren’t a match for comedy world plain and simple.
I agree literally every character is crazy in their own way. Andre from Victorious is probably the most reasonable, cool, and normal character yet he still was a GREAT character.
As a native american I see sly racism every where. I always loved my black brothers and sisters callin out these "producers" in media.
Same💯
@Mikayla W omg there's always one of yall😐
@Mikayla W they never said Indigenous people and Black people are the same? POC gotta stick together that's all, we consider fellow POC to be our brothers and sisters
@Mikayla W now, normally i’d agree. however, Black people & Indigenous are more so on the same level in comparison to the other people of colour.
What are they say now I am curious
always felt like Tori and Andre would've been an amazing couple but the showrunners didn't want to do a mixed race relationship or something :/
I mean beck is indian though and he was with jade and almost tori
I hated tori and jade. Andre was the best
@@magicmnms101 is he brown though? No. And they also have Indians that are brown.... soooo....
exactly, the only interracial relationship was andre and tara for one episode :/ i know avan is half indian, but idk if beck is so im not counting him
@@hostilehunnybunx3707 I mean he's clearly not white
Why is every black character LOUD? I noticed problems with Helen and some others when I was a little younger but I didn’t know if I was just reading into it too much. Sad this sticks with children and they don’t even realize it for years
That's all they think we are
i know, as a poc im like the quietest in my group. i never understand that.
@@lolluhric8351 same, im black and generally a quiet girl lol
Remember that time Sam hired a personal chef, and like, the actress was clearly Asian, but her name was Sonja (which sounds more Russian/Eastern European to me) and she pronounced blueberry muffins as "blubbery moofins" which just... isn't ANY accent at all, that I'm aware of?
There's just no sensitivity at all, everyone in the Shneiderverse who isn't both white and American just gets painted with the same "inexplicably weird and foreign" brush
Was that from icarly or sam&cat
@@allencampbell1058 Icarly
@@allencampbell1058 icarly techfoot episode
I know a girl named Sonia and she's from Singapore so..
(this is just my opinion but)
Yeah i’ve noticed that in a lot of Nick shows there’s only like 1 black person in the cast:
Icarly: T Bo
Victorious: Andre
Drake & Josh: Helen
Zoey101: Michael
Big Time Rush: Kelly
etc.
In KC undercover the full main cast is all black with 1 white person. Seems weird right?
What about neds declassified school survival guide, "cookie" is one of the three main and he had awesome character development and was different from others :)
(He was my fav too btw!) 😊
@@payt00n I like how they don't use their skin as their personality
@@zarambagwu3033 yeah same
@Caleb Mayfield cause it seems like a pattern between each show
Can we talk about how on Thats so raven they made that one darkskin girl aggressive and a bully
one day i realized, "wait: so *another* darkskinned girl obsesses over orlando brown in a disney channel show?" 🥴
i mean, i still think she's funny, but that was *real* sus :(
I WAS JUST THINKING ABOUT THIS THE OTHER DAY
Loca her nick name literally was crazy chick 😖😖😖
@Marisa Againeses but they always used loca as the abusive one. remember when she dated eddie she would always hit him
@@MelisaSmileyFace Again she is the aggressive one. I'm a dude and honestly I love a girl with a little kick. They did make her though a little too aggressive lol
It’s crazy how they made Andre happier with lighter girls then darker girls
That has nothing to do with anything
@@tamagomann it does...it literally relates to racism....did you miss the whole topic of the video?
@@imblack5026 can i ask how? Not saying your wrong jus wondering where you came to that conclusion
didn’t he date a darkskin in the show?
@@_4ui12 yea but she was acting weird like they made her crazy
Not trying to be a downer but what Sam said in iChristmas was... Sam: ‘what’s my favorite color?’ Carly: ‘brown’ Sam: ‘why?’ Carly: ‘it’s the color of gravy’ 😂😂 Which makes way more sense btw!
Lol yeah she corrected herself in the description
since this video is a bit lengthy, i will post the timestamps of what is discussed at different points in the video.
racist comments said in his shows 4:50
the token black friend 6:32
black woman portrayal 9:44
black men portrayal 26:33
asian and latinx portrayal 35:35
Thank u!!!
pls pin this
I’m surprised you didn’t bring up how often they made fun of Jamaicans on iCarly. That always rubbed me the wrong way
yea, and how every food “was on a stick”
@@trinity938 that's the joke of T-boo
Also thiers a lot of Mexican jokes
And Canada
@@valle1581 oh yeah
This is an excellent analysis! Growing up as a white kid in a suburban town, it was easy to just turn a blind eye to how Schneider played up to black stereotypes and caricatures. Looking back at these shows, it’s especially true what you said about the black male best friend characters: they’re pretty much the same archetype. Granted, I always liked Michael from Zoey 101 and he was my favorite character on that show, but the writing itself for that character conformed to a lot of the same cliches that we see in another black male characters
like michael and andre had the same personality, the only difference was that andre made music
harriyanna hook out of curiosity, would putting them word “racism” in the title of this video without using that @ symbol put it in jeopardy of being taken down? If so, that implies some very unsettling things about where TH-cam’s mindset is
Andre’s Grandma was such a great actress let’s be honest
nah she just has Dementia or Schizophrenia and robbies grandma was loud and weird ass help
I did not like that the only black adult on tht show was bat shit crazy
@@jiberish9396 Yea me neither
@@somegurl8488 i get it, but why it had to be the black only adult who had to be soo off. Like she really was off off,I seen a couple episodes with my ex daughter n I was like wow....
Fr now that I think about it
disney channel has done the same thing , zuri from Jessie was overly sassy and her friend that starred on the show that one Michelle Obama episode wasn’t and she was light skinned . Nia on ravens home (lightskinned) is hella proper compared to the darkier skinned girls in the school or dance episodes . there’s also sooo many examples of that one “black friend” that Disney and Nickelodeon have both tried to throw in there shows and call it “diversity “ when each of the black friends have this rude , mean , personality like a stereotype
honestly i feel like it’s difficult to portray black people to black people. essentially we’re normal people and can be written like any other character. and i see andres grandma as crazy and black not crazy because she’s black. however i agree with you on andres girlfriends. and just about everything else. i just feel sometimes a character has a trope and happens to be black instead of being that way because their black.
Yeah thats what I feel
In most of cases I agree! Many characters are just characters
I think it’s really difficult to write black characters as someone who isn’t black. If you write a black character the same way you would write a white character everyone says the character is unrealistic and isn’t relatable because they don’t deal with black struggles. If you write a black character who does deal with black struggles then everyone says the character is a stereotype and that not all black people are like that. I think for white writers it’s very hard to find a balance between the two and unfortunately that is what prevents them from including more black people in their shows and movies.
@@rayanneflorence1830 That unless you're black then its easier to write a black character I never thinking of what a black would act even tho I'm black myself I'm used to the stereotypes
I agree in the sense that, for example, Cat was also kinda "crazy" and so was her brother (who we never seen but I'm going to assume is white as her).
The problem, I think, is when *every single Black female character* is crazy, or aggressive or hyper-s*xual, or generally portrayed in a negative manner. That's what I got from this video, at least.
It's annoying to see people overlooking all of the good points in this video because there are a few reaching ones.
There’s a difference between reaching and not getting facts straight. But I do agree with the overlooking thing, because everyone makes mistakes and they shouldn’t distract from the main points
Because the only real valid point here is that there should be more shows with black leads and main characters that actually have character development. I agree with that. But that could have been a 2 minute video.
Literally every other point she made was either wrong, an opinion, or a reach.
TheFirstHurrah what? did we watch the same video? she made several good point here, like every black character is a harmful stereotype, you are saying way too much about how wrong she is but not giving any insight? like idk if you never faced seeing your race being portrayed as a mocking stereotype or what
@@sugarqcoat *Every* character in any of these shows can be considered some form of harmful stereotype if you reach hard enough. (Besides the main ones like Carly or Tori who have no personalities and are just there so the show can revolve around them.)
These shows were about 'wacky' characters doing 'wacky' things, nothing more. These were not the shows to go to to find role models. And her acting as if they somehow should have been, is why I can't take any of her arguments seriously.
Again, should there have been and be more shows featuring black leads? Sure. But acting like the shows that did exist (the *comedy* shows at that) are 'racist' every time a black character wasn't portrayed as a perfect being is a bit much, and a bit unproductive.
@@TheFirstHurrah I disagree with the "these were not shows to find role models" because icarly, victorious, sam & cat, etc are mostly watched by kids that don't even know what racism is. racism and stereotypes shouldn't be in kids shows, because these are the shows many children grew up with so they're basically teaching young children it's a normal thing and not something thats bad.
Everyone in this comment section go watch Taina. Beautiful, intelligent fun show with well rounded POC main characters. It absolutely blows that it was cancelled after 1 year.
It's so weird to think that Nickelodeon had that in the early 2000s....but then went into a decline.
I'm surprised that you didn't mention the "Inconvenience Store" sketch from All That was Nick Cannon & Kenan Thomspon was in drag dress as "ghetto girls" with big weaves and acrylic nails.
That was funny
BizcliZ23 it might’ve been funny but it’s not how black ppl want to be portrayed
@@tianaalmond70 Never watched that one. Sounds like I made a good passive choice.
The MISOGYNOIR in that sketch 😑
I agree with everything you said except the Ed thing in Good Burger. I always say him as a black surfer dude. If you ever saw fast times at at ridgemont high school he's like the surfer character that was in that movie. But you might have a point that I'm not picking up on.
I love that movie and I agree
Can we also talk about the Asian racism with the sushi restaurant in Victorious. They literally have a scene where the owner makes Tori chop squid while singing a song about disappointing fathers. And the owner character is just an awful Asian stereotype.
i'm wondering if any of the black extras or actors/actresses will speak up if he was ever antiblack to them?
And *that* could lead into *certain* actresses to expose for things that he most likely had done to them... 👀
i feel like there's so much bad about this man that hasn''t come to the public yet. i feel like he's another harvey winstein on the low
@@harriyanna The actor, who played Burf on Victorious, Darsan Soloman came out and said earlier this month, he had experienced racism on set
Here's the instagram link: instagram.com/p/CBBsxHnpmUY/?igshid=yb9hcbh9aks6
we can only hope so. thats deff in all of our best interest.. lets all keep our fingers crossed and hope he was racist towards them.
Nicholas Lane buttttt there’s accusations against him and seeing his script for his shows makes me think that he is a Harvey Weinstein
but theres accusations and
Also in the iCarly special where they go to Japan their rivals were Japanese and they protrayed them as evil
And all the Japanese characters who weren't evil were dumb, like the security guards and the front desk lady who was convinced that Carly and Freddie were a honeymooning couple (because... they were a boy and a girl and they approached the desk at the same time, I guess? Nevermind the fact that they're obviously 15. And the reservation they were asking about included two separate rooms.)
Y’all are reaching so far it’s hilarious
I don’t really think that ones racist, they’re in Japan do you think white people would be there as the villains?
@@howdypartna Can't tell them what and what not to find offensive.
@@howdypartna If anything you're hilarious
I always thought Tori and Andre would be a cute couple
i didn't notice it before but a lot of black girl/women characters in tween tv shows are often made out to be sassy and aggresive, especially as side characters/cameos. writers might think it's a great idea for comedic purposes but a simple thing like that can cause impressionable children to have harmful perception of black women.
Couple of notes at the beginning of the video.
1. I wholeheartedly agree with the underlying racism in Dans shows. Andre on Victorious was the most talented one of the group. (He could sing, write, dance, play multiple instruments, and produce.) and he was always relegated to back up for everyone else save Beck... but Beck didn’t sing.
2. The iCarly Christmas thing is, unfortunately, wrong. Carly says it’s the color of ‘Gravy’ not ‘Crazy.’ Because Sam is obsessed with food.
3. The next point was about Yakama (pardon my misspelling), and they were only mocking it because the context of the episode was that of their Grandfather, who was from said town, wanting to take Carly from her friends and brother to live there. It was mostly said because Carly didn’t want to go, and she said it in a fit.
👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾 yea the joke was clearly about the color brown not skin tone. I feel like she was reaching with a lot of her points.
yeah i couldn’t watch this whole video a lot of her points made no sense lol
Yeah, I don't think they were making fun of the Indian Reservation. Living in Washington, and iCarly being set in Seattle, I bet they were talking about the city of Yakima not the Indian Reservation :)
i remember being little and watching Victorious when it first came out and thinking Andre was gonna be Tori’s love interest, like a best-friends-to-lovers kind of thing. don’t get me wrong, Andre deserves a LOT better than Tori, but in my little kid mind i thought “oh there’s two cute boys (Andre and Beck) and Beck already has a love interest, and Andre and Tori clearly have chemistry, this is gonna be so cute i can’t wait!” and then not understanding why it didn’t happen. and welp only in the last few years has it clicked that it’s probably bc it would’ve been ~controversial~ for a kid’s network to pair up the main girl with ‘the black friend’, bc i can’t rlly think of that many interracial couples in tv shows growing up, at least not pairing up black men with white women
Beck is on e if her best friends in real life. 😀
Yeah the main one I can think of on Nickelodeon would be Darren and Ginger on "As Told By Ginger".
this is disney, but the way leo from lab rats was treated in later seasons...and the way both he and his mom are treated to the annoying/useless eddy smart home system sucked :/ also, if you ever watched hannah montana, jackson had a snarky black guy friend...for like one or two seasons. And Miley's sassy black woman bodyguard who disappeared in season 3 or 4. 🥴
you know what........ i might make a whole video about it's a laugh productions now (the disney channel production company)
She also had the black girl who bullied her (played by Beyonce's cousin )
Musicdollfan her name on that show was amber
harriyanna hook plz do that
@@Musicdollfan Wait what she was Beyonce's cousin
I remember the fact that they made the black character on The Amanda Show so aggressive made me uncomfortable. I’m white and I’ve had more experiences with aggressive white men than I’ve had with aggressive black women. Interesting.
Honesty, with Charlotte I feel like they were more sexist towards her than racist. Like, it felt like they went out of their way to be sexist
Exactly, and they went a bit more harder on her because she was smart.
Im not sure if anyone mentioned this already, but in iCarly when Sam's favorite color is brown, she says "because it's the color of *gravy*", not crazy. Not that this negates any of the other things Dan Schneider has done in his shows, but that joke was about Sam loving meat/food , not about poc being crazy. I hope this doesn't come off as rude or insensitive, i just noticed the line was misheard/misquoted and wanted to point it out
No I heard that too. She may have misheard.
no yeah i was gonna comment that
I don't think she misheard because this video is full of manipulation and victimization.
Thank u
I was so naive as a kid, I mainly thought that the “sassy” characters were just an American thing
With Sheila in the girls room I thought she was the tough one because she was a tomboy because of the way she dressed and her hair was alternative and punky
And I thought Helen was mean because she hates her job as she used to be a famous actress and now she works in a movie theatre
And I thought Andre was stereotypically “black” because he was chill and smooth and I guess that’s why they made him have a crazy grandma because it’s was a polar opposite to him and shows how chill and calm he can be even with all that going on
That is probably what the writers _thought_ they were doing, but they just weren't conscious of the wider implications
If that's the way you interpreted it then that's the way it was
Andres grandma was definitely a racial stereotype
I thought exactly the same, but now I can realize that maybe it was racist purposely (but children will not see if they're not part of the black community)
I agree with all of this but in the first example I looked it up because I was so shocked and she says “because it’s the color of gravy”
Andre’s girlfriend was acting just like Jade and a ton of other white characters.
It’s stereotyping. Either it’s a biatchy tough white chick or angry black woman. Stereotypes are wrong. Periodt.
Maybe, but they didn't have even-keeled black girls on the show to balance it out. There's no range of representation
No Jade was more dark and evil Andre’s grandma was very loud and clueless
Yeah most of the females in that show were fucking crazy
Aiyaluna Yourke Ik that’s why I said clueless to avoid having to spell all of that😂
5:29 the line is "it's the colour of Gravy"
Not "crazy".
Comfort food has always been a huge part of Sam's character.
Shoo Shoo I don’t think the line “comfort food” was in the show. It was just in the person’s comment
was looking for this comment sam loved food and the joke was it being the color of gravy
that’s what i thought
"Hit it white girl"
"I'm actually half latina"
"Then Hit it Moo Cha Cha"
Why did dan schneider have to bring up that the fact that the character tori is half latina and why didn't andre just say "Hit it tori" idk I just didn't like that
The funny part is half latina could technically still be fully white
@@foxini1276 exactly latina is just a ethnicity
Why’d you spell muchacha like that though 😂
@@GDBGDB 😭😭
@@GDBGDB right💀
As a white person who grew up watching nickelodeon almost exclusively, I appreciate your analysis here and pointing out things I didn't notice growing up/was conditioned to think were normal. I do have a comment about Good Burger, though. I've read a few different analyses about Ed's character & looked into it myself extensively (but through a white lens, which is why I'm curious what your thoughts are), and it's been said that he's heavily coded to have autism (taking things literally all the time, childlike behavior, etc & later being shown at the end to have been intelligent the whole time/coming up with the whole plan that saves the day- and also being a really good friend to Dexter but that's probably not related). As someone with autism, I've looked to him for so many years as representation because seeing the way he actually saves the day in the end makes me so happy (and the movie itself is my go-to when I'm in a depressive episode- not so much a guilty pleasure cuz I'll shamelessly tell my roommates "ok we're watching this tonight" but I definitely feel you on that one). Oh, I know this is already long but I'm also curious about your thoughts on Monique because I've loved her & how she calls Dexter out on his bs the whole movie, especially with the contract & how she stands up for Ed and isn't actually shown forgiving Dexter in the end/needing a man. That's how I've seen her (through the white lens) so I'm curious what your thoughts are. Sorry this is so long, there are few things in life I love as much as this movie lol and ever since finding out about the "main" Dan Schneider scandal so to speak, I'm always trying to be a little more informed about it so I can enjoy it while still being critical.
As a black autistic male I respect this comment.
hey I just wanted to say, if you haven't seen it, the Netflix show She-Ra has a really well-written canon autistic character named Entrapta (she's the character in my pfp). I really like her because she's smart and analytical, despite being autistic :)
i’m not black, but i am a minority. and i’m appalled by everything that just flew over my head. talk about underlying racism... i wish there was more content on yt like this. keep doing what you’re doing❤️
I remember one iCarly episode when Sam was insulting Freddy and she said "if you were a country, you would be El Salvador" (a country in Latin America) I mean... Was that necesary? Like they never stop throwing shit...
I grew up watching that and I didn't realize either but as you do still like these programs (not as much as you do but still part of my childhood)
Wasn’t the joke that he was “el salva- dork?” She was all about making fun of him but yeah it was very racist
El-salva-dork isn’t racist but it’s offensive for sure, to use a countries name as an insult
@@moonxue7552 it wasn't racist tho? El Salvador is just probably the closest name of a country to the word dork.
+++ Tori and Trina were latinx, Tori mentioned that a lot
I only remember Tori mentioning she's half Latina one time
her last name was vega
they got some latino blood somewhere
I never realized that; I guess I assumed they were Italian or Spanish.
It's weird how half latinx characters were portrayed by white actors though. That was probably the cause of young me's lack of realization.
Genevieve F. They’re not white in real life they’re latinas
Victoria Justice is half Puerto Rican.
I'm not big into Schneider's work, for the most part, but this is such a great highlight of those little aggressions and how to pick them out in other works too.
I appreciate all the work that went into this.
The fact that they made Trina(who is half latina) try to out scream Andre’s grandma is also annoying bc it feeds into that whole Latinos are loud and obnoxious stereotype
I mean we are arent we /s.
We are tho lol
But you’re wrong about that, although Toris families heritage isn’t clear, their characters have no Hispanic heritage showing. So they’re not meant to portray any specific person, except a Californian.
@@george_MF_washington they said she was half Latina which implies that her family is half latino
When did they mention anything about her being Latina ?
Litterly I am not surprised I remember on that so Raven they make one of the bullies dark skin tall and aggressive and it wasn't cute it was actually offensive because she was the only dark skin in the group and they made her soo aggressive.
black beautiful Queen The whole bully group of that show were stereotypes that have been done millions of times before. The ditzy, vanilla blonde, bitchy chick and then the bitchy Latina. They were two basic bitches, with the one tough one. At least the black girl was different than the other two.
I don't think that was racism tho... That's so Raven even had a very eye opening episode on racism against black people. I actually thank that's so Raven because it educated me on black history month
@@nydiahendrixxx I get what your saying but it just annoying to see someone your skin tone to be pre trade as aggressive and loud I would say it was more of a stereotype than anything, and I do feel like that's so Raven did a good job on talking about Racism.
nydia hendrixxx Exactly.
But she was also the nicest of the three girls.
My sister and I used to discuss Tebo a lot. The actor is talented, but we also knew Tebo was very stereotypical. Especially considering he was the only main black character. They had a black principal for a bit, but he wasn't used as much. I don't think Tebo would have bothered me as much if the principal had shown up more. I know a lot of the shows had racist things, but for some reason iCarly always seemed to take it even further.
I get your point. Just wanted to add that Principal Franklin was not there "for a bit" he is literally the principal until the last season and makes appearances recurrently
@@unknownuser9909 He's not featured as much as Teb though. I think somehow they should have had a connection. Like Tebo could have been the principal's nephew.
@@unknownuser9909 To add to my comment. If they had both been featured equally it would have balanced things out. As for my family tie idea. Since the cast is small I thought it would be a good idea. To keep things together.
A little off topic, but Charlotte was hair goals. She's one of the reasons why I decided to grow out my natural hair. 💯
I don’t know, the main black characters in these shows are usually fan favorites. Yeah they usually had some token features, and sometimes shit was outright like “wow” looking back-but I can’t name one person I know who didn’t love Helen, T Bone, or especially Andre.
I think most people like them bc their black characters and you don’t really see them often in nick shows. So we take what we can get whether it’s stereotypical or not.
Nylah Earl personally they had the best personalities the main characters were usually bland and generic.
Sofia Bravo I agree but they should have more African Americans as main characters in shows!
Andre is such a sweet heart. Most unproblematic character on Victorious
@@nylahearl5003 lmao that's so not true and such a weird thing to say. Isn't saying that people like them just because they are black characters basically stating that that their whole character trait is their blackness? Wtf. Like no, I think people like them because they are interesting and cool.
Thank u for making this video because I never realized any of this when I was little in Victoria,Icarly and Game Shakers
Helen was actually my favorite character on drake and josh and I feel like she’s the only middle aged black woman I can think of on nick/disney sitcoms. Andre’s grandma was only funny for like 2 episodes and then it got old fast. There’s something very dark sided about Dan Schneider shows, at least in hindsight. I wasn’t actually allowed to watch icarly as a kid because of how rude and disrespectful they were (but I did anyway 🤫)
I liked andre. He had feelings and ambitions and he was funny and smart.
Crazy all these flew way past my head when I was such a kid. Andre was a more unique character than Beck and Robbie sucks he wasn’t as utilize as good as he should have been.
I thought the line from iCarly was “it’s the color of gravy”
It is
Right!
Yeah this girl is delusional lol
@@blee5100 Read the description hun
She is!
To be fair on iCarly all the grown men on that show acted like a child. Spencer acted like a child. You had the weird guy front desk guy at their apartment who acted weird and if not acting like a child he certainly wasn't acting like an adult. That's just kind of how their show was regardless for laughs. If it was any other show I'd agree with you on that. But not on iCarly where adults acted child like a lot. Lol.
True
I was thinking the same thing. Dan Schindler loves his adult children
Good point
@@mistylang3329 Keep talking because all of this is great stuff including the story about Alexa Nicholas.
did u mean Lewbert? (This isn’t a big of a deal tho lol so u don’t have to re-edit
omfg andre’s grandmother never sat well w me but i didn't know if i was overreacting
I’m pretty sure that in the iCarly episode, Carly says that Sam’s favorite color was brown because “It’s the color of gravy.” But yeah, these shows are not great at representing people of color.
Read the description
Just to play devils advocate, andres girlfriend’s personality is also portrayed my white women even more (the rich mean girl (I.e Regina George, sharpay evans) but you’re right that black women should not always have to play agressive or catty characters and should be allowed development and variety
I think the problem is that out of all the main or side characters they had on the show, they thought a black actress was the best option to cast in that role.
Its just that they're ALWAYS portrayed the same ways. While the white actors have many different roles including catty/sassy ones
Unfortunately tokenism has been around and is still around prior to Dan Schneider’s shows.
Sam said "because it's the color of gravy" not "crazy." But yeah it's insane looking back on these shows seeing the racist tendencies I didn't pick up on as a kid.
don’t forget the haunted hathaways 😭😭
Oh my god I remember that show! Bruh I miss it, even though I barely remember anything from it😂
Literally the show with the most black rep 😭
On Nickelodeon*
@@z.6480 it was literally the most irrelevant show on nick that featured black people😭😭😭
@@rewriter3981 LITERALLY
I'm so glad you're talking about this. This topic covers a lot of ground: stereotypes (and several different ones), representation, bad writing, and so on.
I had noticed a few years back, when I was thinking about The Girls Room, "hang on... Sheila's that Sassy Black Woman stereotype! That's lame." After seeing the clips of her and the Baliff you included in your video, I couldn't help noticing that both characters are "Amanda's character's designated Black "muscle" minion who roughhouses people she doesn't like so she as a tiny White girl isn't portrayed as getting her hands dirty." (I'm blaming the writers for this, not Amanda. She was little back then. She had no control over the material.)
Thank you for talking about the dearth of Asian and Latinx representation. As soon as you brought it up, I immediately thought, "Hang on, all the Asian people work in food service, and they're always from the same three countries that exist in Hollywood Asia." I don't know how you would comment on Dana Cruz and Lola Martinez as Latina representation, especially since Dana was on Zoey 101 for only one season. If I recall correctly, she was the most athletic and most aggressive of the girls, which carries echoes of the "brown girls are more aggressive than white girls" stereotype. As far as I know, Lola's portrayal was fine (if bare because if you didn't know her last name you couldn't be sure if she was Latina), but I welcome discussion on that!
By the way, were Tori and Trina Vega supposed to be Latina? I don't know because I never watched "Victorious."
according to the show tori and trina are half latina
One of my favorite iCarly characters is Principal Franklin, he’s just so wholesome and is like a father figure.
i felt like with Andre, someone set him up as a cool, great, kind character, but someone just didn't want him to be too successful. they didn't want him to outshine anybody. also the episode with the asian restaurant owner was just uncomfortable for me. the whole thing was like a modern day racist caricature.
there's no portrayal at all of middle easterns which is kinda f!@#'d. Not even princess jasmine was portrayed accurately :'')
Relatable I have never had someone with my background on tv and every middle Eastern person is portrayed by an Indian person as if we're the same
Aladdin have so much racism, lol. So much that they had to put a warning.
Your skin color doesn't define you as a person/character. Your personality does
I was always confused why all the black characters were majority males
I heard sam was supposed to be black but for whatever reason they casted Jeanette but kept the character the same...
Cause she be a walking black stereotype
@@silverstein8308 yeah it's bad...
Doesn't Sam always say she loves fried chicken? Imagine having a black character say that
@@foxini1276 That's probably why they changed her
I heard a rumor that Sam had a rough home life because originally, her character was supposed to be black before McCurdy was cast. On top of that, I have to give Butch Hartman the side eye for (as well as several other reasons) making Tucker's color scheme based off the Jamacian flag. And as much as I love Valerie for having the best character development and being a total badass, I (as a white person) feel like she was probably portrayed with the "angry, loud black woman" stereotype, and it doesn't help the fact that she and Tucker were the only black characters with any story significance. I can't say for sure because it's not my place to, but at the very least, it's sketchy to me for sure.
Edit: Oh yeah, I also forgot to mention the way they colored background/minor asian characters in DP was definitely racist. There was a girl in the beginning of "13" going on a date(?) with Tucker, and her skin is straight up yellow.
There was also a boy and another girl character around 35:23 of "The Ultimate Enemy". The boy isn't as much of a caricature, though he is also yellow. But the girl is probably the worst I've seen. As well as yellow skin, she had sideways lines for eyes.
I definitely have to disagree with you about Ed. His character was actually unique... How many black dumb surfer dude characters do you know? Typically they are all white. I feel like his character is similar to Urkel or Carlton... A universal character type that was not previously portrayed as being black before the 90's. The character's color actually didn't matter because anyone could play that role. His character is not based on an black stereotypes or essentially based on the skin color of the actor. He's just... Him, Ed. It's true color blind casting. There was some good points here but others I feel like were reaching, the modern sjw culture now is making sure we're offended by like everything especially trivial stuff that doesn't affect true injustice and I can't stand it and I'm a black woman. There's sooo much racism behind and in front of the camera and Dan is overall scummy and sucked at writing black characters but honestly I'm more offended by how our own people are portraying ourselves in rap and other ways rn (WAP as a representation of black women as an example). We gotta stop with this victim complex and invest in black media or work towards doing more in entertainment instead of complaining and looking for grievances. Edit: here's a video on why dumb characters exist since they're apparently offensive now in any context (on black shows by a black channel) th-cam.com/video/8mYuUyxI5ME/w-d-xo.html
I agree am I’m a black girl too
Same
@@lustrousandlovely6847 God*
I agree with you for the most part, but I disagree that WAP is a 'representation of black women' bc its not, it can pertain to any woman. And while I agree not everything is meant to be taken offensively, it is not a 'victim complex' bc as a black woman you should know there are real injustices, as you mentioned, in the media & everyday life. We can create more outlets for ourselves while also calling out certain injustices as well
@@callmeroguee a lot of black women were mad kylie was there because apparently the song was a "black space" and was "cultural" for black women
You've made some good points. You should do a video about the Alexa Nikolas situation during her time off the set of Zoey 101.
that sitiuation made me so angry. i will do a video for it but i need to prepare myself to do so.
@@harriyanna That is fine. I feel for Alexa because all she wanted was to have friends.
i looked up what happened to andres parents in victorious and it said his parents were drug dealers- 🤦🏽♀️
What?
This is the video I needed!!! Looking back on these shows they did and still do us dirty. I'm starting to do more calling out of those in the industry on my channel as well and girl if you are ever in Chicago I'll hire you to act in a heartbeat 💜
seriously that means alot to me. thank you so much
girl at this point i really don't want to be working with people who do not care about the wellbeings of black people. cause it's hurtful.
@@harriyanna i 💯 mean it 💜
@@harriyanna it really is and they don't care, I have a video coming out later today about how they treated the black Frozen Broadway actors and how they felt so discriminated against they started a hastag called #TheaterInColor so black people and poc can tell their stories about how they've been treated less than. We have to keep calling them out.